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Would doubt yet that anything is nailed down.

Keane has done well so far at FB so let him keep going. If nothing else it's important to have good backup be it either Cafferkey or Keane that takes the spot. No harm either to give Colm Boyle a rest. Both Durcan and Coen are big enough guys physically but they need game time against tough Div1 opposition. Same for O'Connor in 1/2 fw line.

I think COC going in on the edge of the square is ok but personally I would have tried Freeman in the corner to see if he could win more ball.
Subs as usual will be interesting.

So who's left ?

Clarke, Hennelly, O'Malley
Harrisson, Keane, Hall, Cafferkey, Higgins, Cuniffe
Boyle, Coen, Durcan, Keegan, McHale, Feeney
Parsons, B Moran, SOS, Vaughan
A Gallagher, McLoughlin, AOS, Doherty, Dillon, DOC
Freeman, Ronaldson, COC, A Moran, Sweeney, Conroy

Others
Drake, Lyons ...... who else ?

2 more i think of - COS and Regan
Brings total to 35

So who's left ?

Clarke, Hennelly, O'Malley
Harrisson, Keane, Hall, Cafferkey, Higgins, Cuniffe
Boyle, Coen, Durcan, Keegan, McHale, Feeney
Parsons, B Moran, SOS, Vaughan
A Gallagher, McLoughlin, AOS, Doherty, Dillon, DOC
Freeman, Ronaldson, COC, A Moran, Sweeney, Conroy

Others
Drake, Lyons ...... who else ?

In fairness to Holmes he is not stringing either Duffy or the rest of the Mayo public along this year with the idea he might be playing. Better he is cut now and call it a day. 

New Management, somewhat new backroom, same team that got to 2 successive finals and lost out narrowly last year in a semi.

What are the expectations this year from the fans for the team and management? Is it All Ireland or bust? Or would a Connacht title retention and getting to the semi-finals be adequate for ratifying the new managements capabilities?

Thoughts?

[But failure to win that 5 in a row would see Mayo having to take the back door qualifier route.]

Moysider, i take your point about Mayo people and the 5 in a row. But failure to win that 5 in a row would see Mayo having to take the back door qualifier route. That is alien territory to this Mayo team and would examine their mental fortitude. The qualifier route is a minefield littered with unexploded mines, as Mayo found to their cost in Longford. Much safer to take the 5 in a row route.

Failure in Connacht would probably mean an early exit on the road, yeah. That would provoke a lot of soul searching in the county.
For Roscommon and Galway beating us would be the easy part. To get to last 4/2 you have to beat a Dublin, Cork, Donegal or Kerry in CP - or Limerick!

Maybe it wouldn't do any harm to dampen expectations a little. The gist of the thread here towards Mayo is that it's all or nothing. Quite a load to carry into the championship under new management. Ok you could say the same about Dublin but remember Dublin have completely different resources at their behest not to mention that they will be playing all their games on their home patch in Croker which is undoubtedly a massive advantage.

Furthermore Mayo teams of the past 2 years have been trying to peak for the late Summer. This year they will have to peak all the way through. Galway will not simply roll over especially in Pearse stadium because Mayo lads need to conserve energy. Never mind Ros.
Kerry and Cork have a much easier run of it because of the seeding system.

Overall it's not difficult to see Mayo slipping back as the workload increases in Connacht before even getting to a possible final four.

Who are the top 4? Is it the four you named because they were last year's semi-finalists?
If it is a lot of possibilities who will displace the top 4 comes down to the provincial winners as all they have to do then is win won game against a team who has come through a tough qualifier route.

so here you go

Munster = (probably Kerry) but Cork are improving
Leinster = Dubs
Connacht = tough call for Mayo with first game away in Galway
Ulster = Lottery

Most likely = Cork or Galway

[Tyrone are man-to-man inferior to Mayo]

Tyrone are man-to-man inferior to Mayo. Few if anyone outside Tyrone could or would argue otherwise.

Tyrone were probably the team of the last decade but since at least 2010 Tyrone haven't seriously challenged for Sam, while Mayo have. It was a remarkable achievement for Harte to get Tyrone to the AISF in 2013.

Tyrone just need to keep building if they want to win number four. Winning number four in Mayo is an altogether more maddening task for the natives.

That Mayo forward line are in no way shape or form better man for man than Tyrone's and that's a pretty significant section of the team. Bar Cillian O'Connor i wouldn't have any of them on the Tyrone forward line. I suspect we will appreciate how good a job James Horan did with Mayo by the end of this season.

Not true, as a unit come the hard ground we have a decent forward unit better than Tyrones.

Tyrone's forward line individually and collectively is better than Mayo's. 

No, it isn't. So there!

I would say it's 50/50

Donnelly, O'Shea, Mcloughlin
McCurry, Cavanagh, O Connor,

True and unfortunately neither will Freeman it looks like.  Do you have a big lad in mind? I ve heard Byrne and Irwin mentioned but they might have their hands full at U21 yet.

No I don't have a solution but it should be investigated broader. I'm surprised that Pat (if he is calling the shots) hasn't tried out  Barry Moran  or Kirby at FF. They did play in that position for him at club. Personally I would move Freeman to the corner and start Cillian at FF to see how it goes.

Pateen had time to come up with a strategy for Diarmuid Connolly last year too. Didn t look like much thought was put into it. Look we all know what time of management we got. Leopards don t change their spots. Pat is not going to turn into a master tactician at this stage.

Out of curiosity how come you don't include Noel Connelly in the equation here? AFAIK it's a dual management role.

Justin McMahon would love to see him or any other giant we could wheel out coming. Remember him or the brother put Donaghy in his box in 08. We can t handle any big ff (remember the scrios caused by Derry's McGuickin last year in McHale Park) but other counties can. Other counties fear skill and pace rather than size. We just don t have a big 14 that can play and until one emerges we should find another way.

All the top 4/5 counties have both options.
Kerry have donaghy Walsh along with O'Donogue (height and pace)
Dublin - O'Gara along with a myriad of forwards
Donegal - Murphy.McFadden along with Mcbrearty
Tyrone - Seán Cavanagh along with McCurry and Mattie Donnelly
Cork - plenty of guys

Both are needed to offer variation in a game when required. So Mayo probably need them too. Sweeney and Ronaldson won't cut it against the big guns when everyone much fitter and the hits much harder 

How long do you give freeman in the 14 jersey? One more shot, two more , the whole league campaign ?

Depends on the alternatives. Obviously Andy Moran will take it but there should be a different guy who might stand up. Someone younger is needed. Someone with nothing to lose. You'd imagine in a county the size of Mayo with the amount of clubs there are that there would be one big guy out there. Up to now though you had to be playing at minor or U21 level to be even considered nearly for Senior. I think it's time to look out side the box.

I would most of the time anyway. 

Wouldn t overcome the problerm of the blanket in itself though. Our biggest problem today was converting fairy easy chances from play and dead balls. Tyrone would have seen us run through Kerry last week and were not going to let us walk through them.
The squeezed us like they did in AI semi in 2013 and we squealed again today. But we had chances today.

A few positives over the 2 games. Both Hall and Durcan look at home at this level.

I thought Keane did well too looks to be a real option at 3

I think it's too early to be lauding Keane and Hall as being capable for this level. Especially on today's game. Most of the time neither had anyone to mark because of the the blanket defense. I think both their cards should be marked diferently -  Keane against the likes of Donaghy, O'Gara or Murphy. Mark Hall against the likes of a near the top Dublin corner fw e.g. McMenamon, Brogan, McBrearty etc.

Durcan - yes - he does look a viable option but again wait until he has to mark say Paul Flynn, Donochadh Walsh or if you like check him out against Connolly. He is the yardstick for a 1/2 back

Wow, where did I even criticise the referee ?

It was a general comment about the rules that are in place. They need looking at and indeed the direction the game in general is going. I'm genuinely worried about the future of the game .
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In fairness Larry you didn't criticise the ref but a lot of others on here have.

Watched the game on TV and I thought Deegan was poor in certain circumstances but then he got severe abuse from both sides when decisions went against them.James Horan also came out and criticised him on TV after he made that call about the hop ball. (Even though as we have seen here Deegan was right)

What he should have done was probably yellow card more players for dissent and sent of a few more to quieten them. Probably time for refs to take this harder course of action and stand up for themselves more. 

Also I think the problem for refs at senior level now is too much is going on. Either there should be more direct involvement from linesmen or else a second ref is required because the pace of the game is too fast and the pitch too big for one man anymore.  Also properly defined rules ala the tackle must be written correctly into the GAA rule book.

Again I think Refs should probably put their foot down to get these decisions amended as the general public won't ever do this.

I think Hall has massive potential, not sure he's a corner back though. Have we any new corner backs on the squad? Would Ger Caff be an option there if Keane was at fb?

I hope Gallagher gets some time

Harrison last year did very well at corner back in the League.
Cafferkey can play CB as well and is usually sent out to mark the danger man in the opposition FF line. Then of courses there's Cunniffe so there could be a full compliment across the FB line if  someone like Hall were to show potential. Hard to judge Hall though as he is so young and inexperienced at this level.