Adams' brother sought over alleged abuse

[brokencrossbar1]

Gerry Adams of 20 years ago and the circumstances of 20 years ago are too far removed what is perceived as normality to draw any conclusions on what was the best course of action.  Not every tout got a bullet, not eveyone mixing in the wrong circles got kneecapped.  You cannot judge what did or did not happen.  Unless you were in the middle of the issue with a full understanding of what was going on could you even attempt to comprehend what was going through anyones mind.  Perhaps there was a private family reason for nothing more happening than did happen.  That is the business of the Adams family and should be left at that.  We will never know what happened in a meeting up the Whiterock or anywhere else for that matter relating to this.  Adams is dealing with a hugely difficult scenario as best as he can and I don't think it is something that keyboard warriors and gutter press hacks should have any input into.  Family matters are family matters and should be kept at that.

[Myles Na G.]

The journalist Chris Jones  (UTV program?) was interviewed by Pat Kenny this morning, still going on about his opinions on Gerry Adams's perceived complicity. Adams rang up the show some 20 minutes later and deconstructed the main points made by Jones. He said he wasn't going to do anymore interviews on this matter but just had to reply to what was being presented as fact on RTE.

Is the journalist not Chris Moore?

[stew]

Btw eg would you mind telling me exactly what Gerry Adams should have done, about his brother and his father.

Since Adams knew about his brother's crimes since back in the day when the IRA took upon itself to "police" Republican districts, he might have arranged through his contacts within armed Repubblicanism   for a "punishment squad" [sic] along to kneecap him - the standard sentence (or worse?) for such anti-social activities, I believe.
Of course, I say "might", only that the surname of the (alleged) rapist in question is "Adams".
Now, having answered your question, would you like to tell me exactly what GA would have done, if his neice had been abused all those years ago by someone with a different surname? 

Bear in mind the wishes of their victims.

Aye, tell that to the "victims" of John Brown (see my post #47).

So after your little essay the only thing you can criticise Adams on is the fact that he didn't arrange a punishment beating

[Myles Na G.]

Btw eg would you mind telling me exactly what Gerry Adams should have done, about his brother and his father.

Since Adams knew about his brother's crimes since back in the day when the IRA took upon itself to "police" Republican districts, he might have arranged through his contacts within armed Repubblicanism   for a "punishment squad" [sic] along to kneecap him - the standard sentence (or worse?) for such anti-social activities, I believe.
Of course, I say "might", only that the surname of the (alleged) rapist in question is "Adams".
Now, having answered your question, would you like to tell me exactly what GA would have done, if his neice had been abused all those years ago by someone with a different surname? 

Bear in mind the wishes of their victims.

Aye, tell that to the "victims" of John Brown (see my post #47).

So after your little essay the only thing you can criticise Adams on is the fact that he didn't arrange a punishment beating

Liam Adams worked at Clonard youth club for 5 years. Gerry Adams says that he approached the club authorities and made them aware of the allegations against his brother. Brendan Dineen of clonard youth club says the club have reviewed all their documentation and can find no record of the allegations against Liam Adams.

[Evil Genius]

try to stay on topic.

What's amusing you? The title of this thread is "Adams' brother sought over alleged child abuse". all my posts have been strictly on the topic of Gerry Adams and his conduct with regard to his brother etc. 

You know little about the abuse and know little about the conduct of Gerry Adams, yet you surmise and self righteously pontificate like the  good little ultra reactionary you are.
Predictable repetitive agenda but above all, so utterly ignorant of abuse within families.

I know as much about the abuse as any of the other posters on this thread - but somehow I'm not "allowed" to comment, since I fail to conform to the usual take on such issues by posters on this forum?

Rather than dishing out personal insults, why don't you address the points which I (and one or two others) have made?

[orangeman]

Adams' brother employers hit out 

An arrest warrant has been issued for Liam Adams
A community project which employed Gerry Adams' brother has criticised the authorities for not telling them about sexual abuse allegations against him.

Liam Adams worked for the Beechmount Community Project as a youth development officer from 2004 to 2006.

He faces allegations that he abused his daughter when she was a child. Beechmount Community Project said he had been cleared to work with children and that the police and social services had "serious questions" to answer.

A warrant is outstanding for Liam Adams' arrest, to face allegations that he sexually abused Aine Tyrell when she was a young child.

Sinn Fein president Gerry Adams has called for him to hand over himself to the authorities.

It has emerged that Liam Adams worked with children in a number of roles for almost 20 years after his daughter and her mother reported him to the police in 1987.

A spokesperson for the Beechmount Community Project, for which Liam Adams worked between November 2004 and May 2006, said: "We have never received any complaint from any child, young person or their parent, or staff member, with respect to Liam Adams and his period of employment here within our project.

"Nevertheless, we feel that serious lapses by both the Social Services and the police have inexcusably put children and young people within our project at risk."

Liam Adams was also employed as a part-time youth worker at Clonard Youth Centre in west Belfast between 1998 and 2003.

Clearance

The Sinn Fein president has said he told staff there about the allegations against his brother.

"When I discovered in the Belfast situation that he was working in a youth facility I went to those who had responsibility for that facility and told them of the allegation," Mr Adams said.

"He also had RUC or PSNI clearance to work in those facilities."

However, Clonard Youth Centre has issued a statement, making clear it was unaware of any allegations against Liam Adams when he worked there.

Spokesperson Brendan Dineen said the centre had reviewed all its documentation "and there is no record whatsoever regarding concerns about Mr Liam Adams during his time of employment at Clonard Youth Centre".

"If we had been aware of allegations that have recently come to light, he would not have been employed at the centre," he continued.

"There have been very stringent policies and procedures in place since the establishment of the club with no incidents of wrongdoing reported."

[Evil Genius]

Btw eg would you mind telling me exactly what Gerry Adams should have done, about his brother and his father.

Since Adams knew about his brother's crimes since back in the day when the IRA took upon itself to "police" Republican districts, he might have arranged through his contacts within armed Repubblicanism   for a "punishment squad" [sic] along to kneecap him - the standard sentence (or worse?) for such anti-social activities, I believe.
Of course, I say "might", only that the surname of the (alleged) rapist in question is "Adams".
Now, having answered your question, would you like to tell me exactly what GA would have done, if his neice had been abused all those years ago by someone with a different surname? 

Bear in mind the wishes of their victims.

Aye, tell that to the "victims" of John Brown (see my post #47).

So after your little essay the only thing you can criticise Adams on is the fact that he didn't arrange a punishment beating

No. If you actually cared to read what I posted, you'd see that I argued not that Adams should have arranged a "punishment beating" (nice term for what most decent people would call a brutal maiming, btw) - activity which I roundly deplore in any/all circumstances.

Rather, my point was that on past form he might have done so. However, I believe that the only reason he did not carry out "restorative justice" [sic] for this particular victim was because the perpetrator was also a member of his own family. Had the abuser been someone unrelated, I don't believe he'd have hesitated for a second.

[Main Street]

try to stay on topic.

What's amusing you? The title of this thread is "Adams' brother sought over alleged child abuse". all my posts have been strictly on the topic of Gerry Adams and his conduct with regard to his brother etc. 

You know little about the abuse and know little about the conduct of Gerry Adams, yet you surmise and self righteously pontificate like the  good little ultra reactionary you are.
Predictable repetitive agenda but above all, so utterly ignorant of abuse within families.

I know as much about the abuse as any of the other posters on this thread - but somehow I'm not "allowed" to comment, since I fail to conform to the usual take on such issues by posters on this forum?

Rather than dishing out personal insults, why don't you address the points which I (and one or two others) have made?

Did I say you were not allowed to comment?

since I fail to conform to the usual take on such issues by posters on this forum?

ah, the misplaced martyr complex.
You credit yourself too much.
You are taken to task because of the nonsense content of your posts.

Rather than dishing out personal insults

,

Some martyr
Where were they dished out?  all comments refer to the evidence of the content of your posts.

why don't you address the points which I (and one or two others) have made?

I don't usually comment on surmises made by somebody,  with no credible factual base and who it is plain to see has a subjective perspective severely tainted by an agenda.

[Evil Genius]

EG is caught up in the tabloidesque "Let's Make Adams The Story" approach to this issue and quite clearly doesn't give a flying feck about any of the victims in this case.

"Quite clearly"?
I have the utmost sympathy for the young woman who has had to endure years of misery at the hands of this fiend - that much should go without saying (unless, perhaps, you're a Unionist on GAAboard, which makes you "fair game" for all sorts of sh1te).

But if posters are only going to state the obvious - victims deserve sympathy, perpetrators deserve condemnation etc - then it is hardly going to make for debate, is it?

Rather, when I read people expressing sympathy for Gerry Adams in all this, as though he were also one of the "victims", it makes me want to boak.

I have already pointed out the rank hypocrisy of his "understanding" of the players in this particular situation, compared with his cold-blooded callousness when it is people outwith the Republican/Provo "family" who are accused of such crimes.

But all of that is before I think of all the other children who were directly "abused" by members of a certain organisation of which he was never a member - the children who were themselves maimed, even killed in terrorist bombings, or orphaned, or forced out of their homes in terror etc. How much compassion has he ever shown for the two small children who died in Warrington, for instance? Or the ten young children of Jean McConville, who were abused, shunned and taunted even after their mother was taken from them by an IRA "punishment squad"?

Or closer to home, the countless youngsters who were recruited into the Fianna etc by notorious Republican families like the Adamses, but who later came to regret bitterly that they'd ever been led astray. I had a Catholic neighbour, as decent a man as ever breathed, who hated violence and division with a passion. However, one of his daughters was drawn into the IRA whilst barely into her teens, attracted (one assumes) by the "glamour" and "excitement" it offered in a quiet rural backwater. I don't know whether her father ever knew about her involvement, but it must have broken his heart when she later repented her involvement, seeing no way out other than to take her own life whilst barely yet a woman.   

And now the reality of child abuse is visited upon Adams himself. Well, I would never wish it upon anyone, even including Adams himself, but I will say this. When it comes to my sympathy, I reserve all I have for the poor young woman in all this - for I have none whatever for Adams himself.

Meanwhile, having observed the way after a period when Adams uncharacteristically stayed out of the limelight, this decades-old scandal "coincidentally" became public in the gap between the Dublin Abuse Report and the run-up to Christmas, followed by the careful deflection provided by his revelations about what a total **** his father was, I await with interest (and rising nausea) to see what the next installment from the "Adams Family News Management Agency" will be...

[Main Street]

And now the reality of child abuse is visited upon Adams himself. Well, I would never wish it upon anyone, even including Adams himself, but I will say this. When it comes to my sympathy, I reserve all I have for the poor young woman in all this - for I have none whatever for Adams himself.

This point has already been clearly addressed earlier on in a reply to Hardy's question, which he accepted.
No one is minimising the plight of the girl and pouring sympathy towards Gerry Adams, rather exception is taken on the attempt to twist it into an attack on Gerry Adams based on what has been proved as bad facts or at a minimum hotly contested facts and in your case also a cynical agenda.

[pintsofguinness]

What a vile and pathetic little man you are EG.  Keep talking, you're showing yourself up.

[stew]

EG would have us believe that Adams has a case to enter here, he doesnt, not only that but EG takes every word contrary to what Adams says as Gospel, i.e. the fact that there is no diocumentation that he contacted them about the alleged abuse of a child by his brother.

EG, your disdain for Sinn Fein and Adams eats at your credibility here, I  have no time for either him or the party he represents but I think he has handled this as best he can, I understsnd his hesitance to work with the police and about the only thing I can blame him for is the fact that he didnt dispense justice to his brother and father the way the shinners did with other sick cnuts that raped children.

I have some sympathy for Adams, his father was a child molester as was his brother, how could you not feel for the family given these circumstances.

Adams molested nobody, dont paint him as part of the problem here, he isnt.

[pintsofguinness]

EG would have us believe that Adams has a case to enter here, he doesnt, not only that but EG takes every word contrary to what Adams says as Gospel, i.e. the fact that there is no diocumentation that he contacted them about the alleged abuse of a child by his brother.

EG, your disdain for Sinn Fein and Adams eats at your credibility here, I  have no time for either him or the party he represents but I think he has handled this as best he can, I understsnd his hesitance to work with the police and about the only thing I can blame him for is the fact that he didnt dispense justice to his brother and father the way the shinners did with other sick cnuts that raped children.

I have some sympathy for Adams, his father was a child molester as was his brother, how could you not feel for the family given these circumstances.

Adams molested nobody, dont paint him as part of the problem here, he isnt.

The fact that EG can bring Jean McConville in to a discussion about this says it all!

The thing that there's no documentation is a bit stupid, if Adams had a quiet word with someone does anyone think that person  wrote it down on a piece of paper and put it in a filing cabinet?! ffs...  Why was it his responsibility to do this anyway? If you're going to blame Gerry for not telling people you could also blame the victim and her mother and just about everyone else that knew.  Then you'd have to start going around all the other victims of rape and sexual abuse who never found the strength to proceed with cases, and their families, and blame them for not following around their attacker and telling everyone they came in contact with of the allegations. 

Rape victims and sexual abuse victims are encouraged to come forward, Gerry Adams family does and all they get is their brother, who seems to have supported them 100%, hounded.  Any outsider would think he was the one doing the abusing.

He's not going to get his brother a punishment beating for the same reason he allowed the tri colour to go on his father's coffin, because the abuse thing would have come out and that's not what the victim wanted! 

I know of at least 4 people who, in the past, have been accused of sexual abuse - one of them was convicted actually - and none of them got a punishment beating.  As BC says not everyone was treated the same whether they're a relation of Gerry Adams or not.

[Myles Na G.]

In terms of the Clonard youth club aspect, there are two parties with questions to answer. Firstly, it seems that the police gave the youth club the all clear to employ Liam Adams. Given that the allegations against him must have still been on file, should this not have been reported to the youth club management? Secondly, Gerry Adams needs to be clear how he dealt with the situation. Who did he approach at the club to alert that they were employing a paedophile? When he realised that this person or persons weren't acting on his information, what did he do? Did he just drop it, thinking that he'd done his bit? Liam Adams worked there for 5 years. Did this not give Gerry cause for concern?

[Hurler on the Bitch]

In terms of the Clonard youth club aspect, there are two parties with questions to answer. Firstly, it seems that the police gave the youth club the all clear to employ Liam Adams. Given that the allegations against him must have still been on file, should this not have been reported to the youth club management? Secondly, Gerry Adams needs to be clear how he dealt with the situation. Who did he approach at the club to alert that they were employing a paedophile? When he realised that this person or persons weren't acting on his information, what did he do? Did he just drop it, thinking that he'd done his bit? Liam Adams worked there for 5 years. Did this not give Gerry cause for concern?

As I said before - Bishop of Limerick scenario here. The pressure will grow and GA will need to be crystal clear in his words. If he tried to get his brother expelled from Sinn Fein for his alleged activities, then why did he not go to the hierarchy at Clonard - or the PSNI - regarding his job? - he has been on 1st name terms with the Clonard fraternity for 30 years. I know that blood is thicker than water, but there is an issue of sexual morality at stake. However, the most glaring aspect in this is that he has decided to go public on his brother and his father, thus besmirching their names for eternity, but will still not admit that he was ever in the 'Ra? Feck me, discuss? I think he is finished.