Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification

[oakleafgael]

A question for any referee on here.
We had an u14 game at the weekend in a development league, mostly P7s on our team. We struggled getting kickouts aways with distance being a problem for young lads playing for the first time on a full sized pitch. The ref then informed us that provided the ball travels 15m and we have no-one in the arc when the ball is kicked, that we can receive the ball in the arc - in other words players can run into the arc as soon as the ball is kicked to receive the ball.
Is this correct? In our first game we were blew up any time a player touched the ball inside the arc from the kickout so its confusing.

In Tyrone and I presume for most other counties at U14 level the kickout rule is the same as last year, I.e. taken from the 21, all players must be outside the 13m arc and the defending team cannot touch the ball until it is outside the 20m arc

Is this the case throughout underage? Was at a game at the weekend and the opposition team left a forward standing behind the keeper on every kickout. Granted it was a tanking match so maybe the ref didn't care to much

That's allowed in the rules for all age groups including Senior. The only change from the rules applied at Senior is for U14 age group.

[The Trap]

Lots of people giving out managers expressing their opinions. Some thoughts.

They know the game better than anyone else, being involved in it several nights a week and thinking about it 24/7. They are best placed to know what can work and what can't.

They get well paid you will say. Maybe some do but it is money hard earned. They put massive time and effort into it.

Let them learn to coach better you will say. Where are the managers who will take over if some of these people leave? Who will replace McGeeney? Do Meath want to go back to Colm O'Rourke? Where will Galway go after Joyce? What do Donegal look like without McGuinness? How hard was it for Derry and Westmeath to find someone if there are so many managers out there who can adopt to these changes better?

Lets see some of the pundits giving out about managers take their places and see how they do!

[thewobbler]

Lots of people giving out managers expressing their opinions. Some thoughts.

They know the game better than anyone else, being involved in it several nights a week and thinking about it 24/7. They are best placed to know what can work and what can't.

They get well paid you will say. Maybe some do but it is money hard earned. They put massive time and effort into it.

Let them learn to coach better you will say. Where are the managers who will take over if some of these people leave? Who will replace McGeeney? Do Meath want to go back to Colm O'Rourke? Where will Galway go after Joyce? What do Donegal look like without McGuinness? How hard was it for Derry and Westmeath to find someone if there are so many managers out there who can adopt to these changes better?

Lets see some of the pundits giving out about managers take their places and see how they do!

If you were given the task of fixing the NHS, or indeed any public service, you'd need to be especially particular about which of the existing management personnel should be listened to.

They might know the old process better than anyone. But having fed into and profited most from understanding how it worked before will in most cases bring reluctance to change / improvement.

GAA management teams need to be treated similarly, at an arm's length. Some of them are going to lose out dramatically as a result of this change. And you know what? Good.

[clonian]

Lots of people giving out managers expressing their opinions. Some thoughts.

They know the game better than anyone else, being involved in it several nights a week and thinking about it 24/7. They are best placed to know what can work and what can't.

They get well paid you will say. Maybe some do but it is money hard earned. They put massive time and effort into it.

Let them learn to coach better you will say. Where are the managers who will take over if some of these people leave? Who will replace McGeeney? Do Meath want to go back to Colm O'Rourke? Where will Galway go after Joyce? What do Donegal look like without McGuinness? How hard was it for Derry and Westmeath to find someone if there are so many managers out there who can adopt to these changes better?

Lets see some of the pundits giving out about managers take their places and see how they do!

If you were given the task of fixing the NHS, or indeed any public service, you'd need to be especially particular about which of the existing management personnel should be listened to.

They might know the old process better than anyone. But having fed into and profited most from understanding how it worked before will in most cases bring reluctance to change / improvement.

GAA management teams need to be treated similarly, at an arm's length. Some of them are going to lose out dramatically as a result of this change. And you know what? Good.

Oisin McConville said they should consult with managers and that's exactly what I thought. They have changed the game they played to what it was.

I would consult refs though and see what they think is actually feasible especially at club level.

[The Trap]

That's ok Clonian.....you get rid of all of these managers that you say are holding the game back and replace them with who? Maybe they will find that when they are in the same position their job is to win competitive games and do the best with the players at their disposal.

Not everyone gets the chance to manage the best team ever and then dictate to everyone else how they think the game should be played.

[Spiderlegs]

Managers were getting their last pitch in before the FRC post week 5 review.
I'm not sure I'd listen to many of them - they are thinking purely in terms of winning for their own team and themselves on a fairly short term basis, which is totally fine, but not in keeping with improving the overall health of the sport.

As far as I'm concerned there's been a considerable uplift in entertainment throughout the league thus far, and weather has been mostly poor.
Is the whole thing perfect? Absolutely not, tweaks are needed, but not wholsesale changes, and anyone expecting scrapping of rules are way off. 

My feeling is many spectators just aren't prepared to do the work to learn the new rules but will speak to how confusing it is.
I also see a growing understanding of the rules in the stands as the games have went on.

[The Trap]

So we need to get rid of all the current managers who want to win and replace them with a load of new people whose job it is to entertain the people in the crowd?

That really is a new sport we are inventing because no other sport I know is not all about winning.

Soccer will have to change a load of rules:
  -2 goals for a score from outside the box.
 - Must keep 2 forwards and 2 backs in each half at all times.
 - Keepers must hoof all kick outs into the other half like they used to.
 - Give out to the ref and the ball moved forward 50 metres.

Can you ever imagine them doing that to soccer to make it more entertaining? We want every game to be 5 4 from now in.......

[Saffron_sam20]

So we need to get rid of all the current managers who want to win and replace them with a load of new people whose job it is to entertain the people in the crowd?

That really is a new sport we are inventing because no other sport I know is not all about winning.

Soccer will have to change a load of rules:
  -2 goals for a score from outside the box.
 - Must keep 2 forwards and 2 backs in each half at all times.
 - Keepers must hoof all kick outs into the other half like they used to.
 - Give out to the ref and the ball moved forward 50 metres.

Can you ever imagine them doing that to soccer to make it more entertaining? We want every game to be 5 4 from now in.......

In a nutshell, I don't know why people talk about 'neuturals' enjoying the game, like any sport you enjoy it when your team is playing. I want to see good players playing the game not just contestant 50/50s. Like even the kickouts, yeah I don't like the keeper taking ages but there's already a mechanism there, the ref can hop the ball if he's taking the piss. That was completely fine. They actually took away the short option and then put keeper under time pressure to try pick a pass, it's insane. If that's what they want they'd be as well just doing away with kickouts and having a throw in at the half way every time there's a score if they just want things contested ffs.

[clonian]

That's ok Clonian.....you get rid of all of these managers that you say are holding the game back and replace them with who? Maybe they will find that when they are in the same position their job is to win competitive games and do the best with the players at their disposal.

Not everyone gets the chance to manage the best team ever and then dictate to everyone else how they think the game should be played.

Where did I say get rid of all of the managers?

[JPO]

Gaelic football had become perhaps the most boring sport in the world. Less and less people were attending games. So the FRC were set up to try and help our game. Modern coaches and managers want success because it enhances their CV , enabling them to earn more money by moving to a bigger club or county. Most have no loyalty, its all about money. 

[befair]

In general, the new rules have been a significant improvement on the turgid stuff we've been stuck with for the last decade. I'd scrap the forward mark, the handing the ball back to the opposition, the 2-player throw in, and the fly goalie. Definietly keep the 50 meter rule for dissent; the abuse refs get is unsustainable

[Saffron_sam20]

In general, the new rules have been a significant improvement on the turgid stuff we've been stuck with for the last decade. I'd scrap the forward mark, the handing the ball back to the opposition, the 2-player throw in, and the fly goalie. Definietly keep the 50 meter rule for dissent; the abuse refs get is unsustainable

Why not just book the player like in soccer? Players then walk the right rope for the rest of the game. In some cases managers will take them off rather than sent off. Much better than the moving the ball 50m

[statto]

In general, the new rules have been a significant improvement on the turgid stuff we've been stuck with for the last decade. I'd scrap the forward mark, the handing the ball back to the opposition, the 2-player throw in, and the fly goalie. Definietly keep the 50 meter rule for dissent; the abuse refs get is unsustainable

Why not just book the player like in soccer? Players then walk the right rope for the rest of the game. In some cases managers will take them off rather than sent off. Much better than the moving the ball 50m

The ref should not get abuse and that is why the penalty is that harsh.  Technically, you could have numerous players giving the ref abuse and only receiving a yellow card, but the ref continues to get the abuse.  The FRC want respect for ref normalised with this rule change it would seem which is fair enough.

[EoinW]

In general, the new rules have been a significant improvement on the turgid stuff we've been stuck with for the last decade. I'd scrap the forward mark, the handing the ball back to the opposition, the 2-player throw in, and the fly goalie. Definietly keep the 50 meter rule for dissent; the abuse refs get is unsustainable

Why not just book the player like in soccer? Players then walk the right rope for the rest of the game. In some cases managers will take them off rather than sent off. Much better than the moving the ball 50m

That's exactly right!  A yellow card would stop dissent just as quickly.  There never was any reason for the 50 metre penalty.

Also a great point about time wasting goalkeepers.  There was already a rule and punishment against that.

[Saffron_sam20]

In general, the new rules have been a significant improvement on the turgid stuff we've been stuck with for the last decade. I'd scrap the forward mark, the handing the ball back to the opposition, the 2-player throw in, and the fly goalie. Definietly keep the 50 meter rule for dissent; the abuse refs get is unsustainable

Why not just book the player like in soccer? Players then walk the right rope for the rest of the game. In some cases managers will take them off rather than sent off. Much better than the moving the ball 50m

The ref should not get abuse and that is why the penalty is that harsh.  Technically, you could have numerous players giving the ref abuse and only receiving a yellow card, but the ref continues to get the abuse.  The FRC want respect for ref normalised with this rule change it would seem which is fair enough.

But sure ya could have 5 players abusing the ref after he's moved it and it's still only moved once? Same principal applies. A player booked is much worse for the team and a better deterrent.