Ireland V Austrailia International Rules Official Thread 2008

[AZOffaly]

The fact of the matter as far as I'm concerned is we don't play football particularly well and this is being shown up in the IR series.

That's it in a nutshell.


Zapatista,

I think it does highlight our poor kicking and the skills of Gaelic Football. I don't particularly like the game at all really, although this one seems to have been a bit more sane, but I definitely think it highlights the same things that we see every championship game in Gaelic Football.

Quite a few of our inter county footballers, are simply not very skillful - at football.

[Zulu]

English comprehension problem eh? ... "promoting games internationally" is not the same as the "internationalisation" of Gaelic Games. And I certainly don't buy your assertion that professionalism would be an inescapable component of any move towards internationalisation. That sounds like defeatist to me.

Sorry now FoSB but that sounds delusional to me. There can only be a French, German or Japanese football team if there are people playing the game in those countries. We have GAA in the school system in Brittany, Canada and Britian so in time we might see teams that could play Ireland in an international football fixture but it is a long way away and would require funding that we don't have. As for doing this while remaining amateur, well I just don't see how that is possible, the GAA is embedded into Irish society with massive opportunities for us all to play important games (club, school, college, county) but I don't ever see us convincing many other nationalities to put in the same level of preparation our lads do to have truely competitive teams without financial reward.

[Zapatista]

Exactly. We don't need this to tell us Fermanagh can't shoot. We have lots of examples of how they can't shoot. It is different though having a player that can't shoot as a big aussie is about to blind side him rahter than a player that is about to have his kick blocked. If they are not doing it in football there is a problem you can easily point out, if they are not doing it in IR then it tells us very little about what is right or wrong in their football game.

[ONeill]

Weren't you in class teaching? How'd you manage to see it?

Ways and means. Any lad who lifts his head gets the strap.

[AZOffaly]

Exactly. We don't need this to tell us Fermanagh can't shoot. We have lots of examples of how they can't shoot. It is different though having a player that can't shoot as a big aussie is about to blind side him rahter than a player that is about to have his kick blocked. If they are not doing it in football there is a problem you can easily point out, if they are not doing it in IR then it tells us very little about what is right or wrong in their football game.

I'd agree with you to a certain extent. All I'm saying is it is highlighting what we already knew. They are not doing it in football, nor are they doing it in IR. It's the same problem.

[Zulu]

It high lights nothing. It is a different game against players from a different game. You can't compare a sprinter with a cyclist and say that it shows the cyclist needs to improve on is breathing or that the sprinter needs to improve on stamina. You compare sprinters with sprinters and cyclists with cyclists.

That's the same head in the sand type of comment fellas came up with the last time. I'll give you an example of our woeful technique, Bryan Cullen took a mark and attempted to kick a cross field ball (approx. 15 meters) to Kieran Donaghy. He shanked it and Donaghy had to turn around and dive to gather the ball for the mark, now remember this guy is the primary foot passer for Dublin, yet he made a hash of an unpressurised kick to a teammate less than 20 meters away. He was far from the only culprit, in fact this was repeated all through the game by various Irish players or what about Coulters missed free kick in the first 2 or 3 minutes?

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

English comprehension problem eh? ... "promoting games internationally" is not the same as the "internationalisation" of Gaelic Games. And I certainly don't buy your assertion that professionalism would be an inescapable component of any move towards internationalisation. That sounds like defeatist to me.

Sorry now FoSB but that sounds delusional to me. There can only be a French, German or Japanese football team if there are people playing the game in those countries. We have GAA in the school system in Brittany, Canada and Britian so in time we might see teams that could play Ireland in an international football fixture but it is a long way away and would require funding that we don't have. As for doing this while remaining amateur, well I just don't see how that is possible, the GAA is embedded into Irish society with massive opportunities for us all to play important games (club, school, college, county) but I don't ever see us convincing many other nationalities to put in the same level of preparation our lads do to have truely competitive teams without financial reward.

We'll agree to differ here Zulu. A pal of mine refereed in Paris last year, and there's wasn't a single native anglophone playing; they played for the love of the game (and not badly either), and if they thought that there was a chance of them representing their country or continent playing that game that they love, they'd jump at the chance, and there'd be no need for massive monies to be spent in so facilitating them. That's not to say that it woud be simple, but it would be possible, and that's where a little imaginative application comes in.

[AZOffaly]

I think the problem here is that some people (Zapatista ) don't like this rules game and anything to do with, or any lessons that can be taken from it.

I don't like it either, but I'm still willing to say that if a fella displays singular lack of skill in the basic skills of GAA, as opposed to any of the hybrid skills, then that shows an underlying problem with that lad AS A GAA PLAYER.

I have little time for the series because I think it is a needless risk to our players, and is simply a money exercise for the two associations, but I do think it is instructive to see our best players, or many of them, display serious deficiencies in the skills of Gaelic Football.

Do we need the IR series to display this? - No, certainly not.

Do the IR series highlight this problem? - Yes, in my opinion they do.

[FermPundit]

Exactly. We don't need this to tell us Fermanagh can't shoot.

Steady on Zapatista. Malachy will be working his magic on the Fermanagh forwards over the winter months. I have it on good authority that the Fermanagh players will be wearing a special type of shooting boot next year. Our inability to score will be a thing of the past.

[eyeswideopen]

I watched this mornings game with an open mind and have to say both teams would have benefited from a warm up game. They took a while getting used to that rules. Pat was sore on the Irish lads in order not to show bias. While the Aussie ref was a homer.
Also felt that when the Irish heard the whistle for a mark they automatically stopped instead of using the option to continue. Had Coulter not stopped to take a mark in the first 5 mins he was in for a goal. All in all i did enjoy and am looking forward to next weeks test.

[Zapatista]

I put my hands up a little AZ .

I just can't see how after seeing players fail at basic skills is a defence for the IR when we know it is the case from our own games. I don't think theIR highlights this but I do agree that it shows some of it as do our own games week in week out.

[mackers]

the biggest thing these games have to teach us is our players are not as sharp or as fit as they should be. the number of times an irish player was caught in possesion was shocking. dispite higher skill level most are not able to operate at the spped necessary for a game with a genuine tackle. Im thinking abut Canty reilly bradley and even though he had a great game S macdonell who did his best work with the ball out of hand.
Kavanagh and the tyrone boys  seemed to love it and I thought it was interesting that it was mackeever whio was instigating the professional killing of the game towards the end , you never expect such cynicism out of an armagh lad

Speed has nothing to do with it. Lads can't switch off 20 odd years of training just like that. Training which says draw the tackle and then offload, or sidestep the man, or don't dive in or you'll give away a free etc. Lads can't tackle properly, so what. It'll be over in a week and we'll think no more on it for another year. Or preferably we'll think no more on it full stop.

In a nutshell, Jinxy, a lot of posters are being very harsh on our lads. The tackle in this game is light years away from the tackle in our game, we still had lads trying to shoulder the Australians, there were times in the game where the last thing you wanted to do was catch the ball (after it bounced) cause the Aussies just wrapped them up. I don't care what anybody thinks that will have an effect on shot selection etc..
The Irish footballers can't change the way their mind works on the pitch based on playing this game twice every 1/2 years.

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

Anyways, regardless of anything else, it's resulted in the liveliest thread since the AI Final, so it's not all bad  

[AZOffaly]

Maybe your definition of highlighting is different to ( or more correct than!!) my own. I'm certainly not saying that exposing our lads skill problems is a reason for the IR to continue, or is a 'defence' for it. All I'm saying is that it highlights, or draws attention to (or further attention to), things we 'purists' have been moaning about for quite a while.

[AZOffaly]

the biggest thing these games have to teach us is our players are not as sharp or as fit as they should be. the number of times an irish player was caught in possesion was shocking. dispite higher skill level most are not able to operate at the spped necessary for a game with a genuine tackle. Im thinking abut Canty reilly bradley and even though he had a great game S macdonell who did his best work with the ball out of hand.
Kavanagh and the tyrone boys  seemed to love it and I thought it was interesting that it was mackeever whio was instigating the professional killing of the game towards the end , you never expect such cynicism out of an armagh lad

Speed has nothing to do with it. Lads can't switch off 20 odd years of training just like that. Training which says draw the tackle and then offload, or sidestep the man, or don't dive in or you'll give away a free etc. Lads can't tackle properly, so what. It'll be over in a week and we'll think no more on it for another year. Or preferably we'll think no more on it full stop.

In a nutshell, Jinxy, a lot of posters are being very harsh on our lads. The tackle in this game is light years away from the tackle in our game, we still had lads trying to shoulder the Australians, there were times in the game where the last thing you wanted to do was catch the ball (after it bounced) cause the Aussies just wrapped them up. I don't care what anybody thinks that will have an effect on shot selection etc..
The Irish footballers can't change the way their mind works on the pitch based on playing this game twice every 1/2 years.

I'm being 'harsh' on our lads, or actually more to the point on our training methods in the GAA, because the same thing (poor shot selection, poor shooting, poor passing) can be seen every game in the championship, from many intercounty players.

I don't think our players are any less skillful, inherently, than before, but I certainly think modern training methods are sacrificing skill for sweat.