Down Club Hurling & Football

[snatter]

Is the point not that we have too many grounds left empty for most of the year already without building another one . Surely if you want to go and watch Down badly enough you will get in the car and travel no matter were the ground is ?

Its not the dedicated fans we need to attract - its the unconverted.
It'll be harder for us to persuade joe average in Crossgar to go to Down matches when they're in Newry.
Thye might start to go if tehy're played somewhere closer, even a couple of times a year would be enough to get them and their kids into the GAA.

[downredblack]

Is the point not that we have too many grounds left empty for most of the year already without building another one . Surely if you want to go and watch Down badly enough you will get in the car and travel no matter were the ground is ?

Its not the dedicated fans we need to attract - its the unconverted.
It'll be harder for us to persuade joe average in Crossgar to go to Down matches when they're in Newry.
Thye might start to go if tehy're played somewhere closer, even a couple of times a year would be enough to get them and their kids into the GAA.

The way to get the unconverted and their kids into the GAA is through their local clubs , and from there the interest in the county team will follow . The reality is that we cant have a ground in the 4 corners of Down to accommodate people who don't want to make any effort to support Down . The Marshes is a fine set up and it would be a travesty after all the work that went into it if we didn't use it to the full and that includes letting Armagh in if they so wish .

[Pull Hard Hes No Relation]

Letting Armagh use the Marshes??? The pitch is under enough pressure as it is in terms of the volumes of games being played between county, schools, club championship and the use of Shamrocks teams in both hurling and football.

My concern and I voiced this at the time is that Shamrocks team will get to play on this pitch less and less, already there is talk of a ban on training on the pitch from a club persepctive which I have no real issue with in terms of protecting the pitch but at the same time its a bit rich then to have another county play their games there. IMO we can't expect to have all the gain of having a top class pitch and facilties provided for us from a club perepctive and not expect some pain i terms of access to the pitch but that arguement on behalf of the county board is undermined when they suugest letting Armagh use our facilties. I thought Armagh were one of the richest counties in the GAA??

As regards the query about the Bridge being denied access on the Saturday, I think you'll find that is related to Mayobridge's comments about the pitch and the general set-up at the Marshes a couple fo years ago which annoyed a lot of guys at the club while on a previous occasion they arrived unannounced 3-4 years ago and tried to tell the club hurlers to move off the pitch! You can guess the response that got!

[6th sam]

Is the point not that we have too many grounds left empty for most of the year already without building another one . Surely if you want to go and watch Down badly enough you will get in the car and travel no matter were the ground is ?

Its not the dedicated fans we need to attract - its the unconverted.
It'll be harder for us to persuade joe average in Crossgar to go to Down matches when they're in Newry.
Thye might start to go if tehy're played somewhere closer, even a couple of times a year would be enough to get them and their kids into the GAA.

The way to get the unconverted and their kids into the GAA is through their local clubs , and from there the interest in the county team will follow . The reality is that we cant have a ground in the 4 corners of Down to accommodate people who don't want to make any effort to support Down . The Marshes is a fine set up and it would be a travesty after all the work that went into it if we didn't use it to the full and that includes letting Armagh in if they so wish .

As an East Down man who lives further away from Newry than Crossgar,and as somebody who was initially opposed to the development of Newry,I have to state that I am now a Newry convert.
The venue is superb in so many ways,and will develop even greater atmosphere for floodlit NFL games.
The county budget should not be put under strain by trying to provide a stadium in East Down.A much more important priority is to spend money on a state of the art training venue centrally in the county.East Down clubs would benefit far more from this,with a resultant increased representation from East Down on development squads,county squads etc.To ask players to travel 40+miles for training 3 times a week is not ideal.To ask supporters to travel to Newry for county matches  4 times a year is perfectly reasonable.

[5 Sams]

My concern and I voiced this at the time is that Shamrocks team will get to play on this pitch less and less, already there is talk of a ban on training on the pitch from a club persepctive which I have no real issue with in terms of protecting the pitch but at the same time its a bit rich then to have another county play their games there.

Most other clubs in the county bust their balls from year to year raising money to improve their facilities...Shamrocks get a first class ground for nothing and they complain about somebody else using it...I've heard it all now.

[snatter]

Is the point not that we have too many grounds left empty for most of the year already without building another one . Surely if you want to go and watch Down badly enough you will get in the car and travel no matter were the ground is ?

Its not the dedicated fans we need to attract - its the unconverted.
It'll be harder for us to persuade joe average in Crossgar to go to Down matches when they're in Newry.
Thye might start to go if tehy're played somewhere closer, even a couple of times a year would be enough to get them and their kids into the GAA.

The way to get the unconverted and their kids into the GAA is through their local clubs , and from there the interest in the county team will follow . The reality is that we cant have a ground in the 4 corners of Down to accommodate people who don't want to make any effort to support Down . The Marshes is a fine set up and it would be a travesty after all the work that went into it if we didn't use it to the full and that includes letting Armagh in if they so wish .

As an East Down man who lives further away from Newry than Crossgar,and as somebody who was initially opposed to the development of Newry,I have to state that I am now a Newry convert.
The venue is superb in so many ways,and will develop even greater atmosphere for floodlit NFL games.
The county budget should not be put under strain by trying to provide a stadium in East Down.A much more important priority is to spend money on a state of the art training venue centrally in the county.East Down clubs would benefit far more from this,with a resultant increased representation from East Down on development squads,county squads etc.To ask players to travel 40+miles for training 3 times a week is not ideal.To ask supporters to travel to Newry for county matches  4 times a year is perfectly reasonable.

6th Sam ,

you obviously fall into the category of a dedicated fan, not somebody to be converted.
now it my guess that you live alongside many families who've never been to a down match.

If we're to make inroads into east down soccer country, alongside club efforts we should also showcase the county team.

If we lose Newcastle as secondary venue, then  some of the alleged £17 million should go on a replacement, or a the very least, the upgrading of one east diown ground, eg Downpatrick's ground.  Provide terracing / a stand to allow it to take say 7k, a good national league crowd.

I'd agree that a training ground is a priority, but surely that wouldn't take up all the pot.

[Blue Island]

 Quote - Oh and 5iveTimes, you are some craic. For God's sake, you were waxing lyrical about the shithole that is Newcastle a few months back. Newcastle is a dirty, cold, wet ground, always.

Agree with Snatter on that one wobbler. Newcastle is a poor ground at the moment, but the Marshes was no better before the decsion was made to revamp the ground. The county had the chance at one stage to buy some extra ground at Newcastle that would have enabled then to turn the pitch 180 % to allow for proper re-development. Always thought, of Newcastle as the spiritual home of Down football and would imagine many people would feel the same. Believe it was  wrong to have the county ground at the extreme end of the county, thus alienating much of the county, including the Ards clubs. If not Newcastle, it should have been a new pitch in Castlewellan, which is at the heart, geographically speaking of Down GAA.

That said the decsion was made and the Marshes is a credit to Down GAA and Newcastle will be sold soon.

Agree totally with you wobbler that the development should have been a ground share arrangement. The Ulster Council and Central Council are going to have to get some central control over the development of county grounds throughout the country. There is no need for magnificent white elephants dotted all over the place that are filled once or twice a year. There should be three, possibly four good quality grounds in Ulster and they should be shared. The  large amounts of money saved should be pumped into the grass roots, where it will be far greater dividends. Of course the county needs a home ground for National league and smaller gate matches, but gound capacity of 10,000 or less in each county will cover these.

I believe there is at least four clubs who share the MCG in Melbourne in the Aussie rules and they have no desire to waste money on excess grounds. I think there is something in the psycholgogical make up of the GAA that these big numerous grounds are more of a statement than anything else, ie "look at us (soccer,rugby etc) we are the more successful organisation in this country and look at your pitful grounds". I for one accept there is a certain satisfaction in this but it is an expensive price to pay for that satisfaction and it would be a better organisation if the money was pumped into the grass roots.

[Townie]

As an East down man i would like to defend St Patricks park maybe not the most attractive of grounds but lets be honest here the fat cats at the county board haven't exactly been throwing money at it have they? No, they for years have been putting small change into the atmosphereless place called the marches! A more suitable name should be the swamp! This all to suit our southdown counterparts which sickens me most when people like blue islander whose pitch you wouldn put spuds in can criticise. In fairness to there landlords Bryansford i think they have maintained it to the best possible standard ans should be credited fot it, Iknow this sounds strange from a town man but i pass that place most nights and there is always some team training on it or playing matches everynight of the week, there is not another place in the county that could withstand abuse like that!

[thewobbler]

I back my County with my own money, I dont need a clubs funds

And therein lies the difference between you and the county board.

Look, the point is simple. Down football isn't in debt, but there's feck all cash lying around. Everyone in Down is now banging on about these dedicated training facilities other counties have. The county board understands the need for one. All things being well, the Newcastle deal will finance an initiative such as this. But if it can't, then the funds will have to be achieved elsewhere. And one thing Down football is missing at present is benefactors.

So if an opportunity arose to make easy money on the side, without penalising clubs, supporters or existing sponsors in the process, I suggest it should be taken.

I really do hope that our county isn't full of people like you who want to develop soccer-style rivalries with neighbouring counties, which only get in the way of common sense.

[tyssam5]

Any local Down radio stations that will webcasting the Mayobridge v Dromore gmae on Sunday?

[Mourne Rover]

If we can take a few bob off Armagh, why not ? I would hope that, even in division 3, we could generate a financial return of between 20k and 40k stg for a reasonably attractive NFL fixture at the upgraded Esler Park. Armagh, based on their past rather than their future achievements, should be able to double that for a high-profile game in a higher division. We could ask them for a quarter of the gate, and they would still be well in profit. Armagh would be left embarrassed over their lack of planning and we could gain 50k stg  plus over a  league season. Is that really a bad result ?

[Caitlin]

Just in from the pub but 5ive times your arguments are running thin. We are not a little county .The Rover is on the ball ,with the opportunity to generate money the decider. As I said to my daughter before I left for the 2002 AIF , 'we have to support them'. At the age of 8 she said,' you don't know how hard that it is for me'.At that point I knew we had done a good job in parenting.

[amallon]

5iveTimes - Your argument isn't going to change my mind on it.  I still think it would be a good move for Down to be collecting Armagh's rent. 

[thewobbler]

5iveTimes, what on earth makes you think you would be in the majority? We've people of all ages and all backgrounds on here from Down and there are not too many agreeing with any of your points.

By the way, your "Down = good, Armagh = bad" theory on life is, well, nothing short of Fearon-esque.

[thewobbler]

Why should we be the ones to help them out, we could end up with them as permanent tennants

This is exactly why you come across as having a soccer-style attitude to Gaelic Games.

I hate the Newry Shamrocks with a vile passion, but if they needed a pitch for a year and Ballyholland were in a position to help them out, I'd 100% back any decision to do so. For although I take great pride in those rare occasions when we beat the f**kers, and I can't help letting out a smile when I hear they've lost a game, I would hate to see them go the wall, or even go close to it. We are all part of the same association, after all.

You, on the other hand, seem to believe that there is some advantage in not helping your neighbours out. For reasons which I don't understand, you seem to feel that our position is strengthened when theirs is weakened.