Loughnane goes mad again!

[orangeman]

One thig for sure, he's always went against convention and always took on the authorities. He always believed in riding the donkey near the tail.


I'm not surprised by him any more but he made the best of a decent Clare team in the 90s and was the man to bring Liam to Clare.


For that alone he'll always be remembered even if he's not loved by everyone. But then again, he never set out to be everyone's friend. He knew that in order to win, you had to fall out with some people.


He never apologised for this and never felt the need to even to this day.


He's a bit of a free spirit and was a very driven man who pushed players to the brink and sometimes beyond in order to try and achieve success.

Modern day hurlers probably would find it very difficult to appreciate his greatness.

[NAG]

I think thats what you get when you demand the level of commitment and drive from a team in the way that he did. He wasnt the rational cold and calcullating Mickey Harte or Cody for that matter. He had massive passion and that transmitted to the players and was the driving force behind that era of Clare hurling. But with that comes conflict which he never dealt with well.

I would say that is the reason behind him falling out with alot of people around the place he has high standards and if people dont measure up then they are cast aside.

I think maybe he took himself a little too seriously after the Clare era and is now starting to realise ths a bit.

[AZOffaly]

The thing about that is that it's not sustainable, either for the team, the man himself or the county as a whole. He ruled by a mixture of fear, awe and passion. Driving men to their limits and getting the absolute maximum from a relatively limited bunch, with a few notable exceptions of course.

But that can't last, and 3 or 4 years was longer than I thought it would even then. At some point the fear and awe is replaced by contempt and indifference by the players, and that's when the bubble bursts. And his legacy to Clare was all based around the pressure, pressure game, which has been matched and surpassed by the good teams now, and Ger never left a 'style' of play in Clare that they could build on. Quite simply if you match Clare physically, you beat them.

With other counties, he's never going to reproduce that level of intensity, either in himself or his charges. And in this modern era, the players are much more likely to skip the fear and awe stage and go straight for contempt and indifference to a lad who was never anything to them other than a mad Clare hoor.

When that spark is taken away, I don't think Loughnane has the hurling mind of a Donal O'Grady, Brian Cody or the like. He's trying to recapture the fire in himself, and pass it on to a bunch of people who have been raised on dieticians, psychologists, training regimes tailored to their bodies and sponsored gear. It's tilting at windmills.

[Zulu]

IMO the man is entirely overrated he won AI's with Clare on the basis of getting the players fitter and more driven than their opponents, having some outstanding players and Kilkenny and Cork being at their weakest in the past 30 odd years. He should be a hero in Clare but instead many loath him and if he was any good he would have achieved a bit more with Galway than he did. Great managers are able to re-evaluate if things aren't going right but Ger was incapable of doing this. As far as I can see the man is a nut job who has a place in the GAA hierarcy that is based on being a bit 'left field' rather than on real substance.

[AZOffaly]

I think that's his limitation Zulu. Plan A is work the bollox off lads, and try and turn them into psychos, while at the same time playing games in the media like a poor man's Alex Ferguson. When that doesn't work, he can't adapt tactically, or in his approach, and Plan B is to try Plan A harder, with a few 'home truths'* via the media.

For home truths, read self serving pronouncements about how it's someone else's fault.

[Zulu]

I agree totally AZ and I think it is time this guy slung his hook, I can understand some mud slinging in the papers if I guy is extremely frustrated with a particular situation or if he feels he needs to bring something out in the open for the good of the GAA. But Loughnane just opens up on everyone while seeming to take little or no responsibility himself. I mean he didn't even accept he was wrong not to name the team V Clare in Cusack Park until 5 minutes before throw in. Anyone who can't admit when they are clearly wrong will never learn from their mistakes and is therefore a fool IMO. Yet some people will try to tell you this fella was one of the great managers in hurling.

[magpie seanie]

All that is probably true lads but I would suggest that Donal O'Grady, Brian Cody or anyone else would not have won an All-Ireland with Clare. I think his borderline lunacy was needed to bring success to Clare. Winning things with counties that haven't done so previously is notoriously hard.

[AZOffaly]

I'd say he was one of the great motivators in hurling, but not one of the great managers. He was basically a one trick pony, and the trick was never going to be sustainable or transferrable. He did provide great days for Clare in the 1990s, but it was very much a case of the right man at the right time.

[AZOffaly]

All that is probably true lads but I would suggest that Donal O'Grady, Brian Cody or anyone else would not have won an All-Ireland with Clare. I think his borderline lunacy was needed to bring success to Clare. Winning things with counties that haven't done so previously is notoriously hard.

That's what we're saying though Seanie, although I'd contest the fact that a man like Cody wouldn't have won an All Ireland with Clare. Cody is every bit as driven as Loughnane, but he is a great manager as well, tactically and in terms of keeping lads on their toes.

There's no doubt Loughnane was the right horse for that particular course at the time, but there really was an alignment of the planets going on there. His pure hunger and passion was matched by the players, and the competition from the traditional big guns was at a relatively low ebb. Tipp were cat, Kilkenny were average, Cork were poor. Offaly were the best hurling team of that era, but they couldn't, or wouldn't, try to match Clare's physical approach.

[Zulu]

I agree with you Seanie (and AZ) he might have been the only man that could tap into that Clare teams psyche but he had a lot of great players in important positions and the competition at the time was very weak so they weren't the hardest won AI's ever IMO.

PS I know Offaly were good at the time AZ   but the general standard wasn't great IMO.

Sorry just saw your post there AZ...so to sum up....what AZ said.

[AZOffaly]

Offaly were very, very talented. Lads like Johnny Dooley, John Troy, Johnny Pilkington, Joe Dooley, Brian Whelehan, Hubert Rigney et al could hurl with anyone, but they should have won more All Irelands. They should have beaten Clare in 1995, and were lucky to still be in a position to strike in 1994 after their worst 65 minutes all year. A better Kilkenny team would have made that Offaly team either raise their game (which I believe it would have) or else would have beaten them down.

Offaly circa 1994-2000 were the last of the true amateur amateurs to win stuff. They worked hard when they had to, but they always treated hurling as a game. Probably a healthier mental state than the Clares, Corks and Kilkenny's of the world, but less conducive to consistently winning things.

[INDIANA]

Zulu i agree with what a lot of you're posting on this but two things:

- no-one else could have trained Clare to win those all-irelands.

-he had some great players but he made them great .These guys were unkown underachievers until he came along. And while he had some great players, he had some of the most mediocre players ever to win all-irelands. Guys who wouldn't have made bad cork or kilkenny teams. Yet when they pulled on the Clare jersey under him they hit heights never seen before or ever seen again.

The problem in Galway is that they were never going to buy into his madness. They've won all-irelands at underage, they aren't success starved players. also naming a team in the huddle before the throw in was lunacy in the extreme. What worked in Clare will never work anywhere else ever again. its time Ger realised that . Pity I heardfrom 2 Galway panelists (one player and one sub) that his skills training is top drawer but his man- mnagement was crap in the context of a county thats won a stack of underage titles. If he had of been training Carlow or somewhere it would have worked better.

[Zulu]

no-one else could have trained Clare to win those all-irelands.

-he had some great players but he made them great .These guys were unkown underachievers until he came along. And while he had some great players, he had some of the most mediocre players ever to win all-irelands. Guys who wouldn't have made bad cork or kilkenny teams. Yet when they pulled on the Clare jersey under him they hit heights never seen before or ever seen again.

I'd probably agree on the first point Indiana but I'm not so sure about your second. Although that Clare team were hammered by Tipp the previous two years they were a young coming team and I don't think it is fair to say Loughnane 'made' the 2 Lohans, Seanie Mac, 'mad' Davy, Colin Lynch and Jamesie great players, they would have been great regardless of who trained them. There were some limited players but no more so than the Limerick team which nearly won an AI around the same time or the Wexford team that did IMO.

Although I never thought too much of Ger and I didn't think he'd be a success with Galway, you'd have to say that the Galway team have issues anyway and they might be a group of players that no one will ever get the best out of.

[orangeman]

Lots of good men have tried to bring Galway to the Holy Grail in the recent past but all have failed. They did manage to beat the Cats in a semi in 2003 I think but that's about as close as they came in this era.


Yes Loughnane was a bit mad, but this madness brought the best out of an average Clare team.


Yes Offaly were a more talented side but Clare were more driven purely as a result of their manager.

[orangeman]

The Cork lads were complaining about the training being no good under Gerald - I wonder how they would take to Loughnane ?.