Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
You've come full circle hardstation. Isn't life's coincidents cool.
Had a simliar feeaky experience myself tonight HS....
http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=18.11400
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Shouldn't we all celebrate those who gave up their lives for an Ireland of equals! You'll be an equal too, don't fret.
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Can we have some proof that Pomeroy plunketss organise the parade?
Or is it just a case of people meeting at the club as they are told to do by the organisers? ::)
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 10:01:12 AM
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Can we have some proof that Pomeroy plunketss organise the parade?
Or is it just a case of people meeting at the club as they are told to do by the organisers? ::)
because 'he said so' , and he obv knows pomeroy plunketts well, as he does the IRA and IRA men ::) :D
typical.
I do not think there should be any link between the two organizations!
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 12:30:16 PM
I do not think there should be any link between the two organizations!
Well only an idiot would think that there should be a link!
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 10:01:12 AM
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Can we have some proof that Pomeroy plunketss organise the parade?
Or is it just a case of people meeting at the club as they are told to do by the organisers? ::)
I never stated that it was organised by Pomeroy Plunketts. That the club would permit such a parade though, no matter whom its organised by, does raise questions: one of which I've asked here.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 12:32:07 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 12:30:16 PM
I do not think there should be any link between the two organizations!
Well only an idiot would think that there should be a link!
well there are alot of idiots out there i guess! and when i say no link i mean down to use of clubhouses flags etc!
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:54:30 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 10:01:12 AM
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Can we have some proof that Pomeroy plunketss organise the parade?
Or is it just a case of people meeting at the club as they are told to do by the organisers? ::)
I never stated that it was organised by Pomeroy Plunketts. That the club would permit such a parade though, no matter whom its organised by, does raise questions: one of which I've asked here.
So it's not organised by Pomeroy Plunketts what's the problem or what are they suppose to do about it? ::)
I don't think GAA clubs have the ability to stop a parades ::)
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 12:57:28 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 12:32:07 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 12:30:16 PM
I do not think there should be any link between the two organizations!
Well only an idiot would think that there should be a link!
well there are alot of idiots out there i guess! and when i say no link i mean down to use of clubhouses flags etc!
What do you mean by flags?
Clubhouses are rented out to people or organisations that want them.
I suppose you object to hotels, for example, doing the same?
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 12:40:32 AM
Does a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
Thers a bus stop at the GAA club as well. Is there a relationship between Ulsterbus and the GAA.
well heres another thread ruined by people talking crap.
If the gaa know its an IRA event they should not rent out their clubhouse etc, hotels are businesses and it upto them to decide on what they want to do.
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:33:38 PM
well heres another thread ruined by people talking crap.
If the gaa know its an IRA event they should not rent out their clubhouse etc, hotels are businesses and it upto them to decide on what they want to do.
Wankie you do spout some shite sir, away back to playing with funny shaped balls! ::)
There is no such thing as an IRA event, the last I heard the IRA chose to try and keep themselves quite secret, now you can have a Republican event, but it just doesn't sound as good does it - troll. ::)
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:33:38 PM
well heres another thread ruined by people talking crap.
If the gaa know its an IRA event they should not rent out their clubhouse etc, hotels are businesses and it upto them to decide on what they want to do.
I'm pretty sure renting out premises (gaa clubs, hotel function rooms or other wise) to the IRA would be illegal.
did you two read the title of the thread or just do the usual and go off ina tangent
the tread question:
QuoteDoes a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
read the focking thread before you start your crap!
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 05, 2008, 01:44:49 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:33:38 PM
well heres another thread ruined by people talking crap.
If the gaa know its an IRA event they should not rent out their clubhouse etc, hotels are businesses and it upto them to decide on what they want to do.
Wankie you do spout some shite sir, away back to playing with funny shaped balls! ::)
There is no such thing as an IRA event, the last I heard the IRA chose to try and keep themselves quite secret, now you can have a Republican event, but it just doesn't sound as good does it - troll. ::)
also do you even have anything decent to say?
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:50:51 PM
did you two read the title of the thread or just do the usual and go off ina tangent
the tread question:
QuoteDoes a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
read the focking thread before you start your crap!
You do understand that it's not the IRA that arranges these things, it's generally Sinn Fein - a legal political party.
TYP makes a lot of sense in his post, have a read of that.
Typical Dub.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 02:02:22 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:50:51 PM
did you two read the title of the thread or just do the usual and go off ina tangent
the tread question:
QuoteDoes a parade which organises at and leaves from Pomeroy Plunketts GAA club in memory/celebration of an IRA 'man' meet with the approval of the majority of GAA fans who read this board....or is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.
read the focking thread before you start your crap!
You do understand that it's not the IRA that arranges these things, it's generally Sinn Fein - a legal political party.
TYP makes a lot of sense in his post, have a read of that.
Typical Dub.
Sinn Fein or IRA it doesnt make a difference, GAA clubs should stay away for these types of events!
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:55:16 PM
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 05, 2008, 01:44:49 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 01:33:38 PM
well heres another thread ruined by people talking crap.
If the gaa know its an IRA event they should not rent out their clubhouse etc, hotels are businesses and it upto them to decide on what they want to do.
Wankie you do spout some shite sir, away back to playing with funny shaped balls! ::)
There is no such thing as an IRA event, the last I heard the IRA chose to try and keep themselves quite secret, now you can have a Republican event, but it just doesn't sound as good does it - troll. ::)
also do you even have anything decent to say?
Tankie you clearly have a problem with SF and anything Republican, which taints your thought process, lose the blinkers (and before you say anything, have a read of some of your previous posts), this thread was started by someone on the "mix", hence I don't think it deserves comment, but if you want a reasonable retort then check out TYP response. I can't work out if your constantly on the wind-up or are just an opinionated, self satisfied Dub, with crap opinions about women.
'mischief maker', 'on the mix'....good excuses to avoid the issue at debate in the thread, I suppose.
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 02:38:04 PM
'mischief maker', 'on the mix'....good excuses to avoid the issue at debate in the thread, I suppose.
Good to see "another opinion" on this board, hopefully you will stay and involve yourself in other discussions which happen here, not just pop in infrequently as you have in the past.
To answer your question, I believe it is an issue which is local to that club, and they have deem a parade to be appropriate.
BTW imho you did start this thread to "mix", as I have done in the past. ;)
nah, just a family connection to Pomeroy which lead me to have more of an interest than usual this time.
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 02:11:42 PM
Sinn Fein or IRA it doesnt make a difference, GAA clubs should stay away for these types of events!
Who said the GAA were there?
The thread title?
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 03:04:47 PM
nah, just a family connection to Pomeroy which lead me to have more of an interest than usual this time.
If you were interested in real debate you could tell us what the gaa club has got to do with the parade. Is your only objection that people meet outside it? If so, what do you want the gaa to do?
Also if you were interested in debate you could address Typ's post.
Quote from: Main Street on July 05, 2008, 03:08:50 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 02:11:42 PM
Sinn Fein or IRA it doesnt make a difference, GAA clubs should stay away for these types of events!
Who said the GAA were there?
The thread title?
The open question was what do u think in general, and that is how i feel in general. does anyone read on this board anymore?
I have no problem with such a parade or the fact that it commences from a GAA club. When you consider the fact that the vast majority of GAA members are either nationalist, republican, Catholic or all three, and when you consider that Sinn Fein are nationalist and republican, then it is not surprising that there is some cross over between GAA membership and Sinn Fein membership.
I don't see anything here for the Pomeroy club to apologise for to anyone. But what I do see is another vain attempt by someone with a bigoted agenda to try to stir things up.
P.S. Sinn Fein are a legal political party.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 03:10:52 PM
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 03:04:47 PM
nah, just a family connection to Pomeroy which lead me to have more of an interest than usual this time.
If you were interested in real debate you could tell us what the gaa club has got to do with the parade. Is your only objection that people meet outside it? If so, what do you want the gaa to do?
Also if you were interested in debate you could address Typ's post.
Nonsense.
If the parade is permitted to form in the grounds of the club, there's clearly approval for it to take place from the committee of that club. That leads to the question as to whether the GAA is happy for one of its clubs to sanction involvement in a celebration of the life of a terrorist...or if they object to that term whether the GAA as a whole still regards such people as 'freedom fighters'.
The GAA cant contiue to claim they are a sport open to all whilst their position on IRA terrorism isnt crystal clear.
Now you, pint ofguinness, can continue to try and waffle your way out of this debate as is your right, but some of us would mind a little clarity and honesty.
(I hear there's also a sporting aspect of the celebration planned. If this is in the form of a GAA game at the club in question, we are in even dodgier territory really, arent we?)
Quote from: balladmaker on July 05, 2008, 04:14:18 PM
I have no problem with such a parade or the fact that it commences from a GAA club. When you consider the fact that the vast majority of GAA members are either nationalist, republican, Catholic or all three, and when you consider that Sinn Fein are nationalist and republican, then it is not surprising that there is some cross over between GAA membership and Sinn Fein membership.
I don't see anything here for the Pomeroy club to apologise for to anyone. But what I do see is another vain attempt by someone with a bigoted agenda to try to stir things up.
P.S. Sinn Fein are a legal political party.
Just because it is so, does not mean that ordinary GAA folk, with no allegiance to Sinn Fein or the IRA, need be subjected to a parade like this through the GAA. There are gaels who will have no problem with this parade because of the cross over you mention - and there are gaels that wouldnt want a similar parade being organised through their club. There are clubs where the majority of the members will be of Sinn Fein persusasion. Again - this doesnt mean that it is acceptable.
However, in address to this post:
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 06:09:13 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 03:10:52 PM
Quote from: iluvni on July 05, 2008, 03:04:47 PM
nah, just a family connection to Pomeroy which lead me to have more of an interest than usual this time.
If you were interested in real debate you could tell us what the gaa club has got to do with the parade. Is your only objection that people meet outside it? If so, what do you want the gaa to do?
Also if you were interested in debate you could address Typ's post.
Nonsense.
If the parade is permitted to form in the grounds of the club, there's clearly approval for it to take place from the committee of that club. That leads to the question as to whether the GAA is happy for one of its clubs to sanction involvement in a celebration of the life of a terrorist...or if they object to that term whether the GAA as a whole still regards such people as 'freedom fighters'.
The GAA cant contiue to claim they are a sport open to all whilst their position on IRA terrorism isnt crystal clear.
Now you, pint ofguinness, can continue to try and waffle your way out of this debate as is your right, but some of us would mind a little clarity and honesty.
(I hear there's also a sporting aspect of the celebration planned. If this is in the form of a GAA game at the club in question, we are in even dodgier territory really, arent we?)
I believe that this particular parade - is in memory of the deceased as a member of the GAA club in pomeroy. Surely any club has a right (maybe even an obligation) to remember deceased members any way that they see fit - or does this change depending on the departure of the deceased and/or the nature of his/her lifestyle?
You have mentioned the GAA position and its lack of crystal clarity - however what you need to remember when you discuss something like this is that you are dealing with individual communities and they will remember their deceased as they see fit. Im sure there has been more than one rangers supporters club venue used for something similar on the other side. Being as the orange order would probably be reluctant to offer their hall as a gathering point for such a parade - and being that pomeroy aint quite new york city and bursting at the seams with venues, and considering the fact that the deceased was a member of the GAA club there - it makes sense enough to me (although I wouldnt attend). We all know it goes on, there is no right, or wrong answer to this. If the GAA were to ban such parades, they would run the risk of alienating a large majority of the crossover GAA members/Sinn Fein supporters that exist in the north of ireland. Especially in communities like Pomeroy.
Are the GAA excited to have these types of parades? Probably not.
Iluvni
Quote
Nonsense.
If the parade is permitted to form in the grounds of the club, there's clearly approval for it to take place from the committee of that club. That leads to the question as to whether the GAA is happy for one of its clubs to sanction involvement in a celebration of the life of a terrorist...or if they object to that term whether the GAA as a whole still regards such people as 'freedom fighters'.
The GAA cant contiue to claim they are a sport open to all whilst their position on IRA terrorism isnt crystal clear.
Now you, pint ofguinness, can continue to try and waffle your way out of this debate as is your right, but some of us would mind a little clarity and honesty.
(I hear there's also a sporting aspect of the celebration planned. If this is in the form of a GAA game at the club in question, we are in even dodgier territory really, arent we?)
What a ridiculous post.
The GAA, as a whole, need to clarify their position on the IRA? The GAA can't do this because it's made up of quite a big membership with all differing views but what does it matter? That's like asking what FIFA think of the Israel conflict or the Iraq war? ::)
I wouldn't be so sure that the committee of the club have approved the gathering of people because there's not much they can do to stop it.
Parades have to start somewhere - a few local parades I know of (of the top of my head) all start at local pubs and I doubt it anyone's approval was asked for. ::)
Btw, you don't know an awful lot about the GAA if you think headquarters hand down instructions to clubs.
Puck
Quote
Just because it is so, does not mean that ordinary GAA folk, with no allegiance to Sinn Fein or the IRA, need be subjected to a parade like this through the GAA. There are gaels who will have no problem with this parade because of the cross over you mention - and there are gaels that wouldnt want a similar parade being organised through their club. There are clubs where the majority of the members will be of Sinn Fein persusasion.
The only gaa members that this parade affects is the members of Pomeroy and I'm sure if there are people within the club that are unhappy with it they have their chance to say so.
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 03:15:34 PM
Quote from: Main Street on July 05, 2008, 03:08:50 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 02:11:42 PM
Sinn Fein or IRA it doesnt make a difference, GAA clubs should stay away for these types of events!
Who said the GAA were there?
The thread title?
The open question was what do u think in general, and that is how i feel in general. does anyone read on this board anymore?
I read this
is there unease at yet another demonstration of a relationship between clubs in the GAA and support for IRA terrorists.what did you read?
The parade demonstrates feck all relationship.
Or do you just spout any old shite that comes into your head about what you feel in general at any random moment?
I think the GAA's policy on this type of thing is unclear, at best and ambivalent at worst. It needs to be clarified, once and for all, not least to take pressure off GAA club administrators in the North. I'm certainly uneasy at the readiness with which Sinn Féin hijacks GAA clubs (in the worst interpretation) or at least associates itself with the GAA by default. I don't know the facts of this particular case, but I do know that Sinn Féin thumbed their noses at the GAA before at the time of the Casement rally and got away with it.
We can equivocate and split hairs about whether or not one event or another is simply the hire of a hall or whether one parade or another simply happened to form up in the GAA club car park, or interpret this as a parade commemorating a deceased GAA member, rather than a deceased IRA member. (If it was, why wasn't it organised by the club? And when did GAA clubs start parading in memory of deceased members? And who selects the deceased members to be honoured in this way?). And is nobody even slightly bewildered by the gymnastic ability of some to decry perceived sectarianism in Northern soccer and fail to appreciate that, rightly or wrongly, this stuff is perceived as the exact mirror image?
But we know the deep essential truth is that this is SF at the very least showing disrespect to the GAA's non-party-political rule and riding roughshod over the wishes of GAA members who don't happen to share their ideals. I think fair minded GAA people of all political hues will leave their political views aside and call that what it is - unfair. We rarely see other political parties going out of their way to hijack the GAA's name and reputation like this.
I understand the local pressures that would make it difficult to say no to a request to use GAA facilities for essentially party political purposes. That's why a clear set of guidelines from HQ might make life easier for GAA club administrators, if they can point to a ruling that prevents them facilitating this sort of thing. It would also lessen the instance of numpties coming on here to stir spite.
Some party politician (FF, if I remember correctly) turned up inside St Tiernachs Park in Clones during the last election campaign, handing out election literature. I think he was hounded out of it by the disapproval of the patrons. I remember people here agreeing that we can't let GAA facilities be hijacked for this sort of party political stunt. If it applies to FF, it should also apply to SF.
Hardy agree totally with what you're saying about Sinn Fein thinking they've some God given right to use the GAA and I know of instances where they've tried to effectively bully GAA clubs however I wouldn't say the hiring out of halls/club rooms etc is one of them - at least not in my expereince.
You will know that these places will be hired out - I don't see any problem with that.
You will also know that in most communities the GAA club will be the centre of the community and members will be reluctant - even if they are anti sinn fein or anti IRA - to raise objections to facilities being hired out because it will be their neighbours and friends they are raising objections to.
Take Pomeroy - what member, anti sinn fein or not, would raise an objection to allowing people to gather at the club to remember one of their members?
(I don't know how they can stop people gathering anyway).
Still can't believe we're linking this club to the march because people are told to gather there.
::)
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 07:41:55 PM
Hardy agree totally with what you're saying about Sinn Fein thinking they've some God given right to use the GAA and I know of instances where they've tried to effectively bully GAA clubs however I wouldn't say the hiring out of halls/club rooms etc is one of them - at least not in my expereince.
You will know that these places will be hired out - I don't see any problem with that.
You will also know that in most communities the GAA club will be the centre of the community and members will be reluctant - even if they are anti sinn fein or anti IRA - to raise objections to facilities being hired out because it will be their neighbours and friends they are raising objections to.
Take Pomeroy - what member, anti sinn fein or not, would raise an objection to allowing people to gather at the club to remember one of their members?
(I don't know how they can stop people gathering anyway).
Still can't believe we're linking this club to the march because people are told to gather there.
::)
QuotePuck
Quote
Just because it is so, does not mean that ordinary GAA folk, with no allegiance to Sinn Fein or the IRA, need be subjected to a parade like this through the GAA. There are gaels who will have no problem with this parade because of the cross over you mention - and there are gaels that wouldnt want a similar parade being organised through their club. There are clubs where the majority of the members will be of Sinn Fein persusasion.
The only gaa members that this parade affects is the members of Pomeroy and I'm sure if there are people within the club that are unhappy with it they have their chance to say so.
The inability to reconcile these two statements is vast. On one hand you suggest people in pomeroy would have the chance to voice their unease with this parade - yet in your reference to hardy you (rightly) state how tough it would be to do so. There is little chance a member of pomeroy GAA who was against this parade - could in any way state their true beliefs about said parade and come out of the statement with a happy ending.
QuoteThe inability to reconcile these two statements is vast. On one hand you suggest people in pomeroy would have the chance to voice their unease with this parade - yet in your reference to hardy you (rightly) state how tough it would be to do so. There is little chance a member of pomeroy GAA who was against this parade - could in any way state their true beliefs about said parade and come out of the statement with a happy ending.
No, I said that if a member opposed the parade they could say so but that it's unlikely they would have a problem as it's for one of the members of their club.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 08:37:18 PM
QuoteThe inability to reconcile these two statements is vast. On one hand you suggest people in pomeroy would have the chance to voice their unease with this parade - yet in your reference to hardy you (rightly) state how tough it would be to do so. There is little chance a member of pomeroy GAA who was against this parade - could in any way state their true beliefs about said parade and come out of the statement with a happy ending.
No, I said that if a member opposed the parade they could say so but that it's unlikely they would have a problem as it's for one of the members of their club.
Thats not quite what you said, although if thats what you meant - fair enough.
some people really go out of their way to get offended ...............(iluvni)
Excuse my ignorance, but what is the name of the person for whom the march/rally/celebration is for?
Obviously the stirrer (iluvni) is one of those one eyed Unionists who can only think "terrorist" when a Republican is mentioned.
Of course if his gang of cnuts hadnt been discriminating against the Nationalist Community from 1922 ( not to mention the early 1600s when they were handed the stolen land) there would never have been a Provo IRA nor the need for a forced Coalition Administration in the north.
You reap what you so you one eyed Unionist.
I think alot of people feel there should be a clear separation because of how the term Republician has been hi-jacked by Sinn Fein and the IRA over the last 25 years in a fashion alot of people are uncomfortable with. As a member of the GAA and a Republician I understand the links between the GAA and the countries republican history but I do feel uneasy with the current Sinn Fein and IRA being linked with the organization and that is why I feel no such Sinn Fein events should be held in GAA clubs!
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 10:44:54 PM
I think alot of people feel there should be a clear separation because of how the term Republician has been hi-jacked by Sinn Fein and the IRA over the last 25 years in a fashion alot of people are uncomfortable with. As a member of the GAA and a Republician I understand the links between the GAA and the countries republican history but I do feel uneasy with the current Sinn Fein and IRA being linked with the organization and that is why I feel no such Sinn Fein events should be held in GAA clubs!
are u a republican republican or a fianna fail type republican?
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 05, 2008, 11:15:19 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 05, 2008, 10:44:54 PM
I think alot of people feel there should be a clear separation because of how the term Republician has been hi-jacked by Sinn Fein and the IRA over the last 25 years in a fashion alot of people are uncomfortable with. As a member of the GAA and a Republician I understand the links between the GAA and the countries republican history but I do feel uneasy with the current Sinn Fein and IRA being linked with the organization and that is why I feel no such Sinn Fein events should be held in GAA clubs!
are u a republican republican or a fianna fail type republican?
see this is the issue. What is exactly a Republican Republican? roughly if you can define it. and whats FF republican?
a republican by definition is someone who opposes a monarchy but in our context it generally means a person in favour of a 32 county irish republic. fianna fail sdlp etc say their republicans but their is little evidence to suggest that they are true republicans?
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 05, 2008, 11:20:55 PM
a republican by definition is someone who opposes a monarchy but in our context it generally means a person in favour of a 32 county irish republic. fianna fail sdlp etc say their republicans but their is little evidence to suggest that they are true republicans?
Well i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs, i agree with the route that we have taken at this stage. the issue i have with 'republican' funerals and the GAA is that i do not see alot of these guys as martyrs.
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
I don't think killing innocent people makes you a republican!
sitting on your arse waiting for it to happen doesnt either
Hardy has dissected the problem with clarity, and arrived at the correct position.
Perhaps Tankie, you are what has been termed a "Constitutional Republican".
Interesting debate. I wonder then if, Iluvni, you can comment on the use of Tobermore FC (the club one George Best togged out for) clubrooms for Loyalist fundraising...or the association of orangemen with and who willingly walk behind "Blood and thunder" bands such as the Billy Wright Memorial "Band", or the self-same bands who openly fly the flags of illegal organisations and the orangemen and women and hangers-on who parade behind these bands, and originating from orange halls throughout the wee six. Or how about the picture of a Rangers player in last weeks BBC NI website holding a scarf depicting a sectarian image?
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
So only a man/woman who is prepared to partake/support (in) all the atrocities that have been committed in the name of "republicanism" can be called a republican??? No wonder it has become such a dirty word. Count me out if thats your definition. :-\
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
You could just join Sinn Fein and be pro-British / 32 county / 6 County or whichever suits at any given time and pays the most money,
Quote from: Puckoon on July 06, 2008, 04:06:36 AM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
So only a man/woman who is prepared to partake/support (in) all the atrocities that have been committed in the name of "republicanism" can be called a republican??? No wonder it has become such a dirty word. Count me out if thats your definition. :-\
No, where did I say that?
QuoteTankie
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1090
Re: To unite or not to unite, that is the question.
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2007, 02:06:54 PM »
I wouldnt be too worried about the imagrants, do the people in the south want to unite. Alot of people in the South see the North as a ecconomic drain on the British govenerment and would be asking the question on whether we want to take that over. I would be all up for a United Ireland but the ecconomics would have to be right.
QuoteWhats the point in us all being broke. We have seen how badly Germany struggled with reunification. Unification is something that I would want to take place but not if it is going to set us all back years. I would also be looking for a 70% Yes vote from the north as a mininum because everyone would need to be on board for it to work.
http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=5271.0 (http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=5271.0)
Republican my arse ::)
Quote from: Aerlik on July 06, 2008, 03:58:20 AM
Perhaps Tankie, you are what has been termed a "Constitutional Republican".
Interesting debate. I wonder then if, Iluvni, you can comment on the use of Tobermore FC (the club one George Best togged out for) clubrooms for Loyalist fundraising...or the association of orangemen with and who willingly walk behind "Blood and thunder" bands such as the Billy Wright Memorial "Band", or the self-same bands who openly fly the flags of illegal organisations and the orangemen and women and hangers-on who parade behind these bands, and originating from orange halls throughout the wee six. Or how about the picture of a Rangers player in last weeks BBC NI website holding a scarf depicting a sectarian image?
Certainly. If Tobermore FC use their premises to support in any way the activities of any Loyalist paramilitary grouping, they should face sanction (or expulsion) from the IFA. Under no circumstance should they receive a single penny of funding from the IFA or from any Government body, Sports Council etc. Nor should they be permitted to receive a penny of National Lottery funding. In fact, they should be required to repay each and every penny they've received thus far.
If I was on any committee of a football club and the club made the claim to be open to all sections of the community, I'd vote against the use of the premises by groups which represent only one section of the community in their membership...Orange Order or AoH for instance.
Thats Tobermore's call though, just as its Pomeroy Plunkett's call. They can be judged on theri actions though by the wider community. I see a difference between an OO/AoH parade though than one in support of say a UVF or the IRA terrorist. (and yes I also know many would have no qualms in being involved in both).
(As for the Rangers player...never saw the scarf in question so i dont know)
QuoteI see a difference between an OO/AoH parade though than one in support of say a UVF or the IRA terrorist. (and yes I also know many would have no qualms in being involved in both).
You think the AOH is the same as the OO?
You don't equate an OO march with a republican march? ::)
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
That has to be one of the dumbest statements ever on this board (and we all know there is serious competition for such titles). And if that's the criteria, could you please point out someone who fits it?
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 06, 2008, 12:13:44 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
That has to be one of the dumbest statements ever on this board (and we all know there is serious competition for such titles). And if that's the criteria, could you please point out someone who fits it?
I don't follow?
Tankie has said before that he wouldn't be in favour of a United Ireland if he's going to be out of pocket - that, imo, is not a republican.
If he, or anyone else, thinks that a United Ireland is not worth killing/dying for then that's fair enough. Imo that doesnt affect his claim to be republican.
ILUVNI - Away and start oe about Portadown FC / Linfield etc etc etc !
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 12:20:15 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 06, 2008, 12:13:44 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 05, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
QuoteWell i would be a 32 county republican but not at all costs,
So you're not a republican.
That has to be one of the dumbest statements ever on this board (and we all know there is serious competition for such titles). And if that's the criteria, could you please point out someone who fits it?
I don't follow?
Tankie has said before that he wouldn't be in favour of a United Ireland if he's going to be out of pocket - that, imo, is not a republican.
If he, or anyone else, thinks that a United Ireland is not worth killing/dying for then that's fair enough. Imo that doesnt affect his claim to be republican.
Yes, but there's a difference between
'economic costs' and
'at all costs'. Maybe you're not a
real Republican if you'll give up on such aspirations for fear of being financially disadvantaged, but your first statement (the one i commented on) suggests that you couldn't, for example, be a republican and a pacifist. You do however, seem to have just retracted that implication in your latest post.
maguire
QuoteYes, but there's a difference between 'economic costs' and 'at all costs'. Maybe you're not a real Republican if you'll give up on such aspirations for fear of being financially disadvantaged, but your first statement (the one i commented on) suggests that you couldn't, for example, be a republican and a pacifist. You do however, seem to have just retracted that implication in your latest post.
When Tankie said "at all costs" I assume he meant economic costs because I remember him saying before that he wouldn't be willing to be out of pocket (and I've quoted those posts now).
That's it all cleared up then! ;D
Quote from: orangeman on July 06, 2008, 12:22:14 PM
ILUVNI - Away and start oe about Portadown FC / Linfield etc etc etc !
Topics are constantly started about these.
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 12:57:43 PM
Quote from: orangeman on July 06, 2008, 12:22:14 PM
ILUVNI - Away and start oe about Portadown FC / Linfield etc etc etc !
Topics are constantly started about these.
How many have you started ? ;)
The same number as ive started slagging off the GAA
why do people care so much. if people in pomeroy want to honour their dead then let them, the only people who could have a right to complain are residents who would be affected by the march. and i doubt very much that many in the villiage are going to complain
Remind me again of this connection between Pomeroy GAA and the IRA commemoration parade ???
Another typical brainless attempt by Politicians to justify, capitalise and whip up Unionist prejudice against the GAA.
When politicians get in front of a microphone on these communal issues they only have one motive,
election or re - election, by drumming up intolerance and hate.
When I hear a northern politician in these circumstance stand up in front of a mike and demand respect and understanding for neighbors, respect for the GAA then there might be a slight chance that the GFA experiment might last.
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
I think some people have made it into a little competition - you have to be more offended than the other person.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 12:53:34 PM
maguire
QuoteYes, but there's a difference between 'economic costs' and 'at all costs'. Maybe you're not a real Republican if you'll give up on such aspirations for fear of being financially disadvantaged, but your first statement (the one i commented on) suggests that you couldn't, for example, be a republican and a pacifist. You do however, seem to have just retracted that implication in your latest post.
When Tankie said "at all costs" I assume he meant economic costs because I remember him saying before that he wouldn't be willing to be out of pocket (and I've quoted those posts now).
I would like a United Ireland but a successful United Ireland, huge investment is needed in the north and also alot of people need to move into the 21st centry up there. I would probably not put my life on the line for the republican cause as i think that type of thing is finished and i do not want to push the unionist side into the republic as it would not be successful then. I like the way things are going at the moment is the best way forward, there is investment in the North by the Republic, Britain and many other countries so that is a start on the ecconomic front but the big task for a united ireland is changing people mindset, both nationalists and republicans.
You're perfectly entitled to your opinion but don't start claiming to be a republican.
He aspires to a united irish republic. How is he not a republican?
Quote from: Tankie on July 06, 2008, 05:21:28 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 12:53:34 PM
maguire
QuoteYes, but there's a difference between 'economic costs' and 'at all costs'. Maybe you're not a real Republican if you'll give up on such aspirations for fear of being financially disadvantaged, but your first statement (the one i commented on) suggests that you couldn't, for example, be a republican and a pacifist. You do however, seem to have just retracted that implication in your latest post.
When Tankie said "at all costs" I assume he meant economic costs because I remember him saying before that he wouldn't be willing to be out of pocket (and I've quoted those posts now).
Sure why dont we wait until the economy is flying again and have a United Ireland then!
I understand that people want the country to do well after reunification but to worry about being as well of then as you are now to me says that you are a mercenary fecker who wants everything and if he doesnt get it then keep things as they are because why would we take a chance. Moral cowardice in the extreme.
I would like a United Ireland but a successful United Ireland, huge investment is needed in the north and also alot of people need to move into the 21st centry up there. I would probably not put my life on the line for the republican cause as i think that type of thing is finished and i do not want to push the unionist side into the republic as it would not be successful then. I like the way things are going at the moment is the best way forward, there is investment in the North by the Republic, Britain and many other countries so that is a start on the ecconomic front but the big task for a united ireland is changing people mindset, both nationalists and republicans.
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 05:33:26 PM
He aspires to a united irish republic. How is he not a republican?
Because he wants one as long as he's not out of pocket.
I read it more like he would want something sustainable, but whatever, is there a defining line for being a republican?
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
GAA folowers were stopped going through Pomeroy today to allow an Oranage order march to proceed in the town. The Orange Order march consisted on one band, fronted by one member with union jack, beret and gloves. Didn't seem very religious to me.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:39:08 PM
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 05:33:26 PM
He aspires to a united irish republic. How is he not a republican?
Because he wants one as long as he's not out of pocket.
He is a money hungry fence sitter.
armchair republican
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:48:06 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
Now, Id like you to clarify if there are any circumstances which are not acceptable - or is everything that has been passed as republican activity - acceptable.
Also, please try and leave out the ambiguous answers which can later be flip flopped on and we'll be told "Thats not what I said"
Straight forward enough question - straighforward enough answer required.
Quote
Now, Id like you to clarify if there are any circumstances which are not acceptable - or is everything that has been passed as republican activity - acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean - why don't you list the circumstances and I'll say yes or no.
As for the rest of your post - it's hardly my fault if people won't read posts before responding or if they are waiting to jump on the slightest thing so they can get a row going.
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 06:02:29 PM
armchair republican
Just out of interest, what is an 'armchair republican'? In these times of peace, what does someone have to do to be considered an 'active' republican (if that is the opposite of 'armchair' republican)?
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 06:38:51 PM
Quote
Now, Id like you to clarify if there are any circumstances which are not acceptable - or is everything that has been passed as republican activity - acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean - why don't you list the circumstances and I'll say yes or no.
As for the rest of your post - it's hardly my fault if people won't read posts before responding or if they are waiting to jump on the slightest thing so they can get a row going.
This answer actually gives me a better understanding of your position than any of the previous answers.
QuoteThis answer actually gives me a better understanding of your position than any of the previous answers.
How so?
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:48:06 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Quote
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Yes I'd take poverty and face a terror campaign - I'm a republican.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 07:45:18 PM
Quote
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Yes I'd take poverty and face a terror campaign - I'm a republican.
well that is the most rediculous thing i've heard in a long time!
Quote from: Tankie on July 06, 2008, 07:47:46 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 07:45:18 PM
Quote
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Yes I'd take poverty and face a terror campaign - I'm a republican.
well that is the most rediculous thing i've heard in a long time!
That's your opinion but don't be going around claiming to be a republican.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 08:01:27 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 06, 2008, 07:47:46 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 07:45:18 PM
Quote
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Yes I'd take poverty and face a terror campaign - I'm a republican.
well that is the most rediculous thing i've heard in a long time!
That's your opinion but don't be going around claiming to be a republican.
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D Id roll on the floor laughing - but theres too much dog hair.
Tell me, are all republicans this funny? :D
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 08:01:27 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 06, 2008, 07:47:46 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 07:45:18 PM
Quote
So POG you would be up for a United Ireland where the unionist do not accept it and being a terror campaign and we are totally broke and we are all in the shitter together. You being a true republican tho would have no have no problem taking the poverty over a successful United Ireland when the time is ready?
Yes I'd take poverty and face a terror campaign - I'm a republican.
well that is the most rediculous thing i've heard in a long time!
That's your opinion but don't be going around claiming to be a republican.
you really have lost the plot POG - if the boys up the north have that opinion no wonder the place is in bits!
Quote
you really have lost the plot POG - if the boys up the north have that opinion no wonder the place is in bits!
Lost the plot how - because I want a united Ireland?
I happen to think that if the country struggled financially for a while it would be worth it. I would also think that it would be worth standing up to a terror campaign. People in the north have come through a terror campaign before.
Countless of generations of Irish people have faced terror and poverty because they felt a United Ireland was worth it. They also died and killed for it - where they insane too?
You can count your lucky stars tonight that the people who won you your freedom (and the generations who fought before them) were not as selfish and as cowardly as you.
You only want a united Ireland if it doesnt affect you and then you think you can call yourself a republican.
That's what's funny.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:48:06 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
Can't you be a republican in the sense of the Republic of Ireland?
Quote from: MW on July 06, 2008, 08:47:24 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:48:06 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
Can't you be a republican in the sense of the Republic of Ireland?
How so?
So only Sinn Féiners can be properly described as Republicans while people who are against monarchies/aristocracies etc cant call themselves republicans unless they favour a United Ireland.
Meanwhile nobody from Ulster can call themselves "Ulsterman" unless they are a Protestant Unionist from the 6 North Eastern Counties.
Is it any wonder a lot of folks in the 26 Counties aren't too gone on the idea of a re unified Ireland.
QuoteSo only Sinn Féiners can be properly described as Republicans while people who are against monarchies/aristocracies etc cant call themselves republicans unless they favour a United Ireland.
Who has said this?
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 08:48:45 PM
Quote from: MW on July 06, 2008, 08:47:24 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 05:48:06 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 06, 2008, 05:45:49 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 06, 2008, 01:45:30 PM
Quotewhy do people care so much.
Well you can't go through a week without being offended.
me personally or people such as the maker of this post?
People like the maker of the thread.
NIfan, I have no set definition of being an Irish republican but I think a republican needs to want an united Ireland and not just under particular circumstances.
Can't you be a republican in the sense of the Republic of Ireland?
How so?
Supporting the currently existing republic, and the fact that it is a republic, without it having to be co-terminous with the island?
QuoteSupporting the currently existing republic, and the fact that it is a republic, without it having to be co-terminous with the island?
We've established a number of posts back that we're talking about Irish Republicanism as in someone who wants a United Ireland - lets not start making stuff up to allow Tankie to call himself an Irish republican, that would be a bit silly.
So PoG, is it incompatible to be a real Republican and a Pacifist?
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 06, 2008, 09:40:35 PM
So PoG, is it incompatible to be a real Republican and a Pacifist?
Yes of course an Irish Republican can be a pacifist.
Tankie is no more a Republican then I am a card carrying Paisleyite, this discussion is getting silly, the usual anti-Sinn Fein crap is being spouted by people who should take of the blinkers , this statelet is sitting at a state of peace BECAUSE of SF, accept it and move on!
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 06, 2008, 10:27:44 PM
this statelet is sitting at a state of peace BECAUSE of SF, accept it and move on!
Do you mean because of them in that if they wanted they could start the trouble tomorrow, or do you believe it was down to them that it all stopped?
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 11:22:39 PM
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 06, 2008, 10:27:44 PM
this statelet is sitting at a state of peace BECAUSE of SF, accept it and move on!
Do you mean because of them in that if they wanted they could start the trouble tomorrow, or do you believe it was down to them that it all stopped?
I think what he means is that they played a major part in the Good Friday Agreement, and that indeed Sinn Fein as an entity are easier to swallow than the Provisional IRA. Giving people jobs as politicians rather than guns is a good way forward in my opinion.
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 11:22:39 PM
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 06, 2008, 10:27:44 PM
this statelet is sitting at a state of peace BECAUSE of SF, accept it and move on!
Do you mean because of them in that if they wanted they could start the trouble tomorrow, or do you believe it was down to them that it all stopped?
I am commenting on Tankie and alot of other peoples bias against SF, they were instrumental in carrying the peace process to where it is, and wither you like them or not, they are a well supported legitimate political party!
Too many people on here let their judgements be clouded by their hatred of SF and anything Republican.
maguire: id consider an armchair republican to be someone who would say theyre for a united ireland nd enjoy themselves at an easter rising commemeration in dublin but when it comes down to it their not terribly interested in irish reunification and are happy enough with the status quo. tankie could well be as republican as bobby sands, hes just doing a very good job of hiding it.......
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 07, 2008, 12:14:10 AM
Quote from: nifan on July 06, 2008, 11:22:39 PM
Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on July 06, 2008, 10:27:44 PM
this statelet is sitting at a state of peace BECAUSE of SF, accept it and move on!
Do you mean because of them in that if they wanted they could start the trouble tomorrow, or do you believe it was down to them that it all stopped?
I am commenting on Tankie and alot of other peoples bias against SF, they were instrumental in carrying the peace process to where it is, and wither you like them or not, they are a well supported legitimate political party!
Too many people on here let their judgements be clouded by their hatred of SF and anything Republican.
I do not have a SF bia's, i even voted for SF (which i have said before but people chose not to believe it) but i voted for them in the hope that they were moving forward (and beacuse one of their TD's is an old neighbour). at the present time i would not vote for them as i do not agree with their position on Lisbon and as for a party they are not offering solutions which annoys be greatly and makes me wonder why they asked for a NO vote.
In previous posts on this thread i stated what my view of an United Ireland should be, i just dont think bombing our way there is the solution or is forcing a UnitedIreland on the Unionist side!
Quote from: Tankie on July 07, 2008, 02:07:52 PM
In previous posts on this thread i stated what my view of an United Ireland should be, i just dont think bombing our way there is the solution or is forcing a UnitedIreland on the Unionist side!
british rule was forced on us
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 07, 2008, 05:05:53 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 07, 2008, 02:07:52 PM
In previous posts on this thread i stated what my view of an United Ireland should be, i just dont think bombing our way there is the solution or is forcing a UnitedIreland on the Unionist side!
british rule was forced on us
Just because that why we're in the current situation doesn't necessarily mean it's the way out. Two wrongs etc...
but its hardly a wrong if the majority of people claim to support it?
It's an oldie and a bit trite, but the majority of Germans supported Hitler.
Quote from: Hardy on July 08, 2008, 09:52:41 AM
It's an oldie and a bit trite, but the majority of Germans supported Hitler.
It's also incorrect. The Nazis never got more than 35% of the vote in any General Election they ever contested. By exploiting the political chaos of the time, they eventually got accepted into a coalition government, then intimidated and/or banned the other parties in it, passed Emergency Legislation giving them overall power, then banned further elections.
Good. I can stop using it then.
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 07, 2008, 05:05:53 PM
Quote from: Tankie on July 07, 2008, 02:07:52 PM
In previous posts on this thread i stated what my view of an United Ireland should be, i just dont think bombing our way there is the solution or is forcing a UnitedIreland on the Unionist side!
british rule was forced on us
I was talking more so about the furture as POG said that he would gladly take poverty and a terrorist campaign from the unionist for a United Ireland. I said I would not be in favour of this and i think the best united ireland will be one that comes through peaceful means only.
Relatives of July 7 bomber hold PARTY at his grave to 'celebrate his life'
By Rebecca Camber
Last updated at 10:26 AM on 08th July 2008
It was three years to the day since the July 7 bombers brought carnage to the heart of London.
In Britain yesterday, families of the victims wept for their loved ones.
In a village in Pakistan, a banquet was held to honour one of the young men who committed the murderous crimes.
Yesterday the families of the victims reacted with outrage to the secret ceremony held at the village where 70 guests gathered to offer prayers and blessings for the suicide bomber whose grave is considered to be a 'shrine of a big saint'.
Bradford-born Tanweer, whose father emigrated from Pakistan and ran a chip shop in Leeds, detonated his bomb at Aldgate station on July 7, 2005, killing seven innocent people as well as himself.
Together with Mohammed Sidique Khan, 30, Hasib Hussain,18, and 19-year-old Jermaine Lindsay, the four bombers blew up three Underground trains and a bus.
As thousands mourned in Britain yesterday, in Pakistan there were prayers uttered for his soul and verses of the Koran were read out.
At the commemorative dinner held by Tanweer's uncle, 42-year-old property developer Tahir Pervez at his home in Samundari, guests were treated to two courses of sweet rice and salted rice with curry and beef prepared by a renowned local chef.
etcetc.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1032699/Relatives-July-7-bomber-hold-party-grave-celebrate-life.html
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No different to Pomeroy really.
so you would ban relatives and friends of the dead commemerating their lives if you dont agree with their politics?
Grief is private. Respect is dignified. Commemoration is reflective. Marches or parades are none of these things, which is what prompts me to feel that "commemorative parades" are about something other than grief, respect and commemoration.
Quote from: iluvni on July 08, 2008, 11:03:03 AM
No different to Pomeroy really.
Yeah, he should have turned tens of thousands of civilians into ash. Then they'd have erected a statue of him.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/109/294882577_710d8fc2d2.jpg?v=0)
Quote from: iluvni on July 08, 2008, 11:03:03 AM
Relatives of July 7 bomber hold PARTY at his grave to 'celebrate his life'
By Rebecca Camber
Last updated at 10:26 AM on 08th July 2008
It was three years to the day since the July 7 bombers brought carnage to the heart of London.
In Britain yesterday, families of the victims wept for their loved ones.
In a village in Pakistan, a banquet was held to honour one of the young men who committed the murderous crimes.
Yesterday the families of the victims reacted with outrage to the secret ceremony held at the village where 70 guests gathered to offer prayers and blessings for the suicide bomber whose grave is considered to be a 'shrine of a big saint'.
Bradford-born Tanweer, whose father emigrated from Pakistan and ran a chip shop in Leeds, detonated his bomb at Aldgate station on July 7, 2005, killing seven innocent people as well as himself.
Together with Mohammed Sidique Khan, 30, Hasib Hussain,18, and 19-year-old Jermaine Lindsay, the four bombers blew up three Underground trains and a bus.
As thousands mourned in Britain yesterday, in Pakistan there were prayers uttered for his soul and verses of the Koran were read out.
At the commemorative dinner held by Tanweer's uncle, 42-year-old property developer Tahir Pervez at his home in Samundari, guests were treated to two courses of sweet rice and salted rice with curry and beef prepared by a renowned local chef.
etcetc.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1032699/Relatives-July-7-bomber-hold-party-grave-celebrate-life.html
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No different to Pomeroy really.
What's the issue with this?
Surely these people are entitled to grieve to?
Quote from: Hardy on July 08, 2008, 05:08:55 PM
Grief is private. Respect is dignified. Commemoration is reflective. Marches or parades are none of these things, which is what prompts me to feel that "commemorative parades" are about something other than grief, respect and commemoration.
how are commemorative parades not about commemoration?????????
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 08, 2008, 07:51:13 PM
Quote from: Hardy on July 08, 2008, 05:08:55 PM
Grief is private. Respect is dignified. Commemoration is reflective. Marches or parades are none of these things, which is what prompts me to feel that "commemorative parades" are about something other than grief, respect and commemoration.
how are commemorative parades not about commemoration?????????
Different people can attach different meanings to the same words. See the 'republican' debate earlier.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 08, 2008, 07:13:04 PM
What's the issue with this?
Surely these people are entitled to grieve to?
Maybe that's different. It appeared to be private.
Just out of interest, if some of your family had been murdered by loyalists, would you be happy to see these murderers publically celebrated in your locality? Would you accept it as a 'commemoration'?
Quote
Just out of interest, if some of your family had been murdered by loyalists, would you be happy to see these murderers publically celebrated in your locality? Would you accept it as a 'commemoration'?
I mighten like it but we go through life not liking things.
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 08, 2008, 11:46:19 PM
Quote from: dodgy umpire on July 08, 2008, 07:51:13 PM
Quote from: Hardy on July 08, 2008, 05:08:55 PM
Grief is private. Respect is dignified. Commemoration is reflective. Marches or parades are none of these things, which is what prompts me to feel that "commemorative parades" are about something other than grief, respect and commemoration.
how are commemorative parades not about commemoration?????????
Different people can attach different meanings to the same words. See the 'republican' debate earlier.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 08, 2008, 07:13:04 PM
What's the issue with this?
Surely these people are entitled to grieve to?
Maybe that's different. It appeared to be private.
Just out of interest, if some of your family had been murdered by loyalists, would you be happy to see these murderers publically celebrated in your locality? Would you accept it as a 'commemoration'?
if the majority of the people in my locality wanted to commemerate these people then id have to accept that. i doubt many will be offended in pomery. everyone is allowed to remember their dead as they choose, provided its not designed to annoy people, which this march in pomery is unlikely to do so