Man Utd Thread:

[Ed Ricketts]

It's hard to know what the biggest issue is: the awful squad of footballers or the awful football Solskjaer has them playing.

Zero shots on target tonight, two months since they scored more than once in a game, 18 goals in 20 games since he was given the job permanently. Great fella and all, but he's hopelessly out of his depth. Fluked his way into a job he was never meant to get. Simply does not know how to set up a football team to score goals.

[Farrandeelin]

Jesus, United are a total shambles.

Wait till you see, they'll get a result against Liverpool at OT in a couple of weeks.

Yes, more than likely a f**king hammering. Results are relegation form.

[TabClear]

Jesus, United are a total shambles.

Wait till you see, they'll get a result against Liverpool at OT in a couple of weeks.

Yes, more than likely a f**king hammering. Results are relegation form.

Utd 3/1 at home  but will probably get a result

[Jeepers Creepers]

It's hard to know what the biggest issue is: the awful squad of footballers or the awful football Solskjaer has them playing.

Zero shots on target tonight, two months since they scored more than once in a game, 18 goals in 20 games since he was given the job permanently. Great fella and all, but he's hopelessly out of his depth. Fluked his way into a job he was never meant to get. Simply does not know how to set up a football team to score goals.

He's fallen into the trap of reactive rather than proactive 'football'.

[Maroon Manc]

A very difficult watch but don't know how thats a new low, a draw against a team who are only a point behind their league leaders Ajax is hardly a bad result.

Matic & Fred the 2 biggest disappointments, I was happy for Fred to get his chance but he's shown nothing to suggest he's even a premier league player; He can get about the pitch quickly enough but thats all he's shown so far. Matic is finished, he'll be lucky to get a decent deal when he leaves United next summer. A midfielder is a must in Jan, there'll be average players available for loan who are better than those two, everyone keeps talking about lack of goals but we're not creating any chances although Rashford spends far too much time outside the areas when United are attacking. Ole may well be out of his depth but it does't matter who's in charge of this lot at the moment.

[GetOverTheBar]

It's hard to know what the biggest issue is: the awful squad of footballers or the awful football Solskjaer has them playing.

Zero shots on target tonight, two months since they scored more than once in a game, 18 goals in 20 games since he was given the job permanently. Great fella and all, but he's hopelessly out of his depth. Fluked his way into a job he was never meant to get. Simply does not know how to set up a football team to score goals.

He's fallen into the trap of reactive rather than proactive 'football'.

Absolutely, when he came in he treated it like a free hit - United just went at teams and it worked.

Now? He's fallen into the trap of stopping first and foremost....United are not good enough to stop right now.

[bigarsedkeeper]

A very difficult watch but don't know how thats a new low, a draw against a team who are only a point behind their league leaders Ajax is hardly a bad result.

Matic & Fred the 2 biggest disappointments, I was happy for Fred to get his chance but he's shown nothing to suggest he's even a premier league player; He can get about the pitch quickly enough but thats all he's shown so far. Matic is finished, he'll be lucky to get a decent deal when he leaves United next summer. A midfielder is a must in Jan, there'll be average players available for loan who are better than those two, everyone keeps talking about lack of goals but we're not creating any chances although Rashford spends far too much time outside the areas when United are attacking. Ole may well be out of his depth but it does't matter who's in charge of this lot at the moment.

The result isolated isn't that bad, but as a sequence of terrible performances it doesn't help his case. I'm 100% behind not changing the manager again at this point but the questions are stacking up. There's a bit of revisionism already with how people are looking at Jose's time there but when you look at the performance of the players that he bought, they're all shite to put it mildly.

I can understand the thought process behind keeping Mata and Young around a youthful squad but playing them all the time is madness. Matic is done completely done and when he's the same team as those other 2 the whole thing is way too slow. Lingard has been useless too. Rashford isn't a 9 no matter how much he wants to be. McTominay is a good lad but he needs a top layer alongside him to let Pogba push up. But he'll not be at the club next season either I don't think. Saying that I don't know who'll take him unless he starts playing a bit. He's not the biggest problem but he completely disappears at times.

[Ed Ricketts]

Ole may well be out of his depth but it does't matter who's in charge of this lot at the moment.

That logic is a problem. If we're supposed to believe that the club is in the early days of a 'reset' or change of direction, then it is fundamentally important that the right man is in charge driving that change. But other than two months of decent football at the start of the year, Solskjaer has nothing in his entire managerial career that suggests he possesses the abilities to turn a ship the size of Manchester United around.

Another fundamental that must be in place if the club is to change its fortunes is the coaching set up. Top clubs have world class coaches with excellent CVs. United are way behind their rivals in this area, and it shows. The current first team coaches are:

Phelan - Fergie's coneman, who was plucked out of semi-retirement in Australia for little more than nostalgic reasons.
McKenna - A young coach taken from the academy. A novice.
Carrick - A former player with no coaching experience. Even more of a novice.
Dempsey - Solskjaer's man, with little experience coaching outside of Scandinavia.

How many United players have improved in the last 12 months? McTominay, maybe. How many have appreciably regressed? De Gea, Lindelof, Dalot, Lingard, Rashford, etc., etc. This is down to coaching. And to bring it back to Solskjaer, why would any top coaches want to come work for a manager doomed to failure?

[Boycey]

It depends whether you believe the club is in the early days of a reset or not really and for my money we arent...

Managers, coaches and players arent the root of the issue and nothing changes much with each passing manager does it?

[thewobbler]

Ole may well be out of his depth but it does't matter who's in charge of this lot at the moment.

That logic is a problem. If we're supposed to believe that the club is in the early days of a 'reset' or change of direction, then it is fundamentally important that the right man is in charge driving that change. But other than two months of decent football at the start of the year, Solskjaer has nothing in his entire managerial career that suggests he possesses the abilities to turn a ship the size of Manchester United around.

Another fundamental that must be in place if the club is to change its fortunes is the coaching set up. Top clubs have world class coaches with excellent CVs. United are way behind their rivals in this area, and it shows. The current first team coaches are:

Phelan - Fergie's coneman, who was plucked out of semi-retirement in Australia for little more than nostalgic reasons.
McKenna - A young coach taken from the academy. A novice.
Carrick - A former player with no coaching experience. Even more of a novice.
Dempsey - Solskjaer's man, with little experience coaching outside of Scandinavia.

How many United players have improved in the last 12 months? McTominay, maybe. How many have appreciably regressed? De Gea, Lindelof, Dalot, Lingard, Rashford, etc., etc. This is down to coaching. And to bring it back to Solskjaer, why would any top coaches want to come work for a manager doomed to failure?

It's been United's problem since Fergie. Name one player who has clearly improved in his time at United since Fergie stepped down. There is a culture of underachievement.

[Ed Ricketts]

It depends whether you believe the club is in the early days of a reset or not really and for my money we arent...

Managers, coaches and players arent the root of the issue and nothing changes much with each passing manager does it?

Yep, that probably explains it all. Why United supporters aren't more furious about this situation is beyond me. Maybe the rot has set in there too.

[From the Bunker]

Look at Chelsea. They have the proven model.  Claudio Ranieri, José Mourinho, Guus Hiddink, Luiz Felipe Scolari, Avram Grant, Carlo Ancelotti, André Villas-Boas, Roberto Di Matteo, Rafael Benítez, Antonio Conte and Maurizio Sarri. All these Managers in a short space of time. Chelsea go for proven quality, they just don't pluck a former legend out of nowhere and hope for the best. Some don't do well and are replaced. Some do well and are replaced. Good  players stay at the club despite the many changes in Management. No manager is bigger than the club.

[From the Bunker]

Look at Chelsea. They have the proven model.  Claudio Ranieri, José Mourinho, Guus Hiddink, Luiz Felipe Scolari, Avram Grant, Carlo Ancelotti, André Villas-Boas, Roberto Di Matteo, Rafael Benítez, Antonio Conte and Maurizio Sarri. All these Managers in a short space of time. Chelsea go for proven quality, they just don't pluck a former legend out of nowhere and hope for the best. Some don't do well and are replaced. Some do well and are replaced. Good  players stay at the club despite the many changes in Management. No manager is bigger than the club.

They currently have a former legend plucked from nowhere. And they're shit.
Bad example.

Which club do you see turning around their fortunes quicker?

[From the Bunker]

I don't know.
It's just you said that Chelsea are a good example of a team that the doesn't just pluck a random club legend out of nowhere and hope for the best.
I believe Frank Lampard fits that description better than anyone else.

True but in the main (up to now) and except Di Matteo, Chelsea have gone for the Top experienced coach.

[From the Bunker]

It's not as if Man Utd haven't tried any of the "Top experienced" coaches. They have.

True! And they've horsed the two out despite winning trophies! Maybe they have adapted the Chelsea model!