Just on the back of yet another homeless summit I was just wondering what are the thoughts here. There are so many layers to all this.
First up from my point of view as someone who is early 30s and always rented in Dublin myself and my mates can't get mortgages in general, despite many working in decent jobs.
They are also all getting rent increases with one mate in particular told her tenancy was up due to a brother coming back from Oz only to see her place up on Daft a month later with an increase of €350. This all causes a trickle down effect as the people with jobs end up moving into crappier places for the same price.
Then those who lived there downgrade and in the end those who were struggling in bed sits (studios) end up being totally priced out.
I know it all gets lumped in as one but the roygh sleepers often need real support to get their lives back on track but those who are being squeezed just need rent certainty and more units to come online. For the life of me I don't understand this aversion of going up in areas like the docklands that have no heritage buildings and a blank canvass. Any time people on radio or TV mention high rise the Ballymun flats get brought up. In this case let developers build and cater for the higher-end professionals who are happy to buy or pa decent rent.
Build up and provide places for all the Google and Facebook heads for example. This might help to stop that trickle down.
Obviously there also needs to be a Govt will and there really doesn't seem to be. They need to be pushing through emergency measures and getting a major building scheme going, or at least cut the red tape to allow social housing to be built.
Co-ops are one way to help and would be a really great addition in the housing sector, but there doesn't seem to be many.
Excuse my ignorance but what is the situation like in the north of the island?
Not sure about working people being forced out of housing due to unscrupulous landlords,but in terms of the social problem of homelessness,not
so long ago I attended a seminar addressed by a very senior member of the Belfast City Centre Management Team.He explained to the audience that there is no need for anyone in Belfast to sleep rough outdoors at night.He said every single person is offered a bed but many due to addiction etc,refuse the offer.I am also aware of a few Church linked groups of people who give up their time nightly in Belfast City Centre who go out late at night and offer hot soup etc to the homeless.There have been a few homeless deaths in recent years in Belfast City Centre.
I am assuming that people see the problems of homelessness very simply as a matter of government neglect,whereas I'm sure the case in Dublin,similarly to Belfast and other areas,is that there is a myriad of support for homeless people,from both statutory and voluntary agencies,but sadly many homeless people do not avail of this support.
Quote from: T Fearon on September 09, 2017, 08:27:38 PM
Not sure about working people being forced out of housing due to unscrupulous landlords,but in terms of the social problem of homelessness,not
so long ago I attended a seminar addressed by a very senior member of the Belfast City Centre Management Team.He explained to the audience that there is no need for anyone in Belfast to sleep rough outdoors at night.He said every single person is offered a bed but many due to addiction etc,refuse the offer.I am also aware of a few Church linked groups of people who give up their time nightly in Belfast City Centre who go out late at night and offer hot soup etc to the homeless.There have been a few homeless deaths in recent years in Belfast City Centre.
I am assuming that people see the problems of homelessness very simply as a matter of government neglect,whereas I'm sure the case in Dublin,similarly to Belfast and other areas,is that there is a myriad of support for homeless people,from both statutory and voluntary agencies,but sadly many homeless people do not avail of this support.
Or he's being a little creative in his telling of the story. Those with alcohol or drugs on board are turned away. That's quite different to refusing the offer of accommodation.
In Belfast the homeless are alcoholics and drug users in the main, there are no people living on the street who can't afford accommodation due to high mortgages and low wages... they just exist from hour to hour, noticed a lad from my primary school on the street, decent background good family just turned to alcohol and his life had turned to shit since!!!
Sorting out these problems before it gets to this stage is the only answer
I don't know much about the politics of it all but Belfast has completely changed in the last 10 years. I get off the train at botanic station most mornings and the amount of young people on the streets would genuinely break your heart. From what I can see most of these people are in their late teens. It's alright saying that government etc are doing all they can but there is clearly something wrong somewhere
The guy in question was unambiguous and adamant.Those sleeping rough on the streets of Belfast on any given night are doing so because they have turned down the offer of sheltered accommodation.
Maybe I'm looking at things too simplistically but surely not all those young people are on the streets because they want to be? It's genuinely heart breaking. Something is wrong somewhere
There is something deeply wrong with any society that allows homelessness to be normalised. As well as giving these people shelter the government need to address the causes of homelessness. Having a doss house for young adults shouldn't be an answer.
Take a walk around Belfast, high street mainly or bridge street area, there are a few social housing places all nearby... they are up and at it from craic of dawn sitting on the streets begging getting money going to Lidl and getting drink, they are barely surviving... tackling the problems that took them to that position is the only place to work from, 95 % I see are locals, not migrants as they usual work... these lads women have had huge social and family problems, that living on the street and get off their face is actually easier!
I don't know what the solution would be but I certainly believe there is enough housing for the homeless it's just they can't follow the rules to keep a roof over their heads
No matter what the circumstances I just think it's so hard to see. Good man tony for attending a meeting where some Tory says there is enough beds for everyone. Mustn't really be a problem
Mickey,the guy in question was also training to be a Methodist Minister.I have no reason to doubt the veracity of what he said,what was his motive in lying? Obviously in his day job,it doesn't look good for the image of Belfast to have people sleeping in doorways,but his own additional pastoral concern was evident as well.
I therefore believe him when he said no one needs to be sleeping rough on the streets of Belfast on any night.
Quote from: Captain Scarlet on September 09, 2017, 04:03:17 PM
Just on the back of yet another homeless summit I was just wondering what are the thoughts here. There are so many layers to all this.
First up from my point of view as someone who is early 30s and always rented in Dublin myself and my mates can't get mortgages in general, despite many working in decent jobs.
They are also all getting rent increases with one mate in particular told her tenancy was up due to a brother coming back from Oz only to see her place up on Daft a month later with an increase of €350. This all causes a trickle down effect as the people with jobs end up moving into crappier places for the same price.
Then those who lived there downgrade and in the end those who were struggling in bed sits (studios) end up being totally priced out.
I know it all gets lumped in as one but the roygh sleepers often need real support to get their lives back on track but those who are being squeezed just need rent certainty and more units to come online. For the life of me I don't understand this aversion of going up in areas like the docklands that have no heritage buildings and a blank canvass. Any time people on radio or TV mention high rise the Ballymun flats get brought up. In this case let developers build and cater for the higher-end professionals who are happy to buy or pa decent rent.
Build up and provide places for all the Google and Facebook heads for example. This might help to stop that trickle down.
Obviously there also needs to be a Govt will and there really doesn't seem to be. They need to be pushing through emergency measures and getting a major building scheme going, or at least cut the red tape to allow social housing to be built.
Co-ops are one way to help and would be a really great addition in the housing sector, but there doesn't seem to be many.
Excuse my ignorance but what is the situation like in the north of the island?
Its not as if high rises are not common place all over the world.
I live close to the Long Island City area of Queens in NYC, and the high rises going up along the East River there, in what used to be a large dockland and industrial area, are renting for $5-6K/month for a three bedroom and selling for close to a million or more for two bedrooms.
Sure, there are rough public housing projects all over NYC which are high rise, but the issue is income and social issues, NOT the height of the buildings. Just like there are rough public housing estates in south county Dublin, often abutting directly onto middle to upper class housing estates.
Social house building was a feature of Irish political life from the 1920s to the 1980s when neoliberalism became the system.
Nobody should be homeless in Ireland.
build houses
charge them a fair rent
there are hundreds of boarded up houses and apartments all over Dublin and other towns belonging to various councils
turn them around and give them to these families
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on September 11, 2017, 04:34:59 PM
build houses
charge them a fair rent
there are hundreds of boarded up houses and apartments all over Dublin and other towns belonging to various councils
turn them around and give them to these families
Just give them away?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on September 11, 2017, 04:52:10 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on September 11, 2017, 04:34:59 PM
build houses
charge them a fair rent
there are hundreds of boarded up houses and apartments all over Dublin and other towns belonging to various councils
turn them around and give them to these families
Just give them away?
If they generate more value than the cost of giving the houses away it should be done
Why do people just think homelessness is just about a shortage of housing ?
The "new" homeless who are being put up in hotels etc are victims of a shortage of houses and attendant big rises in private rents.
Also the virtual elimination of Council House Building.
The "old" homeless - rough sleepers, people with psychiatric drug or drink problems is a more complicated situation.
If Politicians' kids or other well heeled people's kids were caught up in the "New" situation they'd soon take action.
Meanwhile all the Super Socialists who were protesting vigorously about €3 or €4 a week charge for public water/sewerage
are very quiet on this issue.
The €150m foregone would provideo 600 to 700 houses per annum.
I think that is key Rossfan. There are two different groups in terms of rough sleepers and then the new homeless.
I get annoyed on Twitter with the anti-everything brigade who can be a bit dismissive of what they call the homeless industry with the likes of Simon and Focus. They don't seem to realise you probably need five people working to get one rough sleeper, manay of whom have serious issues, back on their feet.
They need managed shelter in many cases.
Then the others who are paying rent but are being priced out just need some form of security.
Quote from: Captain Scarlet on September 11, 2017, 07:24:45 PM
I think that is key Rossfan. There are two different groups in terms of rough sleepers and then the new homeless.
I get annoyed on Twitter with the anti-everything brigade who can be a bit dismissive of what they call the homeless industry with the likes of Simon and Focus. They don't seem to realise you probably need five people working to get one rough sleeper, manay of whom have serious issues, back on their feet.
They need managed shelter in many cases.
Then the others who are paying rent but are being priced out just need some form of security.
Why don't they move somewhere outside of the city which is more affordable and get the train bus or drive in? Or move jobs because if you have a job that means you have to live on the street rather find affordable living then you're just a tight cnut!!
The proper homeless who have no jobs, have addiction problem , family issues abuse issues and other reasons to living on the street in minus conditions they need looking after at the source!! Not at the point were they have lost the will to live, but hey to most councils this is something they'd rather let chartable groups deal with when the feed them cloth them and find them temporary accommodation, rather than dip into their own funds or ask the tax payer to give a little bit more..
Minder has already stated, its not a homeless problem, its the issues behind why they are homeless that needs fixed
A major issue is centralisation of jobs, services, etc. Until there is some form of planning of where jobs are available in the public sector and development of businesses in the main cities there will always be a housing crisis that affects a full range of people and benefits the fact landlords comprising of those with a single rented house to those who own dozens on buy to rent mortgages.
In N.Ireland thousands of people travel too far every day for work, mostly by car leading to major congestion on roads and in Belfast in particular.
One good thing that O'Neill did as Agriculture Minister was to decide to move the department buildings to the West and begin a relocation process.Too many other Ministries are located in the Greater Belfast area. Businesses are given planning permission to congregate in the city rather than having active planning to encourage them to move to other areas in the digital age. The lure of business rates encourages council planning committees to pull businesses into the city area regardless of where the workers will come from.
I would imagine that the same problem has occurred in Dublin causing too many people to migrate to a city ill prepared to accommodate them and to transport them to and from work.
There are still many ghost estates all over the RoI from the 2008 financial crash. So the number of houses is not an issue it is where they are located. Look at how many of the ghost estates that were demolished because there would never be people to live in them.