Search for New Mayo Manager

[Syferus]

I can't believe that the players have embarked on this course of action without a couple of moves ahead worked out in advance. I'd say that they will next put a gun to the county boards head, threatening to pull out of the squad en masse unless they get new management with guarantees of higher level of preparation/coaching/medical etc. They may not have any say in names but the likes of Rochford might be acceptable to both sides.

Rochford is the obvious choice. With Buckley alongside. Spoke to a couple of the Corofin lads, before they won their all-Ireland, and they said his level of preparation both on themselves and opposition was like nothing they'd ever seen. Seems to be exactly what the Mayo players feel the current setup is lacking.

K-Mac was the obvious choice last year too Shark.

No he wasn't. I know you're excited but he's not proven at senior intercounty level. Neither mgmt team on offer last year stood out

After Horan you needed a man with a plan.  You picked the CB vice-chairman's brother. Hard to make the case that McStay wasn't Mayo's last best hope of winning an AI with this team.

In all honesty I have huge respect for the current Mayo team - easily the second best Connacht side in my lifetime - but I am very happy Mayo scuffed the choice last Autumn and let us get McStay, a man I rate very highly. If we give him time we'll be well placed.

I have to ask - what team do you consider the best? And what age are you (so I know what teams are within your lifetime)?

As Syferus hasn't answered you I'd presume he's at least in his 20s so he's probably talking about Galway....

Mid-20s. Galway obviously the best because they actually won the big one.

[sid waddell]

Ros were missing Diarmuid Murtagh, Senan Kilbride, Cathal Shine and a couple more in Enniskillen....Back to the Mayo Civil War. How long will it take for H/C To step down? The players may have grievances, but imo, the heave has been motivated by a desire to see James Horan back as manager. It's his job, if he wants it.

Perhaps, seeing as nobody is saying anything we don't know. Horan coming back wouldn't be ths answer. His tactical flaws were there for all to see. Second comings don't usually work either.

The majority I can think of have been successful.

Jack O'Connor won an All-Ireland when he came back.
Billy Morgan woke Cork football out of its slumber when he came back.
John Maughan's return was a relative success in that he got a very average Mayo team back to an All-Ireland final.
Kevin Heffernan left the Dublin team for nearly two years between 1976 and 1978 and went on to win another All-Ireland in 1983.
Art McRory has had several spells in charge of Tyrone and achieved success in each.
Eamon Coleman and Brian McEniff both achieved reasonable success when they came back to manage Derry and Donegal respectively.
Jimmy Barry-Murphy overall had a pretty successful return in Cork even if things went off the rails a bit this year.

Other returns, like John O'Mahony, Babs Keating, Cyril Farrell and Michael Bond, have not been a success. In most of those cases the game had simply passed those managers by and they had not evolved their thinking on the game. That would hardly be the case with Horan given that he's only been gone a year.

But there's nothing to say that a returning manager shouldn't have success merely because he's managed a team previously.

[From the Bunker]

Ros were missing Diarmuid Murtagh, Senan Kilbride, Cathal Shine and a couple more in Enniskillen....Back to the Mayo Civil War. How long will it take for H/C To step down? The players may have grievances, but imo, the heave has been motivated by a desire to see James Horan back as manager. It's his job, if he wants it.

Perhaps, seeing as nobody is saying anything we don't know. Horan coming back wouldn't be ths answer. His tactical flaws were there for all to see. Second comings don't usually work either.

The majority I can think of have been successful.

Jack O'Connor won an All-Ireland when he came back.
Billy Morgan woke Cork football out of its slumber when he came back.
John Maughan's return was a relative success in that he got a very average Mayo team back to an All-Ireland final.
Kevin Heffernan left the Dublin team for nearly two years between 1976 and 1978 and went on to win another All-Ireland in 1983.
Art McRory has had several spells in charge of Tyrone and achieved success in each.
Eamon Coleman and Brian McEniff both achieved reasonable success when they came back to manage Derry and Donegal respectively.
Jimmy Barry-Murphy overall had a pretty successful return in Cork even if things went off the rails a bit this year.

Other returns, like John O'Mahony, Babs Keating, Cyril Farrell and Michael Bond, have not been a success. In most of those cases the game had simply passed those managers by and they had not evolved their thinking on the game. That would hardly be the case with Horan given that he's only been gone a year.

But there's nothing to say that a returning manager shouldn't have success merely because he's managed a team previously.

The thing about doing the job the first time is you are full of excitement, energy and focus. These get lost in a second coming. You know the pitfalls and the work ahead. And this can take a lot away from you including being adventurous and daring.

[sid waddell]

Ros were missing Diarmuid Murtagh, Senan Kilbride, Cathal Shine and a couple more in Enniskillen....Back to the Mayo Civil War. How long will it take for H/C To step down? The players may have grievances, but imo, the heave has been motivated by a desire to see James Horan back as manager. It's his job, if he wants it.

Perhaps, seeing as nobody is saying anything we don't know. Horan coming back wouldn't be ths answer. His tactical flaws were there for all to see. Second comings don't usually work either.

The majority I can think of have been successful.

Jack O'Connor won an All-Ireland when he came back.
Billy Morgan woke Cork football out of its slumber when he came back.
John Maughan's return was a relative success in that he got a very average Mayo team back to an All-Ireland final.
Kevin Heffernan left the Dublin team for nearly two years between 1976 and 1978 and went on to win another All-Ireland in 1983.
Art McRory has had several spells in charge of Tyrone and achieved success in each.
Eamon Coleman and Brian McEniff both achieved reasonable success when they came back to manage Derry and Donegal respectively.
Jimmy Barry-Murphy overall had a pretty successful return in Cork even if things went off the rails a bit this year.

Other returns, like John O'Mahony, Babs Keating, Cyril Farrell and Michael Bond, have not been a success. In most of those cases the game had simply passed those managers by and they had not evolved their thinking on the game. That would hardly be the case with Horan given that he's only been gone a year.

But there's nothing to say that a returning manager shouldn't have success merely because he's managed a team previously.

The thing about doing the job the first time is you are full of excitement, energy and focus. These get lost in a second coming. You know the pitfalls and the work ahead. And this can take a lot away from you including being adventurous and daring.

You don't need time away from a job to know that, though. Any manager who has been in a job for two or three years will have that.

[muppet]

Iolair, I am surprised you invited the lunatic fringe by posting this topic on the general board. The 'discussion' has descended into WUMs, lectures from people from other countries telling our players how to behave (pretty much the same thing) and, of course, all things Roscommon.

The number of 'you are ignoring this user' comments on this thread tells me all I need to know about its value.

If there is to be any proper discussion it should be on the Mayo section of the board.

[Shrewdness]

You'd have to presume that the Mayo players thought this through very carefully before making their move.. They would have allowed for the expected consequences of this, and ideally would have agreed on who they DO want to manage them..Failure to have covered all of the above, runs the risk of making the players very foolish..We still don't know what the players' specific problems with H/C are, although i'm sure the Co Board would know after last night. If the players have a replacement manager in mind, it can only be James Horan.. Who else would they have taken this risk for? Horan has had a lot to say for himself in print and radio during the last 12 months. Has anyone read or heard anything from him since last weekend?

[Syferus]

Iolair, I am surprised you invited the lunatic fringe by posting this topic on the general board. The 'discussion' has descended into WUMs, lectures from people from other countries telling our players how to behave (pretty much the same thing) and, of course, all things Roscommon.

The number of 'you are ignoring this user' comments on this thread tells me all I need to know about its value.

If there is to be any proper discussion it should be on the Mayo section of the board.

Yeah.  Kinda did a bad job keeping this one in house.  Don't burn your panties when it's your own precious panel (who are getting almost no blame from Mayo supporters) that have made Mayo the star of the Autumn again.

Posts like the above don't reflect well on you or your county.

[criostlinn]

I have to go with maigheo on this talk about Tom Parsons

Tom Parsons lined out for Mayo in league matches in 2011 and didn't look anything like an inter county footballer. This same year the two O'Shea's and Barry Moran started to really up their game. Jason Gibbons was also knocking about.
In 2014 James Horan went out of his way to bring Parsons back and despite a bad injury early in the league he continued to have him flown home from Wales for training. It was obvious at this stage that Parsons had totally changed his attitude and only for niggly injuries during the year it was clear Horan fancied him. Its a credit to Parsons the way he has developed the last couple of years and it has shown his desire to play for Mayo. James Horan has to be given some credit for facilitating this. 
You can say what you like about tactics and team selection (and everyone is an expert in hindsight) but I cant remember to many complaining about Tom Parsons exclusion in 2012 and 2013

[Mayo4Sam]

I don't see that it has to be Horan at all.
I'm sure the lads have a fair idea of what level they expect a manager to bring and there's a few out there that would fill that.
Looking at it rationally there are three teams that can win next years AI, we are one of them, any manager would be delighted to get a crack at that.
McGuinness, Rochford, McStay, Horan and possibly Jack O'Connor all look like they could bring a level of professionalism that the players expect. McStay is gone from that list.

It's not unreasonable for the players to expect the best and to act when they feel they're not getting it. These lads are giving up everything and should expect that everything is in place to help them achieve it.



I heard this referenced on Second Captains yesterday:

A Chairde – It is some time since we decided that a letter in this strain should be written in an effort to remedy a state of affairs which, in our opinion, is detrimental to football in Mayo. Year after year we have seen the County Board bring to nought the hours of training which we have put in, but yet, believing it was outside our sphere as players, we have desisted from drawing your attention to the matter. Events in Tralee last Sunday have banished our indecision, however, and we feel the time has come when something must be done before football disappears completely in Mayo – unwept, unhonoured and unsung.
Since 1939, Mayo football has struck a very lean patch and only now is it rounding the corner. The displays given by the team against Kildare, Antrim and Kerry show that with a little help and encouragement – along the right lines – the present batch of footballers is in the top line today. And, furthermore, we think we were in the same grade in 1946 when we played the disputed game with Roscommon. The collapse of the replay and the repetition of the debacle in this year's championship we blame on the total indifference of the County Board. For weeks before the championship the Dublin players clamoured for matches with other counties, not for their own sake – they would have too much football in Dublin – but for the sake of the county and with the view of giving the members of the team an opportunity of playing together and of perfecting their combination. But the only matches were (1) against a makeshift Galway team and (2) against Longford when some of the players had prior engagements.
Not only did these matches fail in their primary object, i.e. as a conclusive try-out for the team but they also failed in their secondary object. i.e. as an informative aid to the selectors in making their final choice, for the simple reason that there were very few selectors present at either game. It seems that when a Mayo team is selected the selectors are permitted to depart home and never see the results of their work.
They never go near an intercounty match, either at their own or the Co. Board's expense unless it is played in their own back garden. We ask you if this is the correct attitude to adopt? Can such a selection committee be efficient and/or effective?
Nor has that indifference vanished yet as can be seen from the fact that only one member of the County Board – and the most maligned member at that – travelled to Tralee for the recent League match. Where were the others? Did they think the result of the match a foregone conclusion, or are they solely a "victory" County Board? Perhaps if they had been present the result might have been a foregone conclusion! However, they weren't there, and the Secretary and four players selected, in approximately ten minutes, a team which was not afraid of Kerry, but which went out and justified their confidence in themselves as footballers. They may have missed the sermons and the fatherly advice and the old reminder that they had the confidence (?) of the Co. Board behind them! But the result of the match should answer that query. That the material is there has now been proved, but that it needs better management has likewise been proved.
For instance, what lesson has the County Board learned from the Tralee game? Is it indicative of good management that one member is expected to bring back a full report on the prowess of each player, while the same member, while in Tralee, was meeting Kerry officials, making arrangements about hotel accommodation, meals etc., supplying bandages, elastoplast, and embrocation, presiding at a selection meeting, massaging the team before they went on the field, towelling and rubbing and supplying badly-needed refreshments at half-time, and even then at the team's request togging out as a sub? But more credit to the man in question – he did all that and something more when, in the first quarter he made two match-winning switches, a practice completely foreign to Mayo GAA officials. It is an unselfish efficiency and spirit such as this that a Co. Board wants, and not until this is forthcoming will football again flourish in Mayo.
If we were asked to explain why recent Mayo selections have been unsuccessful we should say that, in the first place, the selection committee is too unwieldy to be effective. The present committee of from sixteen to twenty members should be slashed to approximately five, as big numbers tend to retard progress; secondly, the players don't get sufficient training as a team. Challenge games should (and can easily) be arranged with other counties so that (a) a team could be selected and (b) having been selected, that it could be trained as a unit. Thirdly, we feel that too much time and energy has been spent on petty squabbles existing among officials, but not among the players. We, as representatives of the four divisions within Mayo, ask you to put aside petty jealousies and favouritism, to get together, stay together and pull together, to pick a team, not of "historic" players, nor of "friendly" or "kindred" players, but a team made up of the best 15 players available.
We know you can do it – we not only ask you but we demand you do this and do it here and now. If you do,1948 will be our year. If you don't, then 1948 will echo the remarks heard from 1940 to 1947 – "Beaten again! Mayo, God help us!"



Signed by Padraic Carney, Sean Flanagan, Liam Hastings, Tom Langan and Eamonn Mongey

[Syferus]

McGuiness won't be taking any mangers job in the near term and Jacko is already installed as Kerry U21 manager. Basically Mayo if they're lucky are going back to the well with Horan or hoping Rochford can win them an AI immediately.

Whatever happens the pressure on the players has racketed up even higher, and that's mostly their own doing.

[Tubberman]

Iolair, I am surprised you invited the lunatic fringe by posting this topic on the general board. The 'discussion' has descended into WUMs, lectures from people from other countries telling our players how to behave (pretty much the same thing) and, of course, all things Roscommon.

The number of 'you are ignoring this user' comments on this thread tells me all I need to know about its value.

If there is to be any proper discussion it should be on the Mayo section of the board.

Yeah.  Kinda did a bad job keeping this one in house.  Don't burn your panties when it's your own precious panel (who are getting almost no blame from Mayo supporters) that have made Mayo the star of the Autumn again.

Posts like the above don't reflect well on you or your county.

Not one of your posts reflect well on your county, but by Jesus it doesn't stop you.

[PW Nally]

Iolair, I am surprised you invited the lunatic fringe by posting this topic on the general board. The 'discussion' has descended into WUMs, lectures from people from other countries telling our players how to behave (pretty much the same thing) and, of course, all things Roscommon.

The number of 'you are ignoring this user' comments on this thread tells me all I need to know about its value.

If there is to be any proper discussion it should be on the Mayo section of the board.

Yeah.  Kinda did a bad job keeping this one in house.  Don't burn your panties when it's your own precious panel (who are getting almost no blame from Mayo supporters) that have made Mayo the star of the Autumn again.

Posts like the above don't reflect well on you or your county.

Not one of your posts reflect well on your county, but by Jesus it doesn't stop you.

[Syferus]

Iolair, I am surprised you invited the lunatic fringe by posting this topic on the general board. The 'discussion' has descended into WUMs, lectures from people from other countries telling our players how to behave (pretty much the same thing) and, of course, all things Roscommon.

The number of 'you are ignoring this user' comments on this thread tells me all I need to know about its value.

If there is to be any proper discussion it should be on the Mayo section of the board.

Yeah.  Kinda did a bad job keeping this one in house.  Don't burn your panties when it's your own precious panel (who are getting almost no blame from Mayo supporters) that have made Mayo the star of the Autumn again.

Posts like the above don't reflect well on you or your county.

Not one of your posts reflect well on your county, but by Jesus it doesn't stop you.

Nice.

[Mayo4Sam]

McGuiness won't be taking any mangers job in the near term and Jacko is already installed as Kerry U21 manager. Basically Mayo if they're lucky are going back to the well with Horan or hoping Rochford can win them an AI immediately.

Whatever happens the pressure on the players has racketed up even higher, and that's mostly their own doing.

Such nonsense, there's pressure on them as a top three team, end of story, maximum pressure if you like. There has been the last four years.

[criostlinn]

I don't see that it has to be Horan at all.
I'm sure the lads have a fair idea of what level they expect a manager to bring and there's a few out there that would fill that.
Looking at it rationally there are three teams that can win next years AI, we are one of them, any manager would be delighted to get a crack at that.
McGuinness, Rochford, McStay, Horan and possibly Jack O'Connor all look like they could bring a level of professionalism that the players expect. McStay is gone from that list.

Realistically so its James Horan or Stephen Rochford
Not a chance of McGuinness coming over to manage Mayo and if he did how much commitment could he give to it. O'Connor has taken the U21 job in Kerry so again not going to happen.

Rochford has won a club title with Corofin and according to the Rossies this is the be all and end all to managerial success but would he really want to take it in the middle of all this mess.  He has no intercounty experience and wont be given time to figure it out like James Horan was in 2011