Irish among dead in balcony collapse

[snoopdog]

I read somewhere this morning that not all those that fell were on the Balcony. May have been trying to help those in trouble and were taken with it. not sure how true this is but seen Independant. ie quoted beside it.

God love them all, spent summers in America suring my college years and as others say they were care free and all about the craic.
May the rest in Peace.

[muppet]

Neighbour and colleague driving his mum to Dublin airport now. They believe his cousin - her niece - is among the dead. Flying over to support. God help the injured and the families of the dead and injured.

Jesus imagine getting that call.

RIP to all the deceased and fingers crossed for the injured.

The rest of us should be marching on THE STAR to politely ask them to leave this island. Scum.

[Walter Cronc]

Neighbour and colleague driving his mum to Dublin airport now. They believe his cousin - her niece - is among the dead. Flying over to support. God help the injured and the families of the dead and injured.

Jesus imagine getting that call.

RIP to all the deceased and fingers crossed for the injured.

The rest of us should be marching on THE STAR to politely ask them to leave this island. Scum.

What did they post?

The NY Times posted a rather derogatory article as well which is very unlike them.

[ballinaman]

Neighbour and colleague driving his mum to Dublin airport now. They believe his cousin - her niece - is among the dead. Flying over to support. God help the injured and the families of the dead and injured.

Jesus imagine getting that call.

RIP to all the deceased and fingers crossed for the injured.

The rest of us should be marching on THE STAR to politely ask them to leave this island. Scum.

The examiner published the same picture.

[moysider]

Some of the NYT article;


"They come by the thousands — Irish students on work visas, many flocking to the West Coast to work in summer jobs by day and to enjoy the often raucous life in a college town at night.

"It was, for many, a rite of passage, one last summer to enjoy travel abroad before beginning a career."

"...the work-visa program that allowed for the exchanges has in recent years become not just a source of aspiration, but also a source of embarrassment for Ireland, marked by a series of high-profile episodes involving drunken partying and the wrecking of apartments in places like San Francisco and Santa Barbara."




     

[screenexile]

Some of the NYT article;


"They come by the thousands — Irish students on work visas, many flocking to the West Coast to work in summer jobs by day and to enjoy the often raucous life in a college town at night.

"It was, for many, a rite of passage, one last summer to enjoy travel abroad before beginning a career."

"...the work-visa program that allowed for the exchanges has in recent years become not just a source of aspiration, but also a source of embarrassment for Ireland, marked by a series of high-profile episodes involving drunken partying and the wrecking of apartments in places like San Francisco and Santa Barbara."




   

That's disgusting... why do they feel the need to print something like that when so many young people have just died?!

[muppet]

Neighbour and colleague driving his mum to Dublin airport now. They believe his cousin - her niece - is among the dead. Flying over to support. God help the injured and the families of the dead and injured.

Jesus imagine getting that call.

RIP to all the deceased and fingers crossed for the injured.

The rest of us should be marching on THE STAR to politely ask them to leave this island. Scum.

The examiner published the same picture.

Well the same sentiment goes to them too.

WTF is wrong with these people?

[doodaa]

I spent 3hrs yesterday trying to get in touch with my brother who is over in San Francisco on holiday with his mates, similar age to those that were involved. Thankfully he was just in bed fast asleep and didn't hear any of the numerous calls to his mobile and completely oblivious to what had happened.

That was the longest 3hrs of my life. 

RIP
Condolences to the family and friends and best wishes to the injured.

[The Iceman]

I'm watching two house's being built in the field beside us here these past few months. There is nothing to houses in America, nothing to construction. All chip board and weatherproof fabric and some cement board siding if you're lucky. Minimal code is enforced. They sit exposed to the elements for months before they are finished and we all live in them unsuspecting of the damage that lies behind the walls and under our feet.
These poor young ones paid the ultimate price. I can't imagine the brief torment they went through as it happened. God bless them all.

[Eamonnca1]

I was a bit taken aback by the NYT article myself. Couldn't believe what I was reading.

[highorlow]

There is nothing to houses in America, nothing to construction. All chip board and weatherproof fabric and some cement board siding if you're lucky.

Yes, looks like this apartment block was a timber frame structure. From the 'before' images the balcony didn't appear to have any surface water outlets. Looks like it was a combination of bad waterproofing initially, added to likely surface water ponding, added to a not fit for purpose design loading. The joists look so bad from the photo's it was only another while before it would have collapsed under it's own weight. Pity it didn't.

[J70]

I'm watching two house's being built in the field beside us here these past few months. There is nothing to houses in America, nothing to construction. All chip board and weatherproof fabric and some cement board siding if you're lucky. Minimal code is enforced. They sit exposed to the elements for months before they are finished and we all live in them unsuspecting of the damage that lies behind the walls and under our feet.
These poor young ones paid the ultimate price. I can't imagine the brief torment they went through as it happened. God bless them all.

Less than two seconds to hit the ground from that height. They were down before they even realized what happened.  At least that is one minor source of comfort. Especially if that thing collapsed very suddenly.

[omaghjoe]

Still can't get over this.

I was reading that Berkeley building code states that the Balcony should have been able to hold 60lbs per sq foot recently upgraded to 100lbs. So it was a 10ft x 5ft balcony leaving it 50sqft. Should have been able to hold 3000lbs according to the old code. Assuming there was 13 people on it @ 150lbs each on average means that would only be 2000lbs only 2/3 of the designed load. Assuming that is was designed and built to withstand this loading you have to assume something else went wrong.

Still can't understand why steel isnt used. It gives a warning of water damage (rust), lets you know when its bearing to much load (flex), and when it does fail doesn't completely give way (yield point v fracture point). But perhaps it might not be practical to attach to a wooden structure, I'm not sure.

Also Iceman is right the houses here are rubbishly made. I thought in California it was necessary to have timber frame houses because of their flexibility in earthquakes however evidently they are the same everywhere.

[cuconnacht]

Just some posts trimmed from NY Times `valid complaints on balcony story section,that may  shed a bit of light for board users.


formertenant
Berkeley 46 minutes ago
I lived in this apartment last year. Not just the building. The exact apartment where this tragedy occurred. The original article by the Times was appalling and this apology is a start but not enough. The building and that balcony specifically were very poorly maintained. The balcony was notably slanted and management should have done something about it.

Whether there were 13 people on it or not the balcony shouldn't have collapsed. It's also likely that a number of those 13 weren't actually standing on the balcony itself but in the adjoining living room and were pulled down as they tried to save the falling people as there's no separation between the balcony and the living room


pragmat
California 12 minutes ago
I am a Berkeley professor, and cry whenever I think of those students and their families. We expect death when our children go to war, not when they go to study. Balconies should be supported by steel beams, not by wood. It is ironic that in our drought a very young building was riddled with dry rot. Both the builders who used wood and the inspectors are at fault. There are no warnings on balconies, since we trust builders and inspectors. Marge Keller is right

John Berard
Aurora. Oregon 10 minutes ago
If the writer and editor had checked, they would found that balconies in Berkeley collapse with scandalous frequency, no matter who is on them. How about investigating that aspect of the story?

Kathy
San Francisco 8 minutes ago
Whether ther people on the balcony were drinking tea or Guinness has nothing to do with the fact that the beams were rotten from water damage. "Darrick Hom, president of the Structural Engineers Association of Northern California, visited the site and said the wood was so decayed that the broken beams crumbled in the hands of investigators." Frankly I am shocked that a 50 sq foot balcony would not require steel beams for support, espeically in an area prone to termite damage. Terrible tragedy and not the time for insensitive, irrelevant commentary




tartar
san francisco 11 hours ago
As a design professional, I immediately noticed that there was something strange about the failure of those joists in the picture. I believe this story will come out soon enough--regardless that the deck was probably overloaded--it should have still held.

I live near Berkeley, and was down there yesterday where there were many people milling around, many crying students and folks who knew these kids, trying to make sense of this accident. I don't think there's any way to convey how big this was, and the tragedy of it. I appreciate the NY Times stepping up to admit to a blindspot in their reporting


Muppet,have  you got a link to the original pile of calumny,can only find the re-edit and the "heartfelt apology to three wasp journos/editors by the wheeled out biddy " for having a dumb readership unable to grasp the progression of a news report.

[screenexile]

They haven't even taken the article down yet . . .

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/17/us/balcony-collapse-berkeley-dead.html?_r=0