Ciaran McDonald not named in Mayo panel

[moysider]

Janey! Some of ye seem to have stronger views about Long Paddy's daughter that ye have about Johnno or Ciaran.

Not really Lar but its a bit early in the afternoon for beer goggles and midnight madonnas. Sure you have nt been layin into the buckfast all morning?

[RedandGreenSniper]

ray silkes thoughts here at www.mayoadvertiser.ie/index.php?aid=5789

I know people have mixed opinions about Silke but I think its strange for the man who captained his county to the All-Ireland in 1998 under O'Mahony to be so critical. Not that he's not entitled to his opinion but could there be a bit of history there?
He's certainly not going to be flavour of the month with O'Mahony in taking McDonald's side so much in that column.
This is going to rumble indefinitely I'm afraid

[Tatler Jack]

Silke will always be on the side of popular opinion. Would not pay any heed to him. Probably the worst footballer ever to lift SAM and well in the running for worst pundit of all times.

[RedandGreenSniper]

Silke will always be on the side of popular opinion. Would not pay any heed to him. Probably the worst footballer ever to lift SAM and well in the running for worst pundit of all times.

I agree he's well up there with the worst footballers ever to lift Sam. As an aside I once heard a conversation about Silke's ability. The first fella started off by saying 'Ray Silke isn't the best half back in Galway'. The next fella trumped that by saying 'Ray Silke isn't the best half-back in Corofin' to which was followed the immortal line by the third buck 'Ray Silke?! Ray Silke isn't even the best wing-back in his own house'!!
Still I think he's a decent pundit - he's willing to put his head on the block with his opinions. Even if you don't agree with those opinions (and I don't a lot of the time) at least he has the cajones to put his head on the block unlike other pundits who look for the fence (JOM, ironically, was probably the greatest example of that type of pundit).
I think Silke's opinion is worth listening to in this case given his experience playing under JOM

[Lar Naparka]

Ray Silke may not be everyone’s choice, either as a pundit or as a footballer in his day.
For all I know, he might get the same satisfaction rating as Padraig Flynn’s daughter would get on a catwalk.
But do bear a few points in mind:
He was deemed good enough to captain an All-Ireland winning side. Who appointed him captain? Was it not our own John O’Mahony?
If either of them is a waste of space then the other has to be one too.
I certainly resent a lot of what he has had to say about Mayo but he does get to say it in a lot of places- and he gets paid for it into the bargain.
Plain and simple; he gets paid for spouting sh**e and I don’t, for doing much the same thing.
Maybe that’s just begrudgery but it is also a fact.
As Tatler Jack says, he does seem to come down on the side of popular opinion, doesn’t he?
But if you go with that one, popular opinion would be that Mac should be back!
Ye all know what?
This thread is clipping going just fine; I hope it keeps going.

[An Gaeilgoir]

Silke will always be on the side of popular opinion. Would not pay any heed to him. Probably the worst footballer ever to lift SAM and well in the running for worst pundit of all times.
[/quote
Did anyone hear him on Today FM yesterday about the Padraig Joyce incident in Castlebar....he said he had a similar experience following a connacht Final...some young Mayo lad gave him a lash of a flag following the game  ...how it was a disgrace...blah blah blah

[Tatler Jack]

Not that it's relevant but I assume Silke was appointed captain because Corofin were county champions at the time. Lucky man!!

[IolarCoisCuain]

Keith Duggan has a thoughtful piece about the crisis in this morning's Irish Times: http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/sport/2008/0503/1209760557139.html



Maverick between Cross and hard place

Sat, May 03, 2008

GAELIC GAMES/PROFILE OF MAYO'S CIARAN McDONALD: If the Crossmolina man's days in the red and green prove to be really over, the game itself will be the biggest loser, writes Keith Duggan

NOTHING ABOUT the football life of Ciarán McDonald has been straightforward and in many ways it is apt the Crossmolina legend would choose to rage against the dying of the light. There was widespread regret when McDonald, aged 33 now, was not named on the Mayo championship squad last week, but few could deem the omission unreasonable.

McDonald had not started a Mayo championship match since the All-Ireland final of 2006 and his involvement with John O'Mahony's squad last year was fleeting, badly compromised by the persistent backache that has dogged the man in recent years.

His last appearance was as a late substitute in a dismal All-Ireland qualifier against Derry, curiously the very county against whom he made his debut in 1993. He has not been part of the squad at all this year.

For Mayo football people of a certain generation, the announcement of a Mayo panel without McDonald must have felt like a genuine end to their youth. All those from the age of 30 to 35 grew up with McDonald as their most celebrated peer.

Here was a thoroughly modernist football player with a persona that was arresting and authentic, a man who played in a manner uniquely of his own creation but also gloried in the traditional virtues of the game.

McDonald on song on a hot day in McHale Park was summer itself. He played football like Best played soccer, like Larry Bird played hoops, like Ayrton Senna raced cars, like John Troy played hurling. You might not always see him win but you walked away from the ground knowing you had seen something illuminating and rare, something different.

In Mayo, there seemed to be a vague belief McDonald would go on forever. It probably never occurred to anyone until last week he was just as mortal as the rest.

Perhaps it never occurred to McDonald himself. Given the Crossmolina man's long history of public reticence, with almost 13 years of gallant silence that suggested he would be happy to let the record speak for itself, his decision to "go running to the papers" this week was staggering. It was a bit like flicking on the television to find JD Salinger yapping on the Late Late Show.

McDonald gave his version of his omission from the panel in Wednesday's Irish Independent. It was clear from his comments he was deeply and honestly pained by his omission from the squad and, not for the first time, he had fears the Mayo public would believe he was indifferent to his county.

His account of communications with John O'Mahony suggested the lines between the pair were hazy at best. It didn't tally with the long-established form of O'Mahony, a man who has proven himself an exceptionally skilful communicator in the sporting as well as the political arenas.

Former Mayo players often chuckle at O'Mahony's seemingly clairvoyant ability to know their whereabouts at all times.

The Mayo manager has expressed his view on McDonald's ability many times in the past. But while football fans can afford to be sentimental, managers must, by necessity, be pathologically forward-thinking.

McDonald was not involved in this year's league but like a number of established senior men, he was in the minds of the management team. But in O'Mahony's mind there had to be a cut-off point in terms of the championship and McDonald's declining of an invitation to attend a challenge game was probably what prompted O'Mahony to draw the line in the sand.

As it was, O'Mahony was happy to clarify that the absence from McDonald was not a snub or an attempt to call time on the county days of a player whose legend will unquestionably bloom in the coming years and decades.

"It is not my intention to retire any player," he said yesterday. "This panel was put together based on players we had seen in the league and after we had invited a number of more senior players in for certain games we had organised. There came a time when names had to be put down on paper. I had to tell four of five guys they would be part of future Mayo panels but not this one.

"I have the highest admiration for Ciarán McDonald. And panels by their very nature are never set in stone. We will always be open to a player showing so well at club level that he deserves to be brought into the county panel and that will remain the case this summer."

O'Mahony's rationale is understandable and follows the normal procedure for finalising a championship panel. But nothing about the history of McDonald and Mayo has been normal.

The Crossmolina man has given 13 years of championship service that have been sometimes frustrating and frequently brilliant. But that passage has never been smooth. McDonald was an iconoclast and a fiercely independent soul trying to operate in a culture where the team ethic is everything. Over the years, his persona and importance became so powerful it was generally accepted the rules worked slightly differently where he was concerned.

He might not appear throughout entire leagues but rejoin panels late, and during those absences he was often more a rumour than a figure of substance in the county, a disappeared man performing feats of Herculean endeavour in the family pipe-laying trade in remote outposts of the county.

But when he did reappear, his hunger for training was considered absolute and his influence on the team immense and obvious. And the last word on McDonald, for all his idiosyncrasies, has always been that he is a likeable and decent person, a salt-of-the-earth type.

He has just been impossible to pin down.

The irony is that this release from the Mayo panel seems to have left McDonald feeling somewhat trapped. He operated beyond convention for so long that his shock at being omitted from a nominal panel was almost certainly heartfelt. And there is something almost innocent about his fears people would think he had decided against playing for the county.

For McDonald advocates, there is a glimmer of hope in that the Mayo panel contains one vacant place - contingent on a troublesome injury suffered by Chris Barrett. But whether McDonald would agree to return in the aftermath of this week's rare outburst is a different matter.

It could be that the public will never know anyway; even if O'Mahony does extend an olive branch, he will be too discreet to publicise it. And McDonald, having spoken, is likely to say nothing further on this matter.

In the past, O'Mahony was famed for his diplomatic handling of strong-minded players, and it could well be the pair will sit down in privacy. And nothing would better prove McDonald's stated desire to still turn out for his county than to agree to rejoin the squad under whatever conditions O'Mahony might impose.

In Mayo, they will wait with bated breath and no great hope. Here is a situation where two strong-minded men believe they are in the right. O'Mahony has an obligation to push on with getting Mayo ready for the big games ahead. McDonald will carry on in lone-spirit mode - he delivered a notable riposte against Ballaghaderreen in a league game last week, hitting four points from play in a personal haul of eight.

A summer of club fireworks for Crossmolina will mean the calls for his instatement will persist.

McDonald was almost wistful in his acknowledgement that the Mayo management might have decided to go with younger men. He understands better than anyone that there are very few seasons left and now, this one hangs by the thinnest of threads.

All anyone can say with certainty is that if Ciarán McDonald's Mayo football days are over, then the game itself will suffer most of all.

[Lar Naparka]

Not that it's relevant but I assume Silke was appointed captain because Corofin were county champions at the time. Lucky man!!

You’re right, TJ; he got that honour because he was Corofin’s captain and he had already led them to their first and only club AI.
I vaguely recall O’Mahony blathering away about his inspiring qualities of leadership before the championships began. It sure was his lucky year.
For me, Keith Duggan is one of the better writers around and he has come at this from a different perspective than Silke. Maybe the logical thing to do is to consider both articles and you will get a more complete picture than either writer conveys. To me, O’Mahony’s job is to manage and he is entitled to decide if Mac fits into his plans or not but Mac deserved a face to face meeting to discuss his future. Here the onus was on O’Mahony to see it came to pass, as he was the one going to call the shots.

“There is no wriggle room left, Ciaran; I want a yes or no and I want it now.”
I think a message delivered directly along those lines would have sufficed to fulfil O’Mahony’s obligations as manager.
This is just an aside here; has any other county finalised its panel and closed it off?

[INDIANA]

he reality is johnno doesn't want mc donald on the panel despite the public utterances. We're talking about an experienced manager who's won more titles to beat the band, if he wanted mc donald on the panel he'd be there. I suspect Mc Donald is aware Johnno doesn't want his services and isn't too happy about it. Which is understandable. Shoddy treatment for such a gifted player, but that's the nults and bolts of it from my point of view.
Johnno really on a limb now- if he doesn't deliver at least a connacht tiltle the knives will be out. Mc Donald i doubt will play for Mayo this year. Johnno can't really back down now and it's clear to me Mc Donald isn't in his plans.

[rosnarun]

"There is no wriggle room left, Ciaran; I want a yes or no and I want it now."

IS THERE ANY OTHER ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION OTHER THAN f**k YUOU
that's the kind of blueshirt diplomacy that bruton ended The 1st IRA ceasefire with within a few months of being taoiseach.
The point of the exercise is to get the best team out not to show whose boss and try and humiliate players

[Lar Naparka]

“There is no wriggle room left, Ciaran; I want a yes or no and I want it now.”
IS THERE ANY OTHER ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION OTHER THAN f**k YUOU

You are not getting my drift with that one, ros.
O’Mahony had the option to do this but he didn’t. Why not?
Because it would have gotten him a straight answer, that’s why! Ciaran might have spelt out the reasons why he was unhappy and that might have caused embarrassment in some quarters.
The way O’Mahony chose to was a classic case of mishandling the situation. The manager, any manager has ultimate authority but with that comes ultimate responsibility. He knows damn well it was his job to ascertain the player’s intentions before going public and saying Mac had decided not to re-join the squad.
It could very well be that Mac has had enough but O’Mahony should not have assumed this. It was his job to check certain that Ciaran was leaving of his own free will before stating this in public. Mac felt his good name was being called into question and went public on this. Rightly or wrongly, he felt he had been shafted and said this.
What was O’Mahony’s reaction??
Did he deny directly any thing McDonald said? I can’t see any evidence of this in his reply. No, Ciaran wasn’t being shafted at all; he could still find his way back into O’Mahony’s plans if his club form warranted this and after all, the entire panel wasn’t really closed firmly in any player’s face.
There is no point in O’Mahony spouting bullshit about the difficulties he had in contacting the player either. He was the boss and he should have checked out the player’s intentions, with a straight yes or no question if necessary, but he flunked that.
Note again that O’Mahony hasn’t contradicted anything that Ciaran said; instead he went on to speak of possibilities that just weren’t there when he implied that Mac had turned his back on his fans in Mayo.

[stephenite]

IS THERE ANY OTHER ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION OTHER THAN f**k YUOU

Plenty of other answers, but you need two things

1) A brain
2) Not to be wearing any blinkers

Sadly you don't qualify for either.

This protracted debate is doing my head in. He's a 33 year old man not some nervous school girl waiting to be asked to the ball, this notion that he should be treated differently because of his special talent is pure rubbish, he is the best footballer I've ever seen, and should be playing for Mayo and it was bad management, we've nearly all agreed on that but spare me all the rest

[moysider]

"There is no wriggle room left, Ciaran; I want a yes or no and I want it now."
IS THERE ANY OTHER ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION OTHER THAN f**k YUOU

You are not getting my drift with that one, ros.
O'Mahony had the option to do this but he didn't. Why not?
Because it would have gotten him a straight answer, that's why! Ciaran might have spelt out the reasons why he was unhappy and that might have caused embarrassment in some quarters.
The way O'Mahony chose to was a classic case of mishandling the situation. The manager, any manager has ultimate authority but with that comes ultimate responsibility. He knows damn well it was his job to ascertain the player's intentions before going public and saying Mac had decided not to re-join the squad.
It could very well be that Mac has had enough but O'Mahony should not have assumed this. It was his job to check certain that Ciaran was leaving of his own free will before stating this in public. Mac felt his good name was being called into question and went public on this. Rightly or wrongly, he felt he had been shafted and said this.
What was O'Mahony's reaction??
Did he deny directly any thing McDonald said? I can't see any evidence of this in his reply. No, Ciaran wasn't being shafted at all; he could still find his way back into O'Mahony's plans if his club form warranted this and after all, the entire panel wasn't really closed firmly in any player's face.
There is no point in O'Mahony spouting bullshit about the difficulties he had in contacting the player either. He was the boss and he should have checked out the player's intentions, with a straight yes or no question if necessary, but he flunked that.
Note again that O'Mahony hasn't contradicted anything that Ciaran said; instead he went on to speak of possibilities  that just weren't there when he implied that Mac had turned his back on his fans in Mayo.

Think you re right Lar. fact the only judgement I would question of your recent posts on this topic is your infatuation with the glamerous daughter of the well known landscape artist Pádraig Fada. I happened to attend todays challenge with Laois. Only a challenge but a couple of things were apparent.

James Nallen still a class act - only the hair line has receded, he still has pace and if i was Johnno i would have been thrilled with him. He is on todays display a better option for Full back line than likes of Cuniffe, O malley or Boyle.

Aiden higgins also a lot to offer in full back line. Comfortable. Composeded. A leader. Enough pace and does nt look like he s shitting himself all the time. Again better option than those younger fellas listed above.
Anyway as far as I can see the best of the young lads for the corner are not in panel - likes of McLoughlin and Cafferkey. Nallen and Higgins best in panel.

Brings me to Mac. There appears to be a public opinion in the county and particularly outside that we re doing fine without him - he was slowing down the game blah blah blah. Dont agree with that but of course there is merit in it on paper. I prefer things to be more controlled than helter skelter. With Mac things were deliberate. Yesterday with Dillon and Andy Moran rested/injured we were a mess in the forwards once hard ball had to be won and used in the half forward line. Dillon is struggling with injury a bit it seems and in last years match in Celtic park he was ineffective due to injury. With Hanley gone who the hell is this dynamic chf that we dont need McDonald. If Dillon is injured as well we re up the creek. Parsons has the ability to do job there but its a big ask to start in championship. A lot of people think McDonald if he was available should be played closer to the goals. Fair enough, I d be delighted to have him anywhere but our cause for a no.11 is as urgent as our quest for a full back has been.  

[ludermor]

f**k me, have so many posters ever been named checked before one one article?