What's said in the confession box will no longer stay there - Church outraged

[Billys Boots]

There are two issues at play here, from my perspective anyway.

Firstly, the legislature, in the form of the Government, appears to be pissed off at the attitude of the Church to Civil Law, i.e. that they consider Canon Law to be pre-eminent, from their (the Church's) perspective.  That's all well and good, for the Govt., but the absence of a constitutional principle for the separation of Church and State doesn't exist here (yet!). 

Secondly, the enactment of unenforceable legislation, on the part of the Legislature, is (in my opinion) an expensive, irresponsible, indefensible and divisive mistake always (and again!). 

[Gaoth Dobhair Abu]

Total non story.
How would you have it eamonca, special branch detective Costello sitting in the confessional next to the one that Fr O'Briens in hearing confession, with Costello holding onto his wee tape recorder? or maybe the Government could spend millions bugging every confessional box in the country? 

[screenmachine]

In theory you could put this Confessional Box secrecy bullshit to the test quite easily.  If, for example, you took to burgling churches/priests houses, vandalising Church property, etc. and then went to the same priest in the same confessional box and admitted these crimes against the church to this one priest on a weekly basis, what do you imagine the outsome would be?  Assuming you were never caught and continued to follow this same routine over a number of years, do you honestly think that this one priest would sit there and tell me to say two Our Father's and five Hail Mary's? Bollocks, the church wheels out this sentimental crap when it suits them. It's about controlling the people and making sure your envelope goes into the basket every Sunday...

[Bogball XV]

In theory you could put this Confessional Box secrecy bullshit to the test quite easily.  If, for example, you took to burgling churches/priests houses, vandalising Church property, etc. and then went to the same priest in the same confessional box and admitted these crimes against the church to this one priest on a weekly basis, what do you imagine the outsome would be?  Assuming you were never caught and continued to follow this same routine over a number of years, do you honestly think that this one priest would sit there and tell me to say two Our Father's and five Hail Mary's? Bollocks, the church wheels out this sentimental crap when it suits them. It's about controlling the people and making sure your envelope goes into the basket every Sunday...

I'm not sure on the detail Screen as it's been a while since my last confession, but I think the priest doesn't have to administer the sacrament if he doesn't think you're genuinely penitent, by repeating the crime week after week, I'd say he'd probably decide you weren't genuinely penitent.  However, he might be glad of the company for that hour that he normally sits there on his own in the box, so he might indulge you for a year or two.

[Lar Naparka]

FFS, how many pricks were going to confession admitting they abused children or murdered anyone anyway. Stupid and hard law to enforce if you ask me.

You are dead right. Introducing a law that's unenforceable is an unwise move.

[screenmachine]

In theory you could put this Confessional Box secrecy bullshit to the test quite easily.  If, for example, you took to burgling churches/priests houses, vandalising Church property, etc. and then went to the same priest in the same confessional box and admitted these crimes against the church to this one priest on a weekly basis, what do you imagine the outsome would be?  Assuming you were never caught and continued to follow this same routine over a number of years, do you honestly think that this one priest would sit there and tell me to say two Our Father's and five Hail Mary's? Bollocks, the church wheels out this sentimental crap when it suits them. It's about controlling the people and making sure your envelope goes into the basket every Sunday...

I'm not sure on the detail Screen as it's been a while since my last confession, but I think the priest doesn't have to administer the sacrament if he doesn't think you're genuinely penitent, by repeating the crime week after week, I'd say he'd probably decide you weren't genuinely penitent.  However, he might be glad of the company for that hour that he normally sits there on his own in the box, so he might indulge you for a year or two.

Aye but if he gets some fellow priest landing in every couple of weeks thats been riding the hole of some altar boy he'd be sure to give him a bye ball...

[Hardy]

There's no need for a specific law for the confessional. Failure to report a crime is already a crime. There is nothing in the law (as far as I know) that excludes the priest in the confessional from this requirement any more than it excludes me. By the same token, the possibility of convicting a priest is about the same as that of convicting me if someone I don't know and can't identify confesses a crime to me in a dark room with no corroborating evidence and nobody else present - especially if I deny it ever happened.

[fearbrags]

It  would be more in line for Inda to sort out our police force and court system, who are useless in cases of child abuse,  very slow, light sentence, etc. In the recent case in Donegal a victim was the one who done must of the surveillance that was after  the abuser was let out after a short sentence .The system had already failed.The abuser was not a priest.I was foolish enough to  think that our police used to investagate reports of abuse, but recently I realised  that  they don't, unless the poor victims  keep  pushing and even then it usually takes years if  not decades . This confessional  shit is load of crap !Inda sort  out  the system and find the abusers quicker and put them away  for ever and protect the children of ireland. I have being very down on the church of late now I think the police and court system are just as bad

[Bogball XV]

There's no need for a specific law for the confessional. Failure to report a crime is already a crime. There is nothing in the law (as far as I know) that excludes the priest in the confessional from this requirement any more than it excludes me. By the same token, the possibility of convicting a priest is about the same as that of convicting me if someone I don't know and can't identify confesses a crime to me in a dark room with no corroborating evidence and nobody else present - especially if I deny it ever happened.

I think there is common law which recognises the seal of the confessional.

[Hardy]

Probably, now that you mention it.

[MR99]

I think its a load of publicitiy claptrap for Enda.  Do you honestly think those who commit henious crimes are really going to go into a confession box and confess it, especially if they know a priest can tout to the cops?

[David McKeown]

It's a load of nonsense as a confession to a priest, be it in the confessional or over pints in the pub, would not be held as evidence in a court of law as the defendent wouldn't be under caution that anything he says etc.

It would certainly be admissible as hearsay evidence in the north sure wasnt it used in the Hazel Stewart case recently. Id be surprised if it were inadmissible in the south

I am all in favour of this law particularly if it protects children and vulnerable people. Yes it will be hard to enforce but that doesnt mean it shouldn't exist.  If it brings even so much as one child molester to court and gets them convicted that it has done its job.

Someone mentioned doctors and lawyers and their confidentially with clients earlier but even that is far from unrestricted.  If someone confesses to a lawyer that lawyer cant then go into court and represent them and contest the charges on a factual basis.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

the Church serves the laws of God, not of Man, this is a non story brought about a grand standing taoiseach, who as a catholic was well aware he was talking nonsense, The seal of the confessional is inviolate in all circumstances

Not in Ireland. The Vatican has no authority in Ireland.

[Bogball XV]

It's a load of nonsense as a confession to a priest, be it in the confessional or over pints in the pub, would not be held as evidence in a court of law as the defendent wouldn't be under caution that anything he says etc.

It would certainly be admissible as hearsay evidence in the north sure wasnt it used in the Hazel Stewart case recently. Id be surprised if it were inadmissible in the south

Totally ignorant of that, what happened?  Who did he/she confess to?  How did the information get out?

Re lawyers, they can still represent their client and on hearing the confession they cannot head over to the prosecution and inform them of the new evidence.

And to the crux of your point, why do you think this would have the effect of 'bringing one child molester to court'.  As things stand, if such a person confessed to a priest, the priest has exactly the same option he will have in the future, he can go to the authorities with the information or choose not to. 

[Bogball XV]

the Church serves the laws of God, not of Man, this is a non story brought about a grand standing taoiseach, who as a catholic was well aware he was talking nonsense, The seal of the confessional is inviolate in all circumstances

Not in Ireland. The Vatican has no authority in Ireland.

No, but at present in Ireland, in common with much of the developed world, there is no obligation to disclose any information gained under the seal of the confessional.  The person obtaining that information has always got the choice of whether to disclose it or not, in reality this all comes down to individual conscience and not whether or not priests place greater store by canon law or civil law. as I'd be shocked if civil law was the winner there.
Essentially a priest hearing such information in the confessional has the choice, he can report it and be excommunicated or remain silent and allow the perpetrator to remain free - he has to decide which is the right and moral course to take.