Down Club Hurling & Football

[Lecale2]

First of Congrats to tipp on a deserved win. Tonight provided further evidence, if needed, of the total unsuitability of Ross and DJ for management of a county football team. Rather than try to play the Down style of football, which players are used to week in and week out, they opt to play the Tyrone style badly. A few individuals kept Down in the game tonight, Gordon,Hughes and Ireland in particular, but as a team they were disorganised and clueless. The shot choices were Juvenile, and that is being kind. Two points were conceded by players playing the Ball across their own goal when it was totally unnecessary.  Apart from roaring contradictory instructions from the sideline, and keeping them in HT, for five minutes longer than permitted, thus incurring a fine, Ross and DJs only contribution was comedy. I still believe this squad has potential, but they will never realise it while Ross and DJ remain in charge. Expect an early exit from championship

What he said.

[Trevor Hill]

i would say joe ireland is disapointed to have been taken off after being introduced. i thought he was winning some decent ball and was performing alright when he was called ashore.

Joe took a heavy knock and should have been replaced at half time in extra time. He had been doing well up until then, but he slowed noticeably after the knock.

Like a lot of posters, I don't like slagging off amateurs who give up so much in the interests of Down football, but a lot of the current squad simply don't have the appetite for the modern game and the management don't seem to have a game plan for those that do. Nothing has changed in Down over the last decade, we are still making the same simple mistakes and playing the same brand of football that does not suit our players. Albert Einstein famously said that insanity was doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results, someone on the county board should be made aware of this.
An idiot behind me at the game yesterday was calling for Ross and DJ to go and Pete McGrath to take over again, this is not the answer either, though it would be a distinct improvement as I don't think a man can serve 2 masters. What I think we need is a fresh approach, someone with no prejudice against certain players or clubs and someone who cannot be accused of favouritism towards others (sons included). What we need is an established outsider. A Micko, a Paidi, a Big Joe or anyone with big game experience. We were all quick to call for PORs head on a plate after Sligo, but this current league campaign has at times been worse than Sligo. The first half in Limerick was the worst I have seen in over 30 years of following Down. IF Club Down are to spend their money wisely they cold do worse than provide the funds for expenses for an experienced manager

[Mid Down Gael]

Yesterday yet again proved our county management are a joke. why pick tubes to play for county when there is far better players within the clubs. Good job its only Fermanagh in the championship. Downs style off play this year is not pretty to watch.

[behind the wire]

thanks Trevor Hill, i didnt realise joe was injured when he went off.

[guevara]

Down kicked themselves out of the game.
Yes Hughes wins a lot of ball. Butwhats the point in having posession if you continually kick bad wides & play suicide passes?
Too many of the so called stars of the team are untouchable. You cant say one bad word about them or everyone throws the toys out of the pram.
In my opinion Aidan Carr was very poor, Hughes wants to do his own thing & there are too many passengers at the minute.
John Boyle was steady enough a CHF & some of the things said on here are a disgrace. Hes no Greg Blaney but he was by no means Downs worst player yesterday...........I think more of the senior players need to stand up & be counted in these big games as oppossed to being happy enough to tag along!

[mournerambler]

Down kicked themselves out of the game.
Yes Hughes wins a lot of ball. Butwhats the point in having posession if you continually kick bad wides & play suicide passes?
Too many of the so called stars of the team are untouchable. You cant say one bad word about them or everyone throws the toys out of the pram.
In my opinion Aidan Carr was very poor, Hughes wants to do his own thing & there are too many passengers at the minute.
John Boyle was steady enough a CHF & some of the things said on here are a disgrace. Hes no Greg Blaney but he was by no means Downs worst player yesterday...........I think more of the senior players need to stand up & be counted in these big games as oppossed to being happy enough to tag along!

You really need to take the Warrenpoint tinted glasses off guevara, the fact is your club mate was poor & not only yesterday.
I don't have an axe to grind with you or Warrenpoint but feel that questions should be asked as to why he continues to be included on the County panel, also some of the things you posted about other players in the past may fall into the same category you are referring to about John Boyle, i've gave one example below regarding Cathal Magee.
GAA Discussion / Local GAA Discussion / Re: Down Club Hurling & Football  on: January 23, 2009, 08:43:36 PM 
Totally agree Lynch is being made a scapegoat for other players shortcomings!!
He isn't the best on the ball but he seems to know that. If there is a 5 yard pass on he gives it but too many times last night he wasn't given any options.
Ireland went AWOL. For guy a lot of people on this board were talking up as next big thing he done nothing, was happy to kick his usual early point then dissapeared.
We are a one trick pony & everyone in the country has copped on. Get it lump it in on top of Benny & pray for a goal!!
Why give high ball when he was devastating against Tyrone with good low ball in space that allowed him to turn & take on the man?
To many of our "seasoned performers" simply didn't show up last night. McKernan, Carr, Sexton, Kearney all brutal!

Also think Cathal Magee proved last night he's definitely not good enough. Dropped ball constantly, fumbled passes & missed several chances.
Would Ronan Murtagh not be an option at 14?? Maybe Wobbler could correct me but is that not were he is best at club level?
Carr seems to be grooming him at 11 but I honestly don't think he's the answer there.

[thewobbler]

why pick tubes to play for county when there is far better players within the clubs.

I can't wait to see the list of players you would bring in. Mickey Walsh is the obvious one, but let's not pretend that Walsh didn't regularly have games as bad as anyone had yesterday when he was a Down regular. Ross and DJ's squad isn't far off the mark at all.

Downs style off play this year is not pretty to watch.

If the last 15 years have taught us anything, it's that Down's free-flowing style of football is never going to win anything - and just as importantly leaves us wide open for a hiding from a well-organised, tactically aware team. Whether Ross and DJ are the right men to implement a more disciplined system is questionable, but i for one am delighted that they at least have recognised the need for change - something their predecessors shunned away from.



To be honest though, there is some amount of shte being talked all the way above. Please put the match in its proper context:

1. The outcome of the game didn't matter, not not bit. Winning a division 3 title or getting promoted from division 3 - it's the same thing. Nobody cares.
2. The under-21s plus a number of key senior players were missing.
3. A number of players picked up knocks and/or were removed from action with the now defunct yellow card ruling.
4. What a tactically inept Tipperary team throw against us is no preparation for what is coming against Fermanagh. The standard in terms of talent isn't going to be much different, but O'Rourke's men will be thinking a whole different ball game.
5. It was a crap Saturday evening in front of a crowd of maybe 300 people.
6. If Down are going experiment with players and tactics, better now than in May and June.

[Mid Down Gael]

why pick tubes to play for county when there is far better players within the clubs.

I can't wait to see the list of players you would bring in. Mickey Walsh is the obvious one, but let's not pretend that Walsh didn't regularly have games as bad as anyone had yesterday when he was a Down regular. Ross and DJ's squad isn't far off the mark at all.

Downs style off play this year is not pretty to watch.

If the last 15 years have taught us anything, it's that Down's free-flowing style of football is never going to win anything - and just as importantly leaves us wide open for a hiding from a well-organised, tactically aware team. Whether Ross and DJ are the right men to implement a more disciplined system is questionable, but i for one am delighted that they at least have recognised the need for change - something their predecessors shunned away from.



To be honest though, there is some amount of shte being talked all the way above. Please put the match in its proper context:

1. The outcome of the game didn't matter, not not bit. Winning a division 3 title or getting promoted from division 3 - it's the same thing. Nobody cares.
2. The under-21s plus a number of key senior players were missing.
3. A number of players picked up knocks and/or were removed from action with the now defunct yellow card ruling.
4. What a tactically inept Tipperary team throw against us is no preparation for what is coming against Fermanagh. The standard in terms of talent isn't going to be much different, but O'Rourke's men will be thinking a whole different ball game.
5. It was a crap Saturday evening in front of a crowd of maybe 300 people.
6. If Down are going experiment with players and tactics, better now than in May and June.

We lost to Tipperary. A hurling county. If Michael Walsh, John Clarke, James Colgan, Mark Poland, James McGovern, Conor Laverty and Sean Parr are not better than a lot off players on squad then i dont understand. I dont want to slate individuals on panel but many have proved time and time again that they simply arent good enough.

[centre 3/4s]

Who was the Down No.11 he was magnificient?  Without doubt the best centre-forward from Greg Blaney.

This is a wind-up isn't it?
Or has it been posted by Mrs Boyle?
If it is a serious post then either the observer needs treatment urgently - or we all do.


Sounds like Mrs Boyle to me to be honest? Even mentioning Greg Blaneys name in the same context really Mrs Boyle!!

[thewobbler]

Michael Walsh, John Clarke, James Colgan, Mark Poland, James McGovern, Conor Laverty and Sean Parr

They're all very useful players, but at the same time there aren't too many people who would would have the latter five anywhere near the Championship XV. Walsh has generally been disappointing for Down, while Clarke was disappointing in last year's Championship after an excellent league campaign.

Bringing those 7 in wouldn't turn this Down team around.

[Mid Down Gael]

Michael Walsh, John Clarke, James Colgan, Mark Poland, James McGovern, Conor Laverty and Sean Parr

They're all very useful players, but at the same time there aren't too many people who would would have the latter five anywhere near the Championship XV. Walsh has generally been disappointing for Down, while Clarke was disappointing in last year's Championship after an excellent league campaign.

Bringing those 7 in wouldn't turn this Down team around.

Thats a matter of opinion. there are some players on squad who dont merit inclusion over these men. Walsh and Clarke in particular are given a raw deal. like Sexton, Murtagh etc.. have made no impact and they get chance after chance.

[behind the wire]

can i ask how many posters here were actually at the game yesterday? sounds like most are going on simply what they seen on tv. you really needed to be there to appreciate fully just how bad down were.

i agree wobbler that it was a nothing game with a terrible attendance in terms of supporters but what we also have to realise is that its less than 4 weeks to championship time.

we can talk all day about what players could be brought in but as wobbler says it would make little difference. what really worries down supporters is that down have no style or system of play and can't effectively move the ball up the field at speed. tipp won yesterday simply because they had a system of play and stuck to it. it wasn't as if they were a great team. i would even go as far as to say that tipp made as many unforced errors as down did. only difference was that tipp were organised and had a plan.

[thewobbler]

Thats a matter of opinion. there are some players on squad who dont merit inclusion over these men. Walsh and Clarke in particular are given a raw deal. like Sexton, Murtagh etc.. have made no impact and they get chance after chance.

Your argument doesn't stack up here. In effect you just want to replace two players who have underachieved in a Down shirt with... two other players who have underachieved in a Down shirt.

[WhoAreYaWhoAreYa!]

Was very dissapointed watching the final yesterday. Seemed to me the players shared the same mentality as some of the posters o nthis board, we are promoted already, so who cares. That is a pathetic atitude to have, honestly. The difference is having a medal and not having one. It another thing to put in your 'honours won' and it is a peice of silverware for our county. Its a trophy for Christs sake! And its a trophy we would have in our possession now if it werent for some terrible displays of shot selection and juvenile mistakes.

I mean, kicking the ball across your own goal is something you are taught not to do when you are under 8!!

Shot selection was dyer. Too many times to players pass the ball to a man 3 yards away. This man proceeeded to do the same, and we went nowhere, back and forth across the feild for what seemed like an eternity, eventually ended in a shot off a weaker left foot into the keepers hands.(cant remember who hit the shot).

And Conor Garvey is well capable of playing at this level, hes the most competent number 3 since his clubmate Brendan Grant, arguably. Now that McKernan is injured, Garvey is definatly the best option there. They are both full backs, who can play football. They are comfortable carrying the ball and drive forward, something we witnessed yesterday with Garveys point just on halftime extratime.

[dodgy umpire]

does anybody really think things would have been as bad yesterday if coulter, mc comiskey, mc kernan, rodgers  and doyler were starting.

dont rate john boyle , doesnt seem willing to give it 100% for 50/50  balls , hit a good point but also a bad wide. BRING BACK WALSH