The Official 2016 Irish General Election thread

[joemamas]

Living in the US for longer that I care to admit, but a few comments.

When you see who gets elected in counties like Tipp Wexford, Kerry just to mention a few, you shake your head and wonder what the people who cast votes are really thinking. "Two creameries at the cross" politics still very evident.

The entire FF/FG daftness from my youth is long gone, where ejjits used to entirely lose the plot around election time and would almost be ready to bear arms or slashers such was the level of passion.
There appears to be shag all between, except that FF were in power when times were really good and abused the shite out of it. Would FG have been any different, who knows. I do hope they come together and help make the entire country prosper.

Problem is when you have a slew of independents who control the balance of power, very poor short-term decisions can be made based on that.

One thing that has me perplexed is that how there has been so little government financing for an Airport (Connaught) in an area that is still playing catch up to the rest of the country big time. It was a no brainer for FG and in particular Enda, as it is has the potential to be an incredible resource for the entire west, but it appears and I could be wrong on this, that they punted on it and instead gave a ton of support to Shannon.

It is also very apparent that there are more small shops and pubs closed in rural Ireland that there were thirty years ago. Not all the governments fault, but not sure will it change soon either.

Maybe only scratching the surface, but an observation from afar nonetheless.

[LeoMc]

Plenty of squirming for FF and FG for the next few weeks. The voters won't appreciate being asked to vote again as well FF and FG both know.

SF did extremely average imo in the election but would expect them to have smiles as wide as cheshire cats here. They can detach themselves from the impasse easily.

I don't think they will get off that lightly by taking the easy option in opposition. FF, SF, AAA and  a long line of independents all said they would get rid of Irish water among many other things in common. So will they not have the balls to all form a government now and do what they promised the people? If not, the narrative will quickly play out that on the 100th year anniversary of 1916, the people voted an absolute bunch of cowards to the Dail, more intent on doing what's best for their party than the country.

They prefer to be hurlers on the ditch, griping about homelessness, queues in health etc while carefullly avoiding actually doing anything to solve these problems.
Someone on Boards.ie described the AAA and SF as like a dog that chases after a car, and when the car stops and they catch up they then wait for the car drive off agan so that they can chase after it yapping.

What would you have them do from the opposition benches? Plenty of ideas have been put forward but ignored by FG. Sneering the opposition has been common place in the last Dail aided by the Clown Comhairle.  Enda doesn't agree with the electorate but respects their right to be wrong. FG's ego has been massively deflated, no surprise they never get re-elected but doubt they'll learn.

At a minimum I would expect them to try to set out a list of deal breakers they would need to go into Government with FF or FG, not to blindly insist they will not go into government with either.

[mikehunt]

Plenty of squirming for FF and FG for the next few weeks. The voters won't appreciate being asked to vote again as well FF and FG both know.

SF did extremely average imo in the election but would expect them to have smiles as wide as cheshire cats here. They can detach themselves from the impasse easily.

I don't think they will get off that lightly by taking the easy option in opposition. FF, SF, AAA and  a long line of independents all said they would get rid of Irish water among many other things in common. So will they not have the balls to all form a government now and do what they promised the people? If not, the narrative will quickly play out that on the 100th year anniversary of 1916, the people voted an absolute bunch of cowards to the Dail, more intent on doing what's best for their party than the country.

They prefer to be hurlers on the ditch, griping about homelessness, queues in health etc while carefullly avoiding actually doing anything to solve these problems.
Someone on Boards.ie described the AAA and SF as like a dog that chases after a car, and when the car stops and they catch up they then wait for the car drive off agan so that they can chase after it yapping.

What would you have them do from the opposition benches? Plenty of ideas have been put forward but ignored by FG. Sneering the opposition has been common place in the last Dail aided by the Clown Comhairle.  Enda doesn't agree with the electorate but respects their right to be wrong. FG's ego has been massively deflated, no surprise they never get re-elected but doubt they'll learn.

At a minimum I would expect them to try to set out a list of deal breakers they would need to go into Government with FF or FG, not to blindly insist they will not go into government with either.

If by "them" you mean Sinn Fein then both FG and FF have said they won't go in with them.

[deiseach]

It is also very apparent that there are more small shops and pubs closed in rural Ireland that there were thirty years ago. Not all the governments fault, but not sure will it change soon either.

This is a particular bugbear of mine, and I think it almost had an effect on the election in my neck of the woods. There is something government can do - protect rural post offices. They may not be economically viable, but that is to miss the point. They provide a certain amount of traffic in an area that might keep the rural shop or pub open. The post office in the village of Bunmahon down the coast from me closed a while back and now there is no shop, even in the summer months, which has the knock-on impact on the tourism trade there, such as it was. During the life of the last government the post office in Kill closed and John Deasy, a man whose employment history is entirely down to his father's status as a former TD and government minister -  Legislative Assistant in the United States Senate, ffs - was quick to sneer at the complaints of the people of Kill. The post office wasn't viable and that was the end of the matter. I have no doubt that such an attitude contributed to the implosion of Deasy's campaign, which saw him make it home by about 500 votes ahead of Paudie Coffey, his outgoing FG colleague (ha!) despite being 1/80 with Paddy Power a few days before the election. Now, before anyone says 'the other lot are as bad', you'd be right. I believe FF closed down over 200 rural post offices in their last time in power, all sacrificed at the altar of cost-saving, as if a universal postal service is ever going to make money. No doubt they are hiding behind some diktat from Brussels, but I don't believe for one second that a case can't be made for the protection of such services, if the will was there. There is no will though, so wedded are all the mainstream parties to making Ireland a good place to do business. With all that in mind, is it any wonder people in Kerry are willing to vote for Healy-Rae in their tens of thousands? It's more surprising that more people don't do it!

[AZOffaly]

That's the conundrum. You can't say you are focussing on national politics exclusively, for the good of the country, because these issues and locations are part of that country. If the Government(s) took rural issues seriously, there'd be no need for Michael Lowry or the Hyphens.

[Arthur_Friend]

No comment.

Starting to think Tony's new Northern Irishness thing might not be such a bad idea after all....

[mikehunt]

That's the conundrum. You can't say you are focussing on national politics exclusively, for the good of the country, because these issues and locations are part of that country. If the Government(s) took rural issues seriously, there'd be no need for Michael Lowry or the Hyphens.

The likes of the Healy Raes and Lowry's of this world are elected because "they get things done". Obviously this is done at a cost to somewhere else where "it doesn't get done". How do they get access to the resoures to get things done? Did the Healy Raes not get over 300k worth of state awarded contracts. If there's a conflict of interest then they should be out of the running. This doesn't just happen at local level, it happens at a national level as we seen with the numerous contracts awarded to O'Brien controlled companies. It needs to stop, we have gombeens at local and national level.

[seafoid]

Most of the Indies are either left wing (the 2 Tipp lads, Wallace,  Connolly, O Sullivan, Zappone, Daly) or anti corruption right wing (Ross and co). FG and FF stand for the same ould shite.

What left wing? Mattie McGrath left wing? Seamus Healy maybe, but Mattie is FF gene pool. Lowry is obviously not. Not sure Mick Wallace would be a socialist really.

FF and FG 'stand for' what most people in this country stand for I'd imagine. Slightly right of centre financially, slightly left of centre socially.

Anyone advocating social housing is LW.  You would think FF and FG would but they are wedded to neoliberalism.

[AZOffaly]

Exactly. So what I'm saying is if the 'National' parties and more appropriately the 'Government' actually governed the whole country, you wouldn't have the rise of Rea-Nua. Like take away the whole 'Biddy needs a hip operation so bump her up the list' type stuff, and what do they 'get done'. They protect local post offices. They try and improve local infrastructure. They try and get local jobs. So on and so forth. Surely part of being the Government of a country means you should have a national strategy that looks at those things anyway, thereby taking most of the wind out of their sails.

[Rossfan]

Most of the Indies are either left wing (the 2 Tipp lads, Wallace,  Connolly, O Sullivan, Zappone, Daly) or anti corruption right wing (Ross and co). FG and FF stand for the same ould shite.

What left wing? Mattie McGrath left wing? Seamus Healy maybe, but Mattie is FF gene pool. Lowry is obviously not. Not sure Mick Wallace would be a socialist really.

FF and FG 'stand for' what most people in this country stand for I'd imagine. Slightly right of centre financially, slightly left of centre socially.

Anyone advocating social housing is LW.  You would think FF and FG would but they are wedded to neoliberalism.

I suppose Wallace could be an Irish left winger as they don't believe in paying tax....

[armaghniac]

Exactly. So what I'm saying is if the 'National' parties and more appropriately the 'Government' actually governed the whole country, you wouldn't have the rise of Rea-Nua. Like take away the whole 'Biddy needs a hip operation so bump her up the list' type stuff, and what do they 'get done'. They protect local post offices. They try and improve local infrastructure. They try and get local jobs. So on and so forth. Surely part of being the Government of a country means you should have a national strategy that looks at those things anyway, thereby taking most of the wind out of their sails.

The problem is that much government is unprincipled. They set targets for things like ambulance coverage and then ignore the fact that they don't meet them. The doctor candidate in Clare reflects the fact that they can't be relied upon to meet coverage for things like GPs. A blind eye is turned to things like queues for hip operations, in part because TDs prefer to "fix things"  rather than set up a proper system. Local councils have been emasculated so that you needn't be talking to your local counciller.

[seafoid]

Exactly. So what I'm saying is if the 'National' parties and more appropriately the 'Government' actually governed the whole country, you wouldn't have the rise of Rea-Nua. Like take away the whole 'Biddy needs a hip operation so bump her up the list' type stuff, and what do they 'get done'. They protect local post offices. They try and improve local infrastructure. They try and get local jobs. So on and so forth. Surely part of being the Government of a country means you should have a national strategy that looks at those things anyway, thereby taking most of the wind out of their sails.

When they paid off the bondholders they cut themselves off

[T Fearon]

The problem is,and this is universal,Governments exert little influence over many facets of life.In the UK,Hospital Consultants and the Doctor's Union,BMA, run the NHS, and threaten strikes etc if they don't get their way.They can also sway public opinion very easily as well.Similarly policing in constrained by all sorts of human rights issues etc.

[imtommygunn]

You are completely wrong about the nhs. Pen pushing politicians run it and that is why it is in the mess it is in and getting worse. Doctors swing public opinion by telling the truth which is something jeremy hunt wouldn't know if it jumped up and bit him. The nhs story from the tories is all smoke and mirrors.

[Main Street]

T stands for Thatcherite.
Thatcherite Fearon