Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
So come up with rules that protect the elite but shit on the rest??????!!
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:56:47 PM
So come up with rules that protect the elite but shit on the rest??????!!
You protect the players in harm's way and then sort the rest out around that. The health of the players is paramount to most anything else.
Can't believe so many people have rose-tinted glasses on when it comes to clubs. They have just as little right to ride a player into the ground as a county team or college team has.
What the feck are you on? The club produces players, protects players, puts an arm around them when they are fecked over. The club ALWAYS has its players best interests at heart.
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 10:06:13 PM
What the feck are you on? The club produces players, protects players, puts an arm around them when they are fecked over. The club ALWAYS has its players best interests at heart.
Their parents 'produce' players. Most of the elite players spend as much time training with their county teams as club from U16 up. The idea clubs are to thank wholly for any player's development is the nonsense that's peddled when things like club v county comes up. It's all part of the same wheel and until some realise that it will be impossible to have a constructive conversation about it.
I've seen gross abuses of IC senior players in my own county by their clubs even in the last six months. Players who needed major surgery but who clubs allowed to play on for the length of their championship jaunts just so they had a better chance of winning a tin cup. Like feck that's in the player's best interests.
Very few clubs make their players play two games in two days like the Sigerson just did
In fact clubs don't ever 'make' their players play.
Its the county boards who fix games. And if proper periods are not left for county players to rest and recover, then it is the CB's fault, not the club.
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 21, 2016, 11:36:00 PM
Very few clubs make their players play two games in two days like the Sigerson just did
In fact clubs don't ever 'make' their players play.
Its the county boards who fix games. And if proper periods are not left for county players to rest and recover, then it is the CB's fault, not the club.
Surely the problem arises that the club wants the county player in play while objecting the the gap caused for their other players if there is a long gap for that county player to rest and recover?
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 21, 2016, 11:36:00 PM
Very few clubs make their players play two games in two days like the Sigerson just did
In fact clubs don't ever 'make' their players play.
Its the county boards who fix games. And if proper periods are not left for county players to rest and recover, then it is the CB's fault, not the club.
If clubs 'always have players' best interests' at heart they wouldn't play them even in the face of a scheduling fúck-up. What he said is nonsense, plain and simple.
I also have seen many, many situations where a player plays IC football the Sunday and then with the club the Monday. The idea that they don't run back-to-back games is wrong also.
Duffy is another school teacher with no vision
Some nonsense here. Paraic Duffy has been a brilliant DG for the GAA. Just watch how difficult it will be to get these proposals through on Saturday. He knows the limits of what he can achieve.
In any case, the proposals are designed for more than the elite young player. if his proposals get through it will affect positively every club player.
Syferus and Seany are clearly county first....club bottom of the pile type of GAA people! If Duffy is so good for the clubs then why is the following happening in 2016:
- players good enough to play for their county minor team cannot play for their club until they are out of the championship. They can train 3 time a week at elite level, half of them sit on the bench all year, but cannot play club football. They could play for their club all through GAA history until this year!
- Lads at 17 years of age that all throughout GAA history have been old enough to play for their club are now deemed not old enough to play for their club. This is to protect the elite 17 year olds who are now training 3 times a week with development squads. What about a 17 year old who is not on a county minor or development squad and whose last game of club minor football is in May. What does he do until April 2017?
The problems Duffy could address are why county developments teams, county minor teams, county senior teams, Sigerson Cup teams, Schools teams etc all have to train so much and take up so much of a players time.
[/li]
Why do club minor games stop in May?
What can Duffy do about that?
Minor games are rushed between February and May to clear the way for the county minor championship.........here are the last two posts on the Derry and Tyrone boards:
DERRY
So what if glen win a senior championship in the next few years, they have put in the work lately, but by the time they win one club football be at a low ebb because off the way in which it is being treated at the moment!!!
I'm guessing that club football has 9/10 years off creditably left in it before the life is sucked out off it!!
It's heading for county or bust if we like it or not, has been for a long time
TYRONE
Anybody have any clue when we can expect the fixtures to be announced and when we can expect to hear the championship draw?
Curious also of manager updates, there was a lot of blank spaces in the last manager post. Surely all clubs now have a manager appointed for the coming season????
this is the middle of the NFL 'county' season - do you think our county board are concerned about our clubs - not a chance...
I see plenty of young lads asked to play 2 games in 24 hours plus extra time in very difficult winter conditions in order to start our minor league which will finish on 3rd April ??? ??? - and then they talk about burnout !!
Listen lads this is my opinion. We are following the path of soccer and rugby, chasing money, tv deals, looking after elite players to the detriment of everything else. I don't like it but I don't think it is going to change. We are an amateur association with wonderful ideals that have served the country so well but we are losing the run of ourselves.
Quote from: The Trap on February 22, 2016, 12:24:45 PM
- Lads at 17 years of age that all throughout GAA history have been old enough to play for their club are now deemed not old enough to play for their club. This is to protect the elite 17 year olds who are now training 3 times a week with development squads. What about a 17 year old who is not on a county minor or development squad and whose last game of club minor football is in May. What does he do until April 2017?
But if minors go to U17, and it means minors can't play adult football, it will allow for proper minor leagues and championships in every county, that won't end in May.
I think its a no brainer. And I think those saying it will leave 17 year olds with no football or that it will have a massive impact on the junior cert are being disingenuous.
Quote from: Seany on February 22, 2016, 12:11:34 PM
Some nonsense here. Paraic Duffy has been a brilliant DG for the GAA. Just watch how difficult it will be to get these proposals through on Saturday. He knows the limits of what he can achieve.
In any case, the proposals are designed for more than the elite young player. if his proposals get through it will affect positively every club player.
Down were one of the counties who were initially earmarked to 'trial' these new age groups allegedly meant to counteract burnout and high attrition rates with great quotes from Gerry McEntee, Niall Moyna and a few other experts in the field.
What they were saying wasn't wrong, but as the trap pointed out, it was reflective of issues only witnessed by an elite set of late teenagers, early 20 year olds, but the fixes put in place would impact on all youngsters in this age group who in some instances would be inclined to walk away due to a lack of fixtures.
On the face of it banning county minors from playing senior with their club makes sense, but its a balls for rural clubs struggling for numbers in adult levels, plus our minors (hurling) had only 7 league fixtures last year, three championship, so we need to be giving these lads adult fixtures to sustain their interest and development throughout the year.
Fix the problem in hand, not create a whole new pile of them with an all sweeping rule. If a young lad is on a county minor panel, he can't play U21 or intercounty senior, if a lad is on a county U21 panel then he can't play intercounty senior and that would cut down on the double jobbing a lot of young lads are experiencing.
Currently intercounty U21 football and hurling are played at different times of the year, can minor level in particular not do something similar as we'd the Tipp minors playing week on week in the hurling and football last year, the Dubs have had similar issues as well in this regard.
I am passionate about the club game, always have been always will be. On the ground I can see what is happening to it and it makes me angry. I used to be a big county supporter too but that has really eroded in recent years as I can see the destructive impact the growing county game from development squads up is having. And I really don't know what the end game is for county football.......professionalism is where it is headed with maybe 12 teams able to sustain it throughout Ireland. Is that what people want?
All you seem to care about is clubs having 'control' of players to use and inevitably use in the wrong ways. Not player safety, not the game as a whole. That myopic view is not needed if we're to solve the scheduling problems that face the GAA.
Access not control syferus
The clubs generally introduce players to the game.
Without the clubs, the GAA is nothing
I agree with Syf here - there seems to be an ownership perception gathering pace. We are all club men first and foremost but if my club ever put their own interests before the best opportunity for the development of any of our players I will be a very loud opposition voice.
Quote from: The Trap on February 22, 2016, 12:24:45 PM
Syferus and Seany are clearly county first....club bottom of the pile type of GAA people! If Duffy is so good for the clubs then why is the following happening in 2016:
- players good enough to play for their county minor team cannot play for their club until they are out of the championship. They can train 3 time a week at elite level, half of them sit on the bench all year, but cannot play club football. They could play for their club all through GAA history until this year!
[/li]
You made some good points Trap, but this one is so very wrong, and is unfortunately symptomatic of the myopic club man's attitude to young players.
Here's what's you see: Young player not allowed to play senior football.
Here's the reality: Young player going 3 times a week across the county to train / play county minors. Then playing club minor one night a week. Training club minor another day. Senior managers telling him he Wong be picked later the year, so he trains twice a week there and maybe squeezes in a friendly. Reserves are short, so he plays in it as he's a superstar at that level and everyone loves him. Oh he's also studying for his A Levels or leaving Cert and his parents are rightly cracking up.
Here's what you and your ilk need to get your heads around:
1. If he's been chosen to play at an elite level, it's an honour for him and his club. Let him get the absolute most of this chance.
2. If your senior team's season is dependent on the availability of. a 17 year old, then you really aren't going to have a great season. Yes he might be able to make you better. But not that much better.
3. When he's done with county minor, he will be a better trained, more focused, more confident player. If he hasn't been ruined by his club he will also be fresh.
Seriously, take this in and pass it on. Clubs are a problem at this level, as much a problem as the other teams combined.
clubs are generally impatient with players coming through.
most of them don't have the luxury of waiting until the players are ready - relegation/promotion/silverware etc
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 22, 2016, 08:37:42 PM
clubs are generally impatient with players coming through.
most of them don't have the luxury of waiting until the players are ready - relegation/promotion/silverware etc
Of course they do. But only an exceptional talent gets more than one shot at county minors.
Wobbler........once again all you can talk about is the elite player........what about the vast majority of lads who don't make county teams? Why stop them from playing? Are you not concerned that a lot of young men could be lost to the game because they don't have an opportunity to play for almost a year?
Trap our own county board had regonised this as a big mistake as have cork. This is to be dealt with at congress I thought. Things are obviously at a low ebb with in your club but maybe it's time to look in the mirror and see what u can do better rather than to blame everyone else
Quote from: The Trap on February 22, 2016, 09:07:02 PM
Wobbler........once again all you can talk about is the elite player........what about the vast majority of lads who don't make county teams? Why stop them from playing? Are you not concerned that a lot of young men could be lost to the game because they don't have an opportunity to play for almost a year?
I'm not stopping them from playing.
The point that you made about county minors is completely wrong.
They need protection from clubs who'll have them playing 3 times a week and training 3 times a week at 17, then wonder why they're always injured or why they don't want to play when they're 25.
At least central council have finally found the easiest way to stop this happening to our better players, which is sadly to withhold them from their clubs.
I wasn't talking about any of your other points.
Quote from: thewobbler on February 22, 2016, 10:44:52 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 22, 2016, 09:07:02 PM
Wobbler........once again all you can talk about is the elite player........what about the vast majority of lads who don't make county teams? Why stop them from playing? Are you not concerned that a lot of young men could be lost to the game because they don't have an opportunity to play for almost a year?
I'm not stopping them from playing.
The point that you made about county minors is completely wrong.
They need protection from clubs who'll have them playing 3 times a week and training 3 times a week at 17, then wonder why they're always injured or why they don't want to play when they're 25.
At least central council have finally found the easiest way to stop this happening to our better players, which is sadly to withhold them from their clubs.
I wasn't talking about any of your other points.
Agree that the priority must always be protecting the player, at the risk of appearing elitist, we particularly need to protect elite players- as they are the ones we should be watching at senior county level in upcoming years. However it is much easier for established clubs to sustain the loss of minor players than up and coming clubs. The problem I have is that for County minors , they may have only 3-4 competitive games in the year, or none in the cases of those outside 1st 15. They are taken out of club circulation for 6months however. I think in an ideal world ,?we alternate 10 week blocks of county football and club football , with 12 week off season/pre-season. During the county block all those club players not on county set ups play league every week , in the knowledge that their county players will return to the fold for an extended club championship . Importantly during the county block there should be loads of county games, rather than continuous training.
This county player/club player protection and provision of regular games must be legislated for, otherwise county players will remain vulnerable to burnout/overuse injury and club players remain subject to weeks without games. The key is that u can not punish clubs for producing county players: ie they are entitled to an extended championship campaign with a full complement of the players they have helped develop. However for "league " games they may have to play without county men- but this is an opportunity for them to develop fringe players who otherwise wouldn't get the chance.
A lot of sense there Sam.
Why does a county player "need" to train 3/4 times a week, week in week out with a county panel?
International soccer teams are happy to train in short bursts ahead of matches and then the players go back to their clubs who look after them week in week out. I fail to see why (both from a financial and player welfare perspective), this shouldn't be the adopted format.
Quote from: theskull1 on February 23, 2016, 04:27:16 PM
Why does a county player "need" to train 3/4 times a week, week in week out with a county panel?
International soccer teams are happy to train in short bursts ahead of matches and then the players go back to their clubs who look after them week in week out. I fail to see why (both from a financial and player welfare perspective), this shouldn't be the adopted format.
Skull I read your posts regularly and enjoy and agree with most. But I am disappointed that you don't see difference between the science and prep at county level compared to club explains why our model will not be the soccer model. Club soccer at at the top clubs leads in science and prep and the country benefit, we are the reverse.
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 12:42:50 PM
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
It won't. Surely you can see everyone benefits from young players not being ran into the ground.
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 01:15:20 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 12:42:50 PM
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
It won't. Surely you can see everyone benefits from young players not being ran into the ground.
1% are being run into the ground, most aren't getting enough games.
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 04:23:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 01:15:20 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 12:42:50 PM
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
It won't. Surely you can see everyone benefits from young players not being ran into the ground.
1% are being run into the ground, most aren't getting enough games.
Being ran into the ground is a far more critical concern rather than having nothing to do for a wile. It is absolutely correct to address the former first.
Quote from: Hound on February 22, 2016, 01:17:27 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 22, 2016, 12:24:45 PM
- Lads at 17 years of age that all throughout GAA history have been old enough to play for their club are now deemed not old enough to play for their club. This is to protect the elite 17 year olds who are now training 3 times a week with development squads. What about a 17 year old who is not on a county minor or development squad and whose last game of club minor football is in May. What does he do until April 2017?
But if minors go to U17, and it means minors can't play adult football, it will allow for proper minor leagues and championships in every county, that won't end in May.
I think its a no brainer. And I think those saying it will leave 17 year olds with no football or that it will have a massive impact on the junior cert are being disingenuous.
Is this being discussed at congress? I know a few clubs who will struggle to field either a team or a reserve/seconds team due to the rule change.
Time to amalgamate then!
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 04:32:23 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 04:23:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 01:15:20 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 12:42:50 PM
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
It won't. Surely you can see everyone benefits from young players not being ran into the ground.
1% are being run into the ground, most aren't getting enough games.
Being ran into the ground is a far more critical concern rather than having nothing to do for a wile. It is absolutely correct to address the former first.
They are not mutually exclusive.
Its possible to stop the burnout of the top 1% by restricting the number of intercounty panels they can be part of, whilst not impacting on the club player already starved of fixtures.
Quote from: johnneycool on February 26, 2016, 02:42:20 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 04:32:23 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 04:23:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2016, 01:15:20 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on February 24, 2016, 12:42:50 PM
Quote from: deiseach on February 24, 2016, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: Old yeller on February 24, 2016, 10:09:15 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 21, 2016, 09:48:24 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 21, 2016, 09:37:31 PM
Reading the article on Pauric Duffy/Congress next weekend in Saturday's indo I was dismayed that the man who is supposed to save club football could only talk about looking after the elite underage player.........since going into office he seems to have realised that the elite players bring in the money and the next generation of those must be looked after. The other 90% odd can go to hell as long as the cream are protected. Can someone at Congress stand up for club footballers or are all the delegates only worried about the elite in their counties as well?
Elite young players are by far the ones being fúcked over by the system more than anyone else. A club player having to sit on his arse in the summer behind a bad club schedule pales in comparison to the suffering alot of young county level players go through in the meat grinder of half a dozen or more 'pay-masters' wanting their piece around the same time of the year.
Duffy is 100% correct here.
Its not the Gulf War, get a grip ffs!
'suffering' might be slightly OTT. Maybe 'exertions' would be better. Otherwise, Syferus' post strikes me as being right on the money.
Its right on the money for the 1% of elite young players, so why bring in rules that may impact on the other 99% in a negative manner?
It won't. Surely you can see everyone benefits from young players not being ran into the ground.
1% are being run into the ground, most aren't getting enough games.
Being ran into the ground is a far more critical concern rather than having nothing to do for a wile. It is absolutely correct to address the former first.
They are not mutually exclusive.
Its possible to stop the burnout of the top 1% by restricting the number of intercounty panels they can be part of, whilst not impacting on the club player already starved of fixtures.
You're wrongly assuming this is the end-point of the changes. What this does is immediately address the dangerous situation these players find themselves in, whether clubs want to admit it or not, while farther reaching issues of schedules are being addressed. And we've already done exactly what you're suggesting at minor IC - in the last year or two no U16s are allowed play minor, indeed most panels would have had at least a few of those players in years past. Few players played minor and U21 in the same year in recent times so that's not an major overlap issue either. But U21s need to be allowed to be on the senior panel too because they are at the age where they're breaking through to that level anyways. It would make no sense at all to me to force a player to be a senior or an U21 player.
Why not? No need for lads who can play senior to play U21 unless you're putting success above their welfare.
Quite simple - a very talented 20 or 21 year old gets on the Senior I C panel then he's not eligible for U20/21.
Why is that a problem? If U21's couldn't play senior then you could play far more games than you do, thus giving those lads more games to develop. It would also give more lads IC football so a win win surely?
There's 21 year-olds who are good enough at that age to win multiple All-Stars and compete for PotYs. It's a form of madness to restrict them from being on their senior team in cases like that, as is forcing them to choose between doing that or playing with the friends they've been playing with from U14 or U15 up.
The only reason you'd be doing it is because of a correctable scheduling malfunction too. There's plenty of time to parse these competitions through the year so you're looking at the trying to fix the problem with the laziest solution to it rather correcting the underlying mess.
Some of the thinking here really isn't going to help improve anything.
Quote from: Zulu on February 26, 2016, 05:37:30 PM
Why is that a problem? If U21's couldn't play senior then you could play far more games than you do, thus giving those lads more games to develop. It would also give more lads IC football so a win win surely?
Not problem Zulu. Proper order to restrict eligibility.
Don't mind Syfín.....
Quote from: Rossfan on February 26, 2016, 05:18:05 PM
Quite simple - a very talented 20 or 21 year old gets on the Senior I C panel then he's not eligible for U20/21.
Then quite simply you have U20/21 competition diluted without its best players. The paying public wants to see the best players competing, the U20/21 players not on senior panels want to test themselves against the best players at that level.
So Mr Duffy, how did Congress for the clubs? Yes fecked in to the ground even more! But ensure that the elite are looked after and money making is maximised..........some day the GAA will realise that they messed it up themselves..........