So what do ye think of the black card rule now?

[ONeill]

Whelo ( and the rest )  don't think much of the black card after today's game. Funny that.

No, Whelan was equally as scathing of it after the Tyrone match, much to Brolly's annoyance.

[AZOffaly]

Not the fault of the black card but the inability of the refs to enforce them.  I'm not a religious man but I am praying that the gaa will wake up to the need for more than one ref very soon.
It seems to me that the players, managers and team prep has moved on a lot in the past 10 years but the administration is light years behind in introducing common sense changes like 2 refs and a stop clock and many other rules.

It is the black card rules fault that the refs can't enforce them. There are far too many variables that occur to be able to make a cut and dry decision like is prescribed in the black card offences. It is making a complete hash of the game at the minute, just like many, many people said it would. There is something seriously wrong with the rules in a high octane, full blooded, contact sport where a player is asked to leave the field of play for one incident such as Mchael Darragh MacAuley or Denis Bastic yesterday, or Marc O'Se and Conor Meyler the week before, or many other examples of clumsy mistimed tackles that by the letter of the law are black card offences but are not worthy in my view of ending a persons involvement in the game. Yet, a tackle found the neck gets a yellow and the lad stays on the pitch. I can't believe we never fully give a chance to the sin bin, where at least any genuine referee mistakes doesn't completely righti off a players involvement in the match. The refs are only part of the problem, we have to make the rules enforceable in as consistent a way as possible, currently as they stand, they don't allow this to happen.

Benny, who railed against the sinbin? The same people railing against the black card. People don't want to be punished severely for cynical play, because it's a lot easier to be cynical than to learn to defend properly.

So f**k out the black card, but next year when lads are back doing the old drag down, slow the game down, fouls 80 yards from their own goals, I don't want to hear the whinging.

[BennyHarp]

Not the fault of the black card but the inability of the refs to enforce them.  I'm not a religious man but I am praying that the gaa will wake up to the need for more than one ref very soon.
It seems to me that the players, managers and team prep has moved on a lot in the past 10 years but the administration is light years behind in introducing common sense changes like 2 refs and a stop clock and many other rules.

It is the black card rules fault that the refs can't enforce them. There are far too many variables that occur to be able to make a cut and dry decision like is prescribed in the black card offences. It is making a complete hash of the game at the minute, just like many, many people said it would. There is something seriously wrong with the rules in a high octane, full blooded, contact sport where a player is asked to leave the field of play for one incident such as Mchael Darragh MacAuley or Denis Bastic yesterday, or Marc O'Se and Conor Meyler the week before, or many other examples of clumsy mistimed tackles that by the letter of the law are black card offences but are not worthy in my view of ending a persons involvement in the game. Yet, a tackle found the neck gets a yellow and the lad stays on the pitch. I can't believe we never fully give a chance to the sin bin, where at least any genuine referee mistakes doesn't completely righti off a players involvement in the match. The refs are only part of the problem, we have to make the rules enforceable in as consistent a way as possible, currently as they stand, they don't allow this to happen.

Benny, who railed against the sinbin? The same people railing against the black card. People don't want to be punished severely for cynical play, because it's a lot easier to be cynical than to learn to defend properly.

So f**k out the black card, but next year when lads are back doing the old drag down, slow the game down, fouls 80 yards from their own goals, I don't want to hear the whinging.

Jeez, AZ that's some generalisation to say that those who railed against the sin bin are now the same people who are railing against the black cards. I for one, was keen on the sin bin and remember it wasn't bought in particularly to deal with cynical play at the time. I think those who may have argued against it then and seeing the black card as an alternative might just be prepared to give it a go. Or we could just use the yellow and red cards properly and two cynical offences (yellows) and your gone. I don't think there'd be too many complaints from MDM for example if he got a yellow for yesterday's offence, did it again and was sent off! (Or sent off for 10mins if the sin bin was used)

[AZOffaly]

I agree if the yellow and red cards were used properly, there'd be no need for anything else. But Refs didn't, and won't in future, give yellows for the little ticky tack cynical stuff which was driving us all nuts. The Black sledgehammer to crack the nut came in, and a lot of that behaviour is gone from the game.

I just think people are blaming the black card for stuff it wasn't designed to deal with. Like Cian O'Sullivan yesterday, that pull back was NOT a black card, but twitter went nuts with people saying it should have been.

I don't accept it's that complicated, but I do accept, now, that people are either deliberately or otherwise, finding it very difficult to understand. This is not helped by analysts and pundits who haven't the slightest clue and can't be bothered learning it either.

[westbound]

Not the fault of the black card but the inability of the refs to enforce them.  I'm not a religious man but I am praying that the gaa will wake up to the need for more than one ref very soon.
It seems to me that the players, managers and team prep has moved on a lot in the past 10 years but the administration is light years behind in introducing common sense changes like 2 refs and a stop clock and many other rules.

It is the black card rules fault that the refs can't enforce them. There are far too many variables that occur to be able to make a cut and dry decision like is prescribed in the black card offences. It is making a complete hash of the game at the minute, just like many, many people said it would. There is something seriously wrong with the rules in a high octane, full blooded, contact sport where a player is asked to leave the field of play for one incident such as Mchael Darragh MacAuley or Denis Bastic yesterday, or Marc O'Se and Conor Meyler the week before, or many other examples of clumsy mistimed tackles that by the letter of the law are black card offences but are not worthy in my view of ending a persons involvement in the game. Yet, a tackle found the neck gets a yellow and the lad stays on the pitch. I can't believe we never fully give a chance to the sin bin, where at least any genuine referee mistakes doesn't completely righti off a players involvement in the match. The refs are only part of the problem, we have to make the rules enforceable in as consistent a way as possible, currently as they stand, they don't allow this to happen.

Edit. I fully agree AZ we need to sit down and rewrite the whole rule book, sanctions etc and tie up any loop holes etc.

Clumsy mistimed tackles are not black card offences by the latter of the law! Deliberate is the key word in the laws!

[BennyHarp]

Not the fault of the black card but the inability of the refs to enforce them.  I'm not a religious man but I am praying that the gaa will wake up to the need for more than one ref very soon.
It seems to me that the players, managers and team prep has moved on a lot in the past 10 years but the administration is light years behind in introducing common sense changes like 2 refs and a stop clock and many other rules.

It is the black card rules fault that the refs can't enforce them. There are far too many variables that occur to be able to make a cut and dry decision like is prescribed in the black card offences. It is making a complete hash of the game at the minute, just like many, many people said it would. There is something seriously wrong with the rules in a high octane, full blooded, contact sport where a player is asked to leave the field of play for one incident such as Mchael Darragh MacAuley or Denis Bastic yesterday, or Marc O'Se and Conor Meyler the week before, or many other examples of clumsy mistimed tackles that by the letter of the law are black card offences but are not worthy in my view of ending a persons involvement in the game. Yet, a tackle found the neck gets a yellow and the lad stays on the pitch. I can't believe we never fully give a chance to the sin bin, where at least any genuine referee mistakes doesn't completely righti off a players involvement in the match. The refs are only part of the problem, we have to make the rules enforceable in as consistent a way as possible, currently as they stand, they don't allow this to happen.

Edit. I fully agree AZ we need to sit down and rewrite the whole rule book, sanctions etc and tie up any loop holes etc.

Clumsy mistimed tackles are not black card offences by the latter of the law! Deliberate is the key word in the laws!

I know, but players are getting black cards for it. That's the problem!

[Stall the Bailer]

I agree if the yellow and red cards were used properly, there'd be no need for anything else. But Refs didn't, and won't in future, give yellows for the little ticky tack cynical stuff which was driving us all nuts. The Black sledgehammer to crack the nut came in, and a lot of that behaviour is gone from the game.

I just think people are blaming the black card for stuff it wasn't designed to deal with. Like Cian O'Sullivan yesterday, that pull back was NOT a black card, but twitter went nuts with people saying it should have been.

I don't accept it's that complicated, but I do accept, now, that people are either deliberately or otherwise, finding it very difficult to understand. This is not helped by analysts and pundits who haven't the slightest clue and can't be bothered learning it either.

I think the referees would gave the yellows if the black card went. The black card introduction resulted in a lot education of the black card rules (Brolly even went to a seminar about it). The GAA public and referees are more aware now of the black card/cynical fouls than pre introduction of the black card (granted some people don't know what is a black card offence).

[AZOffaly]

I agree if the yellow and red cards were used properly, there'd be no need for anything else. But Refs didn't, and won't in future, give yellows for the little ticky tack cynical stuff which was driving us all nuts. The Black sledgehammer to crack the nut came in, and a lot of that behaviour is gone from the game.

I just think people are blaming the black card for stuff it wasn't designed to deal with. Like Cian O'Sullivan yesterday, that pull back was NOT a black card, but twitter went nuts with people saying it should have been.

I don't accept it's that complicated, but I do accept, now, that people are either deliberately or otherwise, finding it very difficult to understand. This is not helped by analysts and pundits who haven't the slightest clue and can't be bothered learning it either.

I think the referees would gave the yellows if the black card went. The black card introduction resulted in a lot education of the black card rules (Brolly even went to a seminar about it). The GAA public and referees are more aware now of the black card/cynical fouls than pre introduction of the black card (granted some people don't know what is a black card offence).

They didn't do it before now, what makes you think they would (maybe apart from a brief 'focus on it' period at the start of the league) if we went back that way?

[Stall the Bailer]

It is easier to award a yellow that black as it doesn't carry as harsh it a penalty. Cynical fouls are more in the conscious now and more likely to be called and carded.   

[AZOffaly]

For a brief period, then there'll be giving out about a 'harmless auld foul' on the opposition 20 metre line, and then there'll be lads giving out about getting the line for 'nothing' after they get a second yellow. After a period, refs will slowly stop giving the 'soft' yellows and then players and management will cotton on to it, and start fouling high up the field to break up counter attacks again, and we'll be back where we started.

[Stall the Bailer]

For a brief period, then there'll be giving out about a 'harmless auld foul' on the opposition 20 metre line, and then there'll be lads giving out about getting the line for 'nothing' after they get a second yellow. After a period, refs will slowly stop giving the 'soft' yellows and then players and management will cotton on to it, and start fouling high up the field to break up counter attacks again, and we'll be back where we started.

That will be the job of the referees assessors to keep them honest and not to fall back into old habits, by punishing them for lack of cards. And also the job of the paid staff in Croke Park to run courses to keep the GAA public (especially the refs up to date on the rules).

[orangeman]

Was Seamie O'Shea correctly black carded today ?.

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

Was Seamie O'Shea correctly black carded today ?.

NO. One of the very few incorrect calls from that ref today, that was a yellow.

[Stall the Bailer]

Yes, it was a black. Can't understand why people saying it wasn't. Deliberate take down.

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

Yes, it was a black. Can't understand why people saying it wasn't. Deliberate take down.

That's not the rule, there was no cynicism in it, it was a straight yellow (it was completely off the ball).