2009 Grand Slam Champions

[passedit]

Going back to the mid seventies I can think of two above average Irish scrum halves (Three if you count Kyran Bracken), Colm Patterson and John Robbie. Neither had particularly long careers so no, no golden age.

If this is the Colin Patterson who got three test caps for the Lions, I think only "above average" is a little stingy.  I'm no fan of Instonians but I couldn't really say anything other than he was a brilliant scrum half. 

The above average was more for Robbie than him tbh as i didn't think a list of 1 was particularly insightful. Any others?

[Roger]

Going back to the mid seventies I can think of two above average Irish scrum halves (Three if you count Kyran Bracken), Colm Patterson and John Robbie. Neither had particularly long careers so no, no golden age.

If this is the Colin Patterson who got three test caps for the Lions, I think only "above average" is a little stingy.  I'm no fan of Instonians but I couldn't really say anything other than he was a brilliant scrum half. 

The above average was more for Robbie than him tbh as i didn't think a list of 1 was particularly insightful. Any others?

I liked Rob Saunders and thought he was a quality player

Aherne and Bradley were probably average enough but Chris Saveramutto and Conor McGuiness were shite.

[bcarrier]

Scrum-half Guide
By Ian Diddams
(A prop, who has played scrum half twice and ended up in hospital once because of it.)


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The scrum half is in essence the lynch pin of a rugby team. It is his or her function to link the awesome power of the pack with the lithe, silky skills of the three-quarters (via a poncy character known as a fly-half, but that's another guide for another day). Unless you are playing in New Zealand and Australia, where he is the only half back, and links the awesome power of the pack with a couple of math graduates that think they are slightly better than him, but not as good as the players outside themselves.
All very confusing. Which sums up scrum-half play in a nutshell. Should he pass? Should he kick? Should he run? And whichever tactic is chosen, he's guaranteed to upset at least two-thirds of his team as they would have done something completely different. (Especially the second rows, who never run anywhere anyway, can't pass for toffee, and wouldn't know how to kick if you asked them.) This is not helped by the schizophrenic nature of the scrum-half's position: is he a ninth forward, or an eighth back? Or perhaps a second ball (as often happens when playing behind a soundly-beaten pack)?

Scrum halves are always Napoleonic in stature. That is, short little bastards always causing strife, occasionally one-handed. They are very stroppy characters, always looking for a fight, and when having found one drags the nearest prop in to sort it out for him. They must have an A-level in niggling, treading on their opponents' feet and kicking loose-head props in the shins when the ref isn't looking.

Every scrum half is a frustrated No. 8. However, nature was cruel and only gave the player five foot two inches of height to use. This never stops scrum halves from playing like No. 8s when given the chance - i.e. running away from support on looping runs, and attempting to tackle the biggest player on the opposite side head on at pace.

The most important part of a scrum half is his mouth. This is so he can spend eighty minutes a week telling other players what they should be doing, especially the incredibly heroic props that arrive late to each ruck and maul because they have single-handedly just gotten up last from the previous one. A non-stop stream of advice can be heard from a scrum-half advising players of which opponent to tackle, where the ball is, where he wants it, which way to go, which arm to bite, etc. Great consternation and abuse will follow if these instructions are not followed instantaneously and fully. However, advice given to a scrum half, such as "pass right, three man overlap" will be studiously ignored, such as box-kicking, as the scrum half has a better vision of the game whilst being surrounded by large forwards than some silly nonce of a centre with nothing near him for twenty yards except an undefended goal line. The kick will be defended with the retort "I could see that their full back was out of position and I wanted to bury him to put him off his game."

Scrum halves are often described as terriers. This is because they are short little yappy things that leave their owners in the shit half the time, and smell.

Scrum halves must have a distinguishing feature. Welsh scrum halves must have large and ridiculous moustaches and sideburns. Scottish scrum halves must have hairy knees (not difficult being Scottish). Irish scrum halves must have foreign sounding names; they can never be called O'Reardon, or O'Reilly, or anything vaguely Irish. Like Paddy Guinness. English scrum halves must have a disabling limp (usually caused by an errant New Zealand flanker), or a stupid name. "Nigel" is a good start, and some have improved upon this with ridiculous double-barreled names like Wibblington-Skrunge, Twattingly-Bottom or Wankington-Toenails

Finally, your average scrum-half is a source, off the pitch, of constant amusement. He can be relied upon to get drunk before everyone else due to his small size, will be the first to lead the singing, and have a very handy party trick involving a balloon and his penis. He will also be the one member of a touring party that will have an embarrassing and totally hilarious encounter with a prostitute and a policeman.

Hope this is of some help.

But probably not...

[bcarrier]

Not Boss again ever please.

O'Leary is improving....a better break and tackle than other options IMO.

[thebandit]

I don't know much about rugby but the scrum half who only ever passes the ball to O'Gara didn't do too badly to score the winning try in a European final by capitalising on that perception of him.

Stringer scored a good try against that team as he noticed the winger goes out of position.  However, if by chance that winger had stayed in position, Stringer would have been made to look a complete mug whereas other scrum halves would maybe have carried it off anyway. As it happened it was a well taken try.  Not worth basing his Ireland selection, and many many other caps on that though.

Also, I appreciate O'Leary's footballing qualities, but it's surely a liability to the team that he takes more time over his passes than a kicker does with his place kicks. The opposition has enough time to take a rest, have a meeting, go for a slash and when they come back O'Leary is still thinking, pondering, wondering, planning - and then, unless he's inside the opposition 22 he'll kick it away anyhow. When Stringer comes on you can see the team immediately look more likely to score.  That's how it looks to me anyway.

Reddan is better than O'Leary in my opinion.  Boss is better than O'Leary.  O'Leary is better than Stringer.

I take your point though that with those mad Italians intent on tackling like gangs of dervishes all game, a good option may be someone who can shift the ball as far away from the pack as possible regardless of where or why the ball goes there.  In that instance Stringer's forte would be applicable. However, against all other teams Stringer adds nothing these days at all.  He would be 4th choice #9 in Ireland for me.

I wouldn't let Isaac Boss carry the water bottles

[The GAA]

Team for England named at lunctime. is wallace and d'arcy the only call to be made?
i think he'll go with the same starting 15 for the third time in a row.

[muppet]

Team for England named at lunctime. is wallace and d'arcy the only call to be made?
i think he'll go with the same starting 15 for the third time in a row.

I'd love to see Earls in the squad but it won't happen. The other young guns Luke and Rob have done well so we shouldn't be afraid of throwing him in.

[Roger]

Team for England named at lunctime. is wallace and d'arcy the only call to be made?

I'm not aware of injuries but I'd say that inside centre is the only performance call. It would be hard on Wallace who has had a couple of very unfortunate injuries but D'Arcy is the more natural choice.  Wouldn't care which way it went.

[The GAA]

It seems kidney is deliberately taking the kicking away from ROG early in these games - presumably to disrupt the opposition back row's plans to get at him. O'Leary's box kicks and the use of wallace at 12 are central to that and i expect wallace to remain for that reason

[Hoof Hearted]

ireland uncganged, Mick O'D in place of Mal O'Kelly in the subs is only change

[Hound]

Unchanged starting line-up is fair enough I suppose.

I can't go Mick O'Driscoll at all. I don't think he's anywhere near international level. I'd definitely have Bob Casey ahead of him.

A bit strange that O'Kelly has gone from sub to not even in the panel. Something happened behind the scences I reckon.

[peterquaife]

since the move up to Croker, we usually go to Quinns (ye gotta miss those big beef baps in Scruffy Murphys done Lansdowne way)..but i called into a bar near enough to the cat and cage on route to the Wales game last year for a quick stout, it had a good outdoor area at the back with BBQ's on match days. Has a long bar to the right as you head in and the toilets are upstairs. anyone know the name of it?

always nervous when ireland have the favourite tags

PQ

[Croí na hÉireann]

The Iveagh House???

[peterquaife]

The Iveagh House???

that rings a bell, cheers. Malcolm O'Kelly was enjoying some stoutage in there before the Welsh game last year, by all accounts, he might well be in again this Saturday!

PQ

[FermGael]

England team to face Ireland in Dublin on 28 February:

D Armitage; Sackey, Tindall, Flutey, Cueto; Flood, Ellis;
Sheridan, Mears, Vickery; Borthwick, Kennedy; Haskell, Worsley, Easter.
Replacements: Hartley, White, Croft, Narraway, Care, Goode, Tait.