Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification

Started by BennyCake, September 09, 2014, 12:47:26 PM

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Rossfan

An acquaintance reckons when the ball was on the tee it's within the field and is therefore considered in play?
Play the game and play it fairly
Play the game like Dermot Earley.

AustinPowers

Westmeath seemed to  get a 2 pointer v Roscommon. Ball bounced in the square and over

I thought it had to  go  straight over the bar? Or  has this been changed? Christ I can't keep up

Armagh18

Quote from: AustinPowers on March 25, 2025, 12:29:23 AMWestmeath seemed to  get a 2 pointer v Roscommon. Ball bounced in the square and over

I thought it had to  go  straight over the bar? Or  has this been changed? Christ I can't keep up
That was changed with the last rules I think.

Milltown Row2

It was the same for the old new rules and stayed the same for the new new rules
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought.

David McKeown

Quote from: befair on March 24, 2025, 02:04:00 AMIn general the new rules have been a great success; tho wish they had kept 4 pts for a goal.

I think they have been a complete disaster. There's no tackling any more. Games are boring for large parts and very one sided for long passages of time. There are far fewer lead changes, tactics and some of the skills of the game are being forced out. There also seem to be far fewer fast breaks as teams always have men back.
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thewobbler

Quote from: David McKeown on March 25, 2025, 05:27:52 PM
Quote from: befair on March 24, 2025, 02:04:00 AMIn general the new rules have been a great success; tho wish they had kept 4 pts for a goal.

I think they have been a complete disaster. There's no tackling any more. Games are boring for large parts and very one sided for long passages of time. There are far fewer lead changes, tactics and some of the skills of the game are being forced out. There also seem to be far fewer fast breaks as teams always have men back.

David no harm to you lad, but it would seem you're not actually watching what's happening. You've just made your mind up for whatever reason and seem unable to look at this objectively.

Everything you described in a negative form above is what was happening the past few years. Every last thing.


Rossfan

Quote from: David McKeown on March 25, 2025, 05:27:52 PM
Quote from: befair on March 24, 2025, 02:04:00 AMIn general the new rules have been a great success; tho wish they had kept 4 pts for a goal.

I think they have been a complete disaster. There's no tackling any more. Games are boring for large parts and very one sided for long passages of time. There are far fewer lead changes, tactics and some of the skills of the game are being forced out. There also seem to be far fewer fast breaks as teams always have men back.

You've described pre 2025 football to a T.
Play the game and play it fairly
Play the game like Dermot Earley.

thewobbler

#2332
You've been around too long for this to be a WUM so I'll break it down one by one for you David:

There's no tackling any more: There was almost zero contact in Gaelic Games for the past 4-5 years, let alone tackling. I watched an AI final as recently as July when there wasn't a single challenge made in the first half. Earlier same season I watched Armagh and Donegal play an Ulster Final where both teams were able to shoot from distance on repeat as there wasn't so much as a tackle in sight.

Games are boring for large parts and very one sided for long passages of time: Gaelic football was on the precipice of dying. From boredom. Now we've just played out a league where in D1 a team finished top with a negative scoring difference, and at one stage on Sunday were being relegated. Similar scenes in D2. We're witnessing more goals than ever. We're witnessing teams coming back from the dead instead of playing out. Most importantly we're witnessing the end of over coaching. Players have to make their own minds up.

There are far fewer lead changes: you'll need stats to back this one up.

tactics: this is a great thing. Tactics are important in sport but excess tactics results in boredom. See Italian football, rugby union.

and some of the skills of the game are being forced out: for the past decade you only needed two skills above all. One being patience in defence. The other being straight line speed on a counter attack. Anything else was a bonus. But breaking ball was a thing of the past. As was long kicking. As was accurate kicking. As was actual goalkeeping. As was commanding the square. As was being a playmaker. As was being a small, industrious corner forward. As was being a big brute full forward. I honestly can't fathom how you've come to this conclusion. You've a taken 3 lefts when you should have taken a right.

There also seem to be far fewer fast breaks as teams always have men back: There's more fast breaks than ever before. Difference is that now, the ball is going the spadework.

Truthsayer

New rules are a breath of fresh air. They've saved Gaelic football. Huge thanks to the committee involved. It was in a dire state. Good players are flourishing again. Really looking forward to the championship.

Milltown Row2

I'm still on the fence, I still see teams moving back to the 40m arc to defend I'm seeing offensive teams play laterally until a gap appears.. managers still trying to work it out.

I haven't noticed a big difference in my distance covered also
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought.

David McKeown

#2335
Quote from: thewobbler on March 25, 2025, 05:39:33 PM
Quote from: David McKeown on March 25, 2025, 05:27:52 PM
Quote from: befair on March 24, 2025, 02:04:00 AMIn general the new rules have been a great success; tho wish they had kept 4 pts for a goal.

I think they have been a complete disaster. There's no tackling any more. Games are boring for large parts and very one sided for long passages of time. There are far fewer lead changes, tactics and some of the skills of the game are being forced out. There also seem to be far fewer fast breaks as teams always have men back.

David no harm to you lad, but it would seem you're not actually watching what's happening. You've just made your mind up for whatever reason and seem unable to look at this objectively.

Everything you described in a negative form above is what was happening the past few years. Every last thing.



It certainly wasn't. The stats back it up. Turnovers from tackles are down (although stats in this area are lacking from previous areas). Number of lead changes are down compared to last year.

There's been a focus on the number of high catches being up and scores being up as evidence that football is now somehow better. The other elements that went in to football are ignored. It seems the rules have divided opinion. I know within my own family those of us who attend matches don't like them. The ones who watch the matches on the TV seem to like them.

In the FRC reports there were two interesting statistics.  Number of long kickouts and possession won there from was up substantially yet hand passes and kick passes were broadly similar as were the scores to shot ratio.  Now if the starting point for gaining possession is considerably advanced and therefore the average distance to be covered is down significantly then you would expect a big drop off in passes (particularly if we believe the myth that these rules have somehow brought kick passing back into vogue) and a big increase in shots (as teams should in theory get into scoring positions quicker)  That's not reflected in the stats at all. Broadly similar number of kick outs broadly similar number of shots   

As I've said previously those who seem to like the new rules caveat it with at least one rule they don't like. That one rule seems to change person to person though.

I like the idea of the solo and go but I think the 8 yards you can get out of it is too much.  The other rules I think the pay off is far too great.

I'm perfectly willing to give the rules more time in the form of the championship but to date I think they've taken away far too much and havent improved the game.

I also have set out that I prefer close tactical battles to all out shoot outs so that obviously factors in to it.
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tiempo

Eoghan Ban Gallagher out of Donegal championship opener with hamstring injury picked up at training, so much for Jim's mythical rules causing hamstring injury theory

The boul Jim has men checking the temperature of hotel rooms in advance of arrival but what's the f**king point of you're gonna flog lads to breaking point

Have a soft spot for Donegal and Jim, I just wish he'd drop the guru act and out himself as a GAA manager plain and simple

Captain Scarlet

David, I am not arguing but where are these stats?

It certainly wasn't. The stats back it up. Turnovers are down, fast breaks are down. Number of lead changes are all down compared to last year

Is a fast break running out of your own 45 and then stopping?

From going to games I am enjoying it and the crowd seem to enjoy more direct football.

One definite thing is that players don't automatically slow down and turn back.

.
them mysterons are always killing me but im grand after a few days.sickenin aul dose all the same.

Minus15

I've been to 4 of Down's 7 games.

I'm not sold on the 2 pointer as it just doesn't feel quite right but does bring great entertainment and excitement when it's your own team availing of it.

The tap and go is a brilliant addition. Even coaching u12s it's a case of how have we not thought of this before?

The lack of f**king about when someone concedes a free with the handing the ball back has been very good for the spectacle also.

I've been a regular attender of county matches for 30 years and played club for most of that time too and despite a general gra for the  tactical innovation that we have seen more recently, the game needed change.

Last year at a national league game in Newry I nearly nodded off. Not one thing to get excited about in the whole game. No spontaneous fist pumping, memorable moments or passages of play to lift the crowd. Nothing.

The last 2 Down games in Newry against Westmeath and in Clones have brought back the excitement again. Quality footballers showing their skills and getting you on the edge of the seat. Losing yourself in the moment and roaring the team on. The way it should be.

I've a young lad of primary school age who is football mad and I'm much more optimistic about the future of the sport for him than the way it had been shaping up the last 5 years.

These rules aren't perfect, and they will no doubt evolve. The challenges of proper implementation in the club game are still to come. However, they are a great stab at reinventing the game and hats off to the FRC for their work to date. It's night and day from last year.

As part of the experiment, if they were to play the NFL finals with the 2024 rules, it would shine further light on the need for change.

trileacman

Was at Tyrone Mayo, it was a truly truly awful game. As bad as any game played last year.

There definitely seems to be a tendency for teams to dominate long periods of matches which is a concern. At least 60 or 70% of div 1 games I seen were dominated by a team for long stretches. Dublin/Donegal, Tyrone Armagh, Dublin Kerry, Galway Derry, Tyrone Dublin. I don't buy that games are more changeable than in the past rules (unless by gale force winds). Remember Errigal/Cuala was played under the old rules and witnessed a fairly incredible comeback by Errigal.

It was a worry that a relatively mild breeze in Omagh the last day, on a day that should have been ideal for league football, was worth 10 points at half time to Tyrone. Certainly the wind seems to be a serious serious advantage. As shown when Tyrone played Armagh. Your 2 pointers and 2 point frees are made so much easier whilst a 2 point score into the wind is pretty much nullified.

I'm not sold either way on the rules. Change was needed but I think the changes made are far too drastic. 2-3 simpler changes would have affected as much positive change.

I think teams adapting to what is a huge change to the game is acting as a great leveller, hence the very close Div 1 and 2. When the tactics settle we'll see the true form of the rule changes.
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