Connacht teams don’t do August

[Dinny Breen]

http://eircomsports.eircom.net/GAA-Football/news/gaa/Man-and-ball-July-28.aspx

When last did a Connacht team cause an upset? A positive one, that is. No, games against each other don't count, so Sligo beating traditional powerhouses Galway and Mayo last year doesn't count. Nor should it in any case, when you consider how meekly both teams exited the championship. Come to think of it, Sligo went out to the tune of 19 points to Down; make what you will of that six-day turnaround.

So just to get this straight, let's look at who eliminated Connacht's representatives in the All Ireland series in 2010: Mayo lost to Longford, Leitrim to Kildare, London and Galway to Wexford, Sligo to Down, and Roscommon to Cork. Outside the Connacht championship where it is unavoidable that someone should win, no side from the western province won a single game outside their own championship. Not one.

The All Ireland series wasn't a whole lot better in 2009: Roscommon drew with and then beat Wexford, Sligo beat Tipperary and then all the cards fell in on the Connacht house thereafter. Again, no big wins. How about 2008? Well no wins outside Connacht there either as three teams – Sligo, Leitrim and London – were all Division 4 so they never even got to go into the qualifiers, instead regressing to the Tommy Murphy Cup. The mud thickens.

The last time a Connacht side even got to an All Ireland semi-final was in 2006 when Mayo made it to the final, and they got spanked by Kerry – 4-15 to 3-05; only three points scored in the second half too with the game still alive. Just two men who started that final – Keith Higgins and Alan Dillon – will line out in the first XV against Cork, while Trevor Mortimer and Andy Moran featured from the bench in that final five years ago.

Then again, that can be seen as a positive. Mayo have been at nothing these past couple of years so manager James Horan has changed tack, brought in youngsters, reshuffled those who've stayed, and still delivered a Connacht title. Whether the title is even worth the leftover shavings from when their name was etched into the David Nestor Cup is another matter. It represented progress, as does an All Ireland quarter-final. They would have taken it before the start of the year.

Getting any farther than that is unrealistic. Cork are too strong, too fast, too athletic, and too indomitable a team. Donncha O'Connor was in sparkling form against Down and there is no reason to suggest that won't continue against the Westerners. The O'Shea brothers – Seamus and Aidan – have been sometimes impressive and sometimes sluggish in midfield for Mayo but they will be cleaned out by Alan O'Connor and Aidan Walsh, particularly if the latter's form improves from the Down game.

It's heavyweights against flyweights all over the pitch. Whether you believe Joe Brolly's assertion that the Rebels are just a battering ram of a team or not, you can't deny their effectiveness. Plus, the Down game did, as has been roundly agreed upon, show Cork at their most fluid since 2009. Paul Kerrigan and Paddy Kelly are two of the more clever forwards in football, and they will open up doors. Fintan Goold have been waiting in the shadows for a long time but he had Down chasing that very thing. There are many prongs to the Rebel attack.

A surprise just isn't going to happen, even if the All Ireland champions have plenty of forwards missing: Colm O'Neill, Ciarán Sheehan and Daniel Goulding. The bigger shocks tend to be against sides from Connacht against sides that are nominally in the same province. By all accounts, London should have beaten Mayo a few months ago. Oh the laughing that would have been had at Horan's expense.

That was saved instead for Fermanagh and manager John O'Neill, as the Erne County gave the Exiles a first championship win since 1977. Not that the other Connacht counties can share in the joke, London are after all the only western team – again, nominally – to win a game outside their province in 2011.

Roscommon and Mayo get their chances this weekend against Tyrone and Cork respectively. We fancy both non-western teams to beat the handicaps of five points.
Connacht teams don't really do August anymore.

[Rossfan]

And Leinster teams don't do September   

[Blowitupref]

True about Leinster teams but shocking record by Connacht teams all the same at Senior level.

This was posted by a Mayo man on another thread he used 2001 as the start point as that is when the structure of the championship changed.

2001 to 2010
All Ireland Senior
Connaught 10% success rate, 33.3% final success rate (1 win in 3)
Leinster 0% success rate, 1 final appearances. (0 win in 1)

All Ireland u-21
Connaught 30% success rate, 60% final success rate (3 wins in 5)
Leinster 20% success rate, 40% final success rate (2 wins in 5)

All Ireland Minor
Connaught 20% success rate, 40% final success rate (2 wins in 5)
Leinster 10% success rate, 33.3% final success rate (1 win in 3)

National League
Connaught 10% success rate, 20% final success rate (1 win in 5)
Leinster - 0% success rate, 0% finals success rate (0 wins in 3)


Ulster,Munster way ahead of both.

[kevmy]

It's true Ulster and Munster have considerably better records and noone is disputing that. However I think there is a Dublin/Leinster bias against Connacht teams.

There are 5 teams in Connacht (6 if you count London) with a fairly low population base yet still our record since 2001 is considerably better than Leinster with 12 teams and the highest population density in the country. Yet you hear very, very little about the poor standard in Leinster. A good (not great) Dublin team has completely dominated Leinster since '01 with only Kildare coming up to challenge them in the last 2 or 3 yrs.

[SLIGONIAN]

http://eircomsports.eircom.net/GAA-Football/news/gaa/Man-and-ball-July-28.aspx

When last did a Connacht team cause an upset? A positive one, that is. No, games against each other don't count, so Sligo beating traditional powerhouses Galway and Mayo last year doesn't count. Nor should it in any case, when you consider how meekly both teams exited the championship. Come to think of it, Sligo went out to the tune of 19 points to Down; make what you will of that six-day turnaround.

So just to get this straight, let's look at who eliminated Connacht's representatives in the All Ireland series in 2010: Mayo lost to Longford, Leitrim to Kildare, London and Galway to Wexford, Sligo to Down, and Roscommon to Cork. Outside the Connacht championship where it is unavoidable that someone should win, no side from the western province won a single game outside their own championship. Not one.

The All Ireland series wasn't a whole lot better in 2009: Roscommon drew with and then beat Wexford, Sligo beat Tipperary and then all the cards fell in on the Connacht house thereafter. Again, no big wins. How about 2008? Well no wins outside Connacht there either as three teams – Sligo, Leitrim and London – were all Division 4 so they never even got to go into the qualifiers, instead regressing to the Tommy Murphy Cup. The mud thickens.

The last time a Connacht side even got to an All Ireland semi-final was in 2006 when Mayo made it to the final, and they got spanked by Kerry – 4-15 to 3-05; only three points scored in the second half too with the game still alive. Just two men who started that final – Keith Higgins and Alan Dillon – will line out in the first XV against Cork, while Trevor Mortimer and Andy Moran featured from the bench in that final five years ago.

Then again, that can be seen as a positive. Mayo have been at nothing these past couple of years so manager James Horan has changed tack, brought in youngsters, reshuffled those who've stayed, and still delivered a Connacht title. Whether the title is even worth the leftover shavings from when their name was etched into the David Nestor Cup is another matter. It represented progress, as does an All Ireland quarter-final. They would have taken it before the start of the year.

Getting any farther than that is unrealistic. Cork are too strong, too fast, too athletic, and too indomitable a team. Donncha O'Connor was in sparkling form against Down and there is no reason to suggest that won't continue against the Westerners. The O'Shea brothers – Seamus and Aidan – have been sometimes impressive and sometimes sluggish in midfield for Mayo but they will be cleaned out by Alan O'Connor and Aidan Walsh, particularly if the latter's form improves from the Down game.

It's heavyweights against flyweights all over the pitch. Whether you believe Joe Brolly's assertion that the Rebels are just a battering ram of a team or not, you can't deny their effectiveness. Plus, the Down game did, as has been roundly agreed upon, show Cork at their most fluid since 2009. Paul Kerrigan and Paddy Kelly are two of the more clever forwards in football, and they will open up doors. Fintan Goold have been waiting in the shadows for a long time but he had Down chasing that very thing. There are many prongs to the Rebel attack.

A surprise just isn't going to happen, even if the All Ireland champions have plenty of forwards missing: Colm O'Neill, Ciarán Sheehan and Daniel Goulding. The bigger shocks tend to be against sides from Connacht against sides that are nominally in the same province. By all accounts, London should have beaten Mayo a few months ago. Oh the laughing that would have been had at Horan's expense.

That was saved instead for Fermanagh and manager John O'Neill, as the Erne County gave the Exiles a first championship win since 1977. Not that the other Connacht counties can share in the joke, London are after all the only western team – again, nominally – to win a game outside their province in 2011.

Roscommon and Mayo get their chances this weekend against Tyrone and Cork respectively. We fancy both non-western teams to beat the handicaps of five points.
Connacht teams don't really do August anymore.

Nice bit of Sligo bashing there, i like the way he doesnt mention we lost to Kerry in Tralee by 1pt in 09. No big deal. Were not that bad and we'll be back. We do deserve a bashing for 08 and this yr though i'll grant him that.

[Kerry Mike]

yerra we go tno game last year in August either, dont worry about it.

[muppet]

Imagine your ambition is to be Pat Spillane (Spillane the mouthballer, not Spillane the footballer). Add a dial up connection and a 486 & hey presto: you have another hero looking for someone down on their luck to bravely give a good kicking to.

[INDIANA]

It's true Ulster and Munster have considerably better records and noone is disputing that. However I think there is a Dublin/Leinster bias against Connacht teams.

There are 5 teams in Connacht (6 if you count London) with a fairly low population base yet still our record since 2001 is considerably better than Leinster with 12 teams and the highest population density in the country. Yet you hear very, very little about the poor standard in Leinster. A good (not great) Dublin team has completely dominated Leinster since '01 with only Kildare coming up to challenge them in the last 2 or 3 yrs.

I think its more to do with the couple of wallopings Mayo got from Kerry in 04 and 06 have distorted opinions some. Because it unfortunately happened for Mayo on the biggest stage of the year it got more coverage then a quarter final hockeying would have.

For example dublin were walloped by kerry in 2009 and tyrone in 08. But because it happened in a quarter final it got a few news cycles. Granted in Dublin we never forgot about it but elsewhere it largely was.

Millions watch all-ireland finals. When it goes pear shaped it distorts views in my opinion.

There has been little difference between the best side in Connacht and best side in Leinster up to 2 years ago. I think Connnacht is in transition at present and Dublin and Kildare are well ahead of the Connacht sides at present.

Galway are poor but going well at underage

Mayo are in transition- will have a good side in about 2 years in my opinion

Rocommon building a nice side but will be 2 years before they will do damage in my view. And I would still say Mayo have more talented players available. Roscommon need to find another 4-5 players. But great underage work going on there.

Sligo- have gone backwards unfortunately.

Leitrim- improving but population base just too small

London- seem to be getting to a respectable level.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

It really is an unfair review of Connacht football when you consider Leinsters record. Leinster teams have only managed to beat opposite opposition in the last two years after most of the decade stuggling to get a scapfull of wins outside their province. Leinster teams have taken as big and in fact bigger batterings at the hands of teas from outside their province than Connacht teams. Connacht does relatively well over the last decade if you consider there are only about 500-550,000 people in the Province, compared to millions in the other Provinces.

[Frank Casey]

It really is an unfair review of Connacht football when you consider Leinsters record. Leinster teams have only managed to beat opposite opposition in the last two years after most of the decade stuggling to get a scapfull of wins outside their province. Leinster teams have taken as big and in fact bigger batterings at the hands of teas from outside their province than Connacht teams. Connacht does relatively well over the last decade if you consider there are only about 500-550,000 people in the Province, compared to millions in the other Provinces.

Population base is only part of it.

Approx figures for the 32 counties are:

Leinster - 2.5m
Ulster - 2.1m
Munster - 1.25m
Connaught 0.55m

On this basis Leinster should be twice as successful as Munster. Dublin county alone has a population almost as big as Munster, indeed the jacks have more males that all of the men, wimmin & children in Connaught - you mightn't realise it sometimes.. Limerick has a bigger population than Kerry, Cork has over 2.5 times the Kingdom's population but hey we're not worried.

Ulster's numbers may be effectively inflated by the inclusion of many with an ambivalence if not a hostility towards GAA - its puts their recent success in to a sharper focus.

With the exception of (east) Galway there isn't a big hurling community (with an ambivalence if not a hostility towards gaelic football) and a resultant loss of players.

Answers on a postcard but I don't think its just numbers.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

Well folks, Connacht football looks a little more respectable through the view of hindsight. With Mayo's impressive performance to dump out reigning All-Ireland Champions Cork, and Roscommon's performance against Tyrone esp. with their very strong midfield and some very good forwards. Even London managed to bring some surprises both inside the Province and out. Underage football is going well in the Western Province, with Galway's U-21s and Ros & G/way minors. Was the wind and rain in the West as opposed to the sun or calm in the other provinces a big factor in making the football in Connacht look poorer than it is. Now I am not claiming we are the best, second best or perhaps even the 3'rd best province at the moment, but Connacht football might have a brighter future than anyone could have hoped for. It would be nice for Sligo to return to form of a year or two back and Galway seniors need to get off their arses. Leitrim will always have a disadvantage but they often make the Connacht teams work and have made Donegal and I think Meath swet in recent years. Roscommon, I hope is on the verge of becoming a handy top 15 team, with the abilty if they do things right of breaking into the top 10. But top 15 is definately within their capabilites.

[ross4life]

Connacht football is on the way up from schools,Minor,U21,Senior & Club football all competing at the highest level this year. the average age of Mayo,Roscommon & Galway is still very young so the best is still to come.

This year reminds me of 1995 when Connacht was at a low point, Galway where given no chance v Tyrone but Could/should have beaten them. from then on Connacht was up there with the best, here's hoping that Mayo win on Sunday will be the start of something good for Connacht Senior football in the years ahead.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

Connacht football is on the way up from schools,Minor,U21,Senior & Club football all competing at the highest level this year. the average age of Mayo,Roscommon & Galway is still very young so the best is still to come.

This year reminds me of 1995 when Connacht was at a low point, Galway where given no chance v Tyrone but Could/should have beaten them. from then on Connacht was up there with the best, here's hoping that Mayo win on Sunday will be the start of something good for Connacht Senior football in the years ahead.

Hopefully Mayo and Roscommon will be the spearhead for this. Trust me the Galway lads will soon get their act together if they think they will be muscled out of Provincial titles and have to watch years of Mayo and Roscommon playing big days in Croke Park. I am unsure of how to rate Sligo, think thats best left to the Sligo lads.

[the Deel Rover]

Connacht football is on the way up from schools,Minor,U21,Senior & Club football all competing at the highest level this year. the average age of Mayo,Roscommon & Galway is still very young so the best is still to come.

This year reminds me of 1995 when Connacht was at a low point, Galway where given no chance v Tyrone but Could/should have beaten them. from then on Connacht was up there with the best, here's hoping that Mayo win on Sunday will be the start of something good for Connacht Senior football in the years ahead.

Here's hoping Ross4life but as a province we are not in to bad an auld shape despite what those outside the provinve may think . Even this year St Brigids made it to the Ai final and gave a great account of themselves against imo the best club team of all time , Galway are under 21 champions, both Roscommon and galway in the minor semi final, ourselves in the senior semi final. We are not in to bad a state in the province .

[AZOffaly]

Don't be getting carried away lads, Sunday was the 31st July