Tyrone v Kildare Part II - The Revenge Div 2 NFL Final Sunday 29th April 2012

[Whishtup]

Seriously, lads, I wouldn't be too worried about that performance.  A couple of poor final passes denied us goal chances in the first half.  Some things didn't go our way, including McCrory's injury and a lot of decisions in the second half.    Just would like to see more runs being made up the wings instead of right through the middle.   Why was Sean's 'shimmy' point disallowed?

[ONeill]

Shane a very generous assessment I would say! Sean Cavanagh was poor and looked uninterested, perhaps thats why, in his 10th year now on the Senior team , he has never been made captain , lacks leadership and when things are not going well , disappears! Honest question..........would Colm be on the team if Sean wasn't? You say Aidan Cassidy is better than that, why? here and when has he produced the type of performance that would justify overlooking that display today??

Sometimes we overlook the good done. Cassidy beat a couple of tackles and set up Mugsy for Tyrone's first score. He started the move by picking up the breaking ball and driving forward for Tyrone's third score (Donnelly). His next run saw him swallowed up by 4 Kildare men when he possibly could have released it earlier. The same happened soon after. His confidence dropped a little after that but wasn't the only culprit. I thought he had an OK second half as he kept it simple.

[orangeman]

Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, it was a draw. The wheels came off after that.

So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.

Young Fogarty had a blinder and gave the full back line plenty to think about.

We can all over react - with 12 games won out of 12 Tyrone were back in the big time and Sam was being openly talked about. With this defeat, people are still over reacting and talking about going nowhere this year.

That's the fickle nature of supporters. Tyrone still not a bad team but as someone else said earlier, the glory days are behind us -  they'll not win an All Ireland with this team. Kerry, Cork and Dublin are well ahead.

[ONeill]

Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, Tyrone it was a draw.

So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.

I think it's beyond doubt that fitness was a major factor for the simple reasons you stated. 10-12 minutes to go men were racing away from Tyrone players whereas earlier in the game they weren't. Kildare kicked points at the end unchallenged. Before that they had to scrap like a terrier for every half chance.

If anyone was talking about Tyrone and Sam (I didn't see or hear any) before now they needed their head tested.

[orangeman]

Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, Tyrone it was a draw.

So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.

I think it's beyond doubt that fitness was a major factor for the simple reasons you stated. 10-12 minutes to go men were racing away from Tyrone players whereas earlier in the game they weren't. Kildare kicked points at the end unchallenged. Before that they had to scrap like a terrier for every half chance.

Momentum swung in Kildare's favour at this stage and their tails were up. People were saying that the benefits of the training trip to Portugal paid dividends. I don't buy that - if anything the bodies would have been tired as a result of a week's training away. But the psyhological benefit of a week away would have stood Kildare in great stead today. But you could be right - if Tyrone are up to playing for 60 minutes, all they have to do now is play for another 10.

[Carmen Stateside]

Just sat down and watched the game for the second time and they lost it as well ! Bottom line is that you will win nothing with no midfield.  Kildare totally dominated that third of the field.  Curran didn't help by kicking it down their throats every time .  This is were Dooher is and will be sorely missed.
I agree with someone before asking what Cassidy has done at any stage in a Tyrone jersey to merit a place.  I have watched a lot of games he has been involved in and never once has he stood out or even impressed, at least the young Cavanagh has had a decent game here and there.
Sean cavanagh should be played full forward with Mugsy and Stephen ONeill each side.  Totally lost at wing forward.

[tyroneman]

I agree wholeheartedly. Sean won player of the year and an AI medal playing at FF. He's someone who looks like he needs to be the pivot of the team and just doesn't seem interested at WHF.

Midfield is a concern. A good day is breaking even. At one stage yesterday we lost 9 KO in a row.

The first half against Donegal we moved the ball into the wide areas at pace and swung it over the bar from distance. This needs to be added to the mix again.

As many have already said - ploughing up the centre will only work if there are 1 or 2 other approaches being used to keep the opposition guessing. Kildare sat with 2 sweepers at one point just waiting to turn us over cos they knew exactly what we would do.

It also seems very much apparant that stopping Harte = stopping Tyrone.

[C_Berg_316]

Was at the game yesterday - was very tempted to go to the top deck off the cusack to get away from the so called 'supporters' behind me.  Not a clue - players just crossing the half way line and shouts of "put that ball over the bar" - another classic "is that wee brian dooher down injured" - never heard worse.  From reading some of the comments on hear either its nearly as bad as the supporters or else we have some unreal ex players here who have never made mistakes playing games.

Fair enough Tyrone had a poor last 10 mins or so and wasn't the best game to watch y.day but gives them plenty of work on and I think I defeat could be more beneficial - brings the players back down to earth a bit and also stops any media talk before we enter the championship about this unbeaten all year Tyrone team.  I cant agree with most of the criticism off the players on here either - Cassidy for example - yes made a few silly errors but as another poster mentioned - was involved in at least 5/6 of Tyrone scores - do people just forget about the good work done and just focus on the negatives all the time - he won at least 2/3 frees directly in front of goals that were scored from breaking through the middle.  And on other occasions running through and laid the ball off simply and it was tapped over.  Also to the posters saying he's never had a good game for Tyrone - he was outstanding in a few qualifier games last year before getting injured - including against Longford (I think from memory) - were he caught at least 8/9 kick outs clean.  Also in the league games a few years ago before picking up nasty ankle injury was Tyrones best player throughout the league having great games against Monaghan/Cork, etc.

[nrico2006]

Echoing the sentiments of others on here, but from what I saw:

- nothing has changed since Cork in 2009, Dublin in 2010 or Dublin last year.  Same one dimensional game plan where players try and run the ball at every opporunity.  When I watch some of the other top teams play they are constantly 20/30 yard kick passes or hitting long diagonal balls frequently

- why do we lack players that can shoot from 30/40 yards and score.  Its similar to the point above in that we seem to have to run the ball as close to goal as we can and recycle it 5 yards to a free standing shooter

- Mark Donnelly got through a mountain of work but again the use of the boot would have caused more damage, why not try Mulligan at 11 as he seems to be the only player that looks to give a pass

- I remember the criticism Mark Harte took when he played about only being a free taker, but he barely ever missed and I think it was taken for granted that there is an abundance of top notch free takers floating about.  SON has been poor at them over the past few years and we seem to also concede 45s as most of them are missed too

- Is it just accepted, as it has been for years now, that its ok to play every game with a midfield that we know will lose when it comes to winning first phase possession?  Why has some of the big fielders within the county never really been given a chance? 

- Haven't seen much of Cassidy but don't see the hype after yesterdays game, very one paced player.  McCarron didn't stand out either and as for the McKenna he was playing in a forward line that didn't get much supply

- The one big thing that I noticed is that there is no width to out game, everything is played down the middle.  When watching the game every player is sucked right into the middle of the pitch and there is acres of space in the wings which could be exploited.

- Coney and O'Neill are big losses but from looking at the team we are still relying on the veterans to win us games, but they have aged and the last few years have shown that they are past their best and we need something new.

-  Sean Cavanagh is not a wing forward, has had his best days at midfield.  Why not put him back there?

[God14]

Positives:
1 Mark Donnelly was excellent as has been mentioned here - but I also thought that Ronan McNabb had a very good game & would take him as a big plus from this league campaign. I think he finished the game in the full back line where he struggled, but up until that point he hoovered up alot of break ball & distributed it well and is most certainly a great option in the half back / half forward line. He will come on for that game as well.
2 Honestly delighted to have shaken off that "unbeaten" tag. It wouldnt have done us any good at all ahead of the ulster championship.

Concerns:
1. You dont win championships without a decent free taker. Tyrone dont have one. I know Petey Harte had a mare at the free's v Donegal last year but I would suggest he has another go at them (I remember watching a young Oisin McConville do the same against Tyrone when he was just starting out, think it was 1998 - and look how he came on)
2. Midfield was cleaned out, again. I would persist with Aidan Cassidy. He was poor yesterday but he's still finding his way back from injury. If fully fit and back in form he is a very formidable midfielder. Should be partnered in my opinion with one of the McMahon's
3. Sean Cavanagh. Tyrone need Cavanagh fit and on form if they are to have any sort of summer at all. Completely wasted on the wing. How many times yesterday did I want him to do the trademan drop shoulder and run - but each time he chequed his run and came back inside his man. It looks more like a psychological thing to me, he doesnt have the confidence to take his man on. Sean must be deployed at FF where he is a target for the likes of Mugsy & P Harte to vary the attack and hit the occasional direct ball in. A run at FF would also benefit his confidence.

Yesterday was a real reality check for alot of us. I would never really thought of Tyrone being AI contenders this year, but I suppose winning 12 outta 12 games, at least in the back of your mind I think most Tyrone fans will admit myself included, we got ahead of ourselves a bit.

I said back in January that considering the overhaul of the squad this year - that promotion & an Ulster Championship would constitute a very good year. I think thats still on.

[God14]

Still think we have the bones of a decent side, my starting 15 for the championship for what its worth would look like:
                      1. Devine
2. McCrory  3. Joe McMahon  4. Gormley
5. McCarron 6. P Harte  7. Conor Clarke
      8. Cassidy & 9 Justin McMahon
10 McNabb  11. Mulligan  12. Mark Donnelly
13. Mattie Donnelly 14. Sean Cavanagh 15 SON

[To whom it may concern]

If we're honest, Kildare were the best team for large parts of the opening league game back in February. The two goals there were decisive and Kildare set up yesterday not to concede goals.

We were too lateral and predictable. O'Neill went 25 minutes before he touched the ball in the first half. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned his name, but the player we are clearly lacking, if only as a game changer, is Brian McGuigan. I remember in 2009, we faced the same problems with Kildare in the QF and he came on and transformed the game. He would have been the go to man yesterday. I looked at the options on the bench and there was nobody that could have done that. Dublin last year showed he doesn't have the legs for 70 mins of that intensity, but he may have for 20 mins, like Canavan in 2005. If it's too late to bring him back, then Peter Harte needs to be moved to 11. He should be doing his best work up the field now and with his goal threat there is little point having him in his own half as teams are now man marking him.

Coney's loss is massive. Our inside men showed well, but are now too easy bottled up and are predictable. Most of their scores will come from frees. Coney can run in behind and is dynamic. Ronan O'Neill could have been the same. Any chance of contending this year is gone with their injuries.

Defensively, we are still struggling with the early ball in, even with the sweeper.

Cavan U-21's and Kildare yesterday have shown how the game is going. Unheralded, powerful players who are tactically aware and hungry. Tyrone are being out thought and out fought

[Jinxy]

Enjoyable enough game.  Terrible reffing.  Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second.  Wouldn't be too disappointed.  I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time.    Sean should've been hauled off at half time.  In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough.  Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough.  Disappointing game by McCarron. 
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well.  Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.

   

On another day, a sniper on the roof of the nally stand could take out half the Kildare players.

'Pale' humour?

That's what it would have taken for Tyrone to be out of sight by half-time on 'another day'.

[rrhf]

Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!

That happened it didn't make one ball of blue, because he done better than 2  cavanaghs, 1 Cassidy, 1 Harte, 1 full back line etc.  you and Mickey must be on the same wavelength.  Our big players were caught out badly today, and thats why we lost yet it's easy to pick out the fringe players. Stork

McKenna was equally as bad as any you have mentioned. He was taken off with 5 mins to go, have yet to really see him shine. You talk about the bigger names, maybe he is getting on because of his own name??

Interesting perspective. It was you naming players and calling for curly fingers for just the one one player but you mentioned he was equally as bad as others.  We won 2 balls in the second half in midfield and he won one.  In the firts half he was involved in most scoring moves.An when other vaunted stars were sauntering around giving the ball away repetively for scores, you still singled out Mc Kenna.  I really think you believe  that because of his name he was selected, thats going to be hard to argue with.   

[Armamike]

Tyrone won something like 12 games on the bounce this year so things can't be all that bad based on one game - they were due to lose one.  You'se had the same midfield personnel i'd presume for the games you won fairly easily throughout the league?