Armagh Fans ...give the minors time

[eireogatron]

well, we'll just have to agree to disagree.

eireogatron, if it is me that you are disagreeing with, I don't think we do disagree. When I say that it is not just a question of bringing in a player or two, I don't mean bring in a shed load of minors, I mean develop new tactics, coach existing players as well as bringing in a couple of minors.

apologies matey- thats is what I think!! Although I'm not sure if the players are there, to a national pedigree to challenge for the next few years.

[Armamike]

I don't see the harm in bringing in a few of those minors next year and giving them actual game time in the McKenna cup and league and not just having them warm the bench all year.  In fact i'd say there would be a great opportunity lost if we didn't have the likes of Grugan, McParland, Tasker, McVerry, Murnin in there.  If they're good enough why hold them back?  No they shouldn't be brought in to the team en masse and left to sink or swim, but they have to start their intercounty career at some point so why not let them start gettting that experience from 19/20.  It's not that young.  County sides up and down the country have lads that age playing. Tyrone didn't win the AI until 2003 but they had the 98 minor side personnel getting senior championship experience in 2000.

[illdecide]

Stefan Campbell is ready for senior, he's 6'1" and is broadening out at the shoulders. A few months of the weights and he's sorted although he is quite strong but for inter county you just need that we bit extra

[eireogatron]

I don't see the harm in bringing in a few of those minors next year and giving them actual game time in the McKenna cup and league and not just having them warm the bench all year.  In fact i'd say there would be a great opportunity lost if we didn't have the likes of Grugan, McParland, Tasker, McVerry, Murnin in there.  If they're good enough why hold them back?  No they shouldn't be brought in to the team en masse and left to sink or swim, but they have to start their intercounty career at some point so why not let them start gettting that experience from 19/20.  It's not that young.  County sides up and down the country have lads that age playing. Tyrone didn't win the AI until 2003 but they had the 98 minor side personnel getting senior championship experience in 2000.

i agree totally. Some people though, think that throwing all the minors in next year will win us the All ireland. It wont. As you say, experience is key but not all will be good enough or ready at that stage. Some will, some wont - its the nature of the beast. And even when they are ready it will take a while before "intercounty" standard becomes "all ireland" standard, if at all. No offence to any of them because they're all better players than I, but can you imagine them forming a half forward line and challenging the likes of O'Se, O'Mahony, Jordan, Harte, Gormley, McMahon, animals like O'Leary, Canty & even Freeman, McQuaid et al?

however, whatever way it is approached these young fellas wont be winning a senior AI medal for a few years - we dont have the players at the minute and my argument is with the boys who think we do. Playing for the county at 19 is one thing challenging for major honours against seasoned stars is another.

Might I add, I am not belittling the acheivements or talent of these boys but just calling for some levity in our standing in todays game and the likelihood off a mass influx of teenagers, however talented, raising us to top 5 standing in the next year or 2.

 

[DuffleKing]

I don't see the harm in bringing in a few of those minors next year and giving them actual game time in the McKenna cup and league and not just having them warm the bench all year.  In fact i'd say there would be a great opportunity lost if we didn't have the likes of Grugan, McParland, Tasker, McVerry, Murnin in there.  If they're good enough why hold them back?  No they shouldn't be brought in to the team en masse and left to sink or swim, but they have to start their intercounty career at some point so why not let them start gettting that experience from 19/20.  It's not that young.  County sides up and down the country have lads that age playing. Tyrone didn't win the AI until 2003 but they had the 98 minor side personnel getting senior championship experience in 2000.

i agree totally. Some people though, think that throwing all the minors in next year will win us the All ireland. It wont. As you say, experience is key but not all will be good enough or ready at that stage. Some will, some wont - its the nature of the beast. And even when they are ready it will take a while before "intercounty" standard becomes "all ireland" standard, if at all. No offence to any of them because they're all better players than I, but can you imagine them forming a half forward line and challenging the likes of O'Se, O'Mahony, Jordan, Harte, Gormley, McMahon, animals like O'Leary, Canty & even Freeman, McQuaid et al?

however, whatever way it is approached these young fellas wont be winning a senior AI medal for a few years - we dont have the players at the minute and my argument is with the boys who think we do. Playing for the county at 19 is one thing challenging for major honours against seasoned stars is another.

Might I add, I am not belittling the acheivements or talent of these boys but just calling for some levity in our standing in todays game and the likelihood off a mass influx of teenagers, however talented, raising us to top 5 standing in the next year or 2.

We have the player.

They are not coached. They spend all of their time on conditioning and skill drills.

We have no game plan worth talking about and only a tiny percentage of training time is spent work, adapting, implementing it.

[The Konica]

I don't see the harm in bringing in a few of those minors next year and giving them actual game time in the McKenna cup and league and not just having them warm the bench all year.  In fact i'd say there would be a great opportunity lost if we didn't have the likes of Grugan, McParland, Tasker, McVerry, Murnin in there.  If they're good enough why hold them back?  No they shouldn't be brought in to the team en masse and left to sink or swim, but they have to start their intercounty career at some point so why not let them start gettting that experience from 19/20.  It's not that young.  County sides up and down the country have lads that age playing. Tyrone didn't win the AI until 2003 but they had the 98 minor side personnel getting senior championship experience in 2000.

i agree totally. Some people though, think that throwing all the minors in next year will win us the All ireland. It wont. As you say, experience is key but not all will be good enough or ready at that stage. Some will, some wont - its the nature of the beast. And even when they are ready it will take a while before "intercounty" standard becomes "all ireland" standard, if at all. No offence to any of them because they're all better players than I, but can you imagine them forming a half forward line and challenging the likes of O'Se, O'Mahony, Jordan, Harte, Gormley, McMahon, animals like O'Leary, Canty & even Freeman, McQuaid et al?

however, whatever way it is approached these young fellas wont be winning a senior AI medal for a few years - we dont have the players at the minute and my argument is with the boys who think we do. Playing for the county at 19 is one thing challenging for major honours against seasoned stars is another.

Might I add, I am not belittling the acheivements or talent of these boys but just calling for some levity in our standing in todays game and the likelihood off a mass influx of teenagers, however talented, raising us to top 5 standing in the next year or 2.

We have the player.

They are not coached. They spend all of their time on conditioning and skill drills.

We have no game plan worth talking about and only a tiny percentage of training time is spent work, adapting, implementing it.

That's my views exactly too DuffleKing based on what I've heard.

I also agree fully - Armagh have the players, I don't think the right ones are being picked in the right places however ...

[armaghniac]

We have the playesr.
They are not coached.

I agree completely. The likes of Vernon has obvious talent and with a bit of fine tuning and a proper team plan can make a greater contribution.

[Apple Crumble]

I don't see the harm in bringing in a few of those minors next year and giving them actual game time in the McKenna cup and league and not just having them warm the bench all year.  In fact i'd say there would be a great opportunity lost if we didn't have the likes of Grugan, McParland, Tasker, McVerry, Murnin in there.  If they're good enough why hold them back?  No they shouldn't be brought in to the team en masse and left to sink or swim, but they have to start their intercounty career at some point so why not let them start gettting that experience from 19/20.  It's not that young.  County sides up and down the country have lads that age playing. Tyrone didn't win the AI until 2003 but they had the 98 minor side personnel getting senior championship experience in 2000.

i agree totally. Some people though, think that throwing all the minors in next year will win us the All ireland. It wont. As you say, experience is key but not all will be good enough or ready at that stage. Some will, some wont - its the nature of the beast. And even when they are ready it will take a while before "intercounty" standard becomes "all ireland" standard, if at all. No offence to any of them because they're all better players than I, but can you imagine them forming a half forward line and challenging the likes of O'Se, O'Mahony, Jordan, Harte, Gormley, McMahon, animals like O'Leary, Canty & even Freeman, McQuaid et al?

however, whatever way it is approached these young fellas wont be winning a senior AI medal for a few years - we dont have the players at the minute and my argument is with the boys who think we do. Playing for the county at 19 is one thing challenging for major honours against seasoned stars is another.

Might I add, I am not belittling the acheivements or talent of these boys but just calling for some levity in our standing in todays game and the likelihood off a mass influx of teenagers, however talented, raising us to top 5 standing in the next year or 2.

We have the player.

They are not coached. They spend all of their time on conditioning and skill drills.

We have no game plan worth talking about and only a tiny percentage of training time is spent work, adapting, implementing it.

Similiar to Spillaine's complaint a few years ago about the Armagh boys spending too much time in the gym and not enough on  putting the ball over the bar.

Anyways, lets look forward to next season with some excitement.  I know I am.

[imtommygunn]

Would Clarke not be a good reason not to bring them on??

Clarke is what 26 or so? The fella seems to have been hanging together this last few years. I dunno if that fella will be back right at all.

Don't get me wrong - I hope he gets back to his best soon. It just seems like he is constantly injured.

Also McDonnell won't have too much left in him. If, and that is if, he plays another year I'd say it'll be his last.

[mountainboii]

Would Clarke not be a good reason not to bring them on??

Clarke is what 26 or so? The fella seems to have been hanging together this last few years. I dunno if that fella will be back right at all.

Don't get me wrong - I hope he gets back to his best soon. It just seems like he is constantly injured.

Perhaps, but there were several other members of the 2002 team that progressed to the seniors before the age of twenty and it didn't seem to do them much harm. Indeed, for every Clarke with his injury problems you can point to a Colm Cooper or Sean Cavanagh, who've also been playing senior intercounty since they were 19 and, as far as I can remember, haven't suffered many major problems.

Also McDonnell won't have too much left in him. If, and that is if, he plays another year I'd say it'll be his last.

There's no if about it, he has confirmed he'll be back next year. Also, the way he was name checking the minors gave me the impression that he was intent on sticking around until those lads came through. I'd say he'll be there til the end of the O'Rourke reign anyway, whether that's next summer or two or three years down the line.

[imtommygunn]

I hope he stays round. If those boys could get a year or two playing with him and Clarke they could learn a lot. Throw in Jamie Clarke and plenty for them to learn of. I just hope some of them are good half forwards!

Clarke may or may not be victim of starting too young. Kerry / Tyrone wouldn't have the same pump iron strategy armagh had which could be a factor. Or he could just be injury prone - I guess we'll never know.

[armaghniac]

There's no if about it, he has confirmed he'll be back next year. Also, the way he was name checking the minors gave me the impression that he was intent on sticking around until those lads came through.

This is very welcome news. Padraig Joyce showed how well a "mature" player can do, although like Stevie many of  the younger fellows around him have neither the skill nor the drive that he has. I'd rest Stevie to some extent, and put out some of the younger prospects, although Div 1 makes this hard.

[eireogatron]

We have the playesr.
They are not coached.

I agree completely. The likes of Vernon has obvious talent and with a bit of fine tuning and a proper team plan can make a greater contribution.

you think we have the players to win an AI next year?? HA!

[mackers]

well, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I think bringing minors in en masse is crazy, the entire history of successful GAA teams would appear to side with me.

There's nobody suggesting that we bring minors in en masse. I think all posters agree that ALL the minors mentioned get a go at some stage through the league at various times but not at the same time. That would be crazy. The forward line I listed earlier only had two of them, one on each line, hardly en masse.

[eireogatron]

well, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I think bringing minors in en masse is crazy, the entire history of successful GAA teams would appear to side with me.

There's nobody suggesting that we bring minors in en masse. I think all posters agree that ALL the minors mentioned get a go at some stage through the league at various times but not at the same time. That would be crazy. The forward line I listed earlier only had two of them, one on each line, hardly en masse.

some people on this site and others are actually suggesting that and seem to think AI minor medals give us a devine right to AI senior success, which is not the case IMO. I didnt mention you or your selection, and have already addressed this post earlier in the thread