McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[Reillers]

The players have never cared about what people thought, in their mind they have and will continue to do the best for Cork hurling, no matter who thinks or says what.

Look if I'm honest I think that it's over. The CCB have won, surprise surprise.
At what cost, only time will tell. I think the consiquences of this will be devastating in the near future and maybe beyond that, if were realistic we're not going to get anywhere near the AI final. Will the CB care, no. They might fire McCarthy if things go absolutely appaulingly as in, worse then they could have imagined and they could end up firing him. I think it's amazing that, we have a CB that would sit there grinning from ear to ear, watching Cork get destroyed by a team like Limerick or Dublin and they would be, for the first time in 6 years the happiest they've ever been.  The players have lost because of the pr campaign which the players lost, they had lost it before they even started fighting one, because Gerald, all due respect to the lad, but he won and was disgaceful in the media campaign and I think a lot of people would have been criticising him to the hill if it was the players who had done what he done. He broke whatever chance was left of reconciliation and he did it blatantly, he didn't try to hide it, everyone knew he did it. He is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad. His cry to the media was damaging to say the least.

But all of that is irrelevant, the players have lost it, they lost before they even began fighting back.

All that remains now is for the final few things to fall into place.

The "leaders" wil probably never play for Cork again, the likes of Donal og, Sully, Sean og, Deane, the twins..etc.

The young guys will eventually break, they'll probably come back, but not walking out on the lads now but I think they'll agree and tell them to go back..Shane O Neill, Naughton, Pa, Hoggy, Sully Og, etc.

The difficult bit is for the guys caught in the middle, everyone else. Some of the guys have a lot of hurling left in them, like Kenny, Brian Murphy, Coleman, Gaa, Fraggy..etc.

I wish that it could be fixed. That one morning the players agreed to go back or McCarthy quit or was fired. But it wont solve the problem, and beisdes that, Gerald is a petty man. And he wont take back some of the players that spoke out against him personally, I don't think he will. He says that he's open to them coming back. But some of the things, that one or two of the YOUNGER players said to home, I don't see him taking them back.  

Sadly the more I think about it, the more time that passes, I can see no realistic solution coming anytime soon.

All the way through this the media has made things worse, you've had a large proportion of clueless idiots fans calling the players who've only ever wanted and fought for the best of Cork hurling, primma donas and crap, when really it's the opposite. They've all made things worse, people who have no clue at all, making things up, spreading their clueless factless oppinions, when really they've not had a flying clue. Attention seekers who had to, no matter how clueless they were, get their oppinions across. They've all made things 100 times worse, all because of their united hate of Cork hurling.

And at the end of the day, hurling has lost. The winners..The CCB..who must be rubbing their hands in satisfaction; mission accomplished. Success may be gone, but control is back. And they'll take control over success any day of the week.

It's not a matter of both sides swallowing their prides, it's beyond that. If either side give in, it will solve nothing.

[theskull1]

He broke whatever chance was left of reconciliation and he did it blatantly, he didn't try to hide it, everyone knew he did it. He is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad. His cry to the media was damaging to say the least.

Reillers. You  say tactfully that "the players lost the media campaign" and then explicitly state that "GMcC is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad."

Would you not say the players lost the media campaign because of their personal attacks on GMcC and that GMcC reacted accordingly in a way which offended the players? It is because of the personalisation in the arguments that things have gotten so bad? Is that not a fairer position to take?

[Tatler Jack]

wish that it could be fixed. That one morning the players agreed to go back or McCarthy quit or was fired. But it wont solve the problem, and beisdes that, Gerald is a petty man

Gerald is not  a petty man Reillers - do you have any evidence of his supposed pettiness over his career. I think you should look closer to the players for pettiness and vindictiveness.  While things are bad a lot of the damage could be fixed if the players were prepared to accept that they share some of the blame. No need for them to be humiliated but there are enough channels open to them to climb down in the same way as the CB had to climb down previously. However if they seek total victory and are not prepared to compromise  then they are the ones that must bear a lot of responsibility for the damage to Cork hurling nd their claim to be doing all of this for the future of Cork hurling will have a hollow ring to it.

[Reillers]

He broke whatever chance was left of reconciliation and he did it blatantly, he didn't try to hide it, everyone knew he did it. He is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad. His cry to the media was damaging to say the least.

Reillers. You  say tactfully that "the players lost the media campaign" and then explicitly state that "GMcC is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad."

Would you not say the players lost the media campaign because of their personal attacks on GMcC and that GMcC reacted accordingly in a way which offended the players? It is because of the personalisation in the arguments that things have gotten so bad? Is that not a fairer position to take?

I have a lot of respect for Gerald as a past great.
But, he started the media fight, every single time he talked to the media, there was one week that he was on the radio nearly every time I turned it on, on a daily basis. He made it personal, he made it bitchy.
The players didn't attack him in the media, they made a passive comment that his training wasn't good. They didn't like it and it wasn't up to their normal that they are used to.
He made it personal, he acted first. He spent about a week whinging to the media before the players said a word. He started it, the media fight that is.
Not only that but he also leaked the confidential document that was done by the players, at the request of the players to try and clear the air between them after the Tipp game, it was leaked by McCarthy (it couldn't have been anyone else but him) purely to make the players look two faced. That ended any chance of the players going back. That destroyed what little trust they had left in him.
He comes across a gent and a guy who wouldn't look at you twice, who wouldn't hurt a fly. But he never had much respect for what the players had to say. He lied to them on several occasions, he didn't want the job but was pretty much forced to take the job and the players and Gerald didn't get on and a lot of that was to do with Gerald not following through in what he said he'd do, what he promised would happen.
He comes across so innocently in all of this, the poor victim he is just as responsible as anyone else in this. All the players want to do is play the game, Gerald's feelings were hurt when the players said his training was crap (anyone who watched it for 10 mins could have told you the same thing.) so he wants to get even. He told the players he was leaving, before he was reappointed, then suddenly when the players make noises about it, he's hell bent on keeping it, suddenly he's got a grand plan for Cork future, which is bull to say the least.
He has used about ever resource he has to get the sympathy vote in this, he is not as innocent as he seems, he's not a shy quiet man, he's exactly the same person as a type of hurler he was..sneaky, sly, stubborn..etc.
Saying training with Gerald is crap, isn't personal, it's the truth and like I said anyone who has seen them train knows that. Gerald made it personal and at times bitchy and childish.
He's a legend, who's fooled a lot of people. But he is not innocent in this whole thing, not even close, but he's got people believing otherwise. He is responsible to why it has gotten so messy in the press. It's his fault.

[theskull1]

Saying training with Gerald is crap, isn't personal, it's the truth and like I said anyone who has seen them train knows that. Gerald made it personal and at times bitchy and childish.

Ah come on. The two things are not mutually exclusive. We can argue over the level of provocation Reillers but it is clear that the players threw the first dig.

[Reillers]

wish that it could be fixed. That one morning the players agreed to go back or McCarthy quit or was fired. But it wont solve the problem, and beisdes that, Gerald is a petty man

Gerald is not  a petty man Reillers - do you have any evidence of his supposed pettiness over his career. I think you should look closer to the players for pettiness and vindictiveness.  While things are bad a lot of the damage could be fixed if the players were prepared to accept that they share some of the blame. No need for them to be humiliated but there are enough channels open to them to climb down in the same way as the CB had to climb down previously. However if they seek total victory and are not prepared to compromise  then they are the ones that must bear a lot of responsibility for the damage to Cork hurling nd their claim to be doing all of this for the future of Cork hurling will have a hollow ring to it.

Are you serious.
Gerald never wanted the job in the first place, he was pretty much forced into it. Donal Og did something he didn't like, he played a short ball in a game where he was told to play a long ball game, long puck outs. He say an oppurtunity and played a short ball, which I'm sorry but it's a players perogative, which ended in a score to the other team, Gerald said that he would never confront a player on his own, they could always bring in another player with them if Gerald needed to talk to them. Another player had to come in. Gerald broke this agreement, confronted Donal Og, on his own, gave out to him like hell for the short puck out, Donal Og said he wasn't sorry and he'd do it again, Gerald dropped him for the next game because of that.
Gerald said that the training wouldn't change, nothing would change but the name of the people in charge. Training got patheticly poor. Players were standing around for a chunk of the session. It frustrated the players, it was affecting their games, Cork prided themselves on sharpness and the basics, under Gerald it went down the drain.Whenever the players who were told that they could and should make comments about the training, mentioned it to McCarthy he humoured them, improved the pace of the session for a training or two and went back to the piss poor way it was.
He didn't know who some of the players played for, or even who some of them were. He was refering to a match before where he said x did really well and made all these points about him, x stood their looking at him, he hadn't played in that game, he'd gotten him mixed up with someone else.
He's had piss poor results. Made naive, bad decisions, poor selections, lost 5 games in 2 seasons. Said that he was leaving to the players. The players presumed he was, but low and behold he took it and someone who didn't want the job in the first place or the last time he spoke to the players about it, suddenly after the players say that they wont play under him and that basically the trainings shit, became hell bent on staying in the job. He leaked a private confidential document that made the players look two faced in his campaign to get sympathy votes.

How is that not petty, that, all of that is petty and spiteful at times.
He's a legend, a great player, but he's not innocent in all of this at all.

The players take the blame for a lot of it, they hold themselves responsible for loosing the matches they lost. But Gerald was a major factor to why they lost. If the players turned around tomorrow and said that they wanted to go back, what will change, the manager, the CB..nothng. The problems will still be there.

[Tatler Jack]

But, he started the media fight, every single time he talked to the

Reillers I would agree with some of your analysis of this dispute but are you serious in saying that Gerald started the media battle, What about the article in the Sunday Tribune with alll the inside petty stories that could only have originated from players. This was followed by Ben O'Connor's inteerview with Diarmuid O'Flynn and it was then that Gerald made his first statement which was quite restrained, This was folllowed by other players interviews including Sean Og's OTT interview. Subsequently Gerald has engaged on some ill advised media stuff that have added to the problem but (and I am not condoning it) he did not start the media fight as you call it. I saw Gerald playing often enough and he rarely started anything but if someone decided to mix it with him he gaveit back in spades. The man has not changed and the players are learning what a tough man he was and is on and off the field.

PS just read your last post; Where did you get the info that Gerald told players he was leaving? Not my info.

[Reillers]

Saying training with Gerald is crap, isn't personal, it's the truth and like I said anyone who has seen them train knows that. Gerald made it personal and at times bitchy and childish.

Ah come on. The two things are not mutually exclusive. We can argue over the level of provocation Reillers but it is clear that the players threw the first dig.

All right, the players said first that the training wasn't good..it wasn't. It was awful, and anyone could have told you that, they made a passive comment, in not even a full interview, how training wasn't good..which is the cold harsh truth.
But Gerald made it personal, and went on and on and on. He ruined any chance of reconciliation.

[Reillers]

But, he started the media fight, every single time he talked to the

Reillers I would agree with some of your analysis of this dispute but are you serious in saying that Gerald started the media battle, What about the article in the Sunday Tribune with alll the inside petty stories that could only have originated from players. This was followed by Ben O'Connor's inteerview with Diarmuid O'Flynn and it was then that Gerald made his first statement which was quite restrained, This was folllowed by other players interviews including Sean Og's OTT interview. Subsequently Gerald has engaged on some ill advised media stuff that have added to the problem but (and I am not condoning it) he did not start the media fight as you call it. I saw Gerald playing often enough and he rarely started anything but if someone decided to mix it with him he gaveit back in spades. The man has not changed and the players are learning what a tough man he was and is on and off the field.

Gerald was making coments to the media well before Ben's interview. He was on the radio a lot harping on and on. It just does my head in that people think oh well done Gerlad, good man, standing up to those players, those bullys, those prima donnas..when really they haven't a clue, they don't realise that it's such a mess because of Gerald.
He hasn't changed, he's the same man as he was a player, and that's clear. Sneaky, sly, stuborn and he'll fight his corner, even when he shouldn't, whem he should stop.

[theskull1]

Reillers, I've trained under a few bad coaches and as frustrating as it was, I would have never forgiven myself if they'd have found out that I had been mouthing to everybody about how bad they were (never mind telling them to their face). The shame would be on me. It is just not the done thing especially in the GAA.

[Reillers]

Reillers, I've trained under a few bad coaches and as frustrating as it was, I would have never forgiven myself if they'd have found out that I had been mouthing to everybody about how bad they were (never mind telling them to their face). The shame would be on me. It is just not the done thing especially in the GAA.

At county level at a county like Cork. So you don't agree with it fine. But you can't justify what Gerald did just because the hurlers said that the training was crap.

[theskull1]

I personally thought that he felt that he had to defend himself against those accusations in the best way he could and that that was to show the contradictory opinions of the players concerned regarding his stewardship. Yes you will say it was confidential information he divulged and make much about that point, but he had to defend his himself in an awkward situation that the players put him in. Hoisted on their own petard so to speak.

[Tatler Jack]

Reillers you are really letting your anger get in the way of logical and rational argument. First Gerald's statement came after Ben's interview - he was not on local radio before that (I live in Cork). Then you say you respect Gerald and then you say "He hasn't changed, he's the same man as he was a player, and that's clear. Sneaky, sly, stuborn and he'll fight his corner, even when he shouldn't, whem he should stop"  What an insult to man who  I saw hime playing as far back as 66 and sneaky or sly I would not call him  - did you see him play?  And if he was so bad as a coach why did the players just not walk away before now. The fact is that tsome of the  players did not want him from the outset and already had their minds made up. For what its worth he would not have been my choice as coach but equally I feel he did not get co-operation from some of the players who were also disloyal in going to the media with stories.

[realrebel]

reillers
ur in a fecking different world
show me where gerald went to the media first show me the proof
the players went first to the papers thats a fact man what are u on bout

[orangeman]

He broke whatever chance was left of reconciliation and he did it blatantly, he didn't try to hide it, everyone knew he did it. He is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad. His cry to the media was damaging to say the least.

Reillers. You  say tactfully that "the players lost the media campaign" and then explicitly state that "GMcC is one of the reasons why things have gotten this bad."

Would you not say the players lost the media campaign because of their personal attacks on GMcC and that GMcC reacted accordingly in a way which offended the players? It is because of the personalisation in the arguments that things have gotten so bad? Is that not a fairer position to take?

I have a lot of respect for Gerald as a past great.
But, he started the media fight, every single time he talked to the media, there was one week that he was on the radio nearly every time I turned it on, on a daily basis. He made it personal, he made it bitchy.
The players didn't attack him in the media, they made a passive comment that his training wasn't good. They didn't like it and it wasn't up to their normal that they are used to.
He made it personal, he acted first. He spent about a week whinging to the media before the players said a word. He started it, the media fight that is.
Not only that but he also leaked the confidential document that was done by the players, at the request of the players to try and clear the air between them after the Tipp game, it was leaked by McCarthy (it couldn't have been anyone else but him) purely to make the players look two faced. That ended any chance of the players going back. That destroyed what little trust they had left in him.
He comes across a gent and a guy who wouldn't look at you twice, who wouldn't hurt a fly. But he never had much respect for what the players had to say. He lied to them on several occasions, he didn't want the job but was pretty much forced to take the job and the players and Gerald didn't get on and a lot of that was to do with Gerald not following through in what he said he'd do, what he promised would happen.
He comes across so innocently in all of this, the poor victim he is just as responsible as anyone else in this. All the players want to do is play the game, Gerald's feelings were hurt when the players said his training was crap (anyone who watched it for 10 mins could have told you the same thing.) so he wants to get even. He told the players he was leaving, before he was reappointed, then suddenly when the players make noises about it, he's hell bent on keeping it, suddenly he's got a grand plan for Cork future, which is bull to say the least.
He has used about ever resource he has to get the sympathy vote in this, he is not as innocent as he seems, he's not a shy quiet man, he's exactly the same person as a type of hurler he was..sneaky, sly, stubborn..etc.
Saying training with Gerald is crap, isn't personal, it's the truth and like I said anyone who has seen them train knows that. Gerald made it personal and at times bitchy and childish.
He's a legend, who's fooled a lot of people. But he is not innocent in this whole thing, not even close, but he's got people believing otherwise. He is responsible to why it has gotten so messy in the press. It's his fault.

A passive comment


Are you serious ?


How did Gardiner get on Primetime ?? Why did he go on Primetime ? Ill advised to say the least.

That was the beginning of the end for the players and their fight to win the sympathy of the public. After Primetime, it was all over.