Well this is the big one for Dublin in the league - Win this and promotion should be close to secure, lose and we will be right back in the chasing pack again...We owe the Farney Men for their big victory 2 years ago and I hope we do it....
It should be a very tough physical game which will suit the players in the long run....lets just hope it is a drier day than Saturday...
Would like to see Shaughnessy come back in for the next match and possibly Cahill (if fit)...hope Fennell plays as the more gametime he gets the better in the long run...Up front Brogan/Cullen need to start firing and would like to see a full forward line of Brogan, Keaney, Brogan...
I assume there will be no hassle getting tickets on the Sat as flying back for this one......
Was Shaughnessy injured on saturday?
Quote from: Gnevin on March 03, 2008, 12:55:08 PM
Was Shaughnessy injured on saturday?
He did his hamstring on Thursday.
Quote from: heffo on March 03, 2008, 12:56:00 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 03, 2008, 12:55:08 PM
Was Shaughnessy injured on saturday?
He did his hamstring on Thursday.
He's the only player when you hear he picks up an injury you think OK grand so at least it wasn't his shoulder
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 03, 2008, 12:50:16 PM
I assume there will be no hassle getting tickets on the Sat as flying back for this one......
I'd also like to know what the score is for admission - can you pay on the night or is there somewhere to buy tickets in advance?
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 03, 2008, 01:41:10 PM
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 03, 2008, 12:50:16 PM
I assume there will be no hassle getting tickets on the Sat as flying back for this one......
I'd also like to know what the score is for admission - can you pay on the night or is there somewhere to buy tickets in advance?
Usually pay at the gate in Parnell. Enjoy, it's going to be a good one!!
As Monaghan have just beaten the 3 weakest teams in Div 2 and have to play Dublin&Cork away with the 2 Meaths at home, I think the Dubs are well in the driving seat for top spot.
However if Monaghan do manage to get off to a flyer and stand their ground I trust that the Dubs can take it on the chin and we will not be reading a lot of whinging about the biased ref in the post game thread.
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2008, 02:09:15 PM
As Monaghan have just beaten the 3 weakest teams in Div 2 and have to play Dublin&Cork away with the 2 Meaths at home, I think the Dubs are well in the driving seat for top spot.
However if Monaghan do manage to get off to a flyer and stand their ground I trust that the Dubs can take it on the chin and we will not be reading a lot of whinging about the biased ref in the post game thread.
Well if Monaghan win they win - if Dublin win they win and either way I wont critiscise the ref - as I said on the Bannon discussion the first time a player goes through 70 mins without making a single mistake then they can talk about a ref and not before....
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2008, 02:09:15 PM
As Monaghan have just beaten the 3 weakest teams in Div 2 and have to play Dublin&Cork away with the 2 Meaths at home, I think the Dubs are well in the driving seat for top spot.
Not sure that Meath aren't one of the weaker teams. They've lost to Westmeath, only managed a draw with Roscommon and got 2 points for nothing from the Cork game. Not sure that this makes them any stronger than Cavan, Armagh or Roscommon.
I do agree that Monaghan have a tougher second half in Division 2.
Dont be so naive lads, if Dublin win, the ref will most certainly be criticised, surely you have been here long enough to know that ;)
Looking forward to this, should be a cracker.
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2008, 02:09:15 PM
However if Monaghan do manage to get off to a flyer and stand their ground I trust that the Dubs can take it on the chin and we will not be reading a lot of whinging about the biased ref in the post game thread.
They beat us fair and square in parnell park last time, it's going to be close.
i think the monghan forwards will fancy their chances on the dublin backs. I don't think Mongahan will be able to exploit Dublin at midfield in the abscence of Whelan though. Cahill is playing against Antrim on Friday night in his comeback game. I think it will be tight enough but i'd expect a big performance from Dublin in light of the hiding we got 2 years ago.
Hard to credit but that win in 2006 against the Dubs was the highlight of a poor season.
Some Armagh fans and pundits thought because Monaghan fielded their first choice 15 that they are supposed to firing at near full capacity - which is ridiculous.
Maybe in Monaghan's favor are the 3 games preparation. It would be hard to put a slide rule over the Dubs (gale force weather) against Cavan and compare it to Monaghans, of course not forgetting Pillar's standby comment "teams are gunning for us" factor :)
Monaghan have a fair bit of homework to do after Sundays game with Armagh. You can be sure though they won't fear Dublin, even in Parnell Park. I was at the last game and thought Dublin were complacent, thought they only had to tog out as Monaghan weren't doin that well up to that point, and 'it's only Monaghan'. Monaghan capitalised on this and left Dublin in their wake.
That was then though and this is now! You can be sure that won't happen again from a Dublin perspective, obviously. I reckon it'll be a cracker as Monaghan will be out to prove two points, one being that they are a decent team and are worthy of being top of the league and two that the last time wasn't a pure fluke..
On the player front, it's good for us that Eoin Lennon came thru the Armagh game without injury as he will be crucial to the cause in this one. I'd like to see our forwards get a bit more return from open play in this one as the margin of scores were from frees on Sunday past. It's encouraging though to win a tight local derby where Tommy Freeman doesn't register a score. Definitely not the Monaghan of old.. Our shot selection was poor on Sunda last which needs to be addressed, extra hand passing when shots should have been taken and shots being taken when hand passes should have been given..
I know it'll be a tough test for Monaghan but one that we're really lookin forward to..
Quote from: INDIANA on March 04, 2008, 09:37:30 AM
i think the monghan forwards will fancy their chances on the dublin backs. I don't think Mongahan will be able to exploit Dublin at midfield in the abscence of Whelan though. Cahill is playing against Antrim on Friday night in his comeback game. I think it will be tight enough but i'd expect a big performance from Dublin in light of the hiding we got 2 years ago.
Yeah, I'd also expect Dublin to put in a much better performance than we did versus Westmeath and Cavan. Should be a cracking game.
I wonder what position Barry Cahill will play when he's back...
Cahill as right wing back with Casey in the centre and Moran on the left.......leaving space for Brennan to play centre back when after the club final hopefully...
Hows Rory Woods been playing in the league so far this year??
I remember he had an excellent game against Dublin in parnell 2 years ago...that game was definitely one of my most dissapointing days as a Dublin fan, Monaghan didn't just beat us that day they totally outclassed us. Dublin didn't want to know about it that day at all.
Apart from going out with the right attitude I think having Conal Keaney on from the start could be the key to winning this game. Having Keaney at full forward gives the Dublin forward line much better shape and I think he kind of holds things together a bit. In my opinion he's a bit of a leader, more so than Alan Brogan. Its also great to have a target man like him to hit when you are going through a period of the game where you are struggling for a score
Is it all ticket?
There is a bit of talk about the Monaghan match from 2 years ago. If memory serves me correct this was played the week after the battle of Omagh and all the crap that followed in its wake. It would be hard to believe that Dubs minds that day were fully focused on the match and while Monaghan dished out a good hiding there might be a ligitimate excuse that minds were still more focused on issues further North. Still think theres a chance Monaghan might turn us over this year anyway. Hopefully not. Dubs defence will have to be stronger and tighter.
Quote from: dubsnsubs on March 04, 2008, 12:56:55 PM
There is a bit of talk about the Monaghan match from 2 years ago. If memory serves me correct this was played the week after the battle of Omagh and all the crap that followed in its wake. It would be hard to believe that Dubs minds that day were fully focused on the match and while Monaghan dished out a good hiding there might be a ligitimate excuse that minds were still more focused on issues further North.
Balls. Dublin underestimated and were then outclassed. What went on the week previous is of little relevance.
strong indications that cahill is being earmarked for centre back this year or collie moran. But Catser at 6 may will be tried during the league. i fear for the vincents lads chances this year as i believe the championship 15 will be near picked by the time they get back- i firmly believe our first 15 this year wil be identical to last year's bar maybe one position which is cullen swopping with moran-that's what i've heard coming from the camp.
They'll not under estimate them this time round. The win over Armagh and last years run in the championship means they'll be well respected. Is O'Shaunessy likely to be fit. The defence will need to tighten up. How come Hanratty didn't start for Monaghan v Armagh?
Quote from: Sky Blue on March 04, 2008, 01:15:39 PM
The defence will need to tighten up. How come Hanratty didn't start for Monaghan v Armagh?
Monaghan have added to their panel this year with the likes of Ronaghan and McGuigan who didn't feature last year. As a result, players of the calibre of Gollogly and Hanratty aren't getting automatic starts. It leaves us with a much healthier bench than last year.
Do dublin sell any of their parnell tickets through ticketmaster??
Quote from: INDIANA on March 04, 2008, 01:15:11 PM
strong indications that cahill is being earmarked for centre back this year or collie moran. But Catser at 6 may will be tried during the league. i fear for the vincents lads chances this year as i believe the championship 15 will be near picked by the time they get back- i firmly believe our first 15 this year wil be identical to last year's bar maybe one position which is cullen swopping with moran-that's what i've heard coming from the camp.
Surely Moran would be playing at centre back during the league then???
All-Ireland final is on Monday after Monaghen match so would assume Brennan, Quinn, Connolly will be back in the fold for the last 2/3 matches anwyay...
I'd be willing to lay any odds that our starting 15 will be identical to last year's aside from positional switches.
As regards Monghan it's all good for Dublin in 2 weeks if Banty believes some of those forwards are better than Hanratty. I thought he was excellent last year for them. I'd be surprised if thye don't play their best 15 against Dublin.
Banty will play his current best 15 INDIANA, but Ciaran Hanratty might not feature in that set;
Hanratty's performance as regards last year;
Monaghan V Down - excellent, best player that day, never seen him as good..
Monaghan V Derry - out-muscled by stern Derry corner back, kept scoreless and didn't really add much
Monaghan V Tyrone - relatively quiet that day too..
He is a class act, I'm not doubting that or being overly critical but still isn't the finished article. When Rory Woods is on form he offers more I feel as he can drop deep or play out the field. His distribution into a 2 man FF line is very good also. Hanratty will get his day though, and I wouldn't mind seeing him start against Dublin, but I doubt it'll happen if the current 15 stay injury free in the run in.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 04, 2008, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: dubsnsubs on March 04, 2008, 12:56:55 PM
There is a bit of talk about the Monaghan match from 2 years ago. If memory serves me correct this was played the week after the battle of Omagh and all the crap that followed in its wake. It would be hard to believe that Dubs minds that day were fully focused on the match and while Monaghan dished out a good hiding there might be a ligitimate excuse that minds were still more focused on issues further North.
Balls. Dublin underestimated and were then outclassed. What went on the week previous is of little relevance.
Of little relevance to Monaghan maybe but deffo of relevance to Dublin. Dont fool yourself.
Not fully focused more than underestimated I would be fairly sure.
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 04, 2008, 12:04:54 PM
Cahill as right wing back with Casey in the centre and Moran on the left.......leaving space for Brennan to play centre back when after the club final hopefully...
surely that man's not still getting a game?
Word from Monaghan is its all ticket
From what source?
Quote from: Maguire01 link=topic=6984.msg#msg date=
From what source?
Lad i work with , says the PRO of the club in Monaghan is looking for numbers as the county board want to set their request to Dublin. No reason not to believe him if it's true would expect official word late tomorrow
don't know why -it's never full for all ticket games anyway.
A number of posts on hoganstand.com saying that Monaghan are being allocated 1,500 tickets to be distributed through clubs with none on general sale...... not sure how reliable that is (hope it's not - i'm officially on the hunt for a ticket!)
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 04, 2008, 09:39:04 PM
A number of posts on hoganstand.com saying that Monaghan are being allocated 1,500 tickets to be distributed through clubs with none on general sale...... not sure how reliable that is (hope it's not - i'm officially on the hunt for a ticket!)
Ticket hunt and its only march
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&id=9667&viewstory=yes
Word on The Hill
Dubs v Monaghan all-ticket clash
Dublin's NFL Division 2 game against Monaghan in Parnell Park on Saturday evening, March 15 will be all-ticket.
The sides currently are level at the top of the table with Monaghan ahead by scoring difference.
Ticket information to follow but as usual preference given to Parnell Park ticket holders and club members.
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 04, 2008, 01:56:23 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on March 04, 2008, 01:15:11 PM
strong indications that cahill is being earmarked for centre back this year or collie moran. But Catser at 6 may will be tried during the league. i fear for the vincents lads chances this year as i believe the championship 15 will be near picked by the time they get back- i firmly believe our first 15 this year wil be identical to last year's bar maybe one position which is cullen swopping with moran-that's what i've heard coming from the camp.
Surely Moran would be playing at centre back during the league then???
All-Ireland final is on Monday after Monaghen match so would assume Brennan, Quinn, Connolly will be back in the fold for the last 2/3 matches anwyay...
Yeah, I don't see any of the Vins lads getting a start come championship - the championship team pretty much picks itself if everyone is fit and well:
Cluxton
Henry - McConnell - Griffin
Casey - Cahill - Moran
Ryan - Whelan
Cullen - Sherlock - Vaughan
Brogan - Keaney - Brogan
(forwards in no particular order!!)
The only two at any kind of risk would be Ryan and Sherlock - purely because they are the ones that Pillar has dropped before.
What will change this year is our subs. Any new lads now are playing to be first or second choice sub. And with injuries, suspensions, or mares, its unlikely we'll have our first 15 every game.
Quote from: Hound on March 05, 2008, 10:07:44 AM
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 04, 2008, 01:56:23 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on March 04, 2008, 01:15:11 PM
strong indications that cahill is being earmarked for centre back this year or collie moran. But Catser at 6 may will be tried during the league. i fear for the vincents lads chances this year as i believe the championship 15 will be near picked by the time they get back- i firmly believe our first 15 this year wil be identical to last year's bar maybe one position which is cullen swopping with moran-that's what i've heard coming from the camp.
Surely Moran would be playing at centre back during the league then???
All-Ireland final is on Monday after Monaghen match so would assume Brennan, Quinn, Connolly will be back in the fold for the last 2/3 matches anwyay...
Yeah, I don't see any of the Vins lads getting a start come championship - the championship team pretty much picks itself if everyone is fit and well:
Cluxton
Henry - McConnell - Griffin
Casey - Cahill - Moran
Ryan - Whelan
Cullen - Sherlock - Vaughan
Brogan - Keaney - Brogan
(forwards in no particular order!!)
The only two at any kind of risk would be Ryan and Sherlock - purely because they are the ones that Pillar has dropped before.
What will change this year is our subs. Any new lads now are playing to be first or second choice sub. And with injuries, suspensions, or mares, its unlikely we'll have our first 15 every game.
Are you mad? The back line is shite , Breannan in for Casey ,Cullen back where he's meant to be and Mossy in the forwards
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:16:36 AM
Are you mad? The back line is shite , Breannan in for Casey ,Cullen back where he's meant to be and Mossy in the forwards
No your mad, I'm right ;)
No way is Quinn better than any of the six I've mentioned, and probably more besides. But I'm sure he'll get runs from the bench.
Cullen proved last year that he's not cut out for centre back. He's too easlily put out of a game. Picking him at 10 with the option to have him roaming around the half back line makes perfect sense.
Brennan is young and still has to prove he's got what it takes in the heat of championship in Croker. He should get chances this year, but it may be 2009 before he establishes himself as first choice.
Quote from: Hound on March 05, 2008, 10:28:49 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:16:36 AM
Are you mad? The back line is shite , Breannan in for Casey ,Cullen back where he's meant to be and Mossy in the forwards
No your mad, I'm right ;)
No way is Quinn better than any of the six I've mentioned, and probably more besides. But I'm sure he'll get runs from the bench.
Cullen proved last year that he's not cut out for centre back. He's too easlily put out of a game. Picking him at 10 with the option to have him roaming around the half back line makes perfect sense.
Brennan is young and still has to prove he's got what it takes in the heat of championship in Croker. He should get chances this year, but it may be 2009 before he establishes himself as first choice.
Quinn had a poor season last year , he was carrying an injury apparently
He was Dublin's top score in 2005, second too Keaney in 2006 , Surely their is a place on the team for him
Playing Moran at forward last year was a joke ,he's no forward and either is Cullen, If he's not good enough at back then he's not good enough. Also you've no shocko on your team ! Your taking the piss right?
I would like to see
Cluxton
Griffen McConnell Henry
Cahil Brennan Moran
Whelan Ryan
Cullen Sherlock Vaughan
Brogan Keaney Brogan
Cullen can play as a forward and did well in 06 - he will however do what Moran did last year and float back around the half back line but without the requirements to mark a centre forward like he had to last year so he can attack more....
Quinn unlikely as Vaughan is the free taker and Quinn to come off the bench - though either him or Connolly could take Sherlocks place and he could come off the bench...
Its nice to have guys like Connolly/Quinn/McMenamon/Bonner to come off the bench though..
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:40:10 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 05, 2008, 10:28:49 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:16:36 AM
Are you mad? The back line is shite , Breannan in for Casey ,Cullen back where he's meant to be and Mossy in the forwards
No your mad, I'm right ;)
No way is Quinn better than any of the six I've mentioned, and probably more besides. But I'm sure he'll get runs from the bench.
Cullen proved last year that he's not cut out for centre back. He's too easlily put out of a game. Picking him at 10 with the option to have him roaming around the half back line makes perfect sense.
Brennan is young and still has to prove he's got what it takes in the heat of championship in Croker. He should get chances this year, but it may be 2009 before he establishes himself as first choice.
Quinn had a poor season last year , he was carrying an injury apparently
He was Dublin's top score in 2005, second too Keaney in 2006 , Surely their is a place on the team for him
Playing Moran at forward last year was a joke ,he's no forward and either is Cullen, If he's not good enough at back then he's not good enough. Also you've no shocko on your team ! Your taking the piss right?
Quinn's a good man to get a goal, but he's not as good a footballer as the other 6. As for Cullen not being a forward, if it was the last minute of a big game with the scores level, the ball in the hands of a Dublin forward with a shooting opportunity from 30 yards - would you prefer Cullen or Quinn to be the man on the ball? I'd pick Cullen every time, without hesitation. More importantly so would Pillar. And in any event Pillar will always play with one forward who can help out in the backs when the need arises.
Shocko's a very good corner back. But just behind Griffin and Henry in the pecking order. There might be a chance I suppose that Pillar will punish Griff for going to Oz for a few months.
Quote from: Hound on March 05, 2008, 11:03:55 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:40:10 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 05, 2008, 10:28:49 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 05, 2008, 10:16:36 AM
Are you mad? The back line is shite , Breannan in for Casey ,Cullen back where he's meant to be and Mossy in the forwards
No your mad, I'm right ;)
No way is Quinn better than any of the six I've mentioned, and probably more besides. But I'm sure he'll get runs from the bench.
Cullen proved last year that he's not cut out for centre back. He's too easlily put out of a game. Picking him at 10 with the option to have him roaming around the half back line makes perfect sense.
Brennan is young and still has to prove he's got what it takes in the heat of championship in Croker. He should get chances this year, but it may be 2009 before he establishes himself as first choice.
Quinn had a poor season last year , he was carrying an injury apparently
He was Dublin's top score in 2005, second too Keaney in 2006 , Surely their is a place on the team for him
Playing Moran at forward last year was a joke ,he's no forward and either is Cullen, If he's not good enough at back then he's not good enough. Also you've no shocko on your team ! Your taking the piss right?
Quinn's a good man to get a goal, but he's not as good a footballer as the other 6. As for Cullen not being a forward, if it was the last minute of a big game with the scores level, the ball in the hands of a Dublin forward with a shooting opportunity from 30 yards - would you prefer Cullen or Quinn to be the man on the ball? I'd pick Cullen every time, without hesitation. More importantly so would Pillar. And in any event Pillar will always play with one forward who can help out in the backs when the need arises.
Shocko's a very good corner back. But just behind Griffin and Henry in the pecking order. There might be a chance I suppose that Pillar will punish Griff for going to Oz for a few months.
Shocko is our best corner back and should be first choice ,if not in the corner play half back , but i'd push griffin up and have shocko in the corner . Cullen has had 4 shots on goal in the last few league matches and made a bags of them Quinn ,every time .Over the past 3 year quinn would still be in the top 3 scorers for Dublin ,not as much style as Brogan but more substance , epically considering how bad brogan is at the minute
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 04, 2008, 09:39:04 PM
A number of posts on hoganstand.com saying that Monaghan are being allocated 1,500 tickets to be distributed through clubs with none on general sale...... not sure how reliable that is (hope it's not - i'm officially on the hunt for a ticket!)
There was a couple of hundred monaghan fans, at most, in Parnell Park last time we played. Why the sudden need for 1500 tickets?
Quote from: tayto on March 05, 2008, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 04, 2008, 09:39:04 PM
A number of posts on hoganstand.com saying that Monaghan are being allocated 1,500 tickets to be distributed through clubs with none on general sale...... not sure how reliable that is (hope it's not - i'm officially on the hunt for a ticket!)
There was a couple of hundred monaghan fans, at most, in Parnell Park last time we played. Why the sudden need for 1500 tickets?
Band wagon jumpers , you know what Monaghan are like as soon as March comes around its a mad rush for tickets ;D
The smell of Dublin blood in the air holds a great attraction for Monaghan fans ;D
QuoteTickets for this game will be available from the competing Counties only. If you are a member of a club in either County you will be able to buy from your Club.
Just got this in an email from GAA HQ. Anyone with a spare, or able to get one, please drop me a PM. I bought the ticket package for the home games, but assumed this one would be handy enough to pay in at the gate.
Gnevin, while Quinn might make an argument for a place, saying he was top scorer in certain seasons is irrelevant. how many handy frees were amongst those scores?
He wont get a sniff of the frees this year. That said, he does seem to be improving from play.
But I wouldnt drop anyone off that team to accomodate him.
Impact sub.
Quote from: tayto on March 05, 2008, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 04, 2008, 09:39:04 PM
A number of posts on hoganstand.com saying that Monaghan are being allocated 1,500 tickets to be distributed through clubs with none on general sale...... not sure how reliable that is (hope it's not - i'm officially on the hunt for a ticket!)
There was a couple of hundred monaghan fans, at most, in Parnell Park last time we played. Why the sudden need for 1500 tickets?
haha
quite true actually. but i recall that i took a mate who is a dublin 'fan' to that game. Just as well, as he would have had bother finding it- he never knew where parnell park was!!!!
you get this with every county. so enough of your smart comments ;)
I've only been in parnell park twice, both times when monaghan played dublin in the league (think around '98 & '06). Paid at the gate the first game and just picked up a ticket outside for the '06 game. On both occasions Monaghan won having played very well (in fact probably their best performances of the respective years.)
Hoping for a win again this time around but for a better summers therafter too!!!
btw: i'll enquire of the local club for tickets tomarrow night. If none are available, i'll take my chances on getting them outside Parnell park again.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 05, 2008, 01:31:35 PM
Gnevin, while Quinn might make an argument for a place, saying he was top scorer in certain seasons is irrelevant. how many handy frees were amongst those scores?
He wont get a sniff of the frees this year. That said, he does seem to be improving from play.
But I wouldnt drop anyone off that team to accomodate him.
Impact sub.
No idea 1-29 in 2005 ,3-14 in 2006 , i don't recall any peno's( in 06) did we really get 43 points from frees in 05 and 06? Plus Keaney gets a few frees .
If it is all ticket and anyone has any spares can you please let me know as not flying in until Friday night before the game...
God bless the parnell pass ;D
so DSFM we're going with the same full back line as last year? God help us. And anyone who wants to disregard what i've said just watch repeats of the o byrne cup final - or last saturday eveing and other episodes over the years. We won't win the big one unless we find some sticky corner backs. All our defenders are very good footballers- but maybe too good. We need to find at least one player for the full back line- who cares about nothing else except defending. Also jayo hasn't the gas for 70 mins- he should be the impact sub. Makes sense to bring someone with pace off the bench- that's what worries defenders in the last 15 mins.
Quote from: INDIANA link=topic=6984.msg#msg date=
so DSFM we're going with the same full back line as last year? God help us. And anyone who wants to disregard what i've said just watch repeats of the o byrne cup final - or last saturday eveing and other episodes over the years. We won't win the big one unless we find some sticky corner backs. All our defenders are very good footballers- but maybe too good. We need to find at least one player for the full back line- who cares about nothing else except defending. Also jayo hasn't the gas for 70 mins- he should be the impact sub. Makes sense to bring someone with pace off the bench- that's what worries defenders in the last 15 mins.
In my opinion shocko is that player. The defense it 10 times better with him in it
Indiana - To me it is not only the fullback line that is at fault...it is the ball coming into them that is too easy at times.....With a halfback line of Cahill, Brennan, Moran and with Cullen as a sweeper I think we would be a lot tighter at the back...and our losses to me come from poor misses up front more than just the fullback line...
Who would Shocko replace - when he came out he was excellent but he needs to take his chances when he comes on and he gets injured at poor times.....If he proves a better corner back I have no problem at all with him being picked but at the moment I haven't seen it yet....
If Quinn/Connolly/Bonner get a starting place I would be delighted and keep Jayo on the bench....
Out of interest who would you value more in the team, Griffin or Cahill?
No they don't DSFM - 3-4 years ago yes- but now it is the defence that is the problem and the stats back this up. Dublin have hit a winning total in every game they've lost back to and including 2005- but they've conceded badly. I agree the defensive system hasn't been up to scratch as we don't seem to have one.
But i'm tired of seeing dublin corner backs up the pitch scoring points- they also have a tendency to shadow rather thsn attack the ball. I accept that if there is space in front you can't always get to it ahead of the forward. But look at the likes of Padraig reidy and marc o se from kerry they play from the front and attack the ball. That coupled with a proper defensive system would help the defence in general and tighten the ship.
Quote from: Main Street on March 05, 2008, 08:24:01 PM
Out of interest who would you value more in the team, Griffin or Cahill?
Thats a tough one, they're both solid players. If pushed i'd say Griff as we have more decent HBs than CBs right now.
these DCU guys on both sides will know each other's games inside out!
DUB
Cluxton
Casey
McConnell
Cullen
MON
lennon
Hanratty
smyth
corey
McAdam
will add extra spice to the game as they 'll be going in that bit harder for bragging rights
Indiana - If they have been kicking winning scores in each match then the opposition can't have had decent backs or defensive systems...and the Kerry backs also come up the pitch and score points...Missing chances was Cosgrove missing an open goal, Vaughan missing a simple free for example against Kerry...
Dublin suffer from a weakness at fullback as we haven't got anyone to take over from Paddy Christie and also with Cullen not being a "stopper" at centre half back....that is why I think while the defensive system was pretty ok last year the personell invovled in certain positions weren't right...
I also feel that we suffer from being too nice further up the field.....Kerry/Tyrone/Armagh forwards are very cynical about commiting fouls in the opposition half in order to allow the defence regroup.
Moran is far more suited to a wingback role than the free man role.
Cullen is far more suited to the free man than the centre back
Cahill will be better on the right wing than the left wing
Brennan will be the stopper at CHB
McConnell should be better with a years experience under his belt..
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 06, 2008, 10:16:00 AM
I also feel that we suffer from being too nice further up the field.....Kerry/Tyrone/Armagh forwards are very cynical about commiting fouls in the opposition half in order to allow the defence regroup.
:D :D Two words 'Mark Vaughan'
Quote from: mattockranger on March 06, 2008, 10:02:35 AM
these DCU guys on both sides will know each other's games inside out!
DUB
Cluxton
Casey
McConnell
Cullen
MON
lennon
Hanratty
smyth
corey
McAdam
will add extra spice to the game as they 'll be going in that bit harder for bragging rights
FYI Mattock Dick Clerkin is playin with DCU this year also.
Quote from: dubinhell on March 06, 2008, 09:42:38 AM
Quote from: Main Street on March 05, 2008, 08:24:01 PM
Out of interest who would you value more in the team, Griffin or Cahill?
Thats a tough one, they're both solid players. If pushed i'd say Griff as we have more decent HBs than CBs right now.
Just I was surprised that Griffin was not even nominated for an all star last year and 2? others nominated ahead of him.
According to Gaelic Life, Monaghan have requested this game be moved to Croke Park, but the GAA won't facilitate this.
good - because it has no business in croke park with the club finals on the monday.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 08, 2008, 05:27:48 PM
good - because it has no business in croke park with the club finals on the monday.
What difference does that make? Different day = play both. At this time of year the pitch should be well able to handle it.
absolutely not- parnell park is our pitch for the league. The gaa won't even allow the club finalists have a training session prior to paddys day- and monaghan want them to play a league match there? I'll tell you what they can do the same as the club finlaists and walk around croke park on the 15th on their way to parnell Park.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 08, 2008, 05:46:08 PM
absolutely not- parnell park is our pitch for the league. The gaa won't even allow the club finalists have a training session prior to paddys day- and monaghan want them to play a league match there? I'll tell you what they can do the same as the club finlaists and walk around croke park on the 15th on their way to parnell Park.
I don't think it's a case of Monaghan wanting Croke Park as such - just wanting to accommodate the number of people who want to see the game. It would appear that some Dublin fans will miss out here also - it's not all about Monaghan, however the allocation of tickets to Monaghan is apparently quite small.
At the same time Indiana, i'm not sure why you're getting so worked up about it. I didn't expect my posts to get such a hostile response.
So I guess the chances of tickets are pretty slim then!!!!!
all ticket at parnell park are never sold out- there is always space- a match in croker would be ridiculous unless they gave away 40,000 free tickets to the schools. DSFM i'd be shocked if you can't get a ticket- it's never been sold out before for an all-ticket -it's too early for teh sunshine boys yet.
Jaysus the Monaghan management have some neck. First they had a whinge at the Dubs not offering to play Cork, now they want them to give up home advantage for this game.
Some neck on them :D
Crafty hoors
Quote from: INDIANA on March 08, 2008, 08:04:20 PM
all ticket at parnell park are never sold out- there is always space- a match in croker would be ridiculous unless they gave away 40,000 free tickets to the schools. DSFM i'd be shocked if you can't get a ticket- it's never been sold out before for an all-ticket -it's too early for teh sunshine boys yet.
I'd bloody better - flying home for this one as its a split family match...
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 08, 2008, 08:17:32 PM
flying home for this one as its a split family match...
Your family split up over a Dubin V Monaghan game?
Jesus sorry man.
;)
Well at least for sure we can say he has a better half.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 09, 2008, 01:21:10 PM
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 08, 2008, 08:17:32 PM
flying home for this one as its a split family match...
Your family split up over a Dubin V Monaghan game?
Jesus sorry man.
;)
Older generation are Monaghan - younger sensible generation are Dublin!!!!
Dublin's NFL Division 2 game against Monaghan in Parnell Park on Saturday evening, March 15 will be all-ticket.
The sides currently are level at the top of the table with Monaghan ahead by scoring difference.
Stand Tickets €15
Terrace Tickets €13
Students €5
Senior Citizens €5
Please note the following arrangements : -
Everybody entering the ground will require a ticket. Exception - Parnell Park Ticket holders will be admitted on production of their current card.
Due to capacity restrictions, and as advised by Croke Park, Stand tickets are available for adults only and a limited number of Senior Citizens.
Adults, Senior Citizens, Students and Juveniles can purchase tickets for the terraces.
Applications for tickets to be submitted to john@dublingaa.ie before 9am on Monday 10th March. Tickets will be available for collection from Parnell Park on Wednesday 12th March from 2.30 - 7.30pm. Club Cheque only - no cash.
Tickets will be limited as allocations have been made by Croke Park to Monaghan. In the event that demand exceeds supply tickets will be allocated proportionally to the number of affiliated club teams.
There are no Group Passes for clubs available.
Kind regards
John Costello (Dublin County Board CEO)
Wow a whole 20 minutes to apply
Quote from: Gnevin on March 10, 2008, 08:38:47 AM
Applications for tickets to be submitted to john@dublingaa.ie before 9am on Monday 10th March. Tickets will be available for collection from Parnell Park on Wednesday 12th March from 2.30 - 7.30pm. Club Cheque only - no cash.
Tickets will be limited as allocations have been made by Croke Park to Monaghan. In the event that demand exceeds supply tickets will be allocated proportionally to the number of affiliated club teams.
There are no Group Passes for clubs available.
Kind regards
John Costello (Dublin County Board CEO)
Wow a whole 20 minutes to apply
The public cannot apply via this route gnevin!!! This is only for clubs.
If there are any tickets left over, then these will go on general sale to the public on Thursday or Friday.
Dubs beaten by Antrim on Friday:
From hill16.ie
QuoteAntrim were full value for their senior football challenge victory at Innisfails on Friday night.
Indeed the Ulster side could have won by a lot more if they had not squandered so many point scoring chances up front.
They also had sub goalkeeper Sean McGreevey to thank for two fine saves late in the second half when he firstly denied Brendan McManamon and later John O'Brien with half-time sub Kevin Bonner setting up the one-on-one chances on both occasions.
Barry Cahill made his return from injury and began well before fading - no doubt due to lack of match fitness while up front Ray Cosgrove and Eoghan O'Gara were the pick of Dublin's attack.
SCORERS - Antrim: CJ McGourty 0-6 (0-3f), K Niblock,T O'Neill, M McCann, S Burke 0-2 each, M Magill, E O'Neill 0-1 each. Dublin: R Cosgrove 0-4 (0-1f, 0-1 '45'), E O'Gara, C Whelan, J O'Brien 0-2 each, D O'Mahony, D Lally, C Keaney (0-1f), K Bonner 0-1 each.
ANTRIM - J Finucane; J Loughrey, T Convery, K O'Boyle; T Scullion, J Crozier, S McVeigh; J Quinn, M McCann; P Close, K Niblock, T O'Neill; CJ McGourty, B Hasson, M Magill. Subs: E O'Neill for Crozier (ht), S Burke for Quinn (48), M Dougan for Niblock (56), S McGreevy for Finucane (59).
DUBLIN - J Leonard; C Prendeville, R McConnell, D Murray; I Kavanagh, B Cahill, D Lally;C Whelan, D O'Mahony; E O'Gara, R Cosgrove, N Corkery, C Keaney, G Cullen, J Donnelly. Subs: B McManamon for Cullen (ht), K Bonner for Donnelly (ht), G Lewis for McConnell (45), J O'Brien for Keaney (51), C Daly for Whelan (51), D Ryan for Cahill (56).
REF: C Reilly (Meath).
I'm not whinging here but I think 1500 out of 13000 is a bit slim.. Given the fact they are the top two teams etc. It's clearly obvious that interest is huge in Monaghan for this one..
Quote from: Hound on March 10, 2008, 08:52:02 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 10, 2008, 08:38:47 AM
Applications for tickets to be submitted to john@dublingaa.ie before 9am on Monday 10th March. Tickets will be available for collection from Parnell Park on Wednesday 12th March from 2.30 - 7.30pm. Club Cheque only - no cash.
Tickets will be limited as allocations have been made by Croke Park to Monaghan. In the event that demand exceeds supply tickets will be allocated proportionally to the number of affiliated club teams.
There are no Group Passes for clubs available.
Kind regards
John Costello (Dublin County Board CEO)
Wow a whole 20 minutes to apply
The public cannot apply via this route gnevin!!! This is only for clubs.
If there are any tickets left over, then these will go on general sale to the public on Thursday or Friday.
Yeah i aware of that and assume the clubs where informed via other routes but what's the point of posting this with 20 minutes to ago?
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 10, 2008, 08:56:06 AM
I'm not whinging here but I think 1500 out of 13000 is a bit slim.. Given the fact they are the top two teams etc. It's clearly obvious that interest is huge in Monaghan for this one..
over 10% of the tickets how many would keep you happy?
Quote from: Hound on March 10, 2008, 08:55:23 AM
Dubs beaten by Antrim on Friday:
From hill16.ie
QuoteAntrim were full value for their senior football challenge victory at Innisfails on Friday night.
Indeed the Ulster side could have won by a lot more if they had not squandered so many point scoring chances up front.
They also had sub goalkeeper Sean McGreevey to thank for two fine saves late in the second half when he firstly denied Brendan McManamon and later John O'Brien with half-time sub Kevin Bonner setting up the one-on-one chances on both occasions.
Barry Cahill made his return from injury and began well before fading - no doubt due to lack of match fitness while up front Ray Cosgrove and Eoghan O'Gara were the pick of Dublin's attack.
SCORERS - Antrim: CJ McGourty 0-6 (0-3f), K Niblock,T O'Neill, M McCann, S Burke 0-2 each, M Magill, E O'Neill 0-1 each. Dublin: R Cosgrove 0-4 (0-1f, 0-1 '45'), E O'Gara, C Whelan, J O'Brien 0-2 each, D O'Mahony, D Lally, C Keaney (0-1f), K Bonner 0-1 each.
ANTRIM - J Finucane; J Loughrey, T Convery, K O'Boyle; T Scullion, J Crozier, S McVeigh; J Quinn, M McCann; P Close, K Niblock, T O'Neill; CJ McGourty, B Hasson, M Magill. Subs: E O'Neill for Crozier (ht), S Burke for Quinn (48), M Dougan for Niblock (56), S McGreevy for Finucane (59).
DUBLIN - J Leonard; C Prendeville, R McConnell, D Murray; I Kavanagh, B Cahill, D Lally;C Whelan, D O'Mahony; E O'Gara, R Cosgrove, N Corkery, C Keaney, G Cullen, J Donnelly. Subs: B McManamon for Cullen (ht), K Bonner for Donnelly (ht), G Lewis for McConnell (45), J O'Brien for Keaney (51), C Daly for Whelan (51), D Ryan for Cahill (56).
REF: C Reilly (Meath).
What was this game about?
Quote from: Gnevin on March 10, 2008, 08:57:26 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 10, 2008, 08:56:06 AM
I'm not whinging here but I think 1500 out of 13000 is a bit slim.. Given the fact they are the top two teams etc. It's clearly obvious that interest is huge in Monaghan for this one..
over 10% of the tickets how many would keep you happy?
25%
Quote from: Gnevin on March 10, 2008, 08:56:34 AM
Yeah i aware of that and assume the clubs where informed via other routes but what's the point of posting this with 20 minutes to ago?
Agreed. Plus John is now going to be inundated with unwanted ticket requests from fans now too!
Dublin v Antrim was just a friendly. The official opening of Innisfails new pitch with floodlights.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 10, 2008, 08:59:04 AM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 10, 2008, 08:57:26 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 10, 2008, 08:56:06 AM
I'm not whinging here but I think 1500 out of 13000 is a bit slim.. Given the fact they are the top two teams etc. It's clearly obvious that interest is huge in Monaghan for this one..
over 10% of the tickets how many would keep you happy?
25%
3250 . Catch a grip would you . 10% -12% (11.54% by my calculations) your getting is quite fair
i guarentee you'll get another 1,000 - because as i said before i have yet to see a full parnell park for an all-ticket game
How many would Monaghan take to a NFL match normally? I wouldn't think it would be much more than 1500. With All Ticket games anywhere there's alway people who buy tickets then don't use them. God knows why but they do. You see empty seats at the All Ireland finals FFS.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 10, 2008, 08:58:19 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 10, 2008, 08:55:23 AM
Dubs beaten by Antrim on Friday:
From hill16.ie
QuoteAntrim were full value for their senior football challenge victory at Innisfails on Friday night.
Indeed the Ulster side could have won by a lot more if they had not squandered so many point scoring chances up front.
They also had sub goalkeeper Sean McGreevey to thank for two fine saves late in the second half when he firstly denied Brendan McManamon and later John O'Brien with half-time sub Kevin Bonner setting up the one-on-one chances on both occasions.
Barry Cahill made his return from injury and began well before fading - no doubt due to lack of match fitness while up front Ray Cosgrove and Eoghan O'Gara were the pick of Dublin's attack.
SCORERS - Antrim: CJ McGourty 0-6 (0-3f), K Niblock,T O'Neill, M McCann, S Burke 0-2 each, M Magill, E O'Neill 0-1 each. Dublin: R Cosgrove 0-4 (0-1f, 0-1 '45'), E O'Gara, C Whelan, J O'Brien 0-2 each, D O'Mahony, D Lally, C Keaney (0-1f), K Bonner 0-1 each.
ANTRIM - J Finucane; J Loughrey, T Convery, K O'Boyle; T Scullion, J Crozier, S McVeigh; J Quinn, M McCann; P Close, K Niblock, T O'Neill; CJ McGourty, B Hasson, M Magill. Subs: E O'Neill for Crozier (ht), S Burke for Quinn (48), M Dougan for Niblock (56), S McGreevy for Finucane (59).
DUBLIN - J Leonard; C Prendeville, R McConnell, D Murray; I Kavanagh, B Cahill, D Lally;C Whelan, D O'Mahony; E O'Gara, R Cosgrove, N Corkery, C Keaney, G Cullen, J Donnelly. Subs: B McManamon for Cullen (ht), K Bonner for Donnelly (ht), G Lewis for McConnell (45), J O'Brien for Keaney (51), C Daly for Whelan (51), D Ryan for Cahill (56).
REF: C Reilly (Meath).
What was this game about?
How did Joey Donnelly play?
QuoteHow many would Monaghan take to a NFL match normally?
approx attendances:
Roscommon in Clones 5500
Cavan in breffni 10000
Armagh in Clones 8000
i'd tend to agree with our monaghan friends- there is an appetite for GAA that i wish we had- the reality is only the hardcore dublin support will be there- and if 3,000 monaghan fans are prepared to turn up - i'd give them the tickets gladly. Like i said dublin won't fill parnell for that game.- so somebody may as well have the tickets rather than having the place only 75% full as is the norm.
I got the promise of a few from a Dublin mate so hopefully he comes up thumps.
Quote from: Mid Mon on March 10, 2008, 12:44:25 PM
QuoteHow many would Monaghan take to a NFL match normally?
approx attendances:
Roscommon in Clones 5500
Cavan in breffni 10000
Armagh in Clones 8000
And
at least 4-5000 Monaghan at each of those. Away support would be just as good for somewhere as close as Dublin. Interest obviously higher than normal given that it is a top of the table clash on a good weekend.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 10, 2008, 12:50:32 PM
i'd tend to agree with our monaghan friends- there is an appetite for GAA that i wish we had- the reality is only the hardcore dublin support will be there- and if 3,000 monaghan fans are prepared to turn up - i'd give them the tickets gladly. Like i said dublin won't fill parnell for that game.- so somebody may as well have the tickets rather than having the place only 75% full as is the norm.
100% spot on, would add to the atmosphere to have a noticeable amount of away fans there for once.
Quote from: Mid Mon on March 10, 2008, 12:54:38 PM
I got the promise of a few from a Dublin mate so hopefully he comes up thumps.
If you're stuck for a ticket then we're all screwed
On a player related note, were the county men playing for their respective clubs at the weekend and if so have they all come through injury free??
I think all could play for their clubs bar the 2 Freeman's
Quote from: thebandit on March 10, 2008, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: Mid Mon on March 10, 2008, 12:54:38 PM
I got the promise of a few from a Dublin mate so hopefully he comes up thumps.
If you're stuck for a ticket then we're all screwed
I usually have a few people to sort out. I wonder how they would look upon a croke park pass.
cahill at 6 for dublin on saturday- think i mentioned that last week and was laughed out of it.
Stephen Cluxton; David Henry, Ross McConnell, Derek Murray; Paul Casey, Barry Cahill, Colin Moran; Eamon Fennell, Shane Ryan; Bryan Cullen, Alan Brogan, Mark Vaughan; Jason Sherlock, Conal Keaney, Bernard Brogan
We can all relax my Monaghan friends.
Monaghan got a second allocation and each club has received the full amount of tickets they applied for. So if you've gone through your club for tickets, you're in.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 11, 2008, 10:42:33 PM
cahill at 6 for dublin on saturday- think i mentioned that last week and was laughed out of it.
Stephen Cluxton; David Henry, Ross McConnell, Derek Murray; Paul Casey, Barry Cahill, Colin Moran; Eamon Fennell, Shane Ryan; Bryan Cullen, Alan Brogan, Mark Vaughan; Jason Sherlock, Conal Keaney, Bernard Brogan
The team for Cavan was stronger than this from what i remember
The Game is on TG4, deferred coverage.
Quote from: Main Street on March 12, 2008, 08:52:15 AM
The Game is on TG4, deferred coverage.
Also Live on Setanta..... (for those who don't already know)
McEnaney relishing showdown with Dubs
By Martin Breheny
Wednesday March 12 2008
F Monaghan supporters had been told a few years ago that by 2008 they would need pre-booked tickets for a Division 2 game in mid-March they might suspect they were being mocked.
But times have changed in Monaghan who head for Parnell Park to take on Dublin in Saturday night's all-ticket televised game, convinced that the impressive upward trend of last year is set to continue.
Monaghan have won their first three League games, raising hopes that the great days of the 1979-88 period when they won League and Ulster championship titles are on their way towards being replicated, if not actually surpassed.
"This is as big as it gets at this time of year," said manager, Seamus McEnaney, a man so wrapped in enthusiasm for the challenge of lifting Monaghan that nothing fazes him. Indeed, he thrives on the ever-increasing demands of life with the big boys.
Raise bar
"This is the type of challenge we need to see where exactly we're going. We have had to raise the bar in each the last three games and now we're very definitely going up again. Dublin have been in the top four in the country for the past five or six years and that's where we're striving to reach.
"We made good progress in 2007, but we've got to make more. That's why a game in Dublin before a full house in Parnell Park is exactly what we need," he said.
Monaghan beat Dublin when the sides last met in the League in 2006, but McEnaney regards it as completely irrelevant now, just as he disregards the theory that Monaghan should have been Dublin's opponents in last year's All-Ireland semi-final.
"Look, Kerry were the best team in the country last year. We had our chance against them in the quarter-final, but they beat us -- end of story. Last year is gone and we've forgotten all about it, other than what it taught us about trying to get to the level we want to be at."
Surviving in a very competitive Division 2 was the first target McEnaney set for Monaghan this spring, but that's all but achieved now, although he reckons they would need to take one more point to make sure. In fact, Monaghan are second favourites behind Dublin to win the group and with two promotion places at stake, their prospects of being in Division 1 next year look quite good.
"It was crucial for us to make a good start to the League because in a tough group like this, it can be mighty hard to recover if you fall behind. I'm pleased with what I have seen from the squad so far, but it's getting harder all the time. We're at that level now where every game is a huge test but taking them on is the only way you can hope to improve."
- Martin Breheny
Quote from: Gnevin on March 12, 2008, 08:48:48 AM
Quote from: INDIANA on March 11, 2008, 10:42:33 PM
cahill at 6 for dublin on saturday- think i mentioned that last week and was laughed out of it.
Stephen Cluxton; David Henry, Ross McConnell, Derek Murray; Paul Casey, Barry Cahill, Colin Moran; Eamon Fennell, Shane Ryan; Bryan Cullen, Alan Brogan, Mark Vaughan; Jason Sherlock, Conal Keaney, Bernard Brogan
The team for Cavan was stronger than this from what i remember
Would strongly disagree, although I dont rate Murray at all, has never impressed me.
Bar Murray and Fennel, thats a team of championship regulars.
Tickets on public sale from PP according to the radio
From www.hill16.ie
Ticket update: Dublin v Monagaghan
All stand tickets have been allocated for this Saturday evening's all-ticket Dublin v Monaghan NFL Division 2 clash in Parnell Park (7.0).
Terrace tickets are available from the Dublin County Board Office in Parnell Park today (Wednesday) from 2.30pm to 7.30pm
Terrace Tickets €13, Students and Juvenile Terrace €5, Senior Citizens Terrace €5
Please note the following arrangements: Everybody entering the ground will require a ticket. Exception - Parnell Park Ticket Holders will be admitted on production of their current card. However any accompanying children will need to purchase a ticket.
Anyone fancy buying up some for travelling fans?
Anyone know if there are tickets left and if they will be available tomorrow???
Tough one that D4S. Tickets are usually return to HQ on the thurs before the game and then go on sale (if available on the Thurs/Fri) Might be worth pinging GAA HQ to find out?
Monaghan name same team as they named for the Armagh game:
P McBennett, D Mone, JP Mone, D McArdle, D Freeman, G McQuaid, P McGuigan, D Clerkin, P Finlay, S Gollogly, V Corey, C McManus, R Woods, R Ronaghan, T Freeman.
Lennon isn't playing ;) :P
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2008, 12:59:45 PM
Monaghan name same team as they named for the Armagh game:
P McBennett, D Mone, JP Mone, D McArdle, D Freeman, G McQuaid, P McGuigan, D Clerkin, P Finlay, S Gollogly, V Corey, C McManus, R Woods, R Ronaghan, T Freeman.
Lennon isn't playing ;) :P
he's playing at no. 30 so ;)
Poor oul Jinxy
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on March 12, 2008, 07:45:00 PM
Anyone know if there are tickets left and if they will be available tomorrow???
According to www.hill16.ie, tickets are on sale from parnell park on Thursday 10.30 to 5.30
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2008, 12:59:45 PM
Monaghan name same team as they named for the Armagh game:
P McBennett, D Mone, JP Mone, D McArdle, D Freeman, G McQuaid, P McGuigan, D Clerkin, P Finlay, S Gollogly, V Corey, C McManus, R Woods, R Ronaghan, T Freeman.
Lennon isn't playing ;) :P
Why do they bother with this nonsense?
Lennon is named on the team I heard
P. McBennett; D. Mone, J. P. Mone, D. McArdle; D. Freeman, G. McQuaid, P. McGuigan; D. Clerkin, E. Lennon; C. McManus, V. Corey, P. Finlay; R. Woods, R. Ronaghan, T. Freeman.
I wouldn't pass any remarks on the named team.
Don't be surprised to see Jinxy lining out - his brief but effective run out against Armagh should warrant inclusion. Ronaghan hasn't done enough to date to keep his place IMO.
Mine team would be:
1. McBennett
2. D Mone
3. JP Mone
4. McArdle
5. D Freeman
6. McQuaid
7. McGuigan
8. Lennon
9. Clerkin
10. Gollogly
11. Finlay
12. McManus
13. Woods
14. Corey
15. T Freeman
I'd drop Finlay into midfield, play Woods on the 40 and leave the two boys inside.
What's the story with Vincent Corey in the half-forwards? He made a big splash at 14 any time he played there it seems to be an odd experiment by Banty...or does he move in to the square at certain points in the game or what?
Quote from: Uladh on March 13, 2008, 02:25:00 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2008, 12:59:45 PM
Monaghan name same team as they named for the Armagh game:
P McBennett, D Mone, JP Mone, D McArdle, D Freeman, G McQuaid, P McGuigan, D Clerkin, P Finlay, S Gollogly, V Corey, C McManus, R Woods, R Ronaghan, T Freeman.
Lennon isn't playing ;) :P
Why do they bother with this nonsense?
I thnk Banty just hands out a team list when the deadline to announce the team arrives. It's just a formality, something that has to be done, so 15 names are given out. I don't think it's intended to decieve or play tricks with the other team. All teams know that changes can be made right up to the throw-in.
Quote from: cavanmaniac on March 13, 2008, 05:09:43 PM
What's the story with Vincent Corey in the half-forwards? He made a big splash at 14 any time he played there it seems to be an odd experiment by Banty...or does he move in to the square at certain points in the game or what?
Return of Raymond Ronaghan gives us another tall man option at 14 that we didn't have last year. It's working out quite well, although Corey isn't as effective now.
According to hogansand.com, a limited number of tickets went onsale through ticketmaster today, but they never went online and the guy in ticketmaster in Belfast couldn't see any sign of them on his system. Anyone else have any luck?
First tickets are available through clubs only, then they're general sale from Parnell Pk and now they're apparently available through TM (possibly). Why did it have to be all-ticket in the first place. Is this a farce?
al ticket for a dublin league game is always a farce- if its full on saturday it will be a first.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2008, 06:39:09 PM
First tickets are available through clubs only, then they're general sale from Parnell Pk and now they're apparently available through TM (possibly). Why did it have to be all-ticket in the first place. Is this a farce?
I'd imagine it's to get as many Dubs as they can to attend the games. Like in any other county, not everyone who is a GAA follower is a member of a club so it gives them the chance to pick up a ticket. Any tickets that would be on general sale/through TM would be surplus to requirements by the clubs in participating counties. I can't imagine too many were returned from Monaghan however. I'm not sure if an initial allocation is made for general sale. If there was why would they wait till Thurs/Fri to release them?
Quote from: charlie linkbox on March 13, 2008, 02:49:40 PM
I wouldn't pass any remarks on the named team.
Don't be surprised to see Jinxy lining out - his brief but effective run out against Armagh should warrant inclusion. Ronaghan hasn't done enough to date to keep his place IMO.
Mine team would be:
1. McBennett
2. D Mone
3. JP Mone
4. McArdle
5. D Freeman
6. McQuaid
7. McGuigan
8. Lennon
9. Clerkin
10. Gollogly
11. Finlay
12. McManus
13. Woods
14. Corey
15. T Freeman
I'd drop Finlay into midfield, play Woods on the 40 and leave the two boys inside.
If Banty is insitant on making his one mandatory change per game could it be bringing in Gollogly in a straight swap with McManus. Again, drop Finlay, bring Woods out and leave the two big lads inside. Comments?
Jinxy will start - Banty always makes a late change and I reckon its Golloglys turn. I reckon Pillar has a fair idea this is going to happen too.
I would keep Ronaghan for now but I would put Vinny inside with himself and Tommy. That way when one comes deeper to collect a ball Tommy isn't as isolated as he was against Armagh. Vinny is too quiet at half forward anyway so moving him in won't change much in the half-forward department where Woods and Gollogly can link with Jap operating between there and mid-field. Can't wait for the game (ticket is in the back pocket)
Anyone needing tickets?
I'd say you could be stuck with the extra tickets Mid Mon. The whole ticket thing was blown out of proportion last week. Seems to be plenty floating about. I don't think it will totally sell out and if it does there will be plenty of people stuck with spare ones. I bought one for a workmate and he has since informed me that he managed to get one elsewhere. Lucky I knew another person looking one.
I will find out when I get home if we got our 4 tickets - if not Mid Mon I will take your tickets off your hands..
I got my tickets as well!
It would be a disgrace/shame however, if it wasn't full. It would mean people who would have travelled staying at home, just because they didn't manage to get a ticket.
Our club looked for 85. We got 70 only four of which are seated. We were expecting 30 so loads of people tried to source tickets elsewhere. A complete mess!!!!
Yeah, but at least there's a new logo ::)
game off parnell unplayable.
What?
like i said game off - the pitch is like a lake.
Nah, I'm just disappointed Indiana I had just come back with a few beers after a club game myself and was looking forward to putting the toes up and watching the match. This shaggin' country >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: INDIANA on March 15, 2008, 07:14:24 PM
like i said game off - the pitch is like a lake.
Surely this it didnt turn into a lake in 2/3 hours , what sort of time is 6 to call off a game , i pity the Monaghan lads who made the trip ,surely this should be been called at 3 or 4 today
Quote from: Zulu on March 15, 2008, 07:21:14 PM
Nah, I'm just disappointed Indiana I had just come back with a few beers after a club game myself and was looking forward to putting the toes up and watching the match. This shaggin' country >:( >:( >:(
You'd think Setanta could have put on one of the other games. :(
calling off a game at 6pm? that a disgrace..
Quote from: INDIANA on March 11, 2008, 10:42:33 PM
cahill at 6 for dublin on saturday- think i mentioned that last week and was laughed out of it.
I thought you said the only change from last year would be a swap of Moran and Cullen. But in any event the fact that Moran has been playing at 7 recently meant that it was obvious as the nose on your face that Cahill would return at 6. I think gnevin was the only one who disagreed - I think he reckons it should be Brennan. The only way I see Cahill not being at 6 come championship is if we have big problems in the full back line...
Judging from the pictures on TV it looks the right decision to call off the game today. Pity it came so late.
Easter Saturday would seem the likely date to play the game
Not long home..... Left work early, etc...
Disgraceful organisation, whoever is responsible, be it the Dubs, the referee or whoever should be held to account. >:(
BTW there was youngsters training on our field at 4pm today. Surely there was one playable field in Dublin (I can think of a big one......). If Clones was unplayable you'd imagine a Monaghan league game being moved to Clontibret or Blayney, or even Ballybay before it being called off completely
That was nice. Drive from Belfast and find out when 1/2 mile from the ground.... and even then only by a phone call from someone else!
First of all, there was no freak rainstorm at the last minute - surely the state of the pitch and the weather forecast should have made this obvious at an earlier stage.
Secondly, why was there no warning to stop traffic driving right up to the ground? On hearing that it had been called off, but still not 100% sure, we pulled in to ask a Garda, who 'thought' it was off..... at 6.05! Surely the Garda should have been amongst the first to know and could have let traffic know a lot earlier?
According to rte.ie, game may be refixed for Tuesday night.
That was nice. Drive from Belfast and find out when 1/2 mile from the ground.... and even then only by a phone call from someone else!
This is SHAMBOLIC !!! >:( >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: thebandit on March 15, 2008, 10:22:36 PM
Not long home..... Left work early, etc...
Disgraceful organisation, whoever is responsible, be it the Dubs, the referee or whoever should be held to account. >:(
BTW there was youngsters training on our field at 4pm today. Surely there was one playable field in Dublin (I can think of a big one......). If Clones was unplayable you'd imagine a Monaghan league game being moved to Clontibret or Blayney, or even Ballybay before it being called off completely
Dublin don't have anyone where that can hold 13,500 even if we did i could never have been switched with only an hours notice. As i said before the pitch didn't become a lake in 5 minutes this should of been called at 2 or 3 latest
I posted a few weeks back that it was a disgrace that the Limerick/Fermanagh game was called off because of fog and here again we have another example of lack of planning and foresight. Why aren't there 2 grounds organised in every county for each league game, the main one and an alternative in the event of the first one being unplayable. Secondly why can't a local county official have the power to call off the game, in fairness to the ref he has to travel as well so his trip could avoided if the game was called off in the morning. I'm sure we can all accept there are occasions when cancellations are inevitable but when you run a sporting organisatiion in Ireland is it not prudent to have alternatives and the balls to make an early decision on games when they are in doubt.
Its an absolute disgrace that people get such short notice of postponements. I remember travelling from a weekend away in Wexford to Roscommon for a Mayo and Armagh league semi to be told on arrival that it had just been called off. There was uproar then and I had thought that a system had been brought in where a county must have a second ground available. Brian Talty was on Setanta last night saying that he thought on Thursday that the game could be in jeopardy if there was heavy rain.
To play the game on Tuesday is completely disrespectful to players and supporters, especially the Farney Army. Good Friday (the GAA won't especially with Parnell Park being beside a Church) or next Saturday (the GAA won't because the Dubs u21s need to have every opportunity to win the u21) would make more sense.
Pain in the arse had the radio on coming in from Meath, no announcements. Had parked, bought a brolly to cover the pregnant missus and didnt head a thing till the guy outside Parnell selling the "hats scarves and headbands" told us it as off.
So went home and drank tea for the night as I had a league game this morning.
Then got a text a half twelve last night to say the league game was off.
FFS that could have been a proper bank holiday saturday piss up, totally scrapped due to two late postponements!!
Must make up for it tonight!!
But the fact that match traffic was still being let in off the main road (traffic was very heavy at this stage), oblivious to a cancellation...... madness!
It's not going to be easy to get a new date that is suitable. If it's midweek, it would have to be an 8pm throw-in at the earliest i'd imagine - even then you could be pushing it to get down the road.
shambolic but is anyone surprised?
The decision to call off the game was a correct one. seen the pictures of the pitch on tv when i got home.
the decision to call off the game at 6pm shows the dis-respect the admin has for both the players and the supporters. This decision could have been made,early afternoon. The state of the pitch at lunchtime together with the weather forecast would have made the call easy.
I left at 4, got home at 8. Drove 200kms, 2 tolls passed through......the pint of stout in kittys was good...but it sure wasnt that good. :P
On the up-side, if the "replay" is not not televised, there will be a strong demand for tickets. Thankfully i still have mine ;D
Then we'll hear all the bar-stoolers at home whinging about the lack of tickets :D
..............always try and see the positive!!!
From HoganStand.com
QuoteMcEnaney wants match in Croker
16 March 2008
Monaghan football boss Seamus McEnaney wants the GAA to re-fix his side's NFL clash with Dublin for next weekend at Croke Park.
McEnaney and his team travelled to Parnell Park yesterday for their date with the Dubs but referee Syl Doyle cancelled the game after a pitch inspection deemed the surface unplayable.
"I always said that this game could have been played in Croke Park in front of 30,000 or 35,000," said a disappointed McEnaney.
"There are 11,000 or 12,000 tickets sold so they have that money in the back already so let's do the game in Croke Park next Saturday night."
Meanwhile Dubs boss Paul Caffrey said the decision, although a late one, was the correct one to make:
"We have a duty of care over our players irrespective of whether the match is sold out or live on TV," said Caffrey.
"I walked the pitch and the referee made the right decision. We're disappointed because we trained hard all week for this. We don't care if it's refixed for Croke Park."
mcenaney is spot on they should play the refixed game in croker. imo they'd get the 30-40k needed to make it worthwhile..
Quote from: magickingdom on March 16, 2008, 02:53:09 PM
mcenaney is spot on they should play the refixed game in croker. imo they'd get the 30-40k needed to make it worthwhile..
Then why was the DCB struggling to sell tickets? Its not warm enough for Croker yet , plus the nell is our home ground and we should n't give that up
Heard McEnaney on Radio Ulster this afternoon. He was saying that the GAA already had the money for the game and that they should open up Croker for free basically to get a big crowd.
Quote from: Gnevin on March 16, 2008, 03:28:08 PM
Then why was the DCB struggling to sell tickets? Its not warm enough for Croker yet , plus the nell is our home ground and we should n't give that up
Not wanting to start any sort of an arguments..... But you're absolutely right!! Parnell park is Dublin's home ground, and it should be used (when playable) for all Dublin home games in the League and
ChampionshipCroke park should only be used as a neutral venue (from Leinster final onwards). Think this would be fair for all counties and give Dublin a true home advantage (maybe even allowing Parnell park to be expanded)!!!
...... Ofcourse the GAA wouldn't make as much money, therefore it will never happen.
will you ever go and feck off- when you're looking for money for your club the next time- bear in mind dublin contribute largely to the GAA coffers over the summer months- if we played in parnell there's d be some drop in income- as for perceived advantage- if you clan't play football wel in Croke Park you should just give up.
I presume that as the DCB has already stated that due to club commitments they'll have no free dates from here till winter to play refixtures that Monaghan will be given the points.
the game has been re-fixed for parnell park, next sunday at 2.30pm
Balls. Not very convenient.
Ayh, made the trip to and only found out when I was mins away from Parnell Park. Not ideal but wasn't surprised really. I had drove to Dub in the afternoon ans it was getting worse the further south I went so I reckoned it'd be called off..
Re-fixing it for an Easter Sunday is hardly ideal either but we'll take it. I'd rather play it sooner than leave it till all other league fixtures have been fulfilled. I'm not sure about the Croker argument, Parnell Park is Dublin's home ground and so they have every right to play there. I know we have Clones (35000) which is more than capable in coping with any league game (in fact some of them are atmosphere-less there..) but Dulbin are entitiled to play their home games in their home ground.
Quote from: TBT on March 16, 2008, 04:44:08 PM
I presume that as the DCB has already stated that due to club commitments they'll have no free dates from here till winter to play refixtures that Monaghan will be given the points.
:-*
What an idiotic thing to say, the ref called the game off, not the Dubs.
Totally different from the Cork situation, and you will remember the Dubs didnt say they wouldnt be able to replay the Cork game due to other fixtures, that was Meath.
The monaghan manager seems dead nuts to get this game into Croke park.
This is for one reason only, they think they have a better chance there than in Parnell park.
He should keep his mouth shut and stop trying to deny Dubin home advantage.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 17, 2008, 10:12:21 AM
The monaghan manager seems dead nuts to get this game into Croke park.
This is for one reason only, they think they have a better chance there than in Parnell park.
He should keep his mouth shut and stop trying to deny Dubin home advantage.
our parnell park form is pretty good. won the last 2 games against the dubs there, so nothing to fear about the venue ;D
Opposition supporters have a tendency to apply bizarre interpretations to Banty's quotes into meanings that he thinks your team is past it or he wants to gain an unfair advantage.
Obviously Banty wants the Croke Park experience for the team and the bigger the crowd the bigger the pressure the better for the teams preparation for those big summer games.
But he is not going to say that is he :)
Beating Dublin would be nice but there is a more important bigger picture.
As much as anything, i think he wanted to try to ensure that as many Monaghan fans as wanted got to see the game. It's not the norm for fans to be restricted by capacity at this stage of the league. Who knows, we may have the same 2 playing off again in Croker in a month or two.
How are they gonna work the ticket situation for the re-fixed match?
quite a fez people had already entered the ground and used their tickets. If people are gonna be permitted to enter with a ticket stub only whats to stop me going in and coming back out with 10 ticket stubs?
Also what about peolpe who may have lost their ticket stubs?
Quote from: donelli on March 16, 2008, 08:44:54 PM
the game has been re-fixed for parnell park, next sunday at 2.30pm
Any news on TV coverage?
Is Setanta still allowed to show the game now that's it's on a Sunday?
(I reckon they should since it's a refixture)
...or maybe tg4 will cover it??
QuoteAny news on TV coverage?
Is Setanta still allowed to show the game now that's it's on a Sunday?
(I reckon they should since it's a refixture)
...or maybe tg4 will cover it??
Tg4 have it next Sunday.
They have one hurling game live and hurling game deferred on the schedule, does that mean they will show the Dub Monaghan game after those 2
No I think they are now showing the Dub/Mon game live with the Limerick hurling game after. At least that's what I think they said after the club hurling final, my Irish isn't all it might be.
TG4 generally favour the Dublin games live - understandably due to audience numbers. It would make most sense to show the Dublin/Monaghan game live also as it's the one where not everyone who wants to go will be able to, whereas the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick will be relatively empty, as per usual.
Regardless it's great news to have it on TG4, live or deferred, on the same day Sunday. I don't have a Setanta sub.
I see that GAA Beo attracts about 100,000 viewers, that's quite good.
Fingers crossed for 'live' coverage. I was all of 200 yards from the gound on Saturday, but on holidays on the other side of the country next week - ragin!
Deferred is never as good as live, even if you don't know what way the game finished - just not the same buzz.
Quote from: Zulu on March 17, 2008, 04:08:34 PM
No I think they are now showing the Dub/Mon game live with the Limerick hurling game after. At least that's what I think they said after the club hurling final, my Irish isn't all it might be.
You're right - it is the live game. Some consolation at least.
Bloody f**kin typical - fly home for the match and it gets postponed.....GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
These things happen. There's no way the ground was playable.
Just because things happen doesn't make the pain of disappointment vanish.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 17, 2008, 04:30:24 PM
TG4 generally favour the Dublin games live -
Don't mean to pick on you, but it gas how often you see people talk about a perceived Dublin bias, yet when you look at the facts its rarely the case.
I didnt think TG4 were scheduled to show any Dublin games this year (until this postponement), and without doubt since their coverage began there is no way on earth they have favoured Dub games.
Ticket for the match.......... €15.00
Surcharge on tickets.......... €2.00
Tank of petrol for the car... €55.00
Brolly to keep the rain off... €10.00
Trip to dublin to see Monaghan v Dublin.............. POINTLESS :)
Its rough having made the trip but looking at the pics on Sat night it was probably the right decision. Can't make it next sunday - can a refund be obtained from the Monaghan Co. Board??
Allianz National Football League
Dublin V. Monaghan, 23/3/08
The GAA wish to advise patrons that tickets purchased for last Saturday's postponed Allianz National Football League football game, Dublin V. Monaghan at Parnell Park will be valid for the rescheduled fixture on Sunday, March 23rd, throw-in at 2.30pm.
Patrons who wish to claim a refund on their ticket may do so by returning their ticket to the point of purchase.
A limited number of tickets for the rescheduled fixture will be available through Ticketmaster outlets later today, Tuesday 18th.
No mention of ticket stubs!!
If i had a stub, i'd look for a refund and then buy another - just to be safe, so that you're not accused of trying to get back in on a used ticket next Sunday, or even worse, refused admission.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 11, 2008, 10:42:33 PM
Stephen Cluxton;
David Henry, Ross McConnell, Derek Murray;
Paul Casey, Barry Cahill, Colin Moran;
Eamon Fennell, Shane Ryan;
Bryan Cullen, Alan Brogan, Mark Vaughan;
Jason Sherlock, Conal Keaney, Bernard Brogan
There'll be at least two changes to the Dublin team from the one picked for the first game.
Alan Brogan and Barry Cahill are both unavailable.
Personally I'd go with Brendan McMenamin in the forwards. He did well on his starting debut last time out I thought, and was a bit unfortunate to lose his place. Alternatively the extra week might mean Whelan is a step closer to a first start of the year and he could go with a 3 man midfield.
Hopefully Ger Brennan is available to take over at 6. It would be a great opportunity for him to force himself into the reckoning. I'm not sure he's quite up to some of the press he's been receiving, but he's young and still improving, and well worth a run
Is match on TG4 ?
Quote from: orangeman on March 21, 2008, 06:32:41 PM
Is match on TG4 ?
Black and white confirmation of what was mentioned before,
TG4 14:00
GAA Beo
'Double bill with live coverage of Dublin V Monaghan in the 4th round of the Allianz National Football League and deferred coverage of Limerick V Galway in the 5th round of the Allianz National Hurling League. Presented by Micheál Ó Domhnaill with commentary by Brian Tyers Coman Goggins and Tomás Ó hAilín'.
2 a piece with 7min gone, in a far from sold out PP.
soccer keepin them away
0-3 to 0-5 23min. in the Ulstermen's favour, Monaghan seem to have lost their shape a bit and are finding it hard to create scoring opportunities. Good pace to the game but quite a few frees also and I think all the scores have come from frees except Sherlocks point. Monaghan defending brilliantly at times, there is a strong breeze but I can't tell who it's favouring.
I see Dublin have their angry face on today. >:( >:( ::)
Breeze is probably against Dublin
Three yellows for the Dubs so far.
They are overloading midfield and still losing out.
Vaughan has missed a tissue of free kicks
.
half time
Monaghan 0-6 Dublin 0-3
Wind is supporting Monaghan though Cluxton can still hit midfield with his kickouts, Vaughan has just missed another easy free (maybe it's the wind). Monaghan are working tremendously hard but a 3 point lead may not be enough. 0-6 tp 0-3 at HT.
Quote from: Zulu on March 23, 2008, 03:08:51 PM
Cluxton can still hit midfield with his kickouts,
He seems more fond of the sideline today. :D
Dublin at their usual shite carry on and loads of wides too.
If they concentrated on football and quicjk ball to forwards they'll likely win it.
They haven't learned any lessons from last year. Same old mouthing and late hits. Which Monaghan have responded to in kind.
Quote from: Rossfan on March 23, 2008, 03:19:04 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 23, 2008, 03:08:51 PM
Cluxton can still hit midfield with his kickouts,
He seems more fond of the sideline today. :D
Dublin at their usual shite carry on and loads of wides too.
If they concentrated on football and quicjk ball to forwards they'll likely win it.
I see that young goalkeeper from St.Vincents was brought into Dublin squad he looked very good in club final
Vaughan sent off Monaghan up by 4 0-7 to 0-3, make that 0-8 to 0-3 Monaghan pulling away.
Goal Dublin, a screamer 1-4 to 0-8 sounds like a great atmosphere and now the Dubs have a free which they've just put over.Level.
Dubs ahead after a fine Keaney point 1-6 to 0-8 55min.
good man jinxy -don't mention the diving, the sledging, the late tackles and the mouthing from the monaghan lads-
1-7 to 0-8 now and the Dubs are looking good with the wind Ciaran Whelan is coming and Keaney has just kicked another beaut. i'd say Monaghan will need a goal if they're to win it. Freeman has a free, which he scores 1-8 to 0-9 60min.
1-10 0-09
1-10 to 0-10 65min. Monaghan have just won a really soft free which Freeman has put over, he's some player.
1-10 to 0-11 now.
2min left 1-10 to 0-12 can Monaghan snatch a draw?
Dubs down to 13 Cullen off and they now have an easy free to level it and they have 0-13 to 1-10. Great match and it's over.
bar the last 20 -a poor game in terms of standard overall. a terrible ref and too many frees. Happy enough though -if i was from monaghan i'd be worried. couldn't beat a 13 man dublin team missing their 3 best players and they can't seem to score fromplay. I backed them heavily for ulster this year - beginning to wonder about my investment after that today ;D ;D
If Caffrey had left midfield alone when Ryan was running the show they would have won by 4/5 points. Another lesson not learned from previous years. When Ryan is your best midfielder, leave him there. Some very soft free's for Monaghan. Brogan should be shot for looking to pass that ball back to Sherlock. Pretty sure his brother would have kept it for himself in the same position!
Caffrey moans about the ref but I think he could have replaced Vaughan and Bonner at HT.
Some lovely play by the Dubs for about 15 minutes in the second half.
Monaghan can take strength from another good finish. Dubs panicked too much at the end.
I suppose we will get the usual comments about Monaghan needing to worry :)
-if i was from monaghan i'd be worried I can't agree there Indiana - Dublin only went down to 13 at the end and usually the 14 man tam goes on to win - Dublin should have won the match but didn't take their chances - I'd say Mc Eneaney will be the happier of the 2 managers this evening. I thought Monaghan really took the game to Dublin and outmuscled them in a lot of areas - Monaghan also appeared to be fitter than Dublin. Whelan brought a lot of experience and know how on to the team. Jayo was a handful.
I think your investment on Monaghan is still good value. Dublin have their eyes not only on Leinster but ultimately the AI so I think Monaghan will be happy enough especially considering they were in Parnell Park - a difficult venue for visitors.
Quote from: orangeman on March 23, 2008, 04:12:40 PM
-if i was from monaghan i'd be worried I can't agree there Indiana - Dublin only went down to 13 at the end and usually the 14 man tam goes on to win - Dublin should have won the match but didn't take their chances - I'd say Mc Eneaney will be the happier of the 2 managers this evening. I thought Monaghan really took the game to Dublin and outmuscled them in a lot of areas - Monaghan also appeared to be fitter than Dublin. Whelan brought a lot of experience and know how on to the team. Jayo was a handful.
I think your investment on Monaghan is still good value. Dublin have their eyes not only on Leinster but ultimately the AI so I think Monaghan will be happy enough especially considering they were in Parnell Park - a difficult venue for visitors.
Where does that leave your own county orangeman?? ???
Quotebar the last 20 -a poor game in terms of standard overall.
I thought it was a very good match, winter type football yes but both teams threw themselves into the fray wholeheartedly and some of the defending was top class. It was a bit free riddled but it was a match that both sets of supporters could and did get into.
Enjoyable match from my neutral perspective. The ref did blow up a little too often but any debatable decisions balanced out over the game.
Based on what I saw, I'd be more worried about meeting Monaghan than Dublin in the summer.
Thought the 2nd half was very good entertainment (at least compared to Man U v Liverpool). Monaghan had a bad 20 mins or so in the 2nd half but didnt panic and thats what probably brought them back into the game albeit with a little help from the referee. Sherlock looked good for the dubs and it looks like Bernard Brogan is shaping up to be a better player than his brother. 2 good teams and a decent game overall. Dublin v Armagh should be a good game.
you got to be kidding orangeman- that was their full whack- we were missing 3 allstars
They were 5 up against 14 men
They scored one point from play
Despite all that they needed a referee to give them a draw after dublin had made 5 changes. Granted we could have closed it out but we'd made 5 changes at that stage.
Honestly i expected Monaghan to win by 5 points beforehand considering our selection. I would be seriously worried about my investment today. i'm not saying dublin are any great shakes because they aren't. but for all the talk about Monaghan this year-i was highly disappointed with them -ive written them off for the all-ireland and have serious reservations about them winning ulster- i hope to christ they improve before the championship.
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2008, 04:20:20 PM
Enjoyable match from my neutral perspective. The ref did blow up a little too often but any debatable decisions balanced out over the game.
Based on what I saw, I'd be more worried about meeting Monaghan than Dublin in the summer.
Why?
Quote from: tyroneboi on March 23, 2008, 04:20:43 PM
Thought the 2nd half was very good entertainment (at least compared to Man U v Liverpool). Monaghan had a bad 20 mins or so in the 2nd half but didnt panic and thats what probably brought them back into the game albeit with a little help from the referee. Sherlock looked good for the dubs and it looks like Bernard Brogan is shaping up to be a better player than his brother. 2 good teams and a decent game overall. Dublin v Armagh should be a good game.
Well said.
Two poor decisions by the ref to give very soft frees for Monaghan at the end to get the draw - but the ref probably would have done the same had the boot been on the other foot.
The longer the game went on the less the two sides liked each other. If they do both make the league final it could be tasty. Though I'm sure other teams will have a bit to say before thats a reality.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 23, 2008, 04:29:42 PM
i'm not saying dublin are any great shakes because they aren't. but for all the talk about Monaghan this year-i was highly disappointed with them -ive written them off for the all-ireland and have serious reservations about them winning ulster
There are no championships won in March.
Monaghan werent great but still got a point and finished well. Dublin should have had it won at that stage.
As for the 2 sendings off -what the **** could they expect -Vaughan already on a tick and a yellow,Cullen already on a yellow and rugby tackled a man to stop an attack.
Caffrey was out of order blaming the ref for being one sided - at one stage everything was a Dublin free.
TG4 also out of order - having a 5 minute interview with one manager and no word at all with anyone from the other camp.
will you ever feck off-there is little enough about monaghan blatantly diving, sledging, late tackling as many times as any dublin player. but then i wouldn't expect anything else on this website. That ref evened that game up today at the ned for a draw- anyone with a braincell can see that. 12 points from frees for monaghan from 13 points?
If the Monaghan camp are happy with that today then it says a lot about their ambition- i'd say the same about dublin who coughed up a 4 point lead- but at least we have 3 allstars to come back in and won't be down to 14 men for 30 mins in every game. We blooded paul flynn who had a fine game and we still have the vincents lads to come back into the frame- monaghan don't that's the reality. I don't think either team will win the all-ireland but i'm full sure monaghan won't. They should be beating that dublin team today- i've just got off the phone with a very disappointed monaghan gaa fan who thought they would win today. I thought so too.
They were completely wiped at midfield today.
Dublin will always be there or there abouts, can't see them win the big one mind you
Jeez, I thought it was a cracking match. 2 teams hammering into each other with the resulting injuries arising. A draw was a fair enough result. I am disappointed to see PC criticizing the ref on TG4, not really a Dublin trait and should imo be cut out altogether.
From what I could see on TV there was alot of backchat from both teams directed at each other.
Great football for March.
Rossfan, I would presume that the reason TG4 nabbed PC after the game and not McEneaney,was due to the inevitable pitch invasion and the fact that the TV showed McE gathering in his players for maybe a "warm down" or a chat. No conspiracy there.
Where does that leave your own county orangeman??
If you read my previous posts about Tyrone you'll see that I have said that Monaghan should win Ulster this year or be be very near to it - Tyrone in my opinion will struggle big time this year - too many injuries, too many miles on the clock sadly.
Ref was a total joke , bad for both side but the frees at the end we beyound bad he should of just kicked the ball over himself
Caffrey was out of order blaming the ref for being one sided
Are you really surprised at Caffrey's attitude ? This is what we have come to expect from him so why be surprised ?
Quote from: INDIANA on March 23, 2008, 04:58:14 PM
They were completely wiped at midfield today.
Except in the last 5 minutes ::)
Of course Monaghan might have scored more from play if they werent being fouled so often.
And at the risk of being totally pedantic -Dublin would have scored more frees if they hadnt sent a load of them wide.
Quote from: orangeman on March 23, 2008, 05:05:01 PM
Caffrey was out of order blaming the ref for being one sided
Are you really surprised at Caffrey's attitude ? This is what we have come to expect from him so why be surprised ?
Did you see some of the frees he gave? I'd have a hard job explaining them to anyone !
Granted - but he was bad for both sides - it was a difficult match to referee with both teams guilty of being over physical a lot of the time.
Quote from: orangeman on March 23, 2008, 05:28:32 PM
Granted - but he was bad for both sides - it was a difficult match to referee with both teams guilty of being over physical a lot of the time.
He made a complete bags of it gave 4/5 soft frees for nothing in the first 5 minutes and set the precedent for the rest of the game. He lost total control of the game and teams being over physical had nothing to do with it they only responded to the refs lack of control
teams being over physical had nothing to do with it
Now you're taking the piss ! ;) ;)
Quote from: Gnevin on March 23, 2008, 05:16:21 PM
[
Did you see some of the frees he gave? I'd have a hard job explaining them to anyone !
As usual the embittered are moaning about the ref.
If there were questions about the ref giving soft frees, he gave them to both sides.
Dublin had more than their share of the so called soft frees in the 2nd half.
Of the 5 Monaghan frees in the last 8 minutes, 3 were stonewall frees and the other 2 won by Freeman I couldn't see because he was surrounded by hyperactive Dubs.
Overall I thought the Ref did very well.
He tried to impose discipline on the proceedings early on.
What can he do but stop play when both teams persist in fouling ?
Both sending offs were entirely justified. Vaughan's elbow yellow card offense was particularly nasty.
The early moments of the second half such several ugly off-the-ball skirmishes breaking out.
It was inevitably that somebody was going to be sent off although Vaughan received his marching orders after getting a second yellow card for a cynical foul on Freeman as the Monaghan man man stormed upfield.
Taken off BBC Sport website -
Quote from: orangeman on March 23, 2008, 05:36:35 PM
teams being over physical had nothing to do with it
Now you're taking the piss ! ;) ;)
Who allows teams to become overly physical ? If he has of ref the poxy game properly from the start and stamped down on " over physica" when needed the game wouldn't of descented into the joke he allowed it too .
Dublin would have finished with about 9 men had he taken that attitude !!
The ref dished out 3 yellow cards to the Dubs in the first 20 minutes.
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2008, 05:56:15 PM
The ref dished out 3 yellow cards to the Dubs in the first 20 minutes.
For what seemed minor enough stuff. What where they for?
As a neutral (relatively), i thought the ref was extremely generous to monaghan in the free stakes. some of them were baffling and unfortunately this is the standard we are facing up and down the country every week. there was of course a couple of soft ones at the other end but certainly not enough to balance it up. these refs, wherever they get them, seem just to blow when they see contact irrespective of how and what type. freeman had div before there was any contact for the last free.
I'm coming round to the way of thinking that we should try and identify 2 or 3 decent intercounty refs and play a game every day of the week to run the national leagues and championships off...
Overall Monaghan kept their discipline better.
The 2 sendings off were entirely justified and well handled by the ref.
My gripe was that he took up too time over the last 8 minutes, when Monaghan had the momentum, to dish out the frees and cards leaving it very tight for Monaghan to get their equaliser.
Vaughan just hasn't got the head for it at this level. Beautiful striker of the ball but he was constantly involved with his marker and the numerous Monaghan defenders who were in his ear the whole time. He has to learn that you don't lose anything by not responding. Just keep your head down and get on with the game.
i think vaughan's man dived for the first one- there was very little contact while ronaghan jumped with his knees straight into Casey in the first half and got no yellow- thought that was bloody scandalous to be honest- right in front of the ref. The ref wanted a draw and he got it - the only reason why monaghan got a grip in the last 5 is because caffrey decided to take the man of the match shane ryan out of midfield and put him into the half forwards and withdraw paul flynn who had a powerful game. decisions i simply couldn't understand. i thought some of the frees today were totally innocuous.
Caffrey does seem to have a good recrod of taking men out that are playing well whilst his team are in front - I have to agree with you that Ronaghan deserved a yellow card for that tacke early on.
Ronaghan deserved a strong yellow for that.
The ref was very strict on shirt pulling, dragging, any sign of hands around the neck area and players coming into the back of others while they are trying to gather the ball. I couldn't find fault with one decision and he didn't miss much.
I have nothing against Vaughan but he was Dublin's biggest liability out there today. They played better when he was sent off and began scored from free kicks.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 23, 2008, 07:07:45 PM
i think vaughan's man dived for the first one- there was very little contact while ronaghan jumped with his knees straight into Casey in the first half and got no yellow- thought that was bloody scandalous to be honest- right in front of the ref. The ref wanted a draw and he got it - the only reason why monaghan got a grip in the last 5 is because caffrey decided to take the man of the match shane ryan out of midfield and put him into the half forwards and withdraw paul flynn who had a powerful game. decisions i simply couldn't understand. i thought some of the frees today were totally innocuous.
I agree in the first half when changes looked needed to steady the ship nothing happened (Vaughan just wasn't at the races today and said he'd get sent off 10 minutes into the game and Murray at 4 didn't really work for me) while in the second after , after the forwards stopped playing musical chairs and everything looked ok mad changes where made .
I think a draw was fair enough - both teams will be happy I'd say.
How do you fancy Armagh's chances against Dublin?
An over physical game, poorly refeered, some challenges extremely dangerous, particularly Ronaghans which went unpunished, draw a fair result overall, though i think Dublin showed greater potential for later in the year. I doubt if even Pillar could explain the rationale behind some of his changes
I thought the ref was very poor today and blew for the slightest hint of a foul - his approach to reffing definitely hindered the Dublin tackling which wasn't overly careless.
Keaney is a great man for hitting purple patches in games. If they could bottle that and get 70 mins out of him, he'll make a footballer. Flanked by Bernard Brogan and the bro, they'll not find scores hard to come by. There's just something brittle about the Dublin defence that has been there since Pillar's been in charge and doesn't seem to have been addressed. When they cave in, they do it in style.
When they cave in, they do it in style
Hasn't that been their achilles heel as past few seasons ?
Quote from: orangeman on March 23, 2008, 08:48:59 PM
When they cave in, they do it in style
Hasn't that been their achilles heel as past few seasons ?
One you'd think a man with 3500 + post could use the quote button instead of bold underline and italics ,that way the rest of us could see where the quote came from, Last season and this season have shown that particular Achilles no longer applies to Dublin and consider Dublin where 5 points down at one stage . Ref handing soft frees and bizarre changes is what lead to them getting the draw .
Quote from: Gnevin on March 23, 2008, 08:54:25 PM
Last season and this season have shown that particular Achilles no longer applies to Dublin
You must be joking. Last year against Kerry, they capitulated for 15 mins at the start of the second half, conceding 1-05, returning only a point. It's this break and collapse of concentration that costs Dublin in the big games or when it's put up to them by a decent side.
I don't think that applies today- as i would re-iterate that was a bloody good second half display from Dublin who were missing 3 all-stars and the vincents contingent against an allegedly all-ireland contender who were buliding themselves up for their biggest test yet accoring to their manager during the week.
What came out of it for me- we have one hell of a strong panel-maybe the best for 10-12 years.
WE came back today 5 down and spent 30 mins with 14 men and the last 2 with 13- that takes a lot of heart.
We were ridden rock solid by a poor ref who seemed to forget you don't have replays in the league.
We only conceded one point from play and monaghan had no realistic goal chances.
The negative was losing the lead- but we'd made a number of changes again that unsettled the team - again i don;t think tactically on the line we're up to much-another negative.
On the Monaghan side- they aren't as good as i thought they were.
Will find it harder to win the Ulster championship than i thought.
Are in real trouble in midfield.
All-ireland quater finalists but will need to improve substantially to go further.
Overall they should be beating that Dublin team today- no question - i didn't speak to any dublin fan beforehand who thought we were going to win. So overall we're happy enough.
Will Whelan and Shane Ryan be your midfield pairing again for the most of this year ?
Reply #241 on: Today at 08:54:25 PM »
Sorry about that Gnevin !
Things to take from today were............
Monaghan are not as good as I thought they were. In fact they're a lot worse.
Syl Doyle is not a good or fair referee.
Shane Ryan should not be moved when he is being totally dominant at centre field.
Mark Vaughan should be substituted when he misses 4 scorable kicks, gets booked and ticked and loses the ball from play more than once. He was either injured or just having a mare generally. Overall I am a fan!
Dublin have more reason to be happy with today's proceedings than Monaghan.
Quote from: dubsnsubs on March 23, 2008, 09:30:22 PM
Things to take from today were............
Monaghan are not as good as I thought they were. In fact they're a lot worse.
Syl Doyle is not a good or fair referee.
Monaghan haven't won anythig but seem to be the team with most potential - I don't think you can reallly say that Syl Doyle is biased - I thought a draw was a fair result and that's how it panned out - Moanghan got some soft ones but so did Dublin !
Is that better Gnevin ? ;)
Was glad to get out of that with a point in the end. Not a great display from Monaghan - far from what they are capable of. Dublin were cleaning up midfield, not sure where Clerkin and Lennon were for a number of periods.
2 points however:
1 - Monaghan did score all bar one from frees, but this was due to Dublin fouling and in most the cases, had the foul not been committed, a point was on the cards anyway; and
2 - Wouldn't feel too worried about meeting Dublin in the summer - Monaghan can and will improve a hell of a lot on today. There may be 3 all-stars to return for Dublin, but lets be honest, would they all be all-stars were they not on the Dublin team? Monaghan are doing ok when they can have a very poor game and still get something out of it.
Lastly, Dublin can have no complaints over the sending-offs. However, for the second match in a row, Monaghan have been unable to capitalise on the extra man for most of the second half.
Quote from: dubsnsubs on March 23, 2008, 09:30:22 PM
Things to take from today were............
Monaghan are not as good as I thought they were. In fact they're a lot worse.
Syl Doyle is not a good or fair referee.
Shane Ryan should not be moved when he is being totally dominant at centre field.
Mark Vaughan should be substituted when he misses 4 scorable kicks, gets booked and ticked and loses the ball from play more than once. He was either injured or just having a mare generally. Overall I am a fan!
Dublin have more reason to be happy with today's proceedings than Monaghan.
;D
But Dublin don't sound too happy so far.
Monaghan are the 4th or 5th team in Ulster.
Bravo, you got a draw playing at home. You're right, you should be happy.
Thought the refereeing was absolutely disgraceful.
I feel as well that Monaghan are becoming a mirror image of Mickey Harte's Tyrone teams in terms of skullduggery and cynicism.
Not a team who will curry favour with neutrals and / or sportsmen.
Quote from: saffron sam2 on March 23, 2008, 09:56:32 PM
Thought the refereeing was absolutely disgraceful.
I feel as well that Monaghan are becoming a mirror image of Mickey Harte's Tyrone teams in terms of skullduggery and cynicism.
Not a team who will curry favour with neutrals and / or sportsmen.
Sure it's Easter Sunday nothing strange in someone appearing dead only to come back to life today ;D
Have to agree I thought some of the Monaghan lads made a meal of things at times, they're well able to give it (which is a good thing) so they should be able to take it.
It is an interesting concept but alien to most, a referee who actually tries to apply, to the best of his ability, the rules of the game to the game that is being played in front of his eyes. A referee who looks to be under 50 years old, who is slim, fit and keeps up with the game.
It's about time we have a referee fit enough to move around the pitch and wise to all the obvious cynical pulling and dragging in the game.
I did observe that he appeared more lenient to Monaghan but maybe Monaghan have brushed up on their tackling "skills".
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 23, 2008, 09:43:58 PM
Was glad to get out of that with a point in the end. Not a great display from Monaghan - far from what they are capable of. Dublin were cleaning up midfield, not sure where Clerkin and Lennon were for a number of periods.
2 points however:
1 - Monaghan did score all bar one from frees, but this was due to Dublin fouling and in most the cases, had the foul not been committed, a point was on the cards anyway; and
2 - Wouldn't feel too worried about meeting Dublin in the summer - Monaghan can and will improve a hell of a lot on today. There may be 3 all-stars to return for Dublin, but lets be honest, would they all be all-stars were they not on the Dublin team? Monaghan are doing ok when they can have a very poor game and still get something out of it.
Lastly, Dublin can have no complaints over the sending-offs. However, for the second match in a row, Monaghan have been unable to capitalise on the extra man for most of the second half.
So you don't think that Cahill, Griffen, Brogan and Whelan won't improve the Dublin team and Quinn, Brennan, Connolly won't either???
alan brogan is a better forward than anything you guys have to offer- end of story.
Whelan would beat Clerkin and Lennon with one arm behind his back. i'd fancy my own chances on the midfield of Monaghan.
Cahil again is better than anything monaghan have in the half backs.
Dublin will beat Monaghan by 6-7 points in the championship if they play. No problem- i'd put my house on it.
one other point - i can't for the life of me understand why monaghan have turfed Corey out of the full forward line considering that he single handedly transformed that team last year. I was full sure we'd be in for a really didfficult day at the back but bar freeman sporadically there was no threat from play.
I still maintain it was a poor enough game bar the last 20-25 mins. I thought both teams in the first half were pretty poor -re-affirming my belief neither will land the big one come summer but that my bet on Monaghan for Ulster is going down the Liffey as we speak. Really was disappointed with then today.
Quotealan brogan is a better forward than anything you guys have to offer- end of story.
Ahh come on now Freeman is at least as good and IMO a better forward than Brogan, now of course you may disagree but there are certainly solid arguments for both.
QuoteDublin will beat Monaghan by 6-7 points in the championship if they play. No problem- i'd put my house on it.
I thought that Monaghan were quite impressive, their workrate and tackling were top notch and we know they have decent forwards so I couldn't see anyone beat them by 6-7 points this summer. Will they win the AI? No IMO, will they win Ulster? Maybe but my money would be on Derry at the moment, but they are definately a team to be reckoned with.
Will Mossey get a starting place? With lads like Keaney and Brogan able to knock them over from placed balls, does Quinn offer much else?
I thought Dublin showed poor discipline. Granted Freeman played up a bit for the last free but Cullen's rugby tackle illustrated, to me, their lack of discipline at the back. Vaughan's tackle shocking too - he had been losing it prior to that with things not going for him.
Not a bad game but like most I was disappointed with Monaghan. Freeman aside none too many forwards looked dangerous. Granted the guy who came on at the end (Ciaran someone - can't mind the second name) will add to it but was disappointed in Ronaghan and particularly woods.
I don't think Dublin are world beaters - I however do think that they are the second best team in the country. This may say more for the current state of football than the standard of the Dublin team. They also have a number of players to come back.(Brogan will be a huge addition as will Whelan but I don't think Mossy will make the team.)Monaghan were missing a few. who did Hughes start for? They looked very suspect in full back line though. Good at turning over the ball in numbers but one on one in the full back line they looked a bit dicy,
Still - entertaining second half especially given conditions.
how did Eamon Fennell play?, very impressed with him against ourselves were he roasted Dermot McCabe
Shane Ryan made a few clinker catches from kick outs - Dublin in general cleaned the Farney out in midfield until Pillar typically and inexplicably decided to dabble.
Why the Dubs keep Caffrey in that job is beyond me. He's in charge of the Man Utd of GAA and in a period of maximum revenue, the Dubs have missed out. Leinster titles don't count.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 23, 2008, 11:16:16 PM
one other point - i can't for the life of me understand why monaghan have turfed Corey out of the full forward line considering that he single handedly transformed that team last year.
That's a myth.
BTW Corey is being developed into Monaghan's equivalent of the total footballer.
Quote from: ONeill on March 23, 2008, 11:45:36 PM
Shane Ryan made a few clinker catches from kick outs - Dublin in general cleaned the Farney out in midfield until Pillar typically and inexplicably decided to dabble.
Dubs didn't get much joy in the first half in midfield.
The wind must have whipped up to twice its strength in the 2nd half :)
Monaghan finally played the short kick out 4 or 5 times to good effect and played through midfield.
Adaptability, when the game is going against you when the backs are against the wall.
That's true - Monaghan did realise they were having no joy in the second half and did adapt. What I was impressed with most of all was that when they were a goal down, with little time left, they had enough self-belief to grab something out of the game. I know it's only Dublin, but that's a great quality.
Quote from: Zulu on March 23, 2008, 11:25:07 PM
Quotealan brogan is a better forward than anything you guys have to offer- end of story.
Ahh come on now Freeman is at least as good and IMO a better forward than Brogan, now of course you may disagree but there are certainly solid arguments for both.
QuoteDublin will beat Monaghan by 6-7 points in the championship if they play. No problem- i'd put my house on it.
I thought that Monaghan were quite impressive, their workrate and tackling were top notch and we know they have decent forwards so I couldn't see anyone beat them by 6-7 points this summer. Will they win the AI? No IMO, will they win Ulster? Maybe but my money would be on Derry at the moment, but they are definately a team to be reckoned with.
I'd take Brogan every time. If he actually got his head up and passed every now and again he would be the complete forward.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 23, 2008, 09:43:58 PM
There may be 3 all-stars to return for Dublin, but lets be honest, would they all be all-stars were they not on the Dublin team?
Its this sort of shite talk that makes the steroetypical non Dub GAA fan seem quite close to the truth.
Statements like that are also hugley insulting to the players involved.
The Dublin Arrogrance rains supreme. As usual they look to the opposition and the ref for blame. The simply fact is they had a 4 point lead and blew it. They may have been down to 14 but they have no-one to blame but themselves for this. If Pillar had balls he would have takne Vaughan off at halftime. He was walking a tight rope and the second yellow he got could easily have been red. An elbow in the face is not acceptable.
Pillar had the lead and was looking at Shane Ryan winning too clean balls in midfield and covering every blade of grass, as usual. But he wanted to parade the great Whelo and moved Ryan to the 40. Monaghan got a foothold, Whelo stood admiring his massive gloves and game was pulled out of the bag. Cullen tackle was silly, they had men back and he could have shadowed him till help arrived.
The ref was cat but no different for both teams. Some of the frees he give was silly but neither team could complain. The dubs discipline was poor and tackling lazy. Twice a late tackle resulted in a free where the ball landed and twice a Dublin defender tried to kick the ball out of the park to waste time, this resulted in an additional 10 yards and a handy free.
Also, some are saying, this is the strongest squad the Dubs have, yet then say they are missing 3 All-Stars and the Vins players. The squad mustn't be that good if they can't still beat a side with potential (nothing more) at home. We were missing our best HB and arguably best player in Gary McQuaid, our regualar CB Colm Flanagan and last years first choice CF Cairan Hanratty is only back from a long lay off. But they don't have All-Stars, so they don't count ::)
As for Monaghan, I think we struggled in midfield and showed how much we rely on Eoin Lennon. The injuries he is carrying and little training he is doing is abviously telling. He is our one genuine midfielder but is struggling for form since the injury in got in training. Hopefully if they beat Meath and qualify, then he can sit out for the last two games and get it right.
I think we need JP back out in middle, where he is best for club, and put Vinny back FB. He ins't nearly as effective on the 40. Also need Hanners back playing to give the forwards more options. Tommy can't do it all and Raymie is struggling for form. McQuaid was a massive miss for carrying the ball out.
Finally, dropping the man back to the 30m line is driving me mad. So negative, in first half with the wind, Damien Freeman was stuck to this stop. Everytime the ball broke down the Dubs had a handy out through Keaney who hung out round the middle and launched attack after attack. Luckily Vaughan managed to mess most of them up ;D Then when we had the extra man, as against Armagh, we continued to play this way, with another spare man at the back and again this was totally ineffective. No benefit for the attack at all and it didn't appear to have any benefit in defence as at times Dublin always had a spare man (luckily it was Brendan Brogan ;D).
The Banty lacks confidence in his team at things and doesn't seem to have a plan B or a plan for an extra man. I dread to think what will happen if we went a man down. When the spare men and HB's did push up in last 5 minutes when they had too, it told a different story.
Overall, was glad to get a point but it should have been two. 5 up with an extra man and to find oursleves 4 down is not good enough against a under strenght Dublin side ;) is not what is expected of potential Ulster contenders. Positives is that we fought back when playing below par. Also, last years Free taking problems appear to be sorted.
Ps the Dubs will not win an All-ireland under Pillar, I'd put my house on it ;) ;D
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 10:50:28 AM
The Dublin Arrogrance rains supreme. As usual they look to the opposition and the ref for blame.
In fairness, when you dont win a game, its usually partially the responsibility of the opposition :D :D :D
I'm not one to whinge about the refs, thats usually the job of the non Dub, in almost every game Dublin play. So to see guys on here say the ref was fair or as bad for both teams, really does suggest that he must have been extremely harsh on the Dubs. If he was fair, ye would say he was all for the Dubs ;)
I wouldnt go writing either side off for the summer based on a performance with understrength teams which leave them both joint top of the league.
Not exactly alarm bell time, no team in any division have shown championship winning form.
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 10:50:28 AM
Pillar had the lead and was looking at Shane Ryan winning too clean balls in midfield and covering every blade of grass, as usual. But he wanted to parade the great Whelo and moved Ryan to the 40. Monaghan got a foothold, Whelo stood admiring his massive gloves and game was pulled out of the bag.
Quote of the year
The referee blew often, that's not just fussiness, he kept up with the game.
One of the reasons we have so much cynical pulling & dragging in the game is that the refs are gasping for air 40m away.
The problem last year for the Dubs was that they only had a superb 15 minutes.
The Dubs have still got a very good 15 minutes. Those 15 minutes might do enough in some games.
But yesterday at home it wasn't enough to beat the joint 4th rated team in Ulster.
And the Dub fans think it is Monaghan who should worry ;D
GAA Beo next Sunday and the live game is Monaghan v Meath.
I can't get used to this, it's going to be an uphill struggle to keep a low profile.
Anyway the game should be a good marker for Monaghan.
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 10:50:28 AM
The Dublin Arrogrance rains supreme. As usual they look to the opposition and the ref for blame. The simply fact is they had a 4 point lead and blew it. They may have been down to 14 but they have no-one to blame but themselves for this. If Pillar had balls he would have takne Vaughan off at halftime. He was walking a tight rope and the second yellow he got could easily have been red. An elbow in the face is not acceptable.
And what would you call losing a 5 point lead to a 14 man team?
As a neutral (with a slight leaning towards Monaghan mind ;)), I thought it was quite an entertaining game played in tough conditions and on a tight pitch which often leaves it hard to play attractive fastflowing football and make scores from play. I believe it also contributed to a lot of the niggling (which both teams were guilty of, let's be honest).
There are negatives and positives to be taken for both teams. Dubs were missing there 3 All-Stars and the Vins lads (even though they will struggle to make the team IMO) while Monaghan where missing, as someone said, one of their top players in McQuaid. Hanratty will also make a big difference when the pitch is hard and there is more space to exploit. Both teams, when ahead by 4/5 points should have closed out the game but in the end I wold say a draw was a fair result, neither team will get to down about it. Monaghan have indeen taken a more physical approach to the game which was seen against Kerry too and I wonder will that come against them later in the year, especially when some of their players 'fall' very easily for frees.
On the Dublin side, I would have reservations on Whelan, I know the Dubs think he's a bit of a God but, honestly, will he make THAT much of an impact? He has played feck all ball the last couple of years. IMO Shane Ryan is the leading Dubs midfielder at present, despite what the great Pillar thinks
Quote from: Gnevin on March 24, 2008, 12:53:09 PM
And what would you call losing a 5 point lead to a 14 man team?
I have already called that, it was Dublin's 15 minutes.
i'll send you a dvd with whelan's performances in ther last couple of seasons - he's still be able to play for Monaghan at midfield if he was 40 based on yesterday. i'll have to cover my bet on monaghan- watched a re-run today- my first instincts were right- poor game overall and monaghan were poor overall- dublin had a good 25mins when the man was sent off.
Sorry if it offends you- but any team that loses a 5 point lead to a 14 man team isn't heading for silverware. Can't win aerial ball and haven't enough punch up front.
Anyone who thinks that was a good quality game yesterday watch the re-run- both sides were bloody awful in the first half. Think we're heading for the last 4 this year again - but again we'll fall short i fear. I'd fancy Derry to cause a surprise in Ulster this year based on current form.
Overall i was disappointed with the game and the Monaghan performance.
Both teams need to greatly improve if they want to make a mark at championship level.
For Monaghan, we really need to change things around midfield. We must stop trying to win clean ball and start challenging for scrappier second ball. Almost every time the ball was knocked down a Dublin player was there to clean up possession. Monaghan had the same problem last year against Tyrone and Kerry.
Personally i thought the Ref had a terrible game. Giving far too much frees to both sided.
Lets forget about this one and move on to next Sunday..... Dublin have a tough game in Cross and Meath won't be a walkover for Monaghan. Still a long way to go in this league, but I ::) think Monaghan & Dublin will meet again in a few weeks (....and hopefully in September ;D )
Quote from: ONeill on March 24, 2008, 11:15:28 AM
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 10:50:28 AM
Pillar had the lead and was looking at Shane Ryan winning too clean balls in midfield and covering every blade of grass, as usual. But he wanted to parade the great Whelo and moved Ryan to the 40. Monaghan got a foothold, Whelo stood admiring his massive gloves and game was pulled out of the bag.
Quote of the year
Thats quality alright. :D The Dubs even have a special "glove carrier" in the backroom staff to help him put them on now!
I'd like to apologise to Damian Freeman for thinking he made a meal of Vaughans challenge.
(http://www.independent.ie/multimedia/archive/00176/Mark_176090d.jpg)
great picture think you could say he was well caught
Quote from: Oriel Man on March 24, 2008, 01:45:42 PM
For Monaghan, we really need to change things around midfield. We must stop trying to win clean ball and start challenging for scrappier second ball. Almost every time the ball was knocked down a Dublin player was there to clean up possession.
In the first half, Monaghan won marginally more ball in midfield.
It's the 2nd half that leaves the more lasting impression.
did anyone notice pillars reaction wen vaughan was sent off? a hearty congratulations hand shake!!! not the behaviour of a county manager IMO, would not like to be up to any badness wen he's on patrol wit the Garda ;)
One of the Dublin posters reckoned Vaughan's challenge didn't even merit a yellow card ? Did he get a second yellow for this or was it a straight red ? It's some picture - well captured !
Quote from: Gnevin on March 24, 2008, 12:53:09 PM
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 10:50:28 AM
The Dublin Arrogrance rains supreme. As usual they look to the opposition and the ref for blame. The simply fact is they had a 4 point lead and blew it. They may have been down to 14 but they have no-one to blame but themselves for this. If Pillar had balls he would have takne Vaughan off at halftime. He was walking a tight rope and the second yellow he got could easily have been red. An elbow in the face is not acceptable.
And what would you call losing a 5 point lead to a 14 man team?
If you read my post, you would see that I was also critical of Monaghan losing their lead and I no way started saying we are All Ireland contenders. Under Banty if we win an Ulster it would be an achievement. He's a great organiser, management figure but tatically he is very limited and this will tell and has told to date. His record as club manager would make Teddy Holland look like Micko.
My is more to the fact that the Dublin attitude is run the opposition down, run the ref down and be happy with their lot as they look for the excuses in a very limited display by a home team.
Great photo by the way. Comically hearing and reading the defence of Vaughan.
No-one ran the opposition down- simply saying we thought Monaghan were better than their performance yesterday considering they openly admitted targetting the game
The ref was atrocious even neutrals said so- why don;t you read sometimes.
Not looking for any excuses - overall we're very happy with a depleted team we got a draw against a top7 team while down to 14 men for 30 mins and down by five points. The only negatives were losing a lead at the end and a poorish first half performance but overall you'd have to be happy with the result yesterday if you were from Dublin because beforehand looking at the teams selected i wasn't confident of getting anything out of the game.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 24, 2008, 01:36:09 PM
i'll send you a dvd with whelan's performances in ther last couple of seasons - he's still be able to play for Monaghan at midfield if he was 40 based on yesterday. i'll have to cover my bet on monaghan- watched a re-run today- my first instincts were right- poor game overall and monaghan were poor overall- dublin had a good 25mins when the man was sent off.
Sorry if it offends you- but any team that loses a 5 point lead to a 14 man team isn't heading for silverware. Can't win aerial ball and haven't enough punch up front.
Anyone who thinks that was a good quality game yesterday watch the re-run- both sides were bloody awful in the first half. Think we're heading for the last 4 this year again - but again we'll fall short i fear. I'd fancy Derry to cause a surprise in Ulster this year based on current form.
Will you send me a DVD of the last time Monaghan played in Parnell Park and the Dublin midfeild was torn a new arsehole by the same Monaghan Midfield we had yesterday?? Very easy to judge a pair on one game. The great gloved one will do his usual cameo role over the summer and disappear into the sunset, something he has practised regualrly over the years ;D
I would agree Monaghan were poor overall but I think the Dubs were equally as poor par a hot spell following the goal. But for a team that were so brutal in midfield we must have done something to still get a draw.
Quote from: ONeill on March 23, 2008, 11:45:36 PM
Shane Ryan made a few clinker catches from kick outs - Dublin in general cleaned the Farney out in midfield until Pillar typically and inexplicably decided to dabble.
Why the Dubs keep Caffrey in that job is beyond me. He's in charge of the Man Utd of GAA and in a period of maximum revenue, the Dubs have missed out. Leinster titles don't count.
Let us see - It is the league, he is using it to give Fennell plenty of experience, he is using it to bring Whelan back to fitness before the Championship - when do you want him to see if players are up to it???
The Irish News carried a story today in the match review about an 'alleged assault' on Freeman leaving the field... mentioned a head butt' and that it had been witnessed by an inter-county referee. Didn't say much more - anyone hear anything else?
Heard about it today. Believe it involved Tommy Freeman and one of the Dublin backroom team, not sure if it was selector, sub or whoever.
Nothing more to add really. I'm sure that nothing will come of it, prob a bit of verbals and an in your face response.
Goodnight thady, is all that needs to be said.The dubs will make some team very happy this summer.
My reflections on the game:
very enjoyable, proabably more to do with the passion than the skill, but in fairness the game was played on a wintery day in march on a poor pitch.
From a Monaghan perspective, it is clear as day that we have a bare bone squad. McQuaid would be a huge loss to any team in the country but we have no-one near a winning county standard to replace him.Granted the lad is young, but i havent seen a county player in darren hughes yet. ronaghan was disapointing yesterday but he will have his better days. our midfield wasnt up to it yesterday buit i would be too worried on them. think lennon is a very good player and clerkin is a great workhorse (he was very poor yesterday though). a worry is the cover for midfield, ie ...we have none :-[
Not a great monaghan performance, but a great comeback (albeit against 14 men). to get a draw in parnell given the dubs bite for the game was a good result. we may actually get promoted now!! Unfortunatly, the only silverware i could see this monaghan team come near to this year is the div 2 league title. i hope im wrong. ulster is going to be so tough. fermanagh in brewster followed by probably a derry team keen on revenge last year and that just to get to the final!!! i'd love it if we won it though. as for talk about AI's, now thats just fantasy football. still its great to even be considered by others outside the county. monaghan have come a long way in the last 5 years.
regarding the tommy freeman incident at the end. My mate seen a dublin official headbutt tommy freeman just before jap was about to take the equalising point. the lad was wearing a dublin sweater and think he had a clipboard in hand. the incident occured at the tv camera side of the big square. this was verified by another lad i was talking to after the game who was seated in the stand.
An absolute disgrace. it happened within the game time, not after the game as reported on the radio this morning. A 12 months ban on this kind of behaviour is the mininum requirement.
I watched the game afterwards on sunday night on video again and have to say pillar's remarks after the game were uncalled for, perhaps rash made in the heat of the moment. However, what i couldnt condone was his actions applauding mark vaughen after he was sent off. it was a vicious tackle made on freeman which could have resulted in a broken jaw. A straight red should have been the appropiate punishment.
he deserved to go for a straight red on the second incident- but the first yellow was a joke. But if Freeman wasn't acting the bollix the whole game then maybe he wouldn't get hit. I'm not condoning vaugahn he deserved to walk- but if you continually goad your opponents like his marker did all day- at some point, some day some opponent witha short fuse is going to level you with a thump. I've no sympathy for Freeman on that basis- but i've none for vaughan either- he was dumb enough to fall for it- so he desered to go for being so bloody stupid in the first place.
Why did the DCB , say the match was sold out 3 time and then where taking cash at the gate?
Met Vaughan & few of the other Crokes players in the City Bar last week end, a lad went up & asked for his autograph & then jokingly asked him to sign it 'Owen Mulligan' - he was raging! Very funny though!
Well, the Dubs complaining about goading ???
The Dublin tune has changed over Vaughan's 2nd yellow.
Did it take the incontrovertible proof of a photograph to bring that on?
Vaughan's first yellow was for a facial assault using his elbow as a weapon, right in front of the ref.
As Pillar says, there was no intent ;D
The witness accounts of a head butt on Freeman isn't on the tv footage.
But you can see the pathetic disgraceful scenes of a mob on the pitch surrounding the ref as he walked off the pitch, screaming abuse at him.
Pillar's juvenile post match comments could only be seen as condoning that behaviour as he used that hostile incident to support his statement that the ref left a lot to be desired for.
Quote from: Gnevin on March 25, 2008, 11:05:30 AM
Why did the DCB , say the match was sold out 3 time and then where taking cash at the gate?
Expenses for Easter I'd say ! There were a few Easter eggs to buy. ;) :D
Thomas Freeman is at the centre of an alleged headbutting incident
Monaghan have made an official complaint after claiming that star forward Thomas Freeman was headbutted after Sunday's league game with Dublin.
Freeman was allegedly assaulted as he left the Parnell Park pitch after a stormy encounter with ended in a draw.
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
Dublin players were not believed to be involved but fans were able to come onto the field after the final whistle.
Two Dublin players were sent off during the game and referee Syl Doyle, who did not witness the Freeman incident, needed a gardai escort off the pitch.
The Farney County have lodged a complaint with the Central Competitions Control Committee (CCCC) and they want an investigation into the incident.
Dublin officials also said they would investigate the allegations regarding Freeman.
606: DEBATE
Give your thoughts on Gaelic Games
"I asked Tommy after the game what happened and he said he was headbutted," Farney county chairman John Connolly told the Irish News.
"I was very disappointed with the venue of Parnell Park.
"There were some young and not-so-young people on the field pushing into you - if anyone had of reacted someone could have got seriously hurt.
"There was abuse being shouted too, which just wasn't on. It's high time somebody highlighted this kind of thing because there is no security for players to get off the pitch in games."
Monaghan trainer Martin Martin McElkennon said players were unable to warm-down after the Allianz NFL Division Two match.
"There were too many people on the pitch after the game that shouldn't have been there, so Seamus (McEnaney, Monaghan manager) decided to call the players into the changing rooms.
"There were verbals being exchanged and it could have turned nasty, so we waited inside for a while before coming out and doing our warm-down.
"There were stewarts and gardai around, but it was still dangerous for players, especially the way in which the game ended."
Brom the BBC
Monaghan claim Freeman assaulted
Thomas Freeman is at the centre of an alleged headbutting incident
Monaghan have made an official complaint after claiming that star forward Thomas Freeman was headbutted after Sunday's league game with Dublin.
Freeman was allegedly assaulted as he left the Parnell Park pitch after a stormy encounter with ended in a draw.
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
Dublin players were not believed to be involved but fans were able to come onto the field after the final whistle.
Two Dublin players were sent off during the game and referee Syl Doyle, who did not witness the Freeman incident, needed a gardai escort off the pitch.
The Farney County have lodged a complaint with the Central Competitions Control Committee (CCCC) and they want an investigation into the incident.
Dublin officials also said they would investigate the allegations regarding Freeman.
606: DEBATE
Give your thoughts on Gaelic Games
"I asked Tommy after the game what happened and he said he was headbutted," Farney county chairman John Connolly told the Irish News.
"I was very disappointed with the venue of Parnell Park.
"There were some young and not-so-young people on the field pushing into you - if anyone had of reacted someone could have got seriously hurt.
"There was abuse being shouted too, which just wasn't on. It's high time somebody highlighted this kind of thing because there is no security for players to get off the pitch in games."
Monaghan trainer Martin Martin McElkennon said players were unable to warm-down after the Allianz NFL Division Two match.
"There were too many people on the pitch after the game that shouldn't have been there, so Seamus (McEnaney, Monaghan manager) decided to call the players into the changing rooms.
"There were verbals being exchanged and it could have turned nasty, so we waited inside for a while before coming out and doing our warm-down.
"There were stewarts and gardai around, but it was still dangerous for players, especially the way in which the game ended."
You would think that Pillar would catch himself on after so many incidents. Obviously he believes that imtimidation and overt acts of aggression are the way to "toughen" up this team.
It seems one of his many backroom team in an orange bib hit Tommy Freeeman a headbutt - how can this be condoned ?
Did Paul Clarke not get a suspension for some act of indiscipline last year ?
Why should this be tolerated just because it's Dublin ?
The behaviour of the Dublin players, management team, backroom staff and some of their supporters was disgraceful !
But I'd say Pillar will excuse them and we'll just have to wait on them to deliver the next shameful episode which should arrive shortly.
You would think that Pillar would catch himself on after so many incidents. Obviously he believes that imtimidation and overt acts of aggression are the way to "toughen" up this team.
It seems one of his many backroom team in an orange bib hit Tommy Freeeman a headbutt - how can this be condoned ?
Did Paul Clarke not get a suspension for some act of indiscipline last year ?
Why should this be tolerated just because it's Dublin ?
The behaviour of the Dublin players, management team, backroom staff and some of their supporters was disgraceful !
But I'd say Pillar will excuse them and we'll just have to wait on them to deliver the next shameful episode which should arrive shortly.
Quote from: bingobus on March 24, 2008, 06:49:39 PM
Great photo by the way. Comically hearing and reading the defence of Vaughan.
More comical reading eejits who just make up crap.
Nobody anywhere said that Vaughan didnt deserve at least a yellow for his final challenge.
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 11:43:26 AM
It seems one of his many backroom team in an orange bib hit Tommy Freeeman a headbutt - how can this be condoned ?
Who condoned it?
The worst display of refereeing I have ever had the misfortune to wittness. That man shouldn't be allowed near a u12 match.
The highly respected referee can only be Pat"In my opinion you got it alright in '96" McEnaney
Quote from: Hound on March 25, 2008, 11:54:30 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 11:43:26 AM
It seems one of his many backroom team in an orange bib hit Tommy Freeeman a headbutt - how can this be condoned ?
Who condoned it?
Did it happen Hound ?
Again orangeman who condoned it? Anyone partaking in that sort of behaviour dublin or otherwise should be banned from the association. so if it's true that's the sanction i'd recommend.
This JOhn Connolly though is some comedy show though. The man should be on Comic Relief.
Just comes across as a whinger to be honest. I agree with him in relation to the Freeman but the rest of his statement is the biggest load of rubbish i've read in a long time. Some of the genuine fans i was talking to after the game thought that some of the Monaghan fans were pretty obnoxious and spent as much time abusing Dublin as anyone else. But that's evidently ok by Mr Connolly's standards.
The man in the bib had no business beingaway from the bench area, never mind on the field. What was the linesman doing?
Stewarding in Parnell Park was a joke. Monaghan having to wait to do a warm down says it all. There is no way that an opposing county team would be treated like that in Clones/Clontibret/Ballybay/Blayney or any other field in Monaghan
Dublin have great footballers and I made the point last year that they don't need to get involved with the opposition - whether it be management, backroom staff or players - Dublin now have a reputation of getting involved and I do think referees will be out to get them if this continues. I think that Dublin need to show commitment but not aggression. They can win the AI but not pursuing their current methods for which Pillar is responsible IMO.
It's evident from the tv footage that there was an amount of thick aggressive Dublin supporters on the pitch throwing abuse at the Ref.
What other sport tolerates this?
Indiana do you even have any anecdotal evidence that these louts were cleared off the pitch before they were accused of throwing abuse at the Monaghan team.
I just hope the Dubs behave themselves when we visit Parnell Park next month. I'd nearly be afraid to bring children to watch them at this stage.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 25, 2008, 01:02:01 PM
I just hope the Dubs behave themselves when we visit Parnell Park next month. I'd nearly be afraid to bring children to watch them at this stage.
You lads are afraid of nothing !
It always amazed me how easy it is to get on the field after a game in Parnell. Everyone on the terrace side just use the pitch as a short cut out!
If this keeps up its only a matter of time before we have a fan attacking a player or vice versa.
It only takes one eegit to start something off. Parnell park need to take a serious look at security measures to protect players before its too late.
Can you imagine the abuse Graham is going to have to put up with? They'll be throwing petrol bombs at him.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 25, 2008, 01:16:49 PM
It always amazed me how easy it is to get on the field after a game in Parnell. Everyone on the terrace side just use the pitch as a short cut out!
If this keeps up its only a matter of time before we have a fan attacking a player or vice versa.
It only takes one eegit to start something off. Parnell park need to take a serious look at security measures to protect players before its too late.
According to eyewitness accounts, that time has come.
Let's all face facts,. Vaughan gets applauded off the pitch by Caffrey, this is typical of the way the Dubs are operating at the moment. They're trying to get a real hard man image so they can bully teams, they know they can't win an all-Ireland by playing football alone.
What's really bad about the Dub's at the moment is most of their fans. I'd say that a lot of people who travel to a game against Dublin do not have a good experience and as Jinxy sais above I would not bring children to a game against them.
It's only a matter of time before a serious incident happens in the crowd and it wont be long before we have to separate different supporters like soccer because of the Dubs. Then we have to hear shite like the Dubs doing well is good for the GAA, bullshit.
QuoteIt always amazed me how easy it is to get on the field after a game in Parnell. Everyone on the terrace side just use the pitch as a short cut out!
If this keeps up its only a matter of time before we have a fan attacking a player or vice versa.
It only takes one eegit to start something off. Parnell park need to take a serious look at security measures to protect players before its too late.
Have to agree with this.
Remember thinking the exact same thing at the end of the o'Byrne cup final although I thought it was great the way the kids could go out on the field at half time.
The other thing I thought was very risky was having the presentation in the middle of the stand.
The day of the O'bryne cup final the dublin team had to trapse up into the midle of the stand while the Longoford crowd were trying to leave it. I thought it was a recipe for disaster. It only takes one ejjit to lose the head and some player could get a doing.
Quote from: Main Street on March 25, 2008, 01:24:55 PM
According to eyewitness accounts, that time has come.
??? care to elaborate? I havent heard anything about players being attacked by fans.
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:27:34 PM
Let's all face facts, Vaughan gets applauded off the pitch by Caffrey, this is typical of the way the Dubs are operating at the moment.
You're first statement is over the top - there are players and supporters on most teams who don't endear themselves to anyone -
But I agree with the second bit about Pillar - he's at best a bad example and I couldn't understand his reappointment.
I edited the post above by Dont Matter. Please refer to Rule 2 and 4.
Thank you Moderator - I did say in my last post that it was over the top.
I've been in Parnell Park for club games and underage intercounty games (between Meath and Dublin) and I have to admit I've always enjoyed the half-time entertainment of hundreds of kids with hurls and footballs tearing around the pitch. It's kind of a tradition at this stage. But for senior intercounty games spectators should not be allowed on the pitch. As has been said already, something relatively minor could escalate into something serious and then we are all up sh*t creek. I do feel however, that some teams from perceived "weaker" counties (i.e. haven't won Sam in donkeys years) do seem to go out against the Dubs with a particular "lets show these k*nts we aren't afraid of them mentality" which doesn't help matters. I've always found there was a decent atmosphere between Meath and Dublin fans at games possibly due to a sense of familiarity and the large amount of crossover between the 2 counties. Hopefully that'll continue, but players and management should take their share of responsibility too and not add fuel to the fire.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 25, 2008, 01:40:37 PM
players and management should take their share of responsibility too and not add fuel to the fire.
Which isn't happening in Dublin at the minute.
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:27:34 PM
What's really bad about the Dub's at the moment is their fans.
Its statements like this that make me despair. Are we all as bad?
Feck sake, I'm the first to give out about the scumbags within the Dublin support. But broad sweeping statements like that are very insulting to the many decent Dublin supporters out there.
Unless you intend to personally insult every Dublin fan (me included) at least have the good grace to point out its a minority of the fans who are scum.
As for the rest of your original post, just as well Mods edited, there were some disgraceful comments there.
All Dublin fans shouldn't be tarred with the same brush - every county has supporters that are an embarassment !
I've edited my post, I didn't mean to include all Dublin fans.
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:47:26 PM
I've edited my post, I didn't mean to include all Dublin fans.
Well then fair play! :)
Quote from: EugeneGeraghty on March 25, 2008, 12:07:26 PM
The highly respected referee can only be Pat"In my opinion you got it alright in '96" McEnaney
Does anyone know who the highly respected referee was that is supposed to have seen this headbutt ?
Was it Pat Mc Eneaney, the Monaghan manager's brother ?
Or was it another referee who potentially is looking to earn a few brownie points at Dublin's expense ??? Surely this evidence could be challenged in that this referee ( whoever he is ) has no more authority to report an incident than any other spectator / official who was at the match. I'd hate to think that it was some referee just trying to climb the ladder !
Any ideas ?
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 25, 2008, 01:50:28 PM
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:47:26 PM
I've edited my post, I didn't mean to include all Dublin fans.
Well then fair play! :)
You could be apart of the Dubs supporters I hate. I don't know if you robbed the computer you're useing and how do I know if you're about to shoot up or not?
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:56:36 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 25, 2008, 01:50:28 PM
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 01:47:26 PM
I've edited my post, I didn't mean to include all Dublin fans.
Well then fair play! :)
You could be apart of the Dubs supporters I hate. I don't know if you robbed the computer you're useing and how do I know if you're about to shoot up or not?
You're way out of order again !!!!!!!! Please remove these comments !
I'm only messin there Orangeman.
I don't think it's possible to operate a computer and be off your face.
QuoteYou could be apart of the Dubs supporters I hate. I don't know if you robbed the computer you're useing and how do I know if you're about to shoot up or not?
Typical of some of the nonsense that means I rarely contribute to threads anymore. I haven't heard anyone condoning what Vaughan/Cullen did and if an "official" did indeed hit a player he should have the book thrown at him.
One of the things I enjoy about Parnell is the half time kickabouts and puckabouts. Unfortunately it now looks as if we'll have to walk all the way around the terraces to get out because some gob shites hassled the players.
i sat among the Dubs fans in Breffini Park a few weeks ago, they were a great shower of lads,very knowledgeable etc, Every county has its lunatics, and unfortunately with Dublins population they have a fair few more than the rest of us :-\
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
This can't be right - how can the independence of this person be tested / verified ?
As I said before, this could be the actions of a referee intent on earning a few brownie points and hoping to get a big game later i the year ????
We all go to matches and things happen that the referee doesn't see. Does that mean we should now go to the referee or one of the teams and report this ???
The CCCC would be very busy boys !
The Monaghan fans I encountered during the Div. 2 final in 2005 were no angels. Spewing drink-fuelled bile from start to finish. Then again I had no problems with the Monaghan crowd when we met in Croke park last year. It's the luck of the draw who you end up beside I suppose.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 25, 2008, 01:28:31 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 25, 2008, 01:24:55 PM
According to eyewitness accounts, that time has come.
??? care to elaborate? I havent heard anything about players being attacked by fans.
I am referring to the "head but". A player attacked on the pitch by a non participant, someone unidentified.
More disgraceful if the offender turns out to be a so called official.
Imo a head butt is a real Glasgow Kiss not one of these fake coming togethers, so it could have been a close verbal assault.
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 02:05:20 PM
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
This can't be right - how can the independence of this person be tested / verified ?
As I said before, this could be the actions of a referee intent on earning a few brownie points and hoping to get a big game later i the year ????
We all go to matches and things happen that the referee doesn't see. Does that mean we should now go to the referee or one of the teams and report this ???
The CCCC would be very busy boys !
Catch a grip Orangeman, you've posted this twice now and it is totally trying to make a story out of nothing. If he has no ties with either county he is independent, its not rocket science.
If this incident happened and I haven't heard anyone in the DCB or Dublin camp denying it, then it should be investigaed and any evidence considered particularly that of the player involved, both CB's and any officials who witnessed it. When its over I hope the Monaghan County Board take note of how such a procedure is carried out, as they have failed to act in such a manner themselves in the recent past.
But how far do we take this ?
If it was a member of the Dublin camp, and the headbut was thrown, should the Dubs take the moral stance and issue an apology and deal with it in house or suspend the perpetrator
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 02:05:20 PM
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
This can't be right - how can the independence of this person be tested / verified ?
As I said before, this could be the actions of a referee intent on earning a few brownie points and hoping to get a big game later i the year ????
We all go to matches and things happen that the referee doesn't see. Does that mean we should now go to the referee or one of the teams and report this ???
The CCCC would be very busy boys !
read in one of the papers today that it was a tyrone referee who was the witness to what happened with Tommy Freeman.
it wasnt a member of the Dublin team though SB
The Dublin Panel have already been cleared of any wrongdoing.
it was a fan who came onto the pitch at the end of the game.
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 02:20:51 PM
But how far do we take this ?
To the White House, the buck stops there!! ;D
Let the CCCC deal with it and then move on. Too many appeals, courts cases, strikes etc in the gaa. Let the appropriate body take care of it in a timely manner, punish the individual if he identified and close the book.
He should step forward and let the DCB punish him but that would probably result in him stepping down from his position. The CCCC would prob be lesser :-\
Quote from: tyroneboi on March 25, 2008, 02:25:12 PM
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 02:05:20 PM
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
This can't be right - how can the independence of this person be tested / verified ?
As I said before, this could be the actions of a referee intent on earning a few brownie points and hoping to get a big game later i the year ????
We all go to matches and things happen that the referee doesn't see. Does that mean we should now go to the referee or one of the teams and report this ???
The CCCC would be very busy boys !
read in one of the papers today that it was a tyrone referee who was the witness to what happened with Tommy Freeman.
Are referees highly respected in Tyrone?
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on March 25, 2008, 02:26:07 PM
it wasnt a member of the Dublin team though SB
The Dublin Panel have already been cleared of any wrongdoing.
it was a fan who came onto the pitch at the end of the game.
It wasn't a fan it was a Dublin official , if what I heard during the game was correct
Those are absolutely disgrasful comments "Dont Matter"!!!
(I won't even quote them again as you should remove them immeditaley)
I also dislike the way you edited your post to "most of".
The facts of the matter are that some Dublin supporters leave alot to be desired. Some of them are bringing the "Larger Lout" mentality into the GAA...... but absoutly most of the the Dublin fans are genuine fans that want to be entertained and enjoy a game of football
(although some are easily influenced by the bad apples)
Quote from: Jinxy on March 25, 2008, 02:28:49 PM
Quote from: tyroneboi on March 25, 2008, 02:25:12 PM
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 02:05:20 PM
A highly respected referee, who was a spectator at the game, saw the incident and notified the Monaghan camp.
This can't be right - how can the independence of this person be tested / verified ?
As I said before, this could be the actions of a referee intent on earning a few brownie points and hoping to get a big game later i the year ????
We all go to matches and things happen that the referee doesn't see. Does that mean we should now go to the referee or one of the teams and report this ???
The CCCC would be very busy boys !
read in one of the papers today that it was a tyrone referee who was the witness to what happened with Tommy Freeman.
Are referees highly respected in Tyrone?
There are very few highly respected referees in the country...but the first one that springs to mind is Pat McEnaney (sp?)...a Monaghan man and might well have been at the match. I dont know if it was him, but it would make sense that he'd be there as I'm sure he follows his county.
QuoteThe facts of the matter are that some Dublin supporters leave alot to be desired. Some of them are bringing the "Larger Lout" mentality into the GAA...... but absoutly most of the the Dublin fans are genuine fans that want to be entertained and enjoy a game of football
Some of them are quite small though. :D
read in one of the papers today that it was a tyrone referee who was the witness to what happened with Tommy Freeman.
[/quote]
Are referees highly respected in Tyrone?
[/quote]
A Tyrone referee who was merely a spectator who reported the incident to the Monaghan camp - this is VERY strange indeed - why did he not go to the referee who was the match official ?
My point is again - incidents happen quite often in matches eg off the ball stuff, half time shemozzles, tunnel incidents etc etc - are we as spectators able to go in future to the referee / county boards and report what we see ????
Who was the Tyrone referee and again I'd have to ask the question - why did he decide to embark on this course of action ???
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 02:04:07 PM
I'm only messin there Orangeman.
I don't think it's possible to operate a computer and be off your face.
Don't matter is clearly a Wind up account of a other member . Of his 27 posts 18-20 are bad mouthing the Dub's at this guy who's been a member since July only turn up to post shit about the Dubs
The fact is, if it was Pat, he wasn't there in his capacity as a ref. The "Monaghan managers brother saying he saw something" angle will far outweigh the "All-Ireland final ref saying he saw something" angle.
You'd have to concede that point alright Jinxy - I just find it strange that whoever the referee is, that he decides to have report an incident invloving the Dubs - I could be wrong but it just doesn't add up - when was the last time something like this happened ?
Quote from: Gnevin on March 25, 2008, 02:39:13 PM
Quote from: Dont Matter on March 25, 2008, 02:04:07 PM
I'm only messin there Orangeman.
I don't think it's possible to operate a computer and be off your face.
Don't matter is clearly a Wind up account of a other member . Of his 27 posts 18-20 are bad mouthing the Dub's at this guy who's been a member since July only turn up to post shit about the Dubs
Yep, I just scanned through his previous posts. Absolutely no constructive comments, and consistently slagging other counties (especially the dubs) And "shooting up" seems to be a recurring theme.
Mods, I think this is a good example of a poster we don't need in the Forum..... Similar suspension to Vaughan????
if somone threw a headbutt he should be banned from the association. Have to admit i can't defend pillar if this clown is part of his management team. I sincerely hope it's some random idiot official.
A lot of verbals in the game between players and mentors from both teams unfortunatley.
This fella is part of the Dublin backroom team.
Given Caffrey's behaviour after the match yesterday, is it any wonder that he has like minded, blinkered individuals afterwards.
Any manager that shakes the hand of a man whose tempestuous, ill-judged actions hav cost his team a man in an important league fixture needs to have his head examined. Do young Dublin fans think that Vaughan's actions are appropriate given that they were condoned by his manager?
The article i read made it clear it was not Pat McEnaney that saw the incident. And it didnt name the Tyrone referee but it was probably Mickael Hughes because there isnt another "high profile" referee from tyrone.
Quote from: tyroneboi on March 25, 2008, 03:10:29 PM
The article i read made it clear it was not Pat McEnaney that saw the incident. And it didnt name the Tyrone referee but it was probably Mickael Hughes because there isnt another "high profile" referee from tyrone.
If it is Hughes, that would be par for the course for him - a man who just loves the headlines and will be looking a few browniy points - enough said. Typical !!!!!!
Quote from: thebandit on March 25, 2008, 03:07:32 PM
This fella is part of the Dublin backroom team.
Seems like we have found a witness!! Who was it then Mr. Bandit?
IF this incident happened, then the people involved should be punished. However there have been a number of ridiculous and untrue stories published recently about GAA players that were false such as the Carlow hotel and the kevin Bonner episode.
Quote from: thebandit on March 25, 2008, 03:07:32 PM
Any manager that shakes the hand of a man whose tempestuous, ill-judged actions hav cost his team a man in an important league fixture needs to have his head examined.
I'm sure Vaughan will recieve the bollocking he rightly deserves from Pillar at training. Should Pillar stand screaming at Vaughan on the sideline? Do you know what he actually said to Vaughan? How much public humilation of a player do you require?
I'll await similair howls of protest when a player from another county gets sent off without being berated on the sideline by a manager who should be paying attention to the match.
Orangeman, your attitude to this incident is baffling!!
You are way off the mark. A player been head butted on the field is as bad as anything that is happened in the GAA in the recent past, yet you are treating the whole thing as a conspiracy by a inter county ref to make a name for himself ??? ???
Maybe the alledged aggressor was one of the Refs umpires disguised as a Dub and they plotted the incident to make it look like Hughes was a top offcial and he would soon to Reffing All Irelands on the back of this incident.
Should the whole thing be forgotten about because it wasn't spotted by the ref on the field? Has the second ref (placed on the grassy knoll) gone seeking publicity for it?
That's cynical Orangeman,
does someone always have to have a hidden selfish agenda ?
Hughes has not been shy to propogate the message that referees are entitled to respect, free from physical and verbal abuse, same as players.
He is a witness, by GAA standards a good witness, his statement should be considered with due respect.
Guys the headbutt is "alleged" at the moment, so lets not call for heads to roll yet.
If, and I repeat IF its true, the culprit, IF he is a member of the backroom team, should be thrown out for good.
But lets not go there until we find out how true the allegations are.
Some eye witnesses are saying it was a fan, some a backroom staff member, nothing seems clear at the moment.
Quote from: bingobus on March 25, 2008, 03:47:38 PM
Orangeman, your attitude to this incident is baffling!!
You are way off the mark. A player been head butted on the field is as bad as anything that is happened in the GAA in the recent past, yet you are treating the whole thing as a conspiracy by a inter county ref to make a name for himself ??? ???
Maybe the alledged aggressor was one of the Refs umpires disguised as a Dub and they plotted the incident to make it look like Hughes was a top offcial and he would soon to Reffing All Irelands on the back of this incident.
Should the whole thing be forgotten about because it wasn't spotted by the ref on the field? Has the second ref (placed on the grassy knoll) gone seeking publicity for it?
I heard their was a second head butting , it came from the direction of a grassy knoll
My point AGAIN is this :
Do we ALL go to the referee and report incidents or alleged incidents from now on and will they be reported and taken up by the CCC - as I said before, the CCC will be VERY busy !
I don't understand orangeman. Are you saying it's a BAD thing that an independent witness to a serious incident came forward?
I think it would be extremely harsh to throw the man out of for good just for this misdemeanour. He should get a ban obviously but not be kicked out for good.
If he did headbutt Freeman it obviously wasn't too hard as Freeman wasn't injured in the incident.
Quote from: Stagmeister on March 25, 2008, 04:22:32 PM
I think it would be extremely harsh to throw the man out of for good just for this misdemeanour. He should get a ban obviously but not be kicked out for good.
If he did headbutt Freeman it obviously wasn't too hard as Freeman wasn't injured in the incident.
Whatever about your first two sentences, which may or may not have merit depending on the circumstances, I have to assume you are not offering the third sentence seriously?
According to RTE.ie, the letter Monaghan sent complained of a "head-butt aimed at" Freeman
http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2008/0325/monaghan.html
If that's supposed to imply that there was no contact made, it also says later on that he 'got a headbutt'.
on the vaughan incident - having watched vaughan getting the provocation he got during the game might have tempered pillar's view of giving him a bollocking in front of everyone. Have to be honest -i'd a pretty short fuse as a player and i probably would have given Freeman some of his own mediciine at some point. If you go around looking for it- you'll get it at some point. Vaughan should know better at this stage then to get involved but it can be hard sometime when the officials like linesmen were turniing a blind eye to everything from both sides.
Piilar won't criticise or ignore a player in front of a camera like Tommy Lyons did- but you can be rest assured vaughan will get a bollocking behind closed doors for being stupid enough to react.
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 25, 2008, 04:09:26 PM
I don't understand orangeman. Are you saying it's a BAD thing that an independent witness to a serious incident came forward?
Who is independent ?
If on any Sunday you go to a match and see something unsavoury, are you allowed to go to the referee and report the incident ?
Who decides on whether this should be pursued ?
That's answering my question with a series of other questions. In this case, I'm asking you if you think it's a bad thing that the referee in the crowd came forward with evidence of what he saw?
Who is independent enough then to give evidence ?
And again.
Are you not going to answer my question?
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 04:58:01 PM
Who is independent enough then to give evidence ?
Read the report on RTE, no mention of the additional ref. Tommy reported the incident, it was passed onto the DCB and the Monaghan County Board put it in writing to the CCCC. Weather or not the other ref was used as an witness or not is not detailed nor is it relevant.
Player alledged he got headbutted, County board make submission. End of, leave your strange agenda at the door and move on.
Quote from: dubinhell on March 25, 2008, 03:46:34 PM
Quote from: thebandit on March 25, 2008, 03:07:32 PM
This fella is part of the Dublin backroom team.
Seems like we have found a witness!! Who was it then Mr. Bandit?
IF this incident happened, then the people involved should be punished. However there have been a number of ridiculous and untrue stories published recently about GAA players that were false such as the Carlow hotel and the kevin Bonner episode.
Quote from: thebandit on March 25, 2008, 03:07:32 PM
Any manager that shakes the hand of a man whose tempestuous, ill-judged actions hav cost his team a man in an important league fixture needs to have his head examined.
I'm sure Vaughan will recieve the bollocking he rightly deserves from Pillar at training. Should Pillar stand screaming at Vaughan on the sideline? Do you know what he actually said to Vaughan? How much public humilation of a player do you require?
I'll await similair howls of protest when a player from another county gets sent off without being berated on the sideline by a manager who should be paying attention to the match.
It was a member of the backroom team, I did witness the incident, but I wouldn't be comfortable in naming a person lest I break a rule!
I wouldn't suggest for a second that Piller should have given Vaughan a bollocking on the sideline, but by shaking his hand, he was condoning a cowardly attack that has no place in our games. I would however accept that Vaughan was a certain amount provoked, and there was plenty of mouthing on either side throughout!
To try and defend him afterwards makes the whole thing worse - hopefully some of them has the brains to apologise for the apologise for the 2 incidents, and in doing so would take a good bit of the sting out of it, doing them no harm when it comes to suspensions etc........ but I wouldn't be holding my breath for common sense coming from Piller
Incorrect reporting then - it now turns outthat there wasn't a highly respected referee at the match who is supposed to have went to the Monaghan people - this instigated the whole question about how it would / could be investigated -
In answer to your question, AZ I think it would be a good thing if incidents like this were able to be raised by a neutral observer ( like a citing commissioner in rugby ).
Just on the RTE report, the incident didn't happen afetr the final whistle, it happened just immediately before the last free was kicked
Where were the umpires, linesmen etc ???
I would count the linesman as being badly at fault here - he should have some control over who is coming out of the dugouts etc
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 05:23:00 PM
Where were the umpires, linesmen etc ???
I could break several of the forum rules in replying to you but I will hold my tongue on this one.
Hold on boys, there sems to be a lot of apportioning blame, linesmen, refs, players.. IMHO at the end of the day IF a headbut was thrown the only one responsible is the person who threw it, end of story. That person should be thrown out of our game.
As i said earlier on, if it was a member of the Dublin backroom team then the DCB should take the moral high ground and ban him now if guilty
Quote from: bingobus on March 25, 2008, 05:30:38 PM
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 05:23:00 PM
Where were the umpires, linesmen etc ???
I could break several of the forum rules in replying to you but I will hold my tongue on this one.
What's wrong Bingobus ? ;)
Quote from: Square Ball on March 25, 2008, 05:34:34 PM
Hold on boys, there sems to be a lot of apportioning blame, linesmen, refs, players.. IMHO at the end of the day IF a headbut was thrown the only one responsible is the person who threw it, end of story. That person should be thrown out of our game.
As i said earlier on, if it was a member of the Dublin backroom team then the DCB should take the moral high ground and ban him now if guilty
And in doing so they would save face and an awful amount of hassle
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 05:36:36 PM
Quote from: bingobus on March 25, 2008, 05:30:38 PM
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 05:23:00 PM
Where were the umpires, linesmen etc ???
I could break several of the forum rules in replying to you but I will hold my tongue on this one.
What's wrong Bingobus ? ;)
I just hope that Tommy gets justice ;) ;D
Quote from: thebandit on March 25, 2008, 05:44:57 PM
Quote from: Square Ball on March 25, 2008, 05:34:34 PM
Hold on boys, there sems to be a lot of apportioning blame, linesmen, refs, players.. IMHO at the end of the day IF a headbut was thrown the only one responsible is the person who threw it, end of story. That person should be thrown out of our game.
As i said earlier on, if it was a member of the Dublin backroom team then the DCB should take the moral high ground and ban him now if guilty
And in doing so they would save face and an awful amount of hassle
Agreed - I have no problem with that - but it looks likes this oe could be open to challenge ??
I just hope that Tommy gets justice
So do I Bingobus but will he ?
I would hope so (My comment was double ended and would relate to a "little incident" in a abandoned leage semi in December which involved the "victim") ;)
Couple of comments -
1 - If any of the Dublin panel aimed a headbutt I hope they own up and take their suspension like a man and don't try appealing...
2 - With regards to Caffrey and Vaughan he shouldn't abuse him in public and obviously at the time could easily not have seen what exactly happened until seeing it on TV later...
3 - Why all the whinging about Vaughan reacting to the obvious taunting he got....if it had been the Monaghan player reacting to Dublin abuse everyone would be giving out about hte Dublin abuse and off the ball fouling etc...(note I am not condoning Vaughans actions)
Losing the rag and reacting to a taunting on the spot is different than inflicting a calculated assault later on.
It looked to me that Vaughan was giving as good as he got with the verbals.
Bertie Ahern is usually near the dugout at Parnell Park.
Quote from: Aaron Boone on March 25, 2008, 07:55:52 PM
Bertie Ahern is usually near the dugout at Parnell Park.
Should that be digout??????
Id like to think that an inter county referee from a county not involved would be as independant as you could get orangeman. If not then he shouldnt be refereeing intercounty games. Also by your way of thinking then all referees arent independant and players shouldnt be punished for their actions which are reported by the referee.
Quote from: Frank Casey on March 25, 2008, 07:58:39 PM
Quote from: Aaron Boone on March 25, 2008, 07:55:52 PM
Bertie Ahern is usually near the dugout at Parnell Park.
Should that be digout??????
So that's why they were taking cash at the turnstiles ???? But was it it sterling or euro ? ;)
Quote from: orangeman on March 25, 2008, 05:18:35 PM
Incorrect reporting then - it now turns outthat there wasn't a highly respected referee at the match who is supposed to have went to the Monaghan people - this instigated the whole question about how it would / could be investigated -
In answer to your question, AZ I think it would be a good thing if incidents like this were able to be raised by a neutral observer ( like a citing commissioner in rugby ).
More red tape . If the Dubs county board had any decency they would get this matter sorted quickly .Give the guy up and let him serve his suspension .
If the Mentors are getting so worked up they cant be making rational decissions .
What sort of a "mentor" is he ? Mentor or mental ? ;D
Do we all know who the alleged guilty party is? I can think of one well known individual who was in the vicinity at the time. I'm presuming everyone here knows they just don't want to say.
What role did this member of the management team have ? He must be very "head"strong !! ;)
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
Seemingly he was wearing an orange bib. According to the Monaghan statement.
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
I think they wear different colour bibs to designate their function. I know the maor uisce and maor camán wear differnt colours in hurling. I think the Bainisteor wears a different colour as well.
But Dublin have different "functions" to the rest of Ireland ! ;D
And each bib has an unique Barcode that is scanned before and after they enter the field, its used to do up their wages at end of week.
Rumour has it that Bertie wears a Rainbow coloured bib under his suit in his position as Honory Head Function Delegator of the secret scet of Bibs
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who
aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
Quote from: bingobus on March 26, 2008, 10:48:16 AM
And each bib has an unique Barcode that is scanned before and after they enter the field, its used to do up their wages at end of week.
Rumour has it that Bertie wears a Rainbow coloured bib under his suit in his position as Honory Head Function Delegator of the secret scet of Bibs
:D ;D ;D Is that a new political party or just a fundraiser ?
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 12:11:13 PM
Quote from: bingobus on March 26, 2008, 10:48:16 AM
And each bib has an unique Barcode that is scanned before and after they enter the field, its used to do up their wages at end of week.
Rumour has it that Bertie wears a Rainbow coloured bib under his suit in his position as Honory Head Function Delegator of the secret scet of Bibs
:D ;D ;D Is that a new political party or just a fundraiser ?
Depends on who is asking or donating!!
The Independent has come out very strongly against Pillar today demanding that Pillar names and shames the culprit - it goes on to outline a whole list of incidents of indiscipline associated with the Dublin set up - it's a piece by Colm Keys -
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 12:51:42 PM
The Independent has come out very strongly against Pillar today demanding that Pillar names and shames the culprit - it goes on to outline a whole list of incidents of indiscipline associated with the Dublin set up - it's a piece by Colm Keys -
Here's the Article:
Quote
Dublin in the dock
By Colm Keys
Wednesday March 26 2008
(c) www.independent.ie
PRESSURE intensified on Dublin last night to name the member of their backroom team who head- butted Monaghan forward Tommy Freeman after Sunday's fractious NFL match in Parnell Park.
Despite Dublin chairman Gerry Harrington saying yesterday that they were taking Monaghan's claims seriously and that they would conduct an internal investigation, Dublin GAA's top brass have been urged to show leadership and act swiftly in the controversy.
Freeman was standing quite close to the end-line when he was confronted by a person wearing an official bib, who he initially thought was a steward, and was head-butted.
The GAA's Competition Controls Committee have already briefly discussed a complaint lodged by Monaghan that Freeman had been struck and have written to Dublin County Board seeking an explanation and, if it can established, the identity of the person involved.
Monaghan are understood to have up to three cast-iron independent witnesses, including a referee, who were present at the match and have agreed to testify if it comes to that.
That will inevitably pile the pressure on Dublin to come up with the identity of Freeman's alleged assailant, who is understood to be a member of the manager Paul Caffrey's extended backroom team, but not a selector, sooner rather than later.
The allegation that a another member of the Dublin backroom team has been involved in such an incident once again raises questions about the level of composure on the Dublin sideline.
In the past, Caffrey and one of his selectors have been censured for incidents along the sideline. Harrington said that Dublin would not turn a blind eye to the complaint made by Monaghan.
"The chairman of the Monaghan County Board initially made a complaint to myself and John Costello, claiming that one of their players was assaulted by a steward.
"We promised to do so straight away. But he later text ed back, alleging it was a member of the backroom team," explained Harrington.
"We will be carrying out our own investigation and we will be assisting with any other investigation that may be set up to deal with Monaghan's complaint.
"At the moment we can't comment on the specifics of the complaint."
Because of holidays, Harrington said it may not be possible to convene a meeting of the Dublin management committee this week.
Freeman was still feeling the effects of the blow yesterday but is not expected to miss Sunday's match in Clones against Meath. A GAA spokesman confirmed that the CCCC had received the complaint, had discussed it yesterday and would be pursuing the matter with immediate effect.
- Colm Keys
Sorry, I actually think this is the article Orangeman was refering to:
Quote
Who was wearing orange bib, Pillar?
By Colm Keys
Wednesday March 26 2008
(c) www.independent.ie
Accountability for Dublin behaviour begins and ends with the manager.
Word had filtered through to Monaghan in the days leading up to last Sunday's fractious NFL match in Parnell Park that Dublin were studying them closely and were paying particular attention to the cruder elements that Monaghan have brought to their game over the last couple of years.
Sometime last year the teams had met in a challenge match where the whiff of acrimony was palpable throughout. Battle lines between them were drawn that night as Monaghan laid down a marker as to their physical capabilities and Dublin responded in kind.
With Monaghan in town last weekend, Dublin were intent on presenting Parnell Park as something of a fortress. When they had last met there in a League match it was Dublin's next game after their infamous Omagh battle with Tyrone and they succumbed rather easily to a revved up visiting side.
This time it would be different, Dublin had promised themselves.
And from the off there was an edge to their play that manifested itself most perhaps in their half-forward Mark Vaughan who was lucky to survive a reckless first-half tackle with just a booking before he eventually got his marching orders minutes into the second-half.
Dublin just didn't play with the control they had oozed in their O'Byrne Cup campaign and their opening two League matches against Westmeath and Cavan.
And not for the first time that apparent absence of control spilled out on to the sideline where a member of the backroom staff has been fingered for allegedly head-butting Monaghan's ace forward Thomas Freeman.
If and when investigations in either Dublin or Croke Park establish the veracity of Monaghan's apparently water tight claim -- they have up to three independent witnesses including a referee willing to give testimony -- it will be by far the most serious in a line of charges of indiscipline to be brought against members of this Dublin management team.
Perhaps there shouldn't be too much surprise at this turn of events. Paul Caffrey himself has not in the past always been a shining example of calm and composure in dispensing his duties as team manager.
Bans
His shoulder charge into the back of Mayo coach John Morrison before the 2006 All-Ireland semi-final, when Mayo had cornered the Hill 16 end for their warm-up, was an ill-thought move that earned him a one- match championship ban served against Meath in the Leinster first round last June.
Another one-match sideline ban, this time served in the League against Donegal, followed his altercation with Tyrone's Ryan McMenamin at the end of the opening League match in 2007 that celebrated the official switching on of the lights in Croke Park.
McMenamin had just been sent-off for lashing out at Kevin Bonner as the home side chased a one-point deficit. When Dublin needed a calm head on the sideline to re-organise them with a numerical advantage they had a team manager squaring up to an opponent and trading words with him.
A year earlier Dublin selector and 'runner' Paul Clarke also had to sit in the stands for their opening championship match against Longford, a suspension handed down to him by the provincial council after an alleged incident with Wexford player Colin Morris during an O'Byrne Cup game.
In another Parnell Park League match in 2005 against Westmeath there was another sideline flashpoint between members of rival management teams that suitably enraged the then Westmeath manager Paidi O Se.
A steady pattern of sideline chaos and indiscipline has been built-up with this necklace of incidents over the last four years.
The latest incident brings into question once again the liberty afforded to team mentors on match days.
It was an area the GAA tried earnestly to clear up at the end of 2006 when they issued a new charter that governed all aspects of match presentation.
Among the suggestions were the removal of all other selectors to the stands with the exception of the team manager and a runner and the provision of neutral water carriers.
But inter-county managers railed against these proposals, argued the case vehemently that selectors couldn't be detached from the manager for logistical and even safety reasons and the GAA eventually backed down against the weight of opposition.
Tampering
The GAA's case for providing water carriers was also lost as the managers argued successfully that with the advent of dope testing there was the potential for tampering if the teams themselves didn't retain control of what was in the bottles at all times.
Will this latest incident now bring elements of those proposals back to the discussion table?
Counties often scoff at the petty detail of the GAA's match regulation booklet and the nature of the fines that come as a consequence of defying those regulations.
But the regulations, petty as they may seem, are there for a reason and in light of this latest alleged incident is it any wonder that the GAA have tried to clean up its match presentation act.
What business had a member of the Dublin backroom team being to one side of the goals they were defending if he wasn't the official runner (which he wasn't) or water carrier?
On top of incidents of goading opponents in a couple of last year's championship games, there has to be question marks over the level of discipline and control Caffrey is exercising over the entire Dublin football project.
He is by his own admission the figurehead, not a manager but the head of a management team. That management team is ultimately his responsibility. He appoints, therefore he too is accountable. Any probe should begin and end with a simple question to the manager: "Who was that member of your backroom team in the orange bib?"
- Colm Keys
So Monaghan reported the assault from what they beleived to be a steward. Then texted later (presumably after they had left) to say it was a member of the backroom team.
Thats a bit curious, if they didnt know he was at the time, what changed their view after they had left?
I'm not suggesting it was or wasnt a member of the backroom team, just wondering what made Monaghan change the report.
QuoteAny probe should begin and end with a simple question to the manager: "Who was that member of your backroom team in the orange bib?"
Don't think any of the backroom team wear orange bibs? So if the answer to this question was none would that satisfy Mr Keys?
Quote from: Declan on March 26, 2008, 01:58:54 PM
Don't think any of the backroom team wear orange bibs? So if the answer to this question was none would that satisfy Mr Keys?
the only thing that would satisfy mr Keys is a sheep :o
Quote from: heffo on March 26, 2008, 11:18:58 AM
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
I saw someone wearing a yellow/orange bib behind the goals at the church end. This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an All-Ireland.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 26, 2008, 02:18:40 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 26, 2008, 11:18:58 AM
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
I saw someone wearing a yellow/orange bib behind the goals at the church end. This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an All-Ireland.
JASON SHERLOCK ;D
Be careful here lads. Let's leave the innuendo at that. If it becomes public, feel free to comment, but until then lets stop referring to people directly or indirectly. (I realise the Jason Sherlock comment is a joke).
I wasn't implying any guilt. Just saying that a member of the Dublin backroom staff was clearly visible in that particular area. Thats the end of it.
Wasn't aimed at you jinxy, in particular. The thread was just veering towards that moment where someone would say something obvious.
I had to laugh at the bit in the Indo where it said that "holidays" might get in the way of convening a meeting in order to launch an investigation. What a joke ! ;D ;D ;D
"Accountability for Dublin behaviour begins and ends with the manager".
Pillar won't give a fiddlers fart about the headbut and why should he, he has a game to prepare for.
Pillar wouldn't snitch on a fellow comrade, would he?
Quote from: Main Street on March 26, 2008, 04:19:02 PM
"Accountability for Dublin behaviour begins and ends with the manager".
Pillar won't give a fiddlers fart about the headbut and why should he, he has a game to prepare for.
Pillar wouldn't snitch on a fellow comrade, would he?
If it's established that there was a headbutt, then Pillar should sack the guy immediately- it's all speculation at the moment
Quote from: Main Street on March 26, 2008, 04:19:02 PM
"Accountability for Dublin behaviour begins and ends with the manager".
Pillar won't give a fiddlers fart about the headbut and why should he, he has a game to prepare for.
Pillar wouldn't snitch on a fellow comrade, would he?
There's a term for that within the force isn't there ? ;D
Quote from: Jinxy on March 26, 2008, 02:18:40 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 26, 2008, 11:18:58 AM
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
I saw someone wearing a yellow/orange bib behind the goals at the church end. This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an All-Ireland.
Jinxy I too saw Paul Clarke running about behind the goals and had him down as prime suspect. He was however wearing a yellow bib and was specifically ruled out as the monaghan lads confirmed freeman's assailant was a member of the backroom team and not a selector.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 26, 2008, 02:18:40 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 26, 2008, 11:18:58 AM
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
I saw someone wearing a yellow/orange bib behind the goals at the church end. This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an All-Ireland.
sure thats years ago, hard to remember that far back ;D ;)
Quote from: passedit on March 26, 2008, 04:36:41 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 26, 2008, 02:18:40 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 26, 2008, 11:18:58 AM
Quote from: dubinhell on March 26, 2008, 11:13:11 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 26, 2008, 10:39:26 AM
Quote from: thejuice on March 26, 2008, 10:35:31 AM
was the assailant wearing a bib? what colour?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ciaranmcphotography/2357941169/sizes/l/
One of the other posters said it was an orange bib ? Do they wear different colour bibs so that they can be distinguished ? Next day, they'll all be wearing the one colour so as to confuse us ! ;D
The alleged person who aimed a headbutt at Freeman (according to RTE) was supposed to have an orange bib. The only people wearing orange bibs (look at photo) are the stewards. The mentors etc are wearing yellow, green or blue. Not that it excuses that sort of behaviour
I also find it very unlikely that the person they're alleging did it, was up at the end line - I've never seen him away from the bench.
I saw someone wearing a yellow/orange bib behind the goals at the church end. This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an All-Ireland.
Jinxy I too saw Paul Clarke running about behind the goals and had him down as prime suspect. He was however wearing a yellow bib and was specifically ruled out as the monaghan lads confirmed freeman's assailant was a member of the backroom team and not a selector.
I would interpret the term "backroom team" as referring to everyone other than the players and manager. Dunno if that's correct but I could see how the term could be used/misused in this situation. Also, there is a fine line between a yellow bib and an orange bib. Especially if you are colourblind!
This man would be well known to anyone who is familiar with the last Dublin team to win an AI
Are you saying as a player ?
A nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse. ;)
Lads. That's enough. It's fairly obvious who ye are hinting at, and he's even been mentioned by name now. Lets drop it before someone says something stupid that I have to edit.
In fairness mod i was ruling the man out.
Defending his unimpeachable honour if you like. :)
Quote from: passedit on March 26, 2008, 04:58:14 PM
In fairness mod i was ruling the man out.
Defending his unimpeachable honour if you like. :)
;D
Yes, but your post was responded to with this...
QuoteI would interpret the term "backroom team" as referring to everyone other than the players and manager. Dunno if that's correct but I could see how the term could be used/misused in this situation. Also, there is a fine line between a yellow bib and an orange bib. Especially if you are colourblind!
So let's just back off from this now.
Cheers.
Nice one passedit. Just ruined it for everyone. ::) ;D
(http://clubdir.gaa.ie/ulster/monaghan/images/Paul-Finlay-V-Dublin-March-.jpg)
Whats Cluxton looking at?
Answers on a post card to:
DCB yaddayaddayadda
Maybe that young Drumcondra bird from '02.
Quote from: Mid Mon on March 26, 2008, 07:23:19 PM
(http://clubdir.gaa.ie/ulster/monaghan/images/Paul-Finlay-V-Dublin-March-.jpg)
Whats Cluxton looking at?
(http://image.com.com/mp3/images/genie_images/story/2006/h/headbutt_story.jpg)
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 26, 2008, 01:24:50 PM
So Monaghan reported the assault from what they beleived to be a steward. Then texted later (presumably after they had left) to say it was a member of the backroom team.
Thats a bit curious, if they didnt know he was at the time, what changed their view after they had left?
I'm not suggesting it was or wasnt a member of the backroom team, just wondering what made Monaghan change the report.
Hazarding a guess I'd say talking to the victim or looking at video evidence? But hey, I'm no Columbo..
Quote from: Mid Mon on March 26, 2008, 07:23:19 PM
(http://clubdir.gaa.ie/ulster/monaghan/images/Paul-Finlay-V-Dublin-March-.jpg)
Whats Cluxton looking at?
Don't know but it's putting a bit of a strain on those O'neills shorts.
I'm not sure if this is the right message board for you Johnny Cool if you're noticing such detail.. ;D
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 27, 2008, 04:20:44 PM
I'm not sure if this is the right message board for you Johnny Cool if you're noticing such detail.. ;D
The Lads over at blueoyster.com/forum are very friendly. Or so I've been told ;D
Yer man wouldn't a headbutted Finlay. He's as hard as nails!!!
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 27, 2008, 02:12:42 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 26, 2008, 01:24:50 PM
So Monaghan reported the assault from what they beleived to be a steward. Then texted later (presumably after they had left) to say it was a member of the backroom team.
Thats a bit curious, if they didnt know he was at the time, what changed their view after they had left?
I'm not suggesting it was or wasnt a member of the backroom team, just wondering what made Monaghan change the report.
Hazarding a guess I'd say talking to the victim or looking at video evidence? But hey, I'm no Columbo..
Well I'm sure they spoke to the victim before the initial report. As it was Freeman who alerted them to the attack. So what changed the victims mind after he had left is of interest to me.
Also if they had video evidence surely it would be handed over immediately. they menioned witnesses but no video evidence, surely if they had this they wouldnt hide it.
Yep, no Columbo is right ;)
Theres something fishy about all this.
Someone is making something up, I just dont know who.
QuoteSomeone is making something up, I just dont know who.
They ain't making up the fact that Caffery & his backroom team conduct themselves like corner-boys. A disgrace to the Association.
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
Quote from: Over the Bar on March 27, 2008, 07:16:36 PM
QuoteSomeone is making something up, I just dont know who.
They ain't making up the fact that Caffery & his backroom team conduct themselves like corner-boys. A disgrace to the Association.
Thats a bit rich coming from a Tyrone man. Tyrone didn't lick their 'style' from the stones.
Quote
Thats a bit rich coming from a Tyrone man. Tyrone didn't lick their 'style' from the stones.
??? :-\ ???
Quote from: Main Street on March 27, 2008, 08:08:47 PM
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?id=9795&mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&viewstory=yes
Statement Dublin County Committee
The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved. The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken. The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred.
Well the DCB have followed due process and this incident will now be investigated by the CCCC.
P.S i look forward to this being dragged up after very game Dublin play this summer ::)
Quote from: Gnevin on March 27, 2008, 08:50:04 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 27, 2008, 08:08:47 PM
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?id=9795&mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&viewstory=yes
Statement Dublin County Committee
The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved. The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken. The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred.
Well the DCB have followed due process and this incident will now be investigated by the CCCC.
P.S i look forward to this being dragged up after very game Dublin play this summer ::)
The fact that the Mgt committee met at the earliest opportunity and immediately initiated an investigation and identified the culprit won't appease this shower.
Quote from: Gnevin on March 27, 2008, 08:50:04 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 27, 2008, 08:08:47 PM
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?id=9795&mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&viewstory=yes
Statement Dublin County Committee
The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved. The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken. The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred.
Well the DCB have followed due process and this incident will now be investigated by the CCCC.
P.S i look forward to this being dragged up after very game Dublin play this summer ::)
Hopefully this is the end of it and the apology and punishment handed out by DCB will be accepted by the Monaghan board. Don't need to bringing up this every other week. If the "headbutt" was as bad as many would wish, we'd still be trying to pull Tommy Freeman off your man in Parnell Park. He wouldn't be known for been easy going in incidents like this!!
Francie sledging Pillar in Cross.... hmmm that would be good! ;D
Quote from: bingobus on March 27, 2008, 10:09:33 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 27, 2008, 08:50:04 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 27, 2008, 08:08:47 PM
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?id=9795&mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&viewstory=yes
Statement Dublin County Committee
The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved. The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken. The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred.
Well the DCB have followed due process and this incident will now be investigated by the CCCC.
P.S i look forward to this being dragged up after very game Dublin play this summer ::)
Hopefully this is the end of it and the apology and punishment handed out by DCB will be accepted by the Monaghan board. Don't need to bringing up this every other week. If the "headbutt" was as bad as many would wish, we'd still be trying to pull Tommy Freeman off your man in Parnell Park. He wouldn't be known for been easy going in incidents like this!!
Considering Tommy is on camera shaking hands with Dublin players immediately after the final whistle one would expect that the headbutt was not from the "Yosser Hughes" school of headbutting. Anyway hopefully this sorry saga is coming to an end and Monaghan are as vociferous in their acknowledgement of the apology as they were in their condemnation of the kids playing at half time, the stewarding, the Dublin supporters, Parnell Park, etc. etc.
Wonder how long will the offender get ? 4,8,12,24,48 weeks ? I'll go for 8 ( not that it matters a lot )
Quote from: dubsnsubs on March 27, 2008, 11:03:54 PM
Quote from: bingobus on March 27, 2008, 10:09:33 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on March 27, 2008, 08:50:04 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 27, 2008, 08:08:47 PM
At least Pillar is not a snitch. :)
but someone is, the Dublin County board have now forwarded some name.
That €10 reward worked wonders
http://www.hill16.ie/viewstoryhill16.asp?id=9795&mainheading=Word+on+The+Hill&viewstory=yes
Statement Dublin County Committee
The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved. The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken. The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred.
Well the DCB have followed due process and this incident will now be investigated by the CCCC.
P.S i look forward to this being dragged up after very game Dublin play this summer ::)
Hopefully this is the end of it and the apology and punishment handed out by DCB will be accepted by the Monaghan board. Don't need to bringing up this every other week. If the "headbutt" was as bad as many would wish, we'd still be trying to pull Tommy Freeman off your man in Parnell Park. He wouldn't be known for been easy going in incidents like this!!
Considering Tommy is on camera shaking hands with Dublin players immediately after the final whistle one would expect that the headbutt was not from the "Yosser Hughes" school of headbutting. Anyway hopefully this sorry saga is coming to an end and Monaghan are as vociferous in their acknowledgement of the apology as they were in their condemnation of the kids playing at half time, the stewarding, the Dublin supporters, Parnell Park, etc. etc.
Wind your neck in! Nobody was givin out about kids playin at half-time. It was the full-time antics that was the issue. Why can't you see and admit that it is not in the best interests of health and safety to allow irate supporters storm the pitch. I can tell ya that folk in Monaghan don't want a bit of this kind of publicity or have this drawn through the media anymore.. What happened Tommy Freeman was disgraceful, end of story. I can guarantee you all in Monaghan will accept the apology and get on with the football, on the pitch.
Nobody likes a snitch. :o
Something from 1 to 5 years will do for starters, depending on previous criminal record.
If a wooden spoon which missed the target is worth a €5000 fine for Mayo then a headbutt which connects with a player on the field of play should be worth at least €15000.
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
From independent.ie
Dubs name Freeman head-butt culprit
By Colm Keys
Friday March 28 2008
DUBLIN have handed over the identity of Tommy Freeman's head-butt assailant to the Central Competition Controls Committee.
It is understood that the name of Ray Boyne, a statistician with the team for the last four years, has been forwarded to Croke Park.
Earlier this week, Monaghan lodged an official complaint to the CCCC about the alleged head-butt which took place in the closing stages of Sunday's fractious NFL match.
Boyne and Dublin manager Paul Caffrey travelled to Monaghan yesterday afternoon when a personal apology for the incident was conveyed to Freeman in the company of Monaghan manager Seamus McEnaney.
Boyne now faces a fourmonth suspension and both Monaghan and Dublin are keen to draw a line under the incident.
The CCCC are expected to issue the sanction next week.
It is understood that communication was made between the two management teams on Wednesday morning and agreement was reached to sort the matter out quickly to everyone's benefit.
The meeting between the parties was understood to be cordial and Freeman readily accepted the apology.
According to an eyewitness account by a high ranking garda officer contacted by the Irish Independent, the incident took place prior to Monaghan's equalising point in the clubhouse corner of Parnell Park.
Freeman was felled by the blow after words were exchanged and Monaghan officials immediately made a complaint to their Dublin counterparts.
Contrary to Monaghan's initial claims however the Dublin team official in question was not wearing a bib and had his name emblazoned across the back of his top, according to the eyewitness account.
Monaghan had other strong eye witnesses willing to give evidence and it helped to strengthen the case for Dublin to reveal the name.
Monaghan chairman John Connolly credited Dublin for their swift action. "As far as we are concerned the matter is now over between the counties and we'd like to commend Dublin for the way they have dealt with it. Both parties met and it was cordial."
Dublin issued a statement last night outlining their version of events.
It read: "The Dublin County Committee have investigated an incident during the Dublin v Monaghan National Football League game last Sunday in Parnell Park and have identified the individual involved.
"The identity of the individual has been communicated to the Central Competitions Control Committee and disciplinary action has been taken.
"The Dublin County Board, Team Management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman and regret that the incident ever occurred."
QuoteMonaghan had other strong eye witnesses willing to give evidence and it helped to strengthen the case for Dublin to reveal the name
Jaysus is the implication that if there were no other witnesses that they wouldn't have taken any action or am I just being paranoid about Keys?
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
QuoteMonaghan had other strong eye witnesses willing to give evidence and it helped to strengthen the case for Dublin to reveal the name
Jaysus is the implication that if there were no other witnesses that they wouldn't have taken any action or am I just being paranoid about Keys?
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
I think we're used to that sort of rubbish from Keys.
The eye-witnesses would have counted for nothing in the reasoning for the DCB coming forward - sure already we'd heard incorrect information from eye-witnesses - some saying it was a steward, others that he'd a yellow bib!
The DCB has a duty to act correctly, to set an example to all clubs in Dublin that this is the way to act if unfortunate circumstances like these arise. Thankfully they've done the right thing, and I think it was inevitable they would.
QuoteBoyne and Dublin manager Paul Caffrey travelled to Monaghan yesterday afternoon when a personal apology for the incident was conveyed to Freeman in the company of Monaghan manager Seamus McEnaney.
If Caffery had an ounce of leadership in him he'd have booted him out of the Dublin set-up and had him make his own way to Monaghan. Little chance of that.
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 27, 2008, 05:12:10 PM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 27, 2008, 02:12:42 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 26, 2008, 01:24:50 PM
So Monaghan reported the assault from what they beleived to be a steward. Then texted later (presumably after they had left) to say it was a member of the backroom team.
Thats a bit curious, if they didnt know he was at the time, what changed their view after they had left?
I'm not suggesting it was or wasnt a member of the backroom team, just wondering what made Monaghan change the report.
Hazarding a guess I'd say talking to the victim or looking at video evidence? But hey, I'm no Columbo..
Well I'm sure they spoke to the victim before the initial report. As it was Freeman who alerted them to the attack. So what changed the victims mind after he had left is of interest to me.
Also if they had video evidence surely it would be handed over immediately. they menioned witnesses but no video evidence, surely if they had this they wouldnt hide it.
Yep, no Columbo is right ;)
Theres something fishy about all this.
Someone is making something up, I just dont know who.
You still off on your alternative theories his holiness??
De radio is saying twas the team stats man. I spose ye'd need to use yer head in that position. As for dublin giving him up without the threat of independent witnesses, John Finn anyone?
Quote from: passedit on March 28, 2008, 10:52:28 AM
De radio is saying twas the team stats man. I spose ye'd need to use yer head in that position. As for dublin giving him up without the threat of independent witnesses, John Finn anyone?
Going back 23 years - you need to get out more.
but as far as i'm aware there is no time limit on precedents. :)
Quote from: Over the Bar on March 27, 2008, 10:23:01 PM
Francie sledging Pillar in Cross.... hmmm that would be good! ;D
Francie doesn't sledge anyone - all he'd have to do with Piller is look at him
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 28, 2008, 08:58:18 AM
Well I'm sure they spoke to the victim before the initial report. As it was Freeman who alerted them to the attack. So what changed the victims mind after he had left is of interest to me.
Also if they had video evidence surely it would be handed over immediately. they menioned witnesses but no video evidence, surely if they had this they wouldnt hide it.
Yep, no Columbo is right ;)
Theres something fishy about all this.
Someone is making something up, I just dont know who.
You still off on your alternative theories his holiness??
[/quote]
There wasnt any alternative theories, just a few points needed clarifying.
But now its been put to bed along with all conspiracy theories of Dublin cover ups.
They name the culprit who has travelled to Monaghan to apologise and will accept whatever punishment is dished out.
Also the talk of Pillar not taking responsibility for his backroom team is also quashed as he took the trip up to Monaghan also with Boyne to see the apology.
I think we can all agree that it was a disgraceful incident, which has been dealt with correctly by all sides.
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
Also re playing the games away from home, again that is silly. This would have happened no matter where the game was played. If it were a steward or a fan who attacked him I would agree fully.
Quote from: Over the Bar on March 28, 2008, 08:53:05 AM
If Caffery had an ounce of leadership in him he'd have booted him out of the Dublin set-up and had him make his own way to Monaghan. Little chance of that.
So much for all the talk of him taking responsibility for his backroom team. I thought taking the trip to Monaghan was doing exactly that.
Re kicking him out, surely accepting whatever ban the GAA see as appropriate is the way to go. If the GAA dont see a lifetime ban as apt then why would Pillar?? :-\
His Holyness
Do you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
All this crap about going down to the Hill before championship games and posing for the cameras.
They're too worried about what the fans and media think of them rather than focusing on the task in hand.
I think the Dubs would have had an AI in recent years had they a descent manager who wasn't so stubborn and blind and play to the teams strengths rather than all this 100% unity and commitment crap and that no-one gets punished if they do wrong.
Indiscipline has and will continue to lead to errors and losing of the BIG matches where getting a silly yellow card for a defender can decide a match.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
His Holyness
Do you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
All this crap about going down to the Hill before championship games and posing for the cameras.
They're too worried about what the fans and media think of them rather than focusing on the task in hand.
I think the Dubs would have had an AI in recent years had they a descent manager who wasn't so stubborn and blind and play to the teams strengths rather than all this 100% unity and commitment crap and that no-one gets punished if they do wrong.
Indiscipline has and will continue to lead to errors and losing of the BIG matches where getting a silly yellow card for a defender can decide a match.
It would be a very poor manager indeed (Tommy Lyons) who would berate a player in public .
What indiscipline had a shocker of a game last week and got sent off poor form but try as they may (Laois backs) he rose above it all last year .This is like the myth the Wheelan is a dirty player and has Dozen's of yellow and red card to his name.
Really Fuzzman you must try harder ::)
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
His Holyness
Do you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Blind loyalty, is that what you would call marching Boyne up to Monaghan to apoligise?
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
He did shake his hand, but lets be honest, nobody knows what was said to Vaughan behind closed doors, he could well have bollocked him out of it, in front of the tv cameras is not the place to have a go at a player.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
Again, how do you know he didnt, just because he didnt do it live on tv doesnt mean it didnt happen.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
All this crap about going down to the Hill before championship games and posing for the cameras.
You will find a lot of Dubs, me included, who agree that the "march" doesnt help.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
They're too worried about what the fans and media think of them rather than focusing on the task in hand.
Now thats crazy talk. The media are the ones slagging them regularly over marching to the hill, if they were worried about the media they would not do it.
But to suggest these guys care more about their image to the fans and what the media say than winning an all ireland is just plain insulting.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
I think the Dubs would have had an AI in recent years had they a descent manager who wasn't so stubborn and blind and play to the teams strengths rather than all this 100% unity and commitment crap and that no-one gets punished if they do wrong.
I would agree in that I think Pillar should have stepped down last year, but the "no-one gets punished if they do wrong" comment is bizarre.
Please explain that one, I didnt think it was Pillars job to dish out punishments for wrong doing, I would have thought that was the job of the ref or Croke park.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Indiscipline has and will continue to lead to errors and losing of the BIG matches where getting a silly yellow card for a defender can decide a match.
I strongly agree, but the last time Dublin had a player sent off in a big championship game which had a big bearing was against Armagh in 2003. Player indiscipline hasnt been an issue for the dubs, results wise.
In fact the two games in recent years which had ye whingeing the most about the Dubs behaviour (Laois last year and Tyrone in Omagh) both resulted in Dublin wins.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PMDo you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
Have you not considered that Vaughan was maybe following orders or at least had Pillar's blessing to use all means fair and foul to teach these Monaghan upstarts a few hard lessons?
Dublin are playing the way Pillar wants them to play.
Surely you can't be suggesting that Pillar's team are out of control.
If Vaughan had not been caught for the assault on Freeman, Pillar would be purring with delight.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Agree that Pillar should not have shook his hand. Though equalling a berating is public would be just as bad - if not worse.
And in defence of Pillar, the incident didnt look near as bad in real time. From where Pillar was, and from where the ref was and from the TV angle, it just looked like a shoulder and a theathrical fall. It seemed the ref wasnt going to even book him initially, but the linesman would have had a much better view so he informed the ref. Though still he only gave him a second yellow.
My inital reaction (which the replays showed was completely wrong) was that he was unfortunate to get sent off. So I can see why Pillar might have had the same initial reaction.
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:44:49 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PMDo you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
Have you not considered that Vaughan was maybe following orders or at least had Pillar's blessing to use all means fair and foul to teach these Monaghan upstarts a few hard lessons?
Dublin are playing the way Pillar wants them to play.
Surely you can't be suggesting that Pillar's team are out of control.
If Vaughan had not been caught for the assault on Freeman, Pillar would be purring with delight.
Utter garbage. Congratulations on your ability to spew it so regulalry and with such ease.
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:44:49 PM
Have you not considered that Vaughan was maybe following orders or at least had Pillar's blessing to use all means fair and foul to teach these Monaghan upstarts a few hard lessons?
Dublin are playing the way Pillar wants them to play.
Surely you can't be suggesting that Pillar's team are out of control.
If Vaughan had not been caught for the assault on Freeman, Pillar would be purring with delight.
And thats 100% fact, coz he said so ::)
was just reading the Irsh news where it was confirmed that a member of the dublin management team head butted Freeman after the game. The Dublin county board has acted promtly and reported the aforemention scum bag to the appropriate authorities. Surely the Dublin management and county board will get rid of this tube. Whats really puzzles me is if the guy was doing his job of gathering stats, how did he get so invovled in the match :o :o ???
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Quote from: Maximus Marillius on March 28, 2008, 01:58:21 PM
was just reading the Irsh news where it was confirmed that a member of the dublin management team head butted Freeman after the game. The Dublin county board has acted promtly and reported the aforemention scum bag to the appropriate authorities. Surely the Dublin management and county board will get rid of this tube. Whats really puzzles me is if the guy was doing his job of gathering stats, how did he get so invovled in the match :o :o ???
Your way behind Max ;)
I know...off for a few adys and then had alot to catch on the when I got back on wednesday and hadn't time to read it all to caught up..sorry. So what is the general gist...do most agree that dublin need to disown this guy?
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Lads I said HE SHOULD NOT HAVE SHOOK HIS HAND.
I did NOT say he should bereate him in public
But lets face it, Vaughan is quite a talented player, expecially from frees but he's young and needs guidance and discipline and shaking his hand after getting sent off sends out ALL the wrong signals to him, his team mates and makes you wonder does Pillar really know how to MANAGE properly or is he just all Blood and guts manager.
If you had a more intelligent man at the helm I think ye'd gain that edge to beat the Mayo's and Kerrys in the last few years.
This BLIND loyalty no matter is holding that team back I think.
He's too slow to make important substitutions also
I agree the media hound him and he struggles to deal with all the attention but he rarely can stand up and admit he got it wrong or that a player did.
So Heffo
You'd leave him on even though he's got a yellow and another Tick and you know how hot headed he is and risk him being sent off just to send out the right message to the other team
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Were you at the game or just did you just see the picture?
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 02:17:35 PM
So Heffo
You'd leave him on even though he's got a yellow and another Tick and you know how hot headed he is and risk him being sent off just to send out the right message to the other team
He's coped quite well in the last year with not reacting physically to backs that try and get a reaction out of him. Perhaps Pillar thought he'd give him the benefit of the doubt and not react again.
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
Eh? Surely an inter-county player should have some self-discipline. As for 'reliable free-taker' - hardly relevant in the case of this particular match.
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:19:09 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Were you at the game or just did you just see the picture?
Not that I think it makes a blind bit of difference, but no I was not at the game, I watched it on the telly. Have you seen the picture in question fom Monday's indo??
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 28, 2008, 02:43:03 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
Eh? Surely an inter-county player should have some self-discipline. As for 'reliable free-taker' - hardly relevant in the case of this particular match.
Indeed an inter-county player should have excellent self-discipline, Vaughan is young yet and there have hundreds of IC players who over the years have learned to control themselves and not react when getting hit and taunted off the ball - some of them even have a few sending offs to match their AI medals, hopefully Vaughan will yet. Perhaps Pillar seen what was happening more so than some posters in this thread who probably werent even at the game, but would have Vaughan banned for life had they their way.
No, he wasn't reliable taking frees on Sunday, but he was very reliable during his first sustained run in a Dublin jersey last year and even up in Cavan in terrible conditions, so to describe him as anything but a reliable free-take is wrong (imo)
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:19:09 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Were you at the game or just did you just see the picture?
Not that I think it makes a blind bit of difference, but no I was not at the game, I watched it on the telly. Have you seen the picture in question fom Monday's indo??
So your opinion on what happened on Sunday is based soley on what the camera was showing and a picture that looks a hundred times worse than had you seen it at the time.
You are right, you're informed opinion should not be clouded by the fact you weren't at the game.
Heffo, I take it that you reckon that Vaughan was receiving some special attention off the ball by Monaghan players and that this was the reason for his reaction/poor display.
That is other crap and you are making excuses for him. I was at game with friends from Dublin and none of them could see Vaughan been singled out. Most of the time Vaughan was dropping deep and with Keaney was playing as Dublins extra man due to Monaghan constantly dropping back to defend deep and in numbers.
Vaughan was having a mare and was solely responsible for getting sent off. On numerous occasions he came running in after frees where awarded to have his say.
Vaughan has a bit of hsitory following a few very heated "firendly" games between these sides and has been involved in a couple of incidents with Monaghan players in these games which I'm not going to go into on a messageboard.
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
His Holyness
Do you not think Pillar's blind loyalty to his players, background and fans is OTT?
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
??? You either did or you didn't.
I have absolutely no sympathy for Damien Freeman - vaughan deserved to go i ave no problem with that he was stupid enough to rise to the bait. But Freeman acted the gurrier for the previous 40 mins. Now when i played Gaelic Football - what went around , came around. So if you acted the bollix like Freeman last Sunday- some day, some opponent was going to level you with a box. Now i'm not saying that's desirable in Gaelic Football, but in a physical contact game somewhere along the line some opponent will do you if you carry on like that.
My only regret is that Vaughan was stupid enough to take the bait- and it's something he has to correct. I agree pillar shouldn't have shook his hand- because i wouldn't have- but Monaghan came down to play a particular brand of football and gave as good as they got in both the verbals and the physical stakes- something a lot of people here don't seem to recognise.
I think Pillar has to get a grip though of his management team. There is too many of them running around like lunatics. If you're not an official selector- you should be sitting with the subs- that's my view. So i think some of the criticism of Caffrey is warranted but i repeat i have no sympathy for D Freeman based on what i saw last sunday.
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:57:36 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:19:09 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Were you at the game or just did you just see the picture?
Not that I think it makes a blind bit of difference, but no I was not at the game, I watched it on the telly. Have you seen the picture in question fom Monday's indo??
So your opinion on what happened on Sunday is based soley on what the camera was showing and a picture that looks a hundred times worse than had you seen it at the time.
You are right, you're informed opinion should not be clouded by the fact you weren't at the game.
I take exception to your comments, but you still haven't answered my question, did you see the photograph I have referred to??
Quote from: INDIANA on March 28, 2008, 03:21:55 PM
I have absolutely no sympathy for Damien Freeman - vaughan deserved to go i ave no problem with that he was stupid enough to rise to the bait. But Freeman acted the gurrier for the previous 40 mins. Now when i played Gaelic Football - what went around , came around. So if you acted the bollix like Freeman last Sunday- some day, some opponent was going to level you with a box. Now i'm not saying that's desirable in Gaelic Football, but in a physical contact game somewhere along the line some opponent will do you if you carry on like that.
My only regret is that Vaughan was stupid enough to take the bait- and it's something he has to correct. I agree pillar shouldn't have shook his hand- because i wouldn't have- but Monaghan came down to play a particular brand of football and gave as good as they got in both the verbals and the physical stakes- something a lot of people here don't seem to recognise.
I think Pillar has to get a grip though of his management team. There is too many of them running around like lunatics. If you're not an official selector- you should be sitting with the subs- that's my view. So i think some of the criticism of Caffrey is warranted but i repeat i have no sympathy for D Freeman based on what i saw last sunday.
Agree 100%
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 03:24:22 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:57:36 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:19:09 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 02:08:59 PM
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on March 28, 2008, 01:10:41 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2008, 01:09:58 AM
Monaghan should be awarded the game with 2 points to spare. Finlay could have been going to bang that free into the back of the net but got distracted by the assault.
Dublin should have to play their next 3 home games away (outside the pale).
Thats just silly, theres no way an intercounty player of his standard would try something so ridiculous when there is the chance of staying joint top at stake.
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
Quote from: Declan on March 28, 2008, 08:20:17 AM
Hefty suspension should be imposed and he should have no further involvement with the IC set-up.
Totally agree with you Declan
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 28, 2008, 01:27:11 PM
Apparently I heard from a Dub that when Vaughan was sent of Pillar comes to meet his prodigal son and shakes his hand
Ridicolous as he should be clipping him areund the ear and saying when are ye gonna learn ya arrogant wee pup?
They were talking about this on newstalk the other evening. Magee was making the point that in 7 years of managing the biffos he had 4 players sent off. On every occassion he didn't as much as look at the player until after the game. Pillar is not the only IC manager who foolishly follows this practice of congratulating a player on getting sent off, but he is one of its main proponents! Mind you it was partly pillar's own fault for sending him back out in the second half with a yellow card and a tick to his name. He wasn't even bringing anything to the Dub set up at time, after a poor performance in the first half. He shouldn't have been on the field of play. He was also blessed to benefit from the current practice of refs giving a second yellow instead of a red (which he should have received) The picture in the indo on Monday was amazing, clearly showing the full force of the punch to Freeman's face (ie. striking = straight red). I am not advocating a public bereating, but it is very simple, you ignore the player until after the game, how hard is that??
Had Pillar taken Vaughan off at half time, it would have sent a clear message out that all you need to do to get rid of Vaughan is wind him up, hit him sly belts off the ball, he'll react eventually, get taken off (though not as slyly as the original transgressions) and Dublin's reliable freetaker is gone.
So what message was being sent out by leaving him on the field and him taking the head off Freeman and reducing his team to 14 men?? It was bad management, pillar should have taken him off at half time.
Were you at the game or just did you just see the picture?
Not that I think it makes a blind bit of difference, but no I was not at the game, I watched it on the telly. Have you seen the picture in question fom Monday's indo??
So your opinion on what happened on Sunday is based soley on what the camera was showing and a picture that looks a hundred times worse than had you seen it at the time.
You are right, you're informed opinion should not be clouded by the fact you weren't at the game.
I take exception to your comments, but you still haven't answered my question, did you see the photograph I have referred to??
Sorry if I didn't directly answer your question with a definitive 'yes' - I thought this had covered it:
"a picture that looks a hundred times worse than had you seen it at the time"
Lads, I think we all need to calm down a wee bit! This thread is turning into a bit of a farce.
Granted Pillar probably shouldn't have shook Vaughan's hand but maybe he didn't realise the offence was as bad or whatever, it's too hard for any of us to guess what was going on in anyones head at any given time, never miind in a high pressure situation like that. I've no doubt that Vaughan recived a few harsh words behing closed doors, if he didn't then Pillar is a worse manager than I thought. Vaughan should have been taken off at half time but that IMO has more to do with Pillar's inadequacies than anythin else.
Bingobus, to say that Vaughan was not on the receiving end of any 'treatment' is a bit rich. Monaghan haven't shied away from that end of things in the last few years and it was clear from watching it on telly that there was quite a bit of sledging etc. from both sides. Don't be trying to paint Monaghan out as totally innocent
I think Pillar has acted appropriately since the game, he has done everything which I would expect from any other manager
I honestly think that Pillar would have considered the half-time substitution of Mark Vaughan a victory of sorts for Monaghan. Thats why he left him on. He's a stubborn man and not the most rational individual during games of this nature.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 28, 2008, 03:21:55 PM
I have absolutely no sympathy for Damien Freeman - vaughan deserved to go i ave no problem with that he was stupid enough to rise to the bait. But Freeman acted the gurrier for the previous 40 mins. Now when i played Gaelic Football - what went around , came around. So if you acted the bollix like Freeman last Sunday- some day, some opponent was going to level you with a box. Now i'm not saying that's desirable in Gaelic Football, but in a physical contact game somewhere along the line some opponent will do you if you carry on like that.
My only regret is that Vaughan was stupid enough to take the bait- and it's something he has to correct. I agree pillar shouldn't have shook his hand- because i wouldn't have- but Monaghan came down to play a particular brand of football and gave as good as they got in both the verbals and the physical stakes- something a lot of people here don't seem to recognise.
I think Pillar has to get a grip though of his management team. There is too many of them running around like lunatics. If you're not an official selector- you should be sitting with the subs- that's my view. So i think some of the criticism of Caffrey is warranted but i repeat i have no sympathy for D Freeman based on what i saw last sunday.
Personally i think Indiana has a point here. Both teams gave as good as they got so I wouldn't make a big deal of it.
Te headbutt incident is an absolute disgrace and I would treat that as a separate incident altogether althoug Pillar seriously has to reign in his selectors/backroom team members
Quote from: pedro on March 28, 2008, 03:28:16 PM
Lads, I think we all need to calm down a wee bit! This thread is turning into a bit of a farce.
Granted Pillar probably shouldn't have shook Vaughan's hand but maybe he didn't realise the offence was as bad or whatever, it's too hard for any of us to guess what was going on in anyones head at any given time, never miind in a high pressure situation like that. I've no doubt that Vaughan recived a few harsh words behing closed doors, if he didn't then Pillar is a worse manager than I thought. Vaughan should have been taken off at half time but that IMO has more to do with Pillar's inadequacies than anythin else.
Bingobus, to say that Vaughan was not on the receiving end of any 'treatment' is a bit rich. Monaghan haven't shied away from that end of things in the last few years and it was clear from watching it on telly that there was quite a bit of sledging etc. from both sides. Don't be trying to paint Monaghan out as totally innocent
I think Pillar has acted appropriately since the game, he has done everything which I would expect from any other manager
Stop talking sense. You'll be run off this board for that kinda talk.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 28, 2008, 03:21:55 PM
I have absolutely no sympathy for Damien Freeman - vaughan deserved to go i ave no problem with that he was stupid enough to rise to the bait. But Freeman acted the gurrier for the previous 40 mins. Now when i played Gaelic Football - what went around , came around. So if you acted the bollix like Freeman last Sunday- some day, some opponent was going to level you with a box. Now i'm not saying that's desirable in Gaelic Football, but in a physical contact game somewhere along the line some opponent will do you if you carry on like that.
My only regret is that Vaughan was stupid enough to take the bait- and it's something he has to correct. I agree pillar shouldn't have shook his hand- because i wouldn't have- but Monaghan came down to play a particular brand of football and gave as good as they got in both the verbals and the physical stakes- something a lot of people here don't seem to recognise.
I think Pillar has to get a grip though of his management team. There is too many of them running around like lunatics. If you're not an official selector- you should be sitting with the subs- that's my view. So i think some of the criticism of Caffrey is warranted but i repeat i have no sympathy for D Freeman based on what i saw last sunday.
What did you see last Sunday that was so criminal? Did he do anything from waht that several of the Dublin players were at? If so a lot of Dublin players have alot coming to them.
Pedro, I said he wasn't been signalled out in particular. It was a physical game. He was getting what several players on both sides where getting, apart from Dessie Mone slagging him about the fact his eyebrows where a different colour than his hair. If this gets him rattled (it happended minutes before he was lined) then he needs anger mgt.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:32:15 PM
I honestly think that Pillar would have considered the half-time substitution of Mark Vaughan a victory of sorts for Monaghan. Thats why he left him on. He's a stubborn man and not the most rational individual during games of this nature.
That can't be right Jinxy - you heard it from Bingbus above - all the Monaghan backs were doing was giving a quiet word of encouragement here and there.
Quote from: heffo on March 28, 2008, 03:35:50 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:32:15 PM
I honestly think that Pillar would have considered the half-time substitution of Mark Vaughan a victory of sorts for Monaghan. Thats why he left him on. He's a stubborn man and not the most rational individual during games of this nature.
That can't be right Jinxy - you heard it from Bingbus above - all the Monaghan backs were doing was giving a quiet word of encouragement here and there.
No, if you read it again they were offering him some hairdressing advice. ::)
The handshake I think was a "Don't let the bastards get you down" kind of gesture, as opposed to the "Well done for getting sent off" kind of gesture which some people here find more credible. Team spirit and all that. I don't think it was wise, but Vaughan is quite a temperamental sort. A bit like his hero GG!
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:44:04 PM
The handshake I think was a "Don't let the bastards get you down" kind of gesture, as opposed to the "Well done for getting sent off" kind of gesture which some people here find more credible. Team spirit and all that. I don't think it was wise, but Vaughan is quite a temperamental sort. A bit like his hero GG!
Yes because Vaughan is special and is the first player to ever get abuse ::)
Quote from: bingobus on March 28, 2008, 03:47:29 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:44:04 PM
The handshake I think was a "Don't let the bastards get you down" kind of gesture, as opposed to the "Well done for getting sent off" kind of gesture which some people here find more credible. Team spirit and all that. I don't think it was wise, but Vaughan is quite a temperamental sort. A bit like his hero GG!
Yes because Vaughan is special and is the first player to ever get abuse ::)
As I said previously in this thread, there have been numerous players over the years who used to react to defenders trying to get them sent off, who calmed down and went on to win AI's - hopefully Vaughan recognises this.
Quote from: bingobus on March 28, 2008, 03:47:29 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:44:04 PM
The handshake I think was a "Don't let the bastards get you down" kind of gesture, as opposed to the "Well done for getting sent off" kind of gesture which some people here find more credible. Team spirit and all that. I don't think it was wise, but Vaughan is quite a temperamental sort. A bit like his hero GG!
Yes because Vaughan is special and is the first player to ever get abuse ::)
If Freeman was put off and Banty gave him a consoling pat on the back as he went past would you be outraged? Managers tend to be sympathetic towards forwards that are sent off, especially if they've been getting plenty of abuse from the stands and opposition defenders.
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:59:04 PM
Quote from: bingobus on March 28, 2008, 03:47:29 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 28, 2008, 03:44:04 PM
The handshake I think was a "Don't let the bastards get you down" kind of gesture, as opposed to the "Well done for getting sent off" kind of gesture which some people here find more credible. Team spirit and all that. I don't think it was wise, but Vaughan is quite a temperamental sort. A bit like his hero GG!
Yes because Vaughan is special and is the first player to ever get abuse ::)
If Freeman was put off and Banty gave him a consoling pat on the back as he went past would you be outraged? Managers tend to be sympathetic towards forwards that are sent off, especially if they've been getting plenty of abuse from the stands and opposition defenders.
I wouldn't be outraged over anything to do with an intercounty player or manager. I think that sometimes to do nothing is adequate. A player sent off shouldn't expect a pat on the back or a handshake from his manager, particulary where he deserved to walk. To the same account he shouldn't expect a bollixing on the sideline either. It should be discussed behind the dressing room door.
However, knowing the relationship between banty and Freeman, he'd prob start licking and dry riding him as he made his way off the field.
Well there you go. Just be glad Pillar kept it to a handshake.
I'm not saying Mickey Harte is the Guru of Football management but numerous times he has taken off players solely cos they're on yellow cards and knows if they walk they could lose the game
This isn't about getting one over on the other team or their fans etc but making wise decisions to benefit the team.
Last week he tried yet another player at full back. He took him off at half time as allegedly he was on his last warning.
Now I know its different for defenders but it was plain to see it was a physical match and its apparent that Vaughan still hasn't learnt he's digging his own grave.
If the manager doesn't discipline him then the Refs will so he's a liability more often than not.
Point being however that a smart manager will haul him off and NOT even make eye contact with him
Pillar is such a stubborn stupid guy he has to make a big deal of going over and shaking his hand.
Totally send's Vaughan the wrong message that he can continue to make wreckless challenges.
One rule for the Dubs and one for the rest.
Dublin man throws a headbutt, its a disgrace, everyone agrees.
someone throws a headbutt at a Dub, he deserved it.
This from the armagh v dublin thread.
"The same Paul Casey who was headbutted by Galvin in the All-Ireland semi last year right in front of the linesman and "as usual" nothing was done?
Wonder why he head butted him?
Casey is the McMenimin of Dublin! - A better footballer with his mouth shut!"
i must agree he's a real liability kicking over 7-8 points a game. One incident doesn't make him a complete idiot- he's been well behaved over the last 15 months. I'd excuse last week as a bit of brain fade and hopefully he learns from it. But the game was out of control at that point- there was an awful lot of shite going on from both teams and monaghan were every bit as bad. But for starters pillar needs to sit everyone bar himself-clarke-talty and billings in the stand.
Because what happened at the end of that game simply isn't acceptable
Video analyst ? Statistician ? How did he manage to get invlolved with Tom Freeman ? What was he doing ?
Seems to be very opposed view on this. There were several wrongs in this one, no combination of which can make a right.
On the Pillar handshake with Vaughan I think that this might come back to haunt the Dubs in two ways. Whatever about having a strip torn off in the privacy of the dressing room a public show of support following a sending off (and no one is really saying that it was a harsh sending off) could feed in to an indiscipline on the field for the blues. Secondly if I were an inter-county ref I wouldn't be too impressed with a manager effectively ignoring a valid decision made by the man in black. Might be tempted to give the Pillar a couple of rings of fire if I were reffing Dublin sometime.
As for the antics of the stats man, or whatever he is, to borrow from Del Boy Trotter - YOU PLONKER.
This is from today's www.irishexaminer.com. As you would expect from langerland there is no fantastic sympathy for the dubs but at least there's a little humour.
Dub trouble as Freeman fallout comes to a head
By Michael Moynihan
WE'RE WORKING hard on a title here for events in Dublin's Parnell Park last weekend. Buttgate sounds like an animated comedy for MTV. Headgate suggests a revolutionary trepanning procedure. Parkgate is a street near the Phoenix Park.
We almost settled on Parnellgate, but the whole idea of scandal aligned with the name Parnell (see the entire works of James A. Joyce for more) seemed already taken. We'll keep going, though; we'll come up with something.
Fallout from the Donnycarney Kiss that Monaghan's Tommy Freeman received at the end of last Sunday's NFL game against Dublin continues to fall all around us like radioactive spores from a nuclear explosion.
At first, it was suggested that a member of the Dublin management team had run onto the pitch after the final whistle and tested the strength of Freeman's brow with a firm header. Then the goalposts shifted, much as they probably shifted in the unfortunate Tommy's field of vision right after the alleged assault when Dublin County Board chairman Gerry Harrington said that he'd been informed by his Monaghan counterpart John Connolly that Freeman had been attacked by one of the match stewards in Parnell Park.
The ever-increasing distance between the Dublin management and responsibility for the incident suggests that by the middle of next week the finger of blame will probably be pointing at a bewildered linesman in Tallaght.
Last night's statement from the Dublin County Board on the matter was more specific, particularly the part which read: "The Dublin County Board, team management and the individual involved have personally apologised to Thomas Freeman."
It doesn't make the trouble go away, of course. The increasingly crowded sidelines at intercounty games must have been one of the inspirations behind Monaghan player Dick Clerkin's suggestion during the week that pitches might have to be enclosed.
(That initiative brought to mind an administrative exchange some years ago in Cork, when the manager of a certain club sought such a pitch for a forthcoming encounter at junior B level; asked to justify seeking to limit the number of people on the sideline, his answer was short and sweet: "The opposition").
It hasn't been a good couple of weeks for discipline in the GAA, which is a sentence that remains in wearyingly common use.
A fine of €5,000 imposed on Mayo County Board because their supporters were throwing missiles at Kerry's Kieran Donaghy is a precedent which suggests that Dublin will get a severe rap in the wallet, if not across the knuckles, when this incident is fully investigated.
In that context Dublin manager Paul Caffrey chose the wrong day to indicate solidarity with forward Mark Vaughan. Sent off for hitting a Monaghan player in the face, Vaughan was greeted warmly by his manager on the sideline.
That's helped to conflate several matters: the crowded sidelines issue in general, the assault on Tommy Freeman and the apparent hostility of the Sky Blue supporters towards Monaghan players after Sunday's game specifically, with all of the above augmented by the fact that two Dublin players were sent off during the Monaghan match itself. That's all now bundled together like a telecoms provider offering a three-for-one deal on general badness.
A willingness outside the Pale to believe the worst about Dublin's support, fuelled primarily by their apparent inability to get to games in their own backyard on time, shouldn't be used as a stick to beat them until all the facts are in (and, er, not necessarily then either, if you get me).
But if those facts support the initial allegation — that a member of Dublin's backroom team was responsible for the assault — then it'll be Caffrey who comes under scrutiny, and the extent to which he's responsible for the brouhaha.
You can't have a gate without a pillar, after all.
Quote from: Louth Exile on March 28, 2008, 01:59:49 PM
You have missed the point here HHNB, I think that main street was referring to a previous incident a couple of years ago where Finlay did win the game for Monaghan when an injury time free dropped in the net in the NFL Div 2 final
I was just being mildly sarcastic which goes way over the heads of the oppressed Dubs.
Hard to believe reports from the Dublin fans that players in a top team like Dublin would allow a mid ranked team like Monaghan to wind them up something stupid before criminally losing a 4 point lead.
The focus is being taken away from Dublin's collapse under mild pressure in the last 8 minutes. Cullen's kamikaze last tackle (not dirty just dreadful) being a prime example .
In the end Monaghan received a few yellows, Dublin received a truckload and that tells the accurate story of discipline on the pitch and off the pitch is another story.
That's all now bundled together like a telecoms provider offering a three-for-one deal on general badness.
Very good piece from the Examiner if you're not a Dub ! ;D
stop talking shite main street- we were down a man for 30 mins , took off key players, were missing key players. you know- a draw was a good result especially with a ref that wanted a draw. If the truth be told we couldn't give a rat's ass about mickey mouse league games in march. Monaghan treated that game like an all-ireland final with more or less a full team and were shite. If i was banty i'd be looking for a parachute- because he's stayed a year too long i reckon- while we're going better than we thought we would be at this time. We found another player last week in Paul Flynn and like i said last week if we shore up the full back line -we're going to be bloody formidable this year because we have some bench going into the championship to supplement the team for the first time in years.
What was Bryan Cullen doing Indiana?
If the truth be told we couldn't give a rat's ass about mickey mouse league games in march. Monaghan treated that game like an all-ireland final with more or less a full team and were shite
You could have fooled me ! Your players were running round like men possessed !
we're going to be bloody formidable this year because we have some bench going into the championship
The statistician / bouncer won't be on that bench I hope ! ;) :D ;D
Quote from: orangeman on March 28, 2008, 09:45:53 PM
If the truth be told we couldn't give a rat's ass about mickey mouse league games in march. Monaghan treated that game like an all-ireland final with more or less a full team and were shite
You could have fooled me ! Your players were running round like men possessed !
we're going to be bloody formidable this year because we have some bench going into the championship
The statistician / bouncer won't be on that bench I hope ! ;) :D ;D
He might be appearing before the bench if he carries on like that ;D
He might be appearing before the bench if he carries on like that
Is there any chance of another public enquiry ? Is Dublin Castle free yet ? Pillar could give evidence for the state !
Quote from: orangeman on March 28, 2008, 10:04:48 PM
He might be appearing before the bench if he carries on like that
Is there any chance of another public enquiry ? Is Dublin Castle free yet ? Pillar could give evidence for the state !
It should be free around 2025. Around the same time as the next metropolitan AI success ;)
We won't have long to wait then on either happening ! ;D
Quote from: INDIANA on March 28, 2008, 09:34:27 PM
stop talking shite main street- we were down a man for 30 mins , took off key players, were missing key players. you know- a draw was a good result especially with a ref that wanted a draw. If the truth be told we couldn't give a rat's ass about mickey mouse league games in march. Monaghan treated that game like an all-ireland final with more or less a full team and were shite. If i was banty i'd be looking for a parachute- because he's stayed a year too long i reckon- while we're going better than we thought we would be at this time. We found another player last week in Paul Flynn and like i said last week if we shore up the full back line -we're going to be bloody formidable this year because we have some bench going into the championship to supplement the team for the first time in years.
;D ;D ;D ;D Don't beleive the hype. Banty stayed a year too long!!! Pillar shouldn't have been let stay. I said it before and I'll say it again, Dublin won't will an AI with pillar, regardless of the bench (In the last few years the first 15 haven't been good enough and it will be the same 15 this year). Ray Gosgrove part of this bench ;D.
Never mind been the Man United of the GAA world, the Dubs are the England of the GAA world. Great efforrt Indiana, Dermot Morgan is alive and well!!!
Bingo - So how come McConnell/Brogan came through last year if it has been the same 15???
Quote from: INDIANA on March 28, 2008, 09:34:27 PM
stop talking shite main street-
a ref that wanted a draw.
If the truth be told we couldn't give a rat's ass about mickey mouse league games in march.
Monaghan treated that game like an all-ireland final with more or less a full team and were shite.
If i was banty i'd be looking for a parachute- because he's stayed a year too long
I give in, I have been totally outshitted there ;D
You just can't compete with the Holy Trinity,
the ref, the we don't care about the league and teams are gunning for us.