McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[orangeman]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/championship/mediaplayer.html?features,2494755,2494755,0,209

[Zulu]

The strikers did bet on it going this far IMO, they knew the CB and were willing to go all the way. There was no room for compromise and there never was, had the players gone to the clubs while still playing nothing would have been achieved, that is human nature, things have to get very bad before most people not directly involved will engage in any issue. Anyway this is CP's propsal taken from AFR website.

GAA Press Release

20th February 2009


The GAA has confirmed that lengthy discussions took place yesterday with all relevant parties in the ongoing Cork hurling impasse.

The GAA put forward their proposal for a solution to all parties in order to provide assistance and were unable to obtain agreement.

See below the document put forward and the GAA is making no further comment on the matter.





To: Cork County Board
Cork Hurling Panel of 2008/2009
Cork Management Team.

Re: Cork Hurling Impasse

Date: 19th Feb 2009.

Following our discussions with the relevant parties in the Cork hurling dispute, we have devoted lengthy consideration to the issues at the core of the disagreement in an attempt to identify a solution that will lead to a resolution acceptable to both sides.

We recognize that all parties concerned have strong views about what would constitute desirable solutions and outcomes. It is also the case that only significant compromise from all parties will lead to a resolution of the disagreement. It is in this context that we make the following proposals as a means both to break the deadlock and to support those who have the best interests of Cork GAA at heart:

1. All parties in the dispute - Cork County Board, the hurlers of Cork and the Cork Senior hurling team manager Gerald McCarthy and his backroom team - agree to work with each other in a spirit of cooperation for the current season. All hurlers will make themselves available for selection for the League and Championship once this document (i.e. containing these proposals) has been signed by all parties. As a core principle, it is accepted by all parties that players for a new 2009 panel will be selected uniquely on the basis of their hurling ability.

2. In recognition of this cooperation, the Senior hurling team manager will appoint an additional member to his coaching team and an additional selector to assist in the preparation of the team for the 2009 season. The people appointed to these roles will be acceptable to all parties.

3. A person designated by Croke Park will review best practice in other counties in the matter of panel preparation and player/management interaction, and will produce recommendations that will be implemented, where required, with regard to the Cork hurling panel prior to this year's Championship.

4. A review of all aspects of the relationships between, on the one hand, players at senior inter-county level in both hurling and football and, on the other, the management teams and the County Board will take place at the end of this year's playing season. This review will be carried out by an independent three-person committee nominated by Croke Park. This committee will consult with the outgoing panels, the teams' managements, the County Board and relevant others and will make a recommendation on the appointment of Senior Team Managers in hurling and football for the 2010 season. This recommendation will be forwarded to the Cork County Board for approval.

5. This committee will remain in place until the end of the 2011 season, at which point the arrangement will be reviewed with all parties concerned. This process, as outlined in points 4 and 5, will be overseen by the Ard Stiúrthóir GAA.

6. A strategic plan for the promotion of Gaelic Games within Cork, in alignment with the National Strategic Vision and Action Plan, will be completed by October 2009 following a consultative process with all stakeholders in Cork GAA. The process will include a comprehensive review of:
o games development strategies within the county (this will include the results of the recently completed NCTC report).
o infrastructure and facilities.
o communication structures.
o fixture planning and execution.
o strategies for addressing the challenge of urbanisation.
o the overall personnel requirements to manage the future of Cork GAA.

This review will lead to the formulation of a strategy that will allow the county to maximise participation and reach its potential over the next five years.

The review process outlined above will be facilitated by Croke Park.

7. This agreement will supersede the Agreement made in 2008 through the offices of Kieran Mulvey.

Conclusion
Croke Park is taking this step to provide assistance to all parties in order that an acceptable solution be found, and it presents this document in good faith. The proposals outlined demand compromise and sacrifice from all parties involved.

The individual points in this document constitute a single indivisible proposal and should be considered as such.

It is the hope of Croke Park that all parties will move beyond the divisions that have characterized the current disagreement and that they will work together in the great tradition of Cork hurling and football to restore Cork teams to their proud position within the GAA.


SIGNED:

On behalf of Cork Co Board

On behalf of 2008 Cork Hurling Panel

On behalf of Cork Hurling Management team

On behalf of GAA

[orangeman]

The strikers did bet on it going this far IMO, they knew the CB and were willing to go all the way. There was no room for compromise and there never was, had the players gone to the clubs while still playing nothing would have been achieved, that is human nature, things have to get very bad before most people not directly involved will engage in any issue


So deliberately bring the whole thing to its knees ? Makes sense aright.

[The GAA]

GAA I think you need to wise up a bit. If you want to debate then debate, don't try to be smart all the time because it doesn't always work.
Even the 2008 panel acknowledge the Mulvey agreement was adhered to but not in the spirit of the law as far as they were concerned and feel their inexperience was shown up.
I made my inital point about the irony of emphasis on procedure now because even the harshest critic of the 2008 panel has been saying that that panel should have gone this route from the very start only to be told by the likes of you it couldn't be done. Now what should have been their first choice is probably their last because their options are close to used up.

Genuine question and if you're not capable of engaging on that basis then say so and we'll put you in the same box as OM.

The clubs route and motions to the CB has been done and shown not to work. what has changd now is the realisation among club that the hurlers will follow through and probably be joined by the footballers. melt down is a real possibility and the ordinary club members are now prepared to sick their heads above the parapet. before the delegates and county board were allowed to get on with it because the attitude from the ordinary member was that this was not their domain. the reality of the situation is finally forcing people to take ownership of how their club is engaging with the county board.

[Zulu]

As has been pointed out to you on many many occassions, the players took the only option open to them, to have gone to the clubs straight away would have been futile because everyone was sick of this conflict from last year. I'd bet every peeny I ever earned that they would have been soundly defeated as they were at the last CB convention. So they would have had to withdraw from playing anyway in order for club folk to start looking more closely at what their CB are doing. You may not agree with what the players did but the reality is that it was the only way forward and more importantly it might energise the clubs to engage the CB more and take back control of their county. The funny thing is, Cork are far from the only county run by a small few most county's are run this way and that isn't healthy or democracy for that matter.

[orangeman]

GAA I think you need to wise up a bit. If you want to debate then debate, don't try to be smart all the time because it doesn't always work.
Even the 2008 panel acknowledge the Mulvey agreement was adhered to but not in the spirit of the law as far as they were concerned and feel their inexperience was shown up.
I made my inital point about the irony of emphasis on procedure now because even the harshest critic of the 2008 panel has been saying that that panel should have gone this route from the very start only to be told by the likes of you it couldn't be done. Now what should have been their first choice is probably their last because their options are close to used up.

Genuine question and if you're not capable of engaging on that basis then say so and we'll put you in the same box as OM.

The clubs route and motions to the CB has been done and shown not to work. what has changd now is the realisation among club that the hurlers will follow through and probably be joined by the footballers. melt down is a real possibility and the ordinary club members are now prepared to sick their heads above the parapet. before the delegates and county board were allowed to get on with it because the attitude from the ordinary member was that this was not their domain. the reality of the situation is finally forcing people to take ownership of how their club is engaging with the county board.

You're too smart for us - can you try and simplify your posts  

[The GAA]

Wouldn't matter for you if i crayoned them up on your monitor

[orangeman]

As has been pointed out to you on many many occassions, the players took the only option open to them, to have gone to the clubs straight away would have been futile because everyone was sick of this conflict from last year. I'd bet every peeny I ever earned that they would have been soundly defeated as they were at the last CB convention. So they would have had to withdraw from playing anyway in order for club folk to start looking more closely at what their CB are doing. You may not agree with what the players did but the reality is that it was the only way forward and more importantly it might energise the clubs to engage the CB more and take back control of their county. The funny thing is, Cork are far from the only county run by a small few most county's are run this way and that isn't healthy or democracy for that matter.

In my view the strikers overstepped the mark.


If the clubs back the strikers and Mc Carthy is turfed out, I'll concede that I was wrong. If the clubs don't back them and Mc Carthy stays in place, it's been an awful waste of time.

[orangeman]

Wouldn't matter for you if i crayoned them up on your monitor

That's right - you're on a different level to which I've alluded before.

[bingobus]

Whole thing a mess. A triangle of a mess - three points and they are all pricks!!

The GAA should take the bull by the horns and appoint an independent consultant to review the whole county set up, from players to CB to team mgt. Throw the book at those found to be acting outside the interests of the GAA and suspend who-ever needs to be done.

Lads the rest of the country are fed up with Cork and the annual mess. I have heard this from people in several counties including IC players. The GAA will survive with or without you's. It is your own county that will suffer, regardless of how passionate about the Cork jersey ye all are.

[orangeman]

Whole thing a mess. A triangle of a mess - three points and they are all pricks!!

The GAA should take the bull by the horns and appoint an independent consultant to review the whole county set up, from players to CB to team mgt. Throw the book at those found to be acting outside the interests of the GAA and suspend who-ever needs to be done.Lads the rest of the country are fed up with Cork and the annual mess. I have heard this from people in several counties including IC players. The GAA will survive with or without you's. It is your own county that will suffer, regardless of how passionate about the Cork jersey ye all are.

The 2008 panel have opted to strike again - the CB have got on with it - so has the manager - but the strikers are stirring the pot at every opportunity. They're holding spearate training sessions, negotiating new kit deals, arranging press conferences, meetings with clubs etc etc. What are these lads on ? 

Just read shop steward Gardiner in today's Independent for further evidence if any evidence was needed.

[dowling]

Quote from: dowling on Today at 01:09:56 PM
GAA I think you need to wise up a bit. If you want to debate then debate, don't try to be smart all the time because it doesn't always work.
Even the 2008 panel acknowledge the Mulvey agreement was adhered to but not in the spirit of the law as far as they were concerned and feel their inexperience was shown up.
I made my inital point about the irony of emphasis on procedure now because even the harshest critic of the 2008 panel has been saying that that panel should have gone this route from the very start only to be told by the likes of you it couldn't be done. Now what should have been their first choice is probably their last because their options are close to used up.


"Genuine question and if you're not capable of engaging on that basis then say so and we'll put you in the same box as OM." GAA

To be honest GAA I'm trying not to engage on the basis of your question even though the answer to this particular question can be found in my posts.
Put me in whatever box you like although I didn't realise you were speaking on behalf of anyone.

[dowling]

Zulu I would be inclined to believe the 2008 panel didn't know their actions would take them to where Cork is today and while maybe two or three of them mighn't have minded I doubt if the majority of the panel had known where this was going they would have been for it. Unfortunately it's a situation the 2008 panel seem unable to dig themselves out of. They probably know by now it's gone too far but are afraid of losing face.
Any players who believed they knew this would lead to the here and now wouldn't seem to have Cork interests at heart.

[Reillers]

Whole thing a mess. A triangle of a mess - three points and they are all pricks!!

The GAA should take the bull by the horns and appoint an independent consultant to review the whole county set up, from players to CB to team mgt. Throw the book at those found to be acting outside the interests of the GAA and suspend who-ever needs to be done.Lads the rest of the country are fed up with Cork and the annual mess. I have heard this from people in several counties including IC players. The GAA will survive with or without you's. It is your own county that will suffer, regardless of how passionate about the Cork jersey ye all are.

The 2008 panel have opted to strike again - the CB have got on with it - so has the manager - but the strikers are stirring the pot at every opportunity. They're holding spearate training sessions, negotiating new kit deals, arranging press conferences, meetings with clubs etc etc. What are these lads on ? 

Just read shop steward Gardiner in today's Independent for further evidence if any evidence was needed.

Stirring the pot? I'm sorry OM but that's rubbish.
Despite us saying it all a long, it has come to light how bad the CB is and you call that, the CB getting on with things and the players stirring things.
The CB has been shone a light on and there is an obvious disgraceful abbuse of power. But no, it's the players, who are trying to bring things to how they should be, the only ones till the clubs eventually stepped up a few days ago who have challenged the disgraceful abuse of power. But no, it's the players who are stirring things.

Yet none of this is excepted by you or Dowling or any of the pro CB. It's a disgrace and ye have basically called it not a big deal.

There has been a piss poor attendance at every game so far of the 09 squad.
Frank got into trouble for Sat nights small attendance, he got a talking to by Munster council. He is now under massive pressure and you wont see him for months after this. He will not surface at all.

A lot of people have pulled out of the CB draw this week and more are continuing to do so.

The clubs finally stood up and were counted for the first time ever.

It has come to light what's been happening at the CB meetings, I mean someone has said it, not just the players but the clubs, it's been none to happen in Cork, but no body but the players have said it out loud.

And from 10-12000 turned out and supported the players at the march.

O2 are apparently ready to walk away.

The CB can continue to hide things and ignore things. They are now under massive pressure to step up and do something.

[orangeman]

Maybe the 2008 panel could getter a better deal from Vodafone ??


There's no point saying it's all Frank's fault as well - the clubs voted consistently and as I have said probably will give Mc Carthy the same mandate all over again - I think you'd agree that if it wnet to ywt another vote, Mc Carthy would get the backing of the clubs.

If the clubs have stood up to the CB now as you claim, then surely the strikers ahve achieved their goal and surely now they'll end the strike and disband ?.