Time for Joe to go??

[Walter Cronc]

Cynical foul in the penalty area should be punished with a straight red, otherwise players are going to assume that the rugby tackle is now part of Gaelic football since the penalty is so lenient that it might as well be.

I disagree that over-use of the handpass is a problem. The problem is this half throwing action that they're getting away with. There's nothing wrong with a predominantly handpassing game when good clean crisp handpasses are used.

What about if it happens outside the penalty area like the Cavanagh one? still a red?

Shouldn't matter if the attacker will be 1 on 1 with keeper. Most fowards shoot from outside the penalty area.

When you look at the tackle in slow mo, Gormley actually misses Mc Manus with an attempted trip. Just before Sean brings him down Colm Cav is committed to foul but goes over him as Sean takes him down!

[sheamy]

Brolly's tirade reinforces the myth that Tyrone are systemic fouling team. Tyrone have been live on Saturday TV the last 3 weekends winning by 2 points each time, easy and lazy to say they must practice fouling in fouling. Complete myth.

It's not a myth. It's a fact. Tyrone employ systematic fouling to gain advantage. Why would they not? Tyrone used other rugby tackles in 'closing out the game' on Saturday. They did it for the second week in a row. These tackles are more dramatic than the usual shirt pull so get more attention.

Mickey Harte has not denied it and also rightly points out that so do others and that his players are also systematically fouled. His anger is over what he sees as selective media comment on his team over others. Harte doesn't have a duty to make Gaelic football a fair or entertaining sport. His job is to win using whatever methods possible.

The Cavanagh incident is only the headline because of the pivotal moment it was in the game. Under the rules it's a yellow so there's nothing more to say about it. It's a rules problem. You could argue it's also an approach problem but with the levels of preparation in modern sport, this level of cynicism isn't going away.

[Count 10]

Just wondering if a Monaghan player had done the same to Cavanagh....and Monaghan had won ....would it all be just part of the game?

[DennistheMenace]

Just wondering if a Monaghan player had done the same to Cavanagh....and Monaghan had won ....would it all be just part of the game?

Doubt it very much but Brolly wouldn't have went off on one either. His rant is a good thing in that this is now highlighted to the extreme and maybe a rule changed will be enforced.

[blewuporstuffed]

Brolly's tirade reinforces the myth that Tyrone are systemic fouling team. Tyrone have been live on Saturday TV the last 3 weekends winning by 2 points each time, easy and lazy to say they must practice fouling in fouling. Complete myth.

It's not a myth. It's a fact. Tyrone employ systematic fouling to gain advantage. Why would they not? Tyrone used other rugby tackles in 'closing out the game' on Saturday. They did it for the second week in a row. These tackles are more dramatic than the usual shirt pull so get more attention.

Mickey Harte has not denied it and also rightly points out that so do others and that his players are also systematically fouled. His anger is over what he sees as selective media comment on his team over others. Harte doesn't have a duty to make Gaelic football a fair or entertaining sport. His job is to win using whatever methods possible.

The Cavanagh incident is only the headline because of the pivotal moment it was in the game. Under the rules it's a yellow so there's nothing more to say about it. It's a rules problem. You could argue it's also an approach problem but with the levels of preparation in modern sport, this level of cynicism isn't going away.

really?
when?

[sheamy]

Brolly's tirade reinforces the myth that Tyrone are systemic fouling team. Tyrone have been live on Saturday TV the last 3 weekends winning by 2 points each time, easy and lazy to say they must practice fouling in fouling. Complete myth.

It's not a myth. It's a fact. Tyrone employ systematic fouling to gain advantage. Why would they not? Tyrone used other rugby tackles in 'closing out the game' on Saturday. They did it for the second week in a row. These tackles are more dramatic than the usual shirt pull so get more attention.

Mickey Harte has not denied it and also rightly points out that so do others and that his players are also systematically fouled. His anger is over what he sees as selective media comment on his team over others. Harte doesn't have a duty to make Gaelic football a fair or entertaining sport. His job is to win using whatever methods possible.

The Cavanagh incident is only the headline because of the pivotal moment it was in the game. Under the rules it's a yellow so there's nothing more to say about it. It's a rules problem. You could argue it's also an approach problem but with the levels of preparation in modern sport, this level of cynicism isn't going away.

really?
when?

yes, I'm not making it up. If the full game was online I'd post the clip. About 2-3 mins to go a Monaghan man is dragged to the ground on or around his own 45 with a rugby tackle around the knees. I think it was Peter Harte for which he received a yellow card. Monaghan people might recall better.

However, as Mickey Harte is pointing out it's no different than the dozens of times players are fouled as they attempt to turn defence into attack. It's part of the game now.

[DennistheMenace]

3) Joe obviously doesn't like Tyrone but is very passionate about this systematic fouling. He was never was PC and in this day in age I find that refreshing, personal insults I don't like.

People posting Londonderry and the likes are pathetic.

Hypocrite.

We're all gaels.

Maybe my Presbyterian roots are kicking in. Should all GAA membership be subject to a family lineage test? 

Whenever the purpose is for winding up your fellow gaels then maybe you need to take a look at yourself. This type of sledging is rife sadly.

[NaomhBridAbú]

There are a few points form all of this - some relating to the rules, some to personal criticism, some to how Tyrone play, some to Brolly...

In that Order the rules need fixed - what SC Did v Monagahn was worthy of the most severe penalty possible. Currently thats a yellow? Not even the black would satisfy the need there, and ultimately a red card will provide the only equitable solution.

Personal criticism of any player in an amateur sport. Cavanagh will go down as one of the best players ever, and shouldnt be remembered by what Brolly or anyone said. his legacy will be his shimmy/shuffle or whatever the f**k it is. his point scoring. his all ireland medals...in all aspects of his on-field play. he is twice the man Brolly ever will be. Brolly has been at this before - he slagged off Fergal Logan a few years ago on TV...that cost him. he has been on about a variety of different players, and this year he was even on about players brothers...there are certain bars in the Shambles of ARmagh that joe would be best to avoid. for life.

Tyrone like any team with a semi final place to play for, should do whatever it takes within the rules to win. As a Tyrone fan i would not have accepted McManus walking thru to score a goal. similarly as a monaghan fan I'd be raging at what happened, but i would have also expected Monagahn to do whatever it takes to win...

And finally brolly himself...he is very generous within GAA. he has given alot to his club of birth and his adopted club in Belfast. as well as others. his kidney donation should define him more than what he says on TV, but i find that he is a bullshitter of the highest order - and deosnt know what he is saying most of the time. he is a hypocrite and a liar. The perfect man for tv and the legal system it seems

[screenexile]

I think Joe went OTT but there is no doubting the fact he's right!!

Mickey Harte always talks about how good our games are and how much better the GAA is than everyone else. Talking about Hypocrisy and there's your answer. Mickey Harte and Cavanagh are 2 of our games role models and should be held to a higher standard than diving and systematic fouling!

The defence by Tyronies on here is " but everyone else does it" I will point you to the reply my Mother used for years "if everyone jumped off a bridge would you do it too?"

Yes others are at it but Tyrone the longest and that's ten years of Cavanagh getting lads booked and sent off with his diving and Harte pretending his team don't engage in the dark arts when he's had McMenamim, Gormley and Cavanagh on his teams for years.

Joe should stand up for our games as Mickey Harte doesn't seem to want to bar his outrage at the International Rules. Joe always played the game in the spirit it was intended so he's as well placed as anyone to stand up for what's right!

[NaomhBridAbú]

I think Joe went OTT but there is no doubting the fact he's right!!

Mickey Harte always talks about how good our games are and how much better the GAA is than everyone else. Talking about Hypocrisy and there's your answer. Mickey Harte and Cavanagh are 2 of our games role models and should be held to a higher standard than diving and systematic fouling!

The defence by Tyronies on here is " but everyone else does it" I will point you to the reply my Mother used for years "if everyone jumped off a bridge would you do it too?"

Yes others are at it but Tyrone the longest and that's ten years of Cavanagh getting lads booked and sent off with his diving and Harte pretending his team don't engage in the dark arts when he's had McMenamim, Gormley and Cavanagh on his teams for years.

Joe should stand up for our games as Mickey Harte doesn't seem to want to bar his outrage at the International Rules. Joe always played the game in the spirit it was intended so he's as well placed as anyone to stand up for what's right!

thats a fairly contentious post there - final line about Joe always playing the game in the right spirit just lets you down. alot.

[DennistheMenace]

Black card rule should stop the vast majority of systematic fouling, the red card rule would stop the vast majority of last ditch fouls to prevent goals (possibly not in final minutes of a game though)

[brokencrossbar1]

Joe is right in what he said.  I really don't think the black card is the answer either.  To deal with systematic fouling I would adopt a 'team foul' system similar to basketball.  When a team reaches  number of fouls every foul thereafter will give the opposition a 21 yard free from the edge of the D on either side depending on who is hitting it.  The player fouled must hit the free, so you could have a goalkeeper hitting the free but it would reduce the level of fouling if a team knew that after committing say 7 fouls per half then they would be at risk of losing a score per foul.  Punish on the score board and award the team that learns how to play within the rules.  While I agree that I would have done what Cavanagh did and applaud my team mates if they did it, that doesn't mean it is right and I think Joe was angry at the 'celebration' from victory which in many ways was achieved through cheating. 

I personally was more annoyed at the other Cavanagh incident, which in many ways is a greater blight on the game.  Darren Hughes executed the perfect tackle and Cavanagh pulled him down.  Darren picked up a yellow card, incorrectly, when it should have been Cavanagh picking it up.  This changed the whole dynamic of the game.  Cavanagh began to dominate MF and scored 3 points on the bounce.  Darren Hughes had to stand off the man as he couldn't risk the second yellow.  Also the sense of injustice would have played on Darren for a good while after this and he was distracted. To me if the ref had made the correct call there then the game probably would have panned out differently.

[NaomhBridAbú]

Black card rule should stop the vast majority of systematic fouling, the red card rule would stop the vast majority of last ditch fouls to prevent goals (possibly not in final minutes of a game though)

straight red is the only way to eliminate this...black card is a bit like 'careful now'...doesnt penalise the time to the fullest extent, which is what is needed

[DennistheMenace]

Black card rule should stop the vast majority of systematic fouling, the red card rule would stop the vast majority of last ditch fouls to prevent goals (possibly not in final minutes of a game though)

straight red is the only way to eliminate this...black card is a bit like 'careful now'...doesnt penalise the time to the fullest extent, which is what is needed

Agreed and even then a red card won't stop it happening all the time.

[Walter Cronc]

Surely a sin bin can be introduced!! 10 mins in the bin for rugby style tackles/blocking runs etc.