GAA Discussion Paper

[shawshank]

GAA Discussion Paper: Duffy aims axe at U21FC
03 November 2015


The Discussion Paper on Overtraining and Burnout, and fixturesParaic Duffy has recommended discontinuing the U21 football championship in a bid to end player burnout.

If the Monaghan man's bold new proposals are rubber-stamped, the minor intercounty grade will also be changed from U18 to U17.

The director general of the GAA launched a discussion paper on Player Overtraining and Burnout and the GAA Fixtures Calendar at Croke Park this morning, listing a number of proposals that could ease the increasing pressure on intercounty players at the younger end of the scale.

The two main concerns being addressed are the pressure being placed on players between the ages of 17 and 21 "who are being asked to train too much, to play too many matches for too many teams and are afforded too little time for rest and recovery" and the absence of a "fair, evenly-distributed and planned schedule of club matches throughout the year due to the scheduling of inter-county fixtures".

The full list of proposals - which would be introduced in 2017 and 2018 - is as follows:

1. Re-grade the inter-county minor grade from U18 to U17.

2. Play the new minor championships alongside the senior championships as is currently the case.

3. Discontinue the U21 football inter-county championship.

4. Conclude the All-Ireland U21 hurling inter-county championship before the senior final.

5. Increase the number of national league weekends, doubling up football and hurling fixtures.

6. Discontinue the AFL Division 1 semi-finals.

7. Establish in rule that players, who are not in the match-day panel of 26 must be available to their clubs on the weekends of intercounty games.

8. Bring forward the senior All-Irelands by two weeks with the hurling final on the second Sunday of August and the football final played on the first Sunday in September.

9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches.

10. Discontinue the All-Ireland inter-county junior football and intermediate hurling championships.

11. Introduce a calendar-year fixtures schedule.


How does this help club football/hurling. More intercounty matches, no detail in bringing All Ireland semi finals forward as well as the final to increase time for the clubs. Where is the consideration for developing players from 17 to 22, never mind the notion of providing games for this age group who can't make the res or sen team (although I do acknowledge this this is pitched at county level, and counties can run their won internal compo. Our u21 compo has kept a number of lads playing that otherwise would have been lost to the club.) This stinks as an agenda to promote intercounty football/hurling

[Syferus]

Scraping U21 totally will never pass.

[muppet]

Why scrap the football U-21 Championship, but not the hurling one?

Are hurlers immune to burnout?

[AZOffaly]

Why scrap the football U-21 Championship, but not the hurling one?

Are hurlers immune to burnout?

I think they scrap the U21 Football, but replace with U19. I don't like this as it is too big a jump from U19 to senior, for development purposes.

[shawshank]

You HAVE just made that up, u19 is not mentioned in the discussion paper.

[muppet]

Why scrap the football U-21 Championship, but not the hurling one?

Are hurlers immune to burnout?

I think they scrap the U21 Football, but replace with U19. I don't like this as it is too big a jump from U19 to senior, for development purposes.

I think this whole idea is arseways.

There is certainly a problem with burnout for a small number of elite players. But that is because every 3rd level institution, club and county (all doubled for a dual players) insists it is their right to play their best players without any consideration given to his health or progression.

But behind every elite 19 year old player playing 3 times a week, is a bench full of lads, who train very hard and are eager to play, who are very close to dropping out of the game. That is worse to me.

The solution is to limit the demands on the small number of players that are the issue, not scrap competitions.

[blewuporstuffed]

Why scrap the football U-21 Championship, but not the hurling one?

Are hurlers immune to burnout?

I think they scrap the U21 Football, but replace with U19. I don't like this as it is too big a jump from U19 to senior, for development purposes.

I think this whole idea is arseways.

There is certainly a problem with burnout for a small number of elite players. But that is because every 3rd level institution, club and county (all doubled for a dual players) insists it is their right to play their best players without any consideration given to his health or progression.

But behind every elite 19 year old player playing 3 times a week, is a bench full of lads, who train very hard and are eager to play, who are very close to dropping out of the game. That is worse to me.

The solution is to limit the demands on the small number of players that are the issue, not scrap competitions.

+1 muppet

[AZOffaly]

You HAVE just made that up, u19 is not mentioned in the discussion paper.

I saw it elsewhere shawshank. Apologies if I'm wrong.

[AZOffaly]

You are correct shawshank. Apologies. In fact he outright recommends against an U19 competition. but confusingly, I think it's included in his illustrated calendar!

An U-19 football championship?
If, on foot of the above proposals, the
Association decides to discontinue the U-21
football championship, then the possibility
of replacing it with an U-19 championship,
as part of the development of elite players
between the ages of 17 and 21, may well receive
renewed attention. It can be argued that an
U-19 football championship would provide an
attractive midweek competition at the peak of
the summer. However, it also raises a question:
can an U-19 championship, beginning in the
last week of June, be played without having a
negative impact on adult club fixtures? Given
that an U-19 competition would be played on a
knockout basis, that its provincial finals would be
completed by the end of July, and that it would
be played at the same time as the provincial
championships and All-Ireland Qualifiers (i.e.
when few club championship games are played),
it can be argued that it would have little negative
impact. However, all of the players on an U-19
inter-county team would be playing on club
adult teams, and many would also have played
on second- and third-level teams earlier in the
year. Given the level of overtraining and the time
spent on the preparation of underage teams,
the dangers of simply replacing one competition
with another are clear. While, for the purposes
of illustration, provision has been made for
such a championship in the calendar for 2018
(Appendix 3), the needs of club players must take
precedence over elite inter-county players.
On balance, I believe that the potential
disadvantages of an U-19 competition outweigh
any potential advantages it may appear to offer.

I blame Coilin for giving me the wrong info

The document is here by the way http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/fixtures_and_results/GAA%20Discussion%20Paper%2003_11_2015.pdf

[joemamas]

If number 9 was made no 1. priority and was changed to play to a conclusion, it would resolve all fixtures issues for clubs and counties in an instant. Schedules could be drawn up in January, and no reason to have a daft three to four weeks between all-Ireland semi-finals etc. All-Irelands could be done by first Sunday in September. 



The full list of proposals - which would be introduced in 2017 and 2018 - is as follows:

1. Re-grade the inter-county minor grade from U18 to U17.

2. Play the new minor championships alongside the senior championships as is currently the case.

3. Discontinue the U21 football inter-county championship.

4. Conclude the All-Ireland U21 hurling inter-county championship before the senior final.

5. Increase the number of national league weekends, doubling up football and hurling fixtures.

6. Discontinue the AFL Division 1 semi-finals.

7. Establish in rule that players, who are not in the match-day panel of 26 must be available to their clubs on the weekends of intercounty games.

8. Bring forward the senior All-Irelands by two weeks with the hurling final on the second Sunday of August and the football final played on the first Sunday in September.

9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches.

10. Discontinue the All-Ireland inter-county junior football and intermediate hurling championships.

11. Introduce a calendar-year fixtures schedule.If No 9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches was made No 1 priority, and make it play to a conclusion, then all schedules for clubs and counties could be made in January. Pretty simple when you think of it.

[Dinny Breen]

Why scrap the football U-21 Championship, but not the hurling one?

Are hurlers immune to burnout?

I think they scrap the U21 Football, but replace with U19. I don't like this as it is too big a jump from U19 to senior, for development purposes.

I think this whole idea is arseways.

There is certainly a problem with burnout for a small number of elite players. But that is because every 3rd level institution, club and county (all doubled for a dual players) insists it is their right to play their best players without any consideration given to his health or progression.

But behind every elite 19 year old player playing 3 times a week, is a bench full of lads, who train very hard and are eager to play, who are very close to dropping out of the game. That is worse to me.

The solution is to limit the demands on the small number of players that are the issue, not scrap competitions.

Goes back to what we were discussing on the coaches thread, Ego. Coaches have egos and coaches want to win.

[Franko]

GAA Discussion Paper: Duffy aims axe at U21FC
03 November 2015


The Discussion Paper on Overtraining and Burnout, and fixturesParaic Duffy has recommended discontinuing the U21 football championship in a bid to end player burnout.

If the Monaghan man's bold new proposals are rubber-stamped, the minor intercounty grade will also be changed from U18 to U17.

The director general of the GAA launched a discussion paper on Player Overtraining and Burnout and the GAA Fixtures Calendar at Croke Park this morning, listing a number of proposals that could ease the increasing pressure on intercounty players at the younger end of the scale.

The two main concerns being addressed are the pressure being placed on players between the ages of 17 and 21 "who are being asked to train too much, to play too many matches for too many teams and are afforded too little time for rest and recovery" and the absence of a "fair, evenly-distributed and planned schedule of club matches throughout the year due to the scheduling of inter-county fixtures".

The full list of proposals - which would be introduced in 2017 and 2018 - is as follows:

1. Re-grade the inter-county minor grade from U18 to U17.

2. Play the new minor championships alongside the senior championships as is currently the case.

3. Discontinue the U21 football inter-county championship.

4. Conclude the All-Ireland U21 hurling inter-county championship before the senior final.

5. Increase the number of national league weekends, doubling up football and hurling fixtures.

6. Discontinue the AFL Division 1 semi-finals.

7. Establish in rule that players, who are not in the match-day panel of 26 must be available to their clubs on the weekends of intercounty games.

8. Bring forward the senior All-Irelands by two weeks with the hurling final on the second Sunday of August and the football final played on the first Sunday in September.

9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches.

10. Discontinue the All-Ireland inter-county junior football and intermediate hurling championships.

11. Introduce a calendar-year fixtures schedule.


How does this help club football/hurling. More intercounty matches, no detail in bringing All Ireland semi finals forward as well as the final to increase time for the clubs. Where is the consideration for developing players from 17 to 22, never mind the notion of providing games for this age group who can't make the res or sen team (although I do acknowledge this this is pitched at county level, and counties can run their won internal compo. Our u21 compo has kept a number of lads playing that otherwise would have been lost to the club.) This stinks as an agenda to promote intercounty football/hurling

Agree with Joe.  No. 9 is the key to this.  I hear post match interviews with managers moaning that 'our boys deserved a replay there today' and the likes.  Never understood where that attitude came from.

[LeoMc]

GAA Discussion Paper: Duffy aims axe at U21FC
03 November 2015


The Discussion Paper on Overtraining and Burnout, and fixturesParaic Duffy has recommended discontinuing the U21 football championship in a bid to end player burnout.

If the Monaghan man's bold new proposals are rubber-stamped, the minor intercounty grade will also be changed from U18 to U17.

The director general of the GAA launched a discussion paper on Player Overtraining and Burnout and the GAA Fixtures Calendar at Croke Park this morning, listing a number of proposals that could ease the increasing pressure on intercounty players at the younger end of the scale.

The two main concerns being addressed are the pressure being placed on players between the ages of 17 and 21 "who are being asked to train too much, to play too many matches for too many teams and are afforded too little time for rest and recovery" and the absence of a "fair, evenly-distributed and planned schedule of club matches throughout the year due to the scheduling of inter-county fixtures".

The full list of proposals - which would be introduced in 2017 and 2018 - is as follows:

1. Re-grade the inter-county minor grade from U18 to U17.

2. Play the new minor championships alongside the senior championships as is currently the case.

3. Discontinue the U21 football inter-county championship.

4. Conclude the All-Ireland U21 hurling inter-county championship before the senior final.

5. Increase the number of national league weekends, doubling up football and hurling fixtures.

6. Discontinue the AFL Division 1 semi-finals.

7. Establish in rule that players, who are not in the match-day panel of 26 must be available to their clubs on the weekends of intercounty games.

8. Bring forward the senior All-Irelands by two weeks with the hurling final on the second Sunday of August and the football final played on the first Sunday in September.

9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches.

10. Discontinue the All-Ireland inter-county junior football and intermediate hurling championships.

11. Introduce a calendar-year fixtures schedule.


How does this help club football/hurling. More intercounty matches, no detail in bringing All Ireland semi finals forward as well as the final to increase time for the clubs. Where is the consideration for developing players from 17 to 22, never mind the notion of providing games for this age group who can't make the res or sen team (although I do acknowledge this this is pitched at county level, and counties can run their won internal compo. Our u21 compo has kept a number of lads playing that otherwise would have been lost to the club.) This stinks as an agenda to promote intercounty football/hurling

Yep No. 9 is the biggie.
What is the point of Number 10?
IS Number 5 an attempt to eliminate dual players?

[orangeman]

A lot of very commendable suggestions in that report.

[Rossfan]

No mention of the great untouchable - third level competitions.
Is the hurlyU21 to be left to avoid upsetting "hurling man"? Makes no sense keeping one while abolishing the other.
Inter Co JFC and IHC don't serve any real purpose.
Good luck with the compulsory extra time but it is a great and easy solution to a problem.
However I can see Prov Finals and AI semis and Finals being exempted €€€€€€s.
Can we also have both Football and Hurling AI semis played in one weekend each? 1 Sat and 1 Sunday.
Obviously a rule limiting eligibilities for the elite 17-21 group might be needed.