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[The problem isn't that the gaps to Wicklow, Antrim, London and Limerick will get bigger than they already are]

Anyone talking about tiering in the context of improving the game in weaker counties is, quite frankly, talking through their hole.

Hard to argue with that, if anything, it'll widen the gap between the haves and the have nots.

From a spectacle point of view (less mismatches), a tiered championship would work well but it's absolutely nothing to do with improving the lot of weaker counties. Better/more equal funding is the only way to achieve that

So you reckon the gap between Dublin and Wicklow, tyrone and antrim, mayo and London, Kerry and limerick will get wider with tiering. I would say the gap is already too wide to narrow within the next 20 years. Funding is something that people have only started to talk about in the last couple of years with the dominance of Dublin. The gap between the top teams and the rest was always there. Funding won't make a difference. Counties like Fermanagh and Wicklow have never won anything. counties like that get 2 championship games a year, 3 if they get a lucky draw. Where is the chance to progress? Tiers would at least give the weaker counties something to play for.

The problem is that, like with restoring the Divisions 1-4 setup over the 1A/1B/2A/2B a decade ago, is that the tiering will entrench the advantages the top teams have by playing each other regularly and raising the standards as a result. The problem isn't that the gaps to Wicklow, Antrim, London and Limerick will get bigger than they already are. It's that after a few years of it the gap to the likes of Laois, Down, Sligo and Tipperary will have got much wider than they already are. And like with Carlow in the hurling this year and Laois next year if they win the Joe MacDonagh Cup, that the team that goes up into the top tier will be chasing shadows and will go straight back down, and whoever follows them likewise.

As has been alluded to before, the push for tiering has little to do with concern for the weaker counties, it's driven to create an elite competition amongst the top teams and feed the media interest and generate greater revenue as a result. That Sligo might win a first round Joe Brolly Cup tie against Waterford in Nenagh is not what enthuses Croke Park about going down the road they have set themselves on.

How much wider can the gap go really? It's huge at present.  The fact that these 4 teams play in a single tournament with the likes of Dublin, Kerry is ridiculous.

The 2nd bit in bold, sure if they're in the top 2 divisions (which they should be busting themselves to do, then they will compete in tier 1.

But in any proposals, ALL counties should start in Tier 1 through their provinces and maybe after rd 1 / rd 2 of qualifers drop down to tier 2, so EVERYONE has a chance of playing EVERYONE. Surely if a county has intentions of progressing then they'll be using the pre-season / league to gear towards the championship.

3rd bit in bold, alluded to by who? the majority of people I Know are happy enough with a tiered championship and we're not Croke Pk suits or in the media. Though in fairness, a Derry man I was sitting with at the game on Sat was dead against it. Din't really say why, just that 'it'll be a pile of balls'

I wondered if you were from one of the big hitters county wise so had a quick look at your posts), post 1 was

Best football memory: 1999 Sligo JFC Q-Final - Owenmore Gaels 1-7 Ballymote 1-6. How would Owenmore have gotten on in the SFC in Sligo that year?

Kick in teeth its not in Celtic Park. Only game there this year has bee the Leitrim one!

Holding off for Mayo in round 3 

Are there many public/council owned GAA pitches anywhere in the North (or South)?

I remember Jennings Park in Newry having a GAA pitch with 2 soccer pitches running across it seemed like it was only or mostly soccer that got played there. I don't think they even have GAA posts there now.

Almost all GAA pitches are either club or school owned.

Doire Trasna play on a council owned pitch in the City

When They See Us - 9/10. Excellent, hard hitting.
Animal Kingdom - 8/10. New season on the go, good show
Mum - 7.5/10. Decent show, though a couple of characters fairly annoying

"GAA President John Horan has revealed that two different formats for a proposed tier two football championship will be put before Croke Park's Central Council before the end of June".

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2019/0612/1054926-horan-cocktail-of-complexities-around-fixtures/

[Mayo spend the most in the country on the senior fooball preparations]

Any ideas of the final figures here from this fundraiser, Mayo spend the most in the country on the senior fooball preparations, which is way more that dual counties spend on two teams?

Do you have to pay taxes on this money when being transferred back to Ireland?

Understandable when they were reaching finals, a logistical nightmare Id say with players located all over the show etc.., What was their spend last year with an early exit out of interest and how would it have compared to say 2017?

https://www.rte.ie/sport/football/2019/0609/1054385-watch-all-ireland-sfc-qualifier-round-1-draw-live/

Anyone know when the televised games appear on the iPlayer? Thanks

Good performance against a poor Wexford team. Game was over by h/t with us playing against a fair wind. A couple of great team goals.
McFaul was excellent today and McGuigan is turning into a serious player at this level.
Decent enough splattering of Derry folk down.

Depending on the exit to Tier 2 parameter proposals, Derry could well be playing Cavan or Monaghan in the qualifiers (probably not Cork due to the Munster setup). IF they are good enough to beat them then they continue in Tier 1, same as now. If not, then they drop into Tier 2 were they will have more games and a potential CP All-Ireland final which would help progression more than not playing.

You didn't answer my question!

In my own county's case, we got a great boost from beating Derry in Celtic Park in 2013, when we were near the bottom of Division 3 in the league. The impetus from that drove us to promotion first to Division 2 and then to Division 1 and a decent improvement in our championship performances even if we didn't win any titles.

I'm not so sure we'd have gotten the same bounce from winning a B title in an empty Croke Park on a Saturday afternoon.

In a word, at the minute, yes tbh.  If Derry continues to progress next year, my answer will probably change.
Derry could win 1/2 Ulster games against the likes of Cavan / Monaghan (great boosts) in Ulster. They could also potentially beat either Cavan or Monaghan in Rd 1 of the qualifiers (happy days again), then get knocked out of Rd 2 of the qualifiers...in the present setup they'd be gone for the summer.
You talk of progress, Derry would, imo progress much more as a unit by playing say 3 / 4/ 5 more competitive games during the summer in Tier 2 (you'd guess mostly Div 3 teams in the latter rounds).

We know were we are at the moment, but potential wise, we're in a much better position than a lot of teams who will continue to be canon fodder in a 1 size fits all championship.

Take my own county as an example, Derry. At the moment we're at a very low base, but progressing. The squad are busting their chops and may get a run in the qualifiers. Are we a country mile behind the top 4 at the moment? Yes. Myself and our crew who travel to the games the length and breadth of the country would love a chance to see this current incarnation of Derry compete at Croke Pk in a tier 2 AI Final. This would be seen as progression, or a stepping stone towards a good run at Sam Maguire down the line.
The fear of scant coverage / attendances a Tier 2 competition would receive won't be any worse then we'll see at Wexford on Saturday.

Would repeating your Division 4 final win by beating Leitrim in a Tommy Murphy Cup Mark II Final on a Saturday afternoon in Croke Park really be any better than taking out Cavan, Monaghan or Cork in an AI qualifier?

Depending on the exit to Tier 2 parameter proposals, Derry could well be playing Cavan or Monaghan in the qualifiers (probably not Cork due to the Munster setup). IF they are good enough to beat them then they continue in Tier 1, same as now. If not, then they drop into Tier 2 were they will have more games and a potential CP All-Ireland final which would help progression more than not playing.

Most Counties have group stages in their County Championships.

Mores the pity.

Derry club football introduced the round robin group stage in 2007 for the county championship, it lasted two years.  They moved to a back door system, that lasted 6/7 years, and then they returned back to the straight knock out a couple of years ago.

You'd wonder about that;

http://www.irishnews.com/sport/gaafootball/2019/05/29/news/derry-treasurer-resigns-amid-financial-worries-for-oak-leaf-board-1630118/

"Our accounts are published annually and tabled at the AGM with all transactions detailed.

"Our treasurer stepped down for personal reasons. Any attempt to portray that there is a wider issue is inaccurate and uninformed."

But no doubt a straight knock-out does hit the county's central pot, but it's what the clubs voted for

[the weak counties a wee to cup to play]

We could maybe just focus on targeting "weaker" counties for increased financing, underage coaching, infrastructure etc rather than just chopping and changing and deluding ourselves into thinking this will make everything rosey. How is a perennial division 4 team ever going to get better if the best they can come up against is a division 4 team in some Mickey Mouse Tommy Murphy mkII?

Yeah, do the same at club level also. I can just imagine ogra colmcille and magilligan taking on slaughtneil and ballinderry in the derry championship if they had a bit more coaching. Some people on here are nuts. Why not just give counties tiers that they have a realistic chance to compete in and progress with a few matches rather than a competition where they have 2 matches every year with no chance of winning. Teams make progress in the league playing against teams their own level and then get thrown into the championship playing against teams 2 or 3 divisions above and get beaten by 20 points plus. All the development is wasted in one fell swoop. It's mad.

Aye well you may tell the boys in Derry city they're wasting their time then! 

If there is an appetite for these elitist proposals among the weaker counties then I'll support them. This notion of giving the weak counties a wee to cup to play for cos they're gonna get hammered is the wrong approach. We've already heured ourselves out to Sky tv and along with the super 8s this is just another commercially motivated proposal to get the shite counties out of the road

talk the Cup could be slightly smaller than the Ashes trophy! 

The reality is most counties haven't a chance of winning Sam or getting anywhere close. What is the problem with letting EVERY county start in their Provinces and the All-Ireland, and if (could be a Provincial semi-final exit or qualifier Rd 2 exit etc...,) a county is not good enough in that particular year, get a chance of playing for a tier 2 cup? Personally I think it's a no brainer.

Take my own county as an example, Derry. At the moment we're at a very low base, but progressing. The squad are busting their chops and may get a run in the qualifiers. Are we a country mile behind the top 4 at the moment? Yes. Myself and our crew who travel to the games the length and breadth of the country would love a chance to see this current incarnation of Derry compete at Croke Pk in a tier 2 AI Final. This would be seen as progression, or a stepping stone towards a good run at Sam Maguire down the line.
The fear of scant coverage / attendances a Tier 2 competition would receive won't be any worse then we'll see at Wexford on Saturday.

If they bring in tiered system, what's the point of keeping the provincials? They just become the McKenna Cup. Nice to get a couple games under your belt, but ultimately, nobody gives a toss.

An open draw is the only way to go. People still remember the Meath Dublin marathon in 1991. Imagine the coverage a Dublin Kerry would get for the first round? You would sell it 10 times over.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the initial proposals from HQ are to retain the Provincials and EVERY county starts with a chance of winning Sam Maguire. IF a Div 3 or 4 team reaches their provincial final they continue on in the Sam Maguire tier. If they don't they play in a B Tier with the other Div 3 and Div 4 teams who didn't reach the Provincial final.  Surely this is fair enough for all counties?

https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1136174691297759234