Rory Gallagher

[PAULD123]

Putting the brackets in, doesn't cover u from libel.lol

the only brackets i used were for the word family. Which was simply a clarification that the court was a family court. How is that libel? I can't libel a court as it isn't a person.

For by that, what do you think i said that was libel? What single accusation have I made about anyone that could be considered libel?

Quite seriously, if you can point it out then I would revise the post to avoid making that mistake

[Wildweasel74]

Was talking about the lad before you Pauld.

[PAULD123]

My View:

Firstly it's complex, I don't think there is an simple way through it. But:

His Character -

• There are lots of people ready to comment that RG is unlikable
• Although you have to be cautious about bandwagon jumpers
• I have not heard a lot of people saying he's a lovey sweet guy
• So, I would conclude he may well not the nicest guy around
• But... is that critical?

The accusations -

• The accusations are horrible. If they could be proven, or even shown to be reasonably certain, I would hope all clubs would choose not to work with RG
• Though just because they are made doesn't mean they are true
• These have been investigated by the Gardai, the PSNI, the courts (family), and the DRA
• No conviction or sanction was imposed by any of these bodies
• In fact no charge or even arrest was ever made
• The DRA said there was no case to answer
• The PPS said that there were no grounds for a prosecution
• However, on the other hand, RG has never denied the accusations publicly

The accuser -

• Nicola clearly has personal issues apart from this direct accusation.
• The marriage ended toxically.
• With reference to the family court above. These accusations were considered as part of the custody hearings and yet the court granted RG full custody of the children.
• I hardly need to point out that full custody to a father is relatively rare.
• But that would not give him an excuse, even given a toxic environment, for physically assaulting a woman
• It is wrong to victim blame and women speaking up should be given the benefit of the doubt.
• But with all the investigations reaching conclusions in RG's favour it can't be denied that some doubt has been created.
• The lack of action would make me wonder what corroboration there was, Nicola claimed people were present, surely if they could back up the accusation there would at least have been some action?
• Equally, in no way unless it is proven otherwise, should Nicola's claims be dismissed. Such claims should be taken seriously.
• None of us can know for sure if the accusations are fact, but we can be sure that a young lady is deeply unhappy in life and that she is suffering. We should all wish her the best.
• The single most important thing is that we don't know. We don't know if he subjected her to violence, and we don't know if he didn't.

Jarlath Burns -

• Jarlath Burns has ignored the findings of the DRA
• He has used his position to put pressure on Naas
• Given all the doubt above, how much is not fully known, that would appear an overreach to me
• Is it not hypocritical? he has not intervened against any other individual despite plenty of GAA managers and players actually being convicted of offences in court
• It is hard to see that Burns has made this decision on anything other than social media.
• If his argument is that he doesn't want specifically abusers of women to be in the GAA then I ask if he has written to the club of the Armagh player, that was arrested for indecent assault recently, to be dropped by his club and county?

Work as a manger? -
Minor side comment here. In his statement Gallagher mentioned working as a manger. What is his tax return record on being employed as a manger? Isn't the GAA supposed to be volunteers? His admission of working should really be of interest to the Revenue Commissioners. (as i said complete side point)

Conclusions -

• We do not know if the accusations are fact
• We do know that Nicola is not in a good place and we should all be sympathetic to her
• We simply cannot state with certainty that RG has done anything to mean he does not deserve a coaching role in the GAA.
• But all investigations, including GAA, have cleared him and I don't think we have anything more to go on than to accept the findings of those with the detailed information.
• In my opinion he should not therefore be denied the opportunity to work unless other information can be proven
• This is the simplest one - In my opinion Jarlath Burns was out of order, going against his own DRA findings and singling out an individual. It was an abuse of his position and laced with hypocrisy

Finally, I do not think highly of him. I would tend to believe that there is at least some partial value in the accusations. I am drawn towards thinking that whatever happened, he was unlikely to have treated he kindly in their relationship. I don't think I would want to be associated with him. But I can't say there is any solid reason for preventing hm for taking a role he is offered.

Independent of all of that, with RG being cleared by the DRA, I think Jarlath Burns was very wrong.

[Halfquarter]

My View:

Firstly it's complex, I don't think there is an simple way through it. But:

His Character -

• There are lots of people ready to comment that RG is unlikable
• Although you have to be cautious about bandwagon jumpers
• I have not heard a lot of people saying he's a lovey sweet guy
• So, I would conclude he may well not the nicest guy around
• But... is that critical?

The accusations -

• The accusations are horrible.
• Though just because they are made doesn't mean they are true
• These have been investigated by the Gardai, the PSNI, the courts (family), and the DRA
• No conviction or sanction was imposed by any of these bodies
• In fact no charge or even arrest was ever made
• The DRA said there was no case to answer
• The PPS said that there were no grounds for a prosecution
• However, on the other hand, RG has never denied the accusations publicly

The accuser -

• Nicola clearly has personal issues apart from this direct accusation.
• The marriage ended toxically.
• With reference to the family court above. These accusations were considered as part of the custody hearings and yet the court granted RG full custody of the children.
• I hardly need to point out that full custody to a father is relatively rare.
• But that would not give him an excuse, even given a toxic environment, for physically assaulting a woman
• It is wrong to victim blame and women speaking up should be given the benefit of the doubt.
• But with all the investigations reaching conclusions in RG's favour it can't be denied that some doubt has been created.
• The lack of action would make me wonder what corroboration there was, Nicola claimed people were present, surely if they could back up the accusation there would at least have been some action?
• Equally, in no way unless it is proven otherwise, should Nicola's claims be dismissed. Such claims should be taken seriously.
• None of us can know for sure if the accusations are fact, but we can be sure that a young lady is deeply unhappy in life and that she is suffering. We should all wish her the best.
• The single most important thing is that we don't know. We don't know if he subjected her to violence, and we don't know if he didn't.

Jarlath Burns -

• Jarlath Burns has ignored the findings of the DRA
• He has used his position to put pressure on Naas
• Given all the doubt above, how much is not fully known, that would appear an overreach to me
• Is it not hypocritical? he has not intervened against any other individual despite plenty of GAA managers and players actually being convicted of offences in court
• It is hard to see that Burns has made this decision on anything other than social media.
• If his argument is that he doesn't want specifically abusers of women to be in the GAA then I ask if he has written to the club of the Armagh player, that was arrested for indecent assault recently, to be dropped by his club and county?

Work as a manger? -

• Minor side comment here. In his statement Gallagher mentioned working as a manger. What is his tax return record on being employed as a manger? Isn't the GAA supposed to be volunteers? His admission of working should really be of interest to the Revenue Commissioners. (as i said complete side point)

Conclusions -

• We do not know if the accusations are fact
• We do know that Nicola is not in a good place and we should all be sympathetic to her
• We simply cannot state with certainty that RG has done anything to mean he does not deserve a coaching role in the GAA.
• But all investigations, including GAA, have cleared him and I don't think we have anything more to go on than to accept the findings of those with the detailed information.
• In my opinion he should not therefore be denied the opportunity to work unless other information can be proven
• This is the simplest one - In my opinion Jarlath Burns was out of order, going against his own DRA findings and singling out an individual. It was an abuse of his position and laced with hypocrisy

Finally, I do not think highly of him. I would tend to believe that there is at least some partial value in the accusations. I am drawn towards thinking that whatever happened, he was unlikely to have treated he kindly in their relationship. I don't think I would want to be associated with him. But I can't say there is any solid reason for preventing hm for taking a role he is offered.

Independent of all of that, with RG being cleared by the DRA, I think Jarlath Burns was very wrong.

If you don't mind me saying so, it's a bit bizarre bring up Rory's Tax Returns, surely that is nobody's business only his own and HMRC / RC .

[PAULD123]

Was talking about the lad before you Pauld.

No bother. I thought I was quite careful in what I said (mind you I was careless and posted it twice, oops).

Although I think the other guy might be ok anyway. Just saying "allegedly" doesn't protect you, but naming the alleger generally does so long as they actually did allege it. From a law website - "If someone has actually alleged something, then the statement is true and therefore it cannot be defamatory. But if nobody has in fact made the allegation, then the statement is false. If it also damages reputation, it is defamatory."

[tbrick18]

My View:

Firstly it's complex, I don't think there is an simple way through it. But:

His Character -

• There are lots of people ready to comment that RG is unlikable
• Although you have to be cautious about bandwagon jumpers
• I have not heard a lot of people saying he's a lovey sweet guy
• So, I would conclude he may well not the nicest guy around
• But... is that critical?

The accusations -

• The accusations are horrible.
• Though just because they are made doesn't mean they are true
• These have been investigated by the Gardai, the PSNI, the courts (family), and the DRA
• No conviction or sanction was imposed by any of these bodies
• In fact no charge or even arrest was ever made
• The DRA said there was no case to answer
• The PPS said that there were no grounds for a prosecution
• However, on the other hand, RG has never denied the accusations publicly

The accuser -

• Nicola clearly has personal issues apart from this direct accusation.
• The marriage ended toxically.
• With reference to the family court above. These accusations were considered as part of the custody hearings and yet the court granted RG full custody of the children.
• I hardly need to point out that full custody to a father is relatively rare.
• But that would not give him an excuse, even given a toxic environment, for physically assaulting a woman
• It is wrong to victim blame and women speaking up should be given the benefit of the doubt.
• But with all the investigations reaching conclusions in RG's favour it can't be denied that some doubt has been created.
• The lack of action would make me wonder what corroboration there was, Nicola claimed people were present, surely if they could back up the accusation there would at least have been some action?
• Equally, in no way unless it is proven otherwise, should Nicola's claims be dismissed. Such claims should be taken seriously.
• None of us can know for sure if the accusations are fact, but we can be sure that a young lady is deeply unhappy in life and that she is suffering. We should all wish her the best.
• The single most important thing is that we don't know. We don't know if he subjected her to violence, and we don't know if he didn't.

Jarlath Burns -

• Jarlath Burns has ignored the findings of the DRA
• He has used his position to put pressure on Naas
• Given all the doubt above, how much is not fully known, that would appear an overreach to me
• Is it not hypocritical? he has not intervened against any other individual despite plenty of GAA managers and players actually being convicted of offences in court
• It is hard to see that Burns has made this decision on anything other than social media.
• If his argument is that he doesn't want specifically abusers of women to be in the GAA then I ask if he has written to the club of the Armagh player, that was arrested for indecent assault recently, to be dropped by his club and county?

Work as a manger? -

• Minor side comment here. In his statement Gallagher mentioned working as a manger. What is his tax return record on being employed as a manger? Isn't the GAA supposed to be volunteers? His admission of working should really be of interest to the Revenue Commissioners. (as i said complete side point)

Conclusions -

• We do not know if the accusations are fact
• We do know that Nicola is not in a good place and we should all be sympathetic to her
• We simply cannot state with certainty that RG has done anything to mean he does not deserve a coaching role in the GAA.
• But all investigations, including GAA, have cleared him and I don't think we have anything more to go on than to accept the findings of those with the detailed information.
• In my opinion he should not therefore be denied the opportunity to work unless other information can be proven
• This is the simplest one - In my opinion Jarlath Burns was out of order, going against his own DRA findings and singling out an individual. It was an abuse of his position and laced with hypocrisy

Finally, I do not think highly of him. I would tend to believe that there is at least some partial value in the accusations. I am drawn towards thinking that whatever happened, he was unlikely to have treated he kindly in their relationship. I don't think I would want to be associated with him. But I can't say there is any solid reason for preventing hm for taking a role he is offered.

Independent of all of that, with RG being cleared by the DRA, I think Jarlath Burns was very wrong.

Perfectly put and I'd agree with all of this.

[PAULD123]

If you don't mind me saying so, it's a bit bizarre bring up Rory's Tax Returns, surely that is nobody's business only his own and HMRC / RC .

I did say it was a minor point and a side point to the main discussion. It was just a bit of side interest for me because I have a degree in accountancy and my best subject was tax. lol

[Wildweasel74]

There a young lady played in the Camogie final with a assault conviction. A Limerick lad too in this years championship. I say at club football u got a fair few. The point is, why Burns jump into this one. I understand why Burns thought he had get involved, but when RG was with the Monaghan team last year and now.What was the point now emailing Naas. t's opened a can of worms and now have to enforce criminal related convictions of a serious nature  when he's enforcing accusations.

[Armaghtothebone]

Rory Gallagher has accused the GAA president Jarlath Burns of trying to sabotage his career after he intervened in his potential appointment at Naas GAA.

In a statement to BBC News NI, Mr Gallagher said Mr Burns' actions were "unprecedented" and "misguided" and threatened legal action if the remarks were not retracted.

The former Derry county football manager was offered a coaching role with Naas but the offer was then withdrawn after details of the appointment were made public at the weekend.

It later emerged Mr Burns had contacted the club to express his concern at the proposed appointment.

Mr Gallagher stepped down as Derry manager in 2023 just weeks before the team played in the Ulster Senior Football Final.

It followed allegations of abuse made by his estranged wife Nicola Gallagher, which he denied.

When news of the appointment at Naas appeared in the media, the association's president spoke to the Naas club chairman before sending an email which was then read at a meeting of party officers at which it was decided not to proceed with Mr Gallagher's appointment.

In the email, which has been seen by the BBC, Mr Burns said he felt compelled to share his perspective given the "potential implications for Naas GAA and the wider association".

He said decisions made by the club "reverberate far beyond your immediate community" and send a "message about the values we uphold and the standards we set for our members and supporters".

He also warned of the implications for the GAA's Game Changer Initiative which was launched in November to challenge the "social and cultural norms that contribute to domestic, sexual and gender based violence".
Jarlath Burns has grey short hair and wears glasses with a grey frame. He is wearing a grey suit, white shirt and burgundy tie.
Image caption,

Mr Burns said employing Mr Gallagher could attract negative attention and criticism for the club

After Mr Gallagher resigned as Derry manager, he was "temporarily debarred" by the GAA in September 2023 when an independent panel was asked to investigate the claims made by his estranged wife.

Mr Gallagher successfully challenged that debarment in February 2024 and a statement from his solicitors in September said there was no "legal impediment" to prevent him returning to a senior role in the game.

"I have engaged with every procedure available to me. The PPS have issued two separate decisions finding that I have no case to answer," Mr Gallagher added in his statement to the BBC.

"Despite having engaged with due process and procedure, it seems clear that the president has now opted to take matters into his own hands.

"It seems that social media commentary and controversy now equates to a license for presidential intervention."

In the email to Naas GAA, Mr Burns said the "appointment of Rory Gallagher given the allegations that have been made public, risks undermining the principles of the Game Changer Initiative and the positive work being done across the GAA".

He added: "The controversy surrounding his personal life has created significant division and concern within the wider GAA community.

"Such a decision by Naas GAA could have far reaching consequences."

Mr Burns added the appointment would likely "polarise opinion" and create unnecessary tension within the club and he questioned the "confusing message" it would send to younger members.

In conclusion the GAA president said he had "no authority to dictate club decisions" but he had a "responsibility to advocate" for what he believed was in the best interests of the association and its members.

"By choosing not to proceed with this appointment you will be making a statement about the principles that define Naas GAA," he added.

Mr Gallagher has called on the GAA president to withdraw his remarks.

"I have never asked for sympathy or support. I do however ask that this action is formally withdrawn and the contents of the correspondence is retracted," he said.

"The president should lead by example and accept when he has overstepped the mark.

"Absent such a retraction, I will have no other alternative but to take legal action to cure the irreparable damage done to me and my family in my ability to continue to work as a manger in the years ahead."


Surely he means volunteer?

He is 100% right to issue that statement, fair play to him. I don't like how he acts on the sidelines but there's been a complete witch hunt for him and it's surely taking a Toal on him and his family. Let the man get on with his life. Many people in the GAA have been convicted of things, served their time and are free to get back at it but just because RG is high profile he's not.

One simple question.
If he's going to court re. Jarlath why did he not issue libel proceedings against the wife of former Fermanagh player Stepen Maguire.
30 seconds on GOOGLE and I can find it.. it's pretty damning
If Gallagher disputes her account why not sue for libel.
I suspect the last place Gallagher wants to be is anywhere near a courtroom.

Yep - she might be telling the truth. But we'll never know.
And maybe he is suing for libel, how would we know if he is or isn't?

I would imagine the authorities would have spoken to the Maguire woman too. Again, GOOGLE is not a source of truth, its just a tool for throwing out information that may or may not be true.
If GOOGLE was the answer, just ask google if the perp is guilty at the next court case and save a fortune on solicitors, barristers and court time.

Rory Gallagher has accused the GAA president Jarlath Burns of trying to sabotage his career after he intervened in his potential appointment at Naas GAA.

In a statement to BBC News NI, Mr Gallagher said Mr Burns' actions were "unprecedented" and "misguided" and threatened legal action if the remarks were not retracted.

The former Derry county football manager was offered a coaching role with Naas but the offer was then withdrawn after details of the appointment were made public at the weekend.

It later emerged Mr Burns had contacted the club to express his concern at the proposed appointment.

Mr Gallagher stepped down as Derry manager in 2023 just weeks before the team played in the Ulster Senior Football Final.

It followed allegations of abuse made by his estranged wife Nicola Gallagher, which he denied.

When news of the appointment at Naas appeared in the media, the association's president spoke to the Naas club chairman before sending an email which was then read at a meeting of party officers at which it was decided not to proceed with Mr Gallagher's appointment.

In the email, which has been seen by the BBC, Mr Burns said he felt compelled to share his perspective given the "potential implications for Naas GAA and the wider association".

He said decisions made by the club "reverberate far beyond your immediate community" and send a "message about the values we uphold and the standards we set for our members and supporters".

He also warned of the implications for the GAA's Game Changer Initiative which was launched in November to challenge the "social and cultural norms that contribute to domestic, sexual and gender based violence".
Jarlath Burns has grey short hair and wears glasses with a grey frame. He is wearing a grey suit, white shirt and burgundy tie.
Image caption,

Mr Burns said employing Mr Gallagher could attract negative attention and criticism for the club

After Mr Gallagher resigned as Derry manager, he was "temporarily debarred" by the GAA in September 2023 when an independent panel was asked to investigate the claims made by his estranged wife.

Mr Gallagher successfully challenged that debarment in February 2024 and a statement from his solicitors in September said there was no "legal impediment" to prevent him returning to a senior role in the game.

"I have engaged with every procedure available to me. The PPS have issued two separate decisions finding that I have no case to answer," Mr Gallagher added in his statement to the BBC.

"Despite having engaged with due process and procedure, it seems clear that the president has now opted to take matters into his own hands.

"It seems that social media commentary and controversy now equates to a license for presidential intervention."

In the email to Naas GAA, Mr Burns said the "appointment of Rory Gallagher given the allegations that have been made public, risks undermining the principles of the Game Changer Initiative and the positive work being done across the GAA".

He added: "The controversy surrounding his personal life has created significant division and concern within the wider GAA community.

"Such a decision by Naas GAA could have far reaching consequences."

Mr Burns added the appointment would likely "polarise opinion" and create unnecessary tension within the club and he questioned the "confusing message" it would send to younger members.

In conclusion the GAA president said he had "no authority to dictate club decisions" but he had a "responsibility to advocate" for what he believed was in the best interests of the association and its members.

"By choosing not to proceed with this appointment you will be making a statement about the principles that define Naas GAA," he added.

Mr Gallagher has called on the GAA president to withdraw his remarks.

"I have never asked for sympathy or support. I do however ask that this action is formally withdrawn and the contents of the correspondence is retracted," he said.

"The president should lead by example and accept when he has overstepped the mark.

"Absent such a retraction, I will have no other alternative but to take legal action to cure the irreparable damage done to me and my family in my ability to continue to work as a manger in the years ahead."


Surely he means volunteer?

He is 100% right to issue that statement, fair play to him. I don't like how he acts on the sidelines but there's been a complete witch hunt for him and it's surely taking a Toal on him and his family. Let the man get on with his life. Many people in the GAA have been convicted of things, served their time and are free to get back at it but just because RG is high profile he's not.

One simple question.
If he's going to court re. Jarlath why did he not issue libel proceedings against the wife of former Fermanagh player Stepen Maguire.
30 seconds on GOOGLE and I can find it.. it's pretty damning
If Gallagher disputes her account why not sue for libel.
I suspect the last place Gallagher wants to be is anywhere near a courtroom.

Yep - she might be telling the truth. But we'll never know.
And maybe he is suing for libel, how would we know if he is or isn't?

I would imagine the authorities would have spoken to the Maguire woman too. Again, GOOGLE is not a source of truth, its just a tool for throwing out information that may or may not be true.
If GOOGLE was the answer, just ask google if the perp is guilty at the next court case and save a fortune on solicitors, barristers and court time.

Firstly referring to" the Maguire woman" shows a level of disrespect (not needed).
Not sure if you are being disingenuous or just totally missed the point.
You state he may be suing her. I'd wager if he was it would be fairly common knowledge. Every man and his dog knows the name of the Armagh player being investigated reference the trip to America
The point is that a quick Google can find the tweet that the lady made.
If it were libelous it would have been removed either voluntarily or at the request of Mr. Gallagher's legal team.
The reference to " the perp" just smacks of a teenage child.
The accused/ the alleged guilty party/ the person about whoom the allegations have been made?

[NotedObserver]

Not sure why teams and counties would be bothered at this stage

[David McKeown]

I think the major issues here is that we dont and wont know the full background.  Without quoting everything written above there's a number of issues i have with this overall.

1. Firstly the starting position involving any criminal allegation is that the accused individual is innocent until proven guilty.  That is not the same as innocent but does mean they are entitled to that presumption and that is the starting point from which everything flows.

2.  We also know that there was not one but two criminal investigations into the alleged conduct and no criminal charges were brought.  We don't know the reasons for that but there are many of potential reasons for that. It is though significant

3. There has been a finding of fact by a competent court in respect of custody of the children whom I understand with RG.  Whilst we don't know exactly what that finding was that remains significant albeit the caveat that no fact finding tribunal is infallible.

4.  Allegations have been made and corroborated on social media.  The corroboration is significant but again must be viewed in the context of points 2 and 3.

5. We know exactly the reasons for the DRA decision and whilst its been a long time since I read it seemed to be more procedurally based than substantive based and focused on the contradictory powers within GAA rules on safeguarding issues. That said my memory of same is that it renders RG not banned within the organisation on a safeguarding issues.

6. There's a suggestion within one of the links that there is a safeguarding report in the possession of Ulster GAA/HQ.  I am not clear what exactly that is but that, if correct is significant, although it begs the question why RG remains not barred from the association if such a report has reached conclusions that there are issues.

7. Naas sought to appoint RG but were contacted by the president.  Again a significant issue but one that raises many further questions.  Namely was such an intervention within his presidential powers?  Is he in possession of more information than we are? etc etc

In summation I think this is a fundamentally difficult case, where we dont have all the necessary information to make a properly informed judgement.  I do though go back to my first point.  RG is entitled to the presumption of innocence, he is not barred from taking up roles within the association.  If those that seek to appoint him are in receipt of enough information to make a properly informed decision then I dont think the GAA president should be interfering in their appointment process.  There are processes within the association they should either be followed or overhauled.  An ad hoc approach on a case by case basis does not serve anyone's interests particularly not the association. 

[Dubh driocht]

Thanks David; as always an informed and useful post.
On point 6: the fact that a report was commissioned is in the public domain, but the content is not. I think this is significant,along with the decision by the GAA to formally join a partnership with Ruhama and White Ribbon Ireland in November; one of the commitments was to 'encourage men and boys to engage in active allyship to eradicate gender-based violence in society'.
Therefore while I understand your conclusion in the final paragraph, I disagree with it, and believe Jarlath was correct to become involved.

[tiempo]

I hope active allyship doesn't include jumping to conclusions

[Spike]

While I don't expect Jarlath to be over every jot and tittle and each case,  if he can't get involved in a high profile case that isn't subject to court proceedings then when can he?

Perhaps he's seen the police referral report to the PPS (that we the public haven't seen) and made his own judgement? 

He's the president of the GAA - buck stops with him

[tiempo]

President, aka judge jury and executioner

Interesting to see if this extends to the orchard

Who in the 50 shades of buckfast does the buck stop with there?