Time: 2 30 PM, Venue: Castlebar
Referee: Rory Hickey
TG4 live coverage.
It's not hard to be humble about Monaghan's chances against hot favourites Mayo in this game.
Especially after Mayo winning away at Kerry and Monaghan only with a useful practice game under their belt against a misfiring Derry team.
Last time we met 4 years ago, a late Monaghan goal took away a little of the scoreboard gloss but not from Mayo's emphatic performance in outclassing Monaghan on the pitch.
If we don't lose by much, then 4 points might be enough to survive, I'm sure Banty will mention that in his pre-match talk ;D
Hey! Are you a relation of our Barney by any chance? ;D
It's just that the said Barney has perfected the art of starting off threads like these with a classic "Mayo, God help us" moan.
I just hope he doesn't get too upset over you beating him to the punch this time and getting your tale of woe online first.
There is no good story from a Monaghan perspective.
We never had the good fortune to meet Mayo in Croke Park in recent times. ;D
We were spanked in the only league encounter and now we have to travel that mickey mouse journey to Castlebar, at a time when by all accounts Mayo are oozing class and Mortimer is stroking them over the bar blindfold from all angles.
May the lord have mercy on us and may it be less than 4 or 5 point so we may have some hope of survival before our last game in Tralee.
Quote from: Main Street on March 22, 2010, 04:12:11 PM
There is no good story from a Monaghan perspective.
We never had the good fortune to meet Mayo in Croke Park in recent times. ;D
We were spanked in the only league encounter and now we have to travel that mickey mouse journey to Castlebar, at a time when by all accounts Mayo are oozing class and Mortimer is stroking them over the bar blindfold from all angles.
May the lord have mercy on us and may it be less than 4 or 5 point so we may have some hope of survival before our last game in Tralee.
I have already asked the Pope to prepare a Pastoral Letter to include the last rites so ye can read it to yerselves at half time in Kerry. Such is the impending sense of doom that Mark Knopfler has renamed his band Dire 'but not as bad as Monaghan' Straits while some say Nostradamus reckoned the end of Monaghan will come long before the end of the world. Even George Lee is rumoured to have moved there.
But we are not buying it in Mayo.
Whatever hope there was of any sort of travelling Monaghan support going to Castlebar has been totally eradicated now that the game is on TG4. Are there many heading down on the Saturday night?
Jaysus its getting worse now, no hope even of a Monaghan support :(
The last man standing will be Oliver Brady, surely to God Oliver will offer his support from the terraces, so the heads on the pitch won't bow too deeply.
To be honest, this is one game we could lose after our impressive exploits against Derry and Kerry away from home. It's also worth noting that Mayo haven't won at home in the league since February the 7th.
I predict we lose this one & get a draw, via a conor point, down in cork
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on March 22, 2010, 10:50:47 PM
I predict we lose this one & get a draw, via a conor point, down in cork
0-1 to 0-1?
Our defense needs to up it.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on March 22, 2010, 10:50:47 PM
I predict we lose this one & get a draw, via a conor point, down in cork
How many points do you boys need to ensure a final spot?? Not that that would have any bearing on the outcome of course..
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 22, 2010, 11:45:33 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on March 22, 2010, 10:50:47 PM
I predict we lose this one & get a draw, via a conor point, down in cork
How many points do you boys need to ensure a final spot?? Not that that would have any bearing on the outcome of course..
If we beat Cork that should do it. It works to take points off them as well as giving us 2. Also it might mean a Mayo v Dublin final, one we are more likely to win than if playing Cork, also it would give us a day out in Croker if it was Mayo v the Dubs, both sets of fans would come out in numbers knowing that both teams couldn't lose, could they :D
Quote from: thebandit on March 22, 2010, 05:00:57 PM
Whatever hope there was of any sort of travelling Monaghan support going to Castlebar has been totally eradicated now that the game is on TG4. Are there many heading down on the Saturday night?
That is one reason, but Monaghan supporters are not being encouraged to travel by the poster who started this thread ;D
see highlighted quote!
Quote from: Main Street on March 22, 2010, 04:12:11 PM
There is no good story from a Monaghan perspective.
We never had the good fortune to meet Mayo in Croke Park in recent times. ;D
see quote!
We were spanked in the only league encounter and now we have to travel that mickey mouse journey to Castlebar, at a time when by all accounts Mayo are oozing class and Mortimer is stroking them over the bar blindfold from all angles.
May the lord have mercy on us and may it be less than 4 or 5 point so we may have some hope of survival before our last game in Tralee.
A national league would be a great boosht for Mayo and Kerry are out of it
so you would have to fancy their chances. When is the last time a connacht team won the football league?
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2010, 03:12:51 PM
A national league would be a great boosht for Mayo and Kerry are out of it
so you would have to fancy their chances. When is the last time a connacht team won the football league?
2001.
The National League title would be great for Mayo, I hope you get the Dubs in the final.
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2010, 04:51:39 PM
The National League title would be great for Mayo, I hope you get the Dubs in the final.
Still at the mind games... ;D Of course Mayo cannot make the final without beating Monaghan first!
a league title would be nice but would be forgotten very shortly thereafter, however, given that its part of the winning habit Mayo should really go for it, i would prefer cork in a league final where you would see what you are really up to, cork are the real deal and are my favourites to land sam this year, kerry have a huge void to fill and tyrone are slipping away, mayo are improving but are still a long way off kerry in sept 2009.
Quote from: mannix on March 23, 2010, 05:59:14 PM
a league title would be nice but would be forgotten very shortly thereafter, however, given that its part of the winning habit Mayo should really go for it, i would prefer cork in a league final where you would see what you are really up to, cork are the real deal and are my favourites to land sam this year, kerry have a huge void to fill and tyrone are slipping away, mayo are improving but are still a long way off kerry in sept 2009.
I agree. Winning the league would do unmeasurable good to this Mayo team. They should be going all out for it now. It would probably mean having to beat Cork 2 games in row, which would make them dig deep to find out a lot about themselves.
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2010, 03:12:51 PM
A national league would be a great boosht for Mayo and Kerry are out of it
so you would have to fancy their chances. When is the last time a connacht team won the football league?
Mayo beat Galway in the Final in Croke Park in 2001
What's all this bull about having to beat Cork first, in order to get to the league final?
You can get to the league final without having to beat Cork.
The path to the finals is staring Mayo in the face.
Surely you're not trying to be cute culchies here. It's not working.
Anybody in their right mind looking at Mayo's next 2 fixtures is saying to themselves, 'thats a handy enough game
for Mayo at home to a tactically inept Monaghan' and also saying 'that's a fierce hard last game for Mayo, down in the rebel county'.
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2010, 07:28:10 PM
What's all this bull about having to beat Cork first, in order to get to the league final?
You can get to the league final without having to beat Cork.
The path to the finals is staring Mayo in the face.
Surely you're not trying to be cute culchies here. It's not working.
Anybody in their right mind looking at Mayo's next 2 fixtures is saying to themselves, 'thats a handy enough game
for Mayo at home to a tactically inept Monaghan' and also saying 'that's a fierce hard last game for Mayo, down in the rebel county'.
Monaghan is surely the more dangerous game. Other than Kerry in All-Ireland Finals it is Mayo's complacency which has cost us over the years, over the last 10 years in games against Roscommon, Limerick, Fermanagh, Meath and a league final against Donegal. Nah Mayo often get to grips with the supposedly big boys & ignore the obviously dangerous teams such as Monaghan who are in a fight to the death with Kerry (how nice it would be for Monaghan to stay up and the All-Ireland champs go down or even greater motivation to stay up and send Ulster rivals Tyrone &/or Derry packing). I think the Mayo V Monaghan game will be a major battle for Mayo. Monaghan need the win this ever so slightly more than Mayo, that has to make them favorites. Mayo have already achieved their league goals by staying up, this has to be an idicateion to pile your money on the lads from Ulster. Not sure its worth the trip to McHale for this game, when the more I look at it the less of a chance I think Mayo have.
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on March 23, 2010, 07:36:27 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2010, 07:28:10 PM
What's all this bull about having to beat Cork first, in order to get to the league final?
You can get to the league final without having to beat Cork.
The path to the finals is staring Mayo in the face.
Surely you're not trying to be cute culchies here. It's not working.
Anybody in their right mind looking at Mayo's next 2 fixtures is saying to themselves, 'thats a handy enough game
for Mayo at home to a tactically inept Monaghan' and also saying 'that's a fierce hard last game for Mayo, down in the rebel county'.
Monaghan is surely the more dangerous game. Other than Kerry in All-Ireland Finals it is Mayo's complacency which has cost us over the years, over the last 10 years in games against Roscommon, Limerick, Fermanagh, Meath and a league final against Donegal. Nah Mayo often get to grips with the supposedly big boys & ignore the obviously dangerous teams such as Monaghan who are in a fight to the death with Kerry (how nice it would be for Monaghan to stay up and the All-Ireland champs go down or even greater motivation to stay up and send Ulster rivals Tyrone &/or Derry packing). I think the Mayo V Monaghan game will be a major battle for Mayo. Monaghan need the win this ever so slightly more than Mayo, that has to make them favorites. Mayo have already achieved their league goals by staying up, this has to be an idicateion to pile your money on the lads from Ulster. Not sure its worth the trip to McHale for this game, when the more I look at it the less of a chance I think Mayo have.
Jaysus, ye nearly have me convinced. If I m ever up before a fella with a wig and me with blood on my hands its you I d want fighting my corner.
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2010, 07:28:10 PM
What's all this bull about having to beat Cork first, in order to get to the league final?
You can get to the league final without having to beat Cork.
The path to the finals is staring Mayo in the face.
Surely you're not trying to be cute culchies here. It's not working.
Anybody in their right mind looking at Mayo's next 2 fixtures is saying to themselves, 'thats a handy enough game
for Mayo at home to a tactically inept Monaghan' and also saying 'that's a fierce hard last game for Mayo, down in the rebel county'.
What is this post-Celtic Tiger world we live in when we have Monaghan posters branding another county as "cute culchies" ???
:-\
Quote from: western exile on March 23, 2010, 08:39:23 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 23, 2010, 07:28:10 PM
What's all this bull about having to beat Cork first, in order to get to the league final?
You can get to the league final without having to beat Cork.
The path to the finals is staring Mayo in the face.
Surely you're not trying to be cute culchies here. It's not working.
Anybody in their right mind looking at Mayo's next 2 fixtures is saying to themselves, 'thats a handy enough game
for Mayo at home to a tactically inept Monaghan' and also saying 'that's a fierce hard last game for Mayo, down in the rebel county'.
What is this post-Celtic Tiger world we live in when we have Monaghan posters branding another county as "cute culchies" ???
:-\
I do believe he thinks he is talking to some Bures from Kiltimagh!
In fact, Mayo's season hinges on this game!!! This could be their last game in Castlebar this year and there will be immense pressure on Mayo to do the business and they may flounder under pressure as most Mayo teams do. Monaghan have nothing to lose apart from Div 1 status and I would bet money on Monaghan winning this game when the going gets tough for Mayo.
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on March 23, 2010, 07:36:27 PM
Monaghan need the win this ever so slightly more than Mayo, that has to make them favorites.
So needing a win makes you the favourite? By that logic, all the teams at the bottom end of divisions 1-3 should be favourites for their remaining games!
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 23, 2010, 09:44:48 PM
In fact, Mayo's season hinges on this game!!! This could be their last game in Castlebar this year and there will be immense pressure on Mayo to do the business and they may flounder under pressure as most Mayo teams do. Monaghan have nothing to lose apart from Div 1 status and I would bet money on Monaghan winning this game when the going gets tough for Mayo.
That doesn't make much sense! That's the only thing that matters for this game.
Monaghan have more to lose than Mayo.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 23, 2010, 09:49:21 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 23, 2010, 09:44:48 PM
In fact, Mayo's season hinges on this game!!! This could be their last game in Castlebar this year and there will be immense pressure on Mayo to do the business and they may flounder under pressure as most Mayo teams do. Monaghan have nothing to lose apart from Div 1 status and I would bet money on Monaghan winning this game when the going gets tough for Mayo.
That doesn't make much sense! That's the only thing that matters for this game.
Monaghan have more to lose than Mayo.
I am aware of what I said. Sure if you do go down, no doubt you will be saying 'sure the championship is more important'. But it is a MASSIVE if.
I have no problem saying now that it's very important that Monaghan retain Division 1 status.
There is some shite being spouted on this thread ::)
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on March 23, 2010, 11:08:34 PM
There is some shite being spouted on this thread ::)
A Sligonian don't be on here to stress us out all together. After peeking so early down in Kerry in the League by the time we meet Sligo we could be in serious trouble. Sligo will be under the radar, Mayo over-hyped. Sligo playing at home against a Mayo team that still conceeding last minute goals, nothing learned and in serious danger of a Mayo V Roscommon 2001 moment. I dispair, even our underage are falling apart. Our Clubs can't even win Connacht, O dear Lord.
Will be interesting to see how Mayo fare against a physical enough Monaghan team who have a couple of handy forwards as well. Who will mark Freeman? KH?
Many changes to be made from the last day? Stick with Conroy at FB or give Feeney a run? Wouldn't mind seeing Feeney in from the start. If Wood is playing, he would suit him I'd say.
Would you give C Mort get a start to give him a bit of fitness?
On paper, you'd say Mayo have better footballers but if it comes down to a hard fought game, you'd be hard pushed not to fancy the Farney.
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 23, 2010, 11:40:01 PM
Will be interesting to see how Mayo fare against a physical enough Monaghan team who have a couple of handy forwards as well. Who will mark Freeman? KH?
On paper, you'd say Mayo have better footballers but if it comes down to a hard fought game, you'd be hard pushed not to fancy the Farney.
The Monaghan lads think we are pulling their legs, but we are damn serious, look what the Dubs did to us. On top of that you never know when the Mayo forwards will misfire and with a possible League Final coming up, I am really afraid the lads might panic a bit like the Irish rugby team last weekend. I wish Monaghan where safe coming into this game.
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 23, 2010, 11:40:01 PM
Will be interesting to see how Mayo fare against a physical enough Monaghan team who have a couple of handy forwards as well. Who will mark Freeman? KH?
Separated at birth?
Quote from: RedandGreenSniper on March 23, 2010, 11:50:06 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 23, 2010, 11:40:01 PM
Will be interesting to see how Mayo fare against a physical enough Monaghan team who have a couple of handy forwards as well. Who will mark Freeman? KH?
Separated at birth?
Wonder can Tommy F hurl as good as our Keith though!?
You'd imagine they'll be marking each other, and has the makings of a great battle.
Mayo could possibly have McGarrity and Kilcoyne back for this - Killer was targetting this match a couple of months back, not sure if he's still on target. Would be great to see himself and the Thriller come on at some stage if we need a few scores.
We have the option of Cafferkey, Conroy, and possibly Feeney (although JOM doesn't seem to have trust in this one) for FB. Each can do a decent job, but I don't think any would have you completely at ease.
Quote from: Tubberman on March 24, 2010, 08:43:04 AM
Quote from: RedandGreenSniper on March 23, 2010, 11:50:06 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 23, 2010, 11:40:01 PM
Will be interesting to see how Mayo fare against a physical enough Monaghan team who have a couple of handy forwards as well. Who will mark Freeman? KH?
Separated at birth?
Wonder can Tommy F hurl as good as our Keith though!?
You'd imagine they'll be marking each other, and has the makings of a great battle.
Mayo could possibly have McGarrity and Kilcoyne back for this - Killer was targetting this match a couple of months back, not sure if he's still on target. Would be great to see himself and the Thriller come on at some stage if we need a few scores.
We have the option of Cafferkey, Conroy, and possibly Feeney (although JOM doesn't seem to have trust in this one) for FB. Each can do a decent job, but I don't think any would have you completely at ease.
He's been injured for the last month. Infection in his leg I think . . .
mayonews have a fairly good podcast, worth listening to. they say on it that kerry were after having a tough week training, how did kerry win a league and championship in the same year last few years? are Mayo that fit now that come summer they will be worn out? can a player not be as fit in april as september?
Quote from: mannix on March 24, 2010, 01:14:15 PM
mayonews have a fairly good podcast, worth listening to. they say on it that kerry were after having a tough week training, how did kerry win a league and championship in the same year last few years? are Mayo that fit now that come summer they will be worn out? can a player not be as fit in april as september?
A player's level of fitness in September?
It is well for Mayo that ye have to deal with those big questions. A Monaghan man could only dream of having to think about one like that in relation to his team.
Mayo hot favourites to win with the bookies at 4/9, the most hotly tipped first div team to win their game in this round.
main street, will you stop? monaghan will give anyone a game and against Mayo they will do the same. Monaghan are not in division 1 without reason.
Monaghan have been a quality addition to the top division this year. I thought they might struggle first year up, but they've been good all the way through and deserve to stay up ahead of some of the more 'established' teams (i.e. bigger names that the media salivate over).
The competitive games will stand to them later in the year as well - they've as good a chance as anyone in Ulster this year..
I think we'll just about do it this weekend with home advantage, but I expect Monaghan to score heavily so if our forwards have another off day like the Dublin game we'll be soundly beaten.
Quote from: mannix on March 24, 2010, 04:47:15 PM
main street, will you stop? monaghan will give anyone a game and against Mayo they will do the same. Monaghan are not in division 1 without reason.
Gaining Div 1 status in itself does not confer a quality and mark my words the pundits will all be chalking this one in Mayo's favour.
When you think about it, Mayo being on 8 points is tricky. Your div 1 status is secure but do you really want the hassle of a distraction of going hell for leather to get to a Div 1 final?
Quote from: Main Street on March 24, 2010, 08:57:06 PM
Quote from: mannix on March 24, 2010, 04:47:15 PM
main street, will you stop? monaghan will give anyone a game and against Mayo they will do the same. Monaghan are not in division 1 without reason.
Gaining Div 1 status in itself does not confer a quality and mark my words the pundits will all be chalking this one in Mayo's favour.
When you think about it, Mayo being on 8 points is tricky. Your div 1 status is secure but do you really want the hassle of a distraction of going hell for leather to get to a Div 1 final?
I would confidently say 'yes'. a big game against Dublin or Cork in HQ would do Mayo no harm at this early stage in the year. I'd say they'd be mad for it in fact!
So basically Sunday's game is to be decided by if Mayo are more mad for a League final than Monaghan are mad for to stay up. We might have a chance then, we can do mad stuff.
The game will be decided by which Monaghan team shows up. They are all Monaghan men after all, so it depends if they have more "main street" or more "GrandMasterFlash" like team members ;)
If the former, easy win for Mayo. 8)
Mayo won midfield comfortably against Kerry. Kerry however did nothing to cram things up and mayo were allowed the space to thrive. Hard to imaging Tom Parsons being allowed to run through a Kerry defence like that in Aug/Sept. Or Monaghan next Sunday for that matter. Dublin beat Mayo by funnelling men back behind the ball and forcing shot selection. When we could nt nail our frees it let them steal it. I expect Monaghan to play it like Dublin but I expect Mayo to cope better this time. Hope Dillon recovers in time for this one. We need him to unpick tight backs and nail the frees.
moysider, i attended the dublin game and mayo were not forced that hard, they just shot really bad from frees and play even with time to line it up. Dublin did cram their defence but Mayo cut through them anyway.If they hit one third of the easy ones they should have scored they would have one by 2 or 3 points. Hopefully they win sunday, a league final would be nice.
They were forced hard enough mannix, but they should have converted their numerous free opportunities that day.
In the scheme of greater things, not converting your chances is no big deal in the league, apart from losing to the Dubs at home of course.
There were 3 or 4 of the Monaghan seniors playing last night in the u21 against Antrim. They are proving to be handy enough needed additions to senior team. I hope they are able to play on Sunday. Dare I say the backbone of the team has more swung to the football skilled players, even if the rake of red and yellow cards indicate old habits still linger. Freeman, Finlay and McManus are providing the vast bulk of the scores and freetaking accuracy is now good to a 40m range. The magic marker for us is the 45.
I'd hope for a high scoring game with the most of them coming for Monaghan, mind you that's a hope and not an expectation. Playing football in September (even August) is still only a dream for us ;D
We can only envy the high standards of Mayo GAA.
Quote from: Main Street on March 25, 2010, 01:36:53 PM
In the scheme of greater things, not converting your chances is no big deal in the league, apart from losing to the Dubs at home of course.
There were 3 or 4 of the Monaghan seniors playing last night in the u21 against Antrim. They are proving to be handy enough needed additions to senior team. I hope they are able to play on Sunday. Dare I say the backbone of the team has more swung to the football skilled players, even if the rake of red and yellow cards indicate old habits still linger. Freeman, Finlay and McManus are providing the vast bulk of the scores and freetaking accuracy is now good to a 40m range. The magic marker for us is the 45.
I'd hope for a high scoring game with the most of them coming for Monaghan, mind you that's a hope and not an expectation. Playing football in September (even August) is still only a dream for us ;D
We can only envy the high standards of Mayo GAA.
Quick, quick! Pass me the bucket! :D
Good to see a relatively novel match on Sunday, we don't cross swords too often.
Like most of the other Mayo lads, I'd be cautious about this one. A lot of similarities to the lead up to the Dublin game.
- Won the two previous matches
- Beat one of the top 3 away from home in the previous match
- This week's game at home so will be fancied to win
- Considered by some as the more 'natural' footballers between the two teams (whatever that means these days)
So we could easily see a repeat performance when the Monaghan men apply the pressure and hard tackling. There's no chance they'll stand off like Kerry seemed to last week.
Still, I'd hope the Mayo players will have learnt from the Dublin match and will be better able to take a shot under pressure, or more importantly, choose the best time to take their shots.
And we can hardly miss so many frees again!
Will be a tight one, a lot could hinge on whether Dillon is available. I'll go for Mayo by 1 or 2, then it's off to Cork :-\
Looks like our u-21s came through last night unscathed, and the senior panellists continued their impressive form, Hughes and Malone in particular. Word is Vinny will be back for this game which would be a big boost, and hopefully JP Mone is fit to start as he really makes a difference in defence.
If we're to have a chance against Mayo we'll need the defence to be very tight against a Mayo attack that has been free-scoring of late. We'll also need everyone up front to be firing well, McManus to continue his great form and if Tommy could fire in a fourth goal in as many games that would be a big help also! I'd be confident of any frees being converted with Finlay and McManus but Mayo won't be giving away handy frees, so we'll have to work for our scores. The midfield battle will be crucial, and it's a game like this where we could really be doing with Eoin Lennon as Mayo are strong here. But Dick is in serious form and he'll run his legs into the ground for the cause. It's going to be very tough, but our boys will make a right go of it.
Although I hope it doesn't turn out that way, this is nicely set up for a Monaghan win.
History has taught us that Mayo are never as vulnerable as when they're coming off a big victory - see Galway '09, Dublin '06, Tyrone '04 etc.
Monaghan might be in difficulty but they're no mugs and they'll rightly fancy it on Sunday.
Mayo badly need these two points if they're serious about reaching the league final - Cork are formidable in Pairc Ui Rinn at the moment and I wouldn't want to be going there looking for a result.
I reckon there might be one change from the starting line up from last Sunday. That is Vinny back in (if he's fully fit) at FF at the expesne of Hughie.
I wonder will the banty hold back on the U21s on account of them playing next Wed against Cavan? I can't see it to be honest. He might start them and then make changes depending on how things materialise.
Should be interesting, if we can get out of the blocks fast (like last week), get the momentum going, the overlaps, supportive running, tracking back, scavanging for breaks around MF and hard (but fair!) tackles in then we give most teams in the country something to think about.. This Monaghan team are built on these qualities and if we see them this Sunday then we're in with a shout. This will be helped if McGarrity and Dillon don't win their fitness battles..
Monaghan by 2!
It is Friday after all lads, time to nail your colours firmly to the mast...
OK so GMF, Mayo will win because they're higher in the table than Monaghan.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 26, 2010, 11:03:45 AM
OK so GMF, Mayo will win because they're higher in the table than Monaghan.
That's ma boy! Yee Haaa!
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 26, 2010, 11:26:51 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 26, 2010, 11:03:45 AM
OK so GMF, Mayo will win because they're higher in the table than Monaghan.
That's ma boy! Yee Haaa!
Surely Antrim should always come top as they start the league top, then after winning their first game, they are still top & so the trend continues.
Both have something to play for, Mayo want to be in Croke Park for a final and Monaghan need to win to avoid the drop, Mayo should win on form and I reckon they will by a few points.
Mayo 1 12 Monaghan 1 09
mayo 2 11 monaghan 1 12
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on March 26, 2010, 10:01:58 AM
I reckon there might be one change from the starting line up from last Sunday. That is Vinny back in (if he's fully fit) at FF at the expesne of Hughie.
I wonder will the banty hold back on the U21s on account of them playing next Wed against Cavan? I can't see it to be honest. He might start them and then make changes depending on how things materialise.
Should be interesting, if we can get out of the blocks fast (like last week), get the momentum going, the overlaps, supportive running, tracking back, scavanging for breaks around MF and hard (but fair!) tackles in then we give most teams in the country something to think about.. This Monaghan team are built on these qualities and if we see them this Sunday then we're in with a shout. This will be helped if McGarrity and Dillon don't win their fitness battles..
Monaghan by 2!
It is Friday after all lads, time to nail your colours firmly to the mast...
No problem, my friend, glad to oblige...
There is no reliable form line between the two to go by so you can only go by the league results so far.
I must admit that I don't know much about the details of Monaghan's games so far but the league tables show that they have played 5, won 2, drew 0, lost 3 and the points diff is -4.
On the other hand, Mayo have also played 5 games, winning 4, losing 1 and have a points diff of +12. Furthermore, the latter is skewed a bit by the fact that Mayo conceded a goal in both the Kerry and Derry games against the run of play and each was literally the last act of the respective matches.
Because of complacency in both cases, Mayo are by no means assured of a final place yet- even if they do manage to win on Sunday.
I can't see O'Mahony letting them ease up in this game and I'd expect Mayo to be at least 3 points in front at the end.
Feck, the little bit of hope I had after reading the rte pundit had called a draw as inevitable, is being seriously tested by the Mayo swagger. I have to admire your calm confidence, when on Sunday, Banty brings his team to town hell bent on mauling you to pieces.
The contrasting relative merits of team quality don't matter so much here, if they did, Monaghan have that lost by 5 points.
Every team I suppose wants to do well but Monaghan have set the bar much higher than that. This year has to show something greater than anything else achieved in Banty's era. Div 1 Survival with dignity (6 points) is a first step. Banty wants those league points and Mayo happen to be the opponents. The bar will have to be pushed a bit higher to achieve that. One aspect of that is players maintaining just enough discipline to stay on the pitch.
Monaghan by a good 2 points
Quote from: Main Street on March 26, 2010, 04:55:59 PM
Feck, the little bit of hope I had after reading the rte pundit had called a draw as inevitable, is being seriously tested by the Mayo swagger. I have to admire your calm confidence, when on Sunday, Banty brings his team to town hell bent on mauling you to pieces.
The contrasting relative merits of team quality don't matter so much here, if they did, Monaghan have that lost by 5 points.
Every team I suppose wants to do well but Monaghan have set the bar much higher than that. This year has to show something greater than anything else achieved in Banty's era. Div 1 Survival with dignity (6 points) is a first step. Banty wants those league points and Mayo happen to be the opponents. The bar will have to be pushed a bit higher to achieve that. One aspect of that is players maintaining just enough discipline to stay on the pitch.
Monaghan by a good 2 points
Main, you're makin Banty sound like captain Caveman there and that we're still atin our young in Monaghan..
We won't dig up past skeletons, let's just say that it takes strength and courage to survive..
Regardless of our shortcomings as a team over the years, one can take pride in 'Monaghan bottle'.
I fully expect Banty to grab Mayo by their achilles heel and adopt a disciplined close combat confrontation. But it will have to be our forwards with football quality who will win the game for us.
Monaghan will be desperate for this one after Tyrone and Galway's wins tonight.
If they lose they'll have a nightmare task going to Killarney on the last day with Kerry needing the points now as well.
I'm expecting tomorrows game to be a real cracker.
Yep a must-win for Monaghan now. Tyrone's last second win was a disaster.
I've just had a look at the table and remaining fixtures and it appears that Tyrone, Kerry, Monaghan and Galway could all potentially finish with 6 points! Given that scenario, a win might not even be enough. It would be a pretty strange scenario, but by no means impossible.
Come on Monaghan!
There seems to be a quiet confidence among Monaghan posters on this thread that is at variance with the media/bookmakers view of this game. Are they all madder than Oliver Brady? I don't think so myself and the optimism might be based on the last time we faced a physically intimidating team last August. Meath bullied us out of the way that day and Monaghan will probably adopt the same gameplan to knock the 'swagger' out of us especially as we have a lot of the same faces on show today. This game will tell us if we learned anything last August.
Any sign of a Mayo starting 15?
Maybe McGarrity coming back in if Dillon is out - O'Shea to the 40?
14 of the same 15 for Mayo.
A bit of confusion over who's playing corner forward on Mid west, Thriller is named but Ronaldo is togged out as well.
Dillon possibly moving to FF with A O'Shea maybe on the 40 according to Billy Fitz..
0-7 to 0-3 to Monaghan after half an hour.
Monaghan playing defensive football and Mayo playing straight into their hands.
Mon 0-9 mayo 1-4 donal vaghan goal on the half time whistle
Quote from: hardstation on March 28, 2010, 03:11:01 PM
Goal for Mayo.
Had the time not elapsed when they scored the point?
Aye, 3 minutes given, Mayo scored a point after 3 and a half minutes and got another attack to get the goal, f*ckin joke, do the refs pick and choose which of the new rules they follow or something?
0-9 to 1-4 at half time.
Dillon 0-2
Vaughan 1-1
Ronaldson 0-1 with the scores
Dillon gone off injured, Ronaldson on.
Mayo playing awful stuff, Trevor Mortimer running down blind alleys, and Aiden O'Shea getting in the way on the 40 more than anything else.
Parsons is having a great game in midfield, but the forwards are playing the wrong kind of game tactically, O'Mahony needs a new plan for teams that crowd the defence like Dublin and Monaghan have done in McHale Park this year.
Quality goal by Vaughan, set up by Parsons just before half time is keeping Mayo in it.
Yep, was wondering where the fourth minute of additional time came from. Whistle should have been blown after Mayo's point. Big blow for Monaghan, but still two points ahead - all to play for.
Aye we're still 2 up at HT and you definately would've taken that before the game. Obviously that was a big boost for Mayo though but hopefully Banty revs up the boys a bit more now, they were going brilliantly there at the back and we need more of the same in the second half. Need to get Tommy and McManus more involved, pity Vinny isn't fit as he'd offer loads in terms of winning ball and laying it off. Great work being put in around the middle, and again we need that to continue, but also better ball being delivered in. No point in launching high ball on top of Tommy and Hanratty, quick low ball is what we need.
How long until Rory Woods makes an appearance?
Aiden O'Shea looks very cumbersome whenever he gets the ball.
He'd be better off on the edge of the square with T Mortimer on the 40.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 28, 2010, 03:23:56 PM
How long until Rory Woods makes an appearance?
If Mayo get a couple of quick scores I'd expect an early appearance.
Vinny on anyway.
In fairness it's at least 3 minutes of additional time, having said that don't know where he got the extra minutes, no break in play.
Parsons having a stromer, Mayo v poor though
Great start to second half. That last point was great - real hunger for it.
Hope that's not as bad as it looked for Higgins.
Great start to the second half, need to keep it going and not let any more goals through.
Mon 0-12 mayo 1-04 higgans gone ankle injury looks bad
F*ck, back to where we were at HT, Mayo on the up now.
Goals keeping us in this - we're still playing awful.
O'Se is developing a nice mullet there.
We're lucky to still be ahead after a couple of Mayo wides. Need another score quick.
Big turn around 1-4 without reply. TM has upped it as has kevin mc & Howley
Loving that there's a billboard behind the goal saying
'To advertise here, contact Aidan Kilcoyne on 087 ....'
Only in the GAA!!
I make that 10 scorers for 14 scores for mayo
Into the stand with the kickout Davey...
good lad.
Much better from Mayo after the second goal. Back to the top of the table. Well done lads.
Deserved win for Mayo, they had a very good last third of the game where nothing went for Monaghan - their own doing.
Very disappointing result for Monaghan. Mayo woke up and Monaghan lost their rhythm. 9 point turnaround for Mayo in the second half, having been 6 points down.
Not sure why Tommy Freeman was playing where he was either. JP brought on too late as well.
Quote from: hardstation on March 28, 2010, 04:05:26 PM
The goal that shouldn't have been between the teams.
Don't think you can just point to that. Monaghan lost their way in the last 20. Hard on them, they've been competitive all season and were good again today, but I fear they'll go down now. Hope they don't - either way they'll be a force in ulster this year and hard beaten.
Probably have to wait nervously for a few days on Kieth Higgins. Hopefully it's not a cruciate and he might be back for the trip to Sligo.
Aye, going on the last 20 minutes or so we had nothing, hit bad wides and gave away silly passes, 2nd goal knocked the stuffing out of us. Typical really, great defending for ages then fell asleep twice for the crucial goals.
Still can't help being pissed off about the first goal, I don't know the rule exactly but my understanding is that the whistle should have been blown after Mayo's last point of the first half. But at the end of the day we regained the 6 point lead at the start of the 2nd half and we can't have any complaints about the 2nd goal, a great pity, I had thought we were on the road to survival, but we threw it away.
Huge ask to get something away to Kerry now. :-\ Unless the Dubs do us a favour in Omagh, alot on the line in the next round.
Quote from: hardstation on March 28, 2010, 04:05:26 PM
The goal that shouldn't have been between the teams.
Post of the weak
That was a lovely point by Finlay early in the 2nd half, hit on the run with the inside of his left boot. Similar to the one he curled over late on against Armagh in last years qualifier.
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
There was an awful snap or crack heard when Keith Higgins went down, Id fear for his cruciate ligament. He will be a big loss :(
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2010, 04:43:33 PM
That was a lovely point by Finlay early in the 2nd half, hit on the run with the inside of his left boot. Similar to the one he curled over late on against Armagh in last years qualifier.
Aye nice point alright, and the one after where McManus won a high ball against Higgins and turned and popped it over, thought at that point we might be able to win as with that point we regained the 6 point lead and looked good. Pity we couldn't have pushed on further though, only scored another 2 points after that one.
Looked a nasty fall for Higgins alright, hope he's fine.
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
There was an awful snap or crack heard when Keith Higgins went down, Id fear for his cruciate ligament. He will be a big loss :(
The incident and the way he went from the field was very similar to Meehan a couple of weeks ago. Hopefully the outcome is the same (no cruciate damage) but if he's gone for the year it's a major hole in our defence.
Options if thats the case?
Barrett or McLoughlin to corner back? Or Vaughan? Howley maybe? We could do with getting Cunniffe back to cover the half back line if that's the case. Thought Liam O'Malley played well today but would have concerns about him in the long run. If Higgins is out, he will probably be a fixture in the full back line for the year, especially with Vaughan going so well at wing half back.
Quote from: Cosmo Kramer on March 28, 2010, 05:33:55 PM
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
There was an awful snap or crack heard when Keith Higgins went down, Id fear for his cruciate ligament. He will be a big loss :(
The incident and the way he went from the field was very similar to Meehan a couple of weeks ago. Hopefully the outcome is the same (no cruciate damage) but if he's gone for the year it's a major hole in our defence.
Options if thats the case?
Barrett or McLoughlin to corner back? Or Vaughan? Howley maybe? We could do with getting Cunniffe back to cover the half back line if that's the case. Thought Liam O'Malley played well today but would have concerns about him in the long run. If Higgins is out, he will probably be a fixture in the full back line for the year, especially with Vaughan going so well at wing half back.
Two years ago we were giving out about Conroy and O Malley playing Fullback and Corner Back and today we still have no answer.
I thought Conroy was cleaned, although O Malley held his own.
With Higgins gone (I hope not but the snap was loud so I fear the worst), we have major problems.
Id be hoping Ger Caff will be back but even if he is we are still in big trouble.
Might be time to call up Kevin Keane.
I know he's young, but if needs must, I say bring him in...
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
Mayo had a commanding 25 minutes coming from behind to win easing away in a competitive game, defending well, playing good attacking football and making score after score.
What more can you want at this stage? I would be well pleased with the Mayo bottle after that.
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2010, 06:04:54 PM
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
Mayo had a commanding 25 minutes coming from behind to win easing away in a competitive game, defending well, playing good attacking football and making score after score.
What more can you want at this stage? I would be well pleased with the Mayo bottle after that.
I think all mayo fans will be delighted with the last 20 minutes, but last year we had a habit early in the season of falling way behind in games and having to come back, happened against Donegal, Galway in the league, New York in the championship even. The first half today was as bad as we have been in the last two years, hopefully it was just a blip.
We won't beat Sligo in Markievicz playing like we did today in the first half, that's for sure.
Quote from: Cosmo Kramer on March 28, 2010, 06:44:25 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2010, 06:04:54 PM
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
Mayo had a commanding 25 minutes coming from behind to win easing away in a competitive game, defending well, playing good attacking football and making score after score.
What more can you want at this stage? I would be well pleased with the Mayo bottle after that.
I think all mayo fans will be delighted with the last 20 minutes, but last year we had a habit early in the season of falling way behind in games and having to come back, happened against Donegal, Galway in the league, New York in the championship even. The first half today was as bad as we have been in the last two years, hopefully it was just a blip.
We won't beat Sligo in Markievicz playing like we did today in the first half, that's for sure.
I think we would beat Sligo quite easily on that performance even. We played in first gear for that 1st hand/start of 2nd half and when it really matter the lads upped a gear two and accounted quite easliy for Monaghan, thats something to be admired and johno said after the match on TG4 if we could dominate the game for 70 minutes then we'd have no problems becoming All Ireland champions every year. Its a work in practice its seen what we need to improve on and we have plenty of time to do it.
I have to say I'm thrilled by the guts shown there today. To come back from been 6 down in the first half to be only 2 down at the break and playing terrible gave me the anticipation that Mayo would win handily in the end. However to go down 6 points once again in the second half and to win by 3, well it's not really 'Mayoish' is it. However this year it seems to be the way with the team, we've done it in Kerry and we've done it again today. Conroy was no good in the full-back today. Chris Barrett was excellent when he came on. Rosnarun was right on this one. Liam O'Malley played well today. PS, did anyone really think Monaghan were going to get a goal, because I didn't. And once Aiden O'Shea (who must have heard me roaring a mouthful at him in the first half) put the ball in the net, we had Monaghan on the rack I felt. So overall, I'm happy enough with the way things are progressing this eyar.
I watched it on the internet with a poor picture but I was impressed with Varley, it was nice to see one of our corner forwards been able to win those 50/50 balls. Shemus O'Shea works hard and seems to be able to hit hard which was nice to see as well. The full back line as mentioned is cause for concern especially if Higgins is out for a while. I would read more into the display against Monaghan than the display against Kerry last week, beating a poor Kerry team in the league will lead us to false dawns come the summer. Monaghan will always give you a tough game with the type of hitting that you might expect in a championship game. Lets hope the display in the final 20 minutes is what we will see come June.
Quote from: Peter Solan the Great on March 28, 2010, 06:48:57 PM
Quote from: Cosmo Kramer on March 28, 2010, 06:44:25 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 28, 2010, 06:04:54 PM
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 28, 2010, 04:51:07 PM
Terrible performance. One of the most laboured and ugly Mayo displays in ages.
Mayo had a commanding 25 minutes coming from behind to win easing away in a competitive game, defending well, playing good attacking football and making score after score.
What more can you want at this stage? I would be well pleased with the Mayo bottle after that.
I think all mayo fans will be delighted with the last 20 minutes, but last year we had a habit early in the season of falling way behind in games and having to come back, happened against Donegal, Galway in the league, New York in the championship even. The first half today was as bad as we have been in the last two years, hopefully it was just a blip.
We won't beat Sligo in Markievicz playing like we did today in the first half, that's for sure.
I think we would beat Sligo quite easily on that performance even. We played in first gear for that 1st hand/start of 2nd half and when it really matter the lads upped a gear two and accounted quite easliy for Monaghan, thats something to be admired and johno said after the match on TG4 if we could dominate the game for 70 minutes then we'd have no problems becoming All Ireland champions every year. Its a work in practice its seen what we need to improve on and we have plenty of time to do it.
I think it would be a big mistake to underestimate Sligo. If we play against Sligo like our first half performance today they would take us in Markievicz, it's a totally different environment to playing them in Castlebar. That said, we shouldn't run ourselves down after such a good comeback today, we will beat Sligo if we play anything like we have shown we are capable of over the course of the league. But on an off day they are capable of doing us.
I don't think PSTG is underestimating Sligo. It is possible to be as sluggish as we were in the first half and beat a lot of teams with a very good second half display. Mayo weren't great today but that meant that they were in a situation in the second half where they were being asked serious questions and they came up wirth the answers. I'd prefer that type of win than if we blitzed Monaghan and won at our ease. Mayo players showed a great ability to fight for dirty ball in the second half and that;s a big bonus.
Parsons has serious ability and is a real threat with his running. But his lack of workrate and his poor decision making would have you pulling your hair out.
I thought Parsons did all right today who along with Liam O Mallley caught the eye. I really cant see Aidan o Shea been a focal point for our full forward line come the summer, He just isn't in the same league as donnaghy etc. I know he is young and has a lot to learn, but he was all over the place today. If he is lacking athleticism at 18 what chance has he at 25. Hopefully Higgins isn't too seriously injured, he would be a big loss. Have to say the subs that came on hepled steady the ship and all put in a good shift. A lot of work to be done yet, but we are in good shape heading into the April/May.
O Se has more talent in his big toe than a lot of the other Mayo forwards and does have the athleticism when he chooses to use it. He came alive for a couple of minutes there and he changed the game.
What about the disallowed volleyed goal from Mortimer where the ref said that O'Se had thrown the ball.
Scanned the recording on SKy+ there now looking at possession from kickouts.... not including 2 throw ins from ref and 1 that resulted in line ball
Mayo
1st half - Won possession 12 times ... 4 clean catches, 4 breaking ball and 4 frees (where Mayo man was likely to win the ball but was fouled before he got it).
2nd half - 8 times ..... 5 breaks, 3 clean
Monaghan
1st half - Won possession 10 times ..... 1 clean and 9 breaks
2nd half - 10 times ..... all breaks
Very surprising to see Mayo won more possession than Monaghan from kickouts in the first half and not so in the second !
There were 16 breaking balls off Mayo kickouts - Monaghan won 12 of them (19 break in all to Monaghan, 9 to Mayo) ..... shocking reflection of Mayo half back line mostly and Clarkes 1-D kickout style, i.e.: in a golfing analogy, even if a 9-iron is needed, he has to try and make that shot using the driver but with a little less horse-power). Re the halk back line - breaking ball is a weakness in Trevor Howleys game imho. I watched a recording of the Meath game a week or so after it last year and Howleys positioning on the breaking ball was dreadful time after time - his man (Joe Sheridan - MotM) was always between Howley and where the ball would break. I didn't have time to look in as much detail this evening but would be surprised if it was any different. Why isn't he told about this and coached in that regard. I'll watch again to see how the real culprits are (obviously inclduing all hald back line, midfield, and half forward line) re breaking ball and get back in a day or so.
Of Mayos 7 clean catches (1 was for example a short kickout) - 4 were off Mayo kick outs, 3 off Monaghan kickouts
Mayo never fouled a Monaghan man when they looked likely to win a break. Monaghan however done it 4 times ... smart fouls i call them
That's surprising alright Blast - seemed we were losing every battle in the first half.
The unforced errors were atrocious, T Mort going down to pick up the ball and leaving it behind him, passes to areas of the pitch where neither a Mayo nor a Monaghan man was standing.
If Monaghan had a bit more cutting edge they could have been out of sight. In truth, despite Conroy being completely at sea at full back, Monaghan never really looked like scoring a goal, apart from the shot that was brilliantly blocked by Liam O'Malley.
Much improved second half performance, once we got on top, we looked good and could create scores for ourselves.
The two biggest concerns now are the constant FB question, and Keith Higgins injury.
Conroy can do a job on a big full-forward who gets high ball dropped in on top of him, but as we saw yesterday if it's a quicker full-forward who has low ball sent either side, Conroy hasn't the pace and is turned far too easily.
So if we're playing horses-for-courses between himself and Cafferkey, Conroy was the wrong horse for the wrong course yesterday. Alan Feeney was warming up but was unused, so it looks like Johnno doesn't think he's up to it at FB.
If that's the case, then I think Cosmo has a point in calling for Kevin Keane to be drafted in.
If the worst is confirmed and Higgins has done his cruciate, then we have a problem in the corner. In fairness, Chris Barrett is a great player to bring in, but he's a half-back. So do we try him in the corner or move Vaughan back, despite him doing so well in the half backs?
Quote from: Cosmo Kramer on March 28, 2010, 07:23:03 PM
I think it would be a big mistake to underestimate Sligo. If we play against Sligo like our first half performance today they would take us in Markievicz, it's a totally different environment to playing them in Castlebar. That said, we shouldn't run ourselves down after such a good comeback today, we will beat Sligo if we play anything like we have shown we are capable of over the course of the league. But on an off day they are capable of doing us.
I think any team in the land shouldn't underestimate Sligo; ask Kerry if they will do so again. Indeed, I doubt if Galway will either and I'm only referring to last year. For years past Sligo didn't carry league form on to the championships.
Going by the law of averages alone, they are going to come good sometime so and I just hope we won't be the ones to get caught.
Right now, I wouldn't worry about them too much as we prepare for Cork and at this stage of the league every game counts. Put it another way; I'd much prefer facing Sligo as league champions rather than as also rans.
Monaghan must be feeling gutted this morning and are surely wondering how they let yesterday's game slip away from them. I wouldn't say they were unlucky as victory was theirs for the taking for three quarters of the game.
It was gratifying to see Mayo hanging in and never losing their shape until the tide turned their way. I know there were lots of things that will concern Johnno but in team building and confidence it was a most useful exercise.
However, on thing struck me about yesterday's display by Mayo and it is that none of the 'vets' in action stepped up to the mark. It was a day that cried out for leadership on the field. I thought none of the experienced hands could be faulted for lack of effort and Trevor in particular tried hard all through but not one of them made any sustained effort to rally the younger lads while the going was rough.
Maybe it's just me but it seemed all through that it would be up to the likes of Vaughan and Varley as well as Ronny and Tom Parsons to save the day. The two O'Sheas are coming along nicely as well and so is McLoughlin. I couldn't fault any of the other younger lads and I think they all benefitted greatly as a result of yesterday's game.
I'm more convinced than ever that John O'Mahony knows that it will only be when he has a team of his own making that Mayo will become serious AI contenders. (I know that's a bit convoluted.)
Right now, he seems to be ticking the right boxes and his team is coming along just fine.
Very pleased with reaction of Mayo team in the final quarter when it looked as if we were going to throw away the possibility of a league final place. I still maintain as I did after the Galway game that Cafferkey needs to be given time to bed in at full back. Neither Conroy or Feeney are options and K. Keane didnt even make full back on the u-21 team. Cafferkey like K Cahill in 95, 96 is prone to error but this is technically the most difficult position to fill and it cant be done without experience. Centre-bck is imho a greater problem. Howley does not do the primary job well enough. He is poorly placed for breaking ball, a poor tackler in that bigger men have no problem rounding him, and lacking pace. He is totally committed and might be more suited to the corner.
I would like to see Conroy given a game at centre back. He is physically more imposing, a good ball player who doesnt give away possession and a great linkman.
Despite our good scoring in the final quarter our forward line is still unbalanced . If McGarrity is to return at midfield I would like to see a forward line of Moran, S O Shea, Trevor, Dillon/Ronnie A O Shea and Conor/Varley. We cant afford the luxury of 4 small forwards at the one time.
Finally I am once again disgusted by the antics of some of our so called supporters who hurl all sorts of abuse at our own players when thing are going wrong. A O Shea has been the target in recent weeks. He is still just a rookie learning the trade. He has been trying hard but no doubt anxiety has caused him to fumble etc at crucial stages. It might be no harm for supporters to remember that Donaghy was well into his 20s before he got a chance with Kerry and Tommy Walsh took 2 to three seasons to bed into a Kerry team which was well established.
All in all we are making progress. Patience is needed now more than ever.
Delighted that we were able to play 10/15 minutes of good football but what went before it was really putrid. Still, 5 wins in the league is a great achievement by the lads given that we faced a very tough fixture list with 4 games on the road. Division 1 is the only place to be developing footballers and the winning habit is a good habit for those younger lads involved.
We are far from the finished article though and I think Mayo supporters realise that. The players sometimes think they can waltz throw a game as if they have a bundle of All Ireland medals in their pockets and that lack of focus/desire is frustrating and gets us into trouble. If we the Monaghan attitude coupled with our skill we could be thinking of City West. As it is it is all shaping up to be a very exciting tussle with Sligo (who are going well) - with the greatest of respect we should beat them - and then a battle royale against Galway. Both teams need to look beyhond Connacht though.
Any news on Keith Higgins? His loss would be immeasureable and I don't know how we could compensate for that even taking into account his flaws as a corner back. It is another converted wing-back we would have to look to whether that be Barrett, moving Howley back, or even McLoughlin. Without Peadar Gardiner for all his flaws we would be down the two senior members of the back line for Sligo game and this will then be the 3rd championship which Higgins will have missed through injury. Vaughan is not an option in the corner in my opinion - his weaknesses here have been shown up. Liam O'Malley is flying - I know I have been extremely critical of him in the past but he was excellent yesterday - I do not think a leopard changes its spots and would still have major concerns come the Summer.
Conroy is not a full-back - Cafferkey has to be restored. That is the option the management went with - it is too late to try anything else here.
I would also be moving Andy Moran back to wing back. He played his best football there last year. He is too stagnant in the half-forward line and predictable. Let him try and drive the team from the back.
I don't know what Trevor Mort was doing yesterday but it definitely was less pretty than his usual contribution and that is saying something. Still the improvement of Ronaldson and the Varley option are great benefits of this league. Add in Kilcoyne and Harte and possibly Barry Moran and we have potentially a good forward unit.
What will happen when McGarrity comes back will also be interesting.
I know many say that it doesn't matter whether we make the Final or not. Two games against Cork would be invaluable and I think we should be going all out to claim a national title. We can only win 3 trophies every year. People rubbish the League; others rubbish the Connacht Championship - Sam is the be all and end all for most. Yes, it is the ultimate aim but the benefit of winning a national league for many of the younger lads would be immeasureable and added to their u21 All Ireland medals would be a winning culture that can serve us well. I would guess the Final will be in Croker if it is Mayo/Cork - wouldn't be more than 15,000 there. Personally I would play it at one of the provincial venues (God knows enough money was spent on them) - encourage a big crowd rather than playing it in an empty soulless Croke Park. Or better still take the gamble and toss for home venue. Hopefully the scenario arises.
Does anybody think McHale Park is now a dead and eerie place for League games with the new stand. You used to get a great atmosphere and apparently there were 7,000 there yesterday but things never got going at all - even with dire games we would be losing the run of ourselves with a few scores!
Anyway role on Pairc Ui Rinn.
Quote from: mrhardyannual on March 29, 2010, 03:11:39 PM
Very pleased with reaction of Mayo team in the final quarter when it looked as if we were going to throw away the possibility of a league final place. I still maintain as I did after the Galway game that Cafferkey needs to be given time to bed in at full back. Neither Conroy or Feeney are options and K. Keane didnt even make full back on the u-21 team. Cafferkey like K Cahill in 95, 96 is prone to error but this is technically the most difficult position to fill and it cant be done without experience. Centre-bck is imho a greater problem. Howley does not do the primary job well enough. He is poorly placed for breaking ball, a poor tackler in that bigger men have no problem rounding him, and lacking pace. He is totally committed and might be more suited to the corner.
I would like to see Conroy given a game at centre back. He is physically more imposing, a good ball player who doesnt give away possession and a great linkman.
Despite our good scoring in the final quarter our forward line is still unbalanced . If McGarrity is to return at midfield I would like to see a forward line of Moran, S O Shea, Trevor, Dillon/Ronnie A O Shea and Conor/Varley. We cant afford the luxury of 4 small forwards at the one time.
Finally I am once again disgusted by the antics of some of our so called supporters who hurl all sorts of abuse at our own players when thing are going wrong. A O Shea has been the target in recent weeks. He is still just a rookie learning the trade. He has been trying hard but no doubt anxiety has caused him to fumble etc at crucial stages. It might be no harm for supporters to remember that Donaghy was well into his 20s before he got a chance with Kerry and Tommy Walsh took 2 to three seasons to bed into a Kerry team which was well established.
All in all we are making progress. Patience is needed now more than ever.
That drives me crazy. Remember the Einsteins who abused CMcD into exile after a league game with Fermanagh.
QuoteQuoteFinally I am once again disgusted by the antics of some of our so called supporters who hurl all sorts of abuse at our own players when thing are going wrong. A O Shea has been the target in recent weeks. He is still just a rookie learning the trade. He has been trying hard but no doubt anxiety has caused him to fumble etc at crucial stages. It might be no harm for supporters to remember that Donaghy was well into his 20s before he got a chance with Kerry and Tommy Walsh took 2 to three seasons to bed into a Kerry team which was well established.
All in all we are making progress. Patience is needed now more than ever.
That drives me crazy. Remember the Einsteins who abused CMcD into exile after a league game with Fermanagh.
I had one of those sitting behind me yesterday. Nearly drove me daft in the first half. I know it was a brutal display at that stage, but this fella seemed to be one of those who actually enjoys when Mayo are playing badly so he can have a good ould moan. When the Monaghan full-back was lamping over those monster frees yer man was roaring down "Are you watching that O'Mahony!?". What did he expect O'Mahony to do - buy the full-back on a transfer market??
QuoteDoes anybody think McHale Park is now a dead and eerie place for League games with the new stand. You used to get a great atmosphere and apparently there were 7,000 there yesterday but things never got going at all - even with dire games we would be losing the run of ourselves with a few scores!
Where were you sitting? I was up the back in the middle of the stand, and I actually thought there was a very good atmosphere - particularly in the 2nd half. I'd imagine if you were in the terrace which doesn't get as full anymore, then it would be a bit dead alright.
did you tell him to shut up? I seen liam mchale being lambasted by a mayo jerseyed fan in Croke Park, anotherfella tore into the abuser and he was a very quiete man for the remainder.
Is it me or is Aidan O'Shea extremely one-paced. I thought he was desperate yesterday. Someone would want to tell him to get out of the gym and start running. He's only 20 yet he looked about 40 on the pitch. He's obviously angling for the move to the AFL with the bulking up he has done. He seems like hes fucked if he makes a little burst at all. I think the fact that he got the goal (which he took well) has glossed over a very sub-standard display. I would take him out of the team and tell him to get fit. His celebration for the goal was the sign of a young player who has believed all the hype.
He could take a leaf out of Seamus's book. He has battled well to get into team and is there to stay.
Foreverhopeful - I find it hard to believe AOS is beginning to believe the hype. He has received very little other than criticism so far this year - and deservedly so. However, I still believe he has great potential and needs good management over the next couple of years until he matures sufficiently as an IC player.
Good win for Mayo and next weekend's game against Cork should be a good one. Mayo should definitely be targeting a league final as a national final against Cork in CP would give the management a fair idea of exactly where Mayo are. Galway and Sligo are shaping up as well so Connacht should provide Mayo with some stern tests prior to the real business at QF stage (should they get there). Anyway good to see Mayo going well and hopefully it will keep lads off the managements back for a few weeks.
Quote from: Barney on March 29, 2010, 03:24:47 PM
Delighted that we were able to play 10/15 minutes of good football but what went before it was really putrid. Still, 5 wins in the league is a great achievement by the lads given that we faced a very tough fixture list with 4 games on the road. Division 1 is the only place to be developing footballers and the winning habit is a good habit for those younger lads involved.
We are far from the finished article though and I think Mayo supporters realise that. The players sometimes think they can waltz throw a game as if they have a bundle of All Ireland medals in their pockets and that lack of focus/desire is frustrating and gets us into trouble. If we the Monaghan attitude coupled with our skill we could be thinking of City West. As it is it is all shaping up to be a very exciting tussle with Sligo (who are going well) - with the greatest of respect we should beat them - and then a battle royale against Galway. Both teams need to look beyhond Connacht though.
Any news on Keith Higgins? His loss would be immeasureable and I don't know how we could compensate for that even taking into account his flaws as a corner back. It is another converted wing-back we would have to look to whether that be Barrett, moving Howley back, or even McLoughlin. Without Peadar Gardiner for all his flaws we would be down the two senior members of the back line for Sligo game and this will then be the 3rd championship which Higgins will have missed through injury. Vaughan is not an option in the corner in my opinion - his weaknesses here have been shown up. Liam O'Malley is flying - I know I have been extremely critical of him in the past but he was excellent yesterday - I do not think a leopard changes its spots and would still have major concerns come the Summer.
Conroy is not a full-back - Cafferkey has to be restored. That is the option the management went with - it is too late to try anything else here.
I would also be moving Andy Moran back to wing back. He played his best football there last year. He is too stagnant in the half-forward line and predictable. Let him try and drive the team from the back.
I don't know what Trevor Mort was doing yesterday but it definitely was less pretty than his usual contribution and that is saying something. Still the improvement of Ronaldson and the Varley option are great benefits of this league. Add in Kilcoyne and Harte and possibly Barry Moran and we have potentially a good forward unit.
What will happen when McGarrity comes back will also be interesting.
I know many say that it doesn't matter whether we make the Final or not. Two games against Cork would be invaluable and I think we should be going all out to claim a national title. We can only win 3 trophies every year. People rubbish the League; others rubbish the Connacht Championship - Sam is the be all and end all for most. Yes, it is the ultimate aim but the benefit of winning a national league for many of the younger lads would be immeasureable and added to their u21 All Ireland medals would be a winning culture that can serve us well. I would guess the Final will be in Croker if it is Mayo/Cork - wouldn't be more than 15,000 there. Personally I would play it at one of the provincial venues (God knows enough money was spent on them) - encourage a big crowd rather than playing it in an empty soulless Croke Park. Or better still take the gamble and toss for home venue. Hopefully the scenario arises.
Does anybody think McHale Park is now a dead and eerie place for League games with the new stand. You used to get a great atmosphere and apparently there were 7,000 there yesterday but things never got going at all - even with dire games we would be losing the run of ourselves with a few scores!
Anyway role on Pairc Ui Rinn.
You were going so well and then you said that! For God's sake I hope O'Mahony doesn't do that again - Andy is not a back and never will be. I would have him at wing half forward on my championship team and nowhere else. For the first 3 or 4 rounds of the league he was probably our best player, I think he will be important this summer. I would say the player in our half forward line who should feel most under pressure is Trevor. I know he's captain but that wasn't good enough yesterday. His aimless soloing into tackles will always cause us problems against teams who crowd the defence, and i can't see him changing at this stage of his career. After Parsons' performance yesterday, something has to give on McGarrity's return and I would drop Trevor, have him to bring on to run the legs off tired defenders in the last 20 if needed.
As regards McHale Park, I used to prefer going to Ballinrobe and Crossmolina for league games (never fancied Stephenites or Charlestown for some reason) but given the investment in the stand and the sale of season tickets, that's where the games are going to be. You could make a case for closing the rest of the ground on league match days and just putting everyone in the stand. That would keep the atmosphere up a bit. But then I know people who wont sit in the stand even if it's pissing down, others who always want to go behind whatever goal Mayo are playing into etc., so there would be complaints then as well I'm sure.
Quote from: mrhardyannual on March 29, 2010, 03:11:39 PM
Finally I am once again disgusted by the antics of some of our so called supporters who hurl all sorts of abuse at our own players when thing are going wrong. A O Shea has been the target in recent weeks. He is still just a rookie learning the trade. He has been trying hard but no doubt anxiety has caused him to fumble etc at crucial stages. It might be no harm for supporters to remember that Donaghy was well into his 20s before he got a chance with Kerry and Tommy Walsh took 2 to three seasons to bed into a Kerry team which was well established.
To be fair, theres a few of those in every county and unfortunately we're no exception. I think the players understand that it is the minority who are idiots and that the real fans want to get behind the team. Gardiner's comments on Mayo fans after the Connacht Final last year were a nice touch and showed that the players do appreciate the support they get and can ignore the idiots.
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 29, 2010, 06:20:06 PM
Is it me or is Aidan O'Shea extremely one-paced. I thought he was desperate yesterday. Someone would want to tell him to get out of the gym and start running. He's only 20 yet he looked about 40 on the pitch. He's obviously angling for the move to the AFL with the bulking up he has done. He seems like hes fucked if he makes a little burst at all. I think the fact that he got the goal (which he took well) has glossed over a very sub-standard display. I would take him out of the team and tell him to get fit. His celebration for the goal was the sign of a young player who has believed all the hype.
He could take a leaf out of Seamus's book. He has battled well to get into team and is there to stay.
My view of his celebration is that it was a case of a very frustrated player letting go a bit once something finally went for him, I don't think he's hyping himself up or anything. I'm just guessing though. He can forget about the AFL on his current form, at the moment I would think that Shine and Conroy would be more attractive to the Aussies from a Connacht perspective than O'Shea.
Lads give Aidan O'Shea a break. For Christ's sake he's only 19. He's playing poorly and the frustrations that has built up came gushing out in the celebration after the goal - to suggest that it was him believing the hype is ridiculous. I used to think people exaggerated about how demanding Mayo supporters are. Now, I'm not to sure. We could go into lengthy analysis of things but the bottom line is this - he's a serious prospect who is going through some bad form at the moment. Be patient, it's only March for Heaven's sake.
I agree with not playing Andy Moran at half back, ever. By all means play him in the Dooher role or whatever but I wouldn't like to see him responsible for a proper forward.
Also agree that people should lay off Aiden O'Shea. See my comment re CMcD. He needs confidence not abuse. I'd suggest Barry Moran at 14 and Aiden at 15 for a few games. That would put extreme pressure for the other 4 places though.
lads for christ's sake your saying he is only 19 yet he cant run. Thats my biggest problem with him. I do think he is a good footballer but he has to work very hard on his footwork. I wouldn't let him near a weights bench for the rest of the year. If he wants to keep going with the bulking up then fair play to him but he is a shadow of the athlete he was in 08'.
I would try him at no.11 for a sustained period. Bring in Barry Moran or Ronan to full.
What do ye think of Seamie O'Shea as a no.6?? I think he would be excellent. Big,strong, we know he can move with the ball. Would be a massive road-block there for teams running through. He reminds me of Canty. He will definitely start in the championship but where? This would allow Howley to move to corner back with Higgins presumably gone
Is there any sign of Tom Cunniffe?
Lads, while a lot of focus has been on our forwards, our full back line is now the biggest area of concern. Kieran Conroy and Ger Cafferkey have both been struggling at full back and now keith higgins injured.
Mayo v Monaghan highlights available to view here for anyone who is overseas and can't access RTE Player.
http://beo.tg4.ie/main.aspx?level=sport&content=62477945857
Actually, it's just Mayo highlights really, they show about one Monaghan score...
Muppet I think we need to forget about Barry Moran - he has missed too many important matches through injuries and when he gets a run of games like last Summer he gets injured at the crucial stage.
As a player he has a lot to offer but it is nearly 12 months since he played intercounty football and he has played about 3/4 matches in the last 2 or 3 years. Its an awful pity but some people are just not built for top class sport.
I would never describe Andy Moran as a top class half-back but I think he is better there than on the wing. He certainly isn't tracking back as much as he should be - maybe that is by design of management than his own decision. I have only seen the home games this year but he was certainly poor against the Dubs and against Monaghan.
What the hell is the answer with our full back line though? I don't there are hidden gems JOM is missing?
Quote from: Cosmo Kramer on March 29, 2010, 10:03:10 PM
Mayo v Monaghan highlights available to view here for anyone who is overseas and can't access RTE Player.
http://beo.tg4.ie/main.aspx?level=sport&content=62477945857
Actually, it's just Mayo highlights really, they show about one Monaghan score...
Sound Cosmo, RTE player is a joke the way you can't watch it overseas. Sunday Sport is put up on youtube usually a week behind games which isn't too bad i suppose.
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 29, 2010, 09:11:59 PM
lads for christ's sake your saying he is only 19 yet he cant run. Thats my biggest problem with him. I do think he is a good footballer but he has to work very hard on his footwork. I wouldn't let him near a weights bench for the rest of the year. If he wants to keep going with the bulking up then fair play to him but he is a shadow of the athlete he was in 08'.
I would try him at no.11 for a sustained period. Bring in Barry Moran or Ronan to full.
What do ye think of Seamie O'Shea as a no.6?? I think he would be excellent. Big,strong, we know he can move with the ball. Would be a massive road-block there for teams running through. He reminds me of Canty. He will definitely start in the championship but where? This would allow Howley to move to corner back with Higgins presumably gone
Is there any sign of Tom Cunniffe?
Why would we want to do this? As far as I recollect he has no experience playing there. And before anybody brings up U21 final v Armagh, he was the free man at the back that day due to Armagh's tactics and so handled a sight of ball but did nt have a marking job to do. Tracking and turning is not his forte, punching forward is. 5,6 or 7 is the place for him.
I d leave Andy where he is and if I was to relocate any of the forwards it would be Trevor to wing back or even 6 might be worth a look.
As we struggle against packed defenses that push up a big target man is essential. There was space in behind all day yesterday but the ball was nt sticking. We still could have had 2 more goals as it is. Aiden O Sé needs to concentrate on his handling drills. He was getting his hands to enough ball but was spilling it. For me its a concentration thing - he s probably thinking too far ahead and what he wants to do with the ball. The only other thing wrong is that he s carrying too much weight. That easily sorted - diet and running. Playing Barry Moran loses a small forward but it could be the right thing to do. Because of the right foot and left foot free takers its Dillon and 1 from Varley/Mort for me with Varley as of now the man in possession.
Yesterday we were a rabble for a long time as a team but individually we were nt doing so badly. I think we re being a bit harsh on Conroy. He looked better than a few years ago. Ok he was rounded a couple of times but his man was getting good ball to run onto and will be a handful for even the most experienced backs. If anything the last few weeks have seen backs around the country being scutched. Anyway we don't have many options at this stage with what we have in the panel.
Management should consider a panel shuffle maybe. Lee Keegan was doing water-boy the last day. Good young player but does anybody think he ll get championship time this year. Ditto Mikey Sweeney. Chris Barrett is doing very well for us and Kevin McLoughlin finished strong yesterday. management have a lot of players that can play but there isn't an assured corner man or full back in the panel, let alone in the teaml. What to do? The simple solution will not happen of course. Management should eat humble pie and beg Aiden Higgins to come back for the Summer like I m Sure Jack O Connor is doing with Michael McCarty. Aiden is quite simply the best 2,3,4 or 6 available. The other thing is to get Kevin Keane - he plays in the fb line, the rest can't. O Malley goin well now but we ve seen that before. Until he does it for a summer the doubts will remain.
I think it was Lar Naparke that said the older heads did not stand up and be counted and Johnno will eventually have to wait til he he has a team all of his own creation before things really happen. For me yesterday the 2 best players that we had were Dillon and Keith H. They are the 2 class players in the team period imo and the fact that we won without them says a lot though not sure exactly what. That Dillon is injury prone and Keith looked in bad trouble yesterday is very worrying. Oh and Andy finished out the game well yesterday. At lest we re finishing strong this year.
I think we won yesterday because the team learned to deal with the problem they faced and came up with the solution. We got more men deeper behind the ball in the second half and created overlaps on the counterattack. In other words we beat them at their own game. I would be happier if management had come up with this strategy earlier rather than having it just happen, as appeared to be the case. The Dublin game should have been the wake up call. Monaghan also tired and playing that kind of game need to have the game won well before the hour mark. The excellent Clerkin and Finlay hardly touched the ball last 15 mins but were like magnets for the first 50 mins. A very useful experience this for everybody if they learn from it.Not every team comes out and goes toe to toe like Kerry did in Tralee. We also need to experience what Cork have. We shouldn't be too apprehensive about this one. Cork have scored goals, same amount as us, but have conceded more. They re also inclined to go off the boil during games. Maybe this is a game to keep tight early because they like to go for the early blitz, and surely will at home.
Any word on Keith Higgins ? It looked bad on TV - Hope he's ok.
Howley was corner back for U-21's in 06 when they won. We desperately need a good corner back and while i would prefer to play Howley elsewhere (no. 10 is where i would have him) i think he is one of the better options in the current panel.
A Higgins should be there but isn't. Crazy stuff.
K Conroy is a verstatile defender but he got shown up when placed on a very good forward who had an ocean of space around him. Conroy will do well against likes of Donaghy & Joe Sheridan and thats why he's needed.
We need to to try Ger Cafferkey elsewhere in the backs. Corner back IMO.
Kevin Keane should be brought in.
Why is Alan Feeney there if not being used? Was he injured recently.
Good to see Chris Barrett doing well. We now have 3 very good options for no. 5 in himself, Vaughan & Gardiner when he returns.
I am concerned about the depth of our backs. Assuming K Higgins is gone then we are in big trouble in the full back line. That is why i see it necessary to suggest Trev Howley as a corner back. Moysider what reshuffle would you do if you were moving trev back into the half backs? I can only presume that it would see Kevin mcloughlin lining up at no.4?
Here's how i would like to see us line up v Cork.
1
D Clarke
2 3 4
T Howley K Keane G Cafferkey
5 6 7
D Vaughan T Mortimer K McLoughlin
11
S O'Shea (sweeper)
8 9
T Parsons R McGarrity
10 14 12
A Dillon Aidan O'Shea A Dillon
13 15
E Varley M Ronaldson
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 29, 2010, 11:03:05 PM
Howley was corner back for U-21's in 06 when they won. We desperately need a good corner back and while i would prefer to play Howley elsewhere (no. 10 is where i would have him) i think he is one of the better options in the current panel.
A Higgins should be there but isn't. Crazy stuff.
K Conroy is a verstatile defender but he got shown up when placed on a very good forward who had an ocean of space around him. Conroy will do well against likes of Donaghy & Joe Sheridan and thats why he's needed.
We need to to try Ger Cafferkey elsewhere in the backs. Corner back IMO.
Kevin Keane should be brought in.
Why is Alan Feeney there if not being used? Was he injured recently.
Good to see Chris Barrett doing well. We now have 3 very good options for no. 5 in himself, Vaughan & Gardiner when he returns.
I am concerned about the depth of our backs. Assuming K Higgins is gone then we are in big trouble in the full back line. That is why i see it necessary to suggest Trev Howley as a corner back. Moysider what reshuffle would you do if you were moving trev back into the half backs? I can only presume that it would see Kevin mcloughlin lining up at no.4?
Here's how i would like to see us line up v Cork.
1
D Clarke
2 3 4
T Howley K Keane G Cafferkey
5 6 7
D Vaughan T Mortimer K McLoughlin
11
S O'Shea (sweeper)
8 9
T Parsons R McGarrity
10 14 12
A Dillon Aidan O'Shea A Dillon
13 15
E Varley M Ronaldson
Christ I dunno what to do with Trevor. I think he played injured yesterday from the throw-in after he took a wild pull at the ball. He played like a drain after. It s only March and Trevor has been around long enough to know that. Still, like against Dublin, when Trevor starts wild the whole team gets the jitters. He is the heart and soul of the team, that is why he is captain. Its unthinkable to drop him but how to use him to best effect?
If I was manager I would look at him again in the half back line because he does too many silly things in the forwards.
I honestly don t think Howley has the necessary for cb. There d be a pile of frees for a start - his recovery when turned is poor. He is programmed to go forward. McLoughlin probably the best in panel at the moment to play in the corner and it may suit him better at this stage to do a marking job. He s still a light lad for the championship playing between the 45s - he s not imposing himself yet winning hard ball around the middle. It was noticeable yesterday that he came into his own yesterday when Mayo gained the initiative and the game was stretched. As of now I would go something like this.
Clarke
Higgins Keane McLoughlin
Vaughan/Cafferkey/ Barrett 'Trevor' Howley
O Sé McGarrity
Parsons Dillon Andy
Varley Moran O Sé
There would be considerable impact from bench as well with likes of Ronnie, Mort, Conroy,Harte
Where have you all been hiding? You must been shaking with fear, struck dumb before the game,
then you all come out of the woodwork and the floodgates open for pages and pages of prose.
You weren't all this excited after the Kerry game.
Quote from: orangeman on March 29, 2010, 10:53:59 PM
Any word on Keith Higgins ? It looked bad on TV - Hope he's ok.
I was a good way from the incident and thought it was an ankle and was nt too bothered. Ye can do stuff with an ankle. Saw the highlights last night and it was obviously a knee twisting. That people heard a snap is ominous but hopefully that was something else. We ll know after the scan but for what its worth (and it might nt be worth a lot) there s word from within that it might 't be too serious. Fingers crossed. Saw a young fella stretchered off a few weeks ago after something similar and thought his year was over. He trained a week later and a scan showed no serious damage. Yet at the time he had a sharp pain in the knee and was straight onto crutches with his summer being written off.
Quote from: Main Street on March 29, 2010, 11:35:02 PM
Where have you all been hiding? You must been shaking with fear, struck dumb before the game,
then you all come out of the woodwork and the floodgates open for pages and pages of prose.
You weren't all this excited after the Kerry game.
We don t get excited any more Main Street. Obviously we did nt know what to expect before the Monaghan game. Of course that s not quite true. We knew that Banty and his team would bring their usual game - and a very good game it is too. Some of us would hope at this stage, would even expect that Mayo would have a way of dealing with it. No chance of that Playing into the wind in the first half we made no attempt to deliberately get men back and our much maligned backs had to make do. In the second half we evolved a swarm intelligence as a result of Monaghan exerting early pressure and our enforced backs- to- the-wall approach turned the game on its head as we are set up to counterattack ourselves. But none of it was preconceived. Wasn't a tactic. It might get you by this time of year but later on when the tactics are vital I would fear for us again. Because in my experience Mayo always have to be the best team on the day, while other serious teams take steps to make sure they give themselves every chance of winning a game. This is the thing about this Mayo team( and Mayo teams of the past I remember tbh). Can play a bit but tactically not the most astute.
i don't know how you can put cafferkey as a no. 5 tbh. There are better options there. Ger isn't good enough on the ball. The accuracy of his passing from the foot isn't great. Vaughan and Barrett provide better options and can give you a point or two a game ala Peadar Gardiner. Could you see Caf taking the point Vaughan got y-day or the goal. No - nose bleed territory for Caf unfortunately. I do think he would do a job at corner back.
I think that Mcloughlin may be best served in the corner this year the more i think of it. He is very light and it would be better for him to be in the corner. He would be one of the better options. He will, in a very short space of time, become one the focal points in this mayo team but for now he should prob serve his apprenticeship in the corner. Big ask for him to be in around some of the giants of the game in the middle third.
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 30, 2010, 12:16:35 AM
i don't know how you can put cafferkey as a no. 5 tbh. There are better options there. Ger isn't good enough on the ball. The accuracy of his passing from the foot isn't great. Vaughan and Barrett provide better options and can give you a point or two a game ala Peadar Gardiner. Could you see Caf taking the point Vaughan got y-day or the goal. No - nose bleed territory for Caf unfortunately. I do think he would do a job at corner back.
I think that Mcloughlin may be best served in the corner this year the more i think of it. He is very light and it would be better for him to be in the corner. He would be one of the better options. He will, in a very short space of time, become one the focal points in this mayo team but for now he should prob serve his apprenticeship in the corner. Big ask for him to be in around some of the giants of the game in the middle third.
To be honest I think that it s unlikely that Caff will be no 1 choice for any jersey at this stage. I put him down as an option for 5 but at this stage he s caught between a rock and a hard place. I believed from the start trying to make him into a full back would do him no good in the long run. I ve said it here often enough and I doubt many know his game better. I should. Younger he looked like a 6 in the making but necessity meant he was used as a 3 because he could cope there well underage while others couldn't at all. Hopefully he ll recover from this and play in a position that suits his abilities. He s a great lad to cover ground when he bursts onto ball. I would have seen him as a probable successor to James Nallen. I don t know how anybody could have seen him as an adult full back.
jesus Lads your hard pleased. some Crazy stuff being suggested. I suppose that the Difference between being a manager and a keyboard Warrior.
Top of the league and you want to change every single one of the backs including 3 people in one position a slighly wayward forward and a player who has never played a senior game for mayo.
If JOM did that and lost he would be rightly strung up from the nearest lamppost.
Having said that i would like to see keane given a run at full back. He looked Very assured in the u21 match and hes an out and out defender unlike the many wannabe attackers mayo seem to favour. Cafferkey is Just not an option at the moment and has shown nothing to suggest he will be .even Shane Mchale would be a better bet . most likely though Conroy will fill in and do a very good job in certain Circumstances but would need to develop very quickly if he wants to be there come summer.
Assuming all fit i would consider the following definite starters
Clarke
Liam omalley ??? K higgins
P gardiner T howley K mclouglin
??? ???
Andy A dillon T mortimer
E varley A osé ???
In other words i think the only debate is over full back, midfield and corner forward
or possibly as early in the league Seamie and 11 leaving dillion at 15 and Ronan and tom at centre field
which would just leave us a Full back short of winning SAM
Full back options conroy, Keane Cafferkey(wouldnt it be great to have BJP as a back up or following up the left field suggestions David Kicullen)
and on current Known form Conroy is our best performer
would love to see Ronaldson playing but he too similar to dillion who cant be dropped if fit at least It eases our dependence on Dillion
if so many people can see Kevin Keane as a very possible answer to our full-back problem then why hasn't he been called into the panel. why is JOM so blinkered on these matters?
We seem well-equipped at half back so maybe Lee Keegan could be dropped for Keane.
Ger McDonagh and Mikey Sweeney are not going to offer us anything of impact from the bench so they could be axed from official squad. Let them train away with squad if they want for the experience (don't see Sweeney as a prospect -sorry)
With the leagues starting in mayo this weekend we will hear more names being thrown in the hat i.e. A Higgins, D Kilcullen, A Campbell, J Kilcullen - Take 3 out of these 4 instead of Ger McDonagh, Lee Keegan & Mikey Sweeney and that is one impressive panel Mayo will have going into the championship.
I wonder is BJP still playing away. Don't think he's the worst option to have on the bench. Very clever and versatile footballer.
Quote from: rosnarun on March 30, 2010, 12:38:09 AM
jesus Lads your hard pleased. some Crazy stuff being suggested. I suppose that the Difference between being a manager and a keyboard Warrior.
Top of the league and you want to change every single one of the backs including 3 people in one position a slighly wayward forward and a player who has never played a senior game for mayo.
If JOM did that and lost he would be rightly strung up from the nearest lamppost.
Having said that i would like to see keane given a run at full back. He looked Very assured in the u21 match and hes an out and out defender unlike the many wannabe attackers mayo seem to favour. Cafferkey is Just not an option at the moment and has shown nothing to suggest he will be .even Shane Mchale would be a better bet . most likely though Conroy will fill in and do a very good job in certain Circumstances but would need to develop very quickly if he wants to be there come summer.
Assuming all fit i would consider the following definite starters
Clarke
Liam omalley ??? K higgins
P gardiner T howley K mclouglin
??? ???
Andy A dillon T mortimer
E varley A osé ???
In other words i think the only debate is over full back, midfield and corner forward
or possibly as early in the league Seamie and 11 leaving dillion at 15 and Ronan and tom at centre field
which would just leave us a Full back short of winning SAM
Full back options conroy, Keane Cafferkey(wouldnt it be great to have BJP as a back up or following up the left field suggestions David Kicullen)
and on current Known form Conroy is our best performer
would love to see Ronaldson playing but he too similar to dillion who cant be dropped if fit at least It eases our dependence on Dillion
Why the question marks? Sure that s what this it s all about. Why not pick 3 certainties and leave 12 ? marks. Nothing crazy was suggested by anybody. Only reasonable alternatives. Since when did you become a champion of JOM? Youv'e practically picked the team he does ,apart of course the obvious selection of Dillon as 11. Most counties would clone Dillon for an 11 but we ve just have never appreciated him at all.
Look we all know that there will have to be tweaking for the championship. All teams will be different come championship. I could name you the starting Tyrone 6 backs for the championship( Ricey, McMahon,Carlin, Harte, Gormely, Jordan - with Sean O Neill as cover for 3 positions and the other McMahon to be redeployed as needed.) but with Mayo it still is guess a player, guess his number. You know as well as I do that that what we saw last Sunday will not get us far come championship. So if Johnno does what he s doing now and loses he will get the Il Duce treatment anyway. He d d be well served to go with some suggestions here, but of course he wont. Jut because we re doing well in the league does nt mean damn all. You should know that by know. I notice you left out Vaughan that scores 1-1 from play the last day. And was MoM in a lot of people s estimation. Why is that?
It might also be an issue that of the 11 players you pick 9 are about 5' 8'' - 5'-11''
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 30, 2010, 01:00:42 AM
if so many people can see Kevin Keane as a very possible answer to our full-back problem then why hasn't he been called into the panel. why is JOM so blinkered on these matters?
Keane is a good prospect but he's very young - he didn't get the no 3 jersey for the U-21s either.......if you were bringing in somebody new, Kilcullen might be the best bet.....
Great discussion lads. You'd be hoping that by the end of the league we'd be almost closing these questions off, rather than reopening them, but as FF spindoctors would say "we are where we are".
Just to throw another name into the mix that seems to be forgotten, Tom Cunniffe is back training with the squad. I have to say, I think he's a better option than Howley at CB (when on top form at least). He's taller, faster and can turn better than Howley. If Keith is out, we could have Cunniffe at CB and move Howley to the corner, or to the wing with McLoughlin/Barrett in the corner.
Hopefully it doesn't come to that - we should know more about Keith's injury later this morning. Fingers crossed.
From The Mayo News:
QuoteMAYO'S dual star Keith Higgins will find out this morning (Tuesday) just how long he will be on the sidelines after sustaining a knee injury during the second half of last Sunday's NFL victory over Monaghan.
The 24 years-old defender was helped off the field after twisting his left knee when he landed awkwardly.
Speaking to The Mayo News last night, Mayo manager John O'Mahony admitted that it will be an anxious wait until the extent of the injury is confirmed.
"Keith is having a scan on Tuesday morning at 10.30am and we'll know more then," he said. "Obviously, there's some damage done but we're keeping our fingers, and toes, crossed that it's not serious. Hopefully, he'll be okay. Keith would be a massive loss to us if there was any long-term damage.
"All the other lads [Aidan Kilcoyne, Barry Moran and Ronan McGarrity] are coming back to fitness so it would be terrible to lose Keith to a long-term injury."
The Ballyhaunis clubman also lined out with the Mayo hurlers last Saturday, turning in an impressive performance and scoring five points during the course of a heavy defeat to London in Division 3A of the NHL.
Meanwhile, Tom Cunniffe returned to full training with the Mayo squad last Thursday night. The Castlebar Mitchels defender, who is currently studying in Liverpool, hasn't played football for almost a year due to a Gilmore's groin injury.
John O'Mahony will also be hoping that all his squad come through next weekend's Mayo GAA league matches unscathed ahead of a trip to Cork on Sunday, April 11.
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 30, 2010, 02:53:35 AM
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 30, 2010, 01:00:42 AM
if so many people can see Kevin Keane as a very possible answer to our full-back problem then why hasn't he been called into the panel. why is JOM so blinkered on these matters?
Keane is a good prospect but he's very young - he didn't get the no 3 jersey for the U-21s either.......if you were bringing in somebody new, Kilcullen might be the best bet.....
Thank you, you beat me to it.
All this talk of Keane is crazy. He had a good season at minor but has a lot to prove to cut it at Senior level.
Arah yea sure no point in bringing anyone until they've gotten at least 3/4 years experience of playing senior football for the county. Just ask Darren Fay in 1996.
Is the gilmore's groin injury anything to Tom Joe ?
Only watched this last night. I though Mayo showed impressive resolve- they'd have lost that game 2 years ago by about 8 points.
Some of the newer players are made of the right stuff from what i can see. No longer solely reliant on Dillon and blondie. Could go quite well this year. I think Galway and Mayo Connacht final will be a cracker this year. Both of them definitely on the up.
So ye want Keane in, cant make the U-21's, no senior experience at all but give him 2 games in the league and he's ready for championship?
As for moving Howley out of CB, another ridiculous one. Howley has been the reason that we've been so tight this spring, he covers acres in the back line, covers every spare man, reads the ball coming in well. He has to work on winning breaking ball but him and Kevin Mc have been our top performers in the league and moving either of them out of the HB line would deprive us of a lot of forward ball.
Moving Andy or Trevor to CB would just be stupid, they are forwards and u want to move them into one of the most important spots on the team?
As for planning for without Higgins, is conroy an option? Other than that barrett?
I think Caff is our only option at FB, he was backed since last yr and he needs time to get experience without being dogged out of it.
Quote from: INDIANA on March 30, 2010, 11:50:19 AM
Only watched this last night. I though Mayo showed impressive resolve- they'd have lost that game 2 years ago by about 8 points.
Some of the newer players are made of the right stuff from what i can see. No longer solely reliant on Dillon and blondie. Could go quite well this year. I think Galway and Mayo Connacht final will be a cracker this year. Both of them definitely on the up.
Do you know what time it is on Indiana?
It is definitely going to be a Ros v Sligo Connacht final this year heineken. And I don't mean U-21s.
I'd doubt it Farrandeelin but sure I suppose ourselves, Letrim or indeed London will turn up on Connacht final day alright, god knows what will happen after that :)
It's kind of mad alright, that the 3 of ye will be in Div 4 next year and contesting this year's Connacht final. On the day anything is possible.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 30, 2010, 10:29:31 AM
Arah yea sure no point in bringing anyone until they've gotten at least 3/4 years experience of playing senior football for the county. Just ask Darren Fay in 1996.
Ok, firstly nobody said anything about 3-4 years experience but calling for Kevin Keane to be thrown in a couple of months before the championship is rubbish talk. Darren Fay was 20 when he burst on the scene in 1996 but he was exceptional. Can you call Kevin Keane exceptional when he was not this years county U21 FB?
If someone cant make the U21 team, what chance have they at Senior this year?
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 30, 2010, 01:04:33 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 30, 2010, 10:29:31 AM
Arah yea sure no point in bringing anyone until they've gotten at least 3/4 years experience of playing senior football for the county. Just ask Darren Fay in 1996.
Ok, firstly nobody said anything about 3-4 years experience but calling for Kevin Keane to be thrown in a couple of months before the championship is rubbish talk. Darren Fay was 20 when he burst on the scene in 1996 but he was exceptional. Can you call Kevin Keane exceptional when he was not this years county U21 FB?
If someone cant make the U21 team, what chance have they at Senior this year?
It was the managers call to put Keane in the corner and McHale at full. Same as it was his call to play Kevin McL at 11 and Nally at midfield. Another manager may have done things differently. Keane was our best defender in that U21 match and looks a better bet going forward that McHale but he too may have something to offer down the road. I believe it was a question of McHale being less versatile and only suited to 3 while Keane was able to play corner. McHale played 5 at minor but looked lost there at times.
What we do know now is that the options for full back line we have at the moment will not be good enough again. We can try and fix it or hope it goes away but it wont go away. We dont know Keane wont work but we already know a couple that def wont. Am I the only one that thinks it a bit strange that Cunniffe is straight back into the panel without having played in over a year - no club form or anything to go on. His form before injury was nt great either.
Quote. Still, like against Dublin, when Trevor starts wild the whole team gets the jitters. He is the heart and soul of the team, that is why he is captain. Its unthinkable to drop him but how to use him to best effect?
If I was manager I would look at him again in the half back line because he does too many silly things in the forwards.
I feel you have summed Trevor very well, moysider. When push comes to shove, I think he is the one they all look to for encouragement and I just can't visualise him ever giving less than his best. But I'd be wary of giving him the no. 5 spot on the basis of "Put the fecker where he'll do least harm."
If heart was all it takes, Trevor would have a sack of All Ireland medals by now. But he does lose his cool when things aren't going well and I'd be very concerned about him giving away scoreable frees too easily if he was playing at chb or thereabouts.
But for me the salient point is that the rest of the team look to him almost exclusively for inspiration and when he starts to get rattled, there is nobody else to take up the slack.
With any of the successful teams I can recall, there has always been a number of characters throughout the field who are or were capable of instinctively raising their game if their talisman was shackled. So, if the Gooch is being kept quiet, Kerry can look to Donaghy or indeed any number of others to take up the running. More or less the same applies to Tyrone and the rest of the high profile teams.
I quite agree that Dillon and Keith Higgins were playing very well until both were unfortunately forced to retire and I can't see Mayo winning anything major without the presence of both- in the near future at any rate.
One can only wish both a speedy and complete recovery both personally and for the good of the team. But, for me anyway, the VIP on the team is David Clarke. I thought he was the one man on Sunday and on many occasions in the past that seemed at ease with his game. From kick outs to interceptions and at marshalling his backs, he seldom puts a foot wrong and he helped greatly to keep Mayo in shape while Monaghan were in the ascendancy last Sunday. I definitely feel that O'Mahony cannot consider going anywhere without Clarke between the posts.
I had expected he would decide that enough was enough at the end of last season-especially after the display against Meath. I feel he has enough of his own faults but he couldn't be blamed for the collective collapse of morale we saw that day.
I'm only echoing Kevin McStay's words when he said that no one was prepared to show for the ball or take on responsibility during the entire game. You can't teach old dogs new tricks and I didn't see any merit in calling for coaching courses for most of the lads on show that day. Still Johnno hung in and it can only be because he sees potential in those who are coming through.
That's why I hope he makes the bare minimum of changes for the next game. Kevin Keane may prove to be a godsend but his time is still to come. I'd feel that throwing him in at the deep end to face Goulding or Lynch or any of the present Cork forwards wouldn't be in his best interests or Mayo's either.
I think Mayo will give Cork one hell of a game next day and I'd go 50/50 on a win.
If some of the older hands show some more initiative and the younger lads continue to sharpen up, it will suffice for me.
Quote from: moysider on March 30, 2010, 01:33:10 PM
Quote from: AbbeySider on March 30, 2010, 01:04:33 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 30, 2010, 10:29:31 AM
Arah yea sure no point in bringing anyone until they've gotten at least 3/4 years experience of playing senior football for the county. Just ask Darren Fay in 1996.
Ok, firstly nobody said anything about 3-4 years experience but calling for Kevin Keane to be thrown in a couple of months before the championship is rubbish talk. Darren Fay was 20 when he burst on the scene in 1996 but he was exceptional. Can you call Kevin Keane exceptional when he was not this years county U21 FB?
If someone cant make the U21 team, what chance have they at Senior this year?
It was the managers call to put Keane in the corner and McHale at full. Same as it was his call to play Kevin McL at 11 and Nally at midfield. Another manager may have done things differently.
Id agree. My theory is it would have been more so one of the selectors call that would have pushed Nally to midfield, at the cost of Jason Gibbons for his own reasons. And it may have been the other selector that would have ensured that McHale was full back at the cost of Keane. ::)
Is it any wonder we underachieved this year with that carry-on.
Quote from: moysider on March 30, 2010, 01:33:10 PM
What we do know now is that the options for full back line we have at the moment will not be good enough again. We can try and fix it or hope it goes away but it wont go away. We dont know Keane wont work but we already know a couple that def wont.
Ill totally agree with that one. We are in serious trouble this year as we dont have many options in the fullback line, and teams will go out to expose that.
I think myself that Conroy and Ger Caff can fill the position of full back on certain days. I think Conroy would be Ok on the likes of Bergan/Donnaughy/Cussan or most big full forwards as he is Ok in the air. He is not a natural defender IMO and is more suited to mid-field but there are days when he can do a job at full back.
I was very impressed with Ger Caff last year and would trust him to play in the corner against pacey forwards and indeed at full back, as long as high balls are not raining in on top of him as fielding is not his strongest point. On current form, Liam O Malley deserves his place. I liked the look of Chris Barrett who really settled into the game very well the last day and took his score with great composure. The variations of the fullback line I would like to see against Cork would be;
Cafferkey, Conroy, Liam, O Malley
Or on certain days
Chris Barrett, Cafferkey, Liam O Malley
Quote from: moysider on March 30, 2010, 01:33:10 PM
Am I the only one that thinks it a bit strange that Cunniffe is straight back into the panel without having played in over a year - no club form or anything to go on. His form before injury was nt great either.
No your not, even seeing his name makes me shudder. Apologies to anyone I insult with that statement but I dont rate him at all. Im surprised as yourself that he is straight back into the panel, was he named on the program? (I cant remember)
@moysider
Did you actually read my post befoe your critique
The ? Marks are the places up for grabs. And i did have dillion at 11. But i thou in an effort to accomdate mcgarr parsons and ose major he may move seamus to 11 like the first few league games.
As for keane not makin the u21 that is some whzt of a distortion he was picked for both games but due to a family funeral didnt play against leitrm ans was the defacto full back against Ros. He is worth a shot and IF you are godd enough you are old enough and cafferkey looks too young
Great news on Keith's knee - he hasn't done the cruciate!
Mid-West (and WJ where I saw it) are reporting that he has sprained his medial ligament. Will probably miss the Cork game, but will be fine for Championship (and maybe the league final :P)
Quote
MAYO FOOTBALL AND HURLING STAR KEITH HIGGINS HAS UNDERGONE AN MRI SCAN TODAY, AFTER HE SUSTAINED A KNEE INJURY IN SUNDAY'S NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE CLASH WITH MONAGHAN.
MAYO MANAGER JOHN O'MAHONY SAYS THE NEWS IS GOOD – WHILE KEITH HAS SUSTAINED A SPRAIN OF THE MEDIAL LIGAMENT, THERE'S NO CRUCIATE DAMAGE.
THE BALLYHAUNIS PLAYER WILL NEED TREATMENT, AND WILL PROBABLY MISS THE CRUCIAL CORK GAME ON SUNDAY WEEK NEXT.
HOWEVER, IF MAYO REACH THE NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE FINAL, JOHN O'MAHONY SAYS KEITH HIGGINS SHOULD BE IN CONTENTION.
QuoteBut, for me anyway, the VIP on the team is David Clarke. I thought he was the one man on Sunday and on many occasions in the past that seemed at ease with his game.
great to see David Clarke being praised. He is an outstanding keeper. Surprised he isn't mentioned more on the National level. He is an incredible shot-stopper and a leader of this team. He would be my captain. He is quiet off the pitch but on it he barks out the orders to the backs and keeps them on their toes.
Keane should at the very least be brought in to the panel. I know that would leave us with 4 full backs but conroy is a utility man covering 3,6,8 &9. Cafferkey needs a shot in the corner.
Would love to see David & James Kilcullen, Aidan Campbell in the panel. Is there any hope??
What is the point in carrying the likes of Ger McDonagh in the panel this year? None IMO. Throw in James Kilcullen to the midfield mix and there will be serious competition in training. Something McGarrity hasn't had in a long time.
I think the sheer pace of Tom Cuniffe is what get's him on the panel. He has a serious turn of pace and JOM obviously sees some use for it. He deserves another chance to see can he nail down a spot on the team. Not sure where tho.
That s as good as news as could be dreamed about re Keith Higgins. We dodged a bullet there. Looked very bad. His ligaments must be made of elastic.
ITs great to see Keith Higgins being mentioned in a game not a month away, the joys of being young and able to take a knock. How is Gardiner coming along?Will Harte be with Mayo this year?
Foreverhopeful
Did Mikey Sweeney tackle your sister or something? You have been going on about him since you came to the board. He is just out of U21's and is still developing, has pace to burn, a good eye for goal but needs to fill out. Knowing the stock he comes from that will happen and in my biased view he is well worth his place in the squad where he could be used in certain games , maybe not all. You dont live up to your name in contantly dismissing the lad.
Joker's Mild
Conor Mortimer has calmed down and is ready to stand up for his county, writes Ewan MacKenna
The west is awake: realising that time is short in his career, Conor Mortimer is now hoping people will be talking about him for the right reasons rather than for the likes of his Michael Jackson tribute in last year's Connacht final
It's getting late and the phone has stayed far too silent for far too long. Conor Mortimer should have called by now but it's been 24 hours and he hasn't gotten back to you with a time or location to meet. Suddenly, well past nightfall and the limits of your hopefulness, the phone goes off. It's a message. "Sorry sham, only back. Been away all day and gym this evening, just got my other phone now. Mort here." You can only laugh because there on the screen is the essence of the man. Just when you think he's pushed you too far, he turns himself back into the loveable rogue.
We meet the next day as he takes a break from job hunting. It hasn't gone well for him but you're still looking forward to the next few hours and his company because Conor Mortimer is always outspoken, never gives a damn and it's been a long time since you've been referred to as sham. In short, he's a rarity in a sport becoming ever more grey in terms of personalities. In fact the last time you crossed paths before the 2006 All Ireland final he finished the interview by saying, "If you ever need anything, just give the Mort a call" while throwing in a wink and a twist of the head for good measure.
In his wild and wacky world, life and football appear to be just two different games to be played and with that mantra in mind you take him back to an incident last April where he and Meath defender Kevin Reilly were hospitalised after being attacked in Ballymun. You ask what exactly happened, throwing in rumours that it kicked off over remarks he made to a girl in pyjamas?
"No comment," he snaps.
But everyone else has their opinion, shouldn't you just say what really happened?
"It's not for the public. It's a private issue. There's nothing to be said on it out of respect for the individuals involved. There was no talk then and there'll be none now. Nobody knows."
You know. You were there.
"Maybe I was there. Maybe I wasn't there."
So it was misreported?
"Don't know. People can think what they want. No comment."
Well on a less serious note then, tell us about Michael Jackson, you say, referring to his RIP t-shirt which he unveiled after scoring a goal in last year's Connacht final.
"I don't see the point in giving it my time. It was just a gag that wasn't an issue for anyone in our squad. People always make big things out of small things when it comes to me. I haven't spoken about it for that reason so no comment chief, and as they say, next question please.
Okay. Next question then. What happened to Conor Mortimer?
"I just realised it's time to put the head down. I wasn't happy with the way last year was from a personal point of view. I'm not 21 years of age anymore. I'll be 28 in May. The hassle I've had over the years and jibes and everything else, you get tired of it. I am a serious footballer and want to be seen as a serious footballer."
Before we meet the new Conor Mortimer, some tales about the old one. Way back in 1999 he was absent for Mayo's run to an All Ireland minor final after a falling out with manager JP Kane. When his county lost that decider he said he was sure they'd have won it if he was there. Soon after he took that same arrogance into the senior squad and in his debut season of 2002 announced to the dressing room he'd be the first man since John Egan to win an All Star in April. Since then, the joker has been ever-present in the pack.
He asked a mouthy goalkeeper his name on the basis he'd like to know who he's talking to when he stitched three goals past him. He told a lippy corner-back he was taking apart that perhaps soccer was his game. In DCU he gave the finger to some UCC fans. When taken off in a qualifier against Limerick he pulled of his jersey and flung it into the crowd. After Mayo were dumped out of the 2008 championship he was asked by the Mayo News what he'd say to people who think the county will never win an All Ireland with him on board and responded, "They won't win one without me either." The list goes on.
But there's been some serious consequences too. In 2002 he was punched from behind when heading to the toilets in a Castlebar pub and before you ask, he doesn't drink. Earlier in the day he missed a simple and crucial free against Galway, a roar went up in the crowd that if Lee Harvey Oswald had been from Mayo then John F Kennedy would still be alive and on that evening's Sunday Game, analysis turned to a ball boy who kicked a free from the same spot when the game was over. In 2005 he was involved in an altercation in Supermac's in Eyre Square after the Connacht final. A year later his car was keyed after the same fixture.
"What can you do? I don't think I was ever doing anything overzealous and still don't. You wear white boots and someone keys your car. I don't get that. But anything out of your control, don't worry about it. When I was younger you'd sometimes wonder what's the point but I'd never let someone's actions determine whether I go somewhere or do something. Playing football is a part of my life and I could never look at it in a negative way. Even if it's all gone way too serious now.
"So because of that, the white boots, all that kind of thing, I'm finished with it. I'm tired of what comes with it and what you have to put up with. It's not hard to settle into this new way either. All you have to do is put all your energy into being the best footballer you can be and not doing silly things that gets the entire country talking. We have a manager in John O'Mahony who has me working harder and being a better player."
But Mortimer has always been a hard worker despite the image he projects. Before the 2004 All Ireland final, his primary principal PJ Dooley recalled how he would solo his way to school when others got lifts. His late grandfather George told a story of how he left Conor off by himself at a new pitch in Headford at 10am one Saturday and didn't pick him up until half-five. Former Mayo player Ray Connolly went one better. When driving through Shrule on the worst day you could imagine he saw a lonely figure making his way through the sleet with a ball in hand. You can guess who it was.
"That's personal work, that's different," says Mortimer now. "Hard work on a team is continuously tackling, making runs, working hard. It's not all about scoring points but there were a number of years when I thought all I had to do was score. You can go out and kick scores on your own any day. But you can't tackle on your own, you need to be part of a team to learn that. And under John O'Mahony I've been learning that."
You get the feeling O'Mahony has played a large part in changing the Mortimer you either loved or hated. Before the 2004 All Ireland semi-final, Joe Kernan was staying in the Mayo team hotel and remembers how he found it odd and worrying that Mortimer was wearing different gear to the rest of the squad. A couple of seasons later when O'Mahony took charge he called Mortimer back into the dressing room and told him to change into the shorts everyone else was wearing for a meagre training night in December.
"I guess I've started to look at it from the point of view of leadership," Mortimer continues. "You don't sense that responsibility coming onto your shoulders but one day the older players are gone and it's there and you have to deal with it. Now I'm ready to step up. As well as that when you have opportunities you have to take them and there's a point where you realise that. Sometimes you'd just cruise through games and seasons but I'm realising now time is short."
His brother Kenneth famously remarked how, after finishing up without an All Ireland to his name, all the Connacht medals and All Stars meant nothing. Conor admits he can finally see where his sibling is coming from. It's why during his four-and-a-half months in Thailand, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa over the turn of the year he was running three times a week and hitting the gym twice, all of which left him in fine shape and saw him leave the bench to hit four crucial points against Kerry last weekend.
"It was nice to get back into the swing of things and to have people talking about you for the right reasons. Over the years I guess people are entitled to their opinion but my reasons to do things are not for people's knowledge. And I don't particularly regret anything I did or said. Where am I in life, if I started worrying about all the things that got people's attention then I'd be a nervous wreck. So I just get on. But it's not about me or how I changed. You have to understand that. It's about Mayo and I want to be part of that cog one way or another."
He's getting ready to leave and unlike our last parting there's no wink, no smart words or no cheeky grin. You tell him he's changed and you're not sure how people will react to the new and quieter Conor Mortimer. But he doesn't care. He just wants it to make him a better footballer across the years he has left at the top.
Sunday Tribune 29/3/2010
Quote from: rosnarun on March 30, 2010, 02:54:27 PM
@moysider
Did you actually read my post befoe your critique
The ? Marks are the places up for grabs. And i did have dillion at 11. But i thou in an effort to accomdate mcgarr parsons and ose major he may move seamus to 11 like the first few league games.
As for keane not makin the u21 that is some whzt of a distortion he was picked for both games but due to a family funeral didnt play against leitrm ans was the defacto full back against Ros. He is worth a shot and IF you are godd enough you are old enough and cafferkey looks too young
Yeah I did read it. And like I had I was acknowledging your selection of Dillon at 11. But if ? are positions up for grabs how is it that no 5 is filled. Surely on form Vaughan is the man in possession of this jersey and must be favoured to keep it with Barrett to challenge for it. As for midfield, they re not up for grabs. In fact they re 2 of the more predictable shirts to fill. 2 from 3 with McG and Par most likely and O Sé in hf line. All 3 certainties to start if fit. Full back is a derelict position because nobody in the panel capable of filling the position with the assuredness we expect.
The Cork game/games will tell us more and Johnno too. While I would nt fear Cork I would hope they put the bar up another bit for us. For one thing it ll be interesting to see how we handle the big mobile men and how in particular Howley deals with Pierce O Neill if that clash happens. Conroy should have been put on Sheridan in Meath game last year. Rather than worrying about who will be starting where I d be still more concerned about how slow management are to deal with crisis on the field. This was evident again the last day but the players managed to find a way on their own.
if fit 5 will be Gardiner for the championship i dont think there is much point in debating that. he is central to the way mayo play with his lightning quick breaks from the half back line. Vaughn is pressing him hard but peader is one of the stone cold certainties .
If you say McG and Parspmd ar definite for midfied that involves moving Dillion frim CHF if you want to accommodate S oSé .
Personally i would prefer if JOM nailed his colours to the mast and picked 2 from 3 and on balance id say head pick Oé and Mcgarrity, don't for get how peripheral a figure parsons was last summer. hes had a very good league and brought himself right back fair play but. JOM is a stubborn man and I feel Parsons couls be Joining CMort on the bench against his fellow countymen(are you reading sligonian :})
Quote from: Zulu on March 30, 2010, 08:32:40 PM
Joker's Mild
Conor Mortimer has calmed down and is ready to stand up for his county, writes Ewan MacKenna
The west is awake: realising that time is short in his career, Conor Mortimer is now hoping people will be talking about him for the right reasons rather than for the likes of his Michael Jackson tribute in last year's Connacht final
It's getting late and the phone has stayed far too silent for far too long. Conor Mortimer should have called by now but it's been 24 hours and he hasn't gotten back to you with a time or location to meet. Suddenly, well past nightfall and the limits of your hopefulness, the phone goes off. It's a message. "Sorry sham, only back. Been away all day and gym this evening, just got my other phone now. Mort here." You can only laugh because there on the screen is the essence of the man. Just when you think he's pushed you too far, he turns himself back into the loveable rogue.
We meet the next day as he takes a break from job hunting. It hasn't gone well for him but you're still looking forward to the next few hours and his company because Conor Mortimer is always outspoken, never gives a damn and it's been a long time since you've been referred to as sham. In short, he's a rarity in a sport becoming ever more grey in terms of personalities. In fact the last time you crossed paths before the 2006 All Ireland final he finished the interview by saying, "If you ever need anything, just give the Mort a call" while throwing in a wink and a twist of the head for good measure.
In his wild and wacky world, life and football appear to be just two different games to be played and with that mantra in mind you take him back to an incident last April where he and Meath defender Kevin Reilly were hospitalised after being attacked in Ballymun. You ask what exactly happened, throwing in rumours that it kicked off over remarks he made to a girl in pyjamas?
"No comment," he snaps.
But everyone else has their opinion, shouldn't you just say what really happened?
"It's not for the public. It's a private issue. There's nothing to be said on it out of respect for the individuals involved. There was no talk then and there'll be none now. Nobody knows."
You know. You were there.
"Maybe I was there. Maybe I wasn't there."
So it was misreported?
"Don't know. People can think what they want. No comment."
Well on a less serious note then, tell us about Michael Jackson, you say, referring to his RIP t-shirt which he unveiled after scoring a goal in last year's Connacht final.
"I don't see the point in giving it my time. It was just a gag that wasn't an issue for anyone in our squad. People always make big things out of small things when it comes to me. I haven't spoken about it for that reason so no comment chief, and as they say, next question please.
Okay. Next question then. What happened to Conor Mortimer?
"I just realised it's time to put the head down. I wasn't happy with the way last year was from a personal point of view. I'm not 21 years of age anymore. I'll be 28 in May. The hassle I've had over the years and jibes and everything else, you get tired of it. I am a serious footballer and want to be seen as a serious footballer."
Before we meet the new Conor Mortimer, some tales about the old one. Way back in 1999 he was absent for Mayo's run to an All Ireland minor final after a falling out with manager JP Kane. When his county lost that decider he said he was sure they'd have won it if he was there. Soon after he took that same arrogance into the senior squad and in his debut season of 2002 announced to the dressing room he'd be the first man since John Egan to win an All Star in April. Since then, the joker has been ever-present in the pack.
He asked a mouthy goalkeeper his name on the basis he'd like to know who he's talking to when he stitched three goals past him. He told a lippy corner-back he was taking apart that perhaps soccer was his game. In DCU he gave the finger to some UCC fans. When taken off in a qualifier against Limerick he pulled of his jersey and flung it into the crowd. After Mayo were dumped out of the 2008 championship he was asked by the Mayo News what he'd say to people who think the county will never win an All Ireland with him on board and responded, "They won't win one without me either." The list goes on.
But there's been some serious consequences too. In 2002 he was punched from behind when heading to the toilets in a Castlebar pub and before you ask, he doesn't drink. Earlier in the day he missed a simple and crucial free against Galway, a roar went up in the crowd that if Lee Harvey Oswald had been from Mayo then John F Kennedy would still be alive and on that evening's Sunday Game, analysis turned to a ball boy who kicked a free from the same spot when the game was over. In 2005 he was involved in an altercation in Supermac's in Eyre Square after the Connacht final. A year later his car was keyed after the same fixture.
"What can you do? I don't think I was ever doing anything overzealous and still don't. You wear white boots and someone keys your car. I don't get that. But anything out of your control, don't worry about it. When I was younger you'd sometimes wonder what's the point but I'd never let someone's actions determine whether I go somewhere or do something. Playing football is a part of my life and I could never look at it in a negative way. Even if it's all gone way too serious now.
"So because of that, the white boots, all that kind of thing, I'm finished with it. I'm tired of what comes with it and what you have to put up with. It's not hard to settle into this new way either. All you have to do is put all your energy into being the best footballer you can be and not doing silly things that gets the entire country talking. We have a manager in John O'Mahony who has me working harder and being a better player."
But Mortimer has always been a hard worker despite the image he projects. Before the 2004 All Ireland final, his primary principal PJ Dooley recalled how he would solo his way to school when others got lifts. His late grandfather George told a story of how he left Conor off by himself at a new pitch in Headford at 10am one Saturday and didn't pick him up until half-five. Former Mayo player Ray Connolly went one better. When driving through Shrule on the worst day you could imagine he saw a lonely figure making his way through the sleet with a ball in hand. You can guess who it was.
"That's personal work, that's different," says Mortimer now. "Hard work on a team is continuously tackling, making runs, working hard. It's not all about scoring points but there were a number of years when I thought all I had to do was score. You can go out and kick scores on your own any day. But you can't tackle on your own, you need to be part of a team to learn that. And under John O'Mahony I've been learning that."
You get the feeling O'Mahony has played a large part in changing the Mortimer you either loved or hated. Before the 2004 All Ireland semi-final, Joe Kernan was staying in the Mayo team hotel and remembers how he found it odd and worrying that Mortimer was wearing different gear to the rest of the squad. A couple of seasons later when O'Mahony took charge he called Mortimer back into the dressing room and told him to change into the shorts everyone else was wearing for a meagre training night in December.
"I guess I've started to look at it from the point of view of leadership," Mortimer continues. "You don't sense that responsibility coming onto your shoulders but one day the older players are gone and it's there and you have to deal with it. Now I'm ready to step up. As well as that when you have opportunities you have to take them and there's a point where you realise that. Sometimes you'd just cruise through games and seasons but I'm realising now time is short."
His brother Kenneth famously remarked how, after finishing up without an All Ireland to his name, all the Connacht medals and All Stars meant nothing. Conor admits he can finally see where his sibling is coming from. It's why during his four-and-a-half months in Thailand, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa over the turn of the year he was running three times a week and hitting the gym twice, all of which left him in fine shape and saw him leave the bench to hit four crucial points against Kerry last weekend.
"It was nice to get back into the swing of things and to have people talking about you for the right reasons. Over the years I guess people are entitled to their opinion but my reasons to do things are not for people's knowledge. And I don't particularly regret anything I did or said. Where am I in life, if I started worrying about all the things that got people's attention then I'd be a nervous wreck. So I just get on. But it's not about me or how I changed. You have to understand that. It's about Mayo and I want to be part of that cog one way or another."
He's getting ready to leave and unlike our last parting there's no wink, no smart words or no cheeky grin. You tell him he's changed and you're not sure how people will react to the new and quieter Conor Mortimer. But he doesn't care. He just wants it to make him a better footballer across the years he has left at the top.
Sunday Tribune 29/3/2010
Read it in the paper on Sunday. Don't know why but I bought the Tribune for the first time in a long time because Mayo football was getting a bit of time.
I have no issue with Conor here or anything. None at all in fact and I thought he handled himself very well there. I would be disappointed with journalist's standards however if they cant come up with a better colour piece than Conor-Off-The-Wall, anytime when Mayo go on a bit of a run. A lot of those Mayo players have stories to tell and would be able to tell it but Conor seems to be the go-to- guy out of pure tabloid type motives.
Quote from: rosnarun on March 30, 2010, 11:23:19 PM
if fit 5 will be Gardiner for the championship i dont think there is much point in debating that. he is central to the way mayo play with his lightning quick breaks from the half back line. Vaughn is pressing him hard but peader is one of the stone cold certainties .
If you say McG and Parspmd ar definite for midfied that involves moving Dillion frim CHF if you want to accommodate S oSé .
Personally i would prefer if JOM nailed his colours to the mast and picked 2 from 3 and on balance id say head pick Oé and Mcgarrity, don't for get how peripheral a figure parsons was last summer. hes had a very good league and brought himself right back fair play but. JOM is a stubborn man and I feel Parsons couls be Joining CMort on the bench against his fellow countymen(are you reading sligonian :})
Hmmmm. Not into debate eh? Or maybe not when it does nt suit your agenda. Lightening quick breaks are great but if they end up in a silly turnover they're worse than useless. To be honest I dont think Peadar would have got 1-1 from Vaughan s opportunities the last day - more likely 1 fisted point. I m not going to debate your Peadar Gardiner stance, but nobody is beyond debate. I ve the height of respect for him and I ve no doubt that he ll be started if fit. Johnno clearly sees him as a leader, like Trevor, and will be first choice.
Dillon should be chf regardless of who is surplus in midfield. It would bring us on to another level with his vision and passing ability and the rest. Let the big lads out on the wing running through the channels.
No chance of Parsons being on the bench - management should get tarred and feathered if he has another glugger year. If Kerry had him he would be with Declan O Sullivan as their game breaker. After Keith H and Dillon he is the class act on the team. And if management could tune him in he could be the most important footballer in the country this year. Delighted with him so far. Showing he is a special talent but nobody is noticing, thank God. Imagine if anybody else had scored that goal v Kerry, caught that mark v Monaghan while yawning at the same time, put Vaughan through for that goal and faded over that last point as well.... Keith and Dillon only rank above Parsons because they ve consistancy as well as class. Parsons can be the most important Mayo player in 6 decades. I think management should get him on as much go forward ball as possible come championship- not battering around kick-outs and stuff. O Sé and MCG in midfield and Parsons in the hf line.
Light hearted enough stuff, Conor is a cheeky bucko and has made lots of people talk, some good and some not so good. If he keeps the head down and does his best he may end up leaving Kenneth jealous.
Ya parsons is like Declan O'Sullivan with his direct running at speed through defences. Mayo were never able to cope with Dec in the All-irelands. Not many can. Parsons is doing well and hopefully will get better. He isn't a scrapper in the middle. it's just not him. Notice how he has improved with the addition of Seamie in there. His best form underage was beside S O'Shea. Would love to see James kilcullen as back-up for Seamie as our grafter now.
QuoteForeverhopeful
Did Mikey Sweeney tackle your sister or something? You have been going on about him since you came to the board. He is just out of U21's and is still developing, has pace to burn, a good eye for goal but needs to fill out. Knowing the stock he comes from that will happen and in my biased view he is well worth his place in the squad where he could be used in certain games , maybe not all. You dont live up to your name in contantly dismissing the lad.
Pace to burn . I'm sick of mayo footballers being picked on their physical attributes rather than their footballing ability. Has happened far too much underage and has stalled mayo's progress. Players with real ability losing out to the quick lad or the strong lad. There is a lot of good footballers who have massive ability but are not spotted because selectors, managers etc. are so blinkered in their views on what a good footballer is.
Finally JOM has seen the light and has players like Enda Varley in his team. He is a proper good footballer. Mikey Sweeney is a speed merchant undoubtedly. But he reminds me of Theo walcott in soccer. Pace is his only game and when thats stopped there's not much else.
I know i'm coming across harsh on Mikey Sweeney but i'm gonna call it as i see it. I'd love if he went out and proved me wrong.
Very much enjoyed that piece on the mort.
Great to see SO'S doing well this year, his workrate and physicality has made a huge difference to us this year, hope he can continue it on into the summer.....
To be honest, I'd leave S O'Shea and Parsons at midfield. They've been doing well there and haven't dropped many balls unlike McGarrity does.
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 31, 2010, 01:22:19 AM
Ya parsons is like Declan O'Sullivan with his direct running at speed through defences. Mayo were never able to cope with Dec in the All-irelands. Not many can. Parsons is doing well and hopefully will get better. He isn't a scrapper in the middle. it's just not him. Notice how he has improved with the addition of Seamie in there. His best form underage was beside S O'Shea. Would love to see James kilcullen as back-up for Seamie as our grafter now.
QuoteForeverhopeful
Did Mikey Sweeney tackle your sister or something? You have been going on about him since you came to the board. He is just out of U21's and is still developing, has pace to burn, a good eye for goal but needs to fill out. Knowing the stock he comes from that will happen and in my biased view he is well worth his place in the squad where he could be used in certain games , maybe not all. You dont live up to your name in contantly dismissing the lad.
Pace to burn . I'm sick of mayo footballers being picked on their physical attributes rather than their footballing ability. Has happened far too much underage and has stalled mayo's progress. Players with real ability losing out to the quick lad or the strong lad. There is a lot of good footballers who have massive ability but are not spotted because selectors, managers etc. are so blinkered in their views on what a good footballer is.
Finally JOM has seen the light and has players like Enda Varley in his team. He is a proper good footballer. Mikey Sweeney is a speed merchant undoubtedly. But he reminds me of Theo walcott in soccer. Pace is his only game and when thats stopped there's not much else.
I know i'm coming across harsh on Mikey Sweeney but i'm gonna call it as i see it. I'd love if he went out and proved me wrong.
Good post Foreverhopeful, I have been harping along the same lines for ages.
Quote from: macdanger2 on March 31, 2010, 02:20:39 AM
Great to see SO'S doing well this year, his workrate and physicality has made a huge difference to us this year, hope he can continue it on into the summer.....
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 31, 2010, 09:32:41 AM
To be honest, I'd leave S O'Shea and Parsons at midfield. They've been doing well there and haven't dropped many balls unlike McGarrity does.
Ya fair play to him. He is very powerful running through the middle and must have drawn and won 4 frees in a row as Monaghan just couldnt deal with him and had to haul him down time and time again.
He is a big addition and brings a new dimension to 11. His workrate is through the roof for a forward and he does a lot of selfless tracking and tackling. Himself, McGarity and Parsons all complement each other, especially for kickouts.
I think a half line of Dillon, S O Se, Andy Moran is very strong. Its classically strong in the middle and fast on the wings. Having O Se imposing himself on the game gives Dillon and Andy Moran a bit more room to do their damage and spade work on the wings. I always said that Dillon would be a better option as a centre forward but that was when we were playing two small men inside or a small full forward line.
Now im thinking that we have better ball winners inside with AOS and Varley so the precision of ball going into them does not have to be as good as it can go in high or low as both can win the 50-50 balls. Even the Mort seems to be winning a bit more than usual although he had a few wides on Sunday.
good discussion going on here lads, great to have these options this year. Picking the forwards is going to give JOM a serious headache.
Here's a forward line that didn't start the last day:
Harte B Kelly A Freeman/N Douglas
Ronaldson B Moran A kilcoyne
Thats very impressive in my eyes.
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 31, 2010, 12:03:20 PM
good discussion going on here lads, great to have these options this year. Picking the forwards is going to give JOM a serious headache.
Here's a forward line that didn't start the last day:
Harte B Kelly A Freeman/N Douglas
Ronaldson B Moran A kilcoyne
Thats very impressive in my eyes.
Id swap Kilcoyne and Douglas and its a bit more balanced. But yeah, there is a good battle going on there.
Quote from: moysider on March 31, 2010, 12:20:15 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 30, 2010, 11:23:19 PM
if fit 5 will be Gardiner for the championship i don't think there is much point in debating that. he is central to the way mayo play with his lightning quick breaks from the half back line. Vaughn is pressing him hard but peader is one of the stone cold certainties .
If you say McG and Parspmd ar definite for midfied that involves moving Dillion frim CHF if you want to accommodate S oSé .
Personally i would prefer if JOM nailed his colours to the mast and picked 2 from 3 and on balance id say head pick Oé and Mcgarrity, don't for get how peripheral a figure parsons was last summer. hes had a very good league and brought himself right back fair play but. JOM is a stubborn man and I feel Parsons couls be Joining CMort on the bench against his fellow countymen(are you reading sligonian :})
Hmmmm. Not into debate eh? Or maybe not when it does nt suit your agenda. Lightening quick breaks are great but if they end up in a silly turnover they're worse than useless. To be honest I dont think Peadar would have got 1-1 from Vaughan s opportunities the last day - more likely 1 fisted point. I m not going to debate your Peadar Gardiner stance, but nobody is beyond debate. I ve the height of respect for him and I ve no doubt that he ll be started if fit. Johnno clearly sees him as a leader, like Trevor, and will be first choice.
Dillon should be chf regardless of who is surplus in midfield. It would bring us on to another level with his vision and passing ability and the rest. Let the big lads out on the wing running through the channels.
No chance of Parsons being on the bench - management should get tarred and feathered if he has another glugger year. If Kerry had him he would be with Declan O Sullivan as their game breaker. After Keith H and Dillon he is the class act on the team. And if management could tune him in he could be the most important footballer in the country this year. Delighted with him so far. Showing he is a special talent but nobody is noticing, thank God. Imagine if anybody else had scored that goal v Kerry, caught that mark v Monaghan while yawning at the same time, put Vaughan through for that goal and faded over that last point as well.... Keith and Dillon only rank above Parsons because they ve consistancy as well as class. Parsons can be the most important Mayo player in 6 decades. I think management should get him on as much go forward ball as possible come championship- not battering around kick-outs and stuff. O Sé and MCG in midfield and Parsons in the hf line.
One of the best posts I've read in a while there Moysider. Parsons is the most naturally talented footballer on the team and Keith Higgins/Alan Dillon a close second. Higgins is absolutely vital though because of our lack of quality corner backs. Shows how good Higgins is that his better position would be wing back but he's still, by far, our best corner back. Also, Dillon is crucial to the forwards and has become the main man in that area of the field, his free taking was badly missed when he went off against Monaghan.
However, I would say that come Championship it will be Parsons and McGarrity midfield with S O'Shea wearing number 11 but playing around the middle also, giving Parsons the freedom to make his runs forward. Dillon would wear 12 but probably play 11 and that would leave space on the wings for the wing backs to attack into. Parsons could be a good 11 but you're missing out on some incredible fielding ability if he plays 11.
I would leave Ger Caff at FB even though it seems he had a couple of poor games. He's the best FB in the squad and he hasn't played much senior football so with time I think he will turn out to be a good FB and an important player. I think if Tom Cunniffe gets back from injury soon he should start 6 and Trevor start in the corner. I think Cunniffes distribution is better and he's more mobile and would be more suited to CFs like Pierce O'Neill and Declan O'Sullivan.
Moysider, I wouldn't normally agree with you but in an argument with Ros..............
I like the idea of Parsons in the half forwards & I agree Dillon has to be CHF, he is our one true class forward.
I dont think it'll happen, mainly because we have enough problems selecting the forwards, given that AOS, TM, A Moran & Dillon are given we have to get 2 more from:
Harte
Conor
Killer
Varley
Ronny
B Moran
A Moran
Tough choices, Varley on form is a shoo in, i think based on last years form Killer was our best forward, B moran is a good option
Mayo recover from poor start to win fifth game of campaign
Division 1
Mayo 2-12
Monaghan 0-15
Mike Finnerty
Castlebar
THESE are the days that remind us why Mayo football can be as frustrating as it can be intoxicating. Why? Because this group of young men is capable of mixing it with any team in the country when the mood takes them. And, of course, they can just as easily lose their way and struggle with the basics on any given Sunday.
Last weekend we were treated to the full gamut of emotions as the homeside allowed Monaghan build up a six-point lead, twice, before recovering their composure in the final quarter to shoot a goal and eight points to save the day. Confused? Well, you should be.
"I would say that we dominated that game for twenty minutes but managed to win it," Mayo manager John O'Mahony reckoned afterwards. "Monaghan dominated for the other fifty-five minutes."
His assessment was as accurate as it was honest. Mayo mixed the good, bad and mediocre at McHale Park but still came away with their fifth win from six matches and they remain on course for their second NFL final in four years.
The story of the game itself is easily told. A fired-up, highly-motivated Monaghan were full value for their 0-9 to 0-3 lead after 36 minutes. Playing with the aid of the breeze, they were dominant in most sectors and picked off some eye-catching scores.
They outmuscled Mayo around the middle as Darren Hughes, Dick Clerkin and Paul Finlay set the tone while Conor McManus was a revelation at full-forward, causing Kieran Conroy problems with his pace.
After 42 minutes, the visitors were ahead by 0-13 to 1-4. They had taken Donal Vaughan's goal four minutes into first-half injury-time on the chin, and replied with the first four points of the second half. Paul Finlay (who ended the afternoon with eight points) and the aforementioned McManus doing the damage.
It was at this stage that Mayo decided to get down to work and the tide started to turn when Aidan O'Shea drilled in his first goal of the season on 48 minutes after he had claimed Andy Moran's 'garryowen' in behind his marker.
That score opened the floodgates and Monaghan were outscored by 0-7 to 0-2 from there to the finish. "Monaghan tend to push up a lot," explained O'Mahony afterwards. "They're really in your face but they tend to leave some space at the back if you can exploit it. It took us a while to do that but the goals were crucial."
That second goal proved a decisive moment and, all over the field, Mayo were transformed. Liam O'Malley was outstanding in the full-back line, the half-back line of Vaughan, Howley and McLoughlin pushed forward, and Seamus O'Shea and Tom Parsons started to come into their own.
Points rained over from Conor Mortimer (free) and Kevin McLoughlin to level the match for the first time before Mark Ronaldson edged Mayo ahead in the 58th minute. Further long-range points from Enda Varley and Chris Barrett gave them breathing space.
Monaghan's place-kicker Paul Finlay kept things interesting with a brace of late frees but the game was closed out when Andy Moran and Tom Parsons nailed scores in stoppage-time.
It had been a much different story for the vast majority of the first half. Three frees from Paul Finlay and a couple of booming place-kicks from Darren Hughes were supplemented by well-taken points from Conor McManus (2), Stephen Gollogly and Tommy Freeman as Monaghan set the tone.
However, in hindsight, Donal Vaughan's goal in the 39th minute (with the last kick of the first half) hauled Mayo back from the brink and instead of being dead and buried, they only trailed by 1-4 to 0-9.
And the moral of the story according to John O'Mahony? "That we can battle. Whatever criticisms one might have about the display, we wore them down and stayed in the game until we got the chances. Then we closed it out. I'd regard that as progress."
Mayo
D Clarke; L O'Malley, K Conroy, K Higgins; D Vaughan (1-1), T Howley, K McLoughlin (0-1); T Parsons (0-1), S O'Shea; A Moran (0-1), A O'Shea (1-0), T Mortimer; E Varley (0-2, 1f), A Dillon (0-2, 1f), C Mortimer (0-1, f).Subs used: M Ronaldson (0-2) for Dillon (inj); C Barrett (0-1) for Higgins (inj); G Cafferkey for Howley.
Monaghan
S Duffy; D McArdle, N McAdam, C Greenan; C Walshe, D Hughes (0-2, 1f, '45), D Mone; D Clerkin, P Finlay (0-8, 7fs); S Gollogly (0-1), H McElroy, K Hughes; D Malone, C McManus (0-3), T Freeman (0-1).
Subs used: C Hanratty for McElroy; V Corey for McArdle; JP Mone for Gollogly; R Woods for Malone.
Referee: R Hickey (Clare)
Quote from: GBXII on March 31, 2010, 01:37:19 PM
Quote from: moysider on March 31, 2010, 12:20:15 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 30, 2010, 11:23:19 PM
if fit 5 will be Gardiner for the championship i don't think there is much point in debating that. he is central to the way mayo play with his lightning quick breaks from the half back line. Vaughn is pressing him hard but peader is one of the stone cold certainties .
If you say McG and Parspmd ar definite for midfied that involves moving Dillion frim CHF if you want to accommodate S oSé .
Personally i would prefer if JOM nailed his colours to the mast and picked 2 from 3 and on balance id say head pick Oé and Mcgarrity, don't for get how peripheral a figure parsons was last summer. hes had a very good league and brought himself right back fair play but. JOM is a stubborn man and I feel Parsons couls be Joining CMort on the bench against his fellow countymen(are you reading sligonian :})
Hmmmm. Not into debate eh? Or maybe not when it does nt suit your agenda. Lightening quick breaks are great but if they end up in a silly turnover they're worse than useless. To be honest I dont think Peadar would have got 1-1 from Vaughan s opportunities the last day - more likely 1 fisted point. I m not going to debate your Peadar Gardiner stance, but nobody is beyond debate. I ve the height of respect for him and I ve no doubt that he ll be started if fit. Johnno clearly sees him as a leader, like Trevor, and will be first choice.
Dillon should be chf regardless of who is surplus in midfield. It would bring us on to another level with his vision and passing ability and the rest. Let the big lads out on the wing running through the channels.
No chance of Parsons being on the bench - management should get tarred and feathered if he has another glugger year. If Kerry had him he would be with Declan O Sullivan as their game breaker. After Keith H and Dillon he is the class act on the team. And if management could tune him in he could be the most important footballer in the country this year. Delighted with him so far. Showing he is a special talent but nobody is noticing, thank God. Imagine if anybody else had scored that goal v Kerry, caught that mark v Monaghan while yawning at the same time, put Vaughan through for that goal and faded over that last point as well.... Keith and Dillon only rank above Parsons because they ve consistancy as well as class. Parsons can be the most important Mayo player in 6 decades. I think management should get him on as much go forward ball as possible come championship- not battering around kick-outs and stuff. O Sé and MCG in midfield and Parsons in the hf line.
One of the best posts I've read in a while there Moysider. Parsons is the most naturally talented footballer on the team and Keith Higgins/Alan Dillon a close second. Higgins is absolutely vital though because of our lack of quality corner backs. Shows how good Higgins is that his better position would be wing back but he's still, by far, our best corner back. Also, Dillon is crucial to the forwards and has become the main man in that area of the field, his free taking was badly missed when he went off against Monaghan.
However, I would say that come Championship it will be Parsons and McGarrity midfield with S O'Shea wearing number 11 but playing around the middle also, giving Parsons the freedom to make his runs forward. Dillon would wear 12 but probably play 11 and that would leave space on the wings for the wing backs to attack into. Parsons could be a good 11 but you're missing out on some incredible fielding ability if he plays 11.
I would leave Ger Caff at FB even though it seems he had a couple of poor games. He's the best FB in the squad and he hasn't played much senior football so with time I think he will turn out to be a good FB and an important player. I think if Tom Cunniffe gets back from injury soon he should start 6 and Trevor start in the corner. I think Cunniffes distribution is better and he's more mobile and would be more suited to CFs like Pierce O'Neill and Declan O'Sullivan.
Jaysus lads ye are fierce excitable about Parsons. I recognise he has ability but to describe him as having the potential to be the most important Mayo player of the last six decades? Well that's stretching it. I know the implication you are making there Moysider but if Mayo win an All-Ireland, Tom Parsons won't be the single greatest driving force.
Still cannot understand how Mayo were so much fitter than monaghan for the last 20 minutes, they say that Monaghan are training hard and Mayo train once a week, likewise that Kerry are training hard. If they are training that hard would they not be fitter?
If I run 3 miles tuesday,wednesday and friday and my opponent runs 3 mile on wednesday only should I expect to be fitter than him for a weekend race?
Andy Moran looked in some games of this league to be a champion sprinter, how can this be if other teams are training hard?
Lots of talk from players and media seem to conflict.And this peaking thing they talk about, does a team really be that much fitter than the other during the summer?
Quote from: mannix on March 31, 2010, 03:02:36 PM
Still cannot understand how Mayo were so much fitter than monaghan for the last 20 minutes, they say that Monaghan are training hard and Mayo train once a week, likewise that Kerry are training hard. If they are training that hard would they not be fitter?
If I run 3 miles tuesday,wednesday and friday and my opponent runs 3 mile on wednesday only should I expect to be fitter than him for a weekend race?
Andy Moran looked in some games of this league to be a champion sprinter, how can this be if other teams are training hard?
Lots of talk from players and media seem to conflict.And this peaking thing they talk about, does a team really be that much fitter than the other during the summer?
I heard JOM on the radio on Monday evening saying that... because of the schedule with games every weekend he had eased off with training so that the players would not be tired, but that he would be increasing the training again soon in preparation for the championship
ya it's a tough one to figure out. Are we leaving ourseves in better shape by easing up on the training now when the pitches are heavy and having more in the tank for matches at the weekend? We're winning them so it's doing the confidence for the Summer no harm whatsoever.
Then again i'm hearing that Kerry were playing full blown training matches day or two before our game. Are they putting in the better base for the Summer?
It you ask me a constant input of training is required. Last year we were hearing that this was the fittest mayo team ever. I'd prefer if they kept the ball in the training as much as possible. Full A v B games in training. No better training IMO. Let the lads tear into each other!
so how are they fitter than monaghan and kerry and the dubs whom they ran ragged only to kick away the levelling score 18 times? Something is not adding up. Being fresh and being fit are two different things I think, Training less does not make you fitter.
Quote from: mannix on March 31, 2010, 03:43:07 PM
so how are they fitter than monaghan and kerry and the dubs whom they ran ragged only to kick away the levelling score 18 times? Something is not adding up. Being fresh and being fit are two different things I think, Training less does not make you fitter.
No. But training too much does make you more tired.
ya was just about say that maybe we're not fitter. Maybe the other teams are more tired with all the intense training they are doing.
Hunger and a new found confidence can come into it in Mayo's case.
Who is in charge of the fitness programme this year?
Erik de Bruin.
;)
It seems JOM is more clued in this year to the football.
It's obvious he sat down with the Mort before he went off with Dillon. It seems he has got through to him. While he only got one score the last day there seemed to be signs of a new attitude with Conor.
Also he has players like Varley and Seamie O'Shea, who have been impressive with UL in the colleges football for a number of years, playing when it seemed he was afraid to give them chances last year.
He took out Cafferkey when we were due to play Donaghy instead putting in Conroy - smart call.
He isn't playing Pat Harte from the start. Harte is/was away working and obviously not getting in as much training as the others. Last year he played most games in the league and his form was poor for the year. This year he will realise he has to work hard to get into the team i.e. his comfort zone is gone. Indeed a lof of players have lost that - McGarrity is no longer going to walk into the team.
He is developing a good bench: Barrett, Freeman & Douglas are obvious examples of players who can make a difference.
I make it we have 23 championship ready players in the panel. A pity that A Higgins was jettisoned while he had so much to offer and it looks like Campbell will never get a look in again as long as this management is in place.
Goalkeepers: David Clarke, Kenneth O'Malley.
Defenders: Donal Vaughan, Ger Cafferkey, Keith Higgins, Lee Keegan, Alan Feeney, Shane Nally, Kieran Conroy, Liam O'Malley, Chris Barrett, Peadar Gardiner, Trevor Howley, Kevin McLoughlin, Tom Cunnife
Midfielders: Tom Parsons, Seamus O'Shea, Ronan McGarrity, Barry Kelly.
Forwards: Andy Moran, Trevor Mortimer, Mark Ronaldson, Aiden O'Shea, Enda Varley, Neil Douglas, Mikie Sweeney, Alan Freeman, Ger McDonagh, Pat Harte, Barry Moran, Aidan Kilcoyne Alan Dillon,Conor Mortimer.
Lads in Bold = highly unlikely to see championship time
Lads in Italic = very good prospects but JOM may not be giving them game time in the Summer
I make that 25. I'm guessing ur not counting Tom Cuniffe as an option. Who else?
lads i normally the mindless optimist on the board but i get a real sense people are beginnig to get carried away, Its not that long since our last league final and that didnt exactly augur well for the summer.
Lets just enjoy this league campaign for what it is . the secondary national competition . well worth winning for itsself but a patchy guide to the Championship. Sure kerry do well when they win the league My guess thats not much more than coincidence , look at last year you could hardly day they carried their form through with the display ahainst sligo and others. in fact their deason did not get going untill 15 mins to go versus antrim.
Mayo players are fitter than other at the moment mainly because of the type of player on the panel. Small quick and light the exact reason a lot of posters are giving out about them so much.
Quote from: rosnarun on April 01, 2010, 02:11:20 AM
lads i normally the mindless optimist on the board but i get a real sense people are beginnig to get carried away, Its not that long since our last league final and that didnt exactly augur well for the summer.
Lets just enjoy this league campaign for what it is . the secondary national competition . well worth winning for itsself but a patchy guide to the Championship. Sure kerry do well when they win the league My guess thats not much more than coincidence , look at last year you could hardly day they carried their form through with the display ahainst sligo and others. in fact their deason did not get going untill 15 mins to go versus antrim.
Mayo players are fitter than other at the moment mainly because of the type of player on the panel. Small quick and light the exact reason a lot of posters are giving out about them so much.
This always seems to happen any time Mayo win even two in a row of any sort. Still, a good league run is encouraging and beats getting stuffed at every turn. League form is but a patchy guide to the Championships alright but it does give managers an ideal opportunity to experiment and fine tune their championships lineups. Given the short run in to the main competition, the longer you stay in, the better prepared you should be.
That may be all the league is good for anymore as the endless fostering about with the rules is devaluing the competition. The business of asking a ref to have a second look at some incidents if a TV company happened to have a camera at the grounds for some games but not for all is bad enough but now both John O'Mahony and Mickey Harte say they had no prior warning that league placings could be decided on previous head to head meetings.
You can't say that knowing this might have changed the Mayo v Dublin result but likewise you can't say for certain that it couldn't either.
BTW: Does the video replay stuff carry over to the Championships?
Quote from: rosnarun on April 01, 2010, 02:11:20 AM
lads i normally the mindless optimist on the board but i get a real sense people are beginnig to get carried away
Not like that to happen in Mayo. ;D
Quote from: Foreverhopeful on March 31, 2010, 10:38:59 PM
It seems JOM is more clued in this year to the football.
Sure we are going to win Sam this year, sure there will be an election ;) and all that weight lost is for the pictures that will be hanging on every Mayo wall for the next 60 years :D
On a serious note, good debate lads, I'll just be happy to read for a while.
Young Donal Vaughan seems like a clued in youngster. Impressed with his defence of Aidan O'Shea and now saying he'd play anywhere on the team to get a jersey.
I for one am not getting carried away ever again. It happened me too many times before. :-[ And I'm only in my early 20s!
yeah but ya got to good with it some times.
as the sod harden Aiden O Sé knocks 3 past sligo, CMort hits 1:11 agaimst galway 2:12 against kildare in the Quater final kerry knocked out by Ross in the Qualifiers
What you gonna do sit on your hands?
Sit on my hands waiting till the winning point goes over in the AI final probably...
what before the Final whistle goes ? i knows some that will wait till the cup is across the shannon be till they start appaulding.
I myself have decided to abstain from any celebration until Sam has arrived in Ballina on the Tuesday night.Just so as not to be jumping the gun when we win.