The should-we-or-shouldn't-we have a border poll thread

[T Fearon]

I actually think there are quite a few,but whenever they try to reach out they are challenged by the hard liners and have to revert to tribalism

[Maguire01]

The really relevant question here is why the British Government let the whole of Scotland decide by means of a vote,whether or not they wish to maintain the union,but has never allowed the whole of Ireland the same basic democratic right,and worse than that,no politician North or South has pointed out this anomaly.

Well the people of Ireland voted for the GFA, which sets out the basis for such a referendum. The people of Scotland only got their vote when the SNP got a majority in their devolved assembly - the same will happen here if the combined SF/SDLP vote gets a majority at Stormont. Without such a scenario, there's absolutely no point in holding a referendum - it's a waste of everyone's time.

[Farrandeelin]

Isn't it up to the Northern Secretary of State to decide on when to hold a Border Poll? Why their discretion if so?

[Maguire01]

Isn't it up to the Northern Secretary of State to decide on when to hold a Border Poll? Why their discretion if so?

Yes, it is. Because that's what the parties negotiated and agreed to and the electorate signed up to in the GFA.

[Farrandeelin]

Isn't it up to the Northern Secretary of State to decide on when to hold a Border Poll? Why their discretion if so?

Yes, it is. Because that's what the parties negotiated and agreed to and the electorate signed up to in the GFA.

So the Nationalists may be waiting for a very long time (depending on the outlook of the Sec. of State)?

[thewobbler]

Isn't it up to the Northern Secretary of State to decide on when to hold a Border Poll? Why their discretion if so?

Yes, it is. Because that's what the parties negotiated and agreed to and the electorate signed up to in the GFA.

So the Nationalists may be waiting for a very long time (depending on the outlook of the Sec. of State)?

As long as he waits until such times as it's not a complete waste of time that unnecessarily raises tensions in our communities, then we are all the better for it too.

[Maguire01]

Isn't it up to the Northern Secretary of State to decide on when to hold a Border Poll? Why their discretion if so?

Yes, it is. Because that's what the parties negotiated and agreed to and the electorate signed up to in the GFA.

So the Nationalists may be waiting for a very long time (depending on the outlook of the Sec. of State)?

Until the Nationalist vote hits 50%. But what's the point in pushing for one before that point anyway?

[OakleafCounty]

No point until there's a nationalist majority in Stormont. I also think we need another generatin of peace. To be blunt I think we need the whole troubles generation to die off.

[seafoid]

Is anything being planned up north for the 100th anniversary of 1916 ? The 50th anniversary was when Paisley got one of his first breaks.

[stibhan]

A poll showing the population of the six counties is as divided as the people of Scotland (which we all know they are) would force significant change with the pressure all on unionism to modernise and act on behalf of everyone not just their own tribe

Unionism is a total mess at the moment. They lose so many talented young graduates and are left with the rest. Is there even 1 decent unionist politician ?

Decent Unionist: an oxymoron if ever I heard one.

[balladmaker]

Let's have a border poll, if only to kick start the process of having one every 7 years, as per the GFA.  At least, every 7 years we will see a progress report or otherwise as to where we stand in relation to the demand for a reunited Ireland.

[Applesisapples]

The Scottish Referendum and the promises made by the Brits has changed forever the shape of the Union. I mentioned in another thread an article last week in the Irish News by Newton Emerson illustrated how a UI would stack up financially. Anyone who believes for a moment that English tax payers are going to continue to pay for the public sector in NI needs their head examined. All the jobs that were created here in the troubles because we were a basket case will not be funded indefinitely. The out working of the granting of further powers to Scotland will mean that English MP's only will get to decide on these matters. The financial subvention will also be reduced as the Barnett formula is rejigged.

As for our Nationalist Parties, of which there are 3 including FF they need to start working out what an AI will look like. How it will accomodate a minority Unionist population, how it will be funded, how it will retain links with GB and reflect Britishness which is important to a sizeable number on this Island. A poll is necessary to give them a base from which to work. But it will be difficult to get a Unionist Secretary of State to call one. And that does not even touch on the work required to get people in the South to say yes.

[muppet]

The Scottish Referendum and the promises made by the Brits has changed forever the shape of the Union. I mentioned in another thread an article last week in the Irish News by Newton Emerson illustrated how a UI would stack up financially. Anyone who believes for a moment that English tax payers are going to continue to pay for the public sector in NI needs their head examined. All the jobs that were created here in the troubles because we were a basket case will not be funded indefinitely. The out working of the granting of further powers to Scotland will mean that English MP's only will get to decide on these matters. The financial subvention will also be reduced as the Barnett formula is rejigged.

As for our Nationalist Parties, of which there are 3 including FF they need to start working out what an AI will look like. How it will accomodate a minority Unionist population, how it will be funded, how it will retain links with GB and reflect Britishness which is important to a sizeable number on this Island. A poll is necessary to give them a base from which to work. But it will be difficult to get a Unionist Secretary of State to call one. And that does not even touch on the work required to get people in the South to say yes.

No work required. Just hide Fearon for a few months.

[yellowcard]

The Scottish Referendum and the promises made by the Brits has changed forever the shape of the Union. I mentioned in another thread an article last week in the Irish News by Newton Emerson illustrated how a UI would stack up financially. Anyone who believes for a moment that English tax payers are going to continue to pay for the public sector in NI needs their head examined. All the jobs that were created here in the troubles because we were a basket case will not be funded indefinitely. The out working of the granting of further powers to Scotland will mean that English MP's only will get to decide on these matters. The financial subvention will also be reduced as the Barnett formula is rejigged.

As for our Nationalist Parties, of which there are 3 including FF they need to start working out what an AI will look like. How it will accomodate a minority Unionist population, how it will be funded, how it will retain links with GB and reflect Britishness which is important to a sizeable number on this Island. A poll is necessary to give them a base from which to work. But it will be difficult to get a Unionist Secretary of State to call one. And that does not even touch on the work required to get people in the South to say yes.

Good post. There is a definite opening for the party that sets out an economically viable strategy to sell the general public the feasibility of the reunification of the country. I think Sinn Fein have begun this strategy a good number of years ago and if they can attract fresh thinking strategist and gain power in the south in the next decade I reckon the referendum will take place within the next 15-20 years.

[dec]

Let's have a border poll, if only to kick start the process of having one every 7 years, as per the GFA.  At least, every 7 years we will see a progress report or otherwise as to where we stand in relation to the demand for a reunited Ireland.

There is no requirement in the GFA to have a poll every 7 years. 7 years is the minimum gap between polls. It could be much longer between polls.