Players grants to be axed - when will the strike start?

[Maguire01]

Can you not read? The point doesn't remain.
Carlow hurlers are more likely to receive €1,400. Also, we haven't determined whether they even have a third choice keeper.

Your point was whether they were worth €5,000 per year to the tax payer. That point is irrelevant as they're only getting about a third of that.

€2,500 for those playing through to September is a pretty insignificant sum and in the context of what the GAA generates in taxes, the burden on the tax payer minimal.

If its so insignificant and have a minimal impact, sure why don't the GAA fund it?

I generate loads in poxy taxes, am I entitled to be paid for my hobbies? Or of more pressing relevance, will other sports not be entitled to it as well?

Its a bad scheme and I'm happy its shelved for a number of reasons, not least that paying GAA players is not a role the state should be involved it.

I think it has been explained many times as to why the GAA doesn't fund it. If you don't know the answer to this question by now, you really shouldn't be engaging in this debate.

You might generate plenty of taxes, but do your hobbies? And I though other sports people did get grants?

And you need to keep up - latest developments (as of yesterday) are that the level of the grant will be reduced but the scheme will not be shelved. I think that's fair enough, given that people in general employment are taking pay cuts at the current time.

The GAA won't fund it because they claim they can't afford it. But according to you its an 'insignificant' amount. €35m would pay for the smear tests the Dept of Health cancelled for lack of funds.

No other team game in Ireland gets these grants, only Olympians.

The sense of entitlement from some in the GAA on this is worrying.

What is significant to the Government and what's significant to the GAA aren't the same thing. Anyway, that's irrelevant - the GAA aren't paying out because that would undermine their amateur ethos, it's not about the monetary amount.

And who's talking about £35m? I thought it was £3.5m?

[Gnevin]

But alright to spend millions on a free Stadium for a useless shower of sponging Soccer cnuts.

Free?

I think there is a slight difference between the state providing sports infrastructure for the community, which all sports fans will agree is a good thing, and the state directly paying players.

The state is giving grants to players not paying them. Do you have a problem with the grants the state gives to multinationals, the arts  and culture?

[Zulu]

I said I don't think its the best use of tax resources, but don't have a huge problem with it. I am into sport, and if it helps attract world class players to rugby and a better calibre to the LoI, so what?

So you have no problem with the state propping up sport clubs because it helps bring in better players (or retain them) but you don't think the government should provide grants to players who put in a massive committment to their sport? The money that the government gains through big games (not clubhouse bars) is far in excess of what they are paying out through grants.  By the way, by not paying the players the GAA has been able to provide a sporting infrastructure that would have cost the state billions over the years. And still you think the minimal amout the government is giving the players is an issue? Let me ask you this (as a lover of sport) do you think the government should pay if the players said they would stop playing, surely you feel they should as you think the tax break is justified to keep top players from other sports in this country?

[dublinfella]

So you have no problem with the state propping up sport clubs because it helps bring in better players (or retain them) but you don't think the government should provide grants to players who put in a massive committment to their sport? The money that the government gains through big games (not clubhouse bars) is far in excess of what they are paying out through grants.  By the way, by not paying the players the GAA has been able to provide a sporting infrastructure that would have cost the state billions over the years. And still you think the minimal amout the government is giving the players is an issue? Let me ask you this (as a lover of sport) do you think the government should pay if the players said they would stop playing, surely you feel they should as you think the tax break is justified to keep top players from other sports in this country?

I don't think showing commitment to a hobby entitles you to a handout from the state.

What money does the Govt gain from big games by the way? If anything that is an argument for grants towords infrastructure, which the GAA get.

[dublinfella]

The state is giving grants to players not paying them. Do you have a problem with the grants the state gives to multinationals, the arts  and culture?

None whatsoever. But of those, arts are the only ones that get grants and in that case its to subsidise people to make a living in something that as a society we deem important to have - musicians, artists, writers.

I don't think GAA players fall into that category.

Put another way. If as its rumoured the grant is abolished, can you see many people stopping playing as a result? Not me.

[Zulu]

What money does the Govt gain from big games by the way? If anything that is an argument for grants towords infrastructure, which the GAA get.

Tax on tickets, food, drink etc. I'll put it another way, if the IC scene folded up at the end of the year would the government be out of pocket next year?

Put another way. If as its rumoured the grant is abolished, can you see many people stopping playing as a result? Not me.

And if it was abolished for artists would painters stop painting or musicians stop playing?

If you were arguing that neither IC GAA players or LoI/rugby players should get any tax breaks I could see your argument and it would at least be consistent. But you don't have a problem with sports people who already get well paid getting a further (government paid) bonus while amateurs, who by the way, provide far more to this country than any painter get nothing. The grant was justified on the basis that soccer and rugby players were getting this tax break, if both go, fine but there is no justification for keeping one and getting rid of the other.

[cornafean]

Tax on tickets, food, drink etc.

There are no taxes on tickets for or admission to GAA games.
People must eat regardless of whether they attend intercounty games.
Claiming responsibility for x number of millions of Euro spent on drink every year might well harm the GAA's reputation.

[INDIANA]

The bottom line for me out of this debate is very simple. there are too many people out of work in this country to be giving grants to GAA players and tax breaks to highly paid professional players. Both should be scrapped in my opinion.

[dublinfella]

Tax on tickets, food, drink etc. I'll put it another way, if the IC scene folded up at the end of the year would the government be out of pocket next year?

No VAT on tickets in the 26, so to answer your question, no. In fact it would save on the amount of Gardai it has to deploy.

And if it was abolished for artists would painters stop painting or musicians stop playing?

As a living, probably.

If you were arguing that neither IC GAA players or LoI/rugby players should get any tax breaks I could see your argument and it would at least be consistent. But you don't have a problem with sports people who already get well paid getting a further (government paid) bonus while amateurs, who by the way, provide far more to this country than any painter get nothing. The grant was justified on the basis that soccer and rugby players were getting this tax break, if both go, fine but there is no justification for keeping one and getting rid of the other.

Again, I think there are two seperate arguments. You can't justify paying amateurs on an economic basis. Its ludicrious.

I have said that the tax break for professional sportsmen should go in the current climate.

[Gnevin]

The state is giving grants to players not paying them. Do you have a problem with the grants the state gives to multinationals, the arts  and culture?

None whatsoever. But of those, arts are the only ones that get grants and in that case its to subsidise people to make a living in something that as a society we deem important to have - musicians, artists, writers.

I don't think GAA players fall into that category.

Put another way. If as its rumoured the grant is abolished, can you see many people stopping playing as a result? Not me.

So in other words the big sport and cultural organisation in the country isn't important to society. That's a good one but can you be serious in your next reply

[Gnevin]

Tax on tickets, food, drink etc. I'll put it another way, if the IC scene folded up at the end of the year would the government be out of pocket next year?

No VAT on tickets in the 26, so to answer your question, no. In fact it would save on the amount of Gardai it has to deploy.

And if it was abolished for artists would painters stop painting or musicians stop playing?

As a living, probably.

If you were arguing that neither IC GAA players or LoI/rugby players should get any tax breaks I could see your argument and it would at least be consistent. But you don't have a problem with sports people who already get well paid getting a further (government paid) bonus while amateurs, who by the way, provide far more to this country than any painter get nothing. The grant was justified on the basis that soccer and rugby players were getting this tax break, if both go, fine but there is no justification for keeping one and getting rid of the other.

Again, I think there are two seperate arguments. You can't justify paying amateurs on an economic basis. Its ludicrious.

I have said that the tax break for professional sportsmen should go in the current climate.

You mean the same amount of Garda that are required at a All-Ireland as required at a Rovers and Bohs game?

[Gnevin]

Tax on tickets, food, drink etc.

There are no taxes on tickets for or admission to GAA games.
People must eat regardless of whether they attend intercounty games.
Claiming responsibility for x number of millions of Euro spent on drink every year might well harm the GAA's reputation.

Yes but people can eat at home , don't need to get a taxi or drive too the game etc. The GAA and sport keeps wealth in the country.

[dublinfella]

So in other words the big sport and cultural organisation in the country isn't important to society. That's a good one but can you be serious in your next reply

Of course it is, and that is why the GAA get more in capital grants than any other sport for facilities.

There is no correlation between the GAAs sporting and cultural importance and the state paying IC players.

Its an Irish solution. They are still amateur so long as someone else is paying them. Next it will be sponsors handing over cash. And the slippery slope begins.

[cornafean]

Yes but people can eat at home , don't need to get a taxi or drive too the game etc. The GAA and sport keeps wealth in the country.

Sorry, I don't understand your logic. Driving to and from games doesn't "keep wealth in the country", on the contrary it increases our petrol/diesel imports. And the extra economic benefit to the State of someone eating a bag of chips outside a match in Clones compared to them having their dinner at home while watching the match is marginal to the point of negligible.

[Gnevin]

Yes but people can eat at home , don't need to get a taxi or drive too the game etc. The GAA and sport keeps wealth in the country.

Sorry, I don't understand your logic. Driving to and from games doesn't "keep wealth in the country", on the contrary it increases our petrol/diesel imports. And the extra economic benefit to the State of someone eating a bag of chips outside a match in Clones compared to them having their dinner at home while watching the match is marginal to the point of negligible.

I could stay at home watch the match and buy a phone on ebay net lose to the country 200. I go to match a lot of that money is stay in Ireland.