GAA Outreach in Action...

[Tony Baloney]

It suits a very particular agenda for unionists/loyalists to associate the handful of GAA teams perceived as controversially named with violent republicanism. It is downright dangerous and totally misrepresents the Association. I had the privilege of being amongst the 82,000 in Croke Park for the first Clare v Cork match and believe it or not the IRA and Sinn Fein didn't feature heavily that day. Unfortunately the same cannot be said for OO days out which tend to be hate filled.

[muppet]

Can I ask for the name of Cromwell Road to be changed?

Thanks.

Now we are moving into the world of politics.

Cromwell Road in return for say Kevin Lynches.

Piss off a few Unionists here for a Gaa club there.

Next trade please?

[Tony Baloney]

Can I ask for the name of Cromwell Road to be changed?

Thanks.

Populated almost entirely of Catholic students and GAA people from QUB and the Poly.

[ONeill]

Sadly, these names like Rossa or St Gall's have no connection to the current generation bar a few.

I'd be shocked if a third of the current St Gall's side knew who St Gall was or would care to know.

[grounded]

I'm gonna be honest here. Since when was the GAA about appeasing Unionists?

Some people might argue that the Orange Order was never "about appeasing" nationalists, but it doesn't mean that some people from the "other side" don't find some parts of their organisations/ activities offensive.

Are we still content in 2013 to operate an "I don't give a f*** what they think" attitude?  We know Brolly is, but I was hoping to come on here and see more liberal/ open-minded thinking from some others here.

The truth is that, whatever the circumstances of Lynch's death, he wasn't put away for handing out sweeties to sick children, but was, in fact, a member of a terrorist organisation. No amount of revisionism from Irish Republicans will change that and, although I have no time for Robinson or the DUP, I agree with him that there is no difference between historical or contemporary terrorism.  The scum who murdered Mr Black or Constable Carroll or the soldiers in Antrim a few years ago are exactly the same class of human being as those who carried out similar acts in the 70s, 80s or 90s.

If people don't understand why the name "Kevin Lynch" attached to a sports club can be deemed offensive then, to be honest, I don't see much evidence of community outreach. But if you don't understand that, then here is a heads-up: don't bother criticising unionists for being openly anti-GAA.

As long as openly anti-GAA doesn't involve assaulting GAA members, burning out Clubhouses/damaging GAA property or in anyway disrupting its activities that's fine by me.

I'm pretty sure that most unionists have in the past and will continue to meet your request.

Meanwhile, unionists can expect to do whatever they like because it's no business of anyone else (Brolly, 2013) and can expect that nationalists will not burn out or attack Orange Order property or, in any way, disrupt its activities.

Yes, that's a solution, both communities can live side by side, doing whatever they like but simultaneously pretend that the other side doesn't exist.  Why didn't we think of that before?

Just interested on your views on this one. Dan Breen was a leading member of the IRA during the war of independence and would have fulfilled all your criteria of a terrorist. The Dan Breen cup is presented each year in Tipperary. Is this acceptable in your eyes?

He was a terrorist to my mind (and based on the little information I have just read, a Nazi supporter). I do, however, accept that, enough time has now passed since he carried out his activities to deem it less offensive, so I would be in no rush to have things like that changed.

That said, shooting someone in the 1920s has the same end result as doing it in the 1970s or in 2012.  I think it's clear that, from this point on, the GAA really need to look at how they act.  They can't, in 2013, do the same things that they did 100 years ago if they are really serious about promoting better community relations.

So the logic of the argument is ' old Terrorist that I can't remember is ok, but recent terrorist is bad '
I take your point about promoting better community relations but the inherent ethos of the GAA is not compatible with the current thinking of Unionism. For the likes of Jim Allister, it will never be acceptable because of those core ethos, its political old boy. Thankfully the GAA accepts people from every section of society regardless of their race, religion, gender, sexual orientation etc. In the South religion doesn't seem to be an issue for aspiring GAA members(accepted the disgraceful sectarian remarks re Drew Wylie in Monaghan) and appears not to be a barrier to rising up the ladder of officialdom. 
           Frankly asking the GAA to change these core ethos is akin to asking the Orange order to admit Catholics or to allow their members to attend a catholic ceremony without the fear of being expelled. I can accept that from the orange order, that is part of their core beliefs. However, parading into neighbourhoods and disrupting other people's everyday lives is another thing. Doesn't give anyone the right to assault any LOL members, damage their property or disrupt their lawful day to day business.
         As to your point
'Yes, that's a solution, both communities can live side by side, doing whatever they like but simultaneously pretend that the other side doesn't exist.  Why didn't we think of that before'?
         Hopefully with the gradual normalisation of society here there will be an increase in the level of integration between the two communities starting with schooling. Its only when the dinosaurs die off that things will move on 

[Dougal Maguire]

The contemporary v historic terrorist arguement was well shot down on The BBC Sunday Sequence programme when Jim Allister refused to accept that Edward Carson was a terrorist

What illegal organisation was Carson a member of?

He set up and armed a militia that was prepared to fight against the Government. That in my mind is enough to be getting on with

[T Fearon]

It's still whataboutery though.I see in the paper today Allister argues it's not just the club's business who it names itself after,and says the £245k in public grants allocated to Kevin lynch Hurling Club Dungiven makes it everybody's business.

Now you can indulge in whataboutery,argue violence was necessary and indeed moral,but in 2013,is the naming of clubs after combatants going to help or hinder the outreach project?

[Tonto]

Tonto...are you telling me that any military response and support from sections of the nationalist community to that "fight back" had nothing to do with unionism?

Well firstly, I never said anything even remotely like that.

Secondly, I wouldn't consider it a 'military', but a 'paramilitary' response.

Thirdly, there were those who took a peaceful line against the injustices of bygone years and I have infinitely more respect for those people than I do for those who CHOSE the path of violence.

[Tonto]

The contemporary v historic terrorist arguement was well shot down on The BBC Sunday Sequence programme when Jim Allister refused to accept that Edward Carson was a terrorist

What illegal organisation was Carson a member of?

He set up and armed a militia that was prepared to fight against the Government. That in my mind is enough to be getting on with

The Ulster Volunteers were not an illegal organisation. 

There is also a difference between sabre rattling and actual willingness to carry out actions.  Besides, the Curragh Mutiny meant that they wouldn't have had anyone to fight against!

It is a fact that one of the reasons for the formation of the UVF was as an attempt to bring discipline into the loyalist community to help prevent mass sectarian murder.

The only people killed by members of the UVF in the period 1913-1918 (which is the only period we are referring to as far as Carson is concerned) were on the battlefields of WWI when they fought and died alongside, not against, the Irish Volunteers.

To compare the UVF (or, indeed, the IVF) of 1913-1914 to the PIRA or the INLA is ludicrous and quite frankly betrays a breathtaking ignorance of your own history.

[Dougal Maguire]

Don't play semantics here. I don't give 2 tosses what the legal status of the Ulster Volunteers was. As far as any right minded person is concerned any man who arms a militia with the intent of fighting a decision taken by a Government is a terrorist. But this goes to the crux of another issue. For the past 90 years we have heard unionists cast scorn on those who tried to influence things by any means other than democracy. Now that the demographics are changing and they don't have the majority thus allowing Belfast Council to take the flag decision suddenly activities from which violence is an inevitable consequence are ok. 

[Milltown Row2]

Sadly, these names like Rossa or St Gall's have no connection to the current generation bar a few.

I'd be shocked if a third of the current St Gall's side knew who St Gall was or would care to know.

Or St Pauls, St Johns and I'd be really shocked if most members of clubs that have saints names as their club name would know.

[theskull1]

Tonto...are you telling me that any military response and support from sections of the nationalist community to that "fight back" had nothing to do with unionism?

Well firstly, I never said anything even remotely like that.

Secondly, I wouldn't consider it a 'military', but a 'paramilitary' response.

Thirdly, there were those who took a peaceful line against the injustices of bygone years and I have infinitely more respect for those people than I do for those who CHOSE the path of violence.

Re.. Your third point

I'm asking you to try to 'understand' not to respect their decision to take up arms (which is how I view it). Across the nationalist demographic the lack of respect and rights given to them for decades was going to result on some thinking it was the only way. Its a very base instinct to abhor what took place during the troubles (it was a shameful part of our past), but both sides of the community have to accept and understand the deep seated reasons why people rightly or wrongly took up arms. Unionist intransigence has a lot to answer for. We can move on to a better place if we accept that we all had a part to play in creating the monster.

[Wildweasel74]

That money (grant) did it not go to dungiven football club not Keven Lynch and yes i now they both play on the same pitch,

[theskull1]

They used to but not anymore. KLs have their own pitch

[cornerback]

That money (grant) did it not go to dungiven football club not Keven Lynch and yes i now they both play on the same pitch,

Where have u been? Kevin Lynch's no longer play on St. Canice's pitch. They got their own pitch maybe 5 years ago...