Tailteann Cup 2025

[Captain Scarlet]

All those games mentioned could still happen if the county wins their games from the start of the year.

Fermanagh could still get to an Ulster Final if they won their games, but they lost on their first day out in 2025. That Barry Owens moment only happened because they had a team capable of competing at the top level.

Sligo could have won Connacht this year, but again, they are not good enough and lost the first day out v Mayo.

My own club still has lore about winning SFC titles. But we did drop to Intermediate for years, but memories are no use if you lose Intermediate games.
 

[Dayman]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

[JoG2]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

[Lazer]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

The problem is promotion doesn't  guarantee a Sam Maguire spot..Down got promoted in 2024, finishing top of D3, and were still in the TC (partially because they lost the league final (which shouldn't exist imo), and because Clare took the last spot by being provincial finalists.

If promotion guaranteed a spot, or a spot in a play off to get a spot in SM..then things would be fairer..but due to provincial finalists taking priority over league finishes, its tough for ulster and Leinster teams..and the TC widens the gaps.


If we insists on a 2nd tier, we need a 3rd tier..so at least the 2nd tier teams are playing someone around their level, not a division 2 team playing a division 4 team!

The

[Armagh18]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

The problem is promotion doesn't  guarantee a Sam Maguire spot..Down got promoted in 2024, finishing top of D3, and were still in the TC (partially because they lost the league final (which shouldn't exist imo), and because Clare took the last spot by being provincial finalists.

If promotion guaranteed a spot, or a spot in a play off to get a spot in SM..then things would be fairer..but due to provincial finalists taking priority over league finishes, its tough for ulster and Leinster teams..and the TC widens the gaps.


If we insists on a 2nd tier, we need a 3rd tier..so at least the 2nd tier teams are playing someone around their level, not a division 2 team playing a division 4 team!

The

Except a division 4 team is in the final, and another division 4 team got to the semi there after beating a team that was division 2 this year and most peoples favourites for the whole thing!

[Lazer]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

The problem is promotion doesn't  guarantee a Sam Maguire spot..Down got promoted in 2024, finishing top of D3, and were still in the TC (partially because they lost the league final (which shouldn't exist imo), and because Clare took the last spot by being provincial finalists.

If promotion guaranteed a spot, or a spot in a play off to get a spot in SM..then things would be fairer..but due to provincial finalists taking priority over league finishes, its tough for ulster and Leinster teams..and the TC widens the gaps.


If we insists on a 2nd tier, we need a 3rd tier..so at least the 2nd tier teams are playing someone around their level, not a division 2 team playing a division 4 team!

The

Except a division 4 team is in the final, and another division 4 team got to the semi there after beating a team that was division 2 this year and most peoples favourites for the whole thing!

Which is wonderful..however doesn't change the fact that the TC is widening the gap between those in the All Ireland and those in the TC..

It is potentially reducing the gap between  division 4 and division 3/2 teams, by giving them more challenging games..but for the borderline division 2/3 teams it's widening the gap between them and the "elite"..

My proposal is top 12 based on league positions go into All Ireland

Have a gap between provincials and All Ireland..and have play offs between bottom 4 division 2, top 4 division 3, and any provincial finalists not in the top 12 to select the 4 to go through to the AI, the remainder going into Tailteann Cup.

This gives these teams the games play they need against similar level opponents, thus helping reduce the widening gap, and giving all similar level teams a chance to play in the
All Ireland regardless of the size and difficulty of their province

[SouthOfThe Bann]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

The problem is promotion doesn't  guarantee a Sam Maguire spot..Down got promoted in 2024, finishing top of D3, and were still in the TC (partially because they lost the league final (which shouldn't exist imo), and because Clare took the last spot by being provincial finalists.

If promotion guaranteed a spot, or a spot in a play off to get a spot in SM..then things would be fairer..but due to provincial finalists taking priority over league finishes, its tough for ulster and Leinster teams..and the TC widens the gaps.


If we insists on a 2nd tier, we need a 3rd tier..so at least the 2nd tier teams are playing someone around their level, not a division 2 team playing a division 4 team!

The

Except a division 4 team is in the final, and another division 4 team got to the semi there after beating a team that was division 2 this year and most peoples favourites for the whole thing!

Which is wonderful..however doesn't change the fact that the TC is widening the gap between those in the All Ireland and those in the TC..

It is potentially reducing the gap between  division 4 and division 3/2 teams, by giving them more challenging games..but for the borderline division 2/3 teams it's widening the gap between them and the "elite"..

My proposal is top 12 based on league positions go into All Ireland

Have a gap between provincials and All Ireland..and have play offs between bottom 4 division 2, top 4 division 3, and any provincial finalists not in the top 12 to select the 4 to go through to the AI, the remainder going into Tailteann Cup.

This gives these teams the games play they need against similar level opponents, thus helping reduce the widening gap, and giving all similar level teams a chance to play in the
All Ireland regardless of the size and difficulty of their province

Thats a good idea

[Armagh18]

Down won 3 games and got cheated out of a draw by a blind umpire. Now it's back to square 1. How do you keep players interested. I'd much rather the chances in a back door system. We managed to reach an all Ireland final 15 years ago through it. The T Cup only creates elitism. Needs gone. Believe me no one here cared that much about the actual competition. The goal was purely getting to the sam maguire series. Give me 14k in newry any day than playing warm up to the proper stuff in croker.

I was too young for 1994 so have only ever seen Down lose finals (11 in a row! Good lord), so I can tell you I absolutely wanted to win the Tailteann Cup! And there's no doubt that even though we've been relegated that we've absolutely kicked on in the last year. It's a shame we're probably back down there again next year, but the way to not be there in the future is pretty clear - get promoted and stay up.

Also in 2010 we were in division 2 so would have been in this version of the All Ireland anyway.

1991 and 1994, mind those years well. You could have named the starting 15 for Down, what a squad of players

Down have seen this year that they can compete and that'll spur them on. Sights set on promotion and a Clones final has to be the target. There's a hell of a lot of other counties not as well set for serious stab at a provincial title, apart from Fermanagh of course

The problem is promotion doesn't  guarantee a Sam Maguire spot..Down got promoted in 2024, finishing top of D3, and were still in the TC (partially because they lost the league final (which shouldn't exist imo), and because Clare took the last spot by being provincial finalists.

If promotion guaranteed a spot, or a spot in a play off to get a spot in SM..then things would be fairer..but due to provincial finalists taking priority over league finishes, its tough for ulster and Leinster teams..and the TC widens the gaps.


If we insists on a 2nd tier, we need a 3rd tier..so at least the 2nd tier teams are playing someone around their level, not a division 2 team playing a division 4 team!

The

Except a division 4 team is in the final, and another division 4 team got to the semi there after beating a team that was division 2 this year and most peoples favourites for the whole thing!

Which is wonderful..however doesn't change the fact that the TC is widening the gap between those in the All Ireland and those in the TC..

It is potentially reducing the gap between  division 4 and division 3/2 teams, by giving them more challenging games..but for the borderline division 2/3 teams it's widening the gap between them and the "elite"..

My proposal is top 12 based on league positions go into All Ireland

Have a gap between provincials and All Ireland..and have play offs between bottom 4 division 2, top 4 division 3, and any provincial finalists not in the top 12 to select the 4 to go through to the AI, the remainder going into Tailteann Cup.

This gives these teams the games play they need against similar level opponents, thus helping reduce the widening gap, and giving all similar level teams a chance to play in the
All Ireland regardless of the size and difficulty of their province

Thats a good idea

Except last years TC winners Down had an excellent Sam Maguire campaign, running one of the genuine all ireland contenders close, previous winners Meath are in the quarter finals and Westmeath managed to have 2 good years in the toughest possible Sam Maguire group they certainly didn't embarrass themselves.

[Milltown Row2]

Or, whatabout the teams that are not good enough, putting a little more effort into their juvenile structures, create sustainability and hopefully see the fruits of their labour when the lads come through to senior?

Teams in div 3/4 have put themselves there, its up to them to bring it up the levels required to get to the top table, most have done it before in the past, some the recent past and others a distant past.

There will always be strong counties, there are your traditional counties that very rarely seem to drop down. Their structures are maintaining the highest level, but the likes of Antrim have not been a force for 70 years, they need to work it out, getting hammered in the Ulster championship most years isn't going to make it better because they are in the All Ireland..

Has to be a bottom up approach rather than the top down approach. Playing at a level that our senior (not this year) can be competitive with. I'm not sure training all year for that one game or two is actually going to bring you on..

For me, I'm a play your level type of guy, get out of that level and you're improving and moving up, taking that improvement and bring on players as you go, introducing lads at different times to be mainstays on the team..

If you were a player looking at just playing in the All Ireland series and you are nowhere near good enough then that is demoralising.

[The Boy Wonder]

The door into the Sam Maguire Cup is narrow for Division 3 and 4 counties. At best the top two in Division 3 qualify but this year neither Kildare nor Offaly got through – their places taken by Down (Tailteann Cup winners 2024) and Clare (Munster Finalists 2025).
 
It is plainly unfair that some Division 3 and 4 counties could qualify for Sam Maguire Cup by winning one game where others would need to win three, e.g. Clare and Longford this year.

In 2022 a line was drawn between Sam Maguire and Tailteann Cups – counties finding themselves in Division 3 and 4 at that point in time were ineligible for Sam Maguire. If one looks back you will find that quite a number of current Sam Maguire counties have spent time in Division 3 and indeed some in Division 4 over the past 20 years.

Some posters here will preach that counties just need to get their act together whilst ignoring the fact that the gap between Sam Maguire and Tailteann Cup teams is widening because of inbuilt inequalities in the formats. The fact that Kildare and Offaly were excluded from the Sam Maguire this year is proof of that.

My own county (Laois) spent most of the last 25 years in Division 2. In that time their records against similar middle-tier counties was decent. Indeed their record against the current All-Ireland Champions was excellent – NFL P12 W9 L3,  Championship P4 W2 L2.

The best way forward in my humble opinion would be
1)   Provincial Championships as standalone competitions
2)   Open-draw knockout Sam Maguire Cup – format below
3)   Scrap Tailteann Cup

Sam Maguire Cup
Round 1: Open draw for the 16 Division 3 and Division 4 teams
Round 2: Open draw for 8 Round 1 winners and 8 Division 2 teams
Round 3 (last 16): Open draw for 8 Round 2 winners and 8 Division 1 teams
Round 4 (quarter-finals) : Open draw for Round 3 winners
All-Ireland Semi-Finals : Open draw for Round 4 winners

[DuffleKing]

I'm not sure the argument stands up that TC winners have become yoyo teams and. Ant bridge the gap.

Down finished second in their group this year and ran an All Ireland challenger very close. Meath have topped their group and will be formidable opposition in the quarter finals this weekend.

Westmeath returned to TC this year but were very competitive in Sam Maguire and division two and very unlucky to be relegated. Ultimately there is only room for 16 and teams have to lose out in any competitive environment.

The TC winners have had a very good opportunity then to push on - it is up to themselves to take it.

[Armagh18]

The door into the Sam Maguire Cup is narrow for Division 3 and 4 counties. At best the top two in Division 3 qualify but this year neither Kildare nor Offaly got through – their places taken by Down (Tailteann Cup winners 2024) and Clare (Munster Finalists 2025).
 
It is plainly unfair that some Division 3 and 4 counties could qualify for Sam Maguire Cup by winning one game where others would need to win three, e.g. Clare and Longford this year.

In 2022 a line was drawn between Sam Maguire and Tailteann Cups – counties finding themselves in Division 3 and 4 at that point in time were ineligible for Sam Maguire. If one looks back you will find that quite a number of current Sam Maguire counties have spent time in Division 3 and indeed some in Division 4 over the past 20 years.

Some posters here will preach that counties just need to get their act together whilst ignoring the fact that the gap between Sam Maguire and Tailteann Cup teams is widening because of inbuilt inequalities in the formats. The fact that Kildare and Offaly were excluded from the Sam Maguire this year is proof of that.

My own county (Laois) spent most of the last 25 years in Division 2. In that time their records against similar middle-tier counties was decent. Indeed their record against the current All-Ireland Champions was excellent – NFL P12 W9 L3,  Championship P4 W2 L2.

The best way forward in my humble opinion would be
1)   Provincial Championships as standalone competitions
2)   Open-draw knockout Sam Maguire Cup – format below
3)   Scrap Tailteann Cup

Sam Maguire Cup
Round 1: Open draw for the 16 Division 3 and Division 4 teams
Round 2: Open draw for 8 Round 1 winners and 8 Division 2 teams
Round 3 (last 16): Open draw for 8 Round 2 winners and 8 Division 1 teams
Round 4 (quarter-finals) : Open draw for Round 3 winners
All-Ireland Semi-Finals : Open draw for Round 4 winners

Kildare had an utterly pathetic year last year, they can have no complaints.

I'd say theres not a person in the country that would say that Clare deserved to be in Sam this year though, the inequality in the provincials needs looked at

[The Boy Wonder]

Both Kildare and Offaly have every reason to be aggrieved that they were denied Sam Maguire Cup football this year.
They were 1st and 2nd in NFL Division 3.

I reckon Kildare would have given a very good account of themselves in Sam Maguire and would have qualified for preliminary quarter-finals at least.

Offaly are a young developing team and they were denied an opportunity of playing against Division 1 and 2 counties.
Again I reckon they could have performed well and would certainly have benefited from the experience.

There may well have been a quite different look to the quarter-finals this weekend.
We might have seen a repeat of that epic 2011 quarter-final where Donegal's Kevin Cassidy's long range point denied Kildare.

[Milltown Row2]

Are they in Sam next year due to being div 2 teams then?

[The Boy Wonder]

Are they in Sam next year due to being div 2 teams then?

Must you be vexatious asking a question that you know the answer to or are you just being a smartass ?
I respect people have different views - you don't seem to be able to take that on board.

Both Kildare and Offaly have lost out this year.
They should have been entitled to compete in the Sam Maguire Cup and whatever the outcome both would have benefited.