Apparently, the horse-faced one will be in the VIP section of the Hogan Stand for Ireland v Scotland in the Six Nations, the first official visit to GAA HQ by a member of the british parasite (sorry) royal family
While she has been to Lansdowne Road on a few occasions in the past, this is the first time such a high ranking member of the buckingham palace inbred germans has visited Croker... with six of our 32 counties still under occupation, this depresses me no end
So???
Regard it as part of growing up!! Wait till you see ! The Sun will rise the next day!
Have Britain ever apologised for it?
If not then I wouldn't let her in the gate
Quote from: zoyler on February 14, 2008, 07:07:20 PM
So???
Regard it as part of growing up!! Wait till you see ! The Sun will rise the next day!
Perpetual darkness till the shameful wrong is righted
I'm just off the phone to the horsey one and she said "one would rather not discuss one's history, one just wants to enjoy the rugby. C'mon Scotland, and beat them feckin Oirish!"
Quote from: thebandit on February 14, 2008, 07:11:13 PM
Have Britain ever apologised for it?
If not then I wouldn't let her in the gate
Apologized for what, exactly? The "six of our 32 counties still under occupation"? Or Bloody Sunday?
One of the downsides to the opening up of Croke Park (and I say this as someone who was broadly in favour of it) are all these bloody 'firsts'. First match, first match against a British team, first soccer match, first soccer match against a British team, first visit from a Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg, first decent attendance from Cork outside an All-Ireland final . . .
Ah lads, leave off the poor auld bugger, isn't she the Scottish rugby union president? Don't mind her supporting the Scots, and anyway, hasn't there been many a ROYAL in Croke Park before?
Quote from: deiseach on February 14, 2008, 07:27:30 PM
One of the downsides to the opening up of Croke Park (and I say this as someone who was broadly in favour of it) are all these bloody 'firsts'. First match, first match against a British team, first soccer match, first soccer match against a British team, first visit from a Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg, first decent attendance from Cork outside an All-Ireland final . . .
A traumatic period, no question... let's hope all these people can just find the strength and perseverance to make it through what will be another very difficult occasion. ::)
what you expect when we opened the gates
Although personally I would have a problem with it, it's time we all moved forwarded. So I say let her come, lets show her a good time. Let her go back to her Mother and tell her that prehaps it's time to get the final foot out the door ;)
Apologised for Bloody Sunday - it was her family's personal army after all
Quote from: ziggysego on February 14, 2008, 07:38:19 PM
So I say let her come, lets show her a good time.
In Greencastle, that's a feed of trout and buttermilk at midday followed by attendance at Greencastle v Urney. The onto the clubrooms for a bout of stout drinking, maybe 8-9 pints of Black Protestant's Porter, stopping briefly for the Angelus. Round it all off with a turf-clodding session on the main road at any passing clergy. Go home with your first cousin if lucky.
Not sure if Anne'd be up for it but no harm in asking I suppose.
That's a good weekend in Greencastle O'Neill. I said I'd show her a good time on Saturday, that's all.
We cant have our cake and eat it lads. We sold our principles, took the cash, and now we have to live with the consequences. I am sure she will receive a hearty Cead Mile Failte from our new enlightened G.A.A. establishment. You never know there might be a few oul honours to be had out of it. Nicky Brennan C.B.E. or even Sir Sean Kelly, now that has a nice ring to it
If this was the worst that could happen then I'd be OK with it. In fact I am OK with it. I think I will spend my energy lobbying those who can (but decide not to) make the right changes regarding the unjust occupation. I know my priority's are all messed up.
Hopefully she'll be forced fed one of the special Croke Park 'hotdogs' that will make her puke her ring.
Quote from: Pangurban on February 15, 2008, 02:07:33 AM
We cant have our cake and eat it lads. We sold our principles, took the cash, and now we have to live with the consequences.
A very fair point I would have t say
cant see the prob with this folks
its not as if the royal family create the policies for the british gov to adhere to.
I very much doubt if the poor hoor would really even want to be there.
would you fancy watching a game you didnt like, plus one played by two crap teams?
Me neither.
Sure Princess Anne is a real Rugby fan. She's the patron of the SRFU. She loves Rugby.
Maybe because the ball looks like her head, but she's always at the Scots' games, especially in Murrayfield.
this real is a step too far . taking one up the arse for political correctness . I was one of those who saw the opening of Croker a a massive wrong and still do. what would Mick hogan think of the one of the queens piglets warming her arse in a stand named in his honor while still claiming to own a 1/4 of the country.
If the bitch wants to come send her down to the hill 16 with the jackeens who have her great grandmother such a welcome back in the day
another great reason to hate the IRFU and their team of private school shirtlifters
I'm sure the Bull Hayes will be amused to hear he is a private school shirtlifter :D
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 11:41:06 AM
this real is a step too far . taking one up the arse for political correctness . I was one of those who saw the opening of Croker a a massive wrong and still do. what would Mick hogan think of the one of the queens piglets warming her arse in a stand named in his honor while still claiming to own a 1/4 of the country.
If the bitch wants to come send her down to the hill 16 with the jackeens who have her great grandmother such a welcome back in the day
another great reason to hate the IRFU and their team of private school shirtlifters
He'd think rosnarun is talking shite as that's not where the word Jackeen comes from .And isn't great we aren't blowing the shit out of each other in a stalemated war
never said where it came from . are you denying that dublin lined the streets for Victoria R when she paid a visit.
and seeing as you are so happy with the current situation will you be standing and belting out GSTQ Pre match in memory of the good old times . in your british liones jersy so beloved of the Irish players
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 12:04:35 PM
never said where it came from . are you denying that dublin lined the streets for Victoria R when she paid a visit.
and seeing as you are so happy with the current situation will you be standing and belting out GSTQ Pre match in memory of the good old times . in your british liones jersy so beloved of the Irish players
British AND IRISH Lions, is the official title.
What's the difference between Anne and the rest of them that have been invited / entertained and treated like royalty / VIPS ?
When us peasants go, we can encounter some cpig ignorant stewards who I'm sure will either not be on duty that day or will have been advised to brush up on their manners.
Honestly, if this is such a big issue, maybe some of ye should stick on the oul celtic tracksuit, and head down to protest.....
Personally I couldn't give a sh!t
QuoteWhat's the difference between Anne and the rest of them that have been invited / entertained and treated like royalty / VIPS ?
She'll be the only one who claims a Divine right to own the country .
British and Irish lions me hole no more than the 'triple crown' the whole venture has no Validity at all unless you consider all 4 teams to be part of the same country/kingdom . what other logic is ther for it other than historic as in pre independance days
anyway it a title ignored by every one outside the 26 counties.
Dont get me wrong im an absoute pacifist but if some one robs your house you dont invite them in to ride your wife as well
I have oft times seen Annie the horse (daughter of Lizzie the hoor) singing "Flower of Scotland" so she is welcome as a foreign visitor to the Irish capital where the team she represents will be playing against men representing the nation of Ireland from Ballycastle to Bantry Bay etc. Just so long as she doesn't get up herself, she'll be right.
Would love to be in Croker singing Amhrain na BhFiann along with Flower of Scotland, two of the best national anthems about. We sang Flower of Scotland at a Scot's friend's wedding in Japan. Very powerful stuff.
Its threads like this that remind me that some northern catholics are truly mad. No idea whether they've been driven to it or been brainwashed into it, but there's no doubt half of them are head cases.
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
What should we do, then? Shoot her?
Years ago the horsey-lookin Anne lassie used to do a bit of horse racing. One day she won a race somewhere. The next day somehow it came up in school and the teacher said " .. and Princess Anne won a race yesterday at Plumpton". One of the lads at the back responded, "who was the jockey?".
We took the soup, and now we have to stomach the complete sell out of our traditions and values.
Shame on all the people who thought that opening up Croke Park was a good idea. Shame, shame, shame on you all.
I bet Sir Sean Kelly will be wiggling his finger in her palm when they meet so that he can shag her in the VIP section........
Lads, look at it another way. You can say, despite all ye did to us, despite the state ye left us in, look at what we are able to do now. Ye couldn't kill us off.
Quote from: give her dixie on February 15, 2008, 03:50:48 PM
We took the soup, and now we have to stomach the complete sell out of our traditions and values.
Shame on all the people who thought that opening up Croke Park was a good idea. Shame, shame, shame on you all.
We (CLCG) are renting our Stadium to the D4RFU for the day. It's up to them who they invite.
If I rent my house to someone for a month I cant dictate who they invite in for tay.
If we dont like it let's just ignore the whole shitty lot of them and count the €uro and put it to good use. As far as I'm concerned they are all welcome to each other( as long as they pay the rent of course)
As for "Shame shame shame" grow up lad and live in the real world.What traditions and values are we selling out.?
"We" are not doing anything.
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 12:04:35 PM
never said where it came from . are you denying that dublin lined the streets for Victoria R when she paid a visit.
and seeing as you are so happy with the current situation will you be standing and belting out GSTQ Pre match in memory of the good old times . in your british liones jersy so beloved of the Irish players
Wasn't their a large British garrison in Dublin at that time?
I generally don't sing other countries anthem at matches ? And why would anyone be singing GSTQ at an Ireland V Scotland match ?
I don't own a British and
Irish lions jersey
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
Leave us Dubs out of your all encompassing tar brushing . Limerick is a Rugby heart land too , called them brits for a while.
Why cant people support to code , rosnarun consult a calender the 1940's are long over
This was the inevitable consequence once we opened Croke Park up. As someone who has had his fair share of run ins with the horsey's personal army I have to say that while I'd prefer if she didn't visit Croke Park I knew this day would come as a result of opening it up to other sports.
Is it hard to take yes, can we do anything about it no! Reality is the orgainsation made its choice and we have to live with that, it was the same for my own club when the PSNI got to play before the All Ireland U21 hurling semi final in Newry between the Dubs and Derry, as dictated by Ulster Council and Croke Park. It hurt like hell to see the b*stards out on the field but we have to try and move on at the end of the day, we all have our beliefs and traditions but let's not forget that we are a sporting organisation first and foremost and that has to be the guiding light in any decision that we make.
Personally I hope there are no protests outside the game as it would only reflect poorly on the GAA even though its a rugby game its being held in our ground. As for what Hogan would have thought who knows, you can't second guess the feelings of the dead.
QuoteAnd why would anyone be singing GSTQ at an Ireland V Scotland match
because it is the preferred anthem of a 1/4 of our egg chasing team players . also of subordianted scots the gaels of which have been driven to the highlands and the rest seem to think wearing an Kilt (whose tartan was granted to them by the englanders) makes them scottish all it does is confirm their redheaded joke jock status to the english.and most of its officials down south . ever go to a club house after a rugby fixture? all thats missing is the Vicar and cucumber sandwhices . it like the last days of the raj.
Ive nothing against rugby in fact i played it for years Its the culture of the game in Ireland that would make you sick. in fact I was in paris only last week cheering on les blues. funniest thing of the weekend was Ireland call most did even bother standing up
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 04:26:43 PM
subordianted scots the gaels of which have been driven to the highlands and the rest seem to think wearing an Kilt (whose tartan was granted to them by the englanders) makes them scottish
I think Rosnarun you'll find that the Gaels of Alba lived
in the Highlands and Islands and in the years following 1745 they were driven
FROM the Garbh Críocha by the Clan Chiefs who had been anglicised and wanted to rent the land to Lowlanders and English.
slightly off the thread here ;) but i don't suppose any of ye would have a ticket to spare
I'd burn the ****in thing if I had as I wouldnt wish to inflict that stupid game on anyone - not even a Mayoite :D
Quote from: Gnevin on February 15, 2008, 04:09:15 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
Leave us Dubs out of your all encompassing tar brushing . Limerick is a Rugby heart land too , called them brits for a while.
Why cant people support to code , rosnarun consult a calender the 1940's are long over
Not to mention those Soccer loving Gaels in Sligo, would make ya sick :D
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 04:26:43 PM
QuoteAnd why would anyone be singing GSTQ at an Ireland V Scotland match
because it is the preferred anthem of a 1/4 of our egg chasing team players . also of subordianted scots the gaels of which have been driven to the highlands and the rest seem to think wearing an Kilt (whose tartan was granted to them by the englanders) makes them scottish all it does is confirm their redheaded joke jock status to the english.and most of its officials down south . ever go to a club house after a rugby fixture? all thats missing is the Vicar and cucumber sandwhices . it like the last days of the raj.
Ive nothing against rugby in fact i played it for years Its the culture of the game in Ireland that would make you sick. in fact I was in paris only last week cheering on les blues. funniest thing of the weekend was Ireland call most did even bother standing up
What the f**k are you talking about
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
Do we only have smug middle class atheitsts in Dublin?
f**k sake rosnarun, we aint all like that.
Quote from: his holiness nb on February 15, 2008, 05:35:11 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
Do we only have smug middle class atheitsts in Dublin?
f**k sake rosnarun, we aint all like that.
Didn't i see your butler parking your Rolls outside the nell last week HHN?
;D ;D ;D ;D
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
I'm suprised at the outrage to be honest, if she is the president of the scottish rubgy association (or something like that) surely this was enevitable when Croke park opened up?
Quote from: Hound on February 15, 2008, 02:50:15 PM
Its threads like this that remind me that some northern catholics are truly mad. No idea whether they've been driven to it or been brainwashed into it, but there's no doubt half of them are head cases.
Maybe its the attitude and warped thought processes of ignorant, patronising twits like you, is the cause.
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
Irony is not lost on you Hardy
We took the money and we have to accept the consequences, it's as simple as that.
I do take eexception to Princess Annie being called the horse faced one however and I am sure that camilla would be very upset to hear that she has been replace in the horse faced category.
No point whinging now lads, the worst day has yet to come, shure owc havent played on the hollow turf of croker yet :P
We took the money and we have to accept the consequences, it's as simple as that
Very good post Stew - it's is indeed as simple as that !
Quote from: his holiness nb on February 15, 2008, 05:35:11 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM
unlike smug middle class Atheists (some how God has been brought into this) who know the price of everything and value of nothing and swing between jacks lads IRFU and the dubs depending on what way the wind is blowing .
you need to have values to try and defend them
Do we only have smug middle class atheitsts in Dublin?
f**k sake rosnarun, we aint all like that.
For once i agree with the Dubs,
No you most certainly aren't all like that...Anyone thats has ever been in the Blanch,Clondalkin,Finglas,Coolock,Darndale,Ballymun,Neilstown areas of Dublin would certainly not call all Dubs middle class... The very idea that all Dubs are middle class is hilarious :D
(Trust me Gnvein,His Holiness there is a compliment in there somewhere ;) )
Ok you took the "middle class" out of it, does that mean we are all still smug atheists?
I'm confused :o
Quote from: his holiness nb on February 15, 2008, 06:26:31 PM
Ok you took the "middle class" out of it, does that mean we are all still smug atheists?
I'm confused :o
God no most of ye are good practising Christians (http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m266/laoislad/afro.gif)
Gnevin is the only
smug atheist as far as i can see ;)
I don't know, now. If there's a competition for smugness, I wouldn't think of aetheists first. I think the people who believe that their god has all the answers, everybody else's god is wrong and those with no god will roast for eternity, have to be in the running.
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on February 15, 2008, 06:38:36 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on February 15, 2008, 06:26:31 PM
Ok you took the "middle class" out of it, does that mean we are all still smug atheists?
I'm confused :o
God no most of ye are good practising Christians (http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m266/laoislad/afro.gif)
Gnevin is the only smug atheist as far as i can see ;)
Are you sure you are the
real that's twice in one week you've agreed with me ;)
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
his holiness nb
maybe if you stopped using a self proclaimed divinity as your avatar some one might take your view on this seriously.
yes the gaa took the schilling but that doesnt mean we have to welcome the bastard offspring of a woman who thinks she pope because on of her ancestors want to get his end away with the kitchen maid.
what ever is done can be undone
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
yes the gaa took the schilling but that doesnt mean we have to welcome the bastard offspring of a woman who thinks she pope because on of her ancestors want to get his end away with the kitchen maid.
The current queen of the UK is not descended from Henry VIII. None of his three legitimate children had children so his line died with them.
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
Well said ros. I am not the best Christian and would be the first to admit it but I find that the some of the most arrogant people I meet are athiests, that said the religious have more than their fair share of arrogant twats as well, that stupid shower of hoors in America that are walking around with placards that state that 'God hates fags'. That got me very annoyed becuase the God I believe in loves us all, and by the way, who am I to say who is going to heaven and who is not?
I will leave that for God to sort out, I have enough to worry about. :-\
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
his holiness nb
maybe if you stopped using a self proclaimed divinity as your avatar some one might take your view on this seriously.
yes the gaa took the schilling but that doesnt mean we have to welcome the bastard offspring of a woman who thinks she pope because on of her ancestors want to get his end away with the kitchen maid.
what ever is done can be undone
Totally agree. And who brought this Catholic shit into it? I'm an athiest and proud of it. Pangurban is correct. We sold ourselves, but the people doing the selling weren't living in the six counties over the past 87 years, so they know f**k all ... anybody going to the match with princess anne remember that when some scottish player goes over in the corner, that's the corner young hogan died in from a bullet delivered by the so-called forces of law and order at the time ... and i would point out at this juncture that after the murdering parachute regiment, the scottish regiments were the most despised of all british regiments in the six counties
Catholic Northerners ? At least we have some religion and some morals to go along with it ! Short memories down there !
Not wanting to take this off-track, but religion and ('good') morals don't necessarily go hand in hand.
Anyway, back on topic; it's not really that big of a deal, is it? She's one spectator out of 80'odd thousand. Once again, we're showing off Croke Park to the outside world - the biggest stadium in the 6 nations competition and something that soccer or rugby haven't managed to achieve in this country. Surely we should view such occasions with a sense of pride(?)
Quote from: red hander on February 15, 2008, 08:12:15 PM
the people doing the selling weren't living in the six counties over the past 87 years, so they know f**k all ...
So only people from the Six Counties aged 87 or over can vote at Congress ???
God give me patience ::)
Surely we should view such occasions with a sense of pride(?)
Pride ? Proud that we are hosting people who tortured us for hunreds of years ? Don't think so !
Quote from: orangeman on February 15, 2008, 11:58:35 PM
Surely we should view such occasions with a sense of pride(?)
Pride ? Proud that we are hosting people who tortured us for hunreds of years ? Don't think so !
She's really not that old!
But yes, pride for where we've come to, what we've achieved, often in the face of adversity.
Croke Park was built for playing GAA, not to show it off as a the biggest stadium in the 6 Nations.
Be proud of it my ass.
If we were told a few years ago before the vote to open it up that we would be hosting members of the Royal family, how many people would of voted differently?
We were sold a big white lie, and en mass, the sheep followed.
At least the members from the 6 northern counties, and Cork and Monaghan can stand tall and say we didn't want it open to other sport, and certainly not for members of the Royal family to come and sit in the stands.
It stank from the start, and it still stinks. Sean Kelly sold you yes people a pup, and now it is a rotweiller........................
As I have said earlier, they took the soup and there is feck all we can do about it.
Quote from: give her dixie on February 16, 2008, 03:08:00 AM
Croke Park was built for playing GAA, not to show it off as a the biggest stadium in the 6 Nations.
Be proud of it my ass.
If we were told a few years ago before the vote to open it up that we would be hosting members of the Royal family, how many people would of voted differently?We were sold a big white lie, and en mass, the sheep followed.
At least the members from the 6 northern counties, and Cork and Monaghan can stand tall and say we didn't want it open to other sport, and certainly not for members of the Royal family to come and sit in the stands.
It stank from the start, and it still stinks. Sean Kelly sold you yes people a pup, and now it is a rotweiller........................
As I have said earlier, they took the soup and there is feck all we can do about it.
Absolutley no one would have voted differently - those that voted in favour of opening up Croke Park couldn't give a toss if the Queen herself wants to come over and throw the sliotar at the next All Ireland hurling final.
Trying to suggest otherwise, is not only incredibly stupid but also displays a complete inability to understand the issues in the first place
Quote from: orangeman on February 15, 2008, 11:13:16 PM
Catholic Northerners ? At least we have some religion and some morals to go along with it ! Short memories down there !
Yes, because morality doesn't exist without religion... ::)
Quote from: give her dixie on February 16, 2008, 03:08:00 AM
Croke Park was built for playing GAA, not to show it off as a the biggest stadium in the 6 Nations.
Be proud of it my ass.
If we were told a few years ago before the vote to open it up that we would be hosting members of the Royal family, how many people would of voted differently?
We were sold a big white lie, and en mass, the sheep followed.
At least the members from the 6 northern counties, and Cork and Monaghan can stand tall and say we didn't want it open to other sport, and certainly not for members of the Royal family to come and sit in the stands.
It stank from the start, and it still stinks. Sean Kelly sold you yes people a pup, and now it is a rotweiller........................
As I have said earlier, they took the soup and there is feck all we can do about it.
I was in favour of opening the stadium. I still am, and visiting royals doesn't change that one iota. I'm standing nice and tall also.
And if Princess Anne visiting Croke Park is the worst thing that happens to you that week, you should be very thankful.
Quote from: red hander on February 15, 2008, 08:12:15 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
his holiness nb
maybe if you stopped using a self proclaimed divinity as your avatar some one might take your view on this seriously.
yes the gaa took the schilling but that doesnt mean we have to welcome the bastard offspring of a woman who thinks she pope because on of her ancestors want to get his end away with the kitchen maid.
what ever is done can be undone
Totally agree. And who brought this Catholic shit into it? I'm an athiest and proud of it. Pangurban is correct. We sold ourselves, but the people doing the selling weren't living in the six counties over the past 87 years, so they know f**k all ... anybody going to the match with princess anne remember that when some scottish player goes over in the corner, that's the corner young hogan died in from a bullet delivered by the so-called forces of law and order at the time ... and i would point out at this juncture that after the murdering parachute regiment, the scottish regiments were the most despised of all british regiments in the six counties
So what are you saying?
That GAA policy should be formulated within limits laid down by northern nationalists? That none of the rest of us who have a different perspective can, by definition, have a worthwhile opinion on these matters?
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
yes the gaa took the schilling but that doesnt mean we have to welcome the bastard offspring of a woman who thinks she pope because on of her ancestors want to get his end away with the kitchen maid.
A religious objection to her attendance. I wasn't expecting that! ;D
To say that you couldn't care less if the Queen herself was in Croke Park Stephenite, is just a perfect example of how people have sold out our basic principles.
No doubt if you were around during the famine, you would probably have been on the streets of Dublin waving your union jack like the rest of them when Victoria visited?
You could have helped to count the £5 donation she made to the famine relief.
The association is in good hands with people like yourself who want to see the royal family spit on the graves of the founders of the GAA.
Next you will probably want Irelands Call played at GAA matches.
I can't wait until the day after this happens and we all realise nothing has changed and nobody give a fcuk anyway. I don't agree with it and I didn't agree with allowing other sports into Croker but I know I am in a minority and will be swept along with it and after the event we will be talking about something else.
Getting all worked up about nothing is not how I want to spend my life. The occupation is worth getting worked up about but not these minor side affects of it as they are only diversions from the real issue. If we consentrate on this sort of crap we won't have time to make the political change and leave ourselves wide open for criticism and lose support.
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
This post should be framed. It wins prizes in more categories than I've ever seen a post capture in all my time here - the funniest, the stupidest, the most irrational, the most presumptuous, the smuggest, the most ungrammatical, the figure-out-the-point-he's-trying-to-make cup, the special merit award for irrelevance to the subject and the grand prix for foaming-at-the-mouth rant of the year to date.
Quote from: Hardy on February 16, 2008, 12:58:19 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
Quote from: Hardy on February 15, 2008, 05:42:58 PM
I see we've "moved on" then. New century, new opportunity grasped to look forward and anticipate a bright future in glowing contrast to the dark past we've struggled through. It's heart-warming, really, to see our little community here on this board in the vanguard as we stride confidently into the future, contemptuous of the suggestion that the mere appearance of a little old woman could deflect our firm gaze from the shining horizon ahead.
this is more like the smug reply i was expecting.
yes we know your all right jack glad things worked out for you. your remarks about religion show you have not understanding of Christianity at all . being a catholic is about summitting you will to a higherpower and having the humility to know you are not perfect but a common sinner. not the philosiphy of the smug . sure many of us are bad christians but thats part of the plan.
This post should be framed. It wins prizes in more categories than I've ever seen a post capture in all my time here - the funniest, the stupidest, the most irrational, the most presumptuous, the smuggest, the most ungrammatical, the figure-out-the-point-he's-trying-to-make cup, the special merit award for irrelevance to the subject and the grand prix for foaming-at-the-mouth rant of the year to date.
Dammit! I'm the current holder of 2 of those >:(
Quotethe funniest, the stupidest, the most irrational, the most presumptuous, the smuggest, the most ungrammatical, the figure-out-the-point-he's-trying-to-make cup, the special merit award for irrelevance to the subject and the grand prix for foaming-at-the-mouth rant of the year to date.
f**k that would be a great thread!
I probably shouldnt start one though :(
Quote from: give her dixie on February 16, 2008, 10:02:00 AM
To say that you couldn't care less if the Queen herself was in Croke Park Stephenite, is just a perfect example of how people have sold out our basic principles.
No doubt if you were around during the famine, you would probably have been on the streets of Dublin waving your union jack like the rest of them when Victoria visited?
You could have helped to count the £5 donation she made to the famine relief.
The association is in good hands with people like yourself who want to see the royal family spit on the graves of the founders of the GAA.
Next you will probably want Irelands Call played at GAA matches.
Surely the above load of sh1te must be this month's prizewinner.
The bit about the Windsor's spitting on the graves of the founders of the GAA ... ::)
We took the thirty pieces of silver lads, we hung ourselves and now we have to accept the consequences, get over it, forget the historical significance of royals sitting in Croker and move on. We did this to ourselves and we cannot have it both ways, we chose financial gain over historical principle, it is a done deal and we have to move on and not concern ourselves with this anymore. Nothing was worse than listening to GSTQ in Croker but we got through that so for me I am going to watch the game and enjoy the fact that every time the rugby boys or sawker lads play in Croke Park we get to reap the benefits financially, that is after all, why we opened the gates to these other sports in the first place right?????
Quote from: stew on February 16, 2008, 03:19:34 PM
enjoy the fact that every time the rugby boys or sawker lads play in Croke Park we get to reap the benefits financially, that is after all, why we opened the gates to these other sports in the first place right?????
Yes
Quote from: deiseach on February 16, 2008, 03:49:54 PM
Quote from: stew on February 16, 2008, 03:19:34 PM
enjoy the fact that every time the rugby boys or sawker lads play in Croke Park we get to reap the benefits financially, that is after all, why we opened the gates to these other sports in the first place right?????
Yes
So why do we have people crying about Anie sitting in a luxury box then? the decision was made and we have to accept it, all the complaining in the wolrd wont change the facts that GSTQ was played in Croke Park, the english rugby team got destroyed by Ireland in croke park and the royals of england are going to be coming to cheer on our opponents, move on lads, we all knew it would come to this if we accepted the money so move on and quit moaning about it. I am going to ignore the fact that she is there, it serves no purpose to ponder it because she has every right to be there.
I think people who opposed the opening of Croke Park - most of them for perfectly good reasons - are saying "look what you have wrought, look what has come to pass!" to those who were in favour of it. Personally I'd say most people were aware of the possibility that the patron of the SRU would turn up should Ireland be playing Scotland and didn't consider it to be sufficiently worrying to change the way they'd vote
Quote from: rosnarun on February 15, 2008, 07:59:31 PM
his holiness nb
maybe if you stopped using a self proclaimed divinity as your avatar some one might take your view on this seriously.
Crikey!
;D ;D ;D
Quote from: stew on February 16, 2008, 03:19:34 PM
Nothing was worse than listening to GSTQ in Croker but we got through that ........
You've obviously managed to avoid any hardship in your life if that was the worst you've had to deal with!
Quote from: give her dixie on February 16, 2008, 10:02:00 AM
To say that you couldn't care less if the Queen herself was in Croke Park Stephenite, is just a perfect example of how people have sold out our basic principles.
No doubt if you were around during the famine, you would probably have been on the streets of Dublin waving your union jack like the rest of them when Victoria visited?
You could have helped to count the £5 donation she made to the famine relief.
The association is in good hands with people like yourself who want to see the royal family spit on the graves of the founders of the GAA.
Next you will probably want Irelands Call played at GAA matches.
Now you're just embarrassing yourself - I'm just delighted that people like yourself are a minority in our association, and always will be.
Quote from: deiseach on February 16, 2008, 04:07:19 PM
I think people who opposed the opening of Croke Park - most of them for perfectly good reasons - are saying "look what you have wrought, look what has come to pass!" to those who were in favour of it. Personally I'd say most people were aware of the possibility that the patron of the SRU would turn up should Ireland be playing Scotland and didn't consider it to be sufficiently worrying to change the way they'd vote
exactly. anyone with the capability of joined up thinking could have figured out that she was odds on to be there, as she was every second year in LR and will be again when its built.
Who cares. Its absolutely none of the GAAs business who attends rugby matches.
That horse bolted a long time ago. The time to be principled about this is long gone. Will the match programme be in German?
QuoteWe took the soup, and now we have to stomach the complete sell out of our traditions and values.
I'd love to understand which of 'our traditions and values' are being 'sold out' now - begrudgery? selfishness? f*ck-the-rules-ology? bar-stool-know-it-all-ism?
And does 'the soup' include irish stew? - I'd happily ate it every day of the winter.
Have to agree, I was against Croke park opening, but I accepted the democratic decision.
This decision included foreign games, which we knew could (and would with regards to rugby) include British teams. It was at this stage we accepted that any member of the royal family, as the monachy of britain, could very well be attending these games. The GAA can do nothing to stop them attending. Its not their decision who attends these games.
I'm not saying anyone giving out is wrong, I'm no fan of the royal family, I am however shocked at how shocked people seem about this.
Id personally love to see the royals kicked up and down the field in Croke Park. Please Graham give it one more year!!
As a matter of interest, prior to the opening up of Croke Park under what rule would a member of the House of Windsor been barred from attending an AIF or any other GAA game?
Now you're talking zoyler, or what tradition either. ::)
I'm sending my two Premium tickets to Mr. Al Fayed.
Quote from: his holiness nb on February 18, 2008, 05:59:06 PM
This decision included foreign games, which we knew could (and would with regards to rugby) include British teams.
Not that we need to be reminded that there were 'foreign' sports in Croke Park well before soccer and rugby were given the green light!
If you were Anne, would you worry about a sniper? Would you scan the place out? A sure maybe here handlers would take the bullet for her (or some other big guy who always gets free tickets into the VIP area, lol).
Still, it will be nice to see the rugger buggers who were upset at the absence of GSTQ in Ravenhill. All the ones I know couldnt care less.
Great craic in the Belfast Telegraph though. Lord Laird is laying it on hot and heavy about being insulted when Ireland played at Ravenhill. The problem is though, the good Lord is an Ulster Scot and admitted a few years ago that he supports Scotland and he would never support Ireland. Classic!
Quote from: Bud Wiser on February 18, 2008, 10:05:12 PM
I'm sending my two Premium tickets to Mr. Al Fayed.
;D Class Bud
Quote from: Maguire01 on February 16, 2008, 10:40:26 PM
Quote from: stew on February 16, 2008, 03:19:34 PM
Nothing was worse than listening to GSTQ in Croker but we got through that ........
You've obviously managed to avoid any hardship in your life if that was the worst you've had to deal with!
Eh I meant that for the first time GSTQ was played in croker, it was very hard to take because I am an Irishman and I love gaelic games, Irish culture and it was a shock to the system when GSTQ was played. I was against opening up Croke Park but once we did I accepted the decision and knew that financially we would be far better off but the price to pay was a steep one.
My comments had nothing to do with my life, and my comments on GSTQ were made froma sporting perespective. I enjoyed tyrones win over Armagh more than I did GSTQ being played in our national stadium. :'(
I for one find yer woman to be a totally obnoxious cow! She runs about claiming to be a 'Scot' when she is about as Scottish as the Duke of Edinburgh's arse! All this bollocks singing 'Flower of Scotland' - to send the English royals back hame tae think again really gets my goat. I am not an extremist but I would hang her by the guts from the rafters of the Hogan Stand, cut her down and trail her eight times around the running track around the pitch and then give what's left of her to the butchers in Dublin so as they could make a black pudding out of her and serve it up to the Scottish Kilt-Wearing lowland snobs that will be over for the game. Otherwise, I have no issues.
QuoteI am not an extremist but I would hang her by the guts from the rafters of the Hogan Stand, cut her down and trail her eight times around the running track around the pitch and then give what's left of her to the butchers in Dublin so as they could make a black pudding out of her and serve it up to the Scottish Kilt-Wearing lowland snobs that will be over for the game.
Jaysus. If you were an extremist you'd give her a right doing :D
Quote from: stew on February 19, 2008, 03:10:38 PM
My comments had nothing to do with my life, and my comments on GSTQ were made froma sporting perespective. I enjoyed tyrones win over Armagh more than I did GSTQ being played in our national stadium. :'(
I thought the entire no camp hinged their arguement on the fact that CP is not in fact a national stadium, but private GAA property?
Quote from: dublinfella on February 19, 2008, 05:50:46 PM
Quote from: stew on February 19, 2008, 03:10:38 PM
My comments had nothing to do with my life, and my comments on GSTQ were made froma sporting perespective. I enjoyed tyrones win over Armagh more than I did GSTQ being played in our national stadium. :'(
I thought the entire no camp hinged their arguement on the fact that CP is not in fact a national stadium, but private GAA property?
OK hands up who the f**k mentioned Shamrock Rovers in this thread !! ;)
The GAA is the national sporting organisation, so of course its stadium is the national stadium.
Its amazing the people on this thread who get all worked up about Anne Windsor (or more properly Anne Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg) and where she goes. If you believe that royalty is bollix, as I do, then you wouldn't be so worried what rugby games they went to. The GAA rented the ground, by agreement within the GAA, who goes there is of no further interest.
Armaghniac, I’m not too sure about the National Stadium part but I sure back you on the second point.
When the first soccer match was played in Croker the Hill 16 end ws advertised as the North Terrace!
That was a bit over the hill to most GAA people I suppose, but the FAI were footing the bill for the occasion.
The IRFU have invited Ann What’s-Her Name along as their guest and it’s up to them to treat her as they will – they’re paying for the privilege and it’s their business.
;D
Quote from: armaghniac on February 19, 2008, 07:41:47 PM
The GAA is the national sporting organisation, so of course its stadium is the national stadium.
Its amazing the people on this thread who get all worked up about Anne Windsor (or more properly Anne Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg) and where she goes. If you believe that royalty is bollix, as I do, then you wouldn't be so worried what rugby games they went to. The GAA rented the ground, by agreement within the GAA, who goes there is of no further interest.
Well said on all fronts.
I would have thought that Croker being our National Stadium was self explanatory, apparently not! :-\
I presumed the "our" in "our national stadium" was referring to us in the GAA. So its the GAA's national stadium.
Ok there was an agreement reached by congress on rule 42 to open Croke park to other sports and the no camp disagreed with the decision, for some of the reasons that are happening now. I too was in the No camp and still am. What some of you guys are failing to realize is simply this, The decision was made but it still doesn't change the opinions that you had prior to the decision. So just because Congress passed this motion doesn't mean all arguments must stop. There are still issues here to be debated. No one should be put down for debating these issues after all our organisation is selectively democratic ie based mainly on majority of the 32 rather than the provinces. I accept the argument of the yes camp but i always come to the same conclusion about it . That it is solely based on money. My own opinion in life would be that money isn't everthing, I would put issues like family and culture before money and would be quiet happy as long as i had enough to live. I take offence to the guy who called the northerners "head cases". I am from the north and i see my fellow southern members as exactly the same as myself, An ordinary GAA member. But i read some southern posters and they have a blatant disregard for the current political scenario in the North. The troubles are still very fresh in our minds. If i were to ask you fella's whether you would have accepted the removal of rule 42 in 1928 what would have been your answer?? There is stil a struggle up north and the southern posters must recognize this stigma. We still live in a society were buildings still fly the Union Jack forcebly over our people. Discrimination in jobs still goes on and much much more. Certain areas are out of bounds based on religious tensions. This is why we are the way we are because what we have is very sacred. The south has progressed and become a more multi cultural society free of the antics that still occur in the north so the issues presented by the no camp wouldn't be as devisive when you are coming from that background. Regarding the Royal visit, we can rant and rave about this but it will be insignificant as it is part of the process that "was" accepted. My own opinion would be that it would be an insult to the men who gave up their lives for our culture and the GAA but i also recognise anyones freedom to attend a GAA event and long may this continue. My opinion of opening croke park wil never change because i simply cannot accept a team that is based on partition (Irelands soccer team) or a team that claims to be 32 countie but doesn't play the National anthem at a world cup. Instead it plays Irelands call at the request of the Northern delegates who quiet clearly held the rest ransom. I ask you guys was this not embarassing??? When i examine all these issues and weigh them up against money i really cannot understand the yes camp but i am willing to listen to their views.
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 20, 2008, 11:49:58 AM
Ok there was an agreement reached by congress on rule 42 to open Croke park to other sports and the no camp disagreed with the decision, for some of the reasons that are happening now. I too was in the No camp and still am. What some of you guys are failing to realize is simply this, The decision was made but it still doesn't change the opinions that you had prior to the decision. So just because Congress passed this motion doesn't mean all arguments must stop. There are still issues here to be debated. No one should be put down for debating these issues after all our organisation is selectively democratic ie based mainly on majority of the 32 rather than the provinces. I accept the argument of the yes camp but i always come to the same conclusion about it . That it is solely based on money. My own opinion in life would be that money isn't everthing, I would put issues like family and culture before money and would be quiet happy as long as i had enough to live. I take offence to the guy who called the northerners "head cases". I am from the north and i see my fellow southern members as exactly the same as myself, An ordinary GAA member. But i read some southern posters and they have a blatant disregard for the current political scenario in the North. The troubles are still very fresh in our minds. If i were to ask you fella's whether you would have accepted the removal of rule 42 in 1928 what would have been your answer?? There is stil a struggle up north and the southern posters must recognize this stigma. We still live in a society were buildings still fly the Union Jack forcebly over our people. Discrimination in jobs still goes on and much much more. Certain areas are out of bounds based on religious tensions. This is why we are the way we are because what we have is very sacred. The south has progressed and become a more multi cultural society free of the antics that still occur in the north so the issues presented by the no camp wouldn't be as devisive when you are coming from that background. Regarding the Royal visit, we can rant and rave about this but it will be insignificant as it is part of the process that "was" accepted. My own opinion would be that it would be an insult to the men who gave up their lives for our culture and the GAA but i also recognise anyones freedom to attend a GAA event and long may this continue. My opinion of opening croke park wil never change because i simply cannot accept a team that is based on partition (Irelands soccer team) or a team that claims to be 32 countie but doesn't play the National anthem at a world cup. Instead it plays Irelands call at the request of the Northern delegates who quiet clearly held the rest ransom. I ask you guys was this not embarassing??? When i examine all these issues and weigh them up against money i really cannot understand the yes camp but i am willing to listen to their views.
From the Bob Marley link I assume you are on the wacky backy that is taking you back to 1928 and beyond. I am a northern nationalist and active GAA member. A lot of this Ulster says "no" speak is the preserve of those who will never quite get around to living i the present and moving forward. I too dont like the Union Jack - neither do I like to see the Irish flag dragged into the gutter at every street corner in certain towns and villages , wrongly flown, left to wither in the wind, placed to deliberately provoke etc. I can see the mote in our own eye.
I am proud to see rugby people who would have had no interest in GAA coming face up to our games and culture in this amazing stadium. What a great advertisement and vindication of our games and culture. It the patron of Scotish rugby sees fit to visit for that sporting event she should be accorded the same courtesy as any other.
Many of the grumblers woold I am sure see no problem with a war-monger like George Bush if he attended a different foreign game that has already been played at Croker before, namely the rugby derivative of american footie.
Let's face it. none of us like the "antics" we see in the north. Some of us are mature enough to know that very many of these antics come from our own communities.
Grow up and get a grip - and live with pride and not with prejudice.
The IRFU fully respected the sensitivities of unionists (who are in a minority in the 9 counties of Ulster) by dropping our National Anthem when Ireland played Italy in Belfast last year. Would it be too much to ask on this occasion at least, that the sensitvities of a far greater number of Irish gaels be respected and that Anne Windsor is tacitly asked not to appear at Croke Park?
Tony, I see a new member called "Fearon".
Is it you again or do you have an impersonator?
Tis me.
Quote from: T Fearon on February 20, 2008, 12:52:29 PM
Tis me.
Why have two accounts at the same time with the same name (more or less) ?
Brand protection?
I am proud to see rugby people who would have had no interest in GAA coming face up to our games and culture in this amazing stadium. What a great advertisement and vindication of our games and culture. It the patron of Scotish rugby sees fit to visit for that sporting event she should be accorded the same courtesy as any other.
For starters i said that the patron of Scottish rugby has an entitilement to be there as does any paying member and long may this continue. Secondly Rugby is a porfessional sport That our Amature organistion competes with so why allow them access to our most prized possession (money). Thirdly what you fail to realize is that allowing other sports into Croke park is not advertising Gaelic it is advertising the other sport at the expense of gaelic :D :D How obvious and silly is this from a marketing perspective. It is the equivalent of Mc Donalds selling burger Kings burgers ???
Grow up and get a grip - and live with pride and not with prejudice
You say this but i ask you what pride do you take in this??? I certainly take non what so ever. My pride lies in my culture and my background, In Gaelic terms my club and my county. Playing for my club on sundays and going home to talk over the game with your father . I have no other allegiances. Whilst i am quiet happy to participate in and watch a lot of other sports i never can be guilty of damaging my own to promote others. I don't live with Prejudice but whether you acknowledge it or not it does exist within the Northern Community in particular and this creates a whole new ball game (pardon the pun) Our political environment has an effect on everything in society, including the GAA. Nothing escapes the grasp of politics. You may choose to hide away from it and claim no allegiance but deep down you have to be something. your very existance is shaped by your environment.
Protest planned according to to-day's Irish News by a Republican Group known as Eirigi. They rightly claim that this visit "is part of a broader British policy of normalisation in Ireland....to soften up the population of Dublin and the 26 counties for a future state visit of her mother, Elizabeth Windsor" If the populace of the 26 counties in general were any softer they would be marshmallow like.
In any case I'm glad someone cares enough to register a protest. Could well be another Love Ulster scenario, and help slap it up Ahern and his cronies like Harris if all hell does break lose >:(
No doubt they'll all be wearing Celtic jerseys. ;D
For a similar dramatic irony effect as last year, surely the protestors should all be wearing crowns and holding their corgis on leads etc ???
;D and arranging the deaths of their daughters in law as well ;D
Just got sorted for a ticket!! If I come across her I'll tell her you were all asking for her!!
QuoteIf I come across her
They dignitaries beside her will hardly let you go that far :o
would love to hear 80,000 singing flower of scotland, i love that song. but ill miss cos im playing gaelic at 4pm, ah well
I was if it's Princess Anne that this new movie's about. Prehaps Croke Park will show a special screening of it on the big screen before the game. ;)
20 minutes till worlds end \0/
Quote from: Gnevin on February 23, 2008, 04:42:06 PM
20 minutes till worlds end \0/
Today? I thought it was tomorrow.
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 20, 2008, 11:49:58 AM
Discrimination in jobs still goes on and much much more. Certain areas are out of bounds based on religious tensions.
Your first point is very simply untrue. It's 2008, not 1978. As for certain areas being our of bounds, that's the same on both sides. Furthemore, with regard to such places, you'd need your head checked if you did actually want to visit them! I don't see how this point has anything to do with your argument either.
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 20, 2008, 11:49:58 AM
My opinion of opening croke park wil never change because i simply cannot accept a team that is based on partition (Irelands soccer team) or a team that claims to be 32 countie but doesn't play the National anthem at a world cup. Instead it plays Irelands call at the request of the Northern delegates who quiet clearly held the rest ransom. I ask you guys was this not embarassing???
Northern delegates hold the IRFU to ransom? Are you having a laugh? If the IRFU wanted, they could push on ahead and do whatever they wanted, with or without the agreement of the Northern delegates. It is the decision of the IRFU to be inclusive,a nd whilst Ireland's Call may not be the best tune in the world, there's sound reasoning behind it, whether you agree with this reasoning or not. Whatever you think, there's no one being 'held to ransom'! And sorry, but what's meant to be embarassing?
Quote from: T Fearon on February 21, 2008, 04:03:28 PM
Protest planned according to to-day's Irish News by a Republican Group known as Eirigi. They rightly claim that this visit "is part of a broader British policy of normalisation in Ireland....to soften up the population of Dublin and the 26 counties for a future state visit of her mother, Elizabeth Windsor" If the populace of the 26 counties in general were any softer they would be marshmallow like.
In any case I'm glad someone cares enough to register a protest. Could well be another Love Ulster scenario, and help slap it up Ahern and his cronies like Harris if all hell does break lose >:(
I'm sure all ten of them will have a great time protesting! Obviously not significant enough to make any news reports.
How many does it take to start a row ?
Eddie Poots standing for the Anthem!
Quote from: Maguire01 on February 23, 2008, 05:06:39 PM
Eddie Poots standing for the Anthem!
He did say at the time of the Down game that he would have no problem standing for the National Anthem if it was an International game.
What a laugh !!
Quote from: orangeman on February 23, 2008, 05:05:09 PM
How many does it take to start a row ?
Who would any protesters (if there are any) want to fight? I doubt Anne would be up for a scrap and the Scottish Rugby crowd can hardly be he opposition.
;D
Quote from: hardstation on February 23, 2008, 05:11:28 PM
Fecking kick off is 10 minutes late.
Worse than Irish dancing feis's.
Were they not just waiting on the Dubs to arrive?
Quote from: Maguire01 on February 23, 2008, 05:21:52 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 23, 2008, 05:11:28 PM
Fecking kick off is 10 minutes late.
Worse than Irish dancing feis's.
Were they not just waiting on the Dubs to arrive?
;D
Fecking cheeky culchie
A schemozzle ? I didn't know how to spell that unitl now ! ;D
Didn't see her but understand she was there. Place did not fall down and was still there yesterday when I passed on my way home.
WhatsWhat are they all going to get all het up about next?
Quote from: zoyler on February 25, 2008, 10:24:13 AM
Didn't see her but understand she was there. Place did not fall down and was still there yesterday when I passed on my way home.
WhatsWhat are they all going to get all het up about next?
I'd say there'll be a bit of a rumpus when that scheduled Concert takes place in honour of the Queen when she visits. Croke Park is the venue for that.
Aye fcukin right. If that was true (unlikely) and Im sure there'd be many of our southern friends wetting themselves that this should happen, and having seen the number of political events and stunts that the IRFU etc have now let Croker out for, would they be prepared to withdraw their atacks on the GAA in the North for also allowing their facilites to be used for outside events that may just have poltical overtones. Before you start I would like you all to be consistent with your views say previously held re; Casement Park for example!
Quote from: feetofflames on February 25, 2008, 10:55:56 AM
Aye fcukin right. If that was true (unlikely) and Im sure there'd be many of our southern friends wetting themselves that this should happen, and having seen the number of political events and stunts that the IRFU etc have now let Croker out for, would they be prepared to withdraw their atacks on the GAA in the North for also allowing their facilites to be used for outside events that may just have poltical overtones. Before you start I would like you all to be consistent with your views say previously held re; Casement Park for example!
What ? Stunts, she is the head of the SRU and so is invited by default .
their attacks on the GAA . Are you referring to the IRFU here?
The Casement park thing was against the GAA on rules ffs , not that matters for much it seems
[/quote]
He did say at the time of the Down game that he would have no problem standing for the National Anthem if it was an International game.
[/quote]
Yeah bus wasn't the game Down v's Donegal - would this not be an international to the DUP?
Your first point is very simply untrue. It's 2008, not 1978. As for certain areas being our of bounds, that's the same on both sides. Furthemore, with regard to such places, you'd need your head checked if you did actually want to visit them! I don't see how this point has anything to do with your argument either.
Maguire. That point has lot to do with my argument. It is very simple, a lot of guys are criticising Northern folk for being stuck in a time warp and dwelling on the past when it comes to these issues. What they seem to forget is the fact that the troubles are still in many ways going on in the North. There still exists dissidents groups and there are certain areas that one cannot go into simply because of your religion. You say it is 2008, obviously you are trying to be ironic. I can understand why you are like this because you are probably looking at it from a southern perspective. It would be great if the North was like the south, where all you had to worry about would be how to attract the next tourist, to make the quick buck and to add to the celtic tiger . Circumstances are different in the north. If you cannot realize this then i rest my case. Now the reason i am saying this is too try and make you understand how an issue like the representative of the British Royal family ( Whose armies still occupy the 6 counties where i live) visting Croke park would be harder to accept for a northern Delegate that one from the south, simply because of the political environment. I cannot make this point any clearer. I can also tell you my friend that people are still being discriminated against in jobs because i know of individuals that have been on the other ends of the wrong doing. A good example would be the police recruitment. It now has to be 50% protestant intake and 50% all others. Is this fair employment?? or is this racially discrimantory towards certain groups????. I wonder do the Gardai share the same policy :D :D. Catch a grip and acknowledge the difference and quit trying to put folk down for their beliefs.
I will grant you one point some of the ones protesting are complete idiots just against change and bigoted and these poeple are usually the dregs of our society. It is these people that are living in these areas that cannot be entered and drawing the money that the government foolishly provides for them. But you seem to be labelling good folk, with genuine concerns alongside these people. These people are not against change but it is like everything else it will take time. Oh and my final point, You said it happens on both sides. In no statement did i say that it didn't you just surmised this because you have a mindset about Northern people. I know both sides of the community are affected by this but this particular incident ie the visit, really only is devicive to one.
Any comment I make is from MY Northern perspective. Some of have moved on - some of us are trying to move on - some of us have no intention of moving on!
What do you mean by - moved on?
I mean we have realised that times and conditions and circumstances and realities have changed/altered and accordingly atitudes and responses (certainly mine) have changed.
I will be out of contact for a few days so look forward to reaing your response
Quote from: zoyler on February 26, 2008, 08:24:26 AM
I mean we have realised that times and conditions and circumstances and realities have changed/altered and accordingly atitudes and responses (certainly mine) have changed.
I will be out of contact for a few days so look forward to reaing your response
So what you really mean is
some people (certainly you) and
some circumstances have changed. How does this qualify as moving on? Perhaps there are still some in the transition period? I know there are many people who's daily life where more affected than others by the situation in Ireland and it's reasonable to assume many still are.
Quotewhere all you had to worry about would be how to attract the next tourist, to make the quick buck and to add to the celtic tiger
Winsamsoon, if you want to throw stones, stay out of the glasshouses!
I didn't know i was in a glass house but i will bare that in mind. Perhaps you should try to have an opinion in a sensible debate Billy Boots instead of sitting and writing little snide comments. Sure we could all do that and sit like the bully in the corner making no sense bar the odd slag at the people who are participating. The phrase i used was merely to illustrate that circumstances in the North of Ireland are different. Ways of life are different, zapatista is 100% correct when he claims that some people are still in transition and i would be right in saying almost all of these people would be from the north. This boils down to the current environment that still exists in the 6 counties.
I don't disagree with anything you said winsamsoon, it's just your complaints about people having stereotyped 'pops' at northerners don't carry much weight if you yourself decide to start talking about couldn't-give-a-shit Celtic Tiger stereotypes (which are just as off-target). Is that clear (and 'un-snide') enough for you?
The fact that i have stereotyped the southern Economy takes away nothing from the fact that some posters still believe the north is the same as the south.
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 27, 2008, 02:13:46 PM
The fact that i have stereotyped the southern Economy takes away nothing from the fact that some posters still believe the north is the same as the south.
Been reading Dennis Feany in the Irish News today?
QuoteThe fact that i have stereotyped the southern Economy takes away nothing from the fact that some posters still believe the north is the same as the south.
I'll say it again. I don't disagree, but that was not the point I was making.
Quotereason i am saying this is too try and make you understand how an issue like the representative of the British Royal family ( Whose armies still occupy the 6 counties where i live) visting Croke park would be harder to
I recall seeing something where they had pulled out ? whats the story with that ?
(genuine question..so don't get all bent out of shape)
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on February 28, 2008, 01:03:53 AM
Quotereason i am saying this is too try and make you understand how an issue like the representative of the British Royal family ( Whose armies still occupy the 6 counties where i live) visting Croke park would be harder to
I recall seeing something where they had pulled out ? whats the story with that ?
(genuine question..so don't get all bent out of shape)
'Security' troops where pulled out. They still have camps and troops there albiet not as many.
Quote from: Zapatista on February 28, 2008, 07:42:40 AM
'Security' troops where pulled out. They still have camps and troops there albiet not as many.
I actually miss the noise of low flying/hovering helicopters when I stay up there these days.
Yeah the troops have been pulled out but there still remains some forces and some barracks not to mention the forces that carry no arms ie British government but that is another debate. Boots could you clarify you point foe me then because i am finding it hard to pick it up.
Okay.
My point is you can't expect to be taken seriously is you're complaining about lazy stereotypes being applied to Northerners, while in the next breath you are applying lazy stereotypes to Mexicans.
So you have no opinion on the actual topic just trying to pick at the type of phrase i use. Please just have an opinion and you can stereotype if you wish and i won't hold it against you. I would even take you seriously. Ps i never mentioned mexican as i think this is the worst i have ever heard in reference to freestaters.
I like 'Mexicans'. It reminds me of the old westerns, 'South of the Border, down Mexico way'.
It's better than freestaters in my opinion. We are a republic now. It's also better than beggars or tarmaccers.
Hey Senior I give you 15 Dollar for your daughter :D :D
Who are you calling Senior?
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 28, 2008, 03:29:38 PM
I like 'Mexicans'. It reminds me of the old westerns, 'South of the Border, down Mexico way'.
It's better than freestaters in my opinion. We are a republic now. It's also better than beggars or tarmaccers.
And that reminds me of Tony slagging Junior for Muff diving, brilliant episode...
QuoteSo you have no opinion on the actual topic just trying to pick at the type of phrase i use. Please just have an opinion and you can stereotype if you wish and i won't hold it against you. I would even take you seriously. Ps i never mentioned mexican as i think this is the worst i have ever heard in reference to freestaters.
I've already stated my opinion three times, I'm not going to do it again. It's not difficult to read before over-reacting.
I would have considered 'Mexican' to be (almost) affectionate, unlike 'freestater' which most certainly is not.
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 28, 2008, 04:10:50 PM
Who are you calling Senior?
El sir apesadumbrado para causar cualquier ofensa pero es su hija para la venta ;) :D.
Only messin AZ. Chill out man 8)
Honestly billy your a geg a minute . Taking offence to everything and having opinions on nothing. What a guy. I'll leave you to it.
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 28, 2008, 03:29:38 PM
I like 'Mexicans'. It reminds me of the old westerns, 'South of the Border, down Mexico way'.
It's better than freestaters in my opinion. We are a republic now. It's also better than beggars or tarmaccers.
It's not a Republic. You can call it what you like, but it's been a free state since 22 and will remain so in the eyes of most northern nationalists until there are 32 counties officially included. That's not your fault, its just the way it is........
Quote from: jodyb on February 28, 2008, 08:54:49 PM
It's not a Republic.
What is it then - a Monarchy?
I think you need to get your medication changed as you are obviously divorced from reality somewhere inside your head.
Quote from: Billys Boots on February 28, 2008, 04:35:22 PM
QuoteSo you have no opinion on the actual topic just trying to pick at the type of phrase i use. Please just have an opinion and you can stereotype if you wish and i won't hold it against you. I would even take you seriously. Ps i never mentioned mexican as i think this is the worst i have ever heard in reference to freestaters.
I've already stated my opinion three times, I'm not going to do it again. It's not difficult to read before over-reacting.
I would have considered 'Mexican' to be (almost) affectionate, unlike 'freestater' which most certainly is not.
funnily enough it depends on how it is said Billy - a lot of people 'affectionately' or more truthfully ' longingly' call Ireland the 'free state'
those trying to insult spit it out as 'freestate'
was highly insulted playing a freshers match for W RTC many moons ago against jordanstown where some supporters called me a free state b@stard.
It wasnt the B@stard part that I found objectionable! :o
not that pushed on the mexicans reference either
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2008, 09:55:02 PM
Quote from: jodyb on February 28, 2008, 08:54:49 PM
It's not a Republic.
What is it then - a Monarchy?
I think you need to get your medication changed as you are obviously divorced from reality somewhere inside your head.
An I thought us northern wans was easy ris :D . I've been lucky enough to live well in the fair 26 for some 19 years at this stage and my southern friends still get a little bemused when I talk about the free state.
It's neither affectionate or insulting from my point of view, I was brought up calling it the free state (through my parents' aspirations or ignorance or whatever you want to call it) and it'll always be the free state to me. Cant help it.
QuoteTaking offence to everything and having opinions on nothing.
Wrong twice in nine words - some going.
;) :D
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
QuoteIt is very simple, a lot of guys are criticising Northern folk for being stuck in a time warp and dwelling on the past when it comes to these issues.
QuoteIt is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
And I'm 'a geg a minute'. ::)
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
Aren't you lucky you live in a free state. Ya wanna try living up here..It's not easy ;)
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
def any relations or friends of mine that use it certainly do not use it as derogatory.
Only a handful of people I have ever met have used it as a negative/put down.
Its it people you have met - or is it what you have heard about/read here on this board - that has created this opinion?
Just wondering?
IMO you are way off what the general consensus is in terms of the use of 'free state' by northern persons.
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
I would tend to agree with Lynchboy . It may be a republic but does this make it wrong to call it a freestate??? After all it is a freestate. Once again Billy you have shown that you cannot have an opinion on any subject and you only proceed to analyse every word or full stop i make . The half of which no one understands. Come on join in the fun on the actual debate. ps i may have included some spelling mistakes to keep you interested :D
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 05:20:07 PM
I would tend to agree with Lynchboy . It may be a republic but does this make it wrong to call it a freestate??? After all it is a freestate. Once again Billy you have shown that you cannot have an opinion on any subject and you only proceed to analyse every word or full stop i make . The half of which no one understands. Come on join in the fun on the actual debate. ps i may have included some spelling mistakes to keep you interested :D
Its never called a free state in the context i am talking about it's always the free state which are have two very different meanings.
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:15:08 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
If they aren't using it was insult why not just say the Republic of Ireland,the Republic, down south? Are their head really that far up their own asses they missed 80 years of the Republic of Ireland?
Don't serve me a bowl of shit and call it pudding .
I would also refer to the Freestate and Freestaters and wouldn't mean anything offensive by it.
I just think some freestaters have a guilty conscience and don't like being reminded of their history and what they done.
That's understandable but don't be so sensitive boys.
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 05:46:12 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:15:08 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
If they aren't using it was insult why not just say the Republic of Ireland,the Republic, down south? Are their head really that far up their own asses they missed 80 years of the Republic of Ireland?
Don't serve me a bowl of shit and call it pudding .
not sure if you know this Gnevin but there was a war up there this last thirty years - if there was a republic of ireland in the last thirty years i'm sure they would helped out a little, can you imagine if there had been a republic in the south and instead of helping their own people during a war they just called them criminals and losked them up, that would be mad wouldn't it?
So the people in the north new there was no republic there at all by default.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 29, 2008, 05:49:34 PM
I would also refer to the Freestate and Freestaters and wouldn't mean anything offensive by it.
I just think some freestaters have a guilty conscience and don't like being reminded of their history and what they done.
That's understandable but don't be so sensitive boys.
OK I'm sure you British subjects aren't sensitive at all , sure you all could be arsed winning your independence with the rest of Ireland </totalbull>
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:54:35 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 05:46:12 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:15:08 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
If they aren't using it was insult why not just say the Republic of Ireland,the Republic, down south? Are their head really that far up their own asses they missed 80 years of the Republic of Ireland?
Don't serve me a bowl of shit and call it pudding .
not sure if you know this Gnevin but there was a war up there this last thirty years - if there was a republic of ireland in the last thirty years i'm sure they would helped out a little, can you imagine if there had been a republic in the south and instead of helping their own people during a war they just called them criminals and losked them up, that would be mad wouldn't it?
So the people in the north new there was no republic there at all by default.
So what is there and imagined country? The ROI and it's government did what it could with in the bounds of international law at time , did to little at others and where pressured into actions at other times .
I haven't a clue about British subjects, you'll have to ask them.
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 06:00:45 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:54:35 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 05:46:12 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:15:08 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
If they aren't using it was insult why not just say the Republic of Ireland,the Republic, down south? Are their head really that far up their own asses they missed 80 years of the Republic of Ireland?
Don't serve me a bowl of shit and call it pudding .
not sure if you know this Gnevin but there was a war up there this last thirty years - if there was a republic of ireland in the last thirty years i'm sure they would helped out a little, can you imagine if there had been a republic in the south and instead of helping their own people during a war they just called them criminals and losked them up, that would be mad wouldn't it?
So the people in the north new there was no republic there at all by default.
So what is there and imagined country? The ROI and it's government did what it could with in the bounds of international law at time , did to little at others and where pressured into actions at other times .
Naw Gnevin there was a Free State there. ;)
Apparently Taliban Prince Harry is stopping off at Croke Park on his way back from Afghanistan !
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 06:03:27 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 06:00:45 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:54:35 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 05:46:12 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 05:15:08 PM
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 04:26:36 PM
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 02:40:37 PM
even counting my words now. :D I call it the freestate aswell lads and mean no harm at all with it. It is just the way i have been brought up aswell. It is something we aspire to so in a way it is still a free state to the occupied states in the north.
I don't aspire to a free state. I aspire to a republic. My da n my brothers still call it the Free State as they don't know it might be offensive and think it actually a welcomed name. The bird,hates it,(shes a dub) it really annoys her ;D. I know better but say it to make my p[oint or else just to annoy people. At home tho I sometimes would say it without thinking and only notice when the women points it out. :D
Why would it they think its welcomed , its always used with disdain and as a put down
No it's not. They simpley don't know that it can be taken as an insult. It's like some people using the term Northern Ireland or Six County's or Ulster as the Six Countys, many of them simpley think that is what it's called and use the term with no intent. It is sometimes used "with disdain and as a put down" but far from always.
If they aren't using it was insult why not just say the Republic of Ireland,the Republic, down south? Are their head really that far up their own asses they missed 80 years of the Republic of Ireland?
Don't serve me a bowl of shit and call it pudding .
not sure if you know this Gnevin but there was a war up there this last thirty years - if there was a republic of ireland in the last thirty years i'm sure they would helped out a little, can you imagine if there had been a republic in the south and instead of helping their own people during a war they just called them criminals and losked them up, that would be mad wouldn't it?
So the people in the north new there was no republic there at all by default.
So what is there and imagined country? The ROI and it's government did what it could with in the bounds of international law at time , did to little at others and where pressured into actions at other times .
Naw Gnevin there was a Free State there. ;)
Yes a free state known as the Republic of Ireland
As in Katie Price known as Jordan?
Quote from: Zapatista on February 29, 2008, 06:12:03 PM
As in Katie Price known as Jordan?
As in the difference i already said between
the free state and
a free state
But Jordan is a monarchy
Gnevin i think you are losing it son one minute you are talking about a free state within a republic then you are talking about being called a free stater is causing you offense. You then have the ignorance to call fellow Irishmen, British subjects. But i think there are many of us in the north that don't expect anything different. Anything we have in the north we have fought for ourselves. As some other posters were saying if we were relying on the Rep/freestate helping us out we would be in some difficulty. You could at least recognise the difference up north and catch a grip getting all up yourself about people calling you a free stater.
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 29, 2008, 09:15:44 PM
Gnevin i think you are losing it son one minute you are talking about a free state within a republic then you are talking about being called a free stater is causing you offense. You then have the ignorance to call fellow Irishmen, British subjects. But i think there are many of us in the north that don't expect anything different. Anything we have in the north we have fought for ourselves. As some other posters were saying if we were relying on the Rep/freestate helping us out we would be in some difficulty. You could at least recognise the difference up north and catch a grip getting all up yourself about people calling you a free stater.
"i think you are losing it son one minute you are talking about a free state within a republic".
When did i ever talk about a free state within a republic ? I clearly said their is a difference between a free state and the free state.
Notice the /endbullshit at the comment about British subject,POG was talking shit so i talked shit back to him . Sure don't be so sensitive winsamsoon and anything we have here was fought for was by our forefathers. I recognise the North is different and that the free state/free stater is a term of abuse .
Quote from: winsamsoon on February 25, 2008, 02:56:17 PM
Your first point is very simply untrue. It's 2008, not 1978. As for certain areas being our of bounds, that's the same on both sides. Furthemore, with regard to such places, you'd need your head checked if you did actually want to visit them! I don't see how this point has anything to do with your argument either.
Maguire. That point has lot to do with my argument. It is very simple, a lot of guys are criticising Northern folk for being stuck in a time warp and dwelling on the past when it comes to these issues. What they seem to forget is the fact that the troubles are still in many ways going on in the North. There still exists dissidents groups and there are certain areas that one cannot go into simply because of your religion. You say it is 2008, obviously you are trying to be ironic. I can understand why you are like this because you are probably looking at it from a southern perspective. It would be great if the North was like the south, where all you had to worry about would be how to attract the next tourist, to make the quick buck and to add to the celtic tiger . Circumstances are different in the north. If you cannot realize this then i rest my case. Now the reason i am saying this is too try and make you understand how an issue like the representative of the British Royal family ( Whose armies still occupy the 6 counties where i live) visting Croke park would be harder to accept for a northern Delegate that one from the south, simply because of the political environment. I cannot make this point any clearer. I can also tell you my friend that people are still being discriminated against in jobs because i know of individuals that have been on the other ends of the wrong doing. A good example would be the police recruitment. It now has to be 50% protestant intake and 50% all others. Is this fair employment?? or is this racially discrimantory towards certain groups????. I wonder do the Gardai share the same policy :D :D. Catch a grip and acknowledge the difference and quit trying to put folk down for their beliefs.
I will grant you one point some of the ones protesting are complete idiots just against change and bigoted and these poeple are usually the dregs of our society. It is these people that are living in these areas that cannot be entered and drawing the money that the government foolishly provides for them. But you seem to be labelling good folk, with genuine concerns alongside these people. These people are not against change but it is like everything else it will take time. Oh and my final point, You said it happens on both sides. In no statement did i say that it didn't you just surmised this because you have a mindset about Northern people. I know both sides of the community are affected by this but this particular incident ie the visit, really only is devicive to one.
I haven't been keeping up with this tread and therefore didn't see this reply to my previous post. I have a few short points to make.
My Monaghan identity on this board obviously makes it appear that all my views are from a southern perspective. I lived in Monaghan for (the first) seven years of my life. The remaining 22 years i have lived in Fermanagh, Antrim and Down, so i'm not removed from reality in the north.
As for your point on employment discrimination, i sense that you are backtracking, turning your original argument on its head, saying that your point is now about discrimination against protestants. Call me a cynic, but i don't think that's the way your argument started. As for the police and their 50/50 recruitment, appointment is still on the basis of merit (i.e. if you're no good, you still won't get in) and the 50/50 element is there to redress the balance and is merely a temporary measure. Of course the Garda don't have such measures - they are already, broadly, representative of the population they serve.
Finally, i am not putting anyone down for their beliefs - it's inaccuracies in your argument (intentional or otherwise) that i have raised issue with.
I never said my argument was about discriminatio against protestants, i did however say that the discrimination still exists on both sides. Some of the clowns on here were suggesting that this had ceased to exist. Gnevin yous still have a failure to realise that in the north the term is used regularly and it meant to cause no hurt whatsover. Remind me again the facts behind you thinking it is a term of abuse.
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isnt much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us.
and, of course, we in kerry have done our bit by letting you win a few handy all-irelands. Some people have no gratitude.
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isnt much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us.
OH my good God. :o :o :o
QuoteOnce again Billy you have shown that you cannot have an opinion on any subject and you only proceed to analyse every word or full stop i make .
Idiotic and paranoid in equal measures - keep it up lad, you're giving us all a good laugh.
Quote from: Gnevin on February 29, 2008, 09:26:47 PM
I recognise the North is different and that the free state/free stater is a term of abuse .
the term CAN be a term of 'abuse' but only very infrequent occasions - so you are not wrong...
in general though its just a reference to Ireland south of the border.
To call Ireland 'the republic of Ireland' is in a way, a phrase that states that the six counties are NOT part of Ireland and this will NEVER be uttered by northerners of at least my age (and a wee bit younger I suspect - def never by older folk , though this seems to be softening as 'unification' approaches).
Freestate is used , in the same way you'd say 'munster' if asked where would this years AI football champions most likely hail from.
etc etc
stand down lads, you are fighting over 'regional usage' of words/phrases for no real reason other than lack of understanding Irelands different and strange 'parochia'l phrases
I would tend to agree with you lynchboy. Mikey i do fully realise that a bloody civil war did occur in the south(Is is ok to call it this?) over the decision to partition the north not just over the north as the north had very little to do with it. I like, yourself would never want bloodshed or any other forms of war to be fought and i don't have the answers to what the south could do to help.. However this original debate started over the visit of the Princess to the Rugby game. My overall point was that the political scenario in the north is in total contrast to the south, hence Northern GAA delegates would find this visit a little harder to swallow. As they did with rule 42 and rule 21. By saying this i am not saying there were no members in the south that this would be hard for them to stomach. Some people then began to suggest that we were stuck in the past in the north and i was highlighting certain areas of society in the north that still hasn't moved on. Again some people couldn't acknowledge this and some then began to question the status of our nationality (i think the term was british subjects)which is highly offensive and ignorant to what is really happeniing in the north.The whole debate has now turned on it's head over the use of names.
Ps I liked the wee dig you got in about the All Irelands it kinda lightened the mood ;) :D
Quote from: winsamsoon on March 03, 2008, 12:08:41 PM
Some people then began to suggest that we were stuck in the past in the north and i was highlighting certain areas of society in the north that still hasn't moved on.
Of which you are one? (<genuine question, not a dig)
Could you rephrase this question maguire? are you looking to know have i moved on??
Quote from: winsamsoon on March 03, 2008, 03:51:24 PM
Could you rephrase this question maguire? are you looking to know have i moved on??
Yes, you're saying that certain sections of society in the north still 'haven't moved on'/ are 'stuck in the past'. You're opposition to 'Princess Anne in Croke Park' would suggest you fall into this category, yet you seem to keep suggesting that these 'certain sections' don't necessarily reflect your position.
I was just wondering how you viewed yourself in this respect? Do you acknowledge that you 'haven't moved on' and are 'stuck in the past'? If so, fair enough. If not, i was just interested in how you view your own position.
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isnt much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us.
Mike, incredibly, unbelievably simplistic, even by your standards ... how does it feel to bask in the freedom won for you by Irish republicans? We wouldn't know up here...
To be brutally honest maguire i would say i have moved on some issues but there are still some issues that i simply cannot conceed at this moment in time. It simply boils down to a conflict of interests. Unionist want to remain part of Britain and i simply want to secure unification. This conflict of interests in leading two sets of people down two different roads. There is no simple answer to the problem in the north and in all honestly myself personally will probably never move on regarding some aspects but it would be for valid reasons and certainly not based on hatred or war. What seems to come across all the time is that we all wanted a war up here, this was simply untrue. If we could have had peace we would have taken it but it simply wasn't achievable again because of the complexedy of the conflict of interests. So i guess would say i would be quite liberal and have moved on in some respects but there are just somethings that i hold to sacred to trade in. After all society should be inclusive of all, this means trying to live together. The GAA would be one of these things. Unionists see the GAA as a bigoted organisation and we all know this simply ain't true but it is issues like this that make change that little bit harder.
So lets show them we're not bigoted? Lets not make a fuss when someone like Anne visits? She (and her family) are irrelevant to most British people, so why should we make any unnecessary fuss over her visit?
QuoteMike, incredibly, unbelievably simplistic, even by your standards
Go on, explain all the complexities to me so red hander. You lads seem to have a very simplistic view of the south and what it should have done, or what it should be doing, in relation to the north. If your not prepared to put yourself in our shoes then dont be surprised if we get tired of hearing what you "expect" of us.
Quote from: deiseach on February 14, 2008, 07:27:30 PM
One of the downsides to the opening up of Croke Park (and I say this as someone who was broadly in favour of it) are all these bloody 'firsts'. First match, first match against a British team, first soccer match, first soccer match against a British team, first visit from a Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg, first decent attendance from Cork outside an All-Ireland final . . .
And that elusive first AI win this lifetime for the Deise... only kidding, sure that'll never happen.
Quote from: red hander on March 03, 2008, 05:38:56 PM
Mike, incredibly, unbelievably simplistic, even by your standards ... how does it feel to bask in the freedom won for you by Irish republicans? We wouldn't know up here...
I'm not trying to stir here, but I know that honestly Red Hander, there are a huge amount of people in the Republic/Free State/Down South that couldn't care that you wouldn't know up there.
Your spot on there stephenite but the previous post from Mike Sheehy shows that not only do some not care but some are so distant from the reality of what is going on that even if they did care it would be more harm than good. I can accept people not caring but to not care for the reason he gave is a bit mad really.
I refer to this - Posted on: March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AMPosted by: Mike Sheehy
Yip some would call Mike sheehy a sad bastard. Im not sure if thats a little extreme though.
I cannot believe that peopel actually got 15 pages out of such a pointless subject!
Well tankie there in lies your ignorance and stupidy. Number 1 it is clearly not pointless as so many people have been commenting on it and number two you are posting on it, so how hypocritical and silly does that make your last statement. As regardes that post by Mikey sheehy, i actually think he raises some honest and valid points. It is up the folk in the north to sort it out because it is now our problem. I would have reservations over the causes of the conflict but, ie. it was the south that partitioned Ireland but we won't get into that. Maguire you are correct in what you say also, We should move on and to be honest i wouldn't have made a big fuss over the visit, because i made my points whilst debating rule 42. I now have to accept that these things have and will happened (whether i like it or not) and i must try and get one with it but by christ it ain't easy. I also acknowledge what stephenite is saying when he says that certain southern folk wouldn't give a damn and this is a general consensus in the north aswell. We know that the South could do without us but this is our culture and identity. To deny someone this would be very very wrong. To totally turn your back on fellow country men in my eyes is an absolute disgrace and kinda like 1921 when we were partitioned. It is clear that the same attitudes still exist in the south ( and i don't mean that in a bad way towards you stephenite). Tankie as this post is pointless you won't be reading this.
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isnt much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us.
Mike, If you weren't taking your history lessons from the Michael Collins film you would know that the Civil War wasn't fought over the north but was in fact fought over the issue of the oath of allegience. The issue of the north was not the driving force behind the civil war. Furthermore, the attitude in your posting of an "Us and "Them" in reguards to the north and south demonstrates the partitionist attitude rampant in the 26 counties. While I'm not wishing to go into a rant about the past, the issue of this British monarch visiting Croke pPark was still a big problem for many many Irish people given that the British government has yet to come clean about it's dirty role in the war in the 6 counties. Givin the ties between the British monarchy and the British Army, is it any wonder that the sight of a member of the British monarch in Croke Park causes upset? (Especially when we consider such things as how the British monarchy honoured the british paras who murdered 14 civil rights marchers in Derry.) Perhaps when the British government come clean about their role in Ireland and apologise then I suspect such visits would not be a problem.
Members of the British Government and the British parliament (who would have had a more direct influence on British Army activities in the North than a little ould wan in a scarf), have attended Croke Park for GAA matches and I don't remember sensitive souls having great difficulties coping with that.
To be fair I don't believe much of the discussion here is in direct relation to a Royal visit to Croke Park. It is the underlying issues and the reactions to them which has taken this thread to a point where the initial discussion is lost and almost irelevant. Every journey starts with one step.
yeah but it is just not enough to state opposition to the visit the reasons why are the most important part of the argument. Some posters have merly came on and argued with other people who have raised valid points. Thye have given no opinion on the subject but just continued to lambast others for their opinion. So we should all state our view on it and then the issues for thinking the way we do. But the majority of the points actually raised have been relevant.
And who is to come clean first? The British Goverment or our local 'heros'. If there is to an accounting for all the goverment did surely we should also get an accounting for all the fine houses that now dominate border areas and belong to families with little visible means of support. Its hardly all down to money from America or whatever. Maybe they will start with that unfortunate murder - sorry killing in North Monaghan. Ye - sure.
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 03:34:32 PM
And who is to come clean first? The British Goverment or our local 'heros'. If there is to an accounting for all the goverment did surely we should also get an accounting for all the fine houses that now dominate border areas and belong to families with little visible means of support. Its hardly all down to money from America or whatever. Maybe they will start with that unfortunate murder - sorry killing in North Monaghan. Ye - sure.
That is the worst attempt of an excuse for anyone to not come clean I've ever heard. Everyone must admit the part they played and everyone must do it together.
The people of those areas ( who where amoung the biggest victims) are the people calling the loudest for truth comission. The silence is coming from the Brits, The Dublin Government and most Unionists.
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 03:34:32 PM
And who is to come clean first? The British Goverment or our local 'heros'. If there is to an accounting for all the goverment did surely we should also get an accounting for all the fine houses that now dominate border areas and belong to families with little visible means of support. Its hardly all down to money from America or whatever. Maybe they will start with that unfortunate murder - sorry killing in North Monaghan. Ye - sure.
What exactly are you suggesting or indeed how is it relevant?
Do you see a nice house in a border area and assume the person who lives there is a criminal? Are you aware that if these people are making their money dishonestly they are accountable to the law unlike the British Government and their various terrorist organisations.
How is it relevant ???
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 09:41:13 PM
How is it relevant ???
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
It's not relevant to any sort of truth commission because anyone earning money dishonestly is answerable to the law.
Ye - anserable to the law just like those people who carried out the murder are answerable. I suppose all those people involved in smugging diesel & petrol and pirating DVDs and making hooch whoich is then bottled in counterfit Vodka bottles are all living in council houses or caravans on the side ofthe road while all the paramilitaries are engaged in peace and reconcilia\tion studies. The hypocracy of so many fellow northerners who drape themselves in the cloak of republicanism and spout the words while engaging in the most foul sectarian and criminal activity while wallowing in victimhood make me sick.
QuoteThe hypocracy of so many fellow northerners who drape themselves in the cloak of republicanism and spout the words while engaging in the most foul sectarian and criminal activity while wallowing in victimhood make me sick.
I agree.
QuoteYe - anserable to the law just like those people who carried out the murder are answerable. I suppose all those people involved in smugging diesel & petrol and pirating DVDs and making hooch whoich is then bottled in counterfit Vodka bottles are all living in council houses or caravans on the side ofthe road while all the paramilitaries are engaged in peace and reconcilia\tion studies.
Yeah, are you suggesting they're not?
I'm sure anyone smuggling etc aren't living in caravans, what's your point?
Well pints how many of themi in South Armagh/north Louth have been answerable to the law to date?
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 09:57:51 PM
Well pints how many of themi in South Armagh/north Louth have been answerable to the law to date?
That's not my problem, take it up with the police/guards.
They aren't the only ones the law aren't doing anything about in the area, in fact, we don't really have any law and order.
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 09:57:51 PM
Well pints how many of themi in South Armagh/north Louth have been answerable to the law to date?
Zoyler are you saying that as some people have not been found guilty of certain crimes no one should be found guilty of any crimes. By definition do you believe that as not every crime will be solved no crime should be solved?
As yet zoyler i think everyone has agreed that a criminal is a criminal so your point on this in invalid. I don't know how this argument has turned into this but i am sure there are loads of posters who live in the area you are talking about and i would say they are honest hard working people. I would also add that for years people who had been sort of close to the IRA and stepped out of the so called line where sent to Dundalk to live. This was wrong but so is insinuating that the whole of Dundalk and south Armagh are terrorists.
Quote from: zoyler on March 04, 2008, 09:57:51 PM
Well pints how many of themi in South Armagh/north Louth have been answerable to the law to date?
Zoyler you keep talking and i'll keep shovelling
Quote from: stevetharlear on March 04, 2008, 12:42:31 AM
Quote from: deiseach on February 14, 2008, 07:27:30 PM
One of the downsides to the opening up of Croke Park (and I say this as someone who was broadly in favour of it) are all these bloody 'firsts'. First match, first match against a British team, first soccer match, first soccer match against a British team, first visit from a Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg, first decent attendance from Cork outside an All-Ireland final . . .
And that elusive first AI win this lifetime for the Deise... only kidding, sure that'll never happen.
Should Waterford land the McCarthy Cup, I can't imagine many would be saying that it's the first since the opening of Croke Park. In fact, I think you'd be the only one.
In fairness it nearly would be the first since the opening of Croke Park. Or Jones' road even :D
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 05, 2008, 06:44:13 PM
In fairness it nearly would be the first since the opening of Croke Park. Or Jones' road even :D
Well, the Hogan Stand has come and gone since the last time :D
Thankfully I have a life beyond the computer screen and only now reading the last few posts.
I'm an Armagh man so I have a fair idea as to what goes on. The point I'm making is that some of those objecting to Princsess Anne in Croke Park have no difficulty with what most regard as criminality in so called Republican areas
Zoyler, you are spouting some of the worst rubbbish I have been unfortunate enough to read on this site for a long time. C
onsidering we are having a discussion about the issue of the British Government having to come clean before their royal family should be welcome in Croke Park, we are taliking about how they need to come clean about their part in collusion. The british government has been found to have been involved in many hundreds of murders of innocent nationalists in Ireland over the last thiry years. To start mouthing off about smuggling is a desparate attempt to change the subject and I suspect is just a way for you to get you republican-bashing out of your system.
Secondly, why is it you seem to tar all republicans with the same brush. i.e. "criminals the lot of them" and speaking of "so called" republican areas? If an area is populated mainly by people of a republican outlook, it therefor can be termed as a republican area, whether you like it or not.
1) So called republican areas - I consider myself a republican but do not wish to be associated with those I regard as having stolen the name while behaving as fascists
2) I have no doubt that the British Goverment have been involved in collusion, cover up etc. Can you think of any other organisation that might have been involved in similar conduct?
3) Where did I say that all republicans are criminals - I did not - However I will say that some who call themselves such most definately are.
Quote from: zoyler on March 06, 2008, 10:34:50 AM
1) So called republican areas - I consider myself a republican but do not wish to be associated with those I regard as having stolen the name while behaving as fascists
2) I have no doubt that the British Goverment have been involved in collusion, cover up etc. Can you think of any other organisation that might have been involved in similar conduct?
3) Where did I say that all republicans are criminals - I did not - However I will say that some who call themselves such most definately are.
you said that the people living aroung the border in big houses were fuel barrons etc etc ::) ::)
To a certain extent Zoyler i actually agree with you. I would say now that the republican movement have become very very dodgy. Now obviously it is not all of them but the Quinn incident, the Northern bank these were all acts of criminality carried out by the republican movement . The Quinn incident in particular seems to have involved some kind of illegal fuel smuggling. This is criminality and should not be tolerated. So i would agree that criminality is criminality no matter how we try to gloss it up. But as some of the lads have said to compare this to British collusion adn cover up is slightly of the mark. There are some so called republicans that are complete gangsters, this actually takes away from the meaning of the IRA who where never supposed to be a criminal organisation but a protector of the people. The old IRA were involved in criminality too, for example stealing guns and importing weapons but this was whilst there was a war going on. They would have never have got their people labelled as criminals. The so called war is over there now exists a fragile peace, there is no room now for this behaviour. The focus should now be on building the community that we live in and not holding people to ransom (that goes on in certain areas, carried out by certain people). the republican movement has became slightly detached from the original plan. But again i think this is of the beaten track but i jsut had to get a rant on it :)
By the Old IRA I presume you are refering to the 1916-1923 period. I do not regard their stealing guns and importing weapons as criminality though I have no doubt that full proceeds of the odd bank robbery may not have found their way to the central fund.
There is no way that conduct at the time supported by the then Sinn Feins election victory can be compared to the activities of the modern day IRAs behaviour which was totally undmocratic and fascist. Many of their 'economic' activities were to say the least selfserving and while I can accept that some of the fine houses in border areas are the result of honest toil there can be no doubt that many if not most are the result of illegal activity which was not subject to what any fair minded person would regard as proper police/revenue scutiny.
QuoteI can accept that some of the fine houses in border areas are the result of honest toil there can be no doubt that many if not most are the result of illegal activity which was not subject to what any fair minded person would regard as proper police/revenue scutiny.
As the owner of, what I consider, to be nice house in a border area I object to you classing me as probably being involved in criminal activity. I know several owners of nice houses in the same area and all work bloody hard (honestly) to get them.
Your generalisation is beyond stupid.
What part of Armagh are you from?
Pints - you know well the sorts of houses I'm referring to. I'm mid county.
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 05, 2008, 11:22:57 PM
Zoyler, you are spouting some of the worst rubbbish I have been unfortunate enough to read on this site for a long time. C
onsidering we are having a discussion about the issue of the British Government having to come clean before their royal family should be welcome in Croke Park, we are taliking about how they need to come clean about their part in collusion. The british government has been found to have been involved in many hundreds of murders of innocent nationalists in Ireland over the last thiry years. To start mouthing off about smuggling is a desparate attempt to change the subject and I suspect is just a way for you to get you republican-bashing out of your system.
Secondly, why is it you seem to tar all republicans with the same brush. i.e. "criminals the lot of them" and speaking of "so called" republican areas? If an area is populated mainly by people of a republican outlook, it therefor can be termed as a republican area, whether you like it or not.
You do realise that Croke Park is only a stadium and to suggest that the use of a stadium should hang on the British government saying sorry is just rediculous. The use of the stadium has nothing to do with what the British government has done. I think you forget that many GAA people are also soccer and Rugby fans who go and watch the national team play in this stadium and are very happy to do so but to think you can insult Princess Anne over something that has nothing to do with sport is just rediculous and very narrow minded.
most are the result of illegal activity which was not subject to what any fair minded person would regard as proper police/revenue scutiny.
[/quote]
Yes but there had to be fair policing first in order to report such incidents. How hypocritical would it be going to the police force that existed here up until about 2004 to report a criminal act when they themselves were spying on people and colluding in the mourder of innocent people. Zoyler you can't be selective in criminality whether it be stealing the odd gun or pistol or robbing the Northern Bank they were still crimes. I wasn't saying the Republican movement now are the same as the Old IRA. The old IRA had principles and fought towards an ideology. There was a respect amoung the members and above all a respect for themselves and the society they lived in. This is clearly non existance in the current set up where a lot of folk are in it for what they can get out of it.
QuoteMike, If you weren't taking your history lessons from the Michael Collins film you would know that the Civil War wasn't fought over the north but was in fact fought over the issue of the oath of allegience
And you lads accuse me of being simplistic. The oath of allegiance was certainly a major factor but was not the sole reason. The republic was declared in 1916 and the treaty did not deliver that republic, many fought on that issue alone , oath or no oath. It may come as a shock to you lads but some of us have family histories down here and we know why
we fought on one side or another (or both). You lads know the Northern perspective, we know the southern perspective.
QuoteFurthermore, the attitude in your posting of an "Us and "Them" in reguards to the north and south demonstrates the partitionist attitude rampant in the 26 counties.
I hope you can see how ironic it is to be accused of an "Us" and "them" attitude by the world masters in "us" and "them-ery".
but, at least you and winsamsoon are making an honest attempt at explaining your position, unlike Red hander and Zapatista who simply accuse others of being simplistic but havent the guts to explain the "complexities" of the North to us naive southerners. Go on lads..I look forward to your learned responses....
QuoteYip some would call Mike sheehy a sad bastard. Im not sure if thats a little extreme though.
yeah, thats a bit extreme..there would be nothing extreme, however, about calling you an arsehole.
Can you clarify Mike? I am more than happy to address anything you want to ask :)
Quote from: zoyler on March 06, 2008, 01:05:51 PM
Pints - you know well the sorts of houses I'm referring to. I'm mid county.
Not really. I know of a couple of people that would fall into the category you're talking about but to say that "many if not most" nice houses are a result of criminal activity is just insane.
Quote from: Zapatista on March 03, 2008, 08:07:58 AM
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isn't much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us.
OH my good God. :o :o :o
I will start Mike. I assume you are talking about the above post? Here goes-
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Some Northerners seem to forget a bloody civil war was fought over the north. Perhaps those in the south of an older generation might take offence at some of the comments by Northerners like winsamsoon.
Partition played a very little part in the Civil war, or have you forgot that? Some northerners might have forgot some might not even know but I assure you most have not forgot. Young and old northerners might take offence to your comment.
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
As for the generations since the civil war, what is it exactly that you would have us do ? What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting when you are fighting for something that is, relatively, far away. Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
I would have the generations since the Civil War show some support, actively campaign for a Republic, as a sovereign nation challenge the British Government on their position in the north, not criminalise and in prison Republicans etc.
I agree with "
What happened in the 1920's happened..its easy now to say that the south should have fought on but people get tired of war and its difficult to keep fighting".
I am not sure what you mean by "
something that is, relatively, far away". If you mean far in the future then I think you are wrong. Unity was already in tact before the treaty was accepted and would still be intact if the treaty had have been rejected. It would only take the rejection or overturning of the treaty to bring unity. If you mean far away is terms of mile then that is absolutely ridiculous. Do you think England and Wales are far away from each other?
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 02, 2008, 02:07:15 AM
Even if Ireland had united at that time there probably would have still been a troubles as the protestant "minority" fought on. No matter what way you look at you were going to be stuck in a bitter bloodletting.
Ireland was united. I'm not sure what you mean above? Are you suggesting partition made no difference? Is it a case of - if there had been no partition the South would not have been involved and let the six countys in the north east contain the "bitter bloodletting" leaving the other 26 countys (with no actual divide between the 6 and 26) in relative peace?
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on March 03, 2008, 08:07:58 AM
The only people that can solve the troubles in the north are the people in the north and there really isn't much real "help" the south, or even the British, can give (if there was a time machine they themeselves would probably go back and shoot William of Orange and those before him that got them into the sorry mess). So no amount of whinging at us is going to help your situation. From my vantage point things have improved a lot in the North. Obviously you, on the ground, can see its not perfect but it would be better if you could clarify what "help" the south can give instead of whinging at us
The only people who can solve the troubles are those who played a part. This is in the design of the GFA and accepted by the people of Ireland. No one can wash their hands of their part including Dublin and London. You might see it a whinging but I see it as years of begging for help being ignored and now we are left with some resentment especially from those who continue to ignore their role.
I am available to answer any questions you want to ask Mike.
I have alsways been taught like yourself mike that the civil war was fought over the aoth of allegiance aswell as the partitioning of the 6 counties. I am sure there are other factors aswell that were a little less significant. Mikey you are quite correct and i wouldn't be that arrogant to suggest that i knew more than yourself on the issue of the civil war as you say members of your family actually fought in it. There were members of the north involved aswell (including some family members) and many battles were fought an houses divided over the issue. I still have a great aunt who worships De Valera (she has the Michael Collins traitor theme going on :)) I acknowledge that with each region there were different aspects and for me to try and tell you how attitudes in Kerry where today or back then would be wrong. But i am sure from your posts you wouldn't mind a sensible debate about the issue. What some of the other posters don't realise is that everything ain't black and white. You could have one opinion and me another and it would be possible for us both to be correct. The we have the guys who resort to name calling and i really share no time for this because it tells me they have no knowledge and we know wit is the lowest form of knowledge.