Missing Plane!!

[Doogie Browser]

"terrorism was ruled out almost immediately". Hold on a second they don't have a clue yet. The airline industry will always play games like this until they are forced to admit what the real cause was. Storms do not make planes crash on their own, something else has to go wrong, human error, a technical fault, a combination of both or a bomb.

"The family has asked for privacy" ok a start would be not writing poems publicising your daughters death and releasing it to the press. You will be left alone as long as you do not court publicity, you have nothing really to add to the story.

Catch yourself on this is not a lottery winner asking for privacy FFS.  The family have a right to do what they want if it helps them deal with the loss of a daughter and sister.

[orangeman]

Terrorism was ruled out almost immediately, terrible wait for the families now.

Why? Because they have conclusive proof it wasn't or so as not to scare the horses?

I thought the fact that there was a message sent from the plane on more than one occasion would mean that it was hardly a bomb.

There was an automated message sent when the plane was lost from the radar, there was no mayday from the pilots.  Something happened to knock it out of the sky pretty quick.  Even if all the engines failed the plane would have kept gliding for 1/2 an hour with plenty of time for the pilots to send out a mayday signal.

The thoughts that would have been running through the passengers' minds as she was literally falling out of the sky.

Horrific.

Sympathy to their families.

Quick death, a great way to go imho. The tragedy is that they were so young.

How long would it take to fall 30,000 feet ?

[muppet]

Terrorism was ruled out almost immediately, terrible wait for the families now.

Why? Because they have conclusive proof it wasn't or so as not to scare the horses?

I thought the fact that there was a message sent from the plane on more than one occasion would mean that it was hardly a bomb.

The media are reporting the electrical fault message as being significant. That is not necessarily the case. A circuit breaker tripping would cause a message like that to be sent automatically but wouldn't necessarily cause difficulties for the aircraft.

No one is in a position to rule out any possibility until they they get the black box or the wreckage.

They rule out hi-jacking and bombs routinely nowadays to stop panic but they can't possibly be sure at the moment.

There is an ELT with the black box which means locating it won't be particularly difficult, it is the logistics of going to the bottom of the Atlantic to get it that is the problem.  

I stand corrected to be wrong, but I would think that if the black box is lying in the bottom of the ocean, finding such a beacon in the VHF/UHF range will be impossible due to the conductive nature of sea water. Has there been any recorded successful attempts of a black box being recovered in the ocean bed outside shallow waters?

It should have an Underwater device.

Air India flight 182 which crashed in 1985 was in 2000 meters deep water and the Black Boxes were recovered.

[Capt Pat]

Terrorism was ruled out almost immediately, terrible wait for the families now.

Why? Because they have conclusive proof it wasn't or so as not to scare the horses?

I thought the fact that there was a message sent from the plane on more than one occasion would mean that it was hardly a bomb.

There was an automated message sent when the plane was lost from the radar, there was no mayday from the pilots.  Something happened to knock it out of the sky pretty quick.  Even if all the engines failed the plane would have kept gliding for 1/2 an hour with plenty of time for the pilots to send out a mayday signal.

The thoughts that would have been running through the passengers' minds as she was literally falling out of the sky.

Horrific.

Sympathy to their families.

Quick death, a great way to go imho. The tragedy is that they were so young.

How long would it take to fall 30,000 feet ?

How long does it take to die from cancer or heart disease?

[Norf Tyrone]

Capt Pat... I'd say after redaing your 'input' on several threats your demise will be swift.

My advice to follow boarders... just ignore everything.

[EC Unique]

Terrorism was ruled out almost immediately, terrible wait for the families now.

Why? Because they have conclusive proof it wasn't or so as not to scare the horses?

I thought the fact that there was a message sent from the plane on more than one occasion would mean that it was hardly a bomb.

There was an automated message sent when the plane was lost from the radar, there was no mayday from the pilots.  Something happened to knock it out of the sky pretty quick.  Even if all the engines failed the plane would have kept gliding for 1/2 an hour with plenty of time for the pilots to send out a mayday signal.

The thoughts that would have been running through the passengers' minds as she was literally falling out of the sky.

Horrific.

Sympathy to their families.

Quick death, a great way to go imho. The tragedy is that they were so young.

How long would it take to fall 30,000 feet ?

How long does it take to die from cancer or heart disease?

Would have passed out long before they hit the water. Terrible time for families though, wondering what happened...

[DennistheMenace]

Say it wasn't a bomb or terrorist attack, would these planes not glide even without any power for at least a short duration of time ?

[orangeman]

Shocking tragedy altogether.


For the sake of the airline involved, the industry and most importantly the families, hopefully they'll find out what happened.

[Rois]

Did anyone else hear the head of the Irish pilot association or whatever it's called on Radio Ulster this morning?

He found it difficult to believe that it was lightening or turbulence. 

[muppet]

Say it wasn't a bomb or terrorist attack, would these planes not glide even without any power for at least a short duration of time ?

As a rule of thumb they will glide for 3 times (in nautical miles) their altitude (in thousands of feet). So an aircraft at 35,000 feet will glide 35 x 3 = 105 nautical miles.

There are a few questions that need to be asked.

* We there any aircraft within VHF range that would have been able to hear any emergency broadcast? The North Atlantic is sufficiently busy to ensure someone would hear such a message but what about the South Atlantic? If the answer is no then we can't derive any conclusion from the apparent lack of a broadcast.
* Are Air France A330s equipped with SatCom or similar devices? This would allow them to communicate regardless of location.


Edit BBC news reporting two items of debris found 60 KM apart. That suggests it may have broken up in the air.

[orangeman]

Say it wasn't a bomb or terrorist attack, would these planes not glide even without any power for at least a short duration of time ?

As a rule of thumb they will glide for 3 times (in nautical miles) their altitude (in thousands of feet). So an aircraft at 35,000 feet will glide 35 x 3 = 105 nautical miles.

There are a few questions that need to be asked.

* We there any aircraft within VHF range that would have been able to hear any emergency broadcast? The North Atlantic is sufficiently busy to ensure someone would hear such a message but what about the South Atlantic? If the answer is no then we can't derive any conclusion from the apparent lack of a broadcast.
* Are Air France A330s equipped with SatCom or similar devices? This would allow them to communicate regardless of location.


Edit BBC news reporting two items of debris found 60 KM apart. That suggests it may have broken up in the air.

60KM apart ? The scale is massive.

[DennistheMenace]

The distance does suggest the plane broke in air, a smallish explosion could explain this and would result in a depressurized cabin I presume.

[orangeman]

The distance does suggest the plane broke in air, a smallish explosion could explain this and would result in a depressurized cabin I presume.

Terrorism

[muppet]

The distance does suggest the plane broke in air, a smallish explosion could explain this and would result in a depressurized cabin I presume.

Terrorism

There are other possibilities such as what happened the TWA 800 but that would be the obvious one.

[DennistheMenace]

The distance does suggest the plane broke in air, a smallish explosion could explain this and would result in a depressurized cabin I presume.

Terrorism

Surely though if it was a bomb then someone would have took responsibility by now ? Why bomb a plane and tell no one you did it ? I doubt it personally.