Magdalene Laundries payout.

[muppet]

I'm not begrudging anybody anything.What about others of the same era,like the wives of drunken husbands etc? Were they not slaves and abused? What about catholic nationalists in the North,denied houses,jobs etc,in this same era? My point is,in Ireland and indeed everywhere else,there was much less scrutiny and emphasis on human and civil rights than there is today,so is it fair that one group should be singled out for compensation,and if not,where is all this going to end?

You are begrudging the Magdalene Laundries victims compensation on the basis of whataboutery.

Classy.

[T Fearon]

Begrudgery isn't querying why one group is being singled out for compensation,which many others equally derserving aren't getting it! It's just pointing out an anomaly

[Lar Naparka]

I'm not begrudging anybody anything.What about others of the same era,like the wives of drunken husbands etc? Were they not slaves and abused? What about catholic nationalists in the North,denied houses,jobs etc,in this same era? My point is,in Ireland and indeed everywhere else,there was much less scrutiny and emphasis on human and civil rights than there is today,so is it fair that one group should be singled out for compensation,and if not,where is all this going to end?

Tony, I've no problem agreeing with you that many other groups were victimised as well and, like you, I don't know where it all is going to end. I believe it never will. It could wind up with you suing me if things get out of hand. After all, you are a nationalist in NI and I am a citizen of the republic.

Discrimination and exploitation have been around since the start of humanity and there is chance that there won't be injustice and inhumanity until its end.
But why should this mean that the inmates of Magdalene homes don't deserve any form of redress?
Sure other sections of society were wronged as well but that doesn't mean that Church and State should be absolved of all blame in this matter. They both made millions at the expense of those incarcerated in the Magdalene laundries.
Each case of wrongdoing should be judged on its own merits; independent of all other considerations. In the case of the laundries it is easy to pinpoint the guilty parties but where should battered wives go to look for compensation? The nationalists of NI would need to go after HMG if they want compensation for the discrimination they had to put up with and so on.
But the fact remains that Church and State can be held accountable for the way the laundry victims were treated.

[muppet]

Begrudgery isn't querying why one group is being singled out for compensation,which many others equally derserving aren't getting it! It's just pointing out an anomaly

Tony liability for battered wives is determined in the courts and usually falls on the perpetrator.

Liability for the discrimination against Catholics you mention could also be determined in the courts or politically.

Liability for the Magdalene Laundry victims is the outcome of a proper process in the South. I believe it should mainly fall on the Church but the State is also liable as it was responsible for many of the victims entering the Laundries.

The whole tone of you argument and snide comment about the victims smiling in old photos betrays your begrudger.

[T Fearon]

Well,yes,I am puzzled that the grainy footage does show smiling faces.This is incompatible with the life of misery, deemed to be so bad that it merits compensation.

At the end of the day,the government can be held responsible for everything that happens,as this case proves,so I would say that there will be a lot of aggrieved groups on the back of this now.

[muppet]

Well,yes,I am puzzled that the grainy footage does show smiling faces.This is incompatible with the life of misery, deemed to be so bad that it merits compensation.

At the end of the day,the government can be held responsible for everything that happens,as this case proves,so I would say that there will be a lot of aggrieved groups on the back of this now.

Try this, a superior ordered them to 'smile'.

You are now arguing that because someone smiled in a photo it suggested they did not have 'a life of misery, deemed to be so bad that it merits compensation'.

Here is a photo from Jewish children in a compensation camp in WW2. Would you deduce from the smiles that everything was comfortable and 'they did not have a life of misery?'

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

Anyone who has ever worked in healthcare, customer service, sales etc. knows they have to smile when they are downright miserable.

Beaten wives/husbands are known to put on a happy face outside the home.

People who lose major sports events, fail exams, lose their jobs, contract life changing or ending conditions put on a brave face.

So why don't you think these people might not smile in a photo, they may be threatened to smile, they may be putting on a brave face or maybe they had the odd day were they were given an icelolly or a piece of cake and were briefly happy. Dictatorships are known to have often beaten people within an inch of their lives and then give them a treat, be it psychological mind games or moments of guilt.

The Nazis threated prisoners wonderfully the days the Red Cross came to visit.

[T Fearon]

Muppet,that looks like a photo of kids at a Championship game in the 60s.So people were/are ordered to smile? Yes,maybe for a family photo or something,but not for a spontaneous film crew.

Another point.Have any of the contributors to this thread got direct first hand experience of what actually went on in these laundries or like me,are you relying on the allegations of people who were actually in them?

[From the Bunker]

Can somebody take this thread down Please! 

[Lar Naparka]

Muppet,that looks like a photo of kids at a Championship game in the 60s.So people were/are ordered to smile? Yes,maybe for a family photo or something,but not for a spontaneous film crew.

Another point.Have any of the contributors to this thread got direct first hand experience of what actually went on in these laundries or like me,are you relying on the allegations of people who were actually in them?

Holy bejasus, Tony, and here was me just beginning to think that you just might be serious!
If by any chance you were/are, you should go talk to somebody in a white coat right away.

FFS, how many championship grounds used barbed wire to prevent spectators going anywhere in the 50s/60s or at any other time?
Another thing, to have 'direct first hand experience' of what went on in those laundries, a contributor to this thread would have to be either a very old nun or an equally old inmate.
How many of either sort would you expect to be posting to this or any other thread?
You really should get out and about a bit more.

[seafoid]

Muppet,that looks like a photo of kids at a Championship game in the 60s.So people were/are ordered to smile? Yes,maybe for a family photo or something,but not for a spontaneous film crew.

Another point.Have any of the contributors to this thread got direct first hand experience of what actually went on in these laundries or like me,are you relying on the allegations of people who were actually in them?

Fiona Doyle is familiar with that sort of attitude. Abuse can't happen without it.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/victim-vindicated-by-rapist-s-sentence-1.1071905

"I've waited for this day for over 20 years, since I first brought the first complaint to the gardai and the HSE. They were like everybody else, my school, my teachers, doctors - they let me down. Nobody would believe me," she said.

[Itchy]

Tony, seriously you need help. You are clearly not right in the head. Maybe go start another few pointless threads and that might help you calm down a bit.

[T Fearon]

Magdalene laundries very sadly were of their time.The abuse meted out by nuns who had probably suffered similar abuse themselves in school growing up.Also you have to factor in the more robustly vengeful nature of religion in those days,were the emphasis was far more on punishment for sin (perceived sin) rather than compassion,and this method was perceived to more efficacious in terms of correcting and improving bad behaviour.

That is not of course to condone the abuse,but a simple statement of fact.Anyone of my generation will no doubt testify that behaving badly attracted a belt from parents or a cane from teachers.

Thankfully we have all moved on from those days,as evidenced in West Belfast last week,bad behaviour leads to an appointment with the local non statutory law enforcers,and a bullet in the kneecaps.

[muppet]

Muppet,that looks like a photo of kids at a Championship game in the 60s.So people were/are ordered to smile? Yes,maybe for a family photo or something,but not for a spontaneous film crew.

Another point.Have any of the contributors to this thread got direct first hand experience of what actually went on in these laundries or like me,are you relying on the allegations of people who were actually in them?

Check the properties of the photo. It is Jewish children in a WW2 concentration camp.

Tony, you are so far off the stage I am beginning to suspect something else is the problem.

[theskull1]

Every chance he's just a fully assimilated roman catholic. Either way he needs help