FAI...June 2024 Friendlies v Hungary and Portugal

[Billys Boots]

Does the GAA have a fascination with participation numbers?  Sometimes I think that stats are their lifeblood.

Not sure. I don't really think about it, but I always just assume the GAA is the most 'widespread' sporting organisation. Doesn't really bother me, although obviously the more playing the GAA the better as far as I'm concerned. However I encourage my young lad to play Soccer and Basketball as well as I think all sport is good.

I draw the line at rugby though.

Boasting about numbers is about money.
Participation statistics matter when it comes to the distribution of the crumbs that come the way via the sports council, where John Tracey has to go cap in hand to the Dail to answer questions and justify why, in front of the finance overseers.
The survey that Billy linked has been much used by the FAI  to support their contention that soccer is most widely participated sport in Ireland and to get more funding. But as AZ guessed, the criteria for participation is a very low bar, question like, do you participate in an informal 5-a-side once a week, if so then you are a participant.
When it came to actual membership of a club, then the GAA (football and hurling  combined) were well in the lead  for actual numbers involved. And even if you take the 6 counties seperately, GAA is the biggest sport when you use the criteria of membership of a club. And I suppose that fact has gone a long way for the GAA to get more than decent funding in proportion to other sports, from HM government.

Indeed, but the GAA 'criteria' for membership is, ahem, unusual.  If I take my local area - the Football club (yes Football, the world game) has 25 teams competing in various leagues and formats (men, women and children) and has ca. 400 members; the GAA club has 28 teams competing in various leagues and formats and has ca. 1000 members.  Riddle you that; I'd love to know the answer.   

I thought you said the GAA were preoccupied with states. You're not doing too badly yourself.

Anyway, the GAA obviously has members who do not play. I wouldn't count 'membership' as indicative of playing numbers.  But if we say 25 teams with 16 per panel for soccer you have exactly 400. 28 teams at approx 26 people per panel would be 728.

Yes AZ, but those 28 teams include girls teams and (very) junior teams, none of whom would have 26-strong panels.  I would have though they'd about 500 playing members.  The rest is bulking up, specifically for the purposes of who-knows-what.

[AZOffaly]

Do they say they have 1,000 playing members, or 1,000 members? There's a significant difference, and I wouldn't be surprised if a big club in Dublin had 1,000 members.

[Billys Boots]

By the way, I saw this on Balls.ie

"The battle for the hearts and minds of the Irish sporting youth has long been a contentious and highly political one. Soccer sits atop the pile with 340,070 participants across the country in 2,500 clubs. The GAA finds itself in second place with 294, 577 registered players across 2,359 clubs. Rugby, though growing, is a distant third with 158,685 registered players and 236 clubs."

So it appears that for registered 'Youth' players, soccer has more clubs and more players.

That would sound right to me too - it's what I recall from the last Sports Council presentation.  There's a fallacy doing the rounds, and rarely challenged in this house, that the GAA is the biggest sporting organisation in the country. 

[ballinaman]

Sorry in interrupt the numbers debate but found this hilarious re the English fcuk the IRA chants last night in the Scotland game...the guy who does them is gas, worth a follow on twitter if ye are on it!

[Billys Boots]

Do they say they have 1,000 playing members, or 1,000 members? There's a significant difference, and I wouldn't be surprised if a big club in Dublin had 1,000 members.

It's an application looking for funding for development - when you are asked for 'members', you're supposed to include only players and coaches as members.  That was the context. 

[AZOffaly]

By the way, I saw this on Balls.ie

"The battle for the hearts and minds of the Irish sporting youth has long been a contentious and highly political one. Soccer sits atop the pile with 340,070 participants across the country in 2,500 clubs. The GAA finds itself in second place with 294, 577 registered players across 2,359 clubs. Rugby, though growing, is a distant third with 158,685 registered players and 236 clubs."

So it appears that for registered 'Youth' players, soccer has more clubs and more players.

That would sound right to me too - it's what I recall from the last Sports Council presentation.  There's a fallacy doing the rounds, and rarely challenged in this house, that the GAA is the biggest sporting organisation in the country.

I suppose it depends on the definition. If you include people who follow it, volunteers, players, etc etc, then it probably is. If you are just counting players, then I'd imagine it's close. (Those figures above are just for youth players).

[AZOffaly]

Do they say they have 1,000 playing members, or 1,000 members? There's a significant difference, and I wouldn't be surprised if a big club in Dublin had 1,000 members.

It's an application looking for funding for development - when you are asked for 'members', you're supposed to include only players and coaches as members.  That was the context.

Fair enough. They must have a lot of coaches. Typical Dublin GAA. In all seriousness, that figure can be queried. All registrations are with Croke Park, so it should be a thing of nothing to find out the actual numbers of players registered with Croker.

[Main Street]

By the way, I saw this on Balls.ie

"The battle for the hearts and minds of the Irish sporting youth has long been a contentious and highly political one. Soccer sits atop the pile with 340,070 participants across the country in 2,500 clubs. The GAA finds itself in second place with 294, 577 registered players across 2,359 clubs. Rugby, though growing, is a distant third with 158,685 registered players and 236 clubs."

So it appears that for registered 'Youth' players, soccer has more clubs and more players.

That would sound right to me too - it's what I recall from the last Sports Council presentation.  There's a fallacy doing the rounds, and rarely challenged in this house, that the GAA is the biggest sporting organisation in the country.

I suppose it depends on the definition. If you include people who follow it, volunteers, players, etc etc, then it probably is. If you are just counting players, then I'd imagine it's close. (Those figures above are just for youth players).

What appears so ain't necessarily so.
That's soccer participants versus GAA registered players.
The Irish Sports council regards participation as being  defined by  a 30 minutes 5 a side, once a week.

There's another table to indicate if the sports participation is done outside a club environment.
58% of soccer participation is done outside of a club
whilst only 1.6% of GAA participation is done outside the club.

[AZOffaly]

By the way, I saw this on Balls.ie

"The battle for the hearts and minds of the Irish sporting youth has long been a contentious and highly political one. Soccer sits atop the pile with 340,070 participants across the country in 2,500 clubs. The GAA finds itself in second place with 294, 577 registered players across 2,359 clubs. Rugby, though growing, is a distant third with 158,685 registered players and 236 clubs."

So it appears that for registered 'Youth' players, soccer has more clubs and more players.

That would sound right to me too - it's what I recall from the last Sports Council presentation.  There's a fallacy doing the rounds, and rarely challenged in this house, that the GAA is the biggest sporting organisation in the country.

I suppose it depends on the definition. If you include people who follow it, volunteers, players, etc etc, then it probably is. If you are just counting players, then I'd imagine it's close. (Those figures above are just for youth players).

What appears so ain't necessarily so.
That's soccer participants versus GAA registered players.
The Irish Sports council regards participation as being  defined by  a 30 minutes 5 a side, once a week.

There's another table to indicate if the sports participation is done outside a club environment.
58% of soccer participation is done outside of a club
whilst only 1.6% of GAA participation is done outside the club.

Actually I never spotted the subtle difference there MS. "Soccer sits atop the pile with 340,070 participants across the country in 2,500 clubs" while the GAA has "294, 577 registered players across 2,359 clubs."

340,070 divided by 2500 clubs is an average of 136 youth players per club. That does not tally with my experiences of soccer clubs, although as I've said I have no experience of city clubs.

[Billys Boots]

340,070 divided by 2500 clubs is an average of 136 youth players per club.

That's 9 squads in a club; that sounds about average, from my experience.  The ginormous clubs in Dublin would have 60-odd squads; the tiny clubs would have 4-5 squads.  And yes, I'm talking about youth (under the age of 18) football. 

[AZOffaly]

Fair enough. You know more about it than I do, and you're definitely closer to the situation in Dublin soccer. Down the country, I think there's probably one soccer team per town at least, and one GAA club as well. Most of the players play both, at least into their adulthood. Then I think more people play GAA. But I accept that if the youth numbers are that high in Dublin, then it's likely that overall the figures would say that there are more registered soccer players than GAA players.

[Main Street]

I don't care how close Billy is to the ground,  can he turn water into wine?
Ball ie are mixing up matter.

Where is the exact research to show that the figure of  340,000 are actual members  of soccer clubs?
Afaiu the 340,000 refers to a figure who claim they participate in soccer once a week.
Only 40% of those  are members of a club and
60% of that participation activity is done outside a club environment.

Participation in soccer is not defined by membership, nor is it defined by activity in a club setting,  participation is defined by a kick about once a week  a
98% of GAA participation activists do so at the GAA club  and 83% of those who claimed  GAA participation are actual club members.

[Max Payne]

Sorry in interrupt the numbers debate but found this hilarious re the English fcuk the IRA chants last night in the Scotland game...the guy who does them is gas, worth a follow on twitter if ye are on it!

Love this. What's his Twitter name just out of interest?

[ludermor]

Sorry in interrupt the numbers debate but found this hilarious re the English fcuk the IRA chants last night in the Scotland game...the guy who does them is gas, worth a follow on twitter if ye are on it!

The Daily Mail is good value as well, some of the comments are hilarious ( esp the ones with the most thumbs up!)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2840643/FA-official-forced-asking-England-supporters-band-stop-playing.html

[ballinaman]

Sorry in interrupt the numbers debate but found this hilarious re the English fcuk the IRA chants last night in the Scotland game...the guy who does them is gas, worth a follow on twitter if ye are on it!

Love this. What's his Twitter name just out of interest?

@squires_david , written on side of the pic..gas man