McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[cicfada]

The footballers I would imagine will come out with a statement of support for the hurlers, saying that they are aware of the board's shortcomings but will not go out on Strike with the hurlers. Conor Counihan has said that he would quit if they do!  Look I have no problem with Mc Carthy quitting or the senior players but that still wouldn't be enough would it? You know as  well as I do that the board will not quit! As regards the facilitator..he was brought in by Donal Og as he is his work colleague. But did the players try to speak with Mc Carthy about thier concerns before bringing in this facilitator or was it the first option tried? I agree that it was an apalling breach of trust to leak the document but if it was Mc Carthy ( you say it was) I'd say he was hurt by the stories that the players were telling Kieran Shannon and company about his training methods and "lack of knowledge about clubs etc" . I am not excusing it merely saying I think that is why it was done by whoever! 2 wrongs never make a right but  it would  be no harm for the players to admit to  a small bit of lack of judgement at the  beginning with the Kieran Shannon article. The leak of the confidential document followed on from that!  At  the end of the day both sides will have to compromise and that means the players as well as the board/Mc Carthy!  Eveyone thought that Kieran Mulvey had sorted it out last year and the players gave an undertaking  that they would not strike again! Yet not a year later they are on strike again. Forget about the board and all the reasons for going on strike, the bottom line is that they are on strike! That's the public perception of the situation regardless of the underlying causes, as honourable  as they may be!  Another public perception is that the players (that the co board are trying to get rid of)   are leading the whole effort and influencing the younger players. It's fairly obvious that, that is the case and if you expect people(outside of Cork) to believe that  Frank Murphy is influencing  all of the club delegates to the detriment of the situation then admit to  the influence of the senior players.  I think the younger players  (4 or 5 of them) should come out and tell the world that they never play for Cork again as long as the co board/Mc Carthy remain in place. That might sort that one out!! I don't know what will sort  the whole mess  out but as I said earlier my heart goes out  to Colmans! What a slap in the face to  that famous hurling nursery!

[orangeman]

So Reillers - it's no longer about the board, it's now back to Mc Carthy ?


You've had a right good dig at him as past 5 or 6 posts.


So it's all Mc Carthy's problem !


Incidentally, do the players have ANY blame at all in this whole sorry saga ?

[theskull1]

Reillers is too close one side of the argument so it' easy to understand why he just doesn't get the proper perspective

[realrebel]

reillers
i dont know why u keep going on bout the players been right. get it into ur head their not
u go on bout gerald and that document but what bout the players releasing info bout geralds training methods to the media first
they were the ones that broke the trust gerald was only defending himself
u go on bout cork losing 5 games under gerald yes they did but did u ever consider that the players said they didnt want ger there in the first place so how do we know they were giving 100% in training etc.
do u blame the manager for the frees o connor and co missed or the penalty sull missed they missed the chances and thats why they lost the games. missing stupid frees
as for kilkenny do u honestly belive cork are better than them. u say we were hammered i didnt see it that way at all
again if we put the simple chances away we would have been a lot closer. plus we got closer to them than any other team in the country in the championship
do u remember when donal og did a short puck out against waterford ger f****d him out of it but donal said he would do it again in the same situation even though waterford scored
these players have no respect for anyone anymore  one of the players who was been trained by a former cork great and manager
told a taxi man that this certain manager couldnt train a greyhound
of course this got back to the manager and after awhile this man is not even a member of the club he loves anymore because of the player
the players are only interested in themselves and should get out now because i know for a fact ger mac isnt going anywhere

[Reillers]

So Reillers - it's no longer about the board, it's now back to Mc Carthy ?


You've had a right good dig at him as past 5 or 6 posts.


So it's all Mc Carthy's problem !


Incidentally, do the players have ANY blame at all in this whole sorry saga ?

Oh my God. For what most be my 100th time saying this..

IT WAS ALWAYS ABOUT THE BOARD. The players problem in the first place was not with Gerald himself it was the way in which he was appointed by the BOARD, they were annoyed with the BOARD'S decision and that has never changed.

"In the end the board put us together again with a manager that they knew we had needed a facilitator to work with during the championship season," says Cusack. "They forced us back together with a guy that they knew players had great difficulties working with. That's the incredible thing here.

"That is not a process. Is there any county board in the country who would force two sides back together again after all that?"

Gerald for what most again be my 100th time saying it is being used as a pawn by both sides.

And again I've said it so many times by now it's not even funny, I think the players actions were WRONG but intentions RIGHT.

I'm not saying it anymore.

[INDIANA]

but that message hasn't registered with the public unfortunately, you canot seem to grasp that concept. Now maybe a lot of the irish public are all simpletons but not all are. And 90% of people out there believe this is mc carthy vs the players. Thats because the message came out badly.

The tribune article about training methods, confronting mc carthy directly and telling him he was too old, a crap manager etc. All of those appeared in the public domain in newspaper articles with quotes attributed to the players. If this was about the board, then they shoulld have hammered it into frank murphy vs the cork panel. They didn't and as a result, most people don't care what the problems are anymore.

[Reillers]

reillers
i dont know why u keep going on bout the players been right. get it into ur head their not
u go on bout gerald and that document but what bout the players releasing info bout geralds training methods to the media first
they were the ones that broke the trust gerald was only defending himself
u go on bout cork losing 5 games under gerald yes they did but did u ever consider that the players said they didnt want ger there in the first place so how do we know they were giving 100% in training etc.
do u blame the manager for the frees o connor and co missed or the penalty sull missed they missed the chances and thats why they lost the games. missing stupid frees
as for kilkenny do u honestly belive cork are better than them. u say we were hammered i didnt see it that way at all
again if we put the simple chances away we would have been a lot closer. plus we got closer to them than any other team in the country in the championship
do u remember when donal og did a short puck out against waterford ger f****d him out of it but donal said he would do it again in the same situation even though waterford scored
these players have no respect for anyone anymore  one of the players who was been trained by a former cork great and manager
told a taxi man that this certain manager couldnt train a greyhound
of course this got back to the manager and after awhile this man is not even a member of the club he loves anymore because of the player
the players are only interested in themselves and should get out now because i know for a fact ger mac isnt going anywhere

I've said over and over again THAT I THINK THAT THE PLAYERS ACTIONS WERE WRONG.


u go on bout gerald and that document but what bout the players releasing info bout geralds training methods to the media first
they were the ones that broke the trust gerald was only defending himself
I go on about Gerald and the document because that shattered the trust, that was going beyond the line, no returning after that, the players, wrongly or rightly, said that they thought Gerald's training was not up to standard, at the end of the day, whether that was the right or wrong thing to do, it was telling the truth. Gerald defending himself, no that's not acceptable, defending himself would have been no my training isn't shite, which ask anyone who's seen it, it is so behind the likes of KK, Tyrone, Kerry and old Cork.
But leaking a donfidential document that was done in good faith by the players, a completley private document that was done to ease the air, was leaked by Gerald, as a snipe. That was beyond the line, that was 100 times worse then the players, wrong or right, saying how shite training was.
It's like somone slapping you and you instead of slapping back run them over with you're car.
It's not on the same level and anyone with an honest unbiased opininon could see that.

u go on bout cork losing 5 games under gerald yes they did but did u ever consider that the players said they didnt want ger there in the first place so how do we know they were giving 100% in training etc.

That's possibly the most insulting thing to have been said about these players. I'm not even going to defend that. I'm not because if you tell me that Munster game against Waterford minus so many important players and coming within a width of a cross bar from getting a result was not them  caring, then I don't know what is, or the Waterford game where gave EVERYTHING and was robbed by the ref. LOOK at those games and tell me that that wasn't 100%. Look at the Galway game and tell me that they didn't care. I was in Thurles that day I'd no voice for days, I've never heard the crowd get behind a team so much as we did that day.
That line is without a doubt the most insulting thing that's been said about these players on this forum and it just proves that you aren't a "Real Rebel"  because no one who is could ever think that.
That was not fake, you've clearly never been to a game, clearly you weren't at that game because I challenge anyone to tell me that that was fake passion. THat was the players giving 110% with 14 men when everyone said that they had no right to win. The same against Clare. You look at the players at the final whistle against KK and tell me that that was them not caring, the vast majority of them, Sully especially were in tears, playing for Cork means EVERYTHING to them and they would never go into a game with the intention of loosing..because that is what you're implying with not giving 100% in training. They give it all, all the time.
But it's bloody infuriating when they've to stand around in training waiting for a go, because of that, their basic skills and sharpness which Cork were known for went down so much, not an oppinion, it's fact, since McCarthy took over they crashed to the ground. Cork were always known for doing the basics outstandingly and being exremely sharp. They weren't. But what happens happens on the field, who is better is decided on the pitch. ALL the players want is a manager that gives them the best chance of winning on the pitch. Not someone they needed a facilitator to get through a season with. Is that too much to ask?

Donal Og wouldn't nor should he apologise for making a call in the game, asked would he do it again he said he would, the manager gives them tactics to play, but it's a player perogative, especially if they're as experienced as Donal Og is, to make a call. It was unfortunate that it ended up with conceding but he made a call, and he'd make it again, that's no disrespect that using your head in a game..and Gerald dropped him. I think not knowing what club a player is from or even some of their names ad turning up late constantly for training is hell lot more disrespectful then that.
The players have NEVER had ANY respect whatsoever from the board. Don't talk to them about being disrespectful, if you read any of my posts on the last page you'd see differently.  

"Someone told a taxi man that this certain manager couldnt train a greyhound"
A taxi, and the game plan was found in the taxi and the secret weapon was found in the taxi..you're taking the piss right. If he's not a member of his club anymore because of that then my oppinion of him just went down a bit because that's pathetic..he heard from a taxi driver that..
If the players were only interested in themselves then why are they still here, I said before in my post that has shockingly gone unread..again, that Gerald is playing a bit of a game, that there is very little motivation of him staying except for his pride, which is not in the best intentions of Cork hurling. If the players are only interested in themselves they wouldn't have kicked up a fuss. This is a lot bigger then them, this is about taking on the biggiest bullys in the game, the difference, which tells me who cares more, is that the players are willing to walk away, they'll stand and fight but if needs be they'll walk away..McCarthy and the Board wont because they are too interested in settling personal vendettas.

"It's just very, very disappointing because from a player's perspective, I can only give them the best possible character reference, because I know it's not about power, it's not about ego, it's not about personalities.

"They have a genuine desire to be the best they can be and bring success to Cork, and under that regime they certainly couldn't do that."-Dessie Farrell.

[Reillers]

but that message hasn't registered with the public unfortunately, you canot seem to grasp that concept. Now maybe a lot of the irish public are all simpletons but not all are. And 90% of people out there believe this is mc carthy vs the players. Thats because the message came out badly.

The tribune article about training methods, confronting mc carthy directly and telling him he was too old, a crap manager etc. All of those appeared in the public domain in newspaper articles with quotes attributed to the players. If this was about the board, then they shoulld have hammered it into frank murphy vs the cork panel. They didn't and as a result, most people don't care what the problems are anymore.

I know, and I get that, they wont and turth be told if I was in their position I wouldn't give them the time of day either, they wont read the fine print..which just happens to put them in good light, which just happens to be much more revealling then people realise.

The players hesitate to come out and blatantly hammer home Murphy because he's not going anywhere, a permanent fixture in Cork hurling, if they come out and do what Donal Og did yesterday it's pretty much signing a death warrant, it's ok if they've a manager who will protect them-O Grady, Allen. But they now have a puppet on a string. So that's more then likely Donal Og finished, I doubt very much we'll ever see him in a Cork geansai again while that board is in place, but someone had to say it and he stood up. Hopefully the other players and clubs can build on that.

"They want to get rid of a certain section of us. Every statement that the board has made, everything, and Gerald is unfortunately taking the heat for the board, has been directed towards pressurising the younger guys," he added."-Donal Og.

But I get that all the public who don't bother reading the fine print is that all they see is the players saying how shite training is, they don't see what even McCarthy is doing, his little song and dance in front of the media and he's playing a blinder. His motives for staying with Cork is based on mainly spite and hurt pride that's not seen, the players though it's not easily seen their actions may be questionable but their reasons for it aren't. They genuinely are the ones with the best intentions in this and everyone who has worked with both the board and players and people who have inside knowlledge of the board and Co. all side with the players, that hasn't hit home either, that the only people who know what's going on side 100% with the players, there's a reason for that but know seems to have coped on to that either.


Nor have the realised that oh yes a document was leaked by Gerald in what was such a bitter snipe condifence and trust shattering move, an irreversable move. No one seems to realise what affect that had on the players..how really there was no coming back from that.

"The final nail in the coffin was the release of that document to the papers last week (Cathal O'Reilly). None of the boys could get over it. We all did that in good faith. That was going into the bag. I don't show it to any other player," he said."-Ben O Connor.

"People have talked about us escalating things or being inclined towards conflict," said O'Neill "but things like the release of the Cathal O'Reilly report will tell people a lot about how hard it would be to go back now."-Shane O Neill.

But people are like oh they're only complaing about Gerald now because they lost to Kilkenny and shit like that, so much so that the fine print of that is blown past. It hits no one that a facilitator at the PLAYERS request was needed to get them through the year..the board knew this and they reappointed him anyway, they reappointed a man that they knew full well that the players couldn't work with. Not because they lost to KK, way earlier on in the year, and someone was needed to come in to try and sort it out.


People say oh the board aren't out to get the players, yet no one reads the fine print here either They REAPPOINTED a manager that the players NEEDED a FACILITATOR to just get through the year. The board did that for one reason and one reason only and that's to get rid of a few senior players.

They muddled through though, accepting changes. The players concede too that, on the several occasions when problems were pointed out, McCarthy took matters on board and things would get better. The sudden deterioration in relations should not disguise the respect which grew between both parties during their time together.

" It was known that we had problems at times with Gerald and that we would have been sceptical of his appointment at first. We went with it, though," added Cusack. "We could have gone to Gerald at any time during the five-meeting process but all the time we genuinely thought that those meetings were part of a process which might lead somewhere. We didn't want to sabotage the process.

"Now we have reached a situation where Gerald's reappointment has been rammed home and even though a significant number of players have gone along personally to Gerald and said that they didn't think that things were working as well as they should, we are still being forced into that relationship."-Donal Og et Humphries.

"In the end the board put us together again with a manager that they knew we had needed a facilitator to work with during the championship season," says Cusack. "They forced us back together with a guy that they knew players had great difficulties working with. That's the incredible thing here.

"That is not a process. Is there any county board in the country who would force two sides back together again after all that?"

It also escapes people that they could have taken this action last season but they didn't because they felt it was disrespectful..

"It's ironic," said Ben O'Connor yesterday, "but the fellas who would be perceived as the troublemakers now would be the same guys who would have argued at that time for the situation to be left be. It was felt there was another year. We would work with it as best we could."

That year has come and is almost gone. The Cork hurlers submitted a couple of performances for the ages this year and must have come away thinking they could smell paradise in the distance. Their manager and themselves have different ideas about why paradise was lost in the first place and how it might be regained.

The Cork County Board, meanwhile, dissembles surprise at the current troubles and backs McCarthy to the hilt in the hope that if he takes three or four senior players down with him when he goes the trouble will have been worth it.-Tom Humphries.


People and I get why, don't read the fine print, but maybe if they did, if they gave it 5 seconds to just think, to give the players the slightest time of day, maybe just maybe they aren't as bad as people think.

[theskull1]

I'm reading the fine print Reillers and the more I hear them defending themselves for their actions, the more I detest what they have done. They just don't realize that the world doesn't revolve around them. A crowd of spoilt brats who would sell their granny to achieve glory for themselves but show the people around them total lack of regard if they don't meet their expected standards. The have a terrible attitude which I and many others find sickening (irrespective of any gripes they may have) as it such a non GAA trait to act in such ways. The GPA aspirations have changed the mindset of alot of these players. The world owes them something or so they would have us believe

[Reillers]

I'm reading the fine print Reillers and the more I hear them defending themselves for their actions, the more I detest what they have done. They just don't realize that the world doesn't revolve around them. A crowd of spoilt brats who would sell their granny to achieve glory for themselves but show the people around them total lack of regard if they don't meet their expected standards. The have a terrible attitude which I and many others find sickening (irrespective of any gripes they may have) as it such a non GAA trait to act in such ways. The GPA aspirations have changed the mindset of alot of these players. The world owes them something or so they would have us believe

Ya just with tinted glasses on that only let you see what you want to see. I told you earlier, we all know that some of ye like yourself especially will always no matter what the players do or how right or wrong they are, or no matter what evidence or fact that back them, you will always come out with the same conclusion, at least have the spine to admit it.

You're not reading the fine print because if you were there's no way you'd be calling them spoilt brats or going on about the GPA when it's got feck all to do with them. You're not reading what they're saying, what people say who know what's happening, people like journalists on the inside, you wont give them the time of day. You hate them and no matter what they do or what they say, no matter what evidence you're shown, like what I just posted, from people like Humphries who know what they're talkinga about or O Grady or Allen or any half decent journo. You refuse to listen, for one reason and one reason only, ye hate them, they can't do anything right, God forbid that they are actually right here..that everyone who knows something about the inner works of the CCB or who have spent 5 mins with the players backs the players. That doesn't matter to you, that EVERYONE on the inside has backed them not some, ALL the people who know what is going on has backed them.
I don't think there's a single person who've experienced things on the inside, who has come out backing the board...Does that not mean something to you, does that not register??

That doesn't matter, none of that matters to you, you wont listen to actual hard cold fact. If you read the fine print there is no way you could think less of the players, you would find some pretty daming stuff about the board and McCarthy. But you wont give them the time of day, you completley ignored my last. Can you just admit that no matter what they do, wrong or right, you'll side against, because you hate them and it's as simple as that. Atleast have the balls to admit that so we can stop having a pretend debate.

[theskull1]

Reillers if you don't mind I'll use my own words to describe what I feel about the players and why. I can sense your frustration at people who in your belief are not prepared to listen to you. But the reality is you're just too close the the players to be worth listening to in that regard. Rose tinted

[Reillers]

Reillers if you don't mind I'll use my own words to describe what I feel about the players and why. I can sense your frustration at people who in your belief are not prepared to listen to you. But the reality is you're just too close the the players to be worth listening to in that regard. Rose tinted

It frustrates me when people WONT look at the other side, not can't WONT.

Answer me this, What do ye think about EVERYONE who knows what's going on and who have worked with the players, back the players, not a sinlge person, (that I know of) back the players..WHY IS THAT?? ..and I swear to God if you come out with oh there all friends with the players, or Donal Og's hypnotised them then you're a lot more biased then I thought.

[orangeman]

Reillers if you don't mind I'll use my own words to describe what I feel about the players and why. I can sense your frustration at people who in your belief are not prepared to listen to you. But the reality is you're just too close the the players to be worth listening to in that regard. Rose tinted

It frustrates me when people WONT look at the other side, not can't WONT.

Answer me this, What do ye think about EVERYONE who knows what's going on and who have worked with the players, back the players, not a sinlge person, (that I know of) back the players..WHY IS THAT?? ..and I swear to God if you come out with oh there all friends with the players, or Donal Og's hypnotised them then you're a lot more biased then I thought.

Objective is how I'd like to describe myself in this thread.

Biased is how you'd be described.



On antoher note, can someone post the article in today's Sunday World by Pat Spillane ??. Thanks

[theskull1]

Back the players??

You telling me Donal O Grady & John Allen 100% support how the players have handled themselves in this dispute. Links please. I obviously need to read the detail

[realrebel]

reillers
where are u getting the infomation about everyone supporting the players ur away with the birds if u think this is true
my friend is working with gerald and he says he got hundreds and i mean hundreds of emails and thousands of phone calls from ex players managers from all counties saying they support him in this case
even supporters who supported the players before are on gers side
how many emails do u think ger got telling him to resign i can ya 1 yes 1 out of hundreds
did u not see any of the polls on all gaa sites even the cork one, he has the support in all of them
we all know who u support in this but stop trying to convince us that we should support the players
everyone can make up their own mind on this