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It may be no harm to remind people what we are voting on next week :

ARTICLE 41
3 1° The State pledges itself to guard with special care the institution of Marriage, on which the Family is founded, and to protect it against attack.

Thirty-fourth Amendment of the Constitution (Marriage Equality) Bill 2015
"Marriage may be contracted in accordance with law by two persons without distinction as to their sex".


The purpose of this amendment is to redefine the accepted meaning of "the institution of marriage" as referenced in Article 41.

Letter to the Editor in today's Irish Independent
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Different can't be equal

A "Marriage Equality Referendum" is what we were originally told we would vote on, and still is.

In the meantime, the Government conveniently brought in the Children and Family Relationship Bill, passing it into law without any public discussion and throwing a spanner in the works. This should have been held over until the equality of marriage' was first decided on. Now the main debate has swung from "marriage equality" to the composition of same-sex families - deliberately confusing the original issue.

Marriage is unique, and thus has no equal or no parallel. "Equality" means equal. A union of male and female could not be equal to a union of two men or a union of two women. Why? Because they are different. Only the male-female union is capable of procreating a natural family and has been so since time immemorial.

The unique marriage union between man and woman, in a loving relationship, to procreate a natural family, with maternal and paternal parents to rear, love and protect them, has no equal on earth. No composition of same-sex family could compare.

If there is anybody in a position to contradict this and provide something more sustainable, I will change my vote from 'No' to 'Yes'.

James Gleeson
Thurles, Co Tipperary



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I hope Mr Gleeson does not mind being quoted here but he succinctly expresses a common viewpoint on the NO side.

I've absolutely no problem with Fr. Standún's views quoted above - he has obviously given thorough consideration to the issue.
There's no Right or Wrong way to vote - if we all vote conscientiously then whatever the outcome it will reflect majority thinking.

Yes - I understand the distinction. Was just expressing how marriage is viewed from one particular perspective.

Just looking at this from perspective of practicing Christians who make up a significant percentage of the population
- a proportion of these, including clergy and members of religious orders have no problem voting YES to same-sex marriage
- a proportion will vote NO as they do have genuine problems of conscience.

There is no "right" way to vote on this issue - each person should vote according to their conscience and we all obviously have a duty to be as fully informed as possible and not let any personal prejudice affect our decision.

One of the reasons that many practicing Christians will vote NO is as follows :
Marriage is a Sacrament of the Church, sodomy as practiced by many same-sex partners is a sin in the eyes of the Church so some Christians will see marriage being tainted by opening it up to same-sex couples.
People holding this viewpoint will be castigated as homophobic but this does not necessarily follow. Whether you want to take my word or not I can assure you that I neither judge nor condemn any person because they are gay.

I appreciate this viewpoint will be lambasted by some, derided by others and I will be amused by the reaction of some trolls on here.

Of course a large segment of the population are not practicing Christians and I am not for a minute denying the validity of their input to this debate.

I recognise and agree with many of the strong arguments for a YES vote but we all have our beliefs, ideals and values and in my case I'm on the NO side. Equality is a word that is bandied about a lot - let's have tolerance too.

I will be voting NO because I don't believe believe aberrant dispositions and behaviours should be normalised as it is not in the greater interests of society. I appreciate that homosexuals don't choose their sexual orientation and would not think any less of a man or woman because they are gay.

I don't understand how I can be labelled homophobic - I neither fear nor hate gay people.

Browsing through this thread and having followed the debate in the media I do wonder if the actual constitutional change that is proposed has been read and understood by all concerned. I've read many letters to the editor(s) etc. and having read the explanatory leaflet received in the post in the last few days I'm of the opinion that many contributors to the debate are actually ill-informed - I was myself.

The origin of this referendum, I believe, was a grouping that was formed to review the constitution and propose amendments if and where required - the 2 proposed amendments that we vote on this month result from the recommendations of the review group.

The most glaring fault line in the same-sex marriage debate is that members of the main political parties are not properly upfront and representing the views (whether Yes or No) of their constituents. It's ironic in the circumstances that here on this forum some of the people willing to put their heads above the parapet and go against the supposed mainstream don't actually have a vote - fair play to the boys from Armagh (There's one fair county in Ireland....).

Anyway, our constitution does not actually define marriage (up to recent years this was no debate as to it's definition) so nobody can state categorically that the constitution discriminates against gays and lesbians. Of course our actual legislation is a different matter and is subject to the parameters of our constitution. No constitution (whether that of a nation, political party, sports club) can be all things to all people - it has to formulated for the greater good (which is what this debate is all about).

I will be voting No but I do respect and understand many of the viewpoints put forward by the Yes side - I would say I am 80% NO.

Down 8/15  Laois 15/8  say the bookies.  Down will be glad of the firm ground and the sun on their backs.  I would be very nervous of the damage Down forwards could do if they click.
Donie Kingston has been our main man - will be a huge loss tomorrow.

Yes - next Saturday will be a huge test with a lot at stake for both teams. Kildare have gotten the upper hand on us over the last 8/9 years - their backs are to the wall so there's no doubt but they will be up for it. It would be a massive boost for us to come out on top.

I think we are going t obe relegated anyhow so don't see how the postponement will help at all. We are not going to beat Roscommon next weekend, Kildare are a stronger team than us despite their poor form and both Meath and Galway will more than fancy their chances against us. Fair enough the Dwon game could go either way but I can't see us getting anymore that 2/3 points which won't be enough to stay up. I haven't checked but I would say we are hot favs to make the drop.

Ok - Roscommon are on an upward curve, have had good underage teams and a good manager in John Evans. On the other hand Laois have a core of experienced players who have been operating at a higher level than Roscommon for the past number of years. If Laois have anything about them (and I believe they have) they will stop the rot next Sunday.

I'm delighted that my faith in the lads was vindicated. It's not going to get any easier from here - away to Meath & Galway, home to Kildare and away to Down - a very tall order. All we can ask is that they bring the same level of commitment to these games as they did last Sunday and que sera sera.

It is a poor reflection on the county that more supporters won't come out and support their team. The commitment these guys are giving to the jersey has to be acknowledged. It's high time for genuine Laois followers to get off their asses. Our expectations may not be too high at the moment but we can be very competitive at a level just below the top. If the supporters had more belief in the lads it would help drive us on.

I think we are going t obe relegated anyhow so don't see how the postponement will help at all. We are not going to beat Roscommon next weekend, Kildare are a stronger team than us despite their poor form and both Meath and Galway will more than fancy their chances against us. Fair enough the Dwon game could go either way but I can't see us getting anymore that 2/3 points which won't be enough to stay up. I haven't checked but I would say we are hot favs to make the drop.

Ok - Roscommon are on an upward curve, have had good underage teams and a good manager in John Evans. On the other hand Laois have a core of experienced players who have been operating at a higher level than Roscommon for the past number of years. If Laois have anything about them (and I believe they have) they will stop the rot next Sunday.

So kerry only have 35 all Irelands, and they also won the one in the polo grounds apparently.  Not a clue.

The Kerry man looked and sounded deadly for a man in his 90s. Was waiting for him to correct Desser but sadly he didn't. Then Moynihan went on a solo run for the 1947 All-Ireland too.

Funny piece in today's Irish News on the subject. Armchair Reporter, page 62. Last paragraph. Classic.

Benny - maybe you would post the article - I tried to google it with no joy.

Anyway, I think that only the older generation are well disposed towards Up for the Match - those of us who enjoy the nostalgia and reminiscences of days past.

You probably enjoy Up for the Match if
- you kicked a ball with an inner tube
- you togged out at side of ditch / boot of car
- you played on pitches with cowpats
- you may have sneaked a look at Ireland's Own as a boy.

Up for the Match can be enjoyable but the presenters are just not suited to the programme.
I enjoyed Killian Burn's monologue and Daniel (like him or loathe him) gave a fine rendition of The Boys of Killybegs.
It's a good build up to the match with enjoyable anecdotes from some of the guests. You get to know past players a bit better too.
The clip of yer wan in the kitchen going mental watching Kerry match on tv was brilliant.

.....so the Fermanagh boys can be thought a lesson in football ....

Dont Matter - you didn't take me up on previous offer of some work on the bog. Are you still free ? We could fit in some grammar lessons if it rains   C'mon Ballyfin !

[Having said that in long list of counties that don't like us they probably are at the head of the queue]

Always had a soft spot for Laois. Some ding dong battles with them in the 00s . Reckon one of the Leinster Finals played which I think we won by a point or two was one of the most enjoyable games I was ever at.
Watched an U21 final in Thurles some years ago when Laois imo threw away  an AI v Cork. Remember it because I actually was genuinely peeved that they lost.

Having said that in long list of counties that don't like us they probably are at the head of the queue.

I wouldn't necessarily agree - personally I support the Dubs when they get out of Leinster but we have our share of clowns amongst our supporters.

I'm hoping that Laois will get a decent following on the day and the lads empty the tank.