Armagh management :Paddy O'Rourke!!!

[rootthemout]

how did you hear this duffleking?is this another leak?

[DuffleKing]

Peter McDonnell has stepped down as Armagh football manager, citing 'sabotage' from within the county as he reason for doing so.

McDonnell, who had been in charge for two years, claimed last night that he and his selectors Dennis Hollywood, Gary Mallon and Benny O'Kane couldn't continue because "it got to the stage when, no what we were trying to do, we felt we were being undermined".



Stressing that neither the county board or players were responsible for the constant rumours of discontent surrounding the squad, McDonnell said in a parting shot: "We have no issue with the county board and we have no issue with the vast majority of players. It's an issue with certain bodies outside our team and outside our county board.

"We enjoyed the challenge that managing the county senior team presented to us. We felt we were well equipped and up to the task and every man gave his all for the cause. However, from the start of the year, there were stories emanating from sources we found very difficult to identify.

"Articles about people walking away from the panel. There were articles referring to food poisoning and one thing or another. I did try to establish who was furnishing newspapers with this information, but drew a blank. Eventually, we did establish where it was coming from.

"There were stories created, there were fabrications going on, all with the purpose of undermining trust in the group and, indeed, public confidence in the group.

"Yes, there were people who left the panel, yes there were people who were given the choice to walk away or be pushed. The dignified thing is always to say 'it's not for me' and to walk away. We gave people choices.

"The bottom line is that we got the panel we wanted. The panel we had, the players we worked along with, were tremendous and got on very well together. There was a tremendous spirit within the group."

The schoolteacher, who is expected to release a statement in the coming days elaborating on these issues, took over from Joe Kernan in September 2007 and guided the Orchard County to an Ulster SFC title at his first attempt last year.

But after suffering a shock All-Ireland quarter-final loss to Wexford, Armagh failed to make an impression this year with a defeat to Tyrone in the opening round of the Ulster SFC being followed by an extra-time loss to Monaghan in the first round of the All-Ireland qualifiers.

Already, the likes of Brian McAlinden, John Rafferty and even Joe Kernan have been linked with the post. McAlinden guided the under 21s to an Ulster final appearance this year and was joint-manager with Brian Canavan when Armagh won back-to-back Ulster SFC titles in 1999 and 2000.

Rafferty led St. Gall's of Belfast to an All-Ireland club final appearance in 2006, while Kernan was at the helm when Armagh captured their one and only All-Ireland senior crown in 2002.

[irunthev]

What outside influences is he referring to?

It seems fair to say at this point that McDonnell lost the dressing room. Is this not simply an issue between players and management that "outside influences" had little to do with.

And is it also not fair to say that without other "outside influences" Paul Grimley would have become manager in 2007?

Would it be true to say that the outside influence referred to was actually just in the process of closing the door behind him. Looks a bit messy this for Armagh.... the ghosts of an All Ireland past seems to be lurking. The CB need to get this next appointment right as Armagh as a team are some way off the pace at the moment. A long-sighted appointment is what is needed, not that McDonnell wasn't a good appointment, just the process of appointment appears to have been somewhat flawed.

[full back]

we have no issue with the vast majority of players.

[DuffleKing]

I presume he must be referring to the culling process from the start of the league til the championship panel was established?

certainly that's what the following would  infer...

"There were stories created, there were fabrications going on, all with the purpose of undermining trust in the group and, indeed, public confidence in the group.

"Yes, there were people who left the panel, yes there were people who were given the choice to walk away or be pushed. The dignified thing is always to say 'it's not for me' and to walk away. We gave people choices.

"The bottom line is that we got the panel we wanted. The panel we had, the players we worked along with, were tremendous and got on very well together. There was a tremendous spirit within the group."

[Smokin Joe]

Why would JK be plotting against him, seeing as he was (allegedly) responsible for McDonnell getting the job in the first place?

[irunthev]

Why would JK be plotting against him, seeing as he was (allegedly) responsible for McDonnell getting the job in the first place?

It's a good question but then again why would Lance Armstrong get back into a saddle and ride the Tour again, when his team have a perfectly capable rider leading the team. Sometimes it's very hard for winners to take their final bow and maybe the TV work isn't satisfying Joe's soul as much as he thought it would and what with his stated policy of not taking on another county while his sons were still playing for Armagh, then it leaves him with just one option.... manage Armagh again. I haven't a clue if there is any truth in it or not, just playing devil's advocate.

[armaghniac]

Why would JK be plotting against him, seeing as he was (allegedly) responsible for McDonnell getting the job in the first place?

It seems more plausible that those who opposed McDonnell were undermining him than those in favour. But we don't know and all of these conspiracy theories do no good.

[brokencrossbar1]

JK was not working against Peter.  I was told at Easter that something like this was brewing and who was involved.  It is a pity for Peter but I think he was right to walk away from it.  Well done for doing your best Peter, the people who wanted you out have no accolades after their name so you have nothing to be ashamed of.

[yellowcard]

The ambiguous nature of PMcD's statement is going to create more gossip and rumour mongering. Armagh football has continued to wash its dirty linen in public and this shows no sign of ceasing. No doubt people will now want to know exactly who was undermining the management set up.

[Donegal Danny]

If the Armagh Couny Board want any advice on how to appoint their new manager then just ask the Donegal County board for some advice, our boys sure know how to handle the whole process from interviews to making a decision to informing the manager, then appointing another manager and so on and so on. By the way how ever said that Bumpy O Hagen was doing a good onb with Glenswilly obviously doesn't know their Donegal football.

[Donnellys Hollow]

Grimley's golden touch

Although he doesn't get all the plaudits, Kildare's second-in-command has been crucial in breathing life back into the Lilywhites

Ewan MacKenna

One day at a time: Kildare's assistant coach Paul Grimley and Kieran McGeeney speak to the Kildare squad in Croke Park after their All Ireland quarter-final defeat to Cork last year inpho/james crombieThe setting might be a little different these days but you'll note it's the same old Paul Grimley. Still the big lump of a man that found himself doing his bit to chisel away at Armagh-Tyrone relations in Omagh in 1989 when the home dressing room was locked, when a pile-up ensued and when he clocked John Lynch without giving it a second thought. Still the soft voice that so easily and often deceives those that have never crossed his path. Still the inner steel that never bent to Joe Kernan and allowed one giant to always provide the other with an honest and invaluable opinion. Still under-appreciated by the masses. Still a number two.

He's sitting in a Newbridge hotel talking at length about the feats of his latest boss Kieran McGeeney. More precisely, when Kernan took over in Armagh he already had a long list of honours streaming behind him but Geezer was a rookie coming to Kildare. However the similarity is the man lurking in the shadows. Armagh players testified to what Grimley brought as an assistant, mentally in terms of his famed speaking and physically in terms of his ruthless training. Kildare players now are not humming the same tune yet strangely many people would fail to pick him from an identity parade and a google search won't get you past page eight.

"That I'm not the manager has been mentioned to me a number of times," he says, "and it has never been a problem for me. A lot of guys who were number twos went on to be managers but I've no great desire for that. I'm happy working with Kieran, I'm happy in Kildare. The most important thing for me is we work as a team. I only ever wanted one management job. I didn't get it. So I'm happy here."

The job he refers to is Armagh. By the end of 2006, himself and Kernan are said to have fallen out over what former players describe as the use of Stephen Kernan. The player's father felt he should start the Ulster semi-final with Fermanagh. Grimley thought it was too much pressure for the youngster and maintained he'd be better used as a substitute. It saw the disintegration of a management team that had conquered all before them but by 2008 Joe Kernan was gone and Grimley fancied his chances of being Armagh manager.

After spending a year coaching Cavan, he'd gotten word of the massive swell of support for his appointment from the clubs back home, quit the Cavan role because he thought it would be unfair on them to continue and then found out it was all for nothing. Peter McDonnell was given the nod and although he's keen to point out he has a lot of time for McDonnell and doesn't want in any way to play with an already fiery situation, it's impossible to tell his present without delving into his past.

"It hurt me immensely. Still to this day. I'm very sensitive about it. I'm not the most emotional person but if that was on a one-to-10 scale, it's 10. Without pointing fingers here it left a taste that might never go away. But I never turned around and gave the impression I had the right to get the job in front of any other man. I had to go through the proper procedures but the way certain individuals behaved towards me was the most upsetting. After years with them I deserved better.

"People came to me after and gave me each side of the story but I have to take that with a pinch of salt too because the main antagonists in this whole thing were once very close to me. One of the things that really put the nail in the coffin was that my brother rang me at 8.40 to tell me the announcement was on teletext. I hadn't been told at that stage. When something is very close to you and you've soldiered with people for so long and then you find the way they go about their business, it's very difficult. But I suppose this Kildare experience has helped the healing."

When McGeeney threatened to quit playing the game over what had gone on, Grimley asked for a quiet word and told him he'd be a long time retired and that he should go on. But minds had already been made up. And when McGeeney got wind of a job in Kildare, Grimley was the first person he contacted. The two came together to meet their new squad late in 2007 and Grimley noticed similarities with his first night meeting the Armagh panel way back in 2001.

"When I got together with Joe we met the fellas in Newry and I saw a bunch of players that were fed up coming second because they were winners. With Kildare, it was like that too. I was looking at a team that had been through a lot and maybe underachieved even more so than Armagh back then. It was packed with household names in a national sense and maybe I was looking at players who could have had medals but never got them. They'd a good way with them, well-mannered, good attitude, prepared to listen and prepared to work.

"But for myself and Kieran and Niall [Carew, selector] the first year was as much a learning curve for us as it was for them adapting to our way of thinking. When we got relegated in the league, we realised it was going to take two or three years to get where we wanted to go. When we lost to Wicklow in the championship we realised we were trying to make an Ulster team out of them and that model doesn't work everywhere. These guys had their own identity and qualities that the Armagh team hadn't. We had to get the common denominator, weld it all together and create a team that was capable of going to the top and staying there. We're probably on the second leg of that journey."

Oisín McConville is convinced Grimley's two favourite words in the English language are tackle and grid, the latter referring to the three-on-three games he set up in small squares that gave Armagh their granite edge. Grimley began to see that same intensity in training this year with Kildare and is convinced they now have the honesty to succeed and no longer have the hiding places to hold them back. His only surprise is how quickly it's all happened.

Then again, he shouldn't be. While the northern attitude may have failed on the pitch for Kildare, it's helped them endlessly off it. Grimley and McGeeney introduced a fine of €20 for any player not in the dressing room a half an hour prior to start time; they brought in former rugby international Willie Anderson to talk to the players, just as Armagh had done in the late 1990s, and were forced to admit their faults, strengths and opinions on teammates openly; they went out more often; they had a Christmas party this year in Time, Naas; they even began a charity white-collar boxing tournament.

"With me and Kieran, he'd ask me about certain things and I'd give him an opinion straight up. We mightn't like what we say to each other but it's always straight and the one thing about McGeeney is there's no behind backs, he doesn't talk with both sides of his mouth. All that makes the friendship extremely strong and a management team really strong. And all these things we did, it was to help the players bond, get their friendship really strong. It has helped us along, that togetherness and the players now socialise together which is fine. It's led to harder training, honesty from guys on the field, they are honest with each other. Everything is going really well."

In fact just about the only thing Kildare have been troubled by is referees. After the 27-8 free-count against Wexford, they invited that day's official Cormac Reilly to a training session. "The best thing that should be happening is giving referees a wider role. They should be coming to training sessions. The likes of this big game on Sunday, why couldn't he come into us on a Tuesday and them on a Thursday, give all the players a rundown of what he expects? And I do believe referees on the back of that should be semi-professional."

Perhaps one for the future, but as for today? "I think these boys have started something off, have turned a corner no matter what happens on Sunday. I feel within the next five years these guys have All Ireland potential. My job is to support Kieran and Kieran will stay on here as long as they want him. We got three years, it's up next year and we'll see from there but this is no stepping stone for some other job. This is a side we want to take to the top."

Belief, passion, success and a surge towards the top. It's still the same old Paul Grimley alright.

emackenna@tribune.ie­

July 12, 2009

http://www.tribune.ie/article/2009/jul/12/grimleys-golden-touch/

[INDIANA]

I think it would be a mistake if JK goes back. His legacy is intact- going back and failing would undermine that. This is a total rebuild job in contrast to the team he took over.

For the sake of his sons he shouldn't go back.

Heard good things about Rafferty - maybe they should look at him.

[armaghniac]

For the sake of his sons he shouldn't go back.

Absolutely agree. The sons are good enough to be on the panel, but their involvement will always be contentious if the Da is managing the team.

[INDIANA]

For the sake of his sons he shouldn't go back.

Absolutely agree. The sons are good enough to be on the panel, but their involvement will always be contentious if the Da is managing the team.

Exactly- which is why I feel he won't go back. Lose a game and thats the first thing that will be dragged up.