French Terrorist Attacks

[gallsman]

Newt Gingrich was straight off the mark for turning it into a pro-gun piece of spin.

American conservatives have been gloating all evening. It'd make you sick.

f**k off you piece of shit, they have not been, I for one am distraught.

No conservative enjoys this, if they do they are the scum of the earth and are the vast, and I mean vast minority and hey can go f**k off, tonight is a night to mourn, not say I told you so!

I have had numerous calls and texts from friends who believe in no God, they tell me to a man, and for wemen, that they have not had a single person gloat over what has transpired!

Yet you somehow managed to bring Clinton into this and even blame Obama.

[Tony Baloney]

On one hand I would like to see the gloves come off with these vermin but I know it would only lead to short term gains and long term they would be replaced by something else as their warped ideology won't go away.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

This is all bluster and rhetoric. ISIS has tentacles all over the place now. Affiliate groups in north Africa. What f**king impact will troops on the ground in Syria have if this turns out to be five French citizens, perhaps of Algerian descent? Or Moroccan decent? Or maybe from west Africa? An enormous proportion of French citizens are Muslim - that is a consequence of France's colonial past and is a an unchangeable fact. Mass war in Syria will have no impact on people like that.

Gmac - as pointed out, the Charlie Hebdo attackers were French. They might have been Muslims, but that does not make them any less French. These lads were probably French too. This is nothing to do with immigration.

It very much is an immigration issue. For whatever reason more and more kids of immigrants across Europe are becoming disillusioned with society and are looking for solutions to their multitude of different problems. Radicalism seems to be the go to option as these muppets are easily manipulated. Its also a bit naive to think that the current wave of refugees is 100% free of any potential terrorists

[general_lee]

This is all bluster and rhetoric. ISIS has tentacles all over the place now. Affiliate groups in north Africa. What f**king impact will troops on the ground in Syria have if this turns out to be five French citizens, perhaps of Algerian descent? Or Moroccan decent? Or maybe from west Africa? An enormous proportion of French citizens are Muslim - that is a consequence of France's colonial past and is a an unchangeable fact. Mass war in Syria will have no impact on people like that.

Gmac - as pointed out, the Charlie Hebdo attackers were French. They might have been Muslims, but that does not make them any less French. These lads were probably French too. This is nothing to do with immigration.

It very much is an immigration issue. For whatever reason more and more kids of immigrants across Europe are becoming disillusioned with society and are looking for solutions to their multitude of different problems. Radicalism seems to be the go to option as these muppets are easily manipulated. Its also a bit naive to think that the current wave of refugees is 100% free of any potential terrorists

Really? That's a very simplistic view of things.

[BennyCake]

I find it convenient that now borders will be shut, and at the same time pressure was being put on various European governments to take in refugees. This episode will serve many purposes.

[gallsman]

This is all bluster and rhetoric. ISIS has tentacles all over the place now. Affiliate groups in north Africa. What f**king impact will troops on the ground in Syria have if this turns out to be five French citizens, perhaps of Algerian descent? Or Moroccan decent? Or maybe from west Africa? An enormous proportion of French citizens are Muslim - that is a consequence of France's colonial past and is a an unchangeable fact. Mass war in Syria will have no impact on people like that.

Gmac - as pointed out, the Charlie Hebdo attackers were French. They might have been Muslims, but that does not make them any less French. These lads were probably French too. This is nothing to do with immigration.

It very much is an immigration issue. For whatever reason more and more kids of immigrants across Europe are becoming disillusioned with society and are looking for solutions to their multitude of different problems. Radicalism seems to be the go to option as these muppets are easily manipulated. Its also a bit naive to think that the current wave of refugees is 100% free of any potential terrorists

They, like the Charlie Hebdo attackers, are most likely to be French citizens. They are also most likely descended from people from former French colonies. They are most likely not immigrants. That makes it a domestic issue, not one of immigration.

[charlieTully]

saw this post on facebook, rings true for me. RIP all the victims.

'Awful news from Paris. Let's blame whoever is responsible and not all Muslims. Remember the vast majority of ISIS victims have been Muslims. The people also fighting them on the ground in Syria and Iraq are also Muslims. Let's not tar a whole religion by the actions of some.'

[Sea The Stars]

My thoughts are with those caught up in this atrocity. Call it naive but I'd have thought France's intelligence system would be able to prevent something like this. I mean this isn't a Boston marathon situation with two brothers turned up with a homemade bomb. These guys had serious artillery at their disposal and sounds like they were trained to use it to cause maximum carnage. It targeted specific weak spots at arguably a weak time. It will surely have taken a fair degree of training, planning, communication, access to weapons, etc. When the investigation begins, these guys will have left a trail of evidence behind them. I wonder if they were already under surveillance. Hopefully lessons can be learned.

[muppet]

Only just catching up with this now. Horrific scenes and news pouring in.

It is amazing how many people quickly can quickly point to their own prejudices with justification when something awful like this happens.

I hope Heffo had a safe night and I agree with his comment on post-colonialism. This is a complicated situation bought about by a whole raft of influences going back decades and possibly even centuries. The behaviour of the Europeans in Africa was beyond brutal and disgusting. Then the West's actions, in the Middle East particularly, and various proxy wars between Saudi and Iran, Qatar/Saudi and Syria, the Bush Oil Wars, Afghanistan etc etc. added to poorly educated young men having their heads filled with religious rhetoric and nothing to lose (in their minds) and it doesn't take much to light the fuse.

France has a massive problem to overcome and does Britain. The latter nut jobs will demand a Brexit even more fervently than before. But new immigrants are unlikely to be the problem, because this is not a new problem.

[Milltown Row2]

Why would they have their passports with them? Being reported a Syrian passport found on one of the terrorists .... Like its not like they had planned to get away and you wouldn't necessarily bring that?

[Syferus]

This is all bluster and rhetoric. ISIS has tentacles all over the place now. Affiliate groups in north Africa. What f**king impact will troops on the ground in Syria have if this turns out to be five French citizens, perhaps of Algerian descent? Or Moroccan decent? Or maybe from west Africa? An enormous proportion of French citizens are Muslim - that is a consequence of France's colonial past and is a an unchangeable fact. Mass war in Syria will have no impact on people like that.

Gmac - as pointed out, the Charlie Hebdo attackers were French. They might have been Muslims, but that does not make them any less French. These lads were probably French too. This is nothing to do with immigration.

It very much is an immigration issue. For whatever reason more and more kids of immigrants across Europe are becoming disillusioned with society and are looking for solutions to their multitude of different problems. Radicalism seems to be the go to option as these muppets are easily manipulated. Its also a bit naive to think that the current wave of refugees is 100% free of any potential terrorists

They, like the Charlie Hebdo attackers, are most likely to be French citizens. They are also most likely descended from people from former French colonies. They are most likely not immigrants. That makes it a domestic issue, not one of immigration.

Two Syrian passports and a French passport found for three of the gunman so far according to reports.

[seafoid]

The wests power brokers (banks, oil and and other corporations) have to shoulder the blame for the way the world is turning at the minute.

For decades they have destabilized countless regimes/regions simply because they wanted to play by there own rules rather than the rules of the west (get away from the petro dollar, re-nationalize industries etc) . Of course the 'reason' was always found to make it the decision to do the right thing and remove them from power (always easy to find with brutal dictatorships) and kill hundreds of thousands of innocents in the process (not to say that dictators didnt do the same thing).

The US backing ISIS in their attempt to destabilize Assad 6 or 7 years ago is just another long line of disastrous foreign policy decisions by them and others. The hate and contempt for our western rulers and the lust for vengeance must be off the scale.

Those who were close to conflict up here I'm sure can understand the dynamic of vengeance as an energy source and how that can mask many of the other emotions that make 'good people' do terrible things to others. 

The world is a very ugly place. Its all about securing resources and controlling foreign exchangeof those resources.

It's about standards of living. Being able to pay 4 Euro for a box of Persil not 10 cents for a small container of it. Being able to go on holidays anywhere in the world and be allowed entry with a rich country passport. Tanking up in Ballyhaunis with oil from a repressive state. Afford a car.

The other thing about life on earth is change. Things are always changing. People have grievances and they'll use violence sometimes.
The authorities have to do a better job infiltrating these groups .

[From the Bunker]

Why would they have their passports with them? Being reported a Syrian passport found on one of the terrorists .... Like its not like they had planned to get away and you wouldn't necessarily bring that?

Yeah, was thinking that. They naturally would have decided to blow themselves up. They had no escape route/strategy bar suicide. So why carry one, unless it was a decoy?

[seafoid]

These groups will continue while the fundamentalist, human rights denying theocracy/dictatorship of Saudi Arabia exists and enables them to have moral and other supports.

You reckon? Getting rid of the theocracy/dictatorship in Iraq didn't help much, did it. Trying to get rid of Assad hasn t quite gone to plan either!.
Problem is what replaces the dictators? Getting rid of them just allows the ultra religious to try and impose their interpretation of their prophet on the world. f**k that!

Iraq and Syria were secular States. Their problem was they weren't pro the US.

Interesting to compare India/Pak and the Middle East. India /Pak/Bangladesh was released from colonialism in 2 lots, each with populations in excess of 100m and allowed democracy.

The Middle East, with total population around 50m in 1948 was gerrymandered into 10+ countries. In the Levant, the land was divided into 4 (Jordan, Palestine/Isral, Lebanon and Syria). No democracy anywhere. Iraq was cobbled together purely for the love of oil.

These arrangements were inherently unstable and are now breaking down. The Yanks broke up Iraq and Syria is imploding. the Arab dictators that kept a lid on things so the oil could flow are a dying breed and it is not clear what will replace them.

[BennyCake]

Why would they have their passports with them? Being reported a Syrian passport found on one of the terrorists .... Like its not like they had planned to get away and you wouldn't necessarily bring that?

Yeah, was thinking that. They naturally would have decided to blow themselves up. They had no escape route/strategy bar suicide. So why carry one, unless it was a decoy?

Same thing happened on 9/11. Black box didn't survive, but a paper passport did