The run up to conflict in Northern Ireland

[T Fearon]

Not in our lifetimes.Meanwhile why don't we all aspire to be Northern Irish with or own unique culture as a priority instead of chasing pipe dreams,and develop special relationships?

[BennyCake]

Not in our lifetimes.Meanwhile why don't we all aspire to be Northern Irish with or own unique culture as a priority instead of chasing pipe dreams,and develop special relationships?

Catholics in the North have an ingrained Irish culture and way of life that has spanned generations, and prior to partition. Living in a part of a British-ruled territory doesn't make them any less irish than a man a couple of miles across an invisible border.

[Rossfan]

Not in our lifetimes.Meanwhile why don't we all aspire to be Northern Irish with or own unique culture as a priority ......?

How would that work in Blacklion/Belcoo and all the other places close to the 300 miles+ border?

[seafoid]

Not in our lifetimes.Meanwhile why don't we all aspire to be Northern Irish with or own unique culture as a priority instead of chasing pipe dreams,and develop special relationships?

It is quite a traumatised  culture in many ways. All the time wasted on sectarianism when you could be talking to people or doing work on the garden or improving your golf swing or whatever

[BallyhaiseMan]

Not in our lifetimes.Meanwhile why don't we all aspire to be Northern Irish with or own unique culture as a priority instead of chasing pipe dreams,and develop special relationships?

That's great,so you will be supporting the NI team from now on then,so we won't have to listen to blab on about the Irish team.

If you're looking for your own unique Northern Irish culture,surely then you should be interested in sports which are widespread in terms of cross-community  support and involvement up there, so you should probably start following Ulster Rugby and disassociate yourself with the GAA.

A good first step would be deleting your account on this website and refraining from ever posting here again.

[T Fearon]

My outlook has evolved.Many unionists have an admiration for the GAA,and I'm not saying for one minute that Northern Irishness should not include aspects of Irish and UK culture (which are ingrained anyway),but the North of Ireland is unique,hence the impossibility of classifying it as 100% UK or 100% Irish.To enhance Northern Irishness will also make the constitutional question irrelevant,as this will be the priority regardless of whether we are governed by London or Dublin.

I don't think any sane person would disagree that neither Dublin or London wants the North,understands the North,etc.If this was the case why did over 90% of the 26 county electorate jettison Articles 2 or 3 (effectively conceding that the British should control the North) at the time of the Good Friday Agreement?

[Rossfan]

We voted for the whole of the Good Friday agreement worked out by the 2 Governments and Nationalists and Unionists in the North.
How far South would "Northern Irishness " go? Would it include Donegal and North Monaghan, two areas further north than many parts of the 6 Cos.

[Arthur_Friend]

My outlook has evolved.Many unionists have an admiration for the GAA,and I'm not saying for one minute that Northern Irishness should not include aspects of Irish and UK culture (which are ingrained anyway),but the North of Ireland is unique,hence the impossibility of classifying it as 100% UK or 100% Irish.To enhance Northern Irishness will also make the constitutional question irrelevant,as this will be the priority regardless of whether we are governed by London or Dublin.

I don't think any sane person would disagree that neither Dublin or London wants the North,understands the North,etc.If this was the case why did over 90% of the 26 county electorate jettison Articles 2 or 3 (effectively conceding that the British should control the North) at the time of the Good Friday Agreement?

Eh, maybe as part of a compromise so there might be a chance of peace in the north.

BTW this whole island is called Ireland. Citizens of the independent republic have no more right to the term 'Irish' than anyone from the north, regardless of the current constitutional arrangement.

[BennyCake]

There's a Northern mindset but no Northern culture. It's either an Irish culture, or British culture (whatever that entails). You can't redraw a border and force a culture on people.

[T Fearon]

So Irish sovereignty is casually and overwhelmingly conceded all for the sake of peace,that was never guaranteed? Incomprehensible.You could argue then that Hitler shouldn't have been confronted,as this would have avoided WW2.

A statelet in existence for 100 years is bound to develop its own special culture,different and unique to that of neighbouring states.Unique to Northern Irishness (in terms of the UK and rest of Ireland) are things like parading,plain speaking,religious adherence,temperance,no sense of easy going (that you'd see in the South).Throw in things like the GAA,Irish Language,Music etc which are an anathema to most unionists.As far back as the 70s,Gerry Fitt conceded he had far more in common with a Belfast Protestant than he had with a catholic from Dublin or Cork.

Two communities striving in polar opposites,for things that are never going to happen,like 100% integration with Britain or a wholly United Ireland is simply pointless.

[imtommygunn]

There's a Northern mindset but no Northern culture. It's either an Irish culture, or British culture (whatever that entails). You can't redraw a border and force a culture on people.

In the most part i think you are right there. Though things like ulster rugby have actually brought more common ground in the sporting arena at least.

Fearon what do you do - give up your respective cultures?

I am not sure about having more in common with belfast protestants than catholics from down south. World cup 90, ai finals, traditional music,visits of pope. Only a number of things but you don't share those. Granted we have common ground up here with anyone in sharing the ludicrous excuse for a government.

I think you are slowly convincing yourself that you admire the unionist values though as the south has went more secular and this is obviously something you oppose. You seem to miss the fact that the hatred they are pushing on things like homosexuality now is what they pushed for people of "your kind" for years and to be honest at times the mask slips now and they appear still the same in that regard anyway.

[T Fearon]

Respective cultures can be maintained,but the ridiculous aspirations,like full integration with Britain or Irish unity,which are never going to happen and which cause such division,need to be shelved and the promotion of common Northern Irishness needs to be prioritised.

I go back to the core and irrefutable contention that neither London nor Dublin wants the North of Ireland or regards its people as their people.

[Arthur_Friend]

So Irish sovereignty is casually and overwhelmingly conceded all for the sake of peace,that was never guaranteed? Incomprehensible.You could argue then that Hitler shouldn't have been confronted,as this would have avoided WW2.

A statelet in existence for 100 years is bound to develop its own special culture,different and unique to that of neighbouring states.Unique to Northern Irishness (in terms of the UK and rest of Ireland) are things like parading,plain speaking,religious adherence,temperance,no sense of easy going (that you'd see in the South).Throw in things like the GAA,Irish Language,Music etc which are an anathema to most unionists.As far back as the 70s,Gerry Fitt conceded he had far more in common with a Belfast Protestant than he had with a catholic from Dublin or Cork.

Two communities striving in polar opposites,for things that are never going to happen,like 100% integration with Britain or a wholly United Ireland is simply pointless.

So given that parading is from the Orange culture and that the GAA, language and music is from Irish culture, what you are proposing building a unique nationality on is that you think we are uptight, speak more plainly, go to church more and don't drink as much (all debatable). Laughable.

[Arthur_Friend]

You also seem to think that because some people in the Republic don't think (quite rightly) that the Republic could cope economically with unification that people in the north are no longer Irish. Illogical.

[imtommygunn]

Respective cultures can be maintained,but the ridiculous aspirations,like full integration with Britain or Irish unity,which are never going to happen and which cause such division,need to be shelved and the promotion of common Northern Irishness needs to be prioritised.

I go back to the core and irrefutable contention that neither London nor Dublin wants the North of Ireland or regards its people as their people.

I don't disagree with your last statement.

We are a dysfunctional "state" though. Part of not being wanted is due to that.

Until we stop being run by bigots we will continue to be dysfunctional. No one would want a place that wastes money like is wasted here.

Look at the money being wasted on things like sports stadiums (how many million on that maze project) , the money being wasted year on year policing parades, we spend money on court cases to stop "gay blood" being used and the list goes on.

When you looking at running a country objectively and you add ni in money will be drained. Currently why would the uk or rest of Ireland want us?