Down Club Hurling & Football

[Pull Hard Hes No Relation]

Wobbler - a couple of points firstly your assertion that the powers that be don't give a damn about the game. If they don't why was Nicky Brennan on the phone to club officials quoting that this had been "arranged" weeks ago between Bertie Ahen, Mulvihill and Martin Mc Guinness - they are playing politics with our games and getting away with it.

To be honest I agree that the pitch etc is a great boost for the club and that we have the advantage of not having to undertake some of the financial burden other clubs have to get similar facilties and yet it is a double edged sword as this occasion proves. Personally I'd be happeir to just have a seperate hurling club well away from the whole set up as our juvenile ranks particularly at U12/10 is made up of young players who play for other football clubs such as Ballyholland, Saval, Burren, Mitchels etc henec oru drive at underage to promote the club as Cumann Iomana Iuir Cinn Tra (Newry Hurling Club) so the kids feel as welcome as possible to come down and hurl.

The whole issue with the kids here was that an arrangement had been made for them to play at half time in the Derry V Dublin game and provide a guard of honour to the teams (effort to promote hurling in the locality) - these all had to be shelved as a result of the PSNI game and the way it was handled.

The hurling club also has a lot of PR lined up to promote the game in the week leading up to the game but again it was all pulled as a result of this PR stunt. If Brennan etc are so keen to make a PR stunt why not take the game to Croke Park! Down Minor Academy are playing Sligo in the Minor C Hurling Final - will they get a high profile match to play in front of ? Not likely Croke Park aren't even going to fix the game and have told the two counties to arrange it themselves - so a PR stunt involving the PSNI being played for poltiical reasons is more important to Croke Park than an All Ireland final involving two parts of the country struggling to promote the most ancient of Irish games. Sums up the GAA hierarchy.

I have no argument with the issues you are making about the facilties Wobbler but I'm hopping mad that a great opportunity to promote hurling in this area had been sacrificed for political expediency - why don't the politicians f*** off and lets us play and promote our games.

[wobbller]

 Well said!

[bcarrier]

Some people dont know when they are winning.

The war is over FFS.

[spiritof91and94]

Tonight Bryansford Gaels meet and this coincides with the County Board Meeting in the Donard Hotel - Peter Quinn Ex-Gaa President will address both meetings......

I must admit I have viewed the proposed Bryansford site and am excited about the potential of it, but I am sure alot of people will be opposing any move.

[Pull Hard Hes No Relation]

I see this as a win/win for both Byransford and the county. Bryansford get a new club facility without debt and under their own ownership rather than the county while the county get the financial boost that is badly required to clear the debts and allow us to build the state of the art training facilties required.

When you look at other counties such as Monaghan, Meath, Derry etc and view their facilities against ours it would put you to shame. One of the greatest head-aches for any county manager in Down is getting pitches for matches/training and selling St Patrick's park allows us to get the finance for this as well as set the county up financial for the forseeable future as well as ensuring that Byransford are catered for as well.

All positive as far as i am concerned.

[amallon]

Spirit - Are you allowed to say where the proposed site is?   Why is Peter Quinn being brought in?  Is he attempting to mediate or something?

If the Ford membership vote no to any move, can the Co. Board move ahead without your approval?

[spiritof91and94]

Aidan the membership not agreeing will only delay the sale - John Miskelly is the key to all this - he is the developer apparently fronting the deal.

The land is 17 acres located on the beginning of the Burrenbridge Road - first left after Bryansford Chapel coming from the village.
We got Quinn involved to mediate as the club was being shafted by the county on any deals on the table in the early stages of this.

4 pitches can be built easy with parking for 200 and then a clubhouse - massive site

[amallon]

Sounds good but are you not worried about the distance from the main population.  Parents are only to happy to let their kids walk to your pitch for an hour and halfs free baby sitting.  When they have to get up and leave them and then collect them again it might not be so appealing.  The Ford might have to start running a mini bus service?  Is the junction of the Burrenbridge road on a bad bend?

Sounds like a wise move getting a shwred operator like Quinn in to advice the club.  What he says on your behalf at the county board meeting will carry more weight than just about anyone else you could have got.

[southdown]

I think the parents should remember that the club there children play for is called Bryansford, and not Newcastle.  The club should be based in Bryansford and if the parents have objections they should maybe form a new team called Newcastle!

[wobbller]

 From a county wide viewpoint it seems to be good as long as Bryansford are happy. Who is going to look after the coffers?Who is going to advise/manage the CB .Could we not hijack Peter Quinn and keep in Down for 3 years of penal servitude.

[Cloc Mor]

I think this is a great deal for all Down people.  I agree that Bryansford must be accommodated and the deal must be done with their support.  There is no way a green field site will be found close to the town and this will cause problems.  Most other clubs cope with famiilies living some distance from their playing fields meaning parents having to put themselves out to leave their kids to training/matches.  The people of Newcastle have the facilities, at present, on their doorstep and sacrifices will have to be made.  They will be given 'state-of-the-art' facilities to cater for all the teams they have at present - something St. Patrick's Park cannot deal with.

A Centre of Excellence can then be established - something we are really in need of.  I believe we need professional people to ensure that this project is carried out for the good of the people of Down.  The County Board have been inept in carrying out many of their duties which has put us in the position we presently find ourselves in.

I also believe that the coaching structures in place are extremely inadequate and 'real' money should be made available to ensure that proper coaches can be employed for the future good of Down football.  We need a coach for every 3 or 4 Primary Schools if we want to catch up with some other counties.  Its is evident that we are way behind alot of other counties and 2 or 3 coaches for the whole of Down will not help us.

We are all looking forward for a positive response fron Newcastle tonight.

[rosskarr]

 It's a short/medium/long term gains for all involved.It would be nice for the GAA to take something from the British in the form of one it's Multinational.

[redandblackjack]

[quote author=thewobbler link=topic=25.msg141777#msg141777 date=11872133

Lads, with the greatest respct, you are trying to make something out of nothing. If you want to make it out that Shamrocks are somehow oppressed as a result of having excellent facilities handed to them on a plate, well I suppose that is your right. Don't expect too much sympathy from around the county though.

Handed on a plate.........the current changing room complex was built by the shamrocks as was the social club, yes there are new rooms in the pipeline but this will make no difference to the shamrocks! No member of the shamrocks expects any sympathy from anyone around the county so why are you implying that we would??

The powers that be came along and TOLD the shamrocks that this match was being played- end of! This sort of shite has been going on long enough!

Again, you have to take the rough with the smooth. Sometimes its nice that a larger body wants to take care over your grounds, sometimes it's a pain in the arse that they want to share those grounds.

who took care and put the money into the up keep of the ground prior to development wobbler?? Ask around and you will find out it was the shamrocks who did this with no fuss and did a good job too.

Spoilt you say?

When you get state of the art changing rooms built for nothing on your grounds next year, you do realise that around the same time there'll be members of clubs all across this county selling £100 tickets in the hope that they can build something half as good. Spoilt is too strong a word, but it is certainly a nice arrangement you have got going on.

Again as i said the existing changing room complex is ideal but the county board want to upgrade it...what do you want the shamrocks to do??

Really though, I may be misinformed here, but as the host club for Championship occasions receives 10% of the gate towards costs etc., I assume this arrangement carries on at other levels too. Newry always gets bigger games and bigger gates than anywhere else. If I'm wrong, and in fact the Shamrocks make nothing out of hosting games, then I take my hat off to your club and to how well they continually mobilise stewards and ticket collectors for matches. If I'm right though, you shouldn't behave like a spoiled child when you are asked to give a little bit extra back.

How many ticket collectors are about on match days wobbler??

Oh and by the way, what infrastructure boost are you talking about? The Stand? Catch a grip..

The stand, the prunty pitch, the floodlighting, the changing rooms in the pipeline. Shamrocks have the best facilities in the county and haven't had to pay too much to have that privilege. But I suppose you'd swap it all just for the right to host juvenile friendly matches whenever you want?

The floodlighting.....you prune, this shows how tuned in you are wobbly...sure the seniors train under them every night!!!! Going by what your saying....the county teams have used the changing rooms for years and havent had to pay too much for that privlege.... you come across quite bitter.

Financial boost you say..... as the only club in Newry to promote all gaelic games do you begrudge them it?

For a South Down club, Shamrocks dedication to hurling is tremendous, and a credit to the club.  But your club simply are not the victims of some horrible atrocity as is portrayed above. They do better out of the arrangement with the county board than vice versa, and this shouldn't be forgotten.

What atrocity has been portrayed? You were the one who started to spit fire and accuse the club of being spoilt bastards?? And by the way the issue is not with the county board it is with more with the ulster council.

End of discussion.

[passedit]

10% rule?

Only percentage rule I'm aware of is that the bottom 2 teams must each have at least 30% of the top team's points tally to avoid automatic relegation.

This is rounded down i.e.

- If Saval finish top with 30 points, bottom teams need ((30/10) * 3 = 9) 9 points to avoid relegation.
- If Saval finish top with 31 points, bottom teams need ((31/10) * 3 = 9.3) 9.3 points to avoid relegation. This is rounded down to 9 points required.
- If Saval finish top with 32 points, bottom teams need ((32/10) * 3 = 9.6) 9.6 points to avoid relegation. This is rounded down to 9 points required.
- If Saval finish top with 33 points, bottom teams need ((33/10) * 3 = 9.9) 9.9 points to avoid relegation. This is still rounded down to 9 points required.
- If Saval finish top with 34 points, bottom teams need ((34/10) * 3 = 10.2) 10.2 points to avoid relegation. This is rounded down to 10 points required.

Wobbler 9.6 and 9.9 are actually rounded up as per conventional mathematics ruling--this was definitely the case in previous years.

We've definitely got 24 points now.

If Hoops beat you Friday night, then you would have to win your last 2 and hope they lose their last 2, and that Harps drop 5pts out of 6.

If you win on Friday night and we lose to Ballymartin, it's all in your own hands, as we play you next.



6 Sams - maybe a long time ago, but it's been rounded down for the past 4 seasons at least.

Wobbler sorry to drag this up again but do you have any specific examples of this? I've been told by a semi official source that 6th sams interpretation of rounding up as per normal mathematical rules is correct.

Ps I'm hoping you are correct btw.

[thewobbler]

Passed It - when we were in a precarious position in Division I two years ago, I phoned Seamus Walsh about this issue a number of times. I was reassured that clubs who almost meet the criteria would never be punished, i.e. the 30% rule is rounded down to the nearest integer. The 30% rule was apparently designed to relegate teams who clearly aren't up to the grade, not to punish those who are on the borders of it.

When I think about it I imagine though, it has probably never been properly specified in a rulebook anywhere. The 30% rule was actually only introduced after Bosco went the whole season in Division II with only one win, but were only relegated by the skins of their teeth through the play-off system. Boscomo could probably tell you the exact season, but around 2001-2002 would probably not be far off the mark. There is a fair chance that in those 5-6 years, no club has actually been in a position to contest or counter-contest what way 30% is worked out.

So given this, while I trust Mr Walsh's word inherently, I suppose there is a very good chance that other members of the board would have a different intepretation of proceedings.

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redandblackjack, I note you have ended the discussion. Perhaps when you take off your green and white glasses and are able to see things from the perspective of others, we should reopen it. You clubmate has the grace to admit that he's hurling mad and also that the Shamrocks have benefitted from their ongoing arrangement with the county board. Meanwhile, you are continuing to give the impression that Shamrocks are being treated like lepers in their own house.