Worthington wants anywhere but windsor

[Orior]

depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

Once again I ask you to show me how the Northern Ireland football team or it's supporters display 'exclusively Unionist monocultural trappings'.  .

Are you, by any chance, blind?

[nifan]

Nifan, in fairness thats hardly the fault of the ROI !
If we had our way it would be all one country, as per the goals of our main political parties.

Im asking about representation of all communities in Ireland. If it is to be one, then all would have to be represented.

[his holiness nb]

Nifan, in fairness thats hardly the fault of the ROI !
If we had our way it would be all one country, as per the goals of our main political parties.

Im asking about representation of all communities in Ireland. If it is to be one, then all would have to be represented.

Lets not get into why they cant be represented 
You know this is not the fault of the FAI

[nifan]

I am being slightly faecetious - tony reckoned in the past ROI flags should be on display at NI games also.

[T Fearon]

The real Ireland team is open to all, plays in a carnival atmosphere devoid of sectarianism or politicised chanting, under a flag which signifies unity equality and peace between Orange and Green.

[Fishead_Sam]

I wonder will they be looking to use Croke Park between grounds, we could introduce Soccerheads to GAA double headers, have NI V Whoever doubling up with ROI V Whoever, and they could cheer oneanother on, bliss

[Main Street]

I am being slightly faecetious - tony reckoned in the past ROI flags should be on display at NI games also.

Would that have a similar effect as to when the Ring was thrown into the Mt Doom volcano

[magickingdom]

ni shouldn't have a team (as i duck behind the couch), nor should scotland wales or england. there should be one uk team then everyone who feels their british they can support it and everyone who feels their irish can support the irish team...  on the bright side for ni fans if this came to pass they would be one uk league and belfast might get a premiership team...

[Chrisowc]

depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

Once again I ask you to show me how the Northern Ireland football team or it's supporters display 'exclusively Unionist monocultural trappings'.  .

Are you, by any chance, blind?

OK. I'll ask you then.  How do the Northern Ireland football team or its supporters display 'exclusively Unionist monocultural trappings'?

[Evil Genius]

I fail to understand why NI fans are oppossed to a move from Windsor.

In my experience, only a minority of NI fans are opposed to a move from Windsor - and at least some of those that are may also be Linfield fans.

What we overwhelmingly want is a modern stadium, to a suitable design, with a realistic capacity, in the right location.

The Maze, which is being forced on soccer without any consultation or consideration, will only meet one of these (modern). Moreover, if we are required to commit to a long-term lease to the Maze, and it turns out to be the White Elephant we are predicting, then it will screw us financially for years to come.

Far better and more cost-effective all-round simply to give us our "share" of the Maze Stadium money to allow us to occupy a suitable stadium (in Belfast), with the equivalent share to GAA and Rugby to do with whatever they like.

Failing that, the fall back position of NI fans is to spend a few millions refurbishing the North Stand roof and building new South and Railway stands at Windsor, to give us a 20-25k capacity. This is by no means perfect, but if needs must...

[Evil Genius]

Tony i take your point and that is one of the reasons i'll never attend one of the North's games. But in fairness I worked with a few of the them and they were decent enough fellas and they dispised some of the loyalist twits who made windsor a cold house for catholics, and many of them weren't staunch unionists. They tried to get me to accompany them to a game but i politely declined. when i told them that i couldn't support the North as in my opinion it would be accepting the partition of ireland they accepted my argument. But i wouldn't say any of them used their support as a badge of political identity.

IC, do you really think that your workmates who, as you say, are "decent enough fellas" would ask you to accompany them if it were going to be that bad an experience for you? I know from personal experience that it is nothing like that these days and just as they wouldn't want you to feel uncomfortable, neither would they wish theirselves to be embarrassed, either.

I don't imagine they really want to "convert" you, either, since they presumably respect your preference for the ROI team.

Rather, I imagine they are actually proud of what a good and enjoyable atmosphere is to be had, plus how well the team is playing, and they want you to enjoy it, too. If nothing else, the offer of a ticket when they are so hard to get is quite generous.

If they repeat the offer, I would urge you to accept what is merely as an opportunity to accompany some friends to a sports match. You could even bring one of those chequered Green and White Fermanagh flags which were so prominent a couple of years back (a mate of mine is never seen without his at NI matches, btw)

And if this all seems a bit "unreal", is it any more unlikely than that they might enjoy themselves somewhat if you invited them to a big GAA match in return?

[Evil Genius]

As an strong irish nationalist, I have to accept that people on this island think of themselves as british, and are proud to sing 'their anthem'. Similarly i am a proud irish man and am proud to sing the irish anthem at GAA matches. That does not make me a bigot. Most catholics in the North support the ROI and i think we should continue to do so. I think we should let NI fans continue to support 'their national team'. The fact that they do so causes no offense to me. All supporting organisations has their fair few disgraceful fans but it is football at the end of the day. Lets not forget that.

I, too, am a proud Irishman. As such, I am particularly proud to follow the NI soccer team, since soccer is my great passion and the NI team represents my own wee bit of this world.
As it happens though, I am also interested in rugby and proudly follow the Ireland rugby team.
When it comes to the anthems, I don't particularly care for GSTQ at Windsor (I have long since felt we should have a particularly NI tune), but I respect it, since it is only 90 seconds before the real business of the 90 minutes starts. (In fact, I'm often in the loo for a last-minute emptying of the old bladder when the band is playing!)
Similarly, when they play the Soldiers Song (twice!) at Lansdowne before rugby internationals. I don't feel anything it, but my attitude is "Stand Up, Shut Up, then Sit Down", as a simple mark of respect.

How do I reconcile my support for both NI and Ireland? Simple, really: I just accept that each sport is administered on a different basis and cheer the boys in green, since I don't feel my presence is making any political statement to anyone. In fact, the politics of the fans around me at Windsor or Lansdowne are of no interest to me, nor mine any business of theirs.

As such, I imagine that is how the likes of Gerry Armstrong (one of my all-time sporting heroes) reconciles his pride at represented his local club at Croke Park whilst a youngster, with his pride at representing NI in numerous internationals whilst an adult.

[Evil Genius]

FAI can pick from any of the 32 counties ,hardly partitionist ...... 

The FAI has yet to select anyone from the 6 not otherwise connected by birth, parents/grandparents or residence to the 26 for their senior* team. This may be because none as yet has been good enough, but it may also be because they are not yet confident that such a player would be eligible.
Indeed, if it should turn out that such a player were ineligible, it could lead to the ROI team being docked points, or even disqualified from any competition in which the player(s) had been selected.
The issue has yet to be resolved by FIFA, which has been asked, but seems in no great hurry to decide.


* - I say "senior", since the eligibility and switching rules are different for under-age players.

[inisceithleann]

As an strong irish nationalist, I have to accept that people on this island think of themselves as british, and are proud to sing 'their anthem'. Similarly i am a proud irish man and am proud to sing the irish anthem at GAA matches. That does not make me a bigot. Most catholics in the North support the ROI and i think we should continue to do so. I think we should let NI fans continue to support 'their national team'. The fact that they do so causes no offense to me. All supporting organisations has their fair few disgraceful fans but it is football at the end of the day. Lets not forget that.

I, too, am a proud Irishman. As such, I am particularly proud to follow the NI soccer team, since soccer is my great passion and the NI team represents my own wee bit of this world.
As it happens though, I am also interested in rugby and proudly follow the Ireland rugby team.
When it comes to the anthems, I don't particularly care for GSTQ at Windsor (I have long since felt we should have a particularly NI tune), but I respect it, since it is only 90 seconds before the real business of the 90 minutes starts. (In fact, I'm often in the loo for a last-minute emptying of the old bladder when the band is playing!)
Similarly, when they play the Soldiers Song (twice!) at Lansdowne before rugby internationals. I don't feel anything it, but my attitude is "Stand Up, Shut Up, then Sit Down", as a simple mark of respect.

How do I reconcile my support for both NI and Ireland? Simple, really: I just accept that each sport is administered on a different basis and cheer the boys in green, since I don't feel my presence is making any political statement to anyone. In fact, the politics of the fans around me at Windsor or Lansdowne are of no interest to me, nor mine any business of theirs.

As such, I imagine that is how the likes of Gerry Armstrong (one of my all-time sporting heroes) reconciles his pride at represented his local club at Croke Park whilst a youngster, with his pride at representing NI in numerous internationals whilst an adult.

EG i take your point on board and perhaps in hindsight i should have gone to windsor with my workmates. however its clear that fans of all backgrounds have no problems supporting ireland as one nation when it comes to rugby. Therefore why can the same not be done when it comes to football. I know that the football authorities split after partition but is it really implausible to suggest that, like rugby everyone on the island could come together and support one team? if this happened i'd be quite happy to remove all anthems and flags from the ground as i don't think they are needed. is it a class thing where rugby fans are more tolerant and from the middle classes??

[Evil Genius]

So Tonys right then that you are mostly unionist or loyalist, and on that basis pro ni in the uk, and would maybe see a ni football team as an expression of that ideal, even though it was never originally formed for that purpose, but sorta grew into the position?

It's hardly a state secret that the majority, but NOT unanimity, of NI fans are unionist/loyalist of one shade or another. And I daresay some of those see their support for the team as an expression of their political ideals.

However, you should be aware that rather than continuing to grow, such an outlook has actually been reversed greatly in recent years. For example, 20+ years ago, Union Flags were greatly in evidence at NI matches, with regular singing of The Sash etc. A noticeable number of fans wore Linfield or Rangers colours (scarves and replica tops etc).
Presently, however, you never hear any political songs or chants at matches (bar a solitary "No Surrender" chant during the anthem by a minority - a Pavlovian reflex, really) and Union Flags have almost all been replaced by NI flags or (increasingly) Green and White flags and banners of one sort or another. As for Linfield colours, those rare individuals (a handful, really) who sometimes wear them tend to get the piss taken out of them. In any case, the overwhelming effect in the stands is of a "Sea of Green".
Similarly, there is an increasing movement amongst the fans e.g. to replace GSTQ as our anthem, in the same way as Scotland and Wales have done.

In fact, such has been the overwhelming transformation in behaviour, atmosphere and appearance at NI games, that the real knuckle-draggers have actually stopped* supporting the NI team, on the basis that they "wouldn't be seen dead wearing green amongst that bunch of hand-wringers and fenian-lovers etc".


* - Not that they've stopped supporting an international team, mind, as the frequent sight of the likes of Johnny Adair and Billy Hutchinson in Ingurland tops testifies...