GAA must 'reach out' to unionism

[orangeman]

Maybe it's because it's late at night and I can't sleep, but is anyone else suspicious about the timing of this piece? I mean a few days after the soccer semi-final in Belfast and the following attack by suspected Linfield supporters.

I was alluding to this earlier Ziggy - a bit suspicious alright !

[Croí na hÉireann]

Gnevin in an ideal world it would be great to say that politcs can be removed from sport but it simply isn't possible. Whether we like it or not ( and i don't) the political climate does effect the sporting arena. This happens on a world wide basis. Described as war without the guns in some circumstances. Unionists and Nationalists have a poltical mindset that will have an influence on absolutely everything they partake in. The GAA will be no different when it comes to this.


Ziggy i wasn't sure what you were talking about there until your second post and you could have a point. Maybe this story was used to sort of sweep under the carpet the violence at the Irish Leagues games.

It's very possible. Remove the flag and Anthem ,changing the wording of the aims and you 75% of the way their

Jaysus  . If ever a 32 county republic comes into being I'd be 90% sure there'll be a new flag and anthem. I'm sure the GAA will have no problem adopting these then but until then the flag that sympolises peace between nationalism and unionism and the anthem will do just fine. If unionists have no problem standing under the flag and listening to the anthem in Landsdowne/Croke Park they should have no problem playing under it/listening to it IF THEY WANTED TO!!!

[lynchbhoy]

Lynchboy if the GAA required an oath to the queen would you  of joined?
Didn't the RUC have to be totally be remade to be acceptable?
What political aspects of Rugby would prevent Republicans supporting it?

Jeez Gnevin - thats way off the mark or irrelevent.

1. I didnt join the cub scouts in england as there was an oath to the queen, but what has that to do with joining the GAA - or more so ...PLAYING GAA games.
Or do Na Fianna have lads dancing around pentacles and alters with sacrificed goats etc (though thinking about their recent success there may be something in this).
I joined the GAA to play football and hurling and thought nothing more of it. Mayeb there ae deep political thinkiers amonst the ranks of 8 year olds today, but I'd be mightily surprised.

2. RUC is now PSNI and is still not policing nationalist areas in NI. There are huge problems with this and only after a couple of years did gerry adams finally speak out against the bad 'service' being performed by the psni - but its too late for adams, he has lost all credibility and support in north county derry and derry city (the only areas I have been hearing directly from).
A wee name rebranding and supposed makeover was never going to fix the problems if the higher ranking order giving officers were not replaced of dealt with. I know you didnt know there were problems in NI over policing, but now you do. There are prob a lot of problems up there you dont know. I try to ignore them myself , which is easy living where we do. But it affects too many still, and these are the people who WANT to embrace change and integration!

Rugby was the game of the unionist middle and upper classes. they didnt allow nationalists to join up until very recently. If they did they were treated to abuse that would make the darren graham affair seem tame.
I have a few friends playing rugby for innishowen RFC who play in the ulster lueague and regularly play throughout NI , and for their troubles get lambasted and verbally abused before during and after games away in places like balinahinch, dungannon and balymena etc. Abused by opponents and fans, rode by biased anti-taig refs (half the innishowen team are not taigs btw). Need I go on...this is current and these instances are still happening this season...
I can give you all the info you want if you like - pm me on the rugby and psni stuff. Its sickening.

[winsamsoon]

Gnevin why in the high heavens would anyone want to remove the flag of the nation from the national games? How daft would that sound. The flag is not and should not be an issue as it is representative of all sections of our siociety. (well maybe not the foreign influx)  Is there no end to the concessions you would give ?? Why don't you become a unionist because you would do a good job on the negotiating front. Unionism aspires to preserve the Union. Nationalism aspires to creating a 32 county state. These are the complete opposite so the politics that surround the issue will never allow one simple solution or even 75% worths . To suggest removing the flag and anthem is the most rediculus point raised yet.

[Gnevin]

Gnevin why in the high heavens would anyone want to remove the flag of the nation from the national games? How daft would that sound. The flag is not and should not be an issue as it is representative of all sections of our siociety. (well maybe not the foreign influx)  Is there no end to the concessions you would give ?? Why don't you become a unionist because you would do a good job on the negotiating front. Unionism aspires to preserve the Union. Nationalism aspires to creating a 32 county state. These are the complete opposite so the politics that surround the issue will never allow one simple solution or even 75% worths . To suggest removing the flag and anthem is the most rediculus point raised yet.

[lfdown2]

Gnevin why in the high heavens would anyone want to remove the flag of the nation from the national games? How daft would that sound. The flag is not and should not be an issue as it is representative of all sections of our siociety. (well maybe not the foreign influx)  Is there no end to the concessions you would give ?? Why don't you become a unionist because you would do a good job on the negotiating front. Unionism aspires to preserve the Union. Nationalism aspires to creating a 32 county state. These are the complete opposite so the politics that surround the issue will never allow one simple solution or even 75% worths . To suggest removing the flag and anthem is the most rediculus point raised yet.

Good counter argument there?!

[AZOffaly]

Gnevin why in the high heavens would anyone want to remove the flag of the nation from the national games? How daft would that sound. The flag is not and should not be an issue as it is representative of all sections of our siociety. (well maybe not the foreign influx)  Is there no end to the concessions you would give ?? Why don't you become a unionist because you would do a good job on the negotiating front. Unionism aspires to preserve the Union. Nationalism aspires to creating a 32 county state. These are the complete opposite so the politics that surround the issue will never allow one simple solution or even 75% worths . To suggest removing the flag and anthem is the most rediculus point raised yet.

Good counter argument there?!

I'm just surprised he didn't mis-spell it

[lfdown2]

 

[orangeman]

I think some of them Freestaters are starting to take the piss out of us Brits ! 

[lfdown2]

sure gnevin is only a west brit!!

[Maguire01]

Gnevin why in the high heavens would anyone want to remove the flag of the nation from the national games? How daft would that sound. The flag is not and should not be an issue as it is representative of all sections of our siociety. (well maybe not the foreign influx)  Is there no end to the concessions you would give ?? Why don't you become a unionist because you would do a good job on the negotiating front. Unionism aspires to preserve the Union. Nationalism aspires to creating a 32 county state. These are the complete opposite so the politics that surround the issue will never allow one simple solution or even 75% worths . To suggest removing the flag and anthem is the most rediculus point raised yet.

Winsamsoon, your arguments are consistent in their inability to represent logical and rational thinking.

The whole point of this argument is to try and identify the barriers there may be to joining the GAA from a unionist perspective.  For unionists, the flag is not of their nation and does not represent them.  We don't need a lession on what the colours of the flag represent - we all know what they represented when the flag was established, but for many, that's irrelevant.

I know i won't feel any less Irish if i was to head to a league or championship game and not see the tricolour.  I'll hopefully also be able to identify that I'll be watching the national game in front of me, despite the lack of a flag. (Oh, and that reminds me of another thread some time ago - if i recall correctly, the flag is not flown at night, i think Parnell Park was the example given.  During none of these evening games did the world end, did unionism advance or did the GAA lose its Irishness - to my knowledge at least.  Excuse the sarcasm.)  I would therefore come to the conclusion that it is not essential to fly the flag at every game.  If a GAA flag is flown, it would be no less Irish, would still represent the 32 counties (and beyond, as would now be relevant), but would remove any unnecessary political dimension.

As for the national anthem, its recital at certain games can be an embarrassment and actually shows a real lack of respect for it, to the extent that it would be better not to play it at all.  Its fine when its played at a big match with a proper band (although the amount of bands that still manage to mess it up baffles me!), but when it's cranked out through a crap PA from some dodgy tape (no CD could sound that bad!), or sung out of tune by a dodgy soloist (and generally without accompaniment from the crowd - at least in this part of the country) it does it no justice. There would be no loss to discontinuing its use, at least at certain levels.

[Gnevin]

. (Oh, and that reminds me of another thread some time ago - if i recall correctly, the flag is not flown at night, i think Parnell Park was the example given.  During none of these evening games did the world end, did unionism advance or did the GAA lose its Irishness - to my knowledge at least.  Excuse the sarcasm.)

Yeah us Dub's respect the flag by not flying it after dusk!

[ardmhachaabu]

The whole point of this argument is to try and identify the barriers there may be to joining the GAA from a unionist perspective.  For unionists, the flag is not of their nation and does not represent them.  We don't need a lession on what the colours of the flag represent - we all know what they represented when the flag was established, but for many, that's irrelevant.

I know i won't feel any less Irish if i was to head to a league or championship game and not see the tricolour.  I'll hopefully also be able to identify that I'll be watching the national game in front of me, despite the lack of a flag. (Oh, and that reminds me of another thread some time ago - if i recall correctly, the flag is not flown at night, i think Parnell Park was the example given.  During none of these evening games did the world end, did unionism advance or did the GAA lose its Irishness - to my knowledge at least.  Excuse the sarcasm.)  I would therefore come to the conclusion that it is not essential to fly the flag at every game.  If a GAA flag is flown, it would be no less Irish, would still represent the 32 counties (and beyond, as would now be relevant), but would remove any unnecessary political dimension.

As for the national anthem, its recital at certain games can be an embarrassment and actually shows a real lack of respect for it, to the extent that it would be better not to play it at all.  Its fine when its played at a big match with a proper band (although the amount of bands that still manage to mess it up baffles me!), but when it's cranked out through a crap PA from some dodgy tape (no CD could sound that bad!), or sung out of tune by a dodgy soloist (and generally without accompaniment from the crowd - at least in this part of the country) it does it no justice. There would be no loss to discontinuing its use, at least at certain levels.

I know the support for such things is coming from the likes of yourself or gnevin.

To that end, it is noted by people in the north, you know, the people who know whether it would actually work...

For some reason you and the likes of gnevin seem to think that you know more about unionist thinking than those of us who live north of the border.  That amazes me as virtually noone else in the north connected to the GAA supports what you are saying about unionist thinking.  Do us all a favour, give it 10 years and then see if unionism has embraced the GAA, then you might get the support you would need from the GAA base.

Until then, forget it.

[Pangurban]

G. Nevin....Yeah us Dub's respect the flag by not flying it after dusk
I am surprised you fly it at all

[Gnevin]

The whole point of this argument is to try and identify the barriers there may be to joining the GAA from a unionist perspective.  For unionists, the flag is not of their nation and does not represent them.  We don't need a lession on what the colours of the flag represent - we all know what they represented when the flag was established, but for many, that's irrelevant.

I know i won't feel any less Irish if i was to head to a league or championship game and not see the tricolour.  I'll hopefully also be able to identify that I'll be watching the national game in front of me, despite the lack of a flag. (Oh, and that reminds me of another thread some time ago - if i recall correctly, the flag is not flown at night, i think Parnell Park was the example given.  During none of these evening games did the world end, did unionism advance or did the GAA lose its Irishness - to my knowledge at least.  Excuse the sarcasm.)  I would therefore come to the conclusion that it is not essential to fly the flag at every game.  If a GAA flag is flown, it would be no less Irish, would still represent the 32 counties (and beyond, as would now be relevant), but would remove any unnecessary political dimension.

As for the national anthem, its recital at certain games can be an embarrassment and actually shows a real lack of respect for it, to the extent that it would be better not to play it at all.  Its fine when its played at a big match with a proper band (although the amount of bands that still manage to mess it up baffles me!), but when it's cranked out through a crap PA from some dodgy tape (no CD could sound that bad!), or sung out of tune by a dodgy soloist (and generally without accompaniment from the crowd - at least in this part of the country) it does it no justice. There would be no loss to discontinuing its use, at least at certain levels.

I know the support for such things is coming from the likes of yourself or gnevin.

To that end, it is noted by people in the north, you know, the people who know whether it would actually work...

For some reason you and the likes of gnevin seem to think that you know more about unionist thinking than those of us who live north of the border.  That amazes me as virtually noone else in the north connected to the GAA supports what you are saying about unionist thinking.  Do us all a favour, give it 10 years and then see if unionism has embraced the GAA, then you might get the support you would need from the GAA base.

Until then, forget it.

I know more about every thing , get use to it , it's like the rising of the sun , nothing you can do about it