Down Club Hurling & Football

[Pangurban]

Thanks Leo for explanation re. Pairc Esler

[Maiden1]

I think the amalgamation for the championship is a great idea.  Look at Kerry which has the divisional teams entering the senior championship, it hasn't done them any harm.  It is easier to see someone who is a good player in division 3 play at a better level than they are used to and if they can have a good game against Mayobridge or whoever it is a good indicator they could cut it with down.  It gives the down management a better look at a player than they would get from a couple of challenge games.

[dundrumite]

DF term "gather ups" pretty much sums up to me the crux of why I see this idea to be a waste of time. How can a team made up of lads from a few different teams expect to get even close to a senior team? A team who will be training together week in week out, working on systems of play and playing upwards of 25 games together a season. Take this in contrast to a team with no continuity, no identity, who are used to playing in games at a much lower intensity.

This idea of "hidden" or even "rough gems" in the lower divisions is a fictional idea. Again as DF said if your at county standard playing in the lower divisions, you will stand out like a porn star at a knitting club.

In addition when do you propose the time to run off such a championship? As it is our season is running well into Mid November.

It may be a novel idea for junior players to play senior championship but I see no sustainability in the proposal. Perhaps if it goes through I may be proved wrong, however, I would be very doubtful.

[rosskarr]

DF term "gather ups" pretty much sums up to me the crux of why I see this idea to be a waste of time. How can a team made up of lads from a few different teams expect to get even close to a senior team? A team who will be training together week in week out, working on systems of play and playing upwards of 25 games together a season. Take this in contrast to a team with no continuity, no identity, who are used to playing in games at a much lower intensity.

This idea of "hidden" or even "rough gems" in the lower divisions is a fictional idea. Again as DF said if your at county standard playing in the lower divisions, you will stand out like a porn star at a knitting club.

In addition when do you propose the time to run off such a championship? As it is our season is running well into Mid November.

It may be a novel idea for junior players to play senior championship but I see no sustainability in the proposal. Perhaps if it goes through I may be proved wrong, however, I would be very doubtful.

     Well you could find yourself in the not too distant future playing alongside your neighbours in Ballykinlar if the underage teams is anything to go by but I doubt if it'll be in the Senior Championship.Never say never!--the world has changed-there are fewer children per couple-no end in sight for the recession,the dwindling numbers of volunteers to Coach underage and the threat of emigration. Sad but becoming very true.

[dundrumite]

DF term "gather ups" pretty much sums up to me the crux of why I see this idea to be a waste of time. How can a team made up of lads from a few different teams expect to get even close to a senior team? A team who will be training together week in week out, working on systems of play and playing upwards of 25 games together a season. Take this in contrast to a team with no continuity, no identity, who are used to playing in games at a much lower intensity.

This idea of "hidden" or even "rough gems" in the lower divisions is a fictional idea. Again as DF said if your at county standard playing in the lower divisions, you will stand out like a porn star at a knitting club.

In addition when do you propose the time to run off such a championship? As it is our season is running well into Mid November.

It may be a novel idea for junior players to play senior championship but I see no sustainability in the proposal. Perhaps if it goes through I may be proved wrong, however, I would be very doubtful.

     Well you could find yourself in the not too distant future playing alongside your neighbours in Ballykinlar if the underage teams is anything to go by but I doubt if it'll be in the Senior Championship.Never say never!--the world has changed-there are fewer children per couple-no end in sight for the recession,the dwindling numbers of volunteers to Coach underage and the threat of emigration. Sad but becoming very true.

Sorry Ross you have me confused here. What does your point have to do with the merits of amalgmated division 3 and 4 teams playing in the Senior championship?

From our own clubs point of view, your a good bit off the mark.

Jaysus man its christmas, lets have the glass half full (for the next week or so anyway). 

[east down gael]

personally i think it would be a great idea.giving guys a chance to play senior football who might otherwise never get such an opportunity.if it didn't work out it could be dropped,no harm done.

[6th sam]

personally i think it would be a great idea.giving guys a chance to play senior football who might otherwise never get such an opportunity.if it didn't work out it could be dropped,no harm done.

Yes,an idea worth trying ,but the logistics would have to be worked out-the main difficulty being that if such a district team were to be successful against well-organised stand alone clubs,those clubs are bound to be annoyed.DF makes good points,and to back up his concerns,there is already a precedent set whereby in Hurling the Down "junior" team has played in the Down SHC every year.Judging by the scores conceded,there appears to be a "gather-up" approach,resulting in a meaningless fixture,as opposed to well-organised competitive district teams,as appears to happen in the Kerry and Cork football championships.

[Bacon]

THere used to be a Barony League in Down yeatrs ago. It was played at the start of the season and was used as a trial for the County. 4 teams were picked from clubs in Mourne, Iveagh, Lecale and somewhere else and they played each other.

It's worth trying again as long as playing in the SFC doesn't prevent a lad playing JFC for his club.

[Dannymcfella]

Think this idea of having Intermediate and Junior teams amalgamate to play in the senior championship is a feed of sh*te! My own club 'played' (i use that term loosely) in the Senior championship last year for the first time, if this rule had of been in place we could have came up against a Ballymartin/Glassdrumman amalgamated side both of which beat us last year in league games, farsical. People say it gives players the chance to play in the Senior championship, thats like saying we might as well give everyone the chance to represent their county. Teams and players should concentrate on their own grade and winning their own championship rather than phoning up their neighbours for a kick about in the senior championship. To be honest I wouldn't want to play in it as an amalgamated side as the right to play in the senior championship should be earned, why take away the incentive for teams to better themselves by giving them this option

[Bacon]

Amalgamations work in the Kerry Championship but WTF would they know about football?

[johnneycool]

Amalgamations work in the Kerry Championship but WTF would they know about football?

Don't Kerry have a club championship running alongside their county championship?

If I'm correct, the amalgamations play in the county championship and if one wins it (which happens quite regularily) then its the club champions who go on to represent Kerry in the Munster club. If a club wins the county championship then they go onto represent Kerry irrespective if another club wins the club championship.

Clear as mud, but why wouldn't it work in Down?

[dundrumite]

Amalgamations work in the Kerry Championship but WTF would they know about football?

Don't Kerry have a club championship running alongside their county championship?

If I'm correct, the amalgamations play in the county championship and if one wins it (which happens quite regularily) then its the club champions who go on to represent Kerry in the Munster club. If a club wins the county championship then they go onto represent Kerry irrespective if another club wins the club championship.

Clear as mud, but why wouldn't it work in Down?

So how are the club champions to represent Kerry in Munster decided if it is an amalgamated team that wins it? How are the amalgamated teams decided in Kerry? I find the Kerry Championship system to resemble the AFL play offs in terms of confusion.
As far as I am aware, however, I may be wrong, is that the Down proposal is aimed at amalgamating two division 3 and a division 4 team (why no involvement of division 2 teams, I ain't so sure.) Can anyone clarify that point?
If it is such a good system how come only two out of the thirty two counties in Ireland have bought into it?

[dundrumite]

Amalgamations work in the Kerry Championship but WTF would they know about football?

Don't Kerry have a club championship running alongside their county championship?

If I'm correct, the amalgamations play in the county championship and if one wins it (which happens quite regularily) then its the club champions who go on to represent Kerry in the Munster club. If a club wins the county championship then they go onto represent Kerry irrespective if another club wins the club championship.

Clear as mud, but why wouldn't it work in Down?

So how are the club champions to represent Kerry in Munster decided if it is an amalgamated team that wins it? How are the amalgamated teams decided in Kerry? I find the Kerry Championship system to resemble the AFL play offs in terms of confusion.
As far as I am aware, however, I may be wrong, is that the Down proposal is aimed at amalgamating two division 3 and a division 4 team (why no involvement of division 2 teams, I ain't so sure.) Can anyone clarify that point?
If it is such a good system how come only two out of the thirty two counties in Ireland have bought into it?

Just re read your post JC. Two championships, if club team wins championship A (which club and amalgmated teams compete in) then they represent Kerr in Munster. However if it is an amalgamated teams that wins that then the winner of championship B (clubs only) that represents Kerry? Would that reading of it be correct?

[Lecale2]

I think that's correct. I'd say it works in Kerry because it's a long tradition and young lads from Junior clubs grow up wanting to play for East Kerry etc.  In i quess Down lads from Saul, Kilclief, Ardglass or Bright won't really want to play together as Lecale. Can you imagine the rows over selection?

[angermanagement]

Amalgamations work in the Kerry Championship but WTF would they know about football?

Don't Kerry have a club championship running alongside their county championship?

If I'm correct, the amalgamations play in the county championship and if one wins it (which happens quite regularily) then its the club champions who go on to represent Kerry in the Munster club. If a club wins the county championship then they go onto represent Kerry irrespective if another club wins the club championship.

Clear as mud, but why wouldn't it work in Down?

So how are the club champions to represent Kerry in Munster decided if it is an amalgamated team that wins it? How are the amalgamated teams decided in Kerry? I find the Kerry Championship system to resemble the AFL play offs in terms of confusion.
As far as I am aware, however, I may be wrong, is that the Down proposal is aimed at amalgamating two division 3 and a division 4 team (why no involvement of division 2 teams, I ain't so sure.) Can anyone clarify that point?
If it is such a good system how come only two out of the thirty two counties in Ireland have bought into it?

Just re read your post JC. Two championships, if club team wins championship A (which club and amalgmated teams compete in) then they represent Kerr in Munster. However if it is an amalgamated teams that wins that then the winner of championship B (clubs only) that represents Kerry? Would that reading of it be correct?

As far as I was aware there is only one senior championship in Kerry, if an amalgamated team wins it the county board pick their Munster representatives and on some occasions their representatives have been picked before the semi finals like this season when South Kerry won the championship who beat a club side in Dr Crokes in the final but it was Austin Stacks who played in Munster even though they were beat in the semi final.