Lions 2009 thread

[Donnellys Hollow]

Today was probably the Lions' best chance of a test win given that you'd have felt beforehand that the Springboks might be a bit undercooked and the next test will be at altitude. There's plenty of positives to take from the second half performance though and the series isn't done and dusted yet. Roberts and O'Driscoll carved them open in the last quarter but they had been starved of ball all day.

Vickery got absolutely mullered in the scrum and this set the tone. Euan Murray's destructiveness was badly missed. I've never really rated Adam Jones but in fairness to the guy he did a good job in helping stabalise the scrum in the second half. Lee Mears' darts were poor and he was blown away physically. I'd like to see Ross Ford given an opportunity - far more physical and a big ball carrier.

I too think Croft's tries masked a fairly disappointing performance. He doesn't have enough dog in him compared to someone like Ferris. That said, Wally and Heaslip weren't any better but it's always hard for a backrow when you're backpeddling on your own scrum.

The backs looked threatening anytime they got ball and they'll do damage if the forwards can get some sort of parity next week. Phillips was impressive at the base and Stephen Jones was solid enough apart from the place-kicking. He has a quare way of kicking the ball from the floor and it can often go wrong for him. ROG should see some gametime next week. Monye is probably the only other back who is under threat assuming Byrne is out. He was caught in no mans land in the build up to the first try and any international class winger should be putting away the two opportunities that came his way. He had the ball in the wrong hand on both occasions and went in far too high and upright.

[tyroneboi]

If only Bowe had have got the opportunities Monye got today you would think he would have got at least one of them. Still think Jones is a better option than ROG. I think ROG kicks far too much ball away and they way the centres played today, they need the ball to stay in hand as much as possible. If Hook recovers then ROG might not even make the 22.

Edit: I see Mr Jones from The Times only gave O'Driscoll a 7/10 ...  thought he deserved more than that. He did give O'Connell a 7 as well though which surprised me even more given his negative comments about him before and throughout the tour.

[Bord na Mona man]

I can only go by justin.tv pictures, but Monye and Vickery really cost the Lions a fistful of points.
Too much could be read into the comeback though.
South Africa wouldn't have emptied the bench and replaced half their team if the game was in the balance.

Starting Luke Fitzgerald and Adam Jones the next day looks fairly obvious, but it might be a completely different game with a couple of other players getting shown up.
The centre combination of Roberts and O'Driscoll looks like the most likely source of a Lions victory the next day.
McGeechan should consider starting James Hook as he is the best option to get the line moving.
Mike Phillips wasn't 8/10 as Jones in the Times rated him and could do with getting his passes away quicker.
I'd nearly chance giving Shane Williams game time. His form is poor, but he is capable of finishing like no one else on the squad can.

[Capt Pat]

With regards to playing the game at altitude I think it might be wise to give O'Gara the game as he is the better tactical kiaker and the ball travels further at altitude. O'Gara has also been more accurate when kicking for goal on this tour and this might really count in what will I expect be a dog fight of a game next week.

I suppose the glass is half full with Croft, but I would be certain that 2 tries like those do not make you world class. I think anyone in the oack including the props would have scored them. He was in the right place at the right time that is fannying about in midfield with O'Drisoll and Roberts. He gives you soemthing good but then you are losing something elsewhere.

[Donnellys Hollow]

Just watching the Churchill Cup Final - any chance they'll call up Neil Best for the second test!! 

[gawa316]

Team versus emerging Spring Bok

British and Irish Lions: 15 Keith Earls (Munster/Ireland), 14 Shane Williams (Ospreys/Wales), 13 Riki Flutey (London Wasps/England), 12 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster/Ireland), 11 Luke Fitzgerald (Leinster/Ireland), 10 Ronan O'Gara (Munster/Ireland), 9 Harry Ellis (Leicester Tigers/England), 8 Andy Powell (Cardiff Blues/Wales), 7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff Blues/Wales), 6 Joe Worsley (London Wasps/England), 5 Nathan Hines (Perpignan/Scotland), 4 Donncha O'Callaghan (Munster/Ireland), 3 John Hayes (Munster/Ireland), 2 Ross Ford (Edinburgh/Scotland), 1 Tim Payne (London Wasps/England).

Replacements: 16 Lee Mears (Bath/England), 17 Phil Vickery (London Wasps/England), 18 Simon Shaw (London Wasps/England), 19 David Wallace (Munster/Ireland), 20 Mike Blair (Edinburgh/Scotland), 21 James Hook (Ospreys/Wales), 22 Ugo Monye (Harlequins/England).

[Donnellys Hollow]

They're taking the piss calling up Tim Payne. I'm sure if he wasn't a Wasps player he wouldn't have even been considered. I've always been impressed with David Flatman's scrummaging and he gave Tony Buckley a very hard time of it last night. I'd have had both Marcus and even Cian Healy ahead of Payne as well.

Good to see the Bull in the front row - what a great servant to Munster and Ireland. O'Gara needs to impose himself on this game right from the start and I suspect whichever one of the wings plays better will leapfrog Monye for Saturday.

[johnneycool]

Just watching the Churchill Cup Final - any chance they'll call up Neil Best for the second test!! 

Is Best back after his gouging, always rated him for his abrasive approach?

[CiKe]

anyone see the game? O'Gara taken off after 44 minutes but from BBC looks like he played quite well. Is that an indication he will start? I'm not Rog's biggest fan but think he has been best outhalf on tour and probably deserves his place. Seems O'Callaghan also had decent game and Earls scored the try. Have seen a few negative comments about Fitzgerald however, which probably means that if Lee Byrne is fit, Kearney will get the nod on the wing.

[DennistheMenace]

anyone see the game? O'Gara taken off after 44 minutes but from BBC looks like he played quite well. Is that an indication he will start? I'm not Rog's biggest fan but think he has been best outhalf on tour and probably deserves his place. Seems O'Callaghan also had decent game and Earls scored the try. Have seen a few negative comments about Fitzgerald however, which probably means that if Lee Byrne is fit, Kearney will get the nod on the wing.

The BBC opinion is quite the opposite

Chances were at a premium at Newlands because of the heavy rain and sodden pitch and few of the Lions were able to stake a claim for inclusion in the second Test.

Luke Fitzgerald was a notable exception, proving sharp in attack and solid in defence.

[screenexile]

Yeah the word is that Byrne won't make it which means Kearney at FB and I think Fitzgerald will get the nod at wing. Stuart Barnes seems to have a bit of a hard on for Williams but I don't think Williams is as sharp as Fitzgerald at the minute.

There will be a completely different front row with probably all 3 Welsh lads to start as well as probably Simon Shaw or DOC at lock, I would favour Shaw. I think there has to be a change in the back row with Willams getting in there somehow. I think he's far too good/inspirational a player to be leaving on the bench for a big game like this. It will be interesting to see the selection!

Can't see ROG taking Jones' place at the minute actually I think Hook offers you more from the bench which would see ROG relegated completely. All my opinion though and not knowing a hell of a lot about Rugby it can be taken with a pinch of salt. I think we have a great chance this weekend again. Is it true that S.A. only worked a maximum of 4 phases in the whole of the First Test? That's some statistic!

[CiKe]

glad to hear that, was just the comments on the 606 board along with the text updates. I'm sure I probably suffer from a bit of bias myself but there isn't too much like the Lions for bringing out the bias in those across the water

[Roger]

Just watching the Churchill Cup Final - any chance they'll call up Neil Best for the second test!! 

Is Best back after his gouging, always rated him for his abrasive approach?

He got banned at the start of October for 18 weeks.   He was back in time some of the Ireland A in Feb / March but played a game instead for Northampton in the league.

[Hound]

ROG missed a sitter of a kick in the early stages, but played well after that. The early substitution was pre-planned, and O'Gara has at least secured his place on the bench ahead of Hook. But not sure he did enough to get ahead of Jones.

Never been a big fan of O'Callaghan, don't think I'd have him in the Ireland side (Cullen), but I think he's played well on this tour and again played well today. As did Shaw. I'd pick DOC on Saturday - Shaw gives away too many pens for my liking.

Very difficult for the backs, conditions were awful. Earls was probably the pick of them, but he's not a contender for Saturday. Very little to choose between Luke and Shane. If Byrne is fit I'd play him at 11 and Kearney at 15 (Kearney the steadier at full back, Byrne the better finisher). By the sounds of things though Byrne won't be fit, so 11  is up for grabs. I really hope they don't give Monye another chance. Interesting hearing both Greenwood and Evans saying Monye deserves to be dropped after Wallace said he would give him another go.

[DennistheMenace]

Moyne decision making is terrible, possible impact sub but I certainly wouldn't start him in the next test.