The Poppy

[delboy]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

In the north, it's a badge of Britishness and little else.  As has been said by others in this thread, the British Legion appeal yearly is for those British soldiers who are still serving as well as those who have left the army - that includes the likes of Clegg, the soldier who shot Aidan McAnesbie etc as well as soliders in Afghanistan, Iraq etc etc

Cleggs name seems to crop up quite a lot in this thread, is there any evidence that he has received any money from the poppy appeal?

You could quite easily stand the badge of britishness stuff on its head, seems to me its more a badge of 'irishness' to reject the poppy and all that it supposedly stands for.

Its bullshit to suggest that people only wear the poppy to get up your nose (some egos on here by the way, a lot of worlds revolving around certain individuals on here). Most people wear it as a mark of respect for the sacrifice of previous generations not because of some petty sectarian nose rubbing exercise.

[ardmhachaabu]

Is there any evidence that any of the murderers in the British Army didn't get money from it?

[delboy]

Is there any evidence that any of the murderers in the British Army didn't get money from it?

If you make an accusation the burden to provide proof is on you, thats the way it normally works (in the real world at least).

[red hander]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6731100.ece

Interesting article from last July ... if anything, things have got worse, sure Nick Griffin's even turning up now

[ardmhachaabu]

delboy, this isn't a court of law.  This is a forum on the internet.  I hope you can see the difference.  In other words, I don't have to prove a thing to you, I made a statement which I will stand by because I believe it to be factual based on evidence I see everyday in the real world

I didn't say that everyone who wears the poppy does so on those grounds, I am sure that people in England, Wales and Scotland would wear it for their own reasons which would have nothing to do with being a badge of Britishness.  I believe that honour goes to some small-minded northern unionists - I don't think that all unionists who wear it do so as a badge of their Britishness, just the majority of thos who wear it

Rejecting the poppy because of what it stands for doesn't make me a better or worse Irishman, just an honest one

That's my opinion, you may not like it and you may not agree with me but that is my opinion

[pintsofguinness]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

Like last year, I have only seen a couple of dozen people with poppies here, I've seen them being sold in one shop this year.  I seen one on a car this morning, isn't that tacky!
I have seen an awful lot more poppies in the 6 counties for weeks surrounding the poppy day and for those reasons my only logical conclusion is that an awful lot of people where them in the North of Ireland as a badge of identity, something to stick in the other crowds faces etc.

[Rav67]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

Like last year, I have only seen a couple of dozen people with poppies here, I've seen them being sold in one shop this year.  I seen one on a car this morning, isn't that tacky!
I have seen an awful lot more poppies in the 6 counties for weeks surrounding the poppy day and for those reasons my only logical conclusion is that an awful lot of people where them in the North of Ireland as a badge of identity, something to stick in the other crowds faces etc.

Been on a course most of the past 2 weeks, think there was 16 trainees so most are mid-late 20s.  One doll wore a poppy on her coat on the way in for about a week, the teacher wore one on the 11th and that's it.  Watching TV you'd think everyone in England wears them flat out for a month.  But then again watching TV and reading the papers you'd swear people over here actually gave a f**k Gordon Brown mis-spelt a squaddie's name.

[Myles Na G.]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

In the north, it's a badge of Britishness and little else.  As has been said by others in this thread, the British Legion appeal yearly is for those British soldiers who are still serving as well as those who have left the army - that includes the likes of Clegg, the soldier who shot Aidan McAnesbie etc as well as soliders in Afghanistan, Iraq etc etc

If you're talking about Lee Clegg, he didn't shoot Aidan McAnespie. He was the para who shot a couple of joyriders in west Belfast.

[AZOffaly]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

I don't for a moment believe the poppy is an inherently in-your-face gesture, especially in Britain. I do think it is just a vehicle to try and get a sense of patriotism and support behind 'the boys' away in Afghanistan, Iraq etc.

I don't think the people I work with in London (a fair few of whom would wear the poppy) are trying to make any sort of statement to me, or to anyone else, other than they remember their dead, and probably that they support their current troops.

In Northern Ireland, the knowledge that it could be taken as provocative by some people, must mean that those who wear it either say feck it, I'm wearing it anyway, and it's their problem if they don't accept I have valid reasons for wearing it, or else they do it to be provocative.

Do people who wear the Easter Lily in NI do so to provoke a response, or do so in spite of the response that might provoke?

I think if you wear it for the right reason, then fair play to you.

[ardmhachaabu]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

In the north, it's a badge of Britishness and little else.  As has been said by others in this thread, the British Legion appeal yearly is for those British soldiers who are still serving as well as those who have left the army - that includes the likes of Clegg, the soldier who shot Aidan McAnesbie etc as well as soliders in Afghanistan, Iraq etc etc

If you're talking about Lee Clegg, he didn't shoot Aidan McAnespie. He was the para who shot a couple of joyriders in west Belfast.

Can you not read the post properly before commenting?  It would save you getting it wrong

[red hander]

If we can ignore the trolls for a moment, how many of us here see the wearing of the poppy as an inherently in-your-face gesture?  I'm not talking about the ubiquity of it on British television or keyboard warriors slandering those who dare to be different, just your attitude to people wearing it in the street

In the north, it's a badge of Britishness and little else.  As has been said by others in this thread, the British Legion appeal yearly is for those British soldiers who are still serving as well as those who have left the army - that includes the likes of Clegg, the soldier who shot Aidan McAnesbie etc as well as soliders in Afghanistan, Iraq etc etc

If you're talking about Lee Clegg, he didn't shoot Aidan McAnespie. He was the para who shot a couple of joyriders in west Belfast.

Can you not read the post properly before commenting?  It would save you getting it wrong

What, and get him to change the habit of a lifetime?

[delboy]

delboy, this isn't a court of law.  This is a forum on the internet.  I hope you can see the difference.  In other words, I don't have to prove a thing to you, I made a statement which I will stand by because I believe it to be factual based on evidence I see everyday in the real world

I didn't say that everyone who wears the poppy does so on those grounds, I am sure that people in England, Wales and Scotland would wear it for their own reasons which would have nothing to do with being a badge of Britishness.  I believe that honour goes to some small-minded northern unionists - I don't think that all unionists who wear it do so as a badge of their Britishness, just the majority of thos who wear it

Rejecting the poppy because of what it stands for doesn't make me a better or worse Irishman, just an honest one

That's my opinion, you may not like it and you may not agree with me but that is my opinion

So your come back is that this is an internet forum and therefore you should be allowed to make all sorts of claims and not have to back them up with any evidence.
That's fair enough but without any evidence to back them up, they are essentially worthless.

That's very generous of you to say that some people don't wear the poppy as some sort of fingers up to you, and that its only the small minded Northern Unionists that do (is there any southern ones anyway? whats with adding the northern?) and a majority at that. Yet another mind reader on here that would give Derren Brown a run for his money, i swear the talent on here is wasted.

Get a grip not everybody goes through their life thinking how they can get one up on the other half or how we could go out of our way to rub their noses in it, some of us don't engage in such petty nonsense (i pity you that you obviously do) some of us have other things to worry about, something called a life.

[Gaoth Dobhair Abu]

But the fact is that while you convince yourself that everyone in the north wears the poppy for the right reason, the rest of us know that a disproportionate number of people (from the one community) in the north wear it, compared to anywhere else why?
Would it be maybe the elephant in the room that you avoid - some unionist/loyalist/protestant people in the north wear it as a "badge of honour" or if you like, a "feck you, we're still here" badge.

[redhugh]

delboy, this isn't a court of law.  This is a forum on the internet.  I hope you can see the difference.  In other words, I don't have to prove a thing to you, I made a statement which I will stand by because I believe it to be factual based on evidence I see everyday in the real world

I didn't say that everyone who wears the poppy does so on those grounds, I am sure that people in England, Wales and Scotland would wear it for their own reasons which would have nothing to do with being a badge of Britishness.  I believe that honour goes to some small-minded northern unionists - I don't think that all unionists who wear it do so as a badge of their Britishness, just the majority of thos who wear it

Rejecting the poppy because of what it stands for doesn't make me a better or worse Irishman, just an honest one

That's my opinion, you may not like it and you may not agree with me but that is my opinion

So your come back is that this is an internet forum and therefore you should be allowed to make all sorts of claims and not have to back them up with any evidence.
That's fair enough but without any evidence to back them up, they are essentially worthless.

That's very generous of you to say that some people don't wear the poppy as some sort of fingers up to you, and that its only the small minded Northern Unionists that do (is there any southern ones anyway? whats with adding the northern?) and a majority at that. Yet another mind reader on here that would give Derren Brown a run for his money, i swear the talent on here is wasted.

Get a grip not everybody goes through their life thinking how they can get one up on the other half or how we could go out of our way to rub their noses in it, some of us don't engage in such petty nonsense (i pity you that you obviously do) some of us have other things to worry about, something called a life.

Of course there is such a thing as a southern Unionist.Do you not think that Orangemen living in the 26 counties would consider themselves Unionist ?Do you not appreciate that these people would rather the link with the UK had been maintained throughout the 32 counties.?Check out the Reform movement for a bit of an insight into Southern Unionist thinking.It's not as black and white as you appear to think.

[nifan]

some unionist/loyalist/protestant people in the north wear it as a "badge of honour" or if you like, a "feck you, we're still here" badge.

Anyone who thinks that noone does it for this reason is deluded.
I do think it is insulting to many people the suggestion that the vast majority do it as a "feck you" which has been suggested by some on this thead