more soccer hooliganism in Dublin

[Geoff Tipps]

Why do people feel the need to constantly compare soccer to GAA?? One thing comparing the relative merits of the game but now the thuggish element that follow both sports. The GAA thugs are somehow slightly better because their violence is not pre-meditated??
If your jaw is broken and it's not a pre-meditated attack it still hurts like hell, right??

you think its pre-meditated?
did they charter a bus to go to break someones jaw?

Sorry I just don't get your argument. Now correct me if I'm wrong but it's something along the lines of - GAA thugs are bad but their violence is spontaneous whereas soccer thugs are worse because their violence is organised??
[/quote]
you are looking at it from a different angle.

my point is that all attacks and fights whether it is soccer, GAA, rugby, basketball, hockey etc etc are acts of thuggery (and I dont think they are generally pre-meditated , despite being bad and disgraceful).

the difference is that ONLY and I mean ONLY soccer have hooligans that organise their violence to 'fight' other 'firms' ( ) or set out to do so - organising transport to go to a rivals pub being the prime example here.
In the past on here , others have equated GAA and soccer as having the same incidents an violence.
I think this case - and others before and others to yet come - depict a huge difference in the GAA (and other sports) and soccer regarding violence, violence thug mentality and pre-meditated actions.
Hope you understand my point now.
[/quote]

Yeah I get your points but 2 bunches of neanderthals with Gary Neville style facial hair meeting for a prearranged fight half a mile away from Dalymount doesn't bother me that much.
A referee getting his jaw broken during a game does.
That's all I'm going to say on the matter 

[dublinfella]

/quote]

Give me one example of pre meditated violence in a GAA match and I'l give you ten examples of it in rugby or soccer.

But its not the point and a complete cop out.

There have been literally dozens of incidents of GAA fans attacking match officials, players and even abusing a 4 year old kid ffs recently.

How many incidents happen at soccer and their nature are irrelevant to the above. The GAA has a hooligan problem and thankfully for the GAA there is relatively benign reporting of these problems compared to soccer.

If there was the amount of problems in soccer there were in the GAA this year alone, the army would be deployed.

Finger wagging on this one is a dangerous game.

[lynchbhoy]

I don't know how my name was dragged into it, but of course I would condemn the incident, whatever it was. Tribune article is light on actual information and quotes and there is no mention of this beyond the article. I would have assumed foot.ie and the bohs site would have had more if it was what the Tribune are making out.

But the substantive point is that the GAA are in no position to point fingers. Hoganstand has TWO games abandoned last weekend due to violence. They have their hooligans, we have ours. But at least there is no whataboutery from the soccer lads - they ban people.

there we have it !
this is complete and utter whataboutery from yourself and soccer folks !
until we get GAA fans organising fights and organsing travel to places to cause violence and fight - then GAA fans will be equal to soccer fans.
There are plenty of club soccer matches abandoned in leinster junior leagues and other leagues throughout the seasons. I have known plenty of lads who play and have told me that their game v whoever in finglas had tobe abandoned or that a different team in tallaght had fans encroahing onto the pitch to hit, fight, intimidate players and frequently get the game abandoned if they were losing !
That goes on as much and maybe more in soccer than in GAA !

also the 'bans' are as effective as a chocolate tea pot - I know soccer fnas still get into grounds despite being banned- Same happens in GAA though.

come back to us with your comparisons when GAA fans start organising buses and fights and tagetting 'rivals pubs' etc !

[lynchbhoy]

Yeah I get your points but 2 bunches of neanderthals with Gary Neville style facial hair meeting for a prearranged fight half a mile away from Dalymount doesn't bother me that much.
A referee getting his jaw broken during a game does.
That's all I'm going to say on the matter 

i dont care about soccer neanderthals fighting among thmselves either
however  my point is - you are missing this- if that people like roversfella here are pointing fingers at GAA fans behavour equating it with soccer fans.
Thugs are thugs, but only soccer has organised (though badly) hooligans - which is what I am pointing out.

[dublinfella]

there we have it !
this is complete and utter whataboutery from yourself and soccer folks !
until we get GAA fans organising fights and organsing travel to places to cause violence and fight - then GAA fans will be equal to soccer fans.
There are plenty of club soccer matches abandoned in leinster junior leagues and other leagues throughout the seasons. I have known plenty of lads who play and have told me that their game v whoever in finglas had tobe abandoned or that a different team in tallaght had fans encroahing onto the pitch to hit, fight, intimidate players and frequently get the game abandoned if they were losing !
That goes on as much and maybe more in soccer than in GAA !

come back to us with your comparisons when GAA fans start organising buses and fights and tagetting 'rivals pubs' etc !

And there we have what?

Soccer has a problem with hooliganism

The GAA has a problem with hooliganism.

The specific acts may manifest differently, but the problems exist. However the GAA are not in any way dealing with these problems other than talking about fencing in the Hill. If these guys turn out to be Rovers fans, on conviction they will be banned from every soccer game in Europe.

What have the GAA done to the lad with the hurl in Tipp or the Louth fans?

Glass houses Lynchboy. Its a fair point.

[dublinfella]

i dont care about soccer neanderthals fighting among thmselves either
however  my point is - you are missing this- if that people like roversfella here are pointing fingers at GAA fans behavour equating it with soccer fans.
Thugs are thugs, but only soccer has organised (though badly) hooligans - which is what I am pointing out.

If you don't care, why start the thread? You brought up the comparison, don't go crying when others challenge it.

You did this to try and score points against soccer and it has failed. Whether the trouble is organised or not is irrelevant. The GAA has serious problems at the moment and no structures in place to deal with it.

[lynchbhoy]

there we have it !
this is complete and utter whataboutery from yourself and soccer folks !
until we get GAA fans organising fights and organsing travel to places to cause violence and fight - then GAA fans will be equal to soccer fans.
There are plenty of club soccer matches abandoned in leinster junior leagues and other leagues throughout the seasons. I have known plenty of lads who play and have told me that their game v whoever in finglas had tobe abandoned or that a different team in tallaght had fans encroahing onto the pitch to hit, fight, intimidate players and frequently get the game abandoned if they were losing !
That goes on as much and maybe more in soccer than in GAA !

come back to us with your comparisons when GAA fans start organising buses and fights and tagetting 'rivals pubs' etc !

And there we have what?
Soccer has a problem with hooliganism
The GAA has a problem with hooliganism.
The specific acts may manifest differently, but the problems exist. However the GAA are not in any way dealing with these problems other than talking about fencing in the Hill. If these guys turn out to be Rovers fans, on conviction they will be banned from every soccer game in Europe.
What have the GAA done to the lad with the hurl in Tipp or the Louth fans?
Glass houses Lynchboy. Its a fair point.

nope - i'd say soccer ,GAA, sports and society in Ireland have a problem with thuggery, violence and anti socialbehaviour.

Hovever soccer has a problem with hooliganism - pre-meditated and 'organised' violence not the off the cuff stuff as mentioned previously - ie:
after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park.

[lynchbhoy]

If you don't care, why start the thread? You brought up the comparison, don't go crying when others challenge it.
You did this to try and score points against soccer and it has failed. Whether the trouble is organised or not is irrelevant. The GAA has serious problems at the moment and no structures in place to deal with it.

I am posting this to show that GAA is NOT the same as soccer- as you personally have stated in the past.
this incident (and many others in the past and no dobt in the future proves it)
I dont care about the violence, I am proving the point that they are not the same. If I was a cop or affected by this i'd care!

"after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park. "

pre-meditated and 'organised' violence = hooliganism !

[deiseach]

after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park.

Maybe they just wanted a drink at that fine hostelry . . . okay, not very likely. Carry on.

[dublinfella]

nope - i'd say soccer ,GAA, sports and society in Ireland have a problem with thuggery, violence and anti socialbehaviour.

So now we are getting somehere - we are now justr arguing semantics. I await with interest you posting an article on GAA or rugby "thuggery, violence and anti socialbehaviour."

Hovever soccer has a problem with hooliganism - pre-meditated and 'organised' violence not the off the cuff stuff as mentioned previously - ie:
after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park.

So an unsourced article claims. Nothing on the bohs forum about it, and I would have assumed they would be going mental. Did the cops ask them who they supported when they lagged them?

Is there a bus from Tallaght to Phibsboro? Surely they would have taken the Luas?

Its a sparse article to say the least.

But the fundamental point remains. On or off the cuff is irrelvant. GAA fans shouldn't really be pointing fingers at the minute until our house is cleaner.

[lynchbhoy]

you point the finger all the time but this
"after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park. " shows that soccer hooliganism is alive.

the other acts of thuggery etc are part of society. if this incident was incorrectly reported in the papers, then I expect a libel case against the paper and them publishing an apology.

hooliganism in soccer exists- it doesnt exist in GAA, Rugby, basketball and other sports !
no other sports fans have pre-meditated or 'organised' violence.

this seems to be worse in England and other places regarding soccer.

[dublinfella]

you point the finger all the time but this
"after the match, which took place in Tallaght Stadium, Rovers' home ground, about 20 fans travelled by bus from Tallaght to the Phibsborough House pub on the northside of the city, which is close to Bohemians' home at Dalymount Park. " shows that soccer hooliganism is alive.

the other acts of thuggery etc are part of society. if this incident was incorrectly reported in the papers, then I expect a libel case against the paper and them publishing an apology.

hooliganism in soccer exists- it doesnt exist in GAA, Rugby, basketball and other sports !
no other sports fans have pre-meditated or 'organised' violence.

this seems to be worse in England and other places regarding soccer.

Christ. You are talking yourself in circles. No-one is disputing that the premeditated element is unique to soccer, What people are saying is so what. They have their issues, the GAA have theirs. The idea that one is worse than the other is a cheap and pointless attempt to point score and deflect.

I have no idea what happened in Phibsboro, but I will say that if 20 hooligans levelled a pub I would have expected a huge amount more press and internet chatter on it. The article isn't clear on how they establshed who these lads were and how they ended up in Phibsboro. But thats irrelevant.

[lynchbhoy]

you refused toaccept previously that this kind of thing happened and asked for examples. I didnt trawl the intenet but said I'd give you an example next time it cropped up and didnt expect to have to wait too long. So just giving you your requested example!

at least you acknowledge that soccer hooliganism is pre-meditated and 'organised'.
thats the difference !

as for the other thuggery in society (as I dont think the problem can be labelled purely towards sports fans) - well the law is just way too soft.
the GAA (and other organisations - sporting or otherwise) dont have 'problems' peer se - they just need to put proper procedure and policies surrounding these incidents for future actions.

[dublinfella]

you refused toaccept previously that this kind of thing happened and asked for examples. I didnt trawl the intenet but said I'd give you an example next time it cropped up and didnt expect to have to wait too long. So just giving you your requested example!

at least you acknowledge that soccer hooliganism is pre-meditated and 'organised'.
thats the difference !

as for the other thuggery in society (as I dont think the problem can be labelled purely towards sports fans) - well the law is just way too soft.
the GAA (and other organisations - sporting or otherwise) dont have 'problems' peer se - they just need to put proper procedure and policies surrounding these incidents for future actions.

So to sum up, when there is an incident at soccer its because they are dirt.

When there is an incident at the GAA, its societies fault.

Glad thats settled. 

[Myles Na G.]

Unlike soccer and rugby, which have cleaned up their act in recent years, GAA still presents examples of pre meditated violence on the pitch. The 'one in all in' mentality still prevails in GAA, the idea that the referee can't send everybody off, so if one fella gets involved in a punch up, everyone else dives in too. Not only is that kind of behaviour prevalent in senior GAA matches, but it can also be seen in schools and junior games.

Give me one example of pre meditated violence in a GAA match and I'l give you ten examples of it in rugby or soccer.

http://www.irishcentral.com/sport/GAA-to-launch-inquiry-into-mass-brawl-during-game-82941112.html
http://www.independent.ie/unsorted/features/40-shades-of-fudge-as-darling-buds-turn-gaa-into-fight-club-126573.html
http://www.irishabroad.com/news/irish-voice/sport/Articles/gaa-brawl230408.aspx